EPTI've never played, so if you're alright with a newbie joining in, then please do sign me up. I've read a few of the guides already though, and it seems like an interesting format. Seems like the type of game that might even be more fun in IRC format.
Mission Mini Mafia
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
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3d12
United States100 Posts
I've never played, so if you're alright with a newbie joining in, then please do sign me up. I've read a few of the guides already though, and it seems like an interesting format. Seems like the type of game that might even be more fun in IRC format. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
And thanks.  | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
Is the deadline of 12:30pm PDT the deadline for confirmation, or the deadline to post each day? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On August 31 2014 14:36 kushm4sta wrote: 3d12 wat wat wat? Hi. I'm new. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
Totally! BFFs forever, or something like that.  | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
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3d12
United States100 Posts
27ninjabunnies gobbledydook 3.5 hours left now.  | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
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3d12
United States100 Posts
From Templar's post, I think this stuck out to me the most: [quote="The_Templar"] And the missions are required for mafia… or they will die. I would say that's better for us anyway[/quote] He makes a good point. We're making a witch-hunt out of nothing right now. I think batsnacks is judging reactions and playing provocateur. He looks pretty town from where I'm standing, but I don't have all my chips on the table just yet. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 02 2014 08:08 The_Templar wrote: And the missions are required for mafia… or they will die. I would say that's better for us anyway. I didn't quote the post directly. Sorry. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 02 2014 10:33 kitaman27 wrote: I see batsnacks voting templar after a large low quality post, but I don't see how you automatically come to this conclusion that his is town based on his vote and assume he is playing provocative. It makes me suspicious of you and I wonder if you may know he is town and are attempting to come up with an suggestion that explains his play without the information being there. On September 02 2014 03:16 Damdred wrote: @3d when you return could you talk more about why you think bat is doing that (as in him being provocative etc) and why town bats would just do that and run out of the thread? Feels like you are giving him a pass on it to easily at this point, though I do not think it is beyond town bats to do it either. It wasn't who he voted for, it was how he voted and why. By casting a vote in a random direction, one can sit back and observe how people react to that vote. That's not typically Mafia behavior, though I will admit the long-winded post from earlier had me confused as well. All in all, it's a tough read; but if I had to imagine myself in his position, I wouldn't imagine he'd want to make such a big target out of himself on D1 if he were Mafia. Instead, I'll be focusing on the people using this event and the surrounding discussion to mask their contributions to the investigation at large. And currently exhibit A on my list is kushm4sta. Despite the awesomely understanding acceptance of my newbie ways, we haven't seen much from him aside from jumping on the batwagon and refuting Vivax -- who, in my opinion, is making the most sense out of anyone in this entire thread, myself included. Exhibit B is Micchan, who seems strangely quiet. I hope he hasn't gone AFK. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 02 2014 22:26 kushm4sta wrote: So why am I scum? "jumping on the bandwagon?" not really a bandwagon since there are only two people voting for batsnacks, and I didn't really jump on it cause I was the first vote. "refuting vivax" Why are my refutations scummy? What has vivax said that makes sense? You're right, I thought I saw a third vote for batsnacks. Sorry. I wish there was a neater way to find the current vote count. Is there a program or something that I could use to loop through the thread and count the votes? As for refuting Vivax, I said that because Vivax is the one that I'm getting the most positive read from so far. He's pointed out very good inconsistency between Templar and kita, and even though Templar has made a few good posts to better explain his views, kita's evasiveness is something to be observed more closely, I think. On September 02 2014 22:12 kitaman27 wrote: How do you feel about obi and poofter so far? Obi is a bit of a mystery, but is starting to look more pink to me. The fact that he was so willing to vote out bat for what was likely a provocation post makes me question his motives, but the fact that he instantly switched his view to Templar after receiving some pressure is a bit more fishy. More data is needed, but the radar is definitely reading slightly pink. Poofter seems alright though; his posts are generally low-content, but unless we revisit the idea of missions involving post count, that's not enough for me to read him as scum. On September 02 2014 17:54 Oatsmaster wrote: just saw 3d's post, calls out micchan for being quiet, doesnt call me out for not posting at all. Clearly sheeping someone's previous sentiment. Or anticipating your mod-kill due to 12 hours without post. Welcome to the game. (And my suspect list, lol)Care to share any opinion on Templar or mderg? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 03 2014 01:11 Damdred wrote: Actually 3d, why are you ignoring bunnies right now? She has said a couple times that she would be happy to get you out of the game, what do you think of that? Why did you put off commenting on it? Not worth comment, imo. She said herself that her read on me is only a "gut read," and if people are happy with bandwagoning on a gut feeling to have me lynched, I'll happily /obs and laugh as the scum runs away with the game. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
If you'd asked me this 4 hours in, I'd have read Obi as green as I did bat. His opening vote was similarly provocative, and there was little reason to suspect. Since pushing to have bat plynched though, Obi has pointed fingers at two other parties and is acting much more defensive. I'm not voting yet, but Obi is definitely on my radar. On September 03 2014 01:38 Damdred wrote: Well I can understand that. However what do you think of bunnies posts besides her gut feeling on you? What posts? Aside from a suspicious(ly silly) read on poofter and a CTA for a vigi on bat, she hasn't contributed much to the discussion so far. If anything, if the deadline was right now and I had to cast my vote, I think 27nb would be my choice. Stepping up and trying to publicly read poofter as town based on nothing but troll posts gives me a bad feeling that there may even be a bus straight to LYLO going on under our noses. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 03 2014 02:28 Micchan wrote: Ok here whatever Im srry 3d i highly suspect ing u after backtracking...ur obviously trying to divert attention rn... Don't be sorry, that's all part of the game. However, reasoning is also part of this game. Care to share yours, or are you just blindly drumming up a wagon? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
Notes from last night: 1. The next person to suggest we ignore missions is getting full-on scumread. This topic keeps coming up, very sporadically, and it feels like a few people are trying to echo the idea across the crowd, so it's more acceptable later. Ignoring the mission concept is completely unacceptable and will only serve to hinder us. Stay vigilant for possible mission-like behaviors, everyone. I get the feeling that they would be rather out-of-the-ordinary missions, otherwise the host could have just as well run vanilla. (Sorry for the meta read there, but if anyone wants to refute that, I'm open to hear your case.) 2. Micchan is giving off a serious mafia vibe to me. Not only did his bandwagoning post seem forced ("Ok here whatever" as if he's trying to seem aloof) but the fact that his only other post yesterday was a defensive misdirection, posted only 20 minutes after he was called out. He's either really bad at this game, scum, too busy IRL to play, or any/all of the above. 3. Poofter's reads (specifically the BMK list) seem solid for the most part, but the way he posted and went after Micchan tells me something isn't right. Specifically, the way he's applying pressure to vote. The reads say town, but the pressure says mafia. Nobody on my town list so far has been pushing for a D1 lynch. 