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On September 09 2016 09:24 Tumblewood wrote:
there is one thing I have on Shapelog that makes me feel really smart. I think he is town because of his setup spec early game, because it shows that he is genuinely interested and not doing it for town cred because setup spec is generally something people scumread you for. not 100% but I'm sticking with it.
other people:
vivax is probably town just for tone and care-ness
calix looks town and NU looks scum to me. even though their entrances were the same from a surface-level point of view, calix feels more genuine and helpful.
Damdred interests me but I do not yet have feelings toward his alignment
On September 10 2016 06:46 Tumblewood wrote:
grack is not as impressive as I once remembered him. demoted from probable town to null
superbia has 6 pages so I am skimming and although he hasn't said anything smart yet I don't think he is scum. still see no reason to townread him though so slight townlean
This looks pretty bad and it stuck out to me almost immediately reading his filter now.
Cause the reasoning he applies to shape fits for superbia like a pair of dutch wood sandals. Except superbia had like 6 pages of setup spec that looked like he was having a seizure like some nutso genius a la rainman (even tho I didn't really buy it cause it didn't yield the same results as for a nutso genius).
I'd define this as "not being faithful towards his own reasons for reads". But don't really want to call him scum just for this when there's the chance we have a scumHF on the loose.
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On September 12 2016 07:19 Holyflare wrote:
all I see is tumblewood town reads, pathetic mafia play
Nha he could be mafia, but after the beating you handed down last game (which wasn't hard admit it) you are on the TLSA watch list this game. And TW got lynched that game as well. If I repeated that course of events twice in a row I'd feel really idiotic.
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On September 12 2016 07:53 NeverUnlucky wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2016 07:50 Holyflare wrote:
he didn't propose the scum team at all Hmm, why would he talk about a cone-hat (Shapelog's avatar), Vienna (Vivax is Austrian), and Puleum (Plamar reference?) then?
He said I'm forcing town to wear dunce caps I think.
More or less saying that anyone listening to me is an idiot.
I think
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Encrypted last wills, or how to turn a game of mafia into a Dan Brown book. Back to real business fun's over. A little test for HF if you will, finding out who wrote this before answering is against the rules, play fair:
I didn't see any reason that HF exaggerating his sureness was indicative of the case being bad. Though iirc he later mentions that he no longer had a scum read (or maybe it was just a weaker scum read? Would have to look it up) on tt and was lynching for information at that point. That bugs me.Mostly because I'm not sure how much reasonably confident information we got from the lynch. Maybe that'll come to me when I reread EoD.
1. Is bolded true?
2. Do you think this post is scummy?
3. Do you think this would ever be able to reach a correct conclusion as to your alignment and this player would believe he could?
4. Once you find out who posted this (you may now), why does he mention you in this way after stating another intention in writing this?
A few more would come to mind but that'd be an assault on your attention span.
I answered to your Damdred stuff, manus manum lavat.
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Picking up where I left yesterday, I'm snipping out one part here (when he talks about the Calix discussion, doesn't yield anything interesting). My comments are in [] brackets.
On September 11 2016 23:46 fuba wrote:
Morning.
Got a few minutes before work. To answer NU's questions (paraphrasing, on my phone):
Why did I vote for tt? The narrative HF originally laid out made sense to me, and then tt disappearing after it just reinforced it. At the end of the day, I could still see scum behaving as he had, so my vote didn't change. I didn't see any reason that HF exaggerating his sureness was indicative of the case being bad. Though iirc he later mentions that he no longer had a scum read (or maybe it was just a weaker scum read? Would have to look it up) on tt and was lynching for information at that point. That bugs me. Mostly because I'm not sure how much reasonably confident information we got from the lynch. Maybe that'll come to me when I reread EoD.
Who are my scum reads? I'll have to get back to you on that one. My two yesterday were you and tt, which is more that I usually have d1 XD. One was proven wrong, the other I'm currently believing is town. Have to dive some filters and probably reread EoD to develop some more.
I also have some thoughts on TW that are almost completely unrelated to this game, and actually take place in an obs QT for another game that he wasn't in as far as I remember, but there are similarities to this game and I was wondering what other people's thoughts were on it. In one of my previous town games I made a case on a suspected scum being town. In the obs QT, it was declared that I was town for doing so by most people present, even if they were unsure of me before. Does anyone feel that this could apply to TW in this game? I could try to find the game, but would have to wait until a few hours after start of day.
