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[M][N] Mini Mafia: The (kinda) Vanilla Experience - Page 23

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 02:25 GMT
#441
Bad or scummy? I think it's bad but not really scummy, especially since I feel like he has been very town otherwise.
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43269 Posts
October 22 2015 02:25 GMT
#442
On October 22 2015 11:25 Chromatically wrote:
Bad or scummy? I think it's bad but not really scummy, especially since I feel like he has been very town otherwise.

eh.. idk.. i want him to explain it.
table for two on a tv tray
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43269 Posts
October 22 2015 02:27 GMT
#443
like idk what he would gain if BH is town here. Or scum...

fuck... but it doesn't make any sense for me from town perspective either.
table for two on a tv tray
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43269 Posts
October 22 2015 02:27 GMT
#444
it is just a townread based on totally 100% non-alignment indicative things.
table for two on a tv tray
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 02:32 GMT
#445
I just wrote a post about what I believe he thinks but I think I'll hold off on that until he posts about it.

I do think mafia would rather not townread him than townread him anyway though.
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43269 Posts
October 22 2015 02:36 GMT
#446
On October 22 2015 11:32 Chromatically wrote:
I do think mafia would rather not townread him than townread him anyway though.

that was my first impression but why would a townie townread him?
well i guess we hear from him....
table for two on a tv tray
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 03:09 GMT
#447
Alright I've reread everything and the people I would most like to lynch are ritoky, yamato, and Hopeless.

ritoky I've talked about a bit already and I stand by what I said. Someone argued that mafia would rather just blend in with what's going on and sheep someone but I disagree. In my experience, mafia feel too uncomfortable just sheeping a read and leaving. They would rather jump on something that's easy to call out in order to seem proactive and "townie" (I did exactly this as mafia in Order 66). ritoky gives a textbook reason for scumreading gumshoe (editing posts + joking?) on a very easy target to call out (especially since gumshoe is mislynched a lot) when I have never looked at an edited post and thought "this really looks like mafia". I think it's more likely to come from a mafia looking for "tells" to call someone out on than a town honestly looking for who they believe are mafia.

Everything else ritoky has posted has just been filler intended to look like contribution:
On October 22 2015 07:03 ritoky wrote:
as someone who impersonated BH recently, BH is town until he does something egregious enough to be considered not town.

evidence:

as mafia -

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/481138-aperture-mafia-4-this-time-its-personal?user=Blazinghand

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/463542-cell-mini-mafia-iii?user=Blazinghand

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/449782-yuma-mini-mafia?user=Blazinghand

as town -

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/477800-vii-titanic-mini-mafia-i-have-a-cunning-plan?user=Blazinghand

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/468053-fantasy-football-ffl-mini?user=Blazinghand

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461330-noir-mini-mafia-chapter-2?user=Blazinghand

we done here?

For example, these are just links to BH's filters; ritoky doesn't give any opinion about his alignment.

Some people have said they get a town feel from his posts and I don't see that at all. This post:
On October 22 2015 06:44 ritoky wrote:
bh sleeping on me winning 6 of my 7 games as mafia on these forums made me die a little inside.

is ego-indicative but not alignment-indicative.


Hopeless I thought had the most awkward entrance into the thread out of everyone:
On October 22 2015 08:10 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2015 08:04 gumshoe wrote:
On October 22 2015 07:56 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On October 22 2015 06:56 gumshoe wrote:
On October 22 2015 06:30 Chromatically wrote:
BH, you talk a lot about why your lynch is random but not at all about why we should follow it.


Theres no point to him trying to convince us to follow his lynch. RNG is viable when reads are shit, convincing town to rng lynch requires shit reads. The game has just begun therefore reads have not had the time to develop quality, which means bh does not yet posses his convince condition.

In the absence of the means to convince us to choose his method, all he can do is argue how his is truly random. Because a mafia player who argues for an actual rng lynch is forfeiting his ability to protect his teammates (and potentially himself) from rng. A competent scumer would usually have faith in his ability to sway town one way or another, which means he probably wouldn't risk an rng team kill. Basically there are only 3 kinds of players who would propose this strat.

1) a player who is so insecure about his play, he is honestly proposing to just roll the dice instead of play(at least on day 1). This player could be town or scum.

2) A town player who is just using this as a means to prove his innocence "why would I risk killing myself or my teamies as mafia? I must be town!" this works sorta because your odds are quite low of hitting yourself and if you do then you can always say "well I know I'm town, so I'll just disregard this result" -_-

3) A scummer who believes that town will not actually rng lynch because it is objectively a bad strat compared to a really solid case/read. He must hope for this, because to a scummer the rng lynch can actually just backfire, since mafia as an entity operate on a clear pool of lives as opposed to towns mist of health.

we can probally straight up rule out the first possibility (bh be goods not scrubs), which leaves 2 and 3. This whole thing seems pre written so hard to tell between them. Honestly best just to ignore the whole thing unless it gets to the point where our reads are so junk an rng lynch is actually more likely.

ether way, I dont think bh expects us to actually straight up rng lynch, this was probably just a way to look active early on without actually offering substance (though it might draw substance out of others, which is always good)

this.
this is a big post of nonsense.


this is basically you saying welcome back : D . I'll tldr the post. I think bh's argument for random makes sense coming out of scum only if you except town not to listen(or you can sabotage the rng) and makes sense out of town only if your trying to look substancey and dont actually think it'll come to a random lynch. So I dont think BH honestly wants an rng lynch / : cause that would be silly, even in a game with good scum. What does that say for his alignment? Not much at all. Basically at the time I didnt think bhs actions meant he was townie, just that he was being active and probably insincere.