4. My posts usually do come across as apologetic. Not just here either. Blame my mother for giving birth within spitting distance of Canada. Anyone reading into that makes it on my scum list, since it looks like they're conjuring fault out of nothing. With my personal notes out of the way, let's move on to direct responses: On September 03 2014 05:23 The_Templar wrote: If you think bunnies' activities make her lynchable right now you should probably explain the posts she has made... Up until this post in the thread, bunnies' biggest contribution to the thread was to town claim for the person she's been buddying/bantering with throughout the whole thread. Suspicious? Yes. Lynchable? Not by itself. I also particularly disliked the way bunnies was gathering information, going from defensive short-posts to prodding people for their reads and then replying to each one-by-one. Generally, townies are more willing to share their reads, instead of needing to base their perspective on other people's reads. Today's bunnies is a bit different from yesterday's bunnies, in that she's laid out a list of her reads. No information or explanation, but at least she's sharing. I do like that. On September 03 2014 22:14 27ninjabunnies wrote: @3d12- you said my read on tehpoofter was silly and based on troll posts, but I think I gave a bit more reasoning than that. why is the read silly to you? What do you think of poofter so far? Also http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/465384-mission-mini-mafia?page=17#338<--------- Town tehpoof The read is silly because it was based entirely on meta. A person's meta can change from game to game. This read came from nothing tangible. For example, it would be impossible for me to have the same read on poof because I've never played with him. Since you and I have been exposed to the same information this game, you are using information I have not been exposed to to make a claim on someone else. That is absolutely 100% fishy, would you agree? As for my reads on poofter, see point 3 from my "last night's notes" above, and my list of reads below. On September 03 2014 05:38 mderg wrote: Anyone else thinking that 3d12 is trying hard to get some newbie bonus? I also don't like how a provocative opening instantly makes him townread people. Anyone else thinking that mderg is trying hard to get some focus on me? I wasn't the only one to nullread/townread bat yesterday. And yes, traditionally from my live mafia experience, provocative openings are usually townies. It's probably an 80/20 split. I never confirmed him green, but I pointed out that bat looked town from the way he opened. If you have a better reason to scumread him instead, why not post your reasoning? On September 03 2014 00:05 mderg wrote: I don't like the batsnacks votes. They seem kinda lazy. Sure, his post didn't make any sense but that's it. This was all the reasoning I could find in your filter, and it's pretty weak. So, how about it, mderg? Batsnacks: scum or town? List of reads: Mafia ObiWanShinobi (Very non-committal so far, easily switched vote from "troll vote" to batsnacks once it seemed like bat was being scumread. Hesitant to share information. Off-topic posts. Only real redeeming quality so far is calling out kush, very pro-town move.) mderg (Repeatedly pushing the "ignore the missions" idea, provoking reactions from players while not disclosing any information himself, heavy lurking, generally defensive) kushm4sta (Tunnel-vision on batsnacks, trying to start a plynch, low activity otherwise) Micchan (Inactivity, defensive, no thoughts shared, no case built, suspicious bandwagoning) Mafia-likely (Pink) TehPoofter (High voting pressure, starting a bandwagon/plynch, very large filter, calls people out on buddying while blatantly attempting to buddy, redeemed so far by good questioning of Templar's motives) Oatsmaster (Avoiding all talk about missions, redirecting scum claims towards bat and Obi, not posting thoughts openly) Neutral (White) The_Templar (Good expression and information-sharing, challenges unnatural ideas/thoughts, sensibly pieces together a motive. Neutral because of weak (meta/defensive) defense about his role) Vivax (Strange read on poofter, but otherwise constructs very sensible and well-put-together posts pointing out discrepancies. Without the pink vibe from his accusations toward kita and templar, would likely be very town atm.) Damdred (No real read yet, seems to be gathering information. Is asking the right questions, but not sharing information openly) 27ninjabunnies (Good info balanced out by suspicious buddying/claiming) Town batsnacks (I wasn't sure at first, but after your expose on kita, I know you're looking in the right places. Your investigation is solid and you're providing direct responses to your challenges. I highly doubt kita is scum, but I like the way you think.) kitaman27 (The main source of information so far imo, this guy is posting very good reads and keeping good notes. Only scummy behavior so far is what was pointed out by Vivax, but without further proof I'm willing to let it slide as a poor choice of words) All in all, I don't like the idea of a plynch. However, I less like the idea of scum lurking the thread and hopping on whatever bandwagon is hot at the time. Let's change that. ##Vote: Micchan | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 03:52 The_Templar wrote: I don't think 3d is lazy. HEY 3d, you have to vote, it's specified in the OP. Lol, I know. I was posting. Sorry, trying to post at work while looking like I'm doing work. It's not a fast process. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 04:21 ObiWanShinobi wrote: 3d called a bunch of people scum for wanting to plynch, and then hops on a plynch bandwagon. lool On September 04 2014 03:53 3d12 wrote: All in all, I don't like the idea of a plynch. However, I less like the idea of scum lurking the thread and hopping on whatever bandwagon is hot at the time. Let's change that. ##Vote: Micchan You seemed to jump on this bandwagon easily, and now you're on the batwagon? What's your motivation, then? I posted mine. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 04:26 The_Templar wrote: read his filter, primarily due because of batsnacks' stupid first post Exactly, he's still bandwagoning on bat for a 0% reason except "this might be a mission." I'll grant that's a valid reason, but I just can't see bat being mafia at this stage. His contributions are far too helpful. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
Which one, this one or Storm? Because it seems like you're pulling your reads on bat from the latter. Please do point out where you've built a constructive case surrounding this thread, though. | ||
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United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 04:33 27ninjabunnies wrote: What has he contributed that has been helpful? Specifically? The kita wagon. Even though I believe it's false, bat is being concise in constructing a case based on things that are not obvious. Everyone else is chasing the obvious lynch, but bat is thinking outside the box. Besides, if he were mafia, why would he go out of his way to start a wagon against a second party? You would think that would make you stick out more than blend in, which it did. That doesn't sound very town of you... You don't like hearing what I have to say? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
This sucks. I guess we can hold out hope for more blue roles, but at this point the thread is going so far off the rails that I don't even know how much that would help. I wish we knew how many scum there were, anyway. Everyone's saying 6 scumreads from me seems too high, but I'm personally a bit more suspicious that you guys don't suspect many people. How many scum do you think there are? I'm betting at least 4. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 04:42 The_Templar wrote: Since there are 13 players, there are almost certainly 3 scum. Have you ever played mafia before out of curiousity? A few times, yeah. Mostly back in high school, it was a pretty popular game to play in band while setting up the stages. So you guys play with a fixed number of mafia? We always played randomized, as long as it was less than half the total players. Though granted, not many people like D1 LYLO. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 04:46 27ninjabunnies wrote: Well I'm guessing if there is a doctor blue role, I'm sure there's a couple other blue roles. IS it too late to change my read back to scum on 3d? Like, that was bad. just bad. What was so bad? If you would rather I hold my information, I can do that instead. I didn't realize I'd be flamed so hard for posting reads. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 04:41 ObiWanShinobi wrote: No, I don't. I think the majority of what you have said thus far has been really contradictory/superficial and you're starting to annoy me. Me not listening to you isn't even alignment indicative but you're acting like it is. So stop. The only people with a motive to quash information are scum. And you seem to take personal offense to my accusation of you. Why is that? You have yet to point out any actual inconsistencies in what I've posted, instead going directly to personal insults. Why are you so threatened? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 06:38 ObiWanShinobi wrote: I'm not threatened. We've pointed out several issues in what you've been saying but you haven't been paying attention to any of them. If you're not reading the thread, then I'm not going to waste my time trying to explain things to you. How about no. What you have pointed out so far is: On September 04 2014 04:21 ObiWanShinobi wrote: 3d called a bunch of people scum for wanting to plynch, and then hops on a plynch bandwagon. lool On September 04 2014 04:23 ObiWanShinobi wrote: That last giant post from 3d is really shitty in more ways than one. If we could do a last minute swap to him, that would be really cool. There are like 50 billion contradictions in there and I doubt he'll be able to explain all of them away. Lots of unnecessary doubt in there and not a whole lot of stuff makes sense on inspection. And then a whole bunch of buttmad just because I hold a different viewpoint than you on the batsnacks issue. If you could actually consolidate your thoughts on me into a cohesive point, you might not read as red as Mars right now. As it stands, you're backtracking and scrambling to start a wagon. Neither are things I would consider town behavior. