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Ok, I'm certain I've solved the game and made a clear case about it.
I can't do anything about Town being full of ostriches + Show Spoiler +Everyones head is in the sand.
Nobody has a better case, nor good reasons why they don't agree with mine. Yet you are all willing to ignore my case, interesting. I'm learning a lot this game.
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Uh I might actually need to reread Barakos filter. Dude has literally no reads/good reasons for his votes anywhere. Only did a case on me D1 and a case on sicklucker D2. Other things are just going back and forth on bunnies and sheeping batsnacks. He was active quite a bit in that ticktoc vs plotspot battle, which makes him look really good. I also skimmed the old game he linked and he had a very strong play in this. (and was mafia)
@Barakos: why am I your #1 scum read? Your D1 case on me was based on like page 1 of my filter. Otherwise you only briefly mention me now and then again. Your filter is like devoid of me.
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EBWOP: Devoid of any real reads or cases that is?
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I said the lynch-list was based on feeling and i would reread. Basically it is there, so i don't get PMs again, that I have to vote till tomorro night.
Feelings I had, while making that list: SL is making tons of sense the last few days, bunnies is just meh, boxer is completely under my radar and you were the first case i had, so I stuck to it. I said I'd be rereading all filters but today is sunday, TI5-Qualifiers, Viagame Housecup + LCS NA, so I just lurk around here and didn't do rereading.
Also note, that tt said, i wouldn't make any cases today, to not draw attention to me and cause discussion about me. That guy isn't even reading the thread, or else he would have noticed, that I was the first to cast a vote.
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Okay, I hope you can contribute a bit more before EoD, though. I will wait to see what you, bunnies and boxerfred will bring to the table this night/tomorrow. Will be home from work ~7h before EoD. Might lurk a bit at work though. If anyone has questions for me, feel free to ask.  Will be around for another hour now.
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On June 01 2015 07:03 Tictock wrote:Ok, I'm certain I've solved the game and made a clear case about it. I can't do anything about Town being full of ostriches + Show Spoiler +Everyones head is in the sand. Nobody has a better case, nor good reasons why they don't agree with mine. Yet you are all willing to ignore my case, interesting. I'm learning a lot this game.
How many mafia games have you played until now? This is my second game. In my first I was lynched on the first day. I guess everyone has given up on explaining to you why if you think I'm scum you lynch Barakos first. I will most likely die soon anyway, I hope you don't fall too hard from your cloud. Not everyone who looks scummy is a freaking scum just because they don't provide enough of a good reason for your standards.
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I worked a double today which wa slike 9 hours........and Plots still has not answered my questions nor have we even posted a full page.
IS anyone actually trying to find mafia? Holy shit.
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@27nb
I was, but stopped when people didn't want to listen to my ideas. Clearly town prefers to have no plan, than a solid case. Oh and good luck with plots, he's a dodgy one.
I'd like to lynch mafia, so even though my case is on plots RB role being fake, I'm fine going with Bara first. Idk why people want to keep the worst Town RB in history around, but w/e.
##Unvote
##Vote: Barakos
They both have
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Ignore the last line, format fail.
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On June 01 2015 12:49 Tictock wrote: @27nb
I was, but stopped when people didn't want to listen to my ideas. Clearly town prefers to have no plan, than a solid case. Oh and good luck with plots, he's a dodgy one.
I'd like to lynch mafia, so even though my case is on plots RB role being fake, I'm fine going with Bara first. Idk why people want to keep the worst Town RB in history around, but w/e.
##Unvote
##Vote: Barakos
They both have
Why Bara?
He's a greencheck
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On June 01 2015 14:28 27ninjabunnies wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2015 12:49 Tictock wrote: @27nb
I was, but stopped when people didn't want to listen to my ideas. Clearly town prefers to have no plan, than a solid case. Oh and good luck with plots, he's a dodgy one.
I'd like to lynch mafia, so even though my case is on plots RB role being fake, I'm fine going with Bara first. Idk why people want to keep the worst Town RB in history around, but w/e.
##Unvote
##Vote: Barakos
They both have Why Bara? He's a greencheck
After this post, I would be totally ok with lynching 27nb.
The simple fact, that she doesn't know about the mayor discussion we had for the last few days shows that she is completely detached from the thread.
Also this here:
On May 31 2015 09:20 27ninjabunnies wrote: There also, tho unlikely, might not be a gf in the game, and both I and barakos are real checks.
Also, I think I might be done with the forum tonight, and will post more tomorrow.
