[M][N] Holy Guardians - Chapter 2 - Page 24

On April 07 2020 06:23 Hapahauli wrote:
BloodyCobber looks the worst to me for three reasons:
1) As I mentioned on Day 1, his Shockey read was pulled out of his ass, and is inconsistent with his approach to the game and general townie paranoia.
2) His behavior around Jock and the lynch, at face value, are very pro-Mafia.
3) His post activity surrounding Jock are again, at face value, consistent with an uncoordinated and unsophisticated mafia team.

---

The Read on Shockey

I'm just going to re-summarize my case for the sake of completeness, and hopefully give some people who were discounting my initial words some more clarity on why I felt as strongly as I did.

Playing as mafia is about creating an illusion of contribution. Contributing to discussion without actually contributing. Taking bold and hard stances without actually taking a risk. Covering your interactions with your partner just enough to avoid suspicion, while allowing you to coordinate with each other towards mafia objectives.

In addition, mafia also play with extra information. They know who's town. Whereas townies often display paranoia, since they are constantly uncertain, especially in the early game.

With these two points in mind, take a look at BC's read list.



Firstly, considering what Shockey had done until this point in the game, a slight-town read is not consistent with a paranoid town mindset. Take a look at Shockey's filter and look from the beginning to post #117. There's very little in there. So much so that multiple players were making remarks that Shockey was just coasting along and not contributing much. BC later even acknowledges this and re-bumps Shockey down to null, likely in an attempt to save face (spoilerized below).

Instead, his first read list is consistent with a mafia-mindset who knows that Shockey is town, and is naturally not-all-that-suspicious.

+ Show Spoiler +

Secondly, and as explained before, the whole rationale behind the read is contrived bullshit. For that, we need to look at the "story" that BloodyCobbler is trying to tell about his town play. BloodyCobber is telling the story that he is reading player filters for the content that they are posting. He considers "substanceless" posting indicative of a mafia tell. Examples are abound:

Regarding his scumread on me (Hapa):


On Trefel:


His stuff on Vivax is especially damning:


... this post on vivax is suggestive that his "method" of early-game tells is just to look for people who seem "contentless" and re-evaluate them as the game goes on. He is willing to cast suspicion on play that he "dislike[s] / view[s] as bad" early on.


Given this mentality of reading for "substanceless posting", it is then inconceivable from a town-BC perspective that he would read Shockey's filter and come out with slightly town. Again, see Shockeyy's filter to post #117:

https://tl.net/forum/mafia/558350-holy-guardians-chapter-2?user=ShoCkeyy

There is NO. FUCKING. WAY. That he could genuinely read Shockey as having any substance. Therefore his read is bullshit. Mafia attempting to contribute bullshit reads, and thereby not contributing. Playing with extra information, and therefore knowing that Shockey is town rather than being suspicious of him.

On April 07 2020 23:28 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Fine. First of all i mostly wanted to play with you so i am annoyed at what you did during the eod1, regardless the out outcome. So fuck you for that.

I tend to play differently than other people. I dont like games where you lynch the low volume posters and most likely win. That translates towards me trying to figure out the "high-profile" mafia players over random lurk-shit-scum, if you know what i mean. That additionally translates to me being super bad and going ham on people like Palmar when they play a low-post-count play (which i am not used to that much) but are right. That's also why i don't play anymore, i can't justify me playing and trying to put shit together just to find out we lost because 20 people didnt play and 6 of those we lynched were townies. Idk if you can see my pov but yeah, that's it.

Talking about people who did bad shit without reason.

I think your case on BC is good, the way he handles shockeyy in comparison to his other scumreads that "talked but didn't contribute anything towards the game". I might have missed your point on D1 or you might have not made it clear enough, but i don't care. It's a good case and BC is probably mafia and i am just super bad this game.

If it is not BC it's gonna be shockeyy, i genuinely find it "why the fuck would mafia do that????" kind of thing when he needed to justify his vote on you over Jock, but if we talk about things that make no sense then yeah that makes no fucking sense at all. Why would anyone ever NOT want to vote for their scumread over another person if the other person is not that scummy?

Third is Trfel. There are things that are just plain out bad. No matter how his case on me was, it was based on "yo rayn isn't playing like this in situation X but i dont know how rayn plays in situation X"... Why.... how can you even say that?

I know there is one mafia left and at least two of those people are town, it's fucked up for me because of what i tend to do and how i form my scumreads. I tend to think people make the best choices available and for... or like if i think about Jock, the mafia has to be you (or Trfel), because that's the correct play as mafia. Basically you're never gonna lose.

But dumbass logic (that's often right) says BC -> Shockeyy.

Chezinu is super town, i agree on what you said on him 12312313%. No bus there.
You're probably town too.
Vivax is town and i think he is faking a read on BC atm just to stay alive, which is dumb but hey he does that.

On April 07 2020 23:28 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Fine. First of all i mostly wanted to play with you so i am annoyed at what you did during the eod1, regardless the out outcome. So fuck you for that.

I tend to play differently than other people. I dont like games where you lynch the low volume posters and most likely win. That translates towards me trying to figure out the "high-profile" mafia players over random lurk-shit-scum, if you know what i mean. That additionally translates to me being super bad and going ham on people like Palmar when they play a low-post-count play (which i am not used to that much) but are right. That's also why i don't play anymore, i can't justify me playing and trying to put shit together just to find out we lost because 20 people didnt play and 6 of those we lynched were townies. Idk if you can see my pov but yeah, that's it.