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[N]A Mostly Normal Game of Mafia - Page 2

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 00:33 GMT
#294
On November 25 2020 09:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 25 2020 09:29 Trfel wrote:
On November 25 2020 09:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On November 25 2020 09:25 Trfel wrote:
On November 25 2020 09:17 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I think you are morely focused on Vivax' meta and i am focused on his meta and then idk our worlds collide ffs lol.... :D
I don't feel too focused on Vivax's meta? I just know he's a capable scum player, and I don't feel like he's done anything out of that range yet. I'm confident his alignment will become more clear over time, I always think that lynches and deadlines make it much easier to discern players' alignments.

uh.. then we have a problem. because i dont have him as "capable scum player" at all.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. IMO you have to assume someone can play to the top of their scum range, and Vivax has demonstrated at least a decent scum range. Even if typically he hasn't hit that.

I like Vivax's play so far and I'd town lean him I think, but I'm not too confident yet.

I dont understand. Why do we have an argument on Vivax if you agree with me on him?
Because you're highly confident he is town, I'm much closer to null but slightly town?

I wouldn't call it an argument, I was just wanting to know where you were coming from. I now understand, even if I don't agree.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 01:02 GMT
#299
Alakaslam, you around?

What do you think of me? Given that I was your main scumread earlier (at least, I think? trying to interpret your post, correct me if I'm wrong) and it seems you have forgotten about that in your latest list post.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 05:35 GMT
#320
On November 25 2020 12:28 Alakaslam wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 25 2020 10:02 Trfel wrote:
Alakaslam, you around?

What do you think of me? Given that I was your main scumread earlier (at least, I think? trying to interpret your post, correct me if I'm wrong) and it seems you have forgotten about that in your latest list post.

I wasn’t around.

I am now if you still are; and there it is scummier still!

Nah actually it turned into a TR because of Hapa. You can thank him.

So that leaves me sussing TT and Jock
Sorry, I'm back now. Makes enough sense for now, I'll take a look. Still trying to get through everyone's filters.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 05:57 GMT
#323
@Fecalfeast, why can't Alakaslam have a fun tone as mafia, especially given that he much prefers the mafia alignment?

Why are you suspicious of Hapahauli?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 06:32 GMT
#324
Town

Town Lean
Hapahauli + Show Spoiler [explanation] +
Hapahauli has been providing critical thinking and has been very present this game. He's pushing his own ideas (suspicious of Grackaroni).


Null
Alakaslam + Show Spoiler [explanation] +
I admit I've been having some trouble reading Alakaslam this game. My toneread on him suggests that he is town, but his mayoral campaign has been a bit suspect as well.

I dunno. The recent game where he was mafia, he just came in and started sharing random thoughts and relevant reads. Here he's been much more joking but still somewhat connected to the thread. But the substance is really lacking. He's shared one suspicion (? if it's even that), one scumread (soon retracted), and one list post. And he said he'd have more time to play so he'd be sharing all his thoughts.

Beats me.

ShoCkeyy
Grackaroni + Show Spoiler [explanation] +
I stand by the points earlier about Grackaroni's response to me calling out his post. Even moreso than the initial post, his follow-up felt quite off. However, outside of that I could see Grackaroni being town this game. Really, the main other thing I find notable about his filter is that he hasn't really found anything suspicious, except for possibly my interaction with him (which he never really followed up on since then, only answering questions about it; in other words, he hasn't followed up his read on me, or tried to figure out my alignment since then). Despite having a mayoral campaign, he seems very unconcerned about who he wants to lynch.

Tictock + Show Spoiler [explanation] +
He hasn't really said much at all. At least he does have a scumread (Fecalfeast), which is more than I can say for some others. But I'm unfortunately not confident in reading him given the low amount of content.