[The thoughts on TW are really uninformative. The argument is that anyone defending town with a case could be town, I don't even get if he's talking about TW defending Calix or TT, and fuba doesn't check it out, doesn't relate to TW's posts and mention examples of this being the case somewhere, he just puts the question out there where it will continue to not bear any fruits. This looks like a prime example of an uncontributive post being buffed with lots of words. Also it's weird he thinks finding the game will change anything about people's reads about TW]
On one hand, I understand that scum have an easy time town reading people (if they're town) because they know they're town. They know it's from a town perspective because everything has to be. On the other, why defend a high content poster once the thread starts swinging slightly against them if your goal is to get them killed? The ability to defend town is greater, but the reason for doing it seems far less so. I know that these scenarios assume tw scum and calix town, but I'm leaving out the possibility that they're both scum because that would be a hard defense of a scum buddy. Which I guess could happen, but it doesn't feel likely? The scenario feels like either both town or one scum.
[Another part that looks big but doesn't say anything. You're never going to get information speculating if somebody defending town was scum. Scum can do a bit of both in a game of a lot of players. He concludes...nothing, as expected of trying to reach a conclusion from wifom. His only goal I could see here is to slap a wall of words instead of simply saying "TW + Calix feel like T+T or T+S"]
I needed to ask because it'll be on my mind until it's resolved (think NU's lynchbait comment).
On September 12 2016 11:51 fuba wrote:
Unfortunately, I need to focus on schoolwork tonight. After class tomorrow, I don't work for 4 days, so my availability should open up.
I'm glad I stopped tunneling you NU, I really liked your last few posts. The stuff about a TW lynch feeling a lot like the TT lynch was exactly what I was thinking at the moment. At least as it pertains to HF. Not saying it makes him scummy, it just has the exact same feeling to it. And if you want my response to the calix NK, it's generally that very few conclusions can be drawn. That's not to say I have no ideas about why it was done, but there's no way to narrow it down from 50 possibilities to even a reasonable fraction of them, so I'm not gonna throw my speculation out there XD
Was gonna call vivax out for trying to get HF to fight his battles for him, but I reread his filter really quick and it actually seems like his read on me has been fluctuating pretty reasonably all game. Incorrect whenever he thinks I'm scum, but I can see the thought behind it, and I think I can remember the approximate timing of most of the posts and I can understand them. He doesn't really push too hard, but at least I think I can see a townie thought process.
Also, without having reread any cases on anyone, so many of TW's posts feel like posts that I make or have made as town that I have trouble really seeing him as scum. He seems better able to let himself post freely, regardless of the consequences, than I do, but I feel some kind of "bad townie" (for lack of a better term) kinship.
Oh, and I really, really wouldn't rely too much on the ghosts or speculation about it. Like, anyone who knows scott shadowed HF or whatever could have set up that little code. Scum can control the LW and scum can control the votes. I don't want to lose because we trust in something we know that scum will try to use against us.
Yay townreads! Scum will come once I have the time to reread more filters XD (should be around the second half of D2 :S)
This post is mostly just here to see if he actually did any of the things he promised in the previous post which doesn't seem like he did. His NU scumread turned to town for his latest posts. Ok.
What about the famous game he talked about? What about EoD and HF changing reads on TT? No delivery. Fuba mostly just talks a lot to say very little. Which doesn't surprise me cause he just pops in occasionally with probably great pressure to look super contributive, but since he's actually doing very little, he fluffs up the posts like a pro.
I think we should lynch him before we lynch TW cause TW at least shows some degree of consistent presence whereas fuba is under the radar 90 % and when he shows up he throws up a post that only really talks about irrelevant stuff in an overly worded way. Scott's message is old news, and nobody is really interested in figuring out NUs alignment at this point. But I guess he felt he had to put it in there for consistency otherwise somebody could call him out for forgetting about his scumread on him.
I'll be voting accordingly.
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On September 11 2016 07:17 Superbia wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2016 07:14 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 07:08 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 07:05 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 07:02 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 06:59 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 06:57 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 06:56 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 06:54 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 06:54 Damdred wrote:
[quote]
Just follow with me for a moment as I'm working through this.
Lets say that you are a mid to high tier player (as I think every one in this game is). You rolled scum, you already have a scum read on the person getting lynched.
