Shin Megami Tensei: The Devil Inside Mafia - Page 3
Forum Index > TL Mafia |
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Give me time to analyze the power role shenanigans. Don't try to resolve that without me. ESP since we might get more info about those shenanigans with the nightkill | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On February 18 2016 05:25 rsoultin wrote: lol >< eden what's your stance on palmar? Am I supposed to have one? Bear in mind that I haven't read anything since about 2am or whenever I last posted. At that point he'd done nothing to give me any indicator either way | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Just think Shining is more likely mafia | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
My bad reason, should anybody care, is that I'm used to Palmar caring out his early strong scum reads, and actively pushing them in the thread. There were obviously reasons to think this didn't per se mean anything this time, but it seemed good enough to consolidate under. | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On February 18 2016 06:12 Trfel wrote: Eden, why didn't you share your reason or make any posts between this post and after the deadline? I mean you see that :57 right? My phone actually registered 2:59 when I switched vote. I thought that post might not beat the deadline... I thought it better to be certain I announced my switch pre-deadline instead of trying to explain and missing | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On February 18 2016 11:20 The Shining wrote: Still no power role shenanigans analysis. Went from not having a stance on Palmmar when rso asked to saying Palmar is a better lynch than both SLs and admitted to not reading since the night before. I also can't get a single Damn interaction or response from the guy who wants to lynch me off of one point. Seems legit. Eden continues to fall down my green list. brb crying to my parents about how scared this makes me feel | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On February 18 2016 02:41 The Shining wrote: Meh this a really large post to try and convince yourself to lynch me. Mostly all of those reads were progressively being typed and made as I made it through filters and I like to think out loud. I didn't feel like erasing what I had said about Tictock so far so I just added as my thoughts progressed. It's a progressing read. Early in a game, I wouldn't expect him or many others to have a strong scumread. But as I continued reading, I found more townreads, some really simple, but no scumreads, which started the red flag. And i did decide that the overall content of his filter warranted more of a scumlean whereas had I been around, early, he would've been a townlean that developed into a scumlean once I realized he was lacking scumreads. All I did was make my read progression from one way to the other transparent as I was making it through his filter. Next time I'll just make a current read and not explain it since that seems to be okay on d1. Hate this response. We should have lynched this guy instead. Note that this explanation doesn't actually respond to the criticism I made. He basically says that the reason he wrote in his reads list that Tictock was doing townie things but was still a net scum lean was because he was writing the read as he read through the filter, and when he got to the end he had decided Tictock was a scumlean. But if you got to the end and decided he was a scumlean, why didn't you go back and justify that scumlean against the evidence you cited of him possibly being town? If someone starts off reading source material about a subject and believes A, but realizes as they're reading more of the material that they actually believe not-A, then they surely would be interested in resolving the discrepancy between their initial belief in A and their current belief in not-A. If I start off reading a philosophical work believing God as a material entity doesn't exist due to XYZ reasons, and I finish reading the work and conclude God does exist for ABC reasons, I would need to find an explanation for why XYZ aren't valid reasons not to believe in God. Shining does not appear to explore this line of inquiry at all let alone explain it to us. This lack of curiosity makes me inclined to believe that he doesn't actually care what Tictock's alignment is and just needed to cover the facts of what Tictock did and come to some conclusion that sounded like it made sense -- in other words, a read coming from mafia. That Shining gets combative and asserts a false dilemma at the end (you can either contradict yourself or give a read without explanation -- you cannot simply give a unified scum read of a person that explains away facets of someone's behavior which is townie to you) seals the deal for me. He is unreasonably antagonistic and irritable when questioned for his lack of thoroughness, when I would expect a townie posed with this criticism to review Tictock again and decide definitively how he feels about Tictock. | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Who's the one taunting who? Your entire post I quoted was empty threats. Then more insults when called out for it. | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
