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(Set-up strategy)
Before dying, marv had a scum read on me. This was his post about it, if you want to take a look:
+ Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 18:54 marvellosity wrote:I'm at my best friend's wedding today, so I'm leaving things in mderg's capable hands. He's probably going to make the final decision, not sure if/when I'll be able to check my phone. Few things I noted, mebbe they're useful or will be, maybe not. With slam/sqrt, check how easy the wagon is, I don't see any pushback for the lynch. I don't really get this weird martyring behaviour from a team of 2, you'd expect at least one of them to prop up the other. I don't know what that means. They're both unstable? Or it's a ploy? ?? I'm not used to Slam insulting the thread like this. That doesn't make me feel good. I'm tentatively ok with this lynch but with reservations I guess. Stratiform doesn't look quite so bad. Not sure about Palmar. Not gonna be around to judge him on today's play so meh. Poofter didn't bother playing. Many scumpoints. I've felt ok about bunnies, but Poofter dragging her down. Probably not lynch but I don't trust. Right now I like Haru/Glowing for mafia most. Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 14:29 GlowingBear wrote:
So, for what I read until now, I have three main targets I want to read more: ExO, Robik and Eden. I'll filter dive them tomorrow, as I didn't have energy enough even to read through 50 long pages.
I have a stronger hunch on sqrt/alakaslam, as a lot of people were saying here.
Why these guys? Because my way of scumhunting is going through passivity and too much friendly behavior. Going against people there were being quite and being friendly was my best bet on my first game and when I did that most of my readings got the right guys.
Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 15:29 GlowingBear wrote:
But I didn't said that... geez...
I had suspicions on you, which doesn't mean you're necessarily suspicious of overly friendly behavior or passivity... that's why I'll filter dive you, so I can get a better view of what gave me the feeling that you were suspicious.
My main scumhunting is attacking passivity/friendly behavior. It's not may only scumhunting method.
Throws in random names (Robik, ExO, Eden) and a couple of times states that he scumhunts through passivity and friendly behaviour. These 3 names don't make much (any?) sense in this context. Robik the most abrasive of them all, Eden has been active, ExO's argued his corner firmly enough. His description of what he's looking for -> these 3 names doesn't seem natural to me. He brings up Robik as suspicious again in a later post but again never explains why, again it is the opposite of what he's looking for in mafia. sqrt/Slam may have been passive to some extent maybe? They've been quite prickly too. There seems to be a whole bunch of other targets that conform to his self-professed view. Basically I find the 3 names he throws in, together with his self-styled description of scumhunting, together with how he introduced sqrt/slam as scummy after that, very suspicious indeed. My best bet for mafia right now.
This happened when votecount was clearly showing that Cabernet Sauvignon was going to be lynched (4 votes on alakaslam/sqrt1, with marv/mderg voting on me). Mafia could simply vote anyone and draw suspicions about anyone; lynch on slam would still happen.
Ok, so, what's an easy thing to do in that scenario? Draw suspicions on a team since before the lynch. Then, using kp to kill a team that draw wrong suspicions on a townie, trying to make everyone go against this townie guy. This isn't WIFOM, it's a very reasonable strategy.
If you check vote count, they have voted on us and then switched at the very end to Carbernet Sauvignon.
So, this is a preliminary thing. This alone means nothing. This is NOT what gave me a scumread on VendettaStrada. But I do think that, if they are mafia, they followed this strategy.
*********************************************
(on Slender's posts - main scumread)
Now this is my main point, why I actually feel Slender's being acting strange.
His first post was a push on me and haru
+ Show Spoiler + On July 12 2014 11:02 TheSlenderMan wrote:
Still nowhere near caught up but I want to
##vote: Unvote
##vote: Team WeDemandALawyer
Haru seems to have no incentive to Scumhunt, yet gives absurd Town-passes to Palmar (most noticeably) and later to Robik/ExO (when asked about the 'meh' comment). He/She also fumbled with his/her explanations (about the Glowinghand-defense) when pressured -- seems like a 'guilty conscience' that wasn't prepared to meet a sudden, hard-hitting question. (This bit, for instance: "Which was to watch out for the kenpachi argument because we felt it might be scum driven." Smells like trying to come up with a Pro-Town motive for something that has already been explained before in several posts -- why not say that commenting on the Kenpachi-argument was a plan devised together as Hydras when questions were first asked from Haru, instead of coming up with this motive only after it had drawn enough attention to be more than one Vote? Isn't this also a direct contradiction to saying earlier that Haru can't speak on Glowinghand's behalf?!)
