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oups, cut the quote... it was from foleys case against TT
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Okay... Can some of the people who Hard-Town Foreman explain their reasons to me?
I can't find them myself, but I would love some eye opener.
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is NU just reposting his old posts?
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Okay, as I'm soon slipping into lower activity, I want to quickly leave a summary here about what I think so far:
① NeverUnlucky - null
- as just explained here, I'm going back to Null on him. My original points can be clever scum play by him or just his current ragemode. I basically liked his non-Calix reads, but keeps the quantity of that useful stuff low by always going back on Calix. Will reevaluate at a later day when topics have shifted and I have seen more from him.
② Calix - townlean
- Calix started out good, stirring up dust, causing conversations. Her last couple of hours were kinda useless, as she was busy with NU. I will for now dismiss this mudfight like I did with NU. What puts Calix above NU is the fact that while I can see an agenda in NUs play especially with my doubts about him earlier, I don't see it with Calix, as I valued her openning far more. But similar to NU, I wish to see other topics discussed to reevaluate.
④ Foreman - scumlean
- I for now write scumlean instead of scum. Simply because there must be something I'm missing here. For no reason seeral people have him toptown??? What is it? Am I really tunneling here? But if no good argument is brought, he remains my #1 lynch
⑤ Rels - Neut
I explained myself here. I'm waiting on his answers before I start judging.
⑥ darthfoley - townlean
I want to revisit him as soon as I have time. I actually envy his clean posting style, it is something I have to learn from. For now his thought process seem calm, looking in all directions and I can follow his ideas well. The ability to concede a point, when receiving an explanation is very refreshing. As said, he will be revisited soon. Not only to reevaluate my judgement on him but also to go through his points again.
⑦ Tictock - townlean
TT is very similar to foley for me so far in what I got from him. Clearly structured, easy to read and reasonable cases with a logical thought process. Also on my filterdive list.
⑧ ExO_ - scumlean
Everything I said here is still true to me, as he hasnt posted since then. As it looks like I won't get any support for a Foreman wagon, Exo is my clear second choice for a lynch.
⑨ Skynx - Neut
The third player I want to filterdive/reevaluate. More then half of his posts are just insulting others about bad style without him doing anything. He made those 2 wot posts... I answered the part about me, I will have to check the rest again. If there is a race between Skynx and anyone but Exo/Foreman he would get my vote, but this is more a policy lynch than anything else. I hope I don't have to do it. (or I find time to investigate him again before the deadline, so I can have a more informed opinion on him)
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On November 04 2016 04:01 darthfoley wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 03:30 Foreman wrote:On November 04 2016 02:48 darthfoley wrote:
I'd also appreciate Foreman's reads when he gets a chance Sure, as soon as you explain your read of me, which was given before you know my reads of everyone else. So the majority of my read on you is based off of your interactions with mahrgell. Although nothing you've done has screamed uber town, small things like you not really giving a shit about how people view your playstyle leads me to believe that you're playing your own style and not trying to conform to "please" other towns. Basically the antithesis of buddying. I liked this post specifically Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 23:59 Foreman wrote:On November 03 2016 21:42 mahrgell wrote:
. Scum has usually 2 options:
a) make up stuff
b) reinforce shitty assumptions by townies
Meanwhile a townie sees what I see. So if I feel myself completely unable to follow the line of thought of a player, this is a scumlean for me. In the end, I have to judge if the different judgements made by other players are due to different character or due to hidden agenda.
This is terribad. So any townie that you disagree with is scummy to you?
Because like, two town can't see the same thing and have completely different thoughts about the same situation, what with the fact that everybody has identical environmental factors and upbringing, amirite? Oh wait... This is a bit of a segue, but mahrgell says a townie sees what I see. So if I feel myself completely unable to follow the line of thought of a player, this is a scumlean for meSo naturally, you'd think he would scum read Rels, after all... Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 23:41 mahrgell wrote:
About Rels. I agree with basically none of his reads, pretty apparent with his 3 top town being my top scum. But there is one thing you can't blame him for: Trying to blend in. I would love to see him explaining his controversial reads.
Mainly I'm interested in:
- why does he town NU
- why does he town Foreman - I can see people not agreeing my concerns regarding foreman, but seriously, what has he done to make him a townread???)
- what makes foley scummy? - "hates post" okay... Tell me more.
Share your thought process. I haven't seen any reasoning on those reads and admit they don't make sense to me. and eventually, in his last large post, claims that he views Rels neutrally. Which doesn't make sense considering his prescribed stance from earlier. This scum read of mine of mahrgell helps me consider you to be town. Why'd you change your vote off of mahrgell to Skynx?
Phonepost...
Read again. I said i want rels explanations before i judge.
So far i see:
Controversial reads, not even trying to blend in - townish
Reads lacking reasons - scummish
I want him to explain himself. If i can make sense out of how he came to his reads... that makes him towny for me. If i cant: i consider him more scummish
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On November 04 2016 04:58 darthfoley wrote:
TL;DR mahrgell's read on Rels is surprisingly safe considering that Rels is viewing town completely opposite from mahrgell; this is a supposed scum tell from earlier, yet he doesn't scum tell him.
