• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:51
CEST 03:51
KST 10:51
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202538Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 202510Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments3[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder10EWC 2025 - Replay Pack4Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced55BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams11
StarCraft 2
General
Serral wins EWC 2025 The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Interview with Chris "ChanmanV" Chan Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 2025 Classic: "It's a thick wall to break through to become world champ"
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) TaeJa vs Creator Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $10,000 live event
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars
Brood War
General
Nobody gona talk about this year crazy qualifiers? [BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder How do the new Battle.net ranks translate? BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 2 Cosmonarchy Pro Showmatches [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 1
Strategy
[G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread 9/11 Anniversary Possible Al Qaeda Attack on 9/11 Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
The Link Between Fitness and…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 544 users

[N]A Mostly Normal Game of Mafia - Page 9

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 7 8 9 10 11 Next All
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 02:00 GMT
#1111
Yeah, I wish I had a better reason to say raynpelikoneet was town. As in, I wish he was a role or something so it was confirmed. I am reading him town as well as I can read him, but there's always the chance he's just playing a ridiculous game.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 02:01 GMT
#1112
On December 01 2020 11:00 Tictock wrote:
Mafia can no shoot so we cannot use JK to confirm someone as mafia.

I don't see a problem with JK confirming someone as town though if a kill does go through.
This is technically correct, but as Hapahauli was saying, if mafia chooses to no-kill, then town gains an extra mislynch. So it's the same result in the end.

Unless you're saying mafia is allowed to store up their shots and use them all at once, but that's a really stupid mechanic that I've never actually seen in a game.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 03:47 GMT
#1117
Fecalfeast?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 03:48 GMT
#1118
Actually... it's majority lynch. Ideally we would have five votes on the same target or mafia could force a no-lynch...

Hopefully raynpelikoneet comes back? If not the right play is to switch back to Hapahauli, right?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 04:03 GMT
#1121
On December 01 2020 12:53 Hapahauli wrote:
FF or Rayn need to vote Vivax. Given that FF has expressed his sense of a Vivax/TT scumteam, I'm not worried about him coming back and consolidating.

Even if Rayn doesn't come back, TT unvoting Vivax to create a no-lynch (when he supposedly has no preference between a Hapa/Vivax lynch) is a straight scum-claim and should get him instantly policy lynched next day. Also remember that a no-lynch does not lose town the game here, which would make such a switch pretty stupid from a scum-TT perspective.
Right, I forgot about that. Thanks, that makes sense.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 04:10 GMT
#1123
On December 01 2020 13:04 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I just arrived at work, i am going to explain why after i grt home
Sounds good, I'll (probably) be there.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 05:23 GMT
#1131
On December 01 2020 13:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2020 13:19 Hapahauli wrote:
Sigh.

Let me start by saying this:

Hapa is saying we should definitely lynch into TT/Vivax because if we hit mafia there the game is practically solved.

This is obviously smart from mafia perspective because he then isnt lynched and town can still make the wrong decision with TT/Vivax.

From town perspective though; Lets say we lynch Vivax and he flips mafia. Trfel jails Hapa (or whoever) and the NK goes through. How is the game solved?
Did Hapahauli ever say this? I thought he was advocating lynching Tictock or Vivax because he thinks they are mafia and he is town (presumably) so that would be a superior lynch?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 05:51 GMT
#1146
On December 01 2020 08:35 Hapahauli wrote:
Let's make a deal TT.

I think Vivax is mafia. You think Vivax is mafia.

Let's kill Vivax. After that, since we both think that Trfel is the JK, he can simply block me tomorrow and "confirm me as mafia". Sounds good?

Game solved and over from your perspective. No need to argue or do anything.
@raynpelikoneet, you are referring to this discussion, right?

I don't think Hapahauli was trying to argue that we should kill between Vivax/Tictock first instead of him because it's somehow superior. Rather, the point Hapahauli is trying to make here is that Tictock is suspicious because by his own logic, he should be fine lynching Vivax. Hapahauli was trying to see if Tictock would go along with that and vote for Vivax, or if he would hesitate. I read it as more of an experiment.

Like I get that he could do this as mafia. It's mafia motivated to move votes off of oneself. But why wouldn't Hapahauli do this as town?

If you're referring to a different discussion, the above is all moot. In that case if you could please point me to it? Because I (quickly) read the thread from Hapahauli's claim until this point and didn't find what you are referring to.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 05:55 GMT
#1147
On December 01 2020 14:48 Tictock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2020 14:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Its okay, lets hear why i am mafia with Vivax.


I am not getting into that, just saying Vivax should be the lynch here.
Can I ask why it's better to lynch Vivax than Hapahauli? I thought you were scumreading both equally?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 06:16 GMT
#1153
On December 01 2020 15:04 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2020 14:51 Trfel wrote:
On December 01 2020 08:35 Hapahauli wrote:
Let's make a deal TT.

I think Vivax is mafia. You think Vivax is mafia.