I think his reasoning is quite OK this. He demands answers. I'm still not finding odd his misinterpretations of our posts.
Then, he posts this huge post, which I answered when I could (both posts on spoiler)
+ Show Spoiler + On July 12 2014 13:45 TheSlenderMan wrote:Take a look at Glowing's filter, as well. No indication there that he wanted to 'watch out for the kenpachi argument because [we] felt it might be scum driven.' In fact, the comment Glowing makes of the 'argument' is quite a polar opposite to this claim (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=19#380). He sits on the fence as well as one can, regarding that subject. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=25#499 Haru says here that they were excited to play but not excited to talk about the Kenpachi-rule for 10 pages. Indicates that they did talk something together. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#503 Haru says that he and Glow should definitely comment on the Kenpachi-discussion -- the only motive I can glean from this post for that is that it was a 'hot topic' in the Thread for a long while. He doesn't say that they should, for instance, try to find possible Scummioso initiative in the initiation of the 'argument'. (And in fact, Haru doesn't seem to ever look for Scum. Not even when Voting for rayn.) http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#510 Haru, again, reiterates that it was important for one of them to comment on the topic that took considerable amounts of threadspace. He says that they, as a Hydra, definitely wanted to talk ABOUT the Topic but nothing else. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#511 No Scumhunting prior to this post, then all of a sudden Palmar gets a FREE Town-pass for absolutely no reason at all. Alarm bells, they be a-ringin'! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#516 Here Haru says he cannot speak on Glow's behalf... http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=27#539 ...and here suddenly bringing the topic up was planned together. (' I can contribute by showing OUR collective intention. Which was to watch out for the kenpachi argument because we felt it might be scum driven.') Why not say that in the first place? And how does this alleged 'collective intention' show at all from the posts (by Glow) in question? Like, the whole notion about a 'collection intention' seems like an afterthought which actually doesn't fit either of their actions. Clearly they HAD discussed something regarding the on-thread discussion, but it doesn't seem like it was what Haru said in #539. Here's what Glow thought about the Kenpachi 'argument': Kenpachi rule doesn't sound as a winning plan to me. You may use it as a secondary argument but to get to the point you have a primary one there is so much game to be played. I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
Why do I think it's secondary: a scum can fake claim vt just so he can get townie to accuse him and get mislynched. More than that, a vt can simply try to pressure someone who claimed vt. Why not?Here's what Haru says they thought about the Ken-arg: OUR collective intention. Which was to watch out for the kenpachi argument because we felt it might be scum driven.I don't see this as consistent. On July 12 2014 15:19 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 14:41 TheSlenderMan wrote:
GlowingBear please filter my posts and comment on the case against you. I don't have many posts yet so the relevant posts are easy to find. Alright. --Your first case: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 11:02 TheSlenderMan wrote:
Still nowhere near caught up but I want to
##vote: Unvote
##vote: Team WeDemandALawyer
Haru seems to have no incentive to Scumhunt, yet gives absurd Town-passes to Palmar (most noticeably) and later to Robik/ExO (when asked about the 'meh' comment). He/She also fumbled with his/her explanations (about the Glowinghand-defense) when pressured -- seems like a 'guilty conscience' that wasn't prepared to meet a sudden, hard-hitting question. (This bit, for instance: "Which was to watch out for the kenpachi argument because we felt it might be scum driven." Smells like trying to come up with a Pro-Town motive for something that has already been explained before in several posts -- why not say that commenting on the Kenpachi-argument was a plan devised together as Hydras when questions were first asked from Haru, instead of coming up with this motive only after it had drawn enough attention to be more than one Vote? Isn't this also a direct contradiction to saying earlier that Haru can't speak on Glowinghand's behalf?!) When did I turn into a hand? lol Kenpachi-argument wasn't a plan devised together as Hydras. I've used the QT to get his opinion about this policy. It was the same as mine. I decided to post about it because I think it was turning into a main point when it should be a secondary argument, and accessory argument. Saying it could be scum driven