I'm arguing more for mahrgell being sus than Rels btw. The team thing was a little facetious
Wtf? I have Rels on null. With a clear anouncement that I consider him scumlean if he does not deliver a good explanation. Are you even reading?
And as you asked for the contrast to Foreman: I asked him out too. just that he refused any kind of answer with his amazing style, and went on doing exactly what I criticized.
If Rels continues doing completely unfounded reads you are right, he will be the same as Foreman. But so far... he has not responded, so I keep him on Null. If he wonnt respond at all until end of the day... I will go with what I said so for: scumlean him. (which in return would have to make me rethink my other scumleans... having too many is not a situation im comfortable with)
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On November 04 2016 06:21 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 02:37 mahrgell wrote:On November 04 2016 02:16 darthfoley wrote:On November 03 2016 22:54 Tictock wrote:On November 03 2016 21:37 Rels wrote:On November 03 2016 21:30 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 03 2016 21:24 Rels wrote:On November 03 2016 03:29 ExO_ wrote:
Also to clarify why I'm claiming my VT role right now:
I'm getting it out the open right now. I think in a game this size trying to fake claim to get scum to target me would be a waste of time. So I'm letting everyone know now I don't have any abilities I cannot do anything at night and can only vote. You can choose to either believe me or not, but I'm telling the truth This makes ExO very likely town Explain. 1. It is obviously anti town to seriously claim VT at the start of the game. Scum usually don't do obvious scummy things, on the contrary they try to be townie. It's WIFOM, but in mafia the simplest explanation is often the right one. 2. It removes ExO's ability to fakeclaim if he's scum, which is a great tool as scum, and even more in semi open setup like the one we're playing. Eh, I like this thinking but I think your first point is moot since Exo stated several times that he doesn't think his claim is bad for town. I'm actually seeing more of a disconnect between how much he talked about why he claimed and yet never realized why that claim might be bad.I suppose since this is a newbie game I should elaborate on why a VT claim is bad for town. Basically it makes mafia's side goal of killing off blue roles that much easier. If you are VT and claim it is essentially helping mafia blue hunt by narrowing the pool of people they want to look into. Why do you "like this thinking" if you admit that his first point is null and you don't respond to the second point? If it's all null or NAI, what is there to like? TT's discussion of Rels seems super off to me. I can indeed see a townish interpretation to what Rels said here and can see myself saying the same(stylewise, not in this specific case), so I disagree with you for now. But I would actually like Rels to answer this himself, to see if his motivation matches my thoughts. What do you want me to answer to ?
I was referencing to a post you answered just before earlier:
On November 04 2016 05:48 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 23:41 mahrgell wrote:
About Rels. I agree with basically none of his reads, pretty apparent with his 3 top town being my top scum. But there is one thing you can't blame him for: Trying to blend in. I would love to see him explaining his controversial reads.
Mainly I'm interested in:
- why does he town NU
- why does he town Foreman - I can see people not agreeing my concerns regarding foreman, but seriously, what has he done to make him a townread???)
- what makes foley scummy? - "hates post" okay... Tell me more.
Share your thought process. I haven't seen any reasoning on those reads and admit they don't make sense to me. I townread NU mainly for a pretty bad reason: that he posted his "mafia metric" team. This is a pretty awful reason 'cause it's based on out-of-the-game thing but that's my main reason to believe NU is town. Outside of that his attitude is also pretty townie and matches the town meta I know of him. Foreman, I read a lot of posts where he was just blunt and not posting BS. I think his tone is super townie. DF I'll have to reread, I just thought his entrance post was super bad. More on everything when I'm caught up and can reread filters.
Okay, I understand your NU point. I noticed this as well, but what struck me with that was something else: At the point NU posted it (here)... not even a day had passed. In fact he claimed to have sent it during the night before. Well... At this point in time mafiametrics were supposed to be sent in every 24 hours.
So either NU sucks badly at reading what cakepie wrote... Or he simply didn't read it because he isn't invited to participate in it anyway and used this badly prepared "towntell" for someone like you to pick it up.
---
Foreman: I see where you are coming from, again. Honestly, if you are right, I would consider it rather sad, but I guess the "be a dick" meta is really the current thing. But here I still lack any attempt by Foremen to progress the game. Okay, let him be blunt, let him be the noBS type. But what did he contribute?
At this point I actually question myself, as I seem to be the only one not liking Foremen. But I simply can't get it. All reasons for him to be town sound like yours "He doesnt give a fuck about others". Yeah, but maybe it would be a useful trait to actually give a fuck about others.
---
DF: You were asked by others too, what struck you as bad about DFs initial post? I have enough reason to reconsider DF myself in the light of the latest posts, but while I didn't consider his first post as outstanding novelty, I didn't get the same shitty feeling you described having.
---
Rels, yourself: Actually, I would like to hear more from you. At this point it looks like we are coming from very different angles. Our reads are still kinda diametral opposites. I could accept your Foreman and NU reasoning, also I explained why I think different. That thing about the first DF post feels off to me, so feel free to clarify.