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 04:15 mderg wrote: I think you're misunderstanding something. I'm undecided about batsnacks, I don't have a better reason to scumread him than you have to townread him but that's exactly why I'm not scumreading him. You pulled some reason to townread batsnacks out of your ass that's 0% reliable. And that's what's bothering me. That's a very fair point. So who do you have as scum so far? I'd like to hear more about what you have, since your filter is devoid of reads and consists mostly of you agreeing with people. What do you think of ObiWanShinobi so far? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 12:34 ObiWanShinobi wrote: Templar, Vivax can base his reads off of meta because he has tons of first hand experience of playing with both of us. They look like shitty reasons to you because we've never played together. This post bothers me the most so far. Unless it's sarcasm, then disregard. Why would an individual's meta be relevant at all? I understand the nature of certain people may not change much, but especially in a forum-based game, is it really so hard to believe that people would act differently from game to game? Because to be honest, it does look like the shittiest reason. I don't like this read from Vivax at all. If you can challenge this view, I'd welcome you to do so. No hate, and I promise I'm reading. Keep in mind that people interpret things differently, and that's part of the fun of Mafia. What one person may not see in a post, someone else might. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 06:39 batsnacks wrote: I was busy. Why ask me these questions now and not when you are imagining they would be important? This discussion is meaningless now. He does have a point. To be honest, it looks like the way you started your wagon could have even been the point of a mission. Something like "be the only vote on a target" or "have X number of targets by EoD." I liked your reasoning on the kita case, but give me a reason to like it. Why not push your target, especially so close to deadline? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 13:19 ObiWanShinobi wrote: I really don't think you understand how meta works. People can consciously change their meta but that doesn't really erase the fact that they're still going to show signs of being mafia or not. Kush is playing to his scum meta because he doesn't give a shit about what's going on. It's hard for him to fake the amount of effort he generally puts into the game when he's town. His posts near EoD were all really good, so it's possible, but he won't be able to keep up that level of interest forever if he's scum. If you want to go ahead and use the database to confirm your suspicions or to look up whether what we're saying or not is true, then go ahead. I understand, I might have to look into that. Thank you for explaining. I've never put much weight into this notion, at least not for live mafia. Maybe forum mafia applies differently. That might be why our radars are so out-of-sync though, meta reads on players don't sit very well with me in general. Re-reading your filter, it does seem like bat's case has a few holes. I didn't take it very seriously at first, since the whole post gave me a bad vibe and bat hadn't exactly seemed the most trustworthy type. What do you think about the discussion of ending the voting early, or otherwise changing the "structural meta?" An idea I had in the shower earlier would be to have each person pick someone who will decide their vote for them. That way, if mafia are forced to vote a certain way, anyone who disobeys the "town meta" will stick out. It's another shot in the dark, but since it's nighttime anyway, why not. It's been a while since the topic of missions was brought up. So far I see a few ways they could have affected the gameplay, as in my post to batsnacks, but nothing too solid. Any thoughts? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 11:30 Damdred wrote: Yes, his read evolution is weird. His town reading bats has me feeling uneasy, and his vote post talking about jumping on a hot wagon and lurking felt off. so I think he has to be in the discussion Why did that part of the post feel off to you? I thought it was pretty straightforward. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 13:43 ObiWanShinobi wrote: Or we can just scumhunt. The trouble of going through with trying to fuck with people's missions that we don't even really know about is a bit much. Scumhunting is probably easier, so wharvez. When you say a bit much, do you mean too much effort or too many people? With a coordinated town effort, I think enough subtle changes to the meta could really throw things off for them. The way I see the Mafia this game, they are likely extra paranoid due to the death condition hanging over their heads. I think the easiest way to bring them out would be to shake things up and see who starts crawling out. Do you disagree? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 13:45 Vivax wrote: 3d12, I quoted two posts of yours regarding bunnies that seem contradictory and generally dont display well how you decide to get the current read on her, can you go into detail about that stuff? Sure. Quoted here, for posterity. My read on bunnies was based mostly on her read of poofter. Early D1 I didn't like the way she openly read him as town for reasons of personal meta. At the moment, it seemed like the most likely scenario was that she was buddying and attempting to avoid suspect. Later on in the day, she seemed to become more perceptive and started posting reads and sharing info, interacting with more people. Specifically this post, which was indicative that we're at least reading kita the same way: On September 03 2014 22:31 27ninjabunnies wrote: Well, Bat's read disagrees with mine. I find you quite townie. Your posts have been pretty good, your reads aren't too bad (though reads arent technically alignment indicative), and your questions have been great. I like where your mind is at. Mostly. Tho, not sure if bats vote is troll or actually serious. If serious, Im curious as to the conclusion he came up with on you and how you are mafia. I'm not 100% convinced she's town, but she gained a few town points to me in the twilight hours of D1. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 16:45 Vivax wrote: Yea but what I'm still missing here is the contradiction: First you said "If I could lynch someone now it would be bunnies". In the later post you backtrack from this and say about the same stuff "suspicious, yes, but lynchable no". Then mention how you didn't like her way of prodding people for reads. And at the end of this it's suddenly all cool cause she shared her reads at some point. Your suspicion of her is not as visible at this point, compared to the previous post where you said you would lynch her, and you mention a mix of scummy and not scummy stuff you conclude with by saying something that you like (she's sharing reads of her own). What also is out of my understanding is that you mention the scummy stuff a person has done and when she stops doing it, it's suddenly all right again. It's like pointing out things that make somebody scum, they are there, they are out and you saw them and picked up on it. And when that person simply stops doing the mistakes you called her out for, you unscumread her? Just like that? On September 04 2014 16:47 Vivax wrote: Oh and with the post you answered to me just now you forgot to mention one of the things you previously found scummy about her: That she was asking people for their reads. Forgetful about the reasons you found her scummy for? The funny thing about contradictions is that, if you look hard enough, you can almost always find one. Since you were asking about my interpretation earlier, allow me to deconstruct this excellent example. First, I'll re-quote the relevant part above, without nesting, to ensure we're contextually on the same page. On September 03 2014 03:07 3d12 wrote: <snip> What posts? Aside from a suspicious(ly silly) read on poofter and a CTA for a vigi on bat, she hasn't contributed much to the discussion so far. If anything, if the deadline was right now and I had to cast my vote, I think 27nb would be my choice. Stepping up and trying to publicly read poofter as town based on nothing but troll posts gives me a bad feeling that there may even be a bus straight to LYLO going on under our noses. Look at the bolded part. What you read as "if I could lynch someone right now it would be bunnies," I read as "there haven't been too many examples of openly scummy behavior yet, so this is my #1 at the moment." By itself, this isn't lynchable, and thus my hesitation to even speculate at a vote, and the wild speculation that ensues in the following sentence. Did I really construe all of that from her filter? No, of course not, there's no factual evidence for it. But it did give me a really bad feeling, especially since I didn't get the same 'provocative' vibe I got from batsnacks. The bad feeling mostly went away though, when I saw more involvement in the later half of D1. What before was "tell me what happened and why that's important to you" bunnies was now "my reads look like yours" bunnies -- much less trolly/fluffy, (lol fluffy bunnies) much more serious, much more involved in the progress of the game. Her posting a reads list did shift her to neutral in my mind, since I'm still mostly focusing on the people who were using the batsnacks confusion on D1 to slip through more or less unnoticed. (Hint: the ones marked as most likely mafia on my reads list) To put it more simply, she went from "probably scum" to "probably not scum." Still no solid read, as we're only on N1. That was fun. For our next exercise in perception, I'd like you to analyze the motive behind this post. Not the content of the post itself, but I'd like you to explain to me why you think 27nb said this: On September 04 2014 11:43 27ninjabunnies wrote: So, the conversations here have been pretty interesting.. Seriously, batsnacks needs to die! There's been like 4 or 5 times Obi has asked BS to give his read as to why there's one between me and him, and BS still has refused to answer. Why are you avoiding it so much, Bat? Also, Dam, how can you be reading me, Bat, and 3d as mafia when I've been pushing on Bat, and called 3d scum/neutral scum earlier? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 21:59 27ninjabunnies wrote: Actually I'm curious. How is asking for reads scummy? 3d, have you played forum mafia before (you might have answered this before, but I'm lazy and don't want to search) I did answer this, and Templar is correct. I've never played forum mafia, only RL and that was about 4-5 years ago now. Is there really that much of a disparity in the meta between the two? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 04 2014 22:21 27ninjabunnies wrote: Then that leads me to this question: did those who asked for other people's reads always turn out scum? Always? No. And no, asking for reads is not inherently scummy. I find the "explain why you find this important" behavior pretty scummy for D1, considering there's generally very little to find important before the first lynch. Again, this may be a difference in meta, but typically nobody's opinion is worth asking about on D1 and most people who do ask for opinions at that stage are too wrapped up in their mafia mindset to come up with an opinion of their own. This obviously wasn't the case with you, as you showed later on, but it did make me suspicious when my first posted impression of bat was taken to mean a true town read by a lot of people. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 05 2014 00:42 The_Templar wrote: live mafia = flailing around and yelling forum mafia = lynching people that flail around and yell Well, you certainly hit the nail on the head for live mafia, so I guess I'll take your word that the meta is very different. I'm seeing some similar patterns, though, so I'll reserve final judgment for later on. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 05 2014 01:31 Oatsmaster wrote: Nah, it just doesnt sound like someone playing their first game of mafia. Lotta meta in that post. Like mafia stratagies and tendencies. On September 05 2014 01:31 Oatsmaster wrote: *forum mafia. You're saying the meta between the two is similar? Templar seems to disagree. I think we're thinking along the same lines on the Micchan situation, though. I know who you're planning to lynch, but how do you feel about batsnacks' stance on the issue? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
Thank you. I'll take that as a compliment. | ||
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United States100 Posts
On September 05 2014 02:15 Oatsmaster wrote: What micchan situation. On September 04 2014 10:39 Oatsmaster wrote: Lynch all the people who overexpained their vote on micchien. Mderg and another guy. On September 04 2014 13:18 Oatsmaster wrote: Obi town too. I'm pretty sure there were at least 2 late adopters of the micchan wagon, I'll check later. Kita come on dude, you can do better than that The situation where we plynched someone with no real reason, creating a bandwagon which was likely easy for scum to jump on. I think we're thinking along the same lines, I just want to see where your head is at. On September 05 2014 02:15 Oatsmaster wrote: And what issue 3d? On September 04 2014 06:26 batsnacks wrote: Taunting does help. It helps me cope with ya'll. We should have NOT voted the easiest possible target d1 and mafia is most benefited by the doctor lynch. On September 04 2014 07:16 batsnacks wrote: Dude I have never said micchan was a townie. Never. The only thing I have said about micchan, and I said it -after- the lynch, was that he was a bad lynch. I'm just curious to see what you think of these posts. Personally, my read from them is that bats is trying to gain favor by going post-hoc on the lynch, maybe to gain traction for his kita case. What do you see? | ||
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On September 05 2014 02:54 kushm4sta wrote: Lol 3rd sc um are never gonna think about their actions strategically like that What makes you say that? Personal meta, or a read you've got? This is a very strange insight, one that a townie typically wouldn't have... | ||
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On September 05 2014 03:15 kushm4sta wrote: Chillax I got 6 scum reads Be careful with that. The last person who posted 6 scum reads had a wagon started against him for it. For real though, 6? Who? Also, do you play "townie until proven scum" or "scummy until proven town?" | ||
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On September 05 2014 03:43 kushm4sta wrote: 3rd I chose scummy till proven town. And the other thing just comes from playing a lot of forum mafia Mah nigga. +1 town point. So how do you weigh in on the meta topic, then? Do you think RL mafia and forum mafia have similar metas, or would you consider them very different? | ||
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On September 05 2014 04:35 sqrtofneg1 wrote: The_Templar the Vanilla Townie has died. Welp, guess I have to take a closer look at this filter. Good thing my work day has been fairly slow so far. Vivax, you seemed to have an issue with Templar's posts. Any thoughts, now that he's no longer among the posting? | ||
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gg man  | ||
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On September 05 2014 04:29 kitaman27 wrote: <snip> Imagine if you're in his shoes. You're dead set that I'm on a mafia mission to vote with the majority. You know you can't get me lynched. What do you do? You convince town to force me to vote outside the majority. It wouldn't have changed the outcome, and as a mafia player, if I were to fail a mission, it would mean my death. That's just as good as a lynch. He didn't even bother asking. In the meantime, while he is running around with his head cut off, he never even gives an opinion on Micchan. I think bat's opinion of Micchan was implied when he was calling him the "easy lynch." This is further compounded by his response to Vivax: On September 03 2014 08:08 batsnacks wrote: <snip> 1) Both and I think the two are related. <snip> Aside from that, I want to personally high-five you for echoing my sentiments exactly. I thought something didn't feel right with bat's wagon, I just couldn't put my finger on what it was. I came very close to the same conclusion though, as quoted: On September 04 2014 13:10 3d12 wrote: He does have a point. To be honest, it looks like the way you started your wagon could have even been the point of a mission. Something like "be the only vote on a target" or "have X number of targets by EoD." I liked your reasoning on the kita case, but give me a reason to like it. Why not push your target, especially so close to deadline? Though, the one aspect of missions that we seem to be assuming as true is that each mafia member has a different mission. Note the target distribution at the end of D1: On September 04 2014 04:29 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Vote Count – Day 1 27ninjabunnies (1): Tehpoofter (0): The_Templar (1): batsnacks (2): Micchan (6): ObiWanShinobi (0): kitaman27 (1): batsnacks Vivax (0): 3d12 (2): ObiWanShinobi, mderg If we clean that up to only the people with votes on them at the end of the day, we get 27nb (1), batsnacks (2), Micchan (6), kitaman27 (1), and 3d12 (2) for a total of five lynch candidates. If we back up a few hours, to the last vote count that was more than an hour before the deadline: On September 03 2014 11:04 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Vote Count – Day 1 27ninjabunnies (0): Tehpoofter (0): The_Templar (0): batsnacks (2): kushm4sta, Obiwanshinobi Micchan (1): Tehpoofter Obiwanshinobi (1): Oatsmaster Three targets. Granted, the timeline between these two posts is extensive, but a few things stick out immediately to me: 1) Two wagons started up within eight hours of the deadline, both on quite flimsy cases, and both without much attempt to get others onboard (me and kita) 2) On each wagon, the people who supported/townread the wagoner neglected to vote with them (me on the kitawagon, 27nb on Obi's dicewagon) 3) No follow-up has been posted from either wagoner to try and rekindle the fire for D2 This is absolutely suspicious behavior, and seems far too similar to be a coincidence. kitaman, you're top town imo. | ||
