EPTNewbie Student Mafia XI - Page 125
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ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
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ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
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Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:21 ruXxar wrote: Alright oats. Real talk here. What made you so sure wave was mafia *before* you checked him? Why did you not check me, who you multiple times wanted to lynch, while you never expressed any desire to lynch wave before today. I've said already, my checks were people I was paranoid about but were not gonna get lynched any time soon. Imo they were great checks. I can't say anything about the setup speculation except recently the roles for games have been pretty weird, not enough oversight. Like when bat flipped I was pretty damn confused, mad hatter and 3 blues in a newbie game is weird but whatever, that's how it is. I think it's pretty close minded to take setup speculation as the reason to lynch me when there is evidence all around that wave is mafia. He's the one that got redchecked and he has put in the least amount of effort today. It should be the other way around if he's town.. Trust me. Lol. Life is tough huh. | ||
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Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:31 ruXxar wrote: And also, do you not agree with the setup analysis? Lol the setup stuff is just observation, how can I agree when I'm in a game that is clearly different from the previous newbie games? | ||
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Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
It's a traditional thing. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:27 Oatsmaster wrote: I'm gonna say this again but I think it's really important. Why do I bother fakeclaiming pretty damn badly instead of just posting seals??? Also, remember all the claims you have seen while playing. How many of them were bad and mafia? How many of them were bad and town? I'm telling you that I have never seen a really really bad mafia fakeclaim, the only thing that gets close is bunnies vet claim in the most recent ver game but in that the claim was good enough for her to survive like 3 extra days. Pretty obvious, because you still have a chance to convince people here despite how terrible your fakeclaim is. I have absolutely seen bad mafia fakeclaims. (See fuba in Inglorious Basterds I think it was?) Hell I've even seen bad 3P fakeclaims (see BH in one of those Golden Sun games) Both got them lynched immediately if I remember correctly. If it was a real claim you would have absolutely claimed off the bat of the day instead of waited to make absolutely certain that nobody was already the cop. | ||
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ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
Show us. Make it clear. Help us understand. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
I have a son, it was father's day yesterday, and then I had a wedding that lasted well into the night. I wasn't about to ruin the day by arguing fruitlessly with you and getting myself all worked up. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:35 ruXxar wrote: If there is so much evidence for wave being mafia, then why are you the only one seeing it? Show us. Make it clear. Help us understand. That's the whole thing. There absolutely isn't. I have been busting my ass for most (I won't suggest I've been trying my hardest the entire time) of this game. All of the points Oats attempts to bring up as me being scum are simply not scumtells. He is desperation grasping at straws to bring up absolutely anything he can to make you guys pause and attempt to reconsider. Notice how he keeps bringing up activity and my 'reaction to the claim?" Horseshit. | ||
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ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
I just want to know how wave has *played* scummy. How you, oats were going to convince us without the cop claim. Besides the geript thing, the only thing you've used to Back up that wave is mafia, is things he has said and done *after* you claimed cop! | ||
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Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
And fyi, i didn't claim at the start because I actually think about optimum play. Claiming at the start of today is only optimal if I have both mafia Rux, I've posted like really clearly why I think wave is mafia. For the setup speculation, we already have had a mad hatter, a role previously never seen in a newbie game so why are you guys using that as an ultimate rule that can never be broken? | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:44 ruXxar wrote: At this point I don't even want to discuss the cop claim. I just want to know how wave has *played* scummy. How you, oats were going to convince us without the cop claim. Besides the geript thing, the only thing you've used to Back up that wave is mafia, is things he has said and done *after* you claimed cop! I actually didn't even consider this point whatsoever. Just further shows that Oats' plan from the start was to all-in on me and me alone. Why he chose me as his fakeclaim target I have no idea---I'm assuming again some sort of 'why would he go for the strongest player if he wasn't telling the truth' WIFOM crap. Ruxxar, I'm curious---because if it seems like people aren't going to change their minds on Oats I may as well---what do you make of Rels vs Kickstart earlier today? | ||
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ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
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Rels
France13467 Posts
Read the list of game Trfel quoted, and look the newbie games. On June 22 2015 15:27 Trfel wrote: Wow. Normally cop claims make the game easier, you just lynch the red check and if it's wrong, lynch the claimed cop. But at MYLO or LYLO, that doesn't work. Before the cop claim, I was scumreading Oatsmaster fairly strongly, and I was pretty convinced that WaveofShadow was town. Setup Analysis + Show Spoiler + We know for a fact that town had a Doctor and a Mad Hatter. Doctor is a very strong power role, and Mad Hatter seems to be of about medium strength (about the same as a vigilante). We don't really know what roles mafia has. However, most (13 player normal) mafia games are two moderately strong town power roles versus one strong mafia role and one weak mafia role. One example of this is the setup normally used in minis, accepted as a very standard setup. The newbie setup is as follows: This game uses a variable open setup. When the game begins, one of the following setups will be chosen: Cop is a strong role, Doctor is a strong role, Vigilante is a moderately strong role, and Veteran is a bit weaker. The setup is at most two strong roles versus one and a half scum roles (Godfather is weaker).A) 1 Town Cop, 1 Town Doctor, 8 Vanilla Townies, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Mafia Godfather, 1 Mafia Goon B) 1 Town Cop, 1 Town Veteran, 8 Vanilla Townies, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Mafia Godfather, 1 Mafia Goon C) 1 Town Vigilante, 1 Town Doctor, 8 Vanilla Townies, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Mafia Godfather, 1 Mafia Goon D) 1 Town Vigilante, 1 Town Veteran, 8 Vanilla Townies, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Mafia Godfather, 1 Mafia Goon Here are a list of the roles in the 13 player normal games with the last post in the past three months (bumps excluded, also note that all setups are 10 town versus 3 mafia):