Let's kill Vivax. After that, since we both think that Trfel is the JK, he can simply block me tomorrow and "confirm me as mafia". Sounds good?

Game solved and over from your perspective. No need to argue or do anything.
@raynpelikoneet, you are referring to this discussion, right?

I don't think Hapahauli was trying to argue that we should kill between Vivax/Tictock first instead of him because it's somehow superior. Rather, the point Hapahauli is trying to make here is that Tictock is suspicious because by his own logic, he should be fine lynching Vivax. Hapahauli was trying to see if Tictock would go along with that and vote for Vivax, or if he would hesitate. I read it as more of an experiment.

Like I get that he could do this as mafia. It's mafia motivated to move votes off of oneself. But why wouldn't Hapahauli do this as town?

If you're referring to a different discussion, the above is all moot. In that case if you could please point me to it? Because I (quickly) read the thread from Hapahauli's claim until this point and didn't find what you are referring to.

Yes i understand towards TT it can be this. Towards you though it doesnt follow the same logic.

If his experiment went well and TT came off as scummy why is he not voting for TT then? I know TT is voting for Vivax here but still, he was very hesitant at first.
Okay, yeah I get why that logic wouldn't work for me. I don't think he ever used that logic towards me though? I don't recall it at all.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 06:19 GMT
#1154
Sorry, I should add, as to the second part, that's a fair point. He'd say that he's similarly confident in Vivax and Tictock and that the point made by the experiment is about association between the two, anyway. Which makes decent sense to me?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 07:06 GMT
#1159
Point by point, paragraph by paragraph.

1. He gets to use the role if he gets shot Night 1, unless mafia roleblocked him as well as killed him (which would literally only be beneficial against the Mad Hatter and Vigilante I believe). I would expect mafia to roleblock someone other than their kill target. As far as the logic for not running for mayor to be able to use his role, that's an interesting point, I guess it would depend on whether he values the protection more or the potential Mad Hatter shot more. Hapahauli saying he would likely run for mayor if there wasn't a good mayoral candidate makes sense to me, if someone else was towny and had utility later then they could be mayor and get the best of both worlds. Whether I qualify as worth giving a bodyguard, that's certainly up for debate. The point has some merit, but I'm unsure how much.

2. Could be missing something but I thought those statements happened in the other order? Where Hapahauli first said Jockmcplop could be mafia because he doesn't remember anything he posted, and then (presumably) looked at it and found other reasons to scumread him.

3. Gosh, I feel bad, but I'm not seeing this one at all Looked through both Hapahauli's and Tictock's filters. I'm so blind

4. I have absolutely no idea. This is an extremely compelling point.

5. I thought that lynching someone for three blues being too much is valid, isn't this what we were talking about yesterday? It's at least worth considering. As for the appeal to emotion itself, I guess I wasn't under the impression that it was a scumtell? I do feel like those statements were somewhat suspect though.

6. Supposedly Hapahauli only had a few minutes to skim the thread, I assume he would say he didn't have the time to actually read your Fecalfeast case earlier. Bleh.

I'm gonna start winding down and going to bed (it's late here), but I'll decide tomorrow. I'm actually horrid at making decisions though, so it would be great if you and Fecalfeast could agree so I can just do that. Currently I'd still prefer not lynching Hapahauli, but I have some things to think about, some questions to get answered, and I'm really not very certain, I wouldn't be surprised if Hapahauli is mafia here. This is the part of mafia games I don't like, where I have to make a decision
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 07:08 GMT
#1160
To add: if you still feel this way by the deadline I guess I'd likely go along with it, even if I disagree. But I'd prefer if it would be possible for us (including Fecalfeast) to somehow work through things and agree.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 07:57 GMT
#1161
I find it very unlikely that Hapahauli would be mafia with Vivax. That doesn't line up with their play today (double bus with Vivax being lazy) and doesn't line up with Hapahauli's push on Vivax Day 2.

So if Hapahauli is mafia, it's with raynpelikoneet or Tictock. If it's raynpelikoneet, they'd be going through a lot of theatrics when they could just get a mislynch and collect the win pretty easily. So I don't really believe that either.

Leaves Hapahauli and Tictock. This is a much more believable combination.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 18:01 GMT
#1315
You guys are posting so quickly I admit I had to skim the last 2 pages or I would never have caught up. Sorry for being away for so long, sleepy Trfel was sleepy.
On December 01 2020 19:44 Tictock wrote:
How in the hell do you think I am mafia with Hapa after today? Rayn/Hapa makes no sense either with Rayn literally not wanting to lynch anyone by Hapa all day.
Why can't you be mafia with Hapahauli? And, come to think of it, you really think that Hapahauli and Vivax are mafia together, with how they've pushed each other? But I suppose raynpelikoneet disagrees. And his reasoning makes sense. But I'd like to hear yours?
On December 01 2020 21:03 Hapahauli wrote:
Trfel, you need to stop being convinced by the last person you speak to.
Yeah, I know
On December 02 2020 00:57 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2020 10:47 Fecalfeast wrote:
basically if I believe hapa is town which honestly I do from all this posting and I don't believe trfel is fake JK then it has to be vivax tt and that's kinda nice so I could switch to vivax


If you bother to compare his earlier days posting (sizeable and sparse) with today's posting (fast reactive) do you not reach the conclusion that he changed his posting style to survive?