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Also, what happened to that reads list you were going to post last night? You seemed fairly confident last time you posted one, so just because you wagoned a mislynch that means all your reads are off? | ||
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##Vote batsnacks | ||
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I have a busy workload, and left all my notes at home, so if I find time I'll write up something quick. Otherwise, don't expect too much out of me for the next eight hours.  | ||
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Does anyone else find this suspicious? On September 05 2014 09:16 batsnacks wrote: Just so we're clear, I'm not actually voting someone right now. First of all, why the host warning? This screams mission to me, since I doubt bat would have been warned for changing his vote otherwise. At least, I'm pretty sure we can vote an unlimited number of times before deadline. And why the defensive clarification? Obviously, he ended his post "not actually voting someone," since his last vote was an unvote. Why specify this to the host, unless it had something to do with a quantification? Conclusion: batsnacks has a mission to vote X number of times today. Any explanation for this, bat? Any clarification from √(-1)? | ||
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On September 06 2014 00:23 kitaman27 wrote: I think you're leading down the wrong path there 3d. This is probably the strangest post I've seen from you yet, kita. Many potential missions have been pointed out by you and you've been really good at pointing out/heading off potential mission-like behavior. What makes you say this couldn't be true? Honestly, from the way your viewpoint changed without any clarification, it sounds like you're trying to pull me off of bat's trail. I'm townreading you so far, so give me a reason to keep doing so. Why is this mod warning irrelevant? | ||
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On September 06 2014 00:28 kitaman27 wrote: You don't make reads off of mod warnings, ever. How about in a scenario with potential death hanging over whether or not you fulfill your mission? I believe a mod would warn bat for trying to cheese his mission and complete it in one post. Without clarification from √(-1) though, it's impossible to tell. The way I see it, if this has nothing to do with a mission, √(-1) should clarify why bat was warned, since his behavior didn't seem outwardly worthy of a warning. If no clarification comes forth, I'm forced to believe it's to protect the integrity of the game, i.e. mission-related. Would you disagree? | ||
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On September 06 2014 00:32 kitaman27 wrote: That would be handled privately in my opinion. More likely, its in incredibly pain for a host to record 10 votes and unvotes on a voting history. So hitting CTRL+V 9 times is worth warning a player? I'll believe it when I hear it from the host. In the meantime, I suggest we keep a closer eye on bat. I was one of the ones who wrote off his intro post as nonsense, but his actions have gotten fishier lately, and that intro post keeps popping back into my mind like it's somehow relevant. You analyzed the intro post he posted and if I recall, you said there was a small section missing? Could you paste or link the missing section? If I have time over my lunch break, I'd like to poke into that a bit myself. | ||
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On September 06 2014 00:38 kushm4sta wrote: 3d do you also think Jews did 911 This made me laugh harder than it probably should have. Thanks. And no, I don't. Did that warning seem completely inconspicuous to you, kush? | ||
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On September 06 2014 01:14 batsnacks wrote: ##vote: kushm4sta dis gon b gud  | ||
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On September 05 2014 00:16 3d12 wrote: That was fun. For our next exercise in perception, I'd like you to analyze the motive behind this post. Not the content of the post itself, but I'd like you to explain to me why you think 27nb said this: Repeating my question to Vivax, for when he returns. I'd like you to provide a clearer perception of your view on bunnies. Quote any relevant posts, if not the above. | ||
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On September 06 2014 02:30 Oatsmaster wrote: ##unvote ##vote kush Oats: Your vote was already on kush? Why vote again, especially without further reason? On a related note, sqrtofneg1, could we get a current vote tally? When you get a moment, of course. | ||
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On September 06 2014 02:59 kushm4sta wrote: Reconsideration of batsnacks as town This idea looks pretty solidly townie. Also the more I think about his "kita needs to vote with the majority idea," the more it seems like too dumb to be scum. When you get a chance kush, I'd like you to expand on the bolded part, please. What do you mean by "too dumb to be scum?" Personally, I liked that case, even if I didn't agree with his conclusion. | ||
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On September 06 2014 03:12 kushm4sta wrote: of course you would like that case... We have zero information about the terms of the missions. Speculating something as specific as that and basing a scumread off of it is ridiculous. So ridiculous that scum would probably never make that argument. Originally I said it indicated tmi. But that is wrong. Scum would not go into lengths about a theory informed by their knowledge of their own missions. No scum is that dumb. Of course I would. Any case that helps root out scum, directly or indirectly, helps us as a whole. And zero information about the terms of the missions doesn't cripple us as much as you might like us to believe. We can infer about certain objectives the host may have arranged and gauge reactions accordingly. I don't like how it seems like you're trying to throw us off that trail. Also, I rather dislike the disparity between "So ridiculous that scum would probably never make that argument" and "No scum is that dumb." (emphasis mine) It seems like you started writing your post in one frame of mind, then switched to another frame of mind to make your point seem less shaky. If anything reeks of tmi in this post, it's that. | ||
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On September 06 2014 03:48 kushm4sta wrote: damdred "no scum is that dumb" and "scum would probably never make that argument" are the same thing. one is just exaggerated. but they represent the same mindset. Maybe it's just me, but I don't like this defensive tone. ##unvote ##Vote kushm4sta You have one chance from me. I was reading you town prior to today, but now I'm willing to put the batwagon on hold to pin you on this: Post your updated reads, or explain in clear terms why batsnacks couldn't be scum. You may quote any posts you would like to make this argument, not just the one you were referencing initially. | ||
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EBWOP to fix formatting. I don't know how stingy the host will be about that. | ||
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##Vote: kushm4sta | ||
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On September 06 2014 04:09 kushm4sta wrote: 3d I made a post explaining why I was reconsidering my bat read. 2 posts actually. Read them? I have been reading. In fact, I've probably been reading more than you would like me to: On September 06 2014 01:52 kushm4sta wrote: batsnacks i think you;re scum but ofc im not certain. I did give some reasons behind my suspicion, though. Why do you think I'm scum? On September 06 2014 02:59 kushm4sta wrote: Reconsideration of batsnacks as town This idea looks pretty solidly townie. Also the more I think about his "kita needs to vote with the majority idea," the more it seems like too dumb to be scum. Here we see one hour separating "batsnacks I think you're scum" and "This idea looks pretty solidly townie." That post from bat was made three days prior. Why did this not have any effect on your read before? On September 06 2014 03:52 kushm4sta wrote: I'm still trying to figure that out. Batsnacks still isn't clear for me. This is the post that opened my eyes to the possibility that he could be town: He has a lot of confidence that people should be able to read him as town. And he looked like he had a genuine protown attitude. However, since then he has fucked off completely so I'm like ehh. And here we are, one hour later, and you're back to "I'm still trying to figure that out." I can't tell if this is an honest approximation of "I'm re-reading and can't come to a conclusion yet" or "shit, I realized my inconsistency and should probably say something noncommittal so I can't be pinned for it." Who wins? Who's next? You decide. On September 06 2014 02:40 kushm4sta wrote: that's a sketchy as fuck thing to base a read on. you aren't me. You don't truly know my current level of caring AND you don't know how business could affect my level of caring. This was the kicker though. This post comes between the first two I've quoted timeline-wise, and takes place approximately one hour before you use the same "sketchy" (translation: scummy) reasoning in your post about bat. I'll re-quote it, in case you forgot: On September 06 2014 03:52 kushm4sta wrote: I'm still trying to figure that out. Batsnacks still isn't clear for me. This is the post that opened my eyes to the possibility that he could be town: He has a lot of confidence that people should be able to read him as town. And he looked like he had a genuine protown attitude. However, since then he has fucked off completely so I'm like ehh. So, with my case on the table, I will repeat my ultimatum. You will either post your list of updated reads with reasons for each, post a clear and concise explanation of why bat couldn't be scum, or you will be lynched. Make your choice. | ||