Fecalfeast
Vivax

Mafia Lean
Jockmcplop + Show Spoiler [explanation] +
I thought there was more in Jockmcplop's filter, but while reading it through again, it's actually quite underwhelming. Jockmcplop presents exactly three ideas:
  • Alakaslam's mayoral campaign is suspicious
  • Grackaroni pointing it out makes him towny
  • Trfel is inconsistent
While there are other things that have happened this game. Jockmcplop seems to have focused on Alakaslam and the things surrounding that, while not paying any attention to the rest of the thread (raynpelikoneet and Hapahauli's back and forth, specifically).

Jockmcplop's play has been pretty bleh so far. It's not terrible, but unremarkable and lacking the critical thinking, substance, and quality that he usually shows as town.

raynpelikoneet + Show Spoiler [explanation] +
I'll start this off by saying that raynpelikoneet is very capable as mafia, in my opinion. With that said, he seems to not care a ton about his reads this game, especially his scumreads. It almost feels disconnected.

To clarify, I mentioned two points earlier about raynpelikoneet: his read on Alakaslam, and lack of stubbornness. I don't think those are very strong anymore, the timing of his read change on Alakaslam matches, and I will always understand/allow someone trying a different playstyle (given that the change isn't mafia motivated).

But his scumreads. First he was suspicious of Hapahauli, but when he was going to bed he posted about his townreads instead. And he didn't really discuss his read on Hapahauli much either. He's explained it of course, but he hasn't been pushing it, which confuses me. Maybe there's some reason why (as town) raynpelikoneet wouldn't want to pursue that at this time, but it's a trend with his other reads too. He is suspicious of ShoCkeyy for being disconnected and not following along (which to me at least is hard to tell, ShoCkeyy has a tendency to not contribute much substance, especially early on). And he is suspicious of Fecalfeast but I don't believe he ever said why. And he's unsure about me and Hapahauli. He later says that his reads are mostly POE, and acknowledges that ShoCkeyy doesn't have reads early on.

It just doesn't quite add up for me. He's campaigning to be mayor, but he's not really got any strong scumreads, just a POE. For a player who has been very present and has been sharing his thoughts, working off of a POE with near-instant townreads and not having solid reasons for scumreading lurkers seems very suspect.

I need to keep thinking about this but raynpelikoneet feels very present in this game, but uninvolved where it matters. Like he's managed to take a backseat despite constantly posting his thoughts. And I feel that that makes him more likely mafia.


Mafia

I know, way too many people are null I'm disappointed about it too. I'll be around for the next hour or so and keep thinking about it, if anyone wants to talk. I'd like to reread Vivax too, I feel like I should have a better read on him by this point.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 06:56 GMT
#325
The more I think about it, the less I like Jockmcplop's criticisms of Alakaslam's mayoral run. I'm not sure how much incentive there is for mafia to want the mayor's bodyguard protection; how likely is it that mafia will be targeted with KP? There is no confirmed town KP, and a third party with KP (while not out of the question) would still have to target him, which is a bit strange too. Nothing Jockmcplop is saying is technically wrong: mafia could campaign to try and get the mayor protection and absolve themselves of responsibility by lynching town's target and getting townreads. But it's just not very compelling. Alakaslam could also be town doing exactly the same thing. The mafia motivation for that kind of play isn't really more compelling than the town motivation, I don't understand how it makes Alakaslam mafia.

I feel like I worded that poorly but it's late at night so I'm not sure if I can say it any better right now. Let me know if that doesn't make sense.