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On November 04 2016 07:06 Rels wrote:
Now the only redeeming thing in DF filter is his push on mahrgell. mahrgell has been super careful with his reads all game and it's true he's again hiding behind "I'll wait for Rels' answers!" to not commit a read on me.
I'm available for some time, so let's talk it out and we will get to something.
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On November 04 2016 07:13 Calix wrote:
Not gonna lie, I have yet to send in a single MafiaMetric read.
Clearly a scumtell!!!
+ Show Spoiler +
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On November 04 2016 07:15 NeverUnlucky wrote:
mahr, with cakepie's announcement, I'm pretty much mod-confirmed.
Is this your thing? Trying to modconfirm yourself day1?
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On November 04 2016 07:18 NeverUnlucky wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 07:17 mahrgell wrote:On November 04 2016 07:15 NeverUnlucky wrote:
mahr, with cakepie's announcement, I'm pretty much mod-confirmed. Is this your thing? Trying to modconfirm yourself day1? I did not actively try to reach this status.
You just actively used it and brought it up.
And yes, I guess cakepies post indeed softhints at you being a townie. This in a way saddens me, because I consider it gameruining.
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On November 04 2016 07:21 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 07:12 mahrgell wrote:On November 04 2016 06:21 Rels wrote:On November 04 2016 02:37 mahrgell wrote:On November 04 2016 02:16 darthfoley wrote:On November 03 2016 22:54 Tictock wrote:On November 03 2016 21:37 Rels wrote:On November 03 2016 21:30 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 03 2016 21:24 Rels wrote:On November 03 2016 03:29 ExO_ wrote:
Also to clarify why I'm claiming my VT role right now:
I'm getting it out the open right now. I think in a game this size trying to fake claim to get scum to target me would be a waste of time. So I'm letting everyone know now I don't have any abilities I cannot do anything at night and can only vote. You can choose to either believe me or not, but I'm telling the truth This makes ExO very likely town Explain. 1. It is obviously anti town to seriously claim VT at the start of the game. Scum usually don't do obvious scummy things, on the contrary they try to be townie. It's WIFOM, but in mafia the simplest explanation is often the right one. 2. It removes ExO's ability to fakeclaim if he's scum, which is a great tool as scum, and even more in semi open setup like the one we're playing. Eh, I like this thinking but I think your first point is moot since Exo stated several times that he doesn't think his claim is bad for town. I'm actually seeing more of a disconnect between how much he talked about why he claimed and yet never realized why that claim might be bad.I suppose since this is a newbie game I should elaborate on why a VT claim is bad for town. Basically it makes mafia's side goal of killing off blue roles that much easier. If you are VT and claim it is essentially helping mafia blue hunt by narrowing the pool of people they want to look into. Why do you "like this thinking" if you admit that his first point is null and you don't respond to the second point? If it's all null or NAI, what is there to like? TT's discussion of Rels seems super off to me. I can indeed see a townish interpretation to what Rels said here and can see myself saying the same(stylewise, not in this specific case), so I disagree with you for now. But I would actually like Rels to answer this himself, to see if his motivation matches my thoughts. What do you want me to answer to ? I was referencing to a post you answered just before earlier: On November 04 2016 05:48 Rels wrote:On November 03 2016 23:41 mahrgell wrote:
About Rels. I agree with basically none of his reads, pretty apparent with his 3 top town being my top scum. But there is one thing you can't blame him for: Trying to blend in. I would love to see him explaining his controversial reads.
Mainly I'm interested in:
- why does he town NU
- why does he town Foreman - I can see people not agreeing my concerns regarding foreman, but seriously, what has he done to make him a townread???)
- what makes foley scummy? - "hates post" okay... Tell me more.
Share your thought process. I haven't seen any reasoning on those reads and admit they don't make sense to me. I townread NU mainly for a pretty bad reason: that he posted his "mafia metric" team. This is a pretty awful reason 'cause it's based on out-of-the-game thing but that's my main reason to believe NU is town. Outside of that his attitude is also pretty townie and matches the town meta I know of him. Foreman, I read a lot of posts where he was just blunt and not posting BS. I think his tone is super townie. DF I'll have to reread, I just thought his entrance post was super bad. More on everything when I'm caught up and can reread filters. Okay, I understand your NU point. I noticed this as well, but what struck me with that was something else: At the point NU posted it ( here)... not even a day had passed. In fact he claimed to have sent it during the night before. Well... At this point in time mafiametrics were supposed to be sent in every 24 hours. So either NU sucks badly at reading what cakepie wrote... Or he simply didn't read it because he isn't invited to participate in it anyway and used this badly prepared "towntell" for someone like you to pick it up. --- Foreman: I see where you are coming from, again. Honestly, if you are right, I would consider it rather sad, but I guess the "be a dick" meta is really the current thing. But here I still lack any attempt by Foremen to progress the game. Okay, let him be blunt, let him be the noBS type. But what did he contribute? At this point I actually question myself, as I seem to be the only one not liking Foremen. But I simply can't get it. All reasons for him to be town sound like yours "He doesnt give a fuck about others". Yeah, but maybe it would be a useful trait to actually give a fuck about others. --- DF: You were asked by others too, what struck you as bad about DFs initial post? I have enough reason to reconsider DF myself in the light of the latest posts, but while I didn't consider his first post as outstanding novelty, I didn't get the same shitty feeling you described having. --- Rels, yourself: Actually, I would like to hear more from you. At this point it looks like we are coming from very different angles. Our reads are still kinda diametral opposites. I could accept your Foreman and NU reasoning, also I explained why I think different. That thing about the first DF post feels off to me, so feel free to clarify. NU: I disagree, this kind of thing comes more often from town than not. And I had the proof last game that NU really plays like that as town. About the 24h thing, actually scum fakeclaims are in general way more clean than town fakeclaims. Foreman: well on a meta level I agree with you, but it is true regardless. Foreman's tone is townie. DF: read further and you'll find things. You're not a newb right ? Can you link to your own forum ?