Ticktock, your thinking was quite along with mine on plots being a mafia rb. I'd like to discuss more about your thinking on this later, after i read your 3 massive posts.
SL- what?
shows, that she isn't following the thread in the slightest, else she should know, that TT doesn't believe in a second roleblocker in the game.
She is basically dropping by, asking if nobody tries to find mafia, tries to start some kind of discussion, that will lead nowhere and drops off again. Seems totally uninterested in the actual topics of discussion in the thread, even the ones she pretends to be interested in.
##unvote ##vote: 27ninjabunnies
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I get that you were kinda busy, but did you have any success with:
On May 31 2015 07:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: I think tonight we need to focus on reading between SL/ dis/ and BF. All three i will filter later on. ?
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Actually 27nb asks a fair question. Why am I switching my vote to Bara?
Well, you guys were probably right. I may have been focusing plots too hard. So I will make this case under the assumption that plots is Town RB.
Greenchecked, but is he GF? So rather than tunnel him, I decided to follow his thinking. N2 plots blocked Bara becuase he thought he saw scum tendencies in his play. Having reviewed some things, I agree. I think plots backed off too early, Bara claiming the RB could easily be a ploy to keep people from guessing he is GF. Remember how he said it?
On May 28 2015 07:57 Barakos wrote: Just saw it now... I was roleblocked. Didn't see the pm at first.
Like an hour after Day phase had started. Remember the Day started with Bats claiming cop and stating his checks.
On May 28 2015 07:04 batsnacks wrote: Alright. I'm the cop. Barakos and 27nb are town. We're lynching sulfur today.
##vote sulfurus
Whats to stop GF!Bara from seeing his PM and seeing he got greenchecked as well? This gives him the perfect opportunity to fool not just one, but 2 blue roles, just by stating that he got RB'd. I know that in it self isn't enough to prove much, but it IS possible.
Votes
Remember Bara's votes D1 and D2? He voted Dis and then SL and gave pretty decent cases on them. Dis + Show Spoiler +On May 22 2015 16:49 Barakos wrote:Morning everyone! I'm here now and almost done to catching up. First thoughts: I like breschke pushing/tunneling sl, to prevent him from being lazy. Makes breschke look town in my eyes. What I didn't like was disformations filter. All he has done so far is posting fluff and agreeing to people but not contributing in any form, except a very weak and non-commiting push on bm for lurking. And then there are these 2 posts: Show nested quote +On May 22 2015 08:07 disformation wrote:
Uh... so let me try this... The italic part says a good towny is up to talk about things happening in the thread and does not be too super defensive if someone else calls him scum. He is open and active and tries to get people to talk in order to find scum. And the other part says that he should look at all the people and be open to reconsider his reads, otherwise he might tunnel super hard.
Still super cryptic stuff. At least I had something to think about for a bit. xD Show nested quote +On May 22 2015 09:01 disformation wrote:Uh. Didn't realize the Mafia QT would be open since 24h either. Otherwise I would have said something about his cheap read. xD Still not seeing a lot to lynch sicklucker though. I kinda expected him to post "lol didn't read" stuff regardless of his alignment anyway. Though he was super eager to paint himself townie: On May 22 2015 07:22 sicklucker wrote: disinfo you gonna correctly read me town again? Solid town read on Tictock for now. Asking all the questions I wish I had asked. xDI agree that BM should explain his bunnies vote, if he is as serious as he claims. In the bolded parts, he explains what good townplay should look like, and what he would like to have done. And that is all he does... he explains and doesn't follow up with anything, that would be good townplay... he just shows, that he knows, what town should do but does actually nothing. But since he shows, that he knows, what good townplay looks like, he is still "looking good" and tries to give the impression, that he is town but just hasn't had the opportunity to really do stuff. So for now my vote is on him. ##vote disformation That was his first post this game, and he never wavered from that logic. Bit odd right? SL + Show Spoiler +On May 26 2015 19:39 Barakos wrote:soo... reread the thread... one thing i found kinda funny: I make a post about the votes not meaning much, because it may very well have been planned to vote for unmotivated scum-scott and a few hours after disformation (my stongest scum-read at that moment) makes a huge post saying he analyzed the votes and stuff... it is almost as if you try to antagonize me, disfo.. Anyways... I doubt scum-disfo would do this, since i was the only one pushing him really hard and scum would at this point try to not draw more of my attention by actively trying to argue with me... so for now, disfo moves down from the top spot of my lynch-list. 27nb: looks not so good. was never under my suspicion, because I felt the exchange we had about sulfurus and her reaction to the case disformation made against