I think Jockmcplop is likely my top suspect at this time.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 08:06 GMT
#329
Sorry Alakaslam, I'm not really sure much of what you are talking about

If you're still around I'd be happy to talk, though I'll likely go to sleep soon. What do you think of Jockmcplop?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 12:20 GMT
#334
On November 25 2020 18:45 Jockmcplop wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 25 2020 15:56 Trfel wrote:
The more I think about it, the less I like Jockmcplop's criticisms of Alakaslam's mayoral run. I'm not sure how much incentive there is for mafia to want the mayor's bodyguard protection; how likely is it that mafia will be targeted with KP? There is no confirmed town KP, and a third party with KP (while not out of the question) would still have to target him, which is a bit strange too. Nothing Jockmcplop is saying is technically wrong: mafia could campaign to try and get the mayor protection and absolve themselves of responsibility by lynching town's target and getting townreads. But it's just not very compelling. Alakaslam could also be town doing exactly the same thing. The mafia motivation for that kind of play isn't really more compelling than the town motivation, I don't understand how it makes Alakaslam mafia.

I feel like I worded that poorly but it's late at night so I'm not sure if I can say it any better right now. Let me know if that doesn't make sense.

I think Jockmcplop is likely my top suspect at this time.


I thought I made it pretty clear I was more critical of you townreading slam than i was of slam's run.

You are exactly right that slam's run *could* be from a town perspective, but my problem was that you immediately assumed it was from a town perspective and didn't even consider the idea that mafia could be doing the same thing for mafia reasons.
@First paragraph: I see, sorry I missed that.

@Second paragraph: It's the way that Alakaslam was going about his campaign that seemed towny to me, not the fact about it. Mostly a tonal read at first. I do think that the "pliability" argument is more likely to come from town, as (in my opinion) lynch blame doesn't really exist and as a result, it feels a bit strange for mafia to come up with that argument. But the tonal read was the main part of my read.

In other news, I really do want you to be town this game But right now, I'm just not seeing it. You feel minimally involved and not very invested. I assume you disagree with my assessment?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 15:34 GMT
#348
I am okay with being mayor, I'm okay with not being mayor. Whatever works best.

Regardless, I think the lynch should be between (in no particular order) Jockmcplop, ShoCkeyy, Fecalfeast, Tictock, and Grackaroni. I'll try and focus on these people. Maybe less inclined to kill Jockmcplop? As his answer earlier is what I was hoping to hear, and I'm interested to see what he does with more time to play.

To filter diving. I'll likely be around for a while.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 15:36 GMT
#350
Oh, and I meant to add, @raynpelikoneet, sorry if I upset you. I never said I was good at the game and don't pretend to be good at the game, I make mistakes all the time. Doesn't stop me from trying as there is no real alternative. I also know my read accuracy tends to be abysmal early on and improve as the game goes on.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 15:54 GMT
#353
Grackaroni, if you are mayor who do you kill? Or who would you consider killing?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 16:14 GMT
#356
Hapahauli, can I ask why you think ShoCkeyy is less interested than normal? To me, in terms of the amount of substance/reads, he seems very typical to me. Or does it have to do with non-substance posting?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 18:43 GMT
#400
Sorry, was napping.

I'm still confused as to why everyone is townreading Jockmcplop. I remember someone said it was because of a good point they raised against me, can someone remind me what point they are thinking of?

Voted for myself, probably time to do that.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 19:01 GMT
#408
I think (other than Jockmcplop, since no one seems to agree with me on that) my preferred lynch is probably Fecalfeast.

I like Tictock's push for raynpelikoneet to be mayor (I mean, I don't like it but it seems slightly town-motivated) because it shows that he is here, present, an cares about the game. He didn't really need to do anything, but he's making reads and is invested in them.

Fecalfeast's play has been obviously very disconnected, he doesn't even seem to care that there is a decent chance he could be lynched. To be honest I am not sure that he is mafia, but I have no misgivings about lynching him and I'm not sure that he will get easier to read over time. I know that he likes to hide in the background as mafia, and it feels like he is doing that this game.

And then there's Grackaroni. I don't like how he came up with so many reads so suddenly after being cautious with his reads earlier. Maybe he is mafia here after all.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 19:05 GMT
#412
On November 26 2020 04:03 Hapahauli wrote:
I think lynching into TT/FF is a bad idea based on recent posting. Neither of them really have that survivalist instinct that I'd associate with mafia in this position.