Its wifom partly, but what's the point to flipping your read bringing ore attention to yourself when your ere being 80% town read just for a I told you so at that point? Who are we talking about here specifically? Let's not nAMe names lets just answer honestly If someone scum scumread TT early on they're somewhat likely to join the waffling near EoD. Or dig in. What about being super paranoid about halfway through d1 hating who's joining the wagon and thinks it's to easy? Scum or town? Depends on who and what. Also actually a hard question, definitely depends on the circumstance. More specifically, the second wagon. Getting people off TT and onto a (nother) town wagon is so good for scum. I honestly don't think calix just rethinking on things is probably scum. Shows paranoia about the lynch to well to be from scum (on a first look) Is way to aggro and put themselves way to out there with Mich to hard a stance and to weird a turn to come from scum. Just ny initial take,though I think,the scum reads are off this time even from myself. Maybe. I need to sleep on it first. HF has echoed my thoughts accurately too many times for me to believe he is scum. Someone has told me before that this is a trap, though HF was town that game. I think hf is town in this situation to. Like I am in a weird position Hf, super, grac, cal, UN, super, fuba are what ant I'd think are my town reads. Paranoid of vivax but I'll,figure that out I'm suspicious of tw Palmar is Monday Sky and shape to me votes look the worst but shapes sick so want to,give him a bit of time (<3) So either its a super easy game or going to get,messy. I think that town list may be too generous. I have no idea on grac/fuba.Cal is mafia pending re-read.
This post is also puzzling as fuck. Superbia townreads HF a few posts earlier for mirroring his thoughts. Has no idea on grack fuba. That leaves Calix, whom he was scumreading, and NU, whom he TR earlier
+ Show Spoiler +On September 11 2016 06:48 Superbia wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2016 06:45 NeverUnlucky wrote:On September 11 2016 06:31 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 06:29 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Calix, you've got to interact with me if you want us to be efficient. I town-read you. Now more than ever is the time you have to collaborate with me. Wild prediction: this guy is getting shot tonight. I actually predict that the mafia'll shoot Vivax over me because he has site experience and it would be framing you, but I wouldn't be surprised if I was found riddled with bullets tomorrow morning. Both of us are so widely tr'ed that we're as close as we can get to confirmed towns in this setup. Then again, they might WIFOM and shoot someone else. Did you have both me and Vivax as townreads? Someone needs to check at some point. Tbf I just think you're town, never a lynch target, and on the wrong side of the argument.
Yet it's "too generous". Super can only think it's too generous for himself and Calix being in it? He has no idea about fuba and Grack. Overall it's a strange way to reply to such a list in such a way when you compare this to his reads. A question "why is calix town, why fuba and grack" would have appeared way more natural.
He's clearly thinking Damdred is town here, but his followup isn't "here is why I think calix is mafia take a look at it Damdred", he's perfectly content with the reply from Damdred about his fuba + grack reads.
On September 11 2016 07:19 Superbia wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2016 07:18 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 07:17 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 07:14 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 07:08 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 07:05 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 07:02 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 06:59 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 06:57 Superbia wrote:On September 11 2016 06:56 Damdred wrote:
[quote]
Let's not nAMe names lets just answer honestly If someone scum scumread TT early on they're somewhat likely to join the waffling near EoD. Or dig in. What about being super paranoid about halfway through d1 hating who's joining the wagon and thinks it's to easy? Scum or town? Depends on who and what. Also actually a hard question, definitely depends on the circumstance. More specifically, the second wagon. Getting people off TT and onto a (nother) town wagon is so good for scum. I honestly don't think calix just rethinking on things is probably scum. Shows paranoia about the lynch to well to be from scum (on a first look) Is way to aggro and put themselves way to out there with Mich to hard a stance and to weird a turn to come from scum. Just ny initial take,though I think,the scum reads are off this time even from myself. Maybe. I need to sleep on it first. HF has echoed my thoughts accurately too many times for me to believe he is scum. Someone has told me before that this is a trap, though HF was town that game. I think hf is town in this situation to. Like I am in a weird position Hf, super, grac, cal, UN, super, fuba are what ant I'd think are my town reads. Paranoid of vivax but I'll,figure that out I'm suspicious of tw Palmar is Monday Sky and shape to me votes look the worst but shapes sick so want to,give him a bit of time (<3) So either its a super easy game or going to get,messy. I think that town list may be too generous. I have no idea on grac/fuba. Cal is mafia pending re-read. I talked a bit about grac earlier I n the night if you want to read that (ie pushing hf lynch etc) and give thoughts be appreciated. As for fun a I liked,his posts and he mirrored my thoughts pretty well. So there is bias there. Can't be bothered atm dude, sorry. I'll need to actually read into his past posts and meta as well, as I have no actual idea how the guy plays mafia.