is not necessarily saying it was certainly scum driven. It was my way of saying that "watch out, you are getting something as certain while it is not, so keep it as a secondary argument and let's focus on a primary one". Haru can't speak on my behalf. We are a team but we don't share the same account nor the same ideas. I have suspicions on Robik. He said he likes Robik. We have different views while inside the same team, and I don't get why it is not natural. Ok, now on your bigger case: --Your second case: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 13:45 TheSlenderMan wrote:(1)Take a look at Glowing's filter, as well. No indication there that he wanted to 'watch out for the kenpachi argument because [we] felt it might be scum driven.' In fact, the comment Glowing makes of the 'argument' is quite a polar opposite to this claim (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=19#380). He sits on the fence as well as one can, regarding that subject. (2)http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=25#499 Haru says here that they were excited to play but not excited to talk about the Kenpachi-rule for 10 pages. Indicates that they did talk something together. (3)http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#503 Haru says that he and Glow should definitely comment on the Kenpachi-discussion -- the only motive I can glean from this post for that is that it was a 'hot topic' in the Thread for a long while. He doesn't say that they should, for instance, try to find possible Scummioso initiative in the initiation of the 'argument'. (And in fact, Haru doesn't seem to ever look for Scum. Not even when Voting for rayn.) (4)http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#510 Haru, again, reiterates that it was important for one of them to comment on the topic that took considerable amounts of threadspace. He says that they, as a Hydra, definitely wanted to talk ABOUT the Topic but nothing else. (5)http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#511 No Scumhunting prior to this post, then all of a sudden Palmar gets a FREE Town-pass for absolutely no reason at all. Alarm bells, they be a-ringin'! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=26#516 Here Haru says he cannot speak on Glow's behalf... (6)http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/461355-team-melee-mini-mafia-v-newbies-and-vets?page=27#539 ...and here suddenly bringing the topic up was planned together. (' I can contribute by showing OUR collective intention. Which was to watch out for the kenpachi argument because we felt it might be scum driven.') Why not say that in the first place? And how does this alleged 'collective intention' show at all from the posts (by Glow) in question? Like, the whole notion about a 'collection intention' seems like an afterthought which actually doesn't fit either of their actions. Clearly they HAD discussed something regarding the on-thread discussion, but it doesn't seem like it was what Haru said in #539. Here's what Glow thought about the Kenpachi 'argument': Kenpachi rule doesn't sound as a winning plan to me. You may use it as a secondary argument but to get to the point you have a primary one there is so much game to be played. I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
Why do I think it's secondary: a scum can fake claim vt just so he can get townie to accuse him and get mislynched. More than that, a vt can simply try to pressure someone who claimed vt. Why not?Here's what Haru says they thought about the Ken-arg: OUR collective intention. Which was to watch out for the kenpachi argument because we felt it might be scum driven.I don't see this as consistent. (1) Answered above (2) It indicates we did talk and got the same opinion that it would be harmful to town to extend discussion regarding kenpachi policy at the time (3) As I said, in his posts he is never implying that the usage of kenpachi rule should be analyzed as possible scum maneuver. What he said is that it could be scum driven. And it could. But it's not a safe ground to walk on. So, why wasting breath on that policy? (4) Hmm, I guess you're getting the wrong interpretation of what he meant? I'll quote his post: + Show Spoiler +On July 11 2014 21:46 HaruRH wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 21:43 Palmar wrote:On July 11 2014 21:39 HaruRH wrote:On July 11 2014 21:34 marvellosity wrote:On July 11 2014 21:28 Palmar wrote:Actually, I'm going to do this: ##Unvote
##Vote Team WeDemandALawyer3. This post On July 11 2014 12:38 GlowingBear wrote:
Kenpachi rule doesn't sound as a winning plan to me. You may use it as a secondary argument but to get to the point you have a primary one there is so much game to be played. I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
Why do I think it's secondary: a scum can fake claim vt just so he can get townie to accuse him and get mislynched. More than that, a vt can simply try to pressure someone who claimed vt. Why not?