I once again would like Grack lynched.
Yeah, I can get behind that. The main reason I would prefer lynching Fecalfeast to Grackaroni is that if Fecalfeast continues to play in this manner, I'm not sure he will be any easier to read in the future. I have higher hopes for Grackaroni to make his play more clear.

Outside of that though I guess Grackaroni seems to have a higher chance of flipping mafia.

I will submit Grackaroni as the lynch in case I end up being elected.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 19:06 GMT
#415
On November 26 2020 04:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2020 04:01 Trfel wrote:
I think (other than Jockmcplop, since no one seems to agree with me on that) my preferred lynch is probably Fecalfeast.

I thought you were already going back on that, i mean you literally said so.
Which part, the Jockmcplop or the Fecalfeast part?

I never went back on my Jockmcplop read. Yes, I changed my mind just now to prefer lynching Grackaroni to Fecalfeast.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 19:07 GMT
#417
On November 26 2020 04:05 Hapahauli wrote:
This game made me realize how much I hate mayor voting.
Just wait until tomorrow, where we have majority voting...
On November 26 2020 04:05 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2020 04:01 Trfel wrote:
because it shows that he is here, present, an cares about the game.


Yeah one hour from EoD and at risk of getting lynched.
Fair enough. Bleh.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 19:08 GMT
#418
On November 26 2020 04:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I meant on Jock. Here you say this.
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2020 00:34 Trfel wrote:

Regardless, I think the lynch should be between (in no particular order) Jockmcplop, ShoCkeyy, Fecalfeast, Tictock, and Grackaroni. I'll try and focus on these people. Maybe less inclined to kill Jockmcplop? As his answer earlier is what I was hoping to hear, and I'm interested to see what he does with more time to play.

This means he is NOT your preferred lynch target no?
Frankly I don't know where I stand on Jockmcplop. When I was excluding him a few posts ago, I didn't mean that he was my #1 lynch target, I simply meant that I was excluding him from my thinking surrounding that process.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 19:09 GMT
#419
On November 26 2020 04:08 Trfel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2020 04:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I meant on Jock. Here you say this.
On November 26 2020 00:34 Trfel wrote:

Regardless, I think the lynch should be between (in no particular order) Jockmcplop, ShoCkeyy, Fecalfeast, Tictock, and Grackaroni. I'll try and focus on these people. Maybe less inclined to kill Jockmcplop? As his answer earlier is what I was hoping to hear, and I'm interested to see what he does with more time to play.

This means he is NOT your preferred lynch target no?
Frankly I don't know where I stand on Jockmcplop. When I was excluding him a few posts ago, I didn't mean that he was my #1 lynch target, I simply meant that I was excluding him from my thinking surrounding that process.
EBWOP: I still scumread Jockmcplop. I don't know where exactly he ranks on my order of who to lynch.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
November 25 2020 19:14 GMT
#422
On November 26 2020 04:10 Vivax wrote:
Trfel I don't really want a Grack lynch. Can we arrange that or do I vote another mayor?

Not because he's supertown or anything but I think he's enjoyable to play with.

Lynching Shockeyy would also help, because I have a hunch that I'm going to think he's mafia at some point anyway based on past experiences. And now I can't tell what he is. Why allow a pokerface in town?
Yes, I agree that Grackaroni is enjoyable to play with, and in that sense I'd like to keep him around longer, but I do think he has an okay chance of being mafia here.

I can take another look at ShoCkeyy, I do think he could be mafia, I guess I would prefer to have reasons why he is mafia before lynching him though. I don't really like lynching people if I can't say why they are mafia.

I'm not certain about voting for Grackaroni, we can talk about it, though I don't mind if you want to vote for someone else for mayor either. If you and Hapahauli could agree on someone that would help too.

Can I ask what you don't like about the reasons Hapahauli brought up to suspect Grackaroni?
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