What stinks to me is that super, should he legitimately be figuring out Damdred here, or actually pushing that scumread, shouldn't just be so happy to let that argument be that way without any reference to Calix whatsoever in the course of it. He just abandons it with the reply about fuba + grack, slaps down a maybe/maybe not Damdred townread, and leaves.
That his scumread died doesn't really seem to mix him up much besides commenting on it being a shit kill (why?).
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On September 13 2016 00:54 Holyflare wrote:
I actually don't hate a vivax case, must be a bus.
Are you calling me mafia?
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I'm reading some stuff where Skynx asked Damdred what happened to his scumread on Skynx, didn't really see an answer to that, then skynx says he missed something. Did Damdred never reply to this or is it what skynx missed, maybe Damdred can enlighten me here.
On September 11 2016 22:16 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2016 08:10 Damdred wrote:On September 11 2016 08:03 NeverUnlucky wrote:On September 11 2016 07:57 Damdred wrote:
Nu why is it again that sky can town hunt and you say he's scum hunting, but when I'm largely town hunting and trying to build what I think is the right group I am not?
And no I disagree with your conclusions over all on sky him voting tt especially when there was a movement away from tt (to a poont) is just scummy.
In fact he complains about people ignoring the other lurkers and never really brings much of anything worth talking about up just says the filter he checked wasn't that bad.
Then he bites someone who he really shouldn't given his filter. So no it's scum The difference is that you are not confrontational at all in your posts. As if you didn't want to make enemies. That just fits with you town-hunting rather than scum-hunting. Why is it scummy then? You make a point. However, you never really brought anything worth talking about either. Does that make you scum as well? How is this making him scummy? Confrontational is a nai trait scum can be nice or mean and,the same as town. This is a non point I have talked about whatever I wanted to,when,I was in,thread, the fights. Reads, my read on tt most,of,these things were ignored by you however. Idk if voting is mandatory where you are, but jumping on at the end,has the least amount,of responsibilities and,if he brought,hf near tie and hf,flipped even more heat would be on him. His decision making,process does not portray town trying to push or figure out anything. Like what he said about ignoring super shape etc but never pushes then himself and votes the person he was upset we were pushing.
That's not town. Let's say I got a train on to Super and some people followed me we kill him instead of someone who hasn't posted for 36 hours. I would be the kill almost 100% of the time D2. You are intentionally wrong sir.
I also don't get what skynx is saying here. Is he saying that if he lynched super successfully he'd have been lynched 100 % D2? Or NKd? And that's his reason for ending up on TT?
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On September 13 2016 01:15 Holyflare wrote:
I'm saying i don't hate one of your cases so it must be a bus can't you read? You even quoted my post.
You mean you're bussing fuba cause otherwise you wouldn't like my case? Alright.
If you really want to give me a hand try to turn this into a case game (for the rest of the players) cause a lot of the discussion so far is people randomly throwing reads out there I feel, which you claimed to hate.
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On September 13 2016 01:21 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Vivax, where were you going when you said that nobody was trying to figure out my alignment at this point?
General consensus seems to be that you're town, which I agree with.
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Grack better be here now and read my cases if he announced he's going to look at other people.
It's upsetting that superbia is getting free TRs left and right when anyone looking at his posts should realize they are really low quality, shallow posts. Looks like only TW is stepping aside and considering him which buys him this day at the very least.
It's not hard to do what super does and inflate filter by posting in three lines what might as well have been in a single post. He doesn't look at new things between his posts a lot of the time, he just randomly splits its content many times. Just to quote one example:
On September 11 2016 07:15 Superbia wrote:
I.e. it's all super wifom.
On September 11 2016 07:15 Superbia wrote:
Everything is wifom
He's also playing a very reactive game where he's rather going to get hung up on something somebody else posted and take a dump on it (for the good or the bad, as long as he has something to talk about).
Skimming the filter trying to find any instance of him going back, rereading something and displaying conclusions along with the appropriate quotes, it-just-doesn't-happen, while it would be scumhunting 101. He should know that he can't shape any opinion to fit his objectives with the way he's playing if he was town, and he's a capable town player usually.
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This game feels so hard cause a ton of people do scummy stuff whenever I go look for it. Only guys I am able to somewhat confidently townread for now are NU, and Grack (but it's pretty heavily meta based and I didn't dive him since).