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and Glowingbear Talking about stuff that is really easy to talk about without giving any sort of an opinion on anyone in the game. I think it was sinani who pointed out that this post also came at a really awkward time, after people had mostly dropped the kenpachi thing. Yeah I don't mind this. I noted this too, and that I wasn't sure I believed the phone = behind excuse. Was also confused when bunnies said she liked this post, although I guess that was just because it was taking her side. - M&M I don't get what you mean If either me or glowingbear, who came in just a few pages after the kenpachi rule fiasco (that was 10+ pages long), we should definitely be saying something about it. Awkward time or not, we have to talk about it. That's it. You don't have to believe the phone=behind excuse at all. After all, being behind or ahead will not change our answer. -WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear That's completely incorrect and I'd actually shoot you guys right now if a) I had a gun, and b) you guys were the same person. Because this idea that you have to talk about it, is super inconsistent with glowingbear's opinion that: On July 11 2014 12:38 GlowingBear wrote:
I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
So why is he wasting his breath? So I guess here is where the problem lies I am not the same person as glowingbear and even though we are the same entity now, we are just a conjoined twin. My stance is that if glowingbear did not talk about the kenpachi rule thing, I would have talked about it. He never said he should talk about the topic and nothing else. This is you putting words in his mouth, dude. He said that, if I had not said anything about the poor usage of kenpachi rule, he would say. That's all. (5) In the context, he doesn't like what Palmar said. So that's why he considered OMGUSing. But he didn't want to OMGUS because it was early. Moreover, Haru played with Palmar before and probably has a good view of his meta, so why OMGUSing if he could have a hunch? (6) It's a team game. Again, I have a suspicion on Robik. Haru likes him. We are two heads in the same team, we think differently. However, sometimes, we have the same opinion, as for the kenpachi policy. He thought that, as a team mate who knows my alignment, he should defend be against attackers because (i) he knew my opinion on that, which was the same as his and (ii) when I'm attacked, he is also attacked because we are a team. I tried to answer it properly, but I am really tired. 3am here. Also, as even Haru said, we are a team but we are not the same person. He could answer you better because you've brought much more Haru's posts than mine. TBH, I don't really understand why you find these posts scummy lol
So, questions answered. Let's move on?
NOPE!
He insists asking things that were already answered. Wants haru to give his word about it and moreover, still twists my answer by saying this:
+ Show Spoiler +On July 14 2014 10:04 TheSlenderMan wrote:@Haru/GlowingBear – so you're both saying that you had agreed to talk about the Kenpachi-argument in-thread but didn't have any concrete plan to, for instance, catch Scum by doing it. What exactly was the reason you wanted to bring up the Kenpachi-argument, then? @Haru@ExO – Why did you not like the Slamroot-Lynch yesterday? @Koshi I'd STILL like you to elaborate on your Strat- and ExO-reads? @Everyone – is Haru's claim that Robik has intentionally 'broken' his meta correct IYO (so that he always can 'confirm' himself as Town) or was VisceraEyes correct when he told me (in an earlier Round) that Robik plays weird tricks like this regardless of his affiliation? @Everyone – no comments on this? Show nested quote +In retrospect ExO's filter is somewhat weird, though: #605 is him finding suspicious stuff about EVERYONE which seems like "shitflinging" (to quote someone earlier in this Thread). One of the null-reads he ends up with is the Team he has been most vocal about analyzing earlier on, aka bunnies/poofter. Hmmmm actually, #1091 is also weird -- namely because I realize that ExO never commented on sqrt (after sqrt started posting, that is) and he's only considering the Lynch in light of Slam's antics... IMO, sqrt's contradictions were definitely the more damning point of the case, so I find it interesting that ExO would only give the Slam-spam as reasoning for considering the Lynch. Especially since he says that he has caught up with the Thread. Annnnd #1091 DOES reek a lil like distancing-oneself-from-a-Mislynch-to-appear-better. All-in-all, ExO seems to end up surprisingly often sitting on the fence about the topics he discusses. (The above should also answer you, Robik. You two are a slot so ofc I want to hear about your meta when ExO's pinging me.)
Really? Kenpachi again? We never brought that up, I just posted that we should move to another topic. Yet he still says that we've brought up. It seems that he is so hardly trying to talk about kenpachi rule again. If so, he should post it. Not trying to convince everybody of something we did not do, which is bringing that thing up.
To me, it seems he is so desperately trying to have an argument to call me scum - leading into a mislynch - that he is picking anything, even little things, and insisting on it. He is even using marv's suspicious to support his hard push, which makes sense with the set-up strategy I've brought. He says "I don't see anything wrong with marv's Glow/Haru -points when he expressed his suspicion".
Then his partner also starts a hard push on me. His reasoning was that I was overexplaining things with no basis. Really? Bringing quotations to support a theory = overexplaining?
And if I really was overexplaining like he said, why would that be so scum that he thought a hard push on me would be a winning plan?
To me, it just seems that they are after me because nightkilled people had a hunch on me, making things easier to mafia to force a mislynch on us. They misinterpret posts and scumreads us based on small things or putting words in our mouths.
"tl;dr, you're OMGUSing" - no, I'm not. Koshi had a scumread on me and I can understand his reasoning. But these guys reasoning... nope. I can't.