This is my first forum mafia game but I have RL mafia experience.
If you really wish, this can be confirmed, but that is out-of-game stuff.
About DF: I was specifically asking about your judgement on his first post. You mentioned several times you "hate it", disliked it etc.. If you have detailed this more in some answer, I missed it. Can you link me?
I said, that the more recent DF posts have been changing my view, but I lacked the time to fully go over him again.
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On November 04 2016 07:32 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 06:12 Rels wrote:On November 04 2016 01:39 NeverUnlucky wrote:for rels Well, this quote isn't as good as I remembered it to be. There are certain points which I still like, others make me uncertain. On November 03 2016 05:30 darthfoley wrote:
Had a read through, albeit quick because I won't be on later until like 7pm and don't want to read through 40 pages in one sitting.
I agree that a lot of the stuff so far is NAI. I think ExO vs. Calix could be TvT and was blown out of proportion based off a gif. Why does he think it could be tvt if most of the stuff is NAI? Also, saying that the Exo - Calix thingy was based off a gif is a mischaracterization of what happened I think. However, I don't like this post. Who spends 4 lines discussing why the claimed VT? This is a super waste of a post.On November 03 2016 03:29 ExO_ wrote:
Also to clarify why I'm claiming my VT role right now:
I'm getting it out the open right now. I think in a game this size trying to fake claim to get scum to target me would be a waste of time. So I'm letting everyone know now I don't have any abilities I cannot do anything at night and can only vote. You can choose to either believe me or not, but I'm telling the truth I don't like this post. This comes off as scummy scummy buddy buddy On November 03 2016 04:32 mahrgell wrote:gosh Calix, can we please stop post synced? Also after what I read from you last game I'm afraid of myself, if I share your thoughts... I don't want to be like you  Sorry. I also don't think the theoretical discussion of anti-town vs. pro-scum has much use if it's kept theoretical. Mind meld. Foreman completely writing off Calix basically because of one push is helping town at all. Seems like uber tunneling that never actually helps town. Don't see any post so far that screams scum SO hard that I wouldn't entertain the possibility that my read on someone was wrong. Seems a bit scummy to me, especially D1. I agree with Skynx that the votes so far have been really dumb and useless drama Foreman did not write off Calix ._. He says that his reads could be wrong, but never stated his reads prior to this... zzz Obviously no post will scream scum. Calix is a slight town read to me currently. I agreed that Skynx's posts were useless until he posted about the votes. Bruh, that post he's referring to is Skynx saying "These posts are shit" and quotes Foreman and ExO's votes on Calix. How is that useful? How does he go from agreeing with Skynx in the previous paragraph to saying that his posts are useless? I'll be back in about three hours, keep posting away I can see why you hated it. Yeah that post was awful. And I don't understand why the fixation on Skynx on this post. He was mentioned three times: "I agree that a lot of the stuff so far is NAI" (Skynx was the one saying that) "I agree with Skynx that the votes so far have been really dumb and useless drama" "I agreed that Skynx's posts were useless until he posted about the votes." Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 06:15 Rels wrote:
LOL rereading the last two sentences it doesnt have match up
DF WHY THE FUCK would you go from "YEAH SKYNX IS RIGHT ALMOST EVERYTHING IS USELESS" to "SKYNX POSTS WERE USELESS" ? You apparently agreed with Skynx that there was not much to talk about ? Why did you consider Skynx posts useless when you agreed with them ? Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 07:05 Rels wrote:On November 04 2016 07:00 Calix wrote:On November 04 2016 06:12 Rels wrote:On November 04 2016 01:39 NeverUnlucky wrote:for rels Well, this quote isn't as good as I remembered it to be. There are certain points which I still like, others make me uncertain. On November 03 2016 05:30 darthfoley wrote:
Had a read through, albeit quick because I won't be on later until like 7pm and don't want to read through 40 pages in one sitting.