I think there is one salient point in there I'll try to address without the things around it... I very clearly gave reasons for why he could be town and started out as a townread but as I got to the end of his filter, the ZERO scumreads raised a red flag. The "evidence I cited for him being town" became evidence of being possibly scummy because, as I pointed out, scum are much more easily capable of handing out easy townreads like he did. Like, what I LITERALLY did is LITERALLY what you're saying I didn't do. Wtf? The way I read the initial reads post, this: His early posts were short but the tone seemed pretty relaxed from the jokes with Shapelog, while also mixing some good posts, mainly the one about Trfel and his TR on him. I'm still working on my Trfel read due to how he's treating me, but I will say I really liked TT's Eden read and see pretty much what he sees. His GB read seemed pretty accurate, too, I've also played with a lackadaiscal, non-caring GB town multiple times before which has ended in GB being prime lynchbait. I could probably see where he's coming from, though I wish GB would actually play. looked like Shining was saying Tictock was townie for making these points about these reads. I guess if he's saying that Tictock is a little more likely to give these reads as mafia, you can still say all this, but when I'm reading it the conclusion I'm being led to is "Tictock is town." Maybe I should have asked first -- since you conclude that Tictock leans scum (and thus was just handing out these townreads to get town credit or be active or whatever have you), why do you think that explanation is more likely than the one where Tictock is town, identifies some other townies early but just doesn't have a good scumread at that point in time? | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On February 18 2016 15:25 The Shining wrote: You got sarcastic with me, as well, but then tell me to cut the attitude out? Kays, I will try my best. At least this post is pretty straightforward. I also explained the answer to that question, to a small degree. I came off of what was imo a great town game by TT in which we were both in Final 4 and we both had the last scum figured out. He also scumread/nailed quite a few of scum in that game. He may have scummed them all at one point. He was also very confident in that game. The lack of confidence in giving any sort of scumread to anyone while giving out townreads in this game didn't line up with that game and with it being so recent, I assumed that confidence would still be evident in his playstyle. Zero scumreads is not what I was expecting from the town TT I know. And, in the interest of fairness, that read was originally supposed to lead to Tictock is town until I finished his filter and realized I had no idea who TT thought was scum or wanted to lynch. I just didn't bother re-reading or addressing the post because I didn't feel I had anything to hide. I thought it was easily summed up in "the lack of scumreads makes it possible that these were just ez town reads that scum could make." This is a much more thorough and insightful read -- really useful elaboration. Thanks for that. Aside from me, and I suppose Tictock? (we're discussing a read you made yesterday, I'm open to any change you may have made in light of updated info, so if you don't suspect him anymore I can buy that), who do you suspect and why? I'm coming around a bit but would like to see more explanations like the ones above to be sure. Thanks in advance. | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Shapelog (blue) Trfel The Shining Breshke Tictock Eden unsure about: rsoultin sicklucker poe pile: Tumblewood nooniansoong scott31337 GlowingBear | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
rsoultin is probably town. i'll make the caveat that she isn't blowing me away with anything, and i'm still not sure how much her mafia game has progressed since my sabbatical. but this would have been outside of her mafia range before i left and it's consistent with what i remember before. high volume posting, very engaged, lots of specific questions with clear directions to them sicklucker's whole shtick as either alignment is to spew a nonsensical, literally egotistic narrative of the game state, where he does really dumb shit and says really dumb things and then bases the entirety of his arguments for the game on those really dumb things and people's reactions to him. it makes him unreadable and generally not a useful contributor to town imo. i think the best way to handle sicklucker is to just leave him alone for several days, literally ignore everything he says, and then see whether his voting record pushed mafia agenda or not and lynch him (or not) off of that while giving him zero quarter to defend himself if he becomes the target. i'm also down for just lynching him on principle for blatantly softing blue and then walking it back like nothing happened, but i also know this isn't going to get him to stop doing stupid shit like that down the line, so i don't know how productive that is. probably just me getting some satisfaction out of punishing what i perceive as poor play over actually trying to catch mafia (which is ironically poor play in itself...) trfel and tictock and shape seem obvious to me. breshke is in a similar place to rsoultin for me -- if i hadn't gone on sabbatical for the greater part of a year then i could say with total confidence that breshke is town. his behavior lines up with a lot of his priors for me, he tends to be background and asks a lot of clarifying/exploring questions as either alignment, but as town his questions are always much more salient and make sense. they're things you would think of on your own to ask, and then you scroll down and see breshke's already asked them. when the questions seem weird or out of place he's mafia. and no offense to breshke's scum play, but i have this unexplained intuitive sense that he hasn't broadened his spectrum of mafia play enough in my time away that my meta priors would be wrong. i have no good reason to think this and could be very wrong about it, but i'm sticking to it until someone gives me a reason not to. i guess my big reversal is on the shining but if you're keeping up with my posts, you'll see that i was coming around to this already. i guess i should explain this one but i don't feel like it of my poe pile i think i'm probably wrong about gb above the rest. the other three would all fit the profile of a lurking scumteam that hasn't needed to do much to force misplays and errant lynches from town | ||
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
GGs gl town! | ||
| ||