A normal game just for JAT <3 - Page 10

On April 20 2016 11:55 sicklucker wrote:


hum im pretty sure jat was not all about lynching an un cced doctor. That was me

On April 20 2016 23:43 rsoultin wrote:
that and i'm just generally not that interested cause i think i fully understand why palmar warns for telling anyone about any type of host interaction. much as i don't want to read into it...it's tilting you toward the town side of null lol >< like i can go into it more but i almost think it's unsporting to do so since you're not an easy townread right now, and it's not 100% anyway just a belief i have regarding how the host would handle things

On April 20 2016 23:58 rsoultin wrote:
also, just for the record, in regards to tumble

i understand why some might think he could be town here, and i'm not saying that i don't have any doubts. i do. he busted his balls eod d1 and some of that looked townie. some of it looked more like he was spinning his wheels since he just asked a lot of questions and didn't really try to direct the lynch anywhere

basically what it comes down to me is the bare bones stuff that should never come from town
- lying about why he said something
- refusing to vote a scumread to save himself but then voting a nullread to save himself
- reads not being informed by new info

i'll sit there and go...that kinda sounded townie, like his exchange with gum, or well you know odd that he's trying that hard and martyring for super if they're scum together even if super is rb, and the doubts will creep in

but especially that second point is just impossible for me to get past. town doesn't do that. knowing super was rb...scum definitely could. town wouldn't. and i can't let that slide and then eat crow end-game just cause sometimes he "feels" townie

besides which...super's play looked like burn-out. he looked like an rsoul in the storm game, who still felt too guilty to not even try (doc claim, palmar push) but had trouble motivating himself anyway. rsoul played kamikaze rsoul cause of shape and kuri, and intended to dance on the lynch platform as long as possible. super hoped town would let him slide and tried to get a doc cc...if his scum team was composed of people completely not trying i don't know that he would have even done that much

so i'm not saying that this CONFIRMS tw scum, but i am saying super's play doesn't make tw town at all. it's hard playing consecutive anti-town roles even for those of us who push through anyway lol ><

(and no this is not me trying to beat a dead horse, this is me trying to convince anyone who isn't yet convinced that we absolutely need to lynch tw next phase. if i die and you don't and he turns out to be scum i will be very angry! and if you just want to get me to stop harping on it >> that's an okay reason to get behind the lynch too lol)

On April 21 2016 00:07 rsoultin wrote:


unrelated, but do you not live in the U.S. anymore? (i may or may not be asking cause lex and i are composing a visitation list for when i bebop into the netherlands this summer lol ^^)

related, are you where i'm at on reads or do you disagree somewhere? i know you and rels were duking it out earlier over something that i kinda just data-dumped cause i didn't really agree with either side (i think...probably. might be alzheimers)

On April 21 2016 00:12 Rels wrote:
JAT for some reason I thought you voted Superbia D1 ?
Tumble not jumping on Superbia but jumping on GB is a indeed a good point considering Superbia was RB.

On April 21 2016 00:26 rsoultin wrote:


bad tina memory! lol sorry (no we don't need to keep talking about this in thread -slinks off-)

okay so we're kinda along the same page then. well idk like i do think it would be worthwhile to go back and make sure ows doesn't have outs and things in-thread and not just go voting rb over possible bad town/possible scum means he's town (not making that mistake again ><) but it does drop him in priority for me

idk though the complaining and doing nothing (i assume you mean in the form of actually voting) is a bit suicidal for you to do as scum when thread sentiment is clearly grinding toward a super lynch? like i know that's not the best reason to townread anyone. i know for a fact it's something i'd be fine doing myself depending on the circumstances. just not really sure ows is that...hm what's the word? brash? arrogant? flashy? as a scum player. from what little experience i've had with his scum game he's more of a simpering blender (<3s ows >> that's not meant to be offensive btw i do the simpering stuff too depending on the situation)

On April 21 2016 00:31 rsoultin wrote:
rels is more his filter just looks like a town filter lol the fluidity of reads changing with new info is there, the willingness to say he's wrong about things instead of dig in his heels, and the probing into a lot of different things in a way that to me at least looks more like trying to figure out thought process and intentions (i.e. alignments) rather than just going on the attack. yet he's still aggressive so it doesn't look too blendy

^ definition of a town filter from a player who knows how to play for me

tbf i know his scum game is good lol >< but i don't think it's quite that good. the fluidity and breadth in particular is pretty hard to accomplish as scum, at least for me

On April 21 2016 00:36 gumshoe wrote:
So I have alot of stuff saved up for eon, but if it’s just going to just get ignored theres no real point to the effort is there / : so I’m writing this preamble to hopefully soften the crowd : D

if I am actively involved in a game and I make it past the first few nights I am going to start putting stuff together. I think in large webs based around core evidence. The problem is you are all very clever people and you find the one or two holes in what I say and assume that those exceptions are in fact the case and subsequently dismiss them in favour of your own reads. Reads that if I felt like doing so, I could pick apart like cotton.