I agree that a lot of the stuff so far is NAI. I think ExO vs. Calix could be TvT and was blown out of proportion based off a gif. Why does he think it could be tvt if most of the stuff is NAI? Also, saying that the Exo - Calix thingy was based off a gif is a mischaracterization of what happened I think. However, I don't like this post. Who spends 4 lines discussing why the claimed VT? This is a super waste of a post.On November 03 2016 03:29 ExO_ wrote:
Also to clarify why I'm claiming my VT role right now:
I'm getting it out the open right now. I think in a game this size trying to fake claim to get scum to target me would be a waste of time. So I'm letting everyone know now I don't have any abilities I cannot do anything at night and can only vote. You can choose to either believe me or not, but I'm telling the truth I don't like this post. This comes off as scummy scummy buddy buddy On November 03 2016 04:32 mahrgell wrote:gosh Calix, can we please stop post synced? Also after what I read from you last game I'm afraid of myself, if I share your thoughts... I don't want to be like you Sorry. I also don't think the theoretical discussion of anti-town vs. pro-scum has much use if it's kept theoretical. Mind meld. Foreman completely writing off Calix basically because of one push is helping town at all. Seems like uber tunneling that never actually helps town. Don't see any post so far that screams scum SO hard that I wouldn't entertain the possibility that my read on someone was wrong. Seems a bit scummy to me, especially D1. I agree with Skynx that the votes so far have been really dumb and useless drama Foreman did not write off Calix ._. He says that his reads could be wrong, but never stated his reads prior to this... zzz Obviously no post will scream scum. Calix is a slight town read to me currently. I agreed that Skynx's posts were useless until he posted about the votes. Bruh, that post he's referring to is Skynx saying "These posts are shit" and quotes Foreman and ExO's votes on Calix. How is that useful? How does he go from agreeing with Skynx in the previous paragraph to saying that his posts are useless? I'll be back in about three hours, keep posting away I can see why you hated it. Yeah that post was awful. And I don't understand why the fixation on Skynx on this post. He was mentioned three times: "I agree that a lot of the stuff so far is NAI" (Skynx was the one saying that) "I agree with Skynx that the votes so far have been really dumb and useless drama" "I agreed that Skynx's posts were useless until he posted about the votes." This is more directed at your next post, but I don't understand your argument. I'm assuming that you're talking about this, right? I agree with Skynx that the votes so far have been really dumb and useless drama
Calix is a slight town read to me currently. I agreed that Skynx's posts were useless until he posted about the votes. I don't see the incongruency. Isn't he basically saying "Skynx was useless until he posted about the votes and I agree with him that the votes are dumb and useless"? Now that I've written it out like that, that's a pretty weird thing to say since it doesn't say much at all and the way it's worded makes it sound like he slight-town-read me because I agreed that Skynx was useless. But I don't think it's inconsistent. Nope. He didn't say "Skynx was useless until he posted about the votes and I agree with him that the votes are dumb and useless" He said "Skynx said everything was NAI and I agree with him", then "I agree Skynx' psots were useless until that very last one about the votes". Basically he both agrees that these posts are useless but also agree with them: + Show Spoiler +On November 03 2016 04:12 Skynx wrote:
Man you guys are way too fun to read On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? On November 03 2016 04:58 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 04:56 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? To generate conversation so that the not-yet-here people have something constructive to add, of course. What is your strategy to find scum if we're doing a poor job of it? Add something constructive when i find opportunity to do so. Like I'm doing now, stopping you guys go overboard with surjective NAI stuff cuz it really means absolutely nothing what you guys accuse each other for in past few pages  On November 03 2016 05:05 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 05:00 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:58 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:56 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? To generate conversation so that the not-yet-here people have something constructive to add, of course. What is your strategy to find scum if we're doing a poor job of it? Add something constructive when i find opportunity to do so. Like I'm doing now, stopping you guys go overboard with surjective NAI stuff cuz it really means absolutely nothing what you guys accuse each other for in past few pages Oh wonderful, that means that you can tell us how my case on NU doesn't show scum-indicative behaviour Do you have any reads at all? I'm skeptical that you have no initial impressions at all. Here is what happened; Calix sr Exo (gif stuff) Exo sr Calix (doesn't like his push) Everyone sr Everyone (because all pushes are very surjective and doesn't mean anything and everyone is aware of that so might aswell sr the others) What you are asking right now makes sense in that regard as me suggesting you guys pushing NAI stuff on eachother means I should also sr you guys but its just not right and this is all really nothing productive in the end. On November 03 2016 05:10 Skynx wrote:
I mean I really dunno what to add here, its just NAI guys.