I am inclined to townread HF cause he looks genuinely interested into solving the game, but the best I can do is give him more time and hold back the paranoia cause he's just too good as scum.
I'd like to townread shapelog cause the fuba stuff started jumping to me when I found the energy to actually read his posts (which still ended up being only his last filter page and some from the early game) and he mentioned fubas flip floppy post parts, but it also felt like he was casually throwing suspicion at me at some points which seemed out of character. But other than this his early posts seemed townie to me.
I'd like to townread skynx cause he picked up on stuff that really showed he was paying attention to tiny details, but I need some stuff cleared up first, starting with the one I posted above. Most tempted to throw him into the townpile next.
These are my only townreads to semi-townreads this game. Kinda sad I can't put Damdred in here. Anyway it's the reason this game feels like a huge knot, it's super hard to go by PoE.
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On September 13 2016 01:42 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Vivax, who would the third scum be in your world? Fuba/Superbia/[?]
Do you believe in a full scum lurking team?
Anyone who isn't in my townish pile is a possibility.
I don't think you can call superbias play lurking either. But the fact that you call him a lurker when he has 12 whopping pages of filter should tell you what the effects of his posting style are on your perception (that he seems active while he isn't).
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I could also go and find a few examples of him exaggerating things to make his posts appear more sensational than they are.
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On September 13 2016 01:57 Superbia wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2016 01:53 Vivax wrote:
I could also go and find a few examples of him exaggerating things to make his posts appear more sensational than they are. For comedic effect*
This one had one
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On September 13 2016 02:02 Superbia wrote:
Vivax I rly do not understand how you are still so tunneled on me. Imo my eod was p decent and my push during the night pretty townie. I would think that there are at least a dozen targets you could look at before me
I advise you just ignore the accusations for now and proceed to comment on the other targets, you're not the only guy I'm talking about today. Read stuff on fuba for example.
YOu asked a while back "whats your opinion on fuba" or something, I post arguments for him being mafia and yet now you are only self-centered on what concerns you. That's not helping your cause.
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On September 13 2016 03:57 Palmar wrote:
I like new and improved Vivax
And fuba?
And super who's one of your top town reads?
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So am I posting for consistency or being inconsistent? I can't be both.
When I talk about consistence I don't refer to a single aspect of it. Your presence is less consistent than TW means you are around fewer times (frequence would be a better term), but you can still be consistent with the content you post. I don't see how that's relevant either way, and how one could apply consistency to you as an entire person like you demand here.
. You say I'm posting under intense pressure to look contributive, but there has been almost none on me the entire game (a fact that I've already mentioned I find strange).
Scum is under more pressure to not get caught, there doesn't need to be actual pressure for you to feel it. If you feel it without any reason to it's more likely you're scum, town has more of an idgaf attitude.
It's funny that in the same post, you point out how no one wants to know my thoughts on something that happened in the thread in the past while at the same time pointing out how I'm not telling everyone all my thoughts from things in the past.
Yes cause you promised them and instead of talking about NU you could talk about how you feel your previous points aren't important enough to look up any more like you did when I posted this.
My guess is as town you would be more confident to post less content and be more concise. You'd post your opinions without necessarily seeing the need to make examples and promising to deliver them later. You'd quote more stuff from the thread and not be as self-centered in your arguments (for example the town-case-on-scummy-player-cause-I-did-once=town-stuff.)
Mostly I'm looking forward to see how you play when you claim to have more time. But remember that if you just play like I suggest you would as town, it won't mean you're suddenly town. Just show me how you play like you feel you want to play.
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On September 14 2016 00:47 Damdred wrote:
He's been pretty lackluster today and doesn't have his usual gung ho and seems to not care about pushing hi a scum read so far.
Lies and slander, I've been here playing the game the way it's meant to be played while only HF and maybe some other dude was around to do discussion.
What happened to your Shape scumread or you liking my posts?
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On September 14 2016 00:37 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2016 00:28 Superbia wrote:On September 14 2016 00:26 Damdred wrote:
Nope not yet,
Super are you going to vote for me today? No idea yet. I will probably either vote more than half the thread or one person. I think there are close to four lock town people (outside myself) I think vivax, tw, sky are all decent votes. Fuba in not sure I'm could be but I'm not sure he feels like he is giving us what we want rather than what he thinks at points.
Not sure you even read my case, then your opinion should be more fleshed out than this.
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EPT