her. Starts to look worse now. I like tictocks point, about her trying to draw attention to the people voting scott by asking, if there was mafia between them and her promising a big reads-post and not delivering also looks bad. sl: oh god, what a mess... it is almost as if he tries to confuse everybody... "i may or may not have a green check on barakos" "i may be cop or doctor" "i am vanilla town" Like wtf this play looks bad on so many levels. If you are vanilla town it is like the worst possible play to claim you have a green check on someone whose filter you haven't even read and you actually say, you can't read him properly... ok... he retracted in the end... i get that. Next thing, why this play was bad as it can be: He might very well have provoked a counter-claim by the real cop/doc... this is a newbie-game after all and if there were a actual cop/doc in the game an excited newbie might have very well counterclaimed right on the spot. So him going all "i am role x/y" and then after some hours of waiting and no counterclaims saying "lol, just kidding i trolled you all, i am a plain vt." looks very much like rolehunting and hoping someone actually bites and counterclaims. Also there is this quote by him going like "masons, i know who you are, you might as well come out and claim."... next occasion he is rolehunting. but when boxerfred has a theory about a cop having a redcheck and therefor trying to start a wagon, he instantly calls him out on in. So it's ok, when he does it... but only, when he does it. Other things I don't like about his spammy, mostly oneliner-filter: He trys to paint himself in a towny light with the most absurd reasons, like the votecount for example. He puts himself in the spot of a town hero by saying it was his vote and him persuading batsnacks to vote scott that finally swung the vote to lynch scott and not disformation, and when he is confronted with a reasonable arguement, that invalidates this arguement (my post that those votes may very well have been preplanned), his reaction is "lol you know, what mafia says in their qt? you are mafia!" You are not mafia for thinking about, what mafia would do in their qt, and what might be their plans... that's a natural thing for town to do - you try to figure them out and you are paranoid about everything that isn't actually confirmed. And this is one point where sl contradicts himself... see this quote: Show nested quote +On May 26 2015 14:44 sicklucker wrote: Maybe I was right about barokos and sulp pre planning their entrances how awesome would that be. Like there giving 0 critical thinking here we probably wont here from them for another 48 hours He refers to this post: Show nested quote +On May 22 2015 17:23 sicklucker wrote:
Did you guys just plan your list posts in the qt or something Not only does he conveniantly forget, that he was throwing dirt at me for entering the thread at the same time as rels (a confirmed town, he also threw dirt at) and not sulfurus, he is also completely fine with speculating about mafia-qts, when it fits his agenda. Only, when it is not fitting for him, he devaluates it by saying the person speculating is mafia for knowing too much about the scum-qt. Also him disregarding the possibility of a serialkiller to devalue votes vs him again lacks critical thinking on his part and ignoring the possibility of a townaction, that negated one kp at night. the chance isn't the biggest, i will agree to that, but there is still a possibility, that something like this happened. So to sum it up: SLs behavior looks very anti-town to me + he has double standarts, when it comes to certain behaviours and lacks town-trades like a certain amount of paranoia and critical thinking. I am totally fine with lynching him today. ##vote sicklucker Here Bara gives his own ideas as to why SL could be Scum, and this vote also stays. He actually does a decent job here not just sheeping stuff I'm tunneled on SL for this day. But...What happened to this case? He totally drops it, and we've never heard about it again.
I even asked Bara why D3 he was voting Sul. He clearly stated, On May 29 2015 20:43 Barakos wrote: Without any role-stuff I would still be onto sl/disfo, but that's not going to happen today... it's complete bs, to argue about what would happen without roles, when there are roles... you can argue, if they are valid claims or not, but pretending they don't exist and not using this information to your advantage is bad townplay... you need to use everything there is...
i am willing to speculate with you about fake-claims and stuff, because that is the reality the game takes place in, but to speculate, what would be without all the claims is just shutting your eyes and ignoring the major things that happend in the past 30 hours.
On May 29 2015 20:47 Barakos wrote: I am not clearing them, but our claimed cop is onto sulfurus so why not do the same? I could of course waste a vote on sl again like last time but I got someone I can sheep atm.
And I am sheeping our claimed cop and not the confirmed mason, because the confirmed mason wasn't making sense with his vote. :p So he has his own thoughts, but wants to sheep Bats? This seems odd from someone so attached to their own thoughts before. It makes sense if Bara is GF though, he wants to keep people thinking he's town and supports Bats to support his checks.