Can we talk about like flowers and butterflies? On November 03 2016 05:14 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 05:10 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 05:05 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 05:00 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:58 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:56 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? To generate conversation so that the not-yet-here people have something constructive to add, of course. What is your strategy to find scum if we're doing a poor job of it? Add something constructive when i find opportunity to do so. Like I'm doing now, stopping you guys go overboard with surjective NAI stuff cuz it really means absolutely nothing what you guys accuse each other for in past few pages Oh wonderful, that means that you can tell us how my case on NU doesn't show scum-indicative behaviour Do you have any reads at all? I'm skeptical that you have no initial impressions at all. Here is what happened; Calix sr Exo (gif stuff) Exo sr Calix (doesn't like his push) Everyone sr Everyone (because all pushes are very surjective and doesn't mean anything and everyone is aware of that so might aswell sr the others) What you are asking right now makes sense in that regard as me suggesting you guys pushing NAI stuff on eachother means I should also sr you guys but its just not right and this is all really nothing productive in the end. Fact-check. I never stated a scum-read on ExO. "all pushes are very subjective" - It's Day 1. Of course they are going to be 'subjective'. In fact, almost every single push in the history of mafia is 'subjective'. That doesn't mean you just do nothing since town has to be proactive to gain information, etc etc. This is all very obvious stuff so I won't drone on. With that in mind, your approach is very hard to understand to me. Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 03:08 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 03:06 ExO_ wrote:On November 03 2016 03:04 Calix wrote:
NU's boring. Nothing new to see there.
ExO, should I be asking why you're not 'largely communicating in gifs'? Don't get me wrong, I'm glad you're not, but I'm curious as to what made you change your mind. ![[image loading]](http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq303/neko_riddles/Fighting_Over_Marisa_From_Touhou_Pr.gif) So if you ARE mainly communicating in gifs then why claim a role first thing before doing that? Seems illogical for town to do. On November 03 2016 05:15 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 05:11 Foreman wrote:On November 03 2016 05:05 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 05:00 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:58 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:56 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? To generate conversation so that the not-yet-here people have something constructive to add, of course. What is your strategy to find scum if we're doing a poor job of it? Add something constructive when i find opportunity to do so. Like I'm doing now, stopping you guys go overboard with surjective NAI stuff cuz it really means absolutely nothing what you guys accuse each other for in past few pages Oh wonderful, that means that you can tell us how my case on NU doesn't show scum-indicative behaviour Do you have any reads at all? I'm skeptical that you have no initial impressions at all. Here is what happened; Calix sr Exo (gif stuff) Exo sr Calix (doesn't like his push) Everyone sr Everyone (because all pushes are very surjective and doesn't mean anything and everyone is aware of that so might aswell sr the others) What you are asking right now makes sense in that regard as me suggesting you guys pushing NAI stuff on eachother means I should also sr you guys but its just not right and this is all really nothing productive in the end. Here is what happened: Skynx entered thread Skynx complained about unproductive content Skynx provided unproductive content What you are doing right now is worse than anything you've complained about, because you should be of the mindset that providing even more unproductive content would only make our situation worse, given your remarks. Well, Calix is the one to make me explain how NAI stuff is NAI you can blame him for that if you really want to. I'm just here to drink milk and fuck bitches. The posta bout the votes is: + Show Spoiler +On November 03 2016 05:18 Skynx wrote:Bah fine; Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 03:19 Foreman wrote:On November 03 2016 03:08 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 03:06 ExO_ wrote:On November 03 2016 03:04 Calix wrote:
NU's boring. Nothing new to see there.
ExO, should I be asking why you're not 'largely communicating in gifs'? Don't get me wrong, I'm glad you're not, but I'm curious as to what made you change your mind. So if you ARE mainly communicating in gifs then why claim a role first thing before doing that? Seems illogical for town to do. Way to overanalyze. So tryhard that it makes me think I should ##Vote Calix Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 03:15 ExO_ wrote:On November 03 2016 03:12 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 03:11 ExO_ wrote:On November 03 2016 03:08 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 03:06 ExO_ wrote:On November 03 2016 03:04 Calix wrote:
NU's boring. Nothing new to see there.
ExO, should I be asking why you're not 'largely communicating in gifs'? Don't get me wrong, I'm glad you're not, but I'm curious as to what made you change your mind. So if you ARE mainly communicating in gifs then why claim a role first thing before doing that? Seems illogical for town to do. You think it's illogical for me to immediate claim VT before posting a gif? Give me a break. If anything your attempt to get me to revert to gif posting only and now trying to throw shade on me is indicative of your scum alignment Please point me to where I 'attempted to get you to revert to gif posting only' if you'd be so kind. You'll note that I specifically said 'I'm glad you are not posting in gifs' (which you then responded to...with a gif...instead of a response) And yes, it's illogical for town to claim a role and then post a gif in lieu of a coherent response. If you were actually happy I wasn't posting gifs, why would you bring up the fact that I said I would post primarily gifs? I think any reasonable person realizes that's much more likely to get me to post gifs, than to offer an explanation that will ultimately be irrelevant to the game. You brought it up in the hopes that I would stick to my word and posts only gifs, instead of helping town. You are scum ##vote Calix These are absolutely terrible votes.
Thanks for quoting. Now I had to put this side to side with Foleys post to understand what you were going at, as I remembered it completely different. I finally see where you are coming from. I completely missed this indirect mention of Skynx.
This actually clarifies this to me as well, so I'm fine with you.
As Calix insists on my giving a clear verdict, if it wasn't clear yet:
Rels: townlean
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On November 04 2016 07:47 Foreman wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 07:12 mahrgell wrote:
Foreman: I see where you are coming from, again. Honestly, if you are right, I would consider it rather sad, but I guess the "be a dick" meta is really the current thing. But here I still lack any attempt by Foremen to progress the game. Okay, let him be blunt, let him be the noBS type. But what did he contribute?