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ugh fuck it let's lynch poofybunnies
bear is trying way too fucking hard to make cases to be scum
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On July 15 2014 11:07 Eden1892 wrote:
ugh fuck it let's lynch poofybunnies
bear is trying way too fucking hard to make cases to be scum
I don't have font big enough to say
+ Show Spoiler +
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On July 13 2014 09:28 Eden1892 wrote:
Robik shut up
I could be okay lynching bunnies
Robik I don't wanna hear it
Tomorrow for sure but I buy it now
Robik I said shut up I don't wanna hear it
Bunnies ovrrxn weird
Yes Robik you were right are you happy
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but really tho this bear dude is not playing a mafia game
mafia take the path of least resistance or at least try to
this dude is barreling into the path of greatest resistance like a steamroller powered on orphans' tears
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robik take the wheel on bunnies im a flaky bitch and am likely to townread her and then scumread her two more times before the day ends
dont let me wander off the True Path
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On July 15 2014 11:16 Eden1892 wrote:but really tho this bear dude is not playing a mafia game mafia take the path of least resistance or at least try to this dude is barreling into the path of greatest resistance like a steamroller powered on orphans' tears
That's not even my final form!
I like the orphan tears part
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I'm back and I'm pissed that people are bullying my bear. Give me 30 min to finish up my league game and ill crush your silly reads on us (IM LOOKING AT YOUR SHIT READ KOSHI)
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god can we exile this dude to 2+2
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On July 15 2014 06:20 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2014 06:16 27ninjabunnies wrote:On July 15 2014 06:13 OnceKing wrote:
Robik Eden and I are LOUISIANA VOLTRON MASONS so we are one and the same
In any case it's not as if I didn't make a case on him as well so idk where you're getting off
Stand yes I found bunnies reasons for pulling off the wagon sketch and not very strong so I am more suspicious of her slot than I was day 1 Robik isn't even from Louisiana. Bunnies has been around this whole time and this is the post she gets offended about and comments on. This confirms to me that when Bunnies/Poofter flip mafia, NEVER EVER EVER lynch OK.
remember world cup mafia when you fucked up and almost lost the game for town.... repeat incoming! Maybe you will stop thinking you're good after this game 
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On July 15 2014 06:26 OnceKing wrote:
Robik or bunnies please show me how nk analysis indicates raynman are guilty
Answering for bunnies but because they have more respect for people that are veterans that might be able to peg and get him lynched based on old meta. With them gone it makes it easy for him to lead town... although based upon play today I lean more town on rayn cause he actually showed up.
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Kay I'm off of work. Longest day ever.
Anyone willing to give me a body massage?
On another note, I'm not answering anything until I can reread the last tenish pages to answer any questions brought up to me.
Hopefully by then, I can change your mind on me and poofter, because ya'll are wrong.
If you want to know anything specific, just @ me. Thanks.
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Alright, it's time to kill some haters and raep some scum
Case #1:
On July 15 2014 08:55 raynpelikoneet wrote:
i still think we should lynch haru/gb because of what's been said on D1. All of our team's filter is full of the case on them and i can't understand why noone has commented on any of it. My posts are hard to understand, i know, but Slendy's are not. Go read them with a bit of time please.
Also their defence (and pretty much all of their posts) consists of multiple omguses and "this thing happened 50 pages ago, just let go" (while never they did comment on the actual accusation in the first place while asked to do so multiple times).
Let me answer this for you:
+ Show Spoiler +On July 15 2014 03:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:pg31-40:sqrtofneg calls my posts townie. My posts have only commented on who i think is town or mafia. Doesn't contribute towards the reads in any way. If he thinks my cases are good why not vote? Why not pressure those people into talking more? marv and robik have a dumb fight. robik flip-flops on his reads. feels like he is running like a headless chicken and idk what to think of it. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 01:24 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Haru is definitely strange. He is not acting like in previous games. I don't like him. His partner, Glowingbear, however, I do like. This: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 00:19 GlowingBear wrote:On July 11 2014 21:28 Palmar wrote:Actually, I'm going to do this: ##Unvote
##Vote Team WeDemandALawyerThe reasons: 1. They both seemed excited to play pre-game, but haven't posted anything of value. 2. This post On July 11 2014 11:47 GlowingBear wrote:
/confirm
Hello guys, it's my second game here.
It seems that there is a ruckus going on already. Can someone explain me what Is the Kenpachi rule?