Now D4 again, we see Bara isn't targeting SL, why? He said D3 he still thinks he's scum. I'm wondering if this post had anything to do with it.
On May 30 2015 06:01 sicklucker wrote: Your green check is garbage because there a gf in the game like 90%+ of the time and barkos is 95%+ town Did he see SL town reading him and not want to piss him off? That's the only thing that makes sense to me.
I find Bara pretty scummy here, his votes and cases especially. I also know I'm not the only one, plots RB'd Bara N2 because he saw similarities in Bara's play this game to a scum game of his. I don't like meta reads, but Bara has been a little too sensible when talking to people and interacting. Yet his cases tend to fall flat, like he's not putting in the same effort.
So yea, Bara is a good lynch today.
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And for those who hate to read, my TL DR version.
I find Bara pretty scummy here, his votes and cases especially. I also know I'm not the only one, plots RB'd Bara N2 because he saw similarities in Bara's play this game to a scum game of his. I don't like meta reads, but Bara has been a little too sensible when talking to people and interacting. Yet his cases tend to fall flat, like he's not putting in the same effort.
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His delay in claiming that he was roleblocked could also mean he was talking about it in mafia qt... And I noticed the lack of reads/read progression, too: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/485267-newbie-student-mafia-x?page=109#2162
So yeah, he might just be mafia (with the last one being sicklucker or boxerfred, if plotspot is the town rb indeed). Still he has a green check... so I am not sure if I would want to lynch him. On the other hand my #3 lynch also has a green check...
To clarify: #1 will be between barakos and boxerfred depending on their answers. #3 is currently still 27ninjabunnies. I get a bunch more of frustrated/annoyed town feeling of her D4, but she still hasn't contributed much... though people are not answering her questions, so I don't really want to lynch her asap. #4 is sicklucker. who feels a bit lazy and lurky to me. but his D3 and D4 filter looks really town to me...
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The super low levels of activity this D4 are also really alarming. Town seems to be either really frustrated or really lazy. Maybe both. Which makes this even easier for mafia. Me no like.
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some things I'd like to add, since I'm going to be on the road to my parents (my fathers birthday tomorrow) this afternoon and don't know, if I'll make it in time to write all this down before eod/eon and well - maybe I get lynched or killed.(I will not fight that lynch... if there are enough people, who think I'm a good lynch, then fine. have it your way, I'll be delighted to see tictock fall off his high horse, he thinks he is riding).
I reread 27nb, bf and disfo. 27nb seems the least involved and doesn't seem to be following the thread unless she needs to. I highly prefer her as lynch today before the other two. In case she flips red, I think there is a connection between her and disfo. Disfo made the case on her D1 at a time, where she had enough time to defend. They voted each other from time to time but in the end disfos vote never was on her at EoD, although he twice had the chance to be the vote, that makes the difference. So this is something one has to look at, if she flips red. An other thing, that happens, if she flips red, is that bf is cleared in my opinion, because both D2 and D3 he was on bunnies, although it was both times a close vote. Especially D3 he could have easily switched with the claimed cop but he didn't. So - in case bunnies is red, bf is most likely green. If she flips green, then well... shit. Votes mean nothing, since then both D2 and D3 were lynches between two townies and mafia couldn't care less, who to vote.
An other thing I would like to say: In case I get lynched, I want you all to make as much fun of TT as you can. His read on plots and me is bad and you should make him feel bad. Still, TT is the 2nd mason and therefore confirmed town... so make fun of him, but don't vote him. Mafia probably won't lynch him either, since his reads are so bad, that it doesn't matter, that he is confirmed town, so try to work with him, because if I get lynched you are in lylo the next day.
If you have lynched me, plots is confirmed town in my eyes, because a setup rb,rb,goon doesn't make sense vs a single town cop. Just my opinion and that's also, why I am so sure of plots being town. I'd like to believe in a 2-rb-mafiateam, cause that would make bunnies and me confirmed, since there wouldn't be a gf in this setup, but I said it before and I'll repeat myself... I don't believe in a setup like this.
Last thing - on sl: I haven't reread sls filter indepth (too long for reading it at work). I think he is the worst lynch today, but in case that bunnies flips green, the scum-team imho is SL + disfo. His posting has decreased significnatly since breshke is dead (bats said, he posts less, once he feels safe) and mostly all of his reasons, why he calls himself confirmed town are weak at best (scotts filter, the votes on scott, etc...) but this is only in case bunnies flips green today.
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note: this post was made before tictocks case on me.
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ebwop: before i read tictocks case on me...
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