At this point I actually question myself, as I seem to be the only one not liking Foremen. But I simply can't get it. All reasons for him to be town sound like yours "He doesnt give a fuck about others". Yeah, but maybe it would be a useful trait to actually give a fuck about others.
Hard to give a fuck about people I don't know. It's a personality thing. Even moreso when it comes to online interactions. Does the fact I'm distant and cold make me scum? If so, prepare to mislynch me consistently for at least a few months. I could go into detail about why I can come across a bit harsh, but I think that would best be discussed after the game.
Well... took the time the time to reread your entire filter under this assumption of your playstyle/character, which was also suggested by Rels before.
Looking at it this way, I will concede, that it does not look as scummy as what I had in mind.
Still most of it it consists out of snarky comments or you calling someones post bullshit. There were some useful and original parts on Skynx though.
With this in mind, I'm feeling to correct my read on you to Neut again. A Neut with a playstyle I don't like, but well.. Will have to deal with it and remember it reading your future posts.
With that... I need some new vote target.
##Unvote
Lemme check Exo again, he was my #2 and posted new stuff... Back in a bit.
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On November 04 2016 07:46 darthfoley wrote:
I can answer the Skynx stuff when I'm not in a movie for class, but I'm putting my vote on mahrgell.
He STILL hasn't said anything conclusive or definitive. He keeps asking the same things to the same people to stall and buy time. He's also using the OMGIS first game defense now. I remember my first forum game (This is my fourth) and I rolled scum. I play a ton of IRL mafia and I'm pretty good at it, but I was terrible with trying to forge reads as scum G1. I can't remember the title of the game but it was on TL.
I see a lot of parallels between my playstyle that game, and his play style in this game. Outside of this, I've already written content on my mahrgell scum read. Look through my filter if you want a refresher. Also find it interesting that he peaches out with all his reads for family time, then as soon as I put heat on him, he finds the time to go semi filter diving and engage with people again.
##Vote: mahrgell
I was specifically asked about it. WTF? What answer would you have not called "using first game" ?
And I didn't even use it myself.
I did not expect Rels to suddenly free me of doubt, and I don't expect anyone to do it. I don't consider myself a noob at mafia, but admittedly I have no experience in forum mafia.
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Okay, finished reading up on Exo.
##Vote Exo_
Writing up my reasoning in a bit.
So far I have 2 more players on my todo pile: DF and Skynx. I will probably try to squeeze those in some time after sleeping and between family ^.^
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Exo:
1)my original post about Exo: http://www.liquiddota.com/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=26146963
Nothing I said there really changed, even with the newer posts. Honestly while he always calls other ppl to read the tread, his posts don't really strike me as if he had read the thread so far. I guess I have to honorary mention that at least he doesn't ask for summaries all the time. Great upgrade.
2)
On November 03 2016 04:46 ExO_ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 04:44 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:40 mahrgell wrote:On November 03 2016 04:35 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:32 mahrgell wrote:gosh Calix, can we please stop post synced? Also after what I read from you last game I'm afraid of myself, if I share your thoughts... I don't want to be like you Sorry. It's ironic because you're insinuating that I am a bad player...but I'm pretty sure that you misinterpreted what Foreman said. He was calling me scum, not you. I am aware that he is only going after you. But as I share your concern regarding NU... And would like the same answer to be answered... He refuses to answer me, because he considers you to be scum. I don't agree on the policy of "I don't talk to who I consider scum". I consider this antitown, but I understand interpretations on this may differ. But I really dislike the policy of "I don't talk to you, because a player I consider to be scum shared your concerns". This is for sure antitown. So either he considers me scum too, or he is just antitown. Both conclusions are not really giving him any plus points in my book. It is extremely anti-town to ignore anyone save for red-checked players or the like. It shows that he is not willing to reconsider his reads and will be prone to tunnel-vision. (this is something I am specifically trying to avoid) I remain uncertain on Foreman. I'm inclined to scum-read him purely for his pathetic dismissal of my NU case (aka the most substantial post made this game) but I'm biased there as I think my case is pretty good. Furthermore, some of his posts have minor town-tells in them. (nothing convincing though) Concluding null as it stands. How can you be so hesitant to scum read anyone? All of your reads come built in with "but I might be wrong." You back pedal on everything you've said so far and leave yourself a way out. Almost as if you are afraid to hard scum read somebody because you know you are lying. I'm quite convinced you are scum leaving yourself as many outs as possible.
Okay. I can follow this idea. But... How on earth have you not gone after me? So far pretty much everyone in the thread confirms me as the "King of leaving outs". Even I do that.
And yet, you haven't once mentioned me? Seriously? I should be your topscum.
At this point, if it wasn't about me, I would actually call you out for distancing. In fact i'm surprised nobody did that yet.