It just seems logical to me that mafia would squeeze through a last effort here. And I don't think that Hapa switching from aforementioned posting style to one-liner spam should make him town. He fell out of character, so to say.
What? Not wanting to get lynched in MYLO makes someone mafia?

I've got to take another look at the P61 thing and Hapahauli's explanation.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 18:11 GMT
#1333
On December 02 2020 03:07 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 02 2020 03:01 Trfel wrote:
You guys are posting so quickly I admit I had to skim the last 2 pages or I would never have caught up. Sorry for being away for so long, sleepy Trfel was sleepy.
On December 01 2020 19:44 Tictock wrote:
How in the hell do you think I am mafia with Hapa after today? Rayn/Hapa makes no sense either with Rayn literally not wanting to lynch anyone by Hapa all day.
Why can't you be mafia with Hapahauli? And, come to think of it, you really think that Hapahauli and Vivax are mafia together, with how they've pushed each other? But I suppose raynpelikoneet disagrees. And his reasoning makes sense. But I'd like to hear yours?
On December 01 2020 21:03 Hapahauli wrote:
Trfel, you need to stop being convinced by the last person you speak to.
Yeah, I know
On December 02 2020 00:57 Vivax wrote:
On December 01 2020 10:47 Fecalfeast wrote:
basically if I believe hapa is town which honestly I do from all this posting and I don't believe trfel is fake JK then it has to be vivax tt and that's kinda nice so I could switch to vivax


If you bother to compare his earlier days posting (sizeable and sparse) with today's posting (fast reactive) do you not reach the conclusion that he changed his posting style to survive?

It just seems logical to me that mafia would squeeze through a last effort here. And I don't think that Hapa switching from aforementioned posting style to one-liner spam should make him town. He fell out of character, so to say.
What? Not wanting to get lynched in MYLO makes someone mafia?

I've got to take another look at the P61 thing and Hapahauli's explanation.


Who doesn't want to not get lynched at MYLO? That doesn't mean that as town you start spamming after pretending to favour a more condensed style. What Hapa and rayn are doing is clearly disruptive.

I don't see the need to start swearing and spamming, burying more informative posts in the process, and with only two mafia in the thread most likely. The outcome is still undecided and if you and FF (and TT maybe) won't change your mind then fine. I just wish you luck picking the target at night because you will decide the game.
Again, I've never seen Hapahauli play as scum (okay that's kind of a lie, I did try and read one of his games last night, good old 7 years old meta...) but I'd say this is definitely within raynpelikoneet's town range, no? Even if it isn't the most "productive" thing to be doing.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 18:12 GMT
#1335
@Hapahauli, you literally never read raynpelikoneet's case on Fecalfeast?

I can understand missing it in the brief skim, but I thought you would have seen it in the deep read to catch up at least? Or did you skip Day 2 in that read? I'm confused/suspicious here.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 18:19 GMT
#1340
On December 02 2020 03:17 Hapahauli wrote:
I don't know why it is that hard for anyone to understand a) why someone can be pissed off when they get tunneled by Rayn, and then b) why that would encourage that person to make raging/irrational posts.
No I get that, I just wanted to check if the explanation had an inconsistency. That makes more sense for me, now I'll check to make sure it's consistent or not.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 18:24 GMT
#1348
On December 02 2020 03:23 raynpelikoneet wrote:
who wants to lynch TT?
Likely down.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
December 01 2020 18:54 GMT
#1368
@raynpelikoneet, you're saying that in one post Vivax said he's still open to the possibility of Tictock being mafia, and in another post, he said that the only possible explanation was that you (raynpelikoneet) and Hapahauli are mafia together putting on a show, right?
Prev 1 7 8 9 10 11 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 9h 9m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 168
NeuroSwarm 161
RuFF_SC2 14
StarCraft: Brood War
Artosis 843
firebathero 159
ggaemo 97
NaDa 79
Sexy 47
Aegong 33
Bale 7
Icarus 5
Dota 2
monkeys_forever657
Counter-Strike
semphis_23
Super Smash Bros
AZ_Axe229
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor185
Other Games
tarik_tv16895
summit1g11936
gofns8280
JimRising 597
shahzam505
Maynarde157
ViBE124
Livibee50
JuggernautJason38
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1511
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta82
• Hupsaiya 70
• Sammyuel 34
• Kozan
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki27
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift5828
• Rush718
Other Games
• Shiphtur334
Upcoming Events
Wardi Open
9h 9m
OSC
22h 9m
Stormgate Nexus
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
LiuLi Cup
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
[ Show More ]
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
FEL Cracow 2025
CC Div. A S7

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
HCC Europe
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025

Upcoming

ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
Thunderpick World Champ.
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.