In contrast, two of the listed games (I Still Cant Believe It's Not Themed Mafia and Game of Thrones Mini Mafia) had a mafia role with no purpose. Framer in the first game, Godfather in the second. It feels like having a Cop in addition to a Doctor and Mad Hatter is very unlikely. We have newbie IX, VIII, VII ... where is X ? Here it is. By now if you read the "fuck" above I suppose you guessed it. Three power roles. So Trfel: - Left out ONE game of newbie these past three month - The game he left out was ofc the game where there was three power roles - Then went on to claim he went through ALL mini normal games of this past 3 month, and ALL had a maximum two power roles Fuck. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:48 Oatsmaster wrote: How is your reaction anything but horse shit? The first thing you talk about is that I green checked Kickstarter. Not that i redchecked you or anything important. Then you leave and like 8 hours later come back and say you just noticed something you shouldve noticed a lot earlier if yyou were actually town. Then you disappear again and come back with inane nonsense about a town v town fight instead of trying to prove that I'm fakeclaiming. And fyi, i didn't claim at the start because I actually think about optimum play. Claiming at the start of today is only optimal if I have both mafia Rux, I've posted like really clearly why I think wave is mafia. For the setup speculation, we already have had a mad hatter, a role previously never seen in a newbie game so why are you guys using that as an ultimate rule that can never be broken? Why shouldn't that be the first thing I talk about? What good is it to town if I shout OATS IS SCUM IM ACTUALLY GREEN? I've already stated that. There is nothing scummy about that whatsoever. And you're saying I 'should've noticed that earlier' if I were town. Why exactly Oats? What's scummy about the timeline there. Please go ahead and explain to all those listening? And now you bring up what I talk about when I return? You're literally, and I mean LITERALLY taking everything I've said recently and attempting to paint that in a scummy light, and just like Ruxxar said, ONLY the stuff after you claimed is scummy somehow? lol. | ||
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Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
on June 16 2015 05:13 WaveofShadow wrote: I mean I'm just sitting here wondering why we're not lynching the guy who's clearly not playing the game, but that's just me. I am liking all the other stuff going on though. It makes me feel like scum are scrambling because the top townreads haven't really changed a whole lot and are untouchable while the scum are trying to figure out which of the dregs they can safely remove to continue on with the game. That in itself makes me feel good about Sulf not being targeted by anyone seemingly other than me. That says likely Sulf is scum and all the target switching and scumreads thrown out constantly means we're on the right track (although having to figure out which of all the people tossing around new scumreads are actually scum is blegggh). This post is a typical mafia post. It's super general and doesn't actually offer and real analysis. He implies that scum are scrambling when in actual fact, like half the game is doing something that he attributes as a scumtell. This is also without any mafia flips. he attributes to know what mafia are doing but the only mafia member he scum reads in this post and the next few posts are sulph, who is not doing what wave said scum or doing. Do you get this? | ||
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Rels
France13467 Posts
I also have to leave work so will be afk for one hour more or less. But right now, with Trfel fucking lying, the only mafia team that makes sense in my mind is WOS / Trfel. I can see Trfel easily as mafia. But WOS is like my super hard town read. I'll have to read all his filter again tonight. Well. During my afk time, ##Vote WaveofShadow | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:52 Rels wrote: Fuck. Fuck fuck fuck. Can't believe it. Read the list of game Trfel quoted, and look the newbie games. We have newbie IX, VIII, VII ... where is X ? Here it is. By now if you read the "fuck" above I suppose you guessed it. Three power roles. So Trfel: - Left out ONE game of newbie these past three month - The game he left out was ofc the game where there was three power roles - Then went on to claim he went through ALL mini normal games of this past 3 month, and ALL had a maximum two power roles Fuck. I'm personally not a fan of setup analysis anyway, I think I ignored that post by Trfel entirely. As is I think the only way for a 3-man power role setup to work is for there to be the presence of a scum roleblocker I believe, and I don't think anyone was informed of being roleblocked this game, unless people just didn't claim it for whatever reason. I know I wasn't roleblocked. That is really interesting though that he omitted only one game from the analysis lol. Can't tell if oversight or on purpose and if so to what end. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 23 2015 00:53 Oatsmaster wrote: This post is a typical mafia post. It's super general and doesn't actually offer and real analysis. He implies that scum are scrambling when in actual fact, like half the game is doing something that he attributes as a scumtell. This is also without any mafia flips. he attributes to know what mafia are doing but the only mafia member he scum reads in this post and the next few posts are sulph, who is not doing what wave said scum or doing. Do you get this? Oats, I can out a fucking hundred posts by you this game without any real analysis. And once again you're not making any sense. Why would I expect Sulfurus to be doing what the other scum are doing when he was the one targeted? Just absolute nonsense constantly spewing from your mouth. | ||
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Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
On June 19 2015 14:48 WaveofShadow wrote: So let me get this straight. You think Damdred is mafia. And you think Scott is mafia. And Scott is voting for Damdred, but he's not bussing this game. I mean...stop me if I'm not making sense here but SOMETHING isn't quite right, you know? Waves 180 on me is also really weird. Within a span of 36 hours, I go from one of his top town reads to one of his probably scum reads. This is consistent with the view of the thread, with kickstart and trfel pushing my case. However, in that space of time, wave only asked me a few questions after which he doesn't really follow up on, making me think that the read was changed in accordance with thread sentiment. There was nothing at all his wvaes filter showing his change of heart, just the change in tone with the posts towards me when he sheeped the scum read of kickstart. It's completely off. Wave totes mafia. | ||
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