3)
On November 04 2016 04:30 ExO_ wrote:I didn't like his filter and trust skynx
Again, are you serious? You come back in the thread, after 13 hours, and all you do to start is an uncommented vote, and when asked this is your reason this is everything? I mean... at least whine about not having time, etc. But all you had to say on those 180 posts that happened in the meantime was that. Stunning!
Actually you promised to look into NU and FM first in your last post before the break. You engaged FM later, but all you did was telling him to learn to read. There was no analysis of him whatsoever. Similarly you also tangled with NU, starting with this post:
On November 04 2016 06:30 ExO_ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 06:27 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:11 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:09 Tictock wrote:On November 04 2016 06:01 Calix wrote:
But how hard is it to just say something like "oh I was joking" or "I wanted to play the game properly" or something? Maybe I'm just assuming that ExO is as amazingly intelligent as I am, but that doesn't seem like a stretch for scum.
His later behaviour is more concerning to me. I don't really like it and the point which I found the most interesting from him is something that you claim was a joke. (I think) Thats actually kinda my point, town!Exo could have said the same things, or started posting gifs to joke around. What did we see? Him getting butthurt that you called him out for not posting Gifs and attacking you for it. Starting a discussion is EXACTLY what town wants to do. And its exactly what I did. Implying that I wouldn't do that is town is at best misleading. What I did drew a lot of attention to me, you really think thats what I would do as scum? Instead of posting a few gifs and joking around a bit? please. Lynch TT its so obvious at this point On October 31 2016 09:24 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Sure. c: One more /in.
This is what is going to happen this game:
1. I will roll town.
2. Game starts; unoriginal players'll say "First confirmed town!"
3. One town will have a weird or even scummy entry.
4. Calix will tunnel said player. NeverUnlucky will have a good read on Calix based on the tunnel.
5. Said town will claim that the intent behind his entry was to stir up conversation.
6. Everyone will mock him and some will town-read him.
7. Active players’ll shitpost, lurkers’ll lurk.
8. One player will case another player who’ll become the main wagon, but the case is weak, thus :
9. People will initiate a CFD at EoD, and a town will die.
1 to 7, check. 8 and 9 to go. Calix hasn't tunneled anyone. You're full of shit
Again not what I would call an analysis. You later gave some weak reads on NUs latest posts, but the "I will look into NU" results posts is still to be seen.
4) Your obsession about your VT claim. Your entire defense seems to be "but I claimed VT"
I still can't make sense of it. The way you present it here, claiming VT is the ultimative move early day1. Everyone should do it, and nobody doing it should ever be lynched day1 except by scum players.
I'm not buying it. And honestly you can't believe that yourself. Either you completely lack the ability to imagine how others may view the game, or this is just some horrible play. And you repeating it again and again doesnt make it better. If you want to convince me... Try another approach. I'm open to arguments, but that VT bullshit is really tiring me and your obsession with it is making you look more scummy in my eyes.
I read your town game. You did much better there. If you are town this game, you are awful. I don't think you are awful from what I've seen, but just feel reminded of your rather similar dota2 scum performance.
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Okay, reading up on what happened between my vote and my post... gimme a moment
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On November 04 2016 08:42 ExO_ wrote:
NU is actively borrowing his reads for rels in an attempt to push me, with Marhgwell being 3rd on a wagon.
Marhgwell is scum, and probably NU
LOL. Are you even reading? You were my #2 scum for almost the entire thread. When I unvoted (because I could follow FMs argument), I already said, that I will look into next, as you are the logical choice. This deeper look convinced me that my original read on you was correct.
So get your timeline right.
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On November 04 2016 08:29 NeverUnlucky wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 08:26 mahrgell wrote:
Okay, finished reading up on Exo.
##Vote Exo_
Writing up my reasoning in a bit.
So far I have 2 more players on my todo pile: DF and Skynx. I will probably try to squeeze those in some time after sleeping and between family ^.^ Would you kindly summarize what your reads now look like?
My more recent and confident ones:
Scum:
Exo_
Neut:
FM
Townlead:
Calix, NU, Rels
I want to reevaluate TT, Skynx and DF next.
DF posted a lot of stuff, and it seemed to not match my image of him and at some point he went completely off when accusing me. But I may be biased on the stuff he writes about me, so I have to reread his filter and I will probably focus on the stuff not concerning me to make my judgement. From first impression I would tend scumlean though.I hope to ind time tmrw for it.
Skynx is Neut in my mind so far, mainly because I didn't pay much attention to his posts besides the onne paragraph directed at me. From memory he posted mostly useless stuff early, but later had 2 wot against me and 3 other players. Then his TT case. I will focus on those. (I actually wanted to do that earlier... but somehow kept busy)
TT I would townlean from memory. But I want to check the case made against him. If I currently Neut Skynx, while having a scum+scumlean, this would make Skynx by process of elimination a townie and his case must have some substance. Also iirc Exo jumped on it. If it was completely fabricated, this would mean the the entire scumteam went allin here... Then again, Exo jumping on it actually makes TT and Skynx look better. But this is now too much speculation, and I will warm this up once we have a flip. Anyway... I just want to read TT again
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EPT