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Anyone else around currently? | ||
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On September 07 2014 00:26 Damdred wrote: ##Vote: 3d12 I think your scummy vivax, but 3d ignoring a ton of posts from poof and other people calling him scummy. Hes been doing it all game, with nb, with poof and with me. He has not interacted with the claims that hes scum hes just let people fight for his towniness without actually fighting himself. Well, good morning to you too! I haven't been ignoring the posts. I actually think poofter is pretty scummy too, but I don't have my notes with me to type up my case. I could maybe reconstruct the case from his posts, but I would need coffee first. As for right now, I'm still catching up. Might take a break to get coffee, ease the process along. If you have any opinions/answers you want, post. I'll respond to whatever relevant ones I find, but idk if you're looking for a particular repsonse over others. | ||
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Man, you sound straight-up grumpy. What's crawled up your butt this morning? Or have you not had coffee yet either? | ||
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On September 07 2014 00:52 batsnacks wrote: I'm always super suspicious when people say they've made hand written notes about the game. Why would anyone do that? You need a computer to play, why not use a word processor so you can copy paste? So my reason for posting right now is I don't believe your lame "don't have my notes can't post what I want" excuse. That's nice. At my job, they fire people who plug removable storage media into the computers and the firewall blocks google docs. So if I want to be able to access my notes at work, they have to be on paper. And why use a word processor when my notes are just +'s and -'s with short reasons and post #'s? Also, this is just a silly post coming from "I have a case built in notepad but don't want to show you" guy. That's even more suspect than my "I have notes, but I cba to go across town to get them" post. How did your mission go? | ||
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On September 07 2014 00:59 3d12 wrote: That's nice. At my job, they fire people who plug removable storage media into the computers and the firewall blocks google docs. So if I want to be able to access my notes at work, they have to be on paper. And why use a word processor when my notes are just +'s and -'s with short reasons and post #'s? Also, this is just a silly post coming from "I have a case built in notepad but don't want to show you" guy. That's even more suspect than my "I have notes, but I cba to go across town to get them" post. How did your mission go? Actually, that reminds me. I was going to test this yesterday when I posted my theory about batsnacks. ##unvote ##Vote: batsnacks ##unvote ##Vote: kitaman27 ##unvote ##Vote: Oatsmaster ##unvote ##Vote: Tehpoofter ##unvote ##Vote: Vivax ##unvote ##Vote: kushm4sta ##unvote ##Vote: ObiWanShinobi ##unvote ##Vote: mderg ##unvote ##Vote: 27ninjabunnies ##unvote ##Vote: Micchan ##unvote ##Vote: Damdred ##unvote ##Vote: The_Templar ##unvote ##Vote: 3d12 ##unvote If everything goes as planned, I will not be warned and bat will be lynched. If I receive a mod warning, I'm willing to read bat as null again, since my case was admittedly weak and based only on structural meta. | ||
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On September 07 2014 01:07 batsnacks wrote: So your firewall blocks google docs but it doesn't block tl.net... right... Every enterprise level web filter I have ever worked with blocks tl.net because it is "Gaming related content." Hey, you're just as baffled as I am. Reddit's not blocked either, only certain subreddits. Go figure. Probably a gamer on the IT staff. If it helps though, we deal with PII so info security is a huge thing. Google docs is blocked under "cloud storage and remote file transfer" | ||
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On September 07 2014 01:01 kushm4sta wrote: 3d OK we heard your real-life based defense. Can you talk about your reads now? You are voting me sitll why? I'm not voting you at the moment, I want to see how my test goes. Your response to my ultimatum was good, even though it seemed a bit contrived, so you're off my radar for the moment. Currently, I'd like to see batsnacks lynched unless my test comes back a failure. This guy had just done too many unexplainably weird things during D1 and D2 to escape notice. If he's trying to act town, he's doing a poor job of it. What I'm confused about regarding you, kush, is this post: On September 06 2014 08:39 kushm4sta wrote: mderg He keeps contradicting himself over and over again about it being dumb to talk about missions, then talking about the missions. Why? Easy shit for scum to talk about. The way he phrases this is really sketch. "His play didn't really look townie" And admitting that he's an easy target shows inherent guilt. Plus not a lot of content at all. And nothing that looks townie. And people don't get modkilled in this game right? ##vote mderg So far, nobody has mentioned mderg. In fact, everyone was kind of taking it for granted that he had afk'd his way out of the game. You're the only one with a reason to believe he's still playing. Why? Do you really think he's scummy or are you just looking to plynch him for afk? | ||
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On September 07 2014 01:12 batsnacks wrote: Tell me the name of the webfilter your company is using and I will consider unvoting you. It should say the name of the filter whenever you try to view a blocked page which, you have done before. It does, but I don't fucking remember. It's some blockpage.cgi on 10.10.1.200 or something like that. You really think I'd get drunk the night before I have to go to work? No, I don't have to walk into that place again until Monday, thank fuck. | ||
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On September 07 2014 01:20 kushm4sta wrote: i think his d1 was pretty scummy. and it doesn't help that he completely stopped playing. I'm sorry, so you do or do not think he is still playing? Because I'm not sure why you would try and raise a case against him if you think he's afk. Voting is mandatory. If he doesn't show up in 3 hours, he's modkilled anyway. I remember this was part of the reason I was suspicious of poofter on D1, although Micchan had actually made a few posts and could have been still active. | ||
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On September 07 2014 01:23 HaruRH wrote: Last warning, one more of this and you will be modkilled. Also, anyone trying to use mod warnings as a read is dumb since we warn both town and scum and will not hesitate to kill either. Even in lylo. Thank you for clarifying, Haru. Well bat, looks like you were just being a trolly asshole after all. Glad we figured that out. ##Vote: kushm4sta So, about this mderg wagon... | ||
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On September 07 2014 01:24 kushm4sta wrote: i was under the impression that modkills for not voting weren't happening until later? I really cant konw if he's still playing or not. Only he knows that. Actually, this is a good point, and we have a co-host present. Haru, could you tell us: If mderg does not vote by the deadline, will he be modkilled on the spot, or later on? | ||
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On September 07 2014 01:30 Vivax wrote: Also I don't see how you come to the conclusion that bats is in any way confirmed town through what happened just now. He can still be mafia, it's just that the hosts won't allow you to figure him out that way. Sorry, but what? I don't see that conclusion either, probably because it's not there. Why are you trying to put reads in my mouth? Trolly asshole != town. On September 07 2014 01:28 Vivax wrote: 3d12 what do you think of damdred, or my proposed solution to the game for that matter. Honestly, I haven't noticed much of damdred. I know he voted me about an hour ago, but as far as his posts go, they're like potato chips: a short burst of greasy flavor that leaves you wanting more. I like his read on kita, since it seems like he's paying attention to how the votes are flowing and reading into the motivations of kita's posting. It does seem like he's rather tunnel visioned on me though, but he could just be sheeping poofter to pressure me into giving answers. I do agree with your point about congruence surrounding the Micchan vote, though. It seems like he wanted it to seem like he was investigating and coming up with reasons for his choices, particularly between the two bolded portions below: On September 05 2014 11:48 Vivax wrote: What Damdred wrote here before and after doesn't seem evry congruent to me, he might be scum. These posts are just about twelve hours apart, and with no further posts from Micchan since. I understand that Damdred prefers to hold his vote to get more information, but since he is claiming he had multiple scum reads at the end of D1, I'm not sure why he sheeped so hard onto the Micchan wagon and then failed to provide any real reason for the evolution of his read. I understand that the "lurker scum" situation happened in a previous game, but player/forum meta means 0% to me as this is my first game here. If you think that's a valid reason to move from "not enough for a scum read currently" to a vote in ~12 hours, I'd like to hear why. Also, not sure what you mean by your "solution to the game," but did you see this post I made during N1? What do you think of this idea? On September 04 2014 13:36 3d12 wrote: <snip> An idea I had in the shower earlier would be to have each person pick someone who will decide their vote for them. That way, if mafia are forced to vote a certain way, anyone who disobeys the "town meta" will stick out. It's another shot in the dark, but since it's nighttime anyway, why not. It's been a while since the topic of missions was brought up. So far I see a few ways they could have affected the gameplay, as in my post to batsnacks, but nothing too solid. Any thoughts? | ||