This is simply because most arguments in mafia come with a free set of holes / : the only reason they continue to stand is because people cant be bothered disproving all of them / :




Heres a post from jat in regards to rels pushing him, at this point jats getting pretty angry. He seems to think that saying my “interactions make it unlikely that were mafia together” is way different from “I cant be mafia with him cause I called him mafia” but rels knows jat and is aware that hes not a hyperbolic player ala ritoky (who would be screaming confirmed for days in jats position after the super flip) which means rels may very well consider an understated claim from him to be equivalent. Is rels right or wrong to do this? Thats besides the point, to qoute jat himself




Is it really that hard to see rels believing this as town?
Jat seems to think that rels could not possibly do this as green and I think thats his biggest fuck up yet



Jat feels rels is bieng an idiot, he knows rels is intelligent, therefore rels is scum.

There are so very many problems with this logic, but lets start simple, jat is a very smart and eloquent person, to him, alot of what we say probably comes off as idiotic because of just that. He has rarely agreed with anyone this game about anything as he is rather confident / : as he should be, he is quite good. Yet that gives him a poor perspective on whats too dumb a move for someone to make.

Also there's the fact that this is a terrible move regardless, which means no matter what alignment he is rels is being stupid, therefore stupidity has no bearing on rels alignment as jat seems to think. There is no reason to attack jat here as all rels has to do if hes scum is look townie. Antagonising townie numero uno may do that indirectly, but it also aggros him thereby making the whole move derp. Only real reason to do it is if rels actually think jats scum based off feel and is using shit reasoning to justify that feel read / : thereby pissing off jat and robbing him of his objectivity. Which sorta makes rels town.

The point I am trying to make here is that I think Jat is a fantastic player, but here he is being a fucking idiot.

I can find shit like this on everyone here and i’m sure they could come up with a million reasons why I’m wrong about them being wrong and we can go back and forth like that forever.

Look, I don't want us to stop finding flaws in one another's arguments, thats mafia, what I want is for us to stop rewarding ourselves for finding those flaws with the instant dismissal of the cases to which those flaws belong. All so that we can get back to proving why were right and everyone else is wrong.

So when I post what may be my last big wall of text ,which is going to be as logical and streamlined and clear as I can possibly make it ,and you find all the potential outs for each and every point, dont just walk away satisfied, ask yourself how effective those outs actually are, how likely is it that they are the rule and not the exception? Das all I ask yo / :

On April 21 2016 00:46 rsoultin wrote:


>> lol god it takes me like 4x as long to do it that way >> i prob should have given how much i spammed this game but...okay you want the honest truth? part of why i dropped it (apart from frustration at palmar lol ><) was it was so damn slow that me capping my spamming wasn't really helpful lol >< part was laziness \o/

On April 21 2016 01:03 gumshoe wrote:


again, I am not upset XD you all are great and I am having a ton of fun regardless. I just needed to do something dramatic cause yeah : P from where I stand the situation calls for it.

On April 21 2016 01:12 Rels wrote:
Well I have to leave work. I thought I would have time to reread the entire D1 before that but actually I don't. =X I will try to do that before deadline. If I have to, I will only read JAT's filter from EOD1, but I would prefer if I have time to read the things in their context.

On April 21 2016 02:03 ObiWanShinobi wrote:
Lurking atm.

On April 21 2016 05:20 Rels wrote:

Well my GF made the surprise of getting back 1 day earlier than she should have so I'm obv gonna stay with her ^^ so I'll resume this tomorrow if we're both still alive.
To confirm: you think your treatment of Superbia D1 makes you unlikely partner, while mine is NAI right ? This is what I want to look for specifically.

On April 21 2016 07:07 gumshoe wrote:
noooo rsoul T_T farewell

btw I have another fat case aside from those 2 but the second was pretty unedited and you dont want to know what the third looks like.

so lets keep things simple.

tumble is town because of the day 1 vote.