I might be totally wrong about but such is the risks of early reads. But yeah, rng is silly, case in point your on the chopping block right now for no reason. Do you think your scum? Do you think BH is derp? if no to both this statements then mine has at least as much chance to be true as there is to lynch into you and hit maf.

Can you tldr your tldr?

This felt to me like a mafia that really didn't know how to insert themselves into the conversation, so they reply to someone with a joke in a way that makes them seem a little "involved". He also votes rayn for RNG, which is obviously very easy to do as mafia. He then posts a lot, but doesn't say anything relevant to the game. He seems to me like mafia trying to blend in and interact with people, because he's only posting things that are very easy for mafia to post (nothing about reads/alignments).


yamato has already been talked about a bit, his entrance was awkward and he's done nothing other than respond when Vivax pressures him. I haven't gone in depth on his meta but I know he's supposed to be much less active as mafia and that fits here.
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 03:11 GMT
#448
That ended up longer than I planned it to be but yeah. I'm probably going to look at some meta now. In particular, I saw that Xatalos was very... cheerful? and I'd like to see if that corresponds more to an alignment.
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 03:11 GMT
#449
##Vote: ritoky
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43269 Posts
October 22 2015 03:17 GMT
#450
what about yamato?
table for two on a tv tray
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43269 Posts
October 22 2015 03:18 GMT
#451
and by yamato i mean slam.
table for two on a tv tray
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 03:23 GMT
#452
I really don't understand how Slam plays at all so I'm not sure. His most recent post at least mentioned that he didn't have scumreads and he was going to look harder for them, so that sounds good at least. He might just end up as PoE unless I feel like I can get a handle on his meta.

What do you think about ritoky?
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43269 Posts
October 22 2015 03:48 GMT
#453
i think ritoky is town tbh
table for two on a tv tray
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 03:52 GMT
#454
Why do you think that?

You think Hopeless is town too, correct?
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
October 22 2015 03:56 GMT
#455
You guys are making it difficult to be objective and all with the calling me mafia and stuff.
Writer@WriterYamato
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 04:18 GMT
#456
On October 22 2015 12:56 yamato77 wrote:
You guys are making it difficult to be objective and all with the calling me mafia and stuff.

Who should we lynch and why is it ritoky? Any reads?
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
October 22 2015 04:23 GMT
#457
I don't think Vivax is mafia.

I think Xatalos has some questionable parts of his filter and I agree with gumshoe to an extent.

I do not think gumshoe is mafia very often (given his play this game).

I think marv has changed how he plays (quite obviously). Don't know what to make of that quite yet.

I think rayn is leaning town but it's hard to say with not much having happened.

Most others are a big ?, including yourself.

tl;dr it's been 20 pages and 8 hours and no reads are confident.
Writer@WriterYamato
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 04:27 GMT
#458
Meta is hard, I don't think I got much from ritoky's at all but maybe that's just because he hasn't posted enough yet. He's usually really trolly as town, but he does it a bit too as mafia and there was a town game here where he was pretty serious anyway so I don't think it says much.

This was from his mafia game here though:
On April 07 2015 13:40 ritoky wrote:
the eye of the chupazi is being engaged!

[image loading]

hijole! cabron!

and he used the same picture here so I think that's pretty much a slam dunk case.
Chromatically
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1700 Posts
October 22 2015 04:28 GMT
#459
On October 22 2015 13:23 yamato77 wrote:
I don't think Vivax is mafia.

I think Xatalos has some questionable parts of his filter and I agree with gumshoe to an extent.

I do not think gumshoe is mafia very often (given his play this game).

I think marv has changed how he plays (quite obviously). Don't know what to make of that quite yet.

I think rayn is leaning town but it's hard to say with not much having happened.

Most others are a big ?, including yourself.

tl;dr it's been 20 pages and 8 hours and no reads are confident.

Who would you lynch between if you had to pick right now?
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
October 22 2015 04:35 GMT
#460
On October 22 2015 13:28 Chromatically wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2015 13:23 yamato77 wrote:
I don't think Vivax is mafia.

I think Xatalos has some questionable parts of his filter and I agree with gumshoe to an extent.

I do not think gumshoe is mafia very often (given his play this game).

I think marv has changed how he plays (quite obviously). Don't know what to make of that quite yet.

I think rayn is leaning town but it's hard to say with not much having happened.

Most others are a big ?, including yourself.

tl;dr it's been 20 pages and 8 hours and no reads are confident.

Who would you lynch between if you had to pick right now?

I wouldn't, because I have like 40 hours to decide.

This is one of the issues I have with Xatalos/Vivax and their "read" on me. Do you really expect me to be super active when there's nothing really that interesting to talk about? It's fucking pointless conjecture. No answer to your question will mean a damn thing in 20 hours when I have more substantive stuff to talk about.

Sure, it makes you question my alignment, but do I really care? No. When I want to, I'll be painfully obvious town and I'll almost certainly find a better lynch than most of you, and once you realize this, we'll be heading in a better direction. Thinking that you're "putting pressure" on me by forcing me to answer asinine questions is literally the least useful thing you could do at this juncture.

If I fail to deliver, you can go ahead and try to get me lynched, but in the mean time, don't delude yourself into thinking I'm scum just because I won't play the game the way you want me to. It's rather silly.
Writer@WriterYamato
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