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##unvote ##Vote: batsnacks | ||
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On September 07 2014 04:22 kitaman27 wrote: Damdred is the guy you should be yelling at for going dark. /agree I don't know what Vivax is on, you're one of the most active people so far. Do you have any read on Oats or Obi? | ||
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On September 07 2014 04:26 3d12 wrote: /agree I don't know what Vivax is on, you're one of the most active people so far. Do you have any read on Oats or Obi? EBWOP: Nevermind, he's back. Lol @ pulling over | ||
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On September 07 2014 04:34 HaruRH wrote: End of day: Night 2 ![[image loading]](http://www.deathbymovies.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Ethan_Hunt_Dangling_Cruise.jpg) Control Center: "Your mission is to steal the painting that is located conveniently close to the electric fence." batsnacks: "Okay" Tehpoofter: "Okay" batsnacks: "Wait wha-" BZZZT. batsnacks the Mission Rolecop has been lynched! Tehpoofter the Mission Mafia has failed his mission and have been electrocuted! mderg the Vanilla Town have been modkilled for inactivity! It is now nighttime. You may speak. New missions may go out via pms. On September 07 2014 04:28 Damdred wrote: I'm the cop checked kish he's green Confirmed liar. At least we learned a few things from this lynch. The most interesting to me being that the blue roles also have missions. That must be an issue of balancing the roles against the Mafia. Did not see that coming, though. If anything, I thought it was a good case from kita and the suspicious behavior from batsnacks did nothing to help his case. Tonight, I'm going back through poofter's filter. I was going to compose a response to his suspicious callout on me at the start of the day anyway, so this will be a good excuse to instead look for any scummy links in what he's posted. | ||
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Batsnacks flipped cop. Oats claimed a roleblock at the start of D2. That means bat most likely checked someone N1. He ended D1 with his vote on kitaman, then ended D2 with his vote on Damdred. Even though I still have a hunch that bat's mission for D2 was to switch his vote X number of times (5, if he only did the minimum) it's interesting to see where he left his vote at EoD. Has anyone gone back through bat's filter to see who he cop-checked? I don't remember him claiming blue at any point, but he should have left some evidence in his filter about who he checked based on how his case changes from D1 to D2, right? | ||
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On September 09 2014 00:20 kushm4sta wrote: OK I'm wrong about damdred not being fancy play scum. Kita I had a thought you might find interesting. Batsnacks was so sure you were scum and your mission was to vote with the majority. Oddly specific right? Well he had insider information about missions as the mission doctor. What if he was right about a scum mission? It makes sense that the hosts would give poofter the mission to vote with the majority, and that he would find it impossible given the circumstances. Also, just want to comment quick on this theory. 100% support. To be honest, we should comb back through bat's filter and look for anything he said about missions. It sucks that we immediately found his behavior suspicious, so he couldn't have clued us in to the "blues having missions" thing without seeming very red himself. But I assume bat would have wanted us to know that blues have missions too, otherwise it makes easy mislynch targets out of otherwise helpful blues. | ||
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##Vote: Damdred It's very strange you would claim cop and reveal your N1 check, but then not tell us the result of your N2 check... And how are you still alive anyway, if our doctor is dead? Too many contradictions and not enough votes, imo. | ||
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The only conclusive part of what I found is that batsnacks definitely didn't check mafia. His questioning and lack of decisiveness near the end of D2 tells me he was still trying to figure it out. Shame it couldn't have been that easy, if he'd just wagoned one person on D2 it would be an easy lynch target today. I've got a lot more work to finish up, but I scheduled my lunch around deadline, so I'll be back for some pre-conversation. In the meantime, I'd like to ask: kush, what do you think of Oats? Oats, what do you think of kush? Also kita, I skimmed your long post and plan to re-read it in more detail later, so forgive me if this is already answered in the post: What is your likelihood of a 27nb/kush/Damdred/poofter team? Personally, those are my reads, since 27nb and poofter buddied pretty closely at the start and without knowing whether or not poofter knew he was going to fail his mission, I have to assume he knew and left his vote on a scumbuddy to cast him in a good light. This also aligns with the fake claim from Damdred and kush's reluctance to lynch him for it, but that would mean the mafia is running a 2-protect-2 strategy, which is risky in itself. Without getting too far into WIFOM though, I think it's a safe assumption that poofter knew he would fail his mission. Whether or not the other mafia did, your guess is as good as mine. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 10 2014 03:03 Vivax wrote: 3d can you reply to damdeds point. Also you were one of the batsnacks lynchers yesterday when I proposed that same theory with exception of poofter not being included. I don't understand what you see in that line both of you keep quoting. I meant exactly what I said; Micchan was the lurkiest in the game at that point, but was not completely inactive. At the time, there was a good chance he was scum, trying to slip quietly past us into D2. But of course, hindsight seems to be blinding you to the fact that without any proper reads, the best decision was to lynch the most likely scummer. Besides, if I wasn't an idiot and had read the OP, I wouldn't have voted for Micchan anyway. Remember mderg? And I assume you're referring to this post? On September 06 2014 14:54 Vivax wrote: Alright, let's see. batsnacks - tentatively town Oatsmaster - town Tehpoofter - town Vivax - town ObiWanShinobi - town mderg - wanna say town but this guy doesn't play the game 3d12 - tentatively town kitaman27 - tentatively scum Damdred - scum kushm4sta - scum 27ninjabunnies - tentatively scum I have no idea how many scum there are in this game, but with the missions considered it could be easily more than 3 since they are at risk of getting "modkilled" every day, and the mission aspect makes the game harder for them. So I'll opt for 4. 7 town 4 scum If we ml we're at 5 town 4 scum, that'll be the last chance to kill one of them. Right now the consensus doesn't seem very huge and that's why we need to get our shit together and decide between these guys I mentioned above. If you're one of the guys I listed among the townies please tell me who you would agree on among the scummers and who you disagree on. If you're among the scummers, well, do whatever you have to do. I disagreed with you because our reads did not align. I had 27nb as town at the time and poof/oats as scum. Since then, I've re-evaluated the game and I believe you're probably more accurate than I initially gave you credit for. I'm about 98% sure that kush is mafia, and Damdred will hang today or I'll eat my hat. But as far as 27nb, maybe it's my bias from D1 still lingering, but I'm having trouble seeing her as mafia. Maybe a re-read will lend me more insight, but I probably won't have time before today's deadline. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 10 2014 04:30 sqrtofneg1 wrote: End of day 3! Damdred the Mafia Mission Roleblocker has been lynched. Night 3 will end in (19:30 GMT (+00:00)). New missions may go out soon. Ha, finally! Glad we got that one through, especially after he faked the worst roleclaim I've ever seen. GG no re. This lends some interesting insight, though. Specifically, why were Damdred and poofter voting differently at the end of D2? If kush is part of this scenario as mafia, it makes little sense why poofter would be voting him and Damdred not. Vivax, I still don't think we're seeing eye-to-eye at this point, so I want to ask you: Which target is better for tomorrow? 27nb or kush? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 10 2014 04:23 kitaman27 wrote: Well since there is no roleblocker I suppose there is no reason not to claim. I'm a Mission Vigilante and I had to make a post with at least 25000 characters (I think the Go Bills put me over the top). I would have tried for it earlier but I didn't have the top. I'll likely just shoot one of the 3 who never showed up today  If this is true, you are awesome. I love when vigi will save shots until N3 rather than shooting the scummiest-looking person N1. :highfive: I say fire at will. Your judgment seems pretty sound so far. Especially with Damdred dead now, your shot probably can't be blocked. Who are you thinking of targeting? I'd personally rather see 27nb flip, but you're the one with the gun. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
As for hot topics, the most recent topic is Damdred's lynch. This plays into kita's theory rather well; at least, scenarios 1 and 3. Let's start with that post. Which scenario do you find most likely? Also, kush and Oats, I'd still like to hear what each of you has to say about the other. Being my only two not-so-solid reads, I'd like to get clearer pieces from the both of you before I examine the whole puzzle again. Thoughts? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 10 2014 19:06 Oatsmaster wrote: kush is town, I said already, why arent you reading? I said like 2-3 times today man come on. To be honest, I was expecting a better response than "OMGUS RTFT LOL" from you, especially since you were ribbing kita for being so wishy-washy on D2. The reason I'm asking is not to find out your reads, that was the part you posted. I want to get an idea of why you feel that way. I do see the following posts about kush from D3: On September 09 2014 12:12 Oatsmaster wrote: woah sick reads bro. Is there the part where you explain nb is bussing me when we have people like damdred and 3d stil alive??? On September 09 2014 22:16 Oatsmaster wrote: It might not be this easy to catch scum. Check my recent games. All of them are this short. change of lifestyle man. OK so kush just went off lynching damdred and doesn't mention him as a possible lynch target. Just me and nb. Kush and damdred might actually be scum together On September 09 2014 22:18 Oatsmaster wrote: Boo misread. It's k, kush town. On September 10 2014 00:05 Oatsmaster wrote: lynch damdred. Its not that i dont trust kush. Its that I dont trust kush. <snip> On September 10 2014 00:50 Oatsmaster wrote: i did say I changed my mind. Im pretty sure kush is town now. I'd like to know why you think this though, especially so soon after coming out and saying you don't trust him. Is it this? On September 07 2014 11:22 Oatsmaster wrote: kush's flailing makes me think hes town. <snip> @kita: On September 11 2014 01:09 kitaman27 wrote: 3d, should I be giving Vivax a hard time for how day three ended or did he have good intentions? You absolutely should. Anyone who uses "double swag" unironically deserves a hard time in my book. No but for reals, what are you referring to? His grudge against the afk? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 11 2014 01:28 Oatsmaster wrote: Game is confusing. 3d has barely any conversational posts. Just heavily structured and thought about. It could be a playstation or he isn't comfortable without structure as scum. Inclined to think the latter reason just for the constant newbie claims. If you look at my posting window, most of my posting is done from work. I don't have much time to continually check the thread from here, so I usually try to put more meat into my posts to make up for it. Are you really scumreading me right now for my filter not containing enough fluff? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 11 2014 02:10 kitaman27 wrote: The fact that he wanted to lynch you instead of damdred, but he didn't have the votes. Is that scummy, a momentary lapse of judgement, or was he right? (Well I'm guessing you're not going to pick #3) Good guess! :D I dunno, I'm up in the air about Vivax now; which is weird because I just posted the other day about how I want to align more closely with him, since his reads were pretty accurate all game so far. Checking his filter, I see he did have reasons for switching his vote. The reasoning seems pretty weak/fishy though: On September 10 2014 03:48 Vivax wrote: His scumread on Poofter from D1 basically vanished, and so does he after short posting bursts. He leaves a lot of stuff adressed at him unanswered and I didn't like that. Plus it would be weird for me to be still alive after scumreading kush and Dam, if they were scum. ##Vote 3d12 I mean, for the entirety of D3 he was pushing for a Damdred/kush scum team, and then suddenly I'm in the limelight after a shitty two-line inference from a (now confirmed, previously suspected) scummer and a day-old NK? If anything, that part seems more like he's trying to sneak a doomed scum-buddy into D4 but then goes back to bussing him when he realizes there's too many afk players to make a vote swing. What do you make of it? Also, I think Vivax's reads are actually good. I re-read some of his filter last night, and I was confused on some of his D1 reads (namely, Templar being scum and the afk-vote on Micchan) but over D2 and D3 he's gotten more focused. The only fishy thing I've noticed about his voting is that Vivax has so far put a ton of weight on personal meta. It really makes me uncomfortable, although seeing Obi flip town after Vivax's flimsy-as-fuck meta defense of his play did reassure me a little. Do you think I'm overthinking it? | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
I didn't tell the rest of you, just the hosts, but I had some RL shit happen and I need to move in the next month. So between copious amounts of overtime and looking for a new apartment, I had no time to maintain the illusion of investigation. I'm glad GB was able to step in and make it work. I'm really glad to have played with you guys, though. Sorry I really fumbled this one, I think that's what threw everyone's reads off in the early game (so, mission accomplished?) was when I was all over the place and being generally very terrible at this game. I hope to play again in the near future though, once I have a new place and some free time. Also, batsnacks: do you still have your "kita notepad case"? I was interested in seeing it, but more interested in mislynching you at the time.  | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 17 2014 11:59 GlowingBear wrote: Never feel sorry and downgrade your play. I playing my 8th game and I'm still being called bad. I probably am. Oats is saying my arguments are bad. Funny thing: I never lost a game. Must be people carrying me. It's just ridiculous how people have to downgrade people's play. It's boring. I'm considering quitting mafia after the next game because bad manner is boring me. To be fair though, I do owe Poofter a personal apology for contributing to his death on D2. Although I will agree, that specific mission is horseshit. Also, just want to repost something from the mafia QT that you may or may not have noticed: If you take a look at the D2 vote count, if Oatsmaster had made a last-minute switch to Damdred instead, town might have killed all mafia at once. Damdred due to lynch, Poof and me to failed missions. Gotta give credit though, the hosts were trying to balance the missions somewhat, since my mission for D2 was basically the same as Poof's, except without the 1h limitation on vote change. So if Oats had changed his vote with no time for me to change mine... D2 gg triple-kill. Just some food for thought.  | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 17 2014 12:07 GlowingBear wrote: You don't suck. I remember playing with you and you almost won he newbie game. But it was against me XD This one you were killed night 1. I don't know mafia mission but if you're town and you say night one, it's that because you made a very good job and can blame good scum play or bad town play for losing. Just want to point out, mafia mission N1 was to kill a non-blue. So yeah, Templar, we killed you because you were guaranteed town. Take it as a compliment. | ||
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3d12
United States100 Posts
On September 18 2014 01:43 Damdred wrote: Town played a good game, their was also a time where the mission d1 was really ambigous and techincally 3d was going to be killed but mafia members argued succesfully that the mission was worded badly and he lived, so yea their were two times town should of had mafia probably Yeah, this was my favorite part, to be honest. Although let me clarify that the mission was not worded poorly, it was just open to ambiguous interpretation. It was a learning experience for all parties, and I'm glad the mods made the decision they did. Not just for my sake, but because it also would have been a boring game if my only post was my D1 reads post (which, btw, LOOOOOOOL ty guys for calling that out, it was scummy as fuck) and then I flipped. On September 18 2014 01:05 kitaman27 wrote: For example, that one time towards the end of the game, I gave 3d a leading question about your d3 actions, wondering if he would bite on a small detail that could be interpreted as scummy, while failing to acknowledge the content of the rest of your filter. I totally did this. Forum mafia is hard. | ||
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