Also, I'll be signing every post of mine with a bolded "-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear" so it gets easier to identify the team.
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear Specifically the bolded sentence feels like massively useless fluff observation. 3. This post On July 11 2014 12:38 GlowingBear wrote:
Kenpachi rule doesn't sound as a winning plan to me. You may use it as a secondary argument but to get to the point you have a primary one there is so much game to be played. I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
Why do I think it's secondary: a scum can fake claim vt just so he can get townie to accuse him and get mislynched. More than that, a vt can simply try to pressure someone who claimed vt. Why not?
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and Glowingbear Talking about stuff that is really easy to talk about without giving any sort of an opinion on anyone in the game. I think it was sinani who pointed out that this post also came at a really awkward time, after people had mostly dropped the kenpachi thing. 3. This post On July 11 2014 19:59 HaruRH wrote:
/confirm
Robik is going to be afk? But exo is a d1 non-poster too...
Meh
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear
I like the summary of his opinion on the issue. "Meh". 1) Being excited =\= spamming. More than that, I wasn't posting anymore because I was sleeping. Different time zones hooray. I'm excited and I'm reading through everything but if you think not giving a opinion on someone is scummy, I'll say that giving free useless opinions on everyone is scummy. As I didn't know at the time what the Kenpachi rule was and as I said we needed more game to have a primary argument, I think it's pretty reasonable to just point out useless effort and wait to have more food to make a case, probably around midday. 2)Pointint out that I didn't know exactly what was happening because I didn't know the meaning of Kenpachi rule. How can I understand a fight if I can not understand the language? I think the team name bolding is very good so we can give a better analysis while diving through the topic. 3) See point 1. Also, I don't think it was unnecessary post as we were wasting breath on a useless subject by the moment, and I find scummy people who just spam things about useless objects, so town loses time and focus. It has already stopped, well, yes, but to the point you would say that I pratically necrobumped it? Check the post times or the distance between my post and the last "Kenpachi rule" post. It's less than a page. More: why would I bring the discussion back just to say "let's not discuss this"? If it was a misleading topic and I were scum, shouldn't I just keep the topic going on saying something like "oh we have to use this policy because of X"? Is a good post. Decent logic here. Overall, I'm on the fence with these guys. Haru, a question for you. Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 00:34 HaruRH wrote:On July 12 2014 00:32 IAmRobik wrote:On July 12 2014 00:28 OnceKing wrote:On July 11 2014 14:31 OnceKing wrote:On July 11 2014 12:38 Stratiform wrote:On July 11 2014 12:28 27ninjabunnies wrote:
Stratiform, I've never seen you before or played with you before.
Do you play here on TL often?
How familiar are you with the game mafia?
What is your take on the game so far? I've never played on TL, only irl and some facebook based games. I'm familiar with how mafia works. As for the game so far, I don't really see any information to cast more than suspicion on anyone. Fun question What merits casting more than suspicion then And who is your suspicion cast upon So I go to sleep and I wake up and this question still isn't answered... Stratiform pls -- Robik can you tell me what bunnies/poof have done that's scummy other than "they disagree with each other"? Alternately can you explain why disagreeing with your teammate is alignment indicative? I don't know. The only thing that really bothers me strongly is that they have differing reads based off of my previous experience with playing as a hydra and the two heads expressing differing reads -- it also happened in my first game with rayn and mocsta expressing different reads. So both hydras that I've played with that were mafia had different reads. The one hydra that I played with that had the same reads (mattisfoolish) had the same reads. it also MINORLY bothers me that bunnies is trying to push scum on me because I'm town, so that's pushing an anti-town agenda I was waiting for you to say that robik Top town Why were you waiting for robik to say this? ![[image loading]](http://www.banfiwines.com/wp-content/uploads/cabernet-sauvignon-670x390.jpg) Now this logic does not make sense to me. How can my case be good and Glowingbear's answer to Palmar be good? That's impossible because my case / reasons for my vote were pretty much the same as Palmar's. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 01:32 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:30 marvellosity wrote:On July 12 2014 01:27 IAmRobik wrote:On July 12 2014 01:27 marvellosity wrote:On July 12 2014 01:01 sqrtofneg1 wrote:On July 11 2014 19:33 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 19:30 mderg wrote:On July 11 2014 19:26 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 18:50 marvellosity wrote:
I think I'm going to ignore Eden, dunno if he posts like a stupid kid for a particular reason, but it makes him look like a stupid kid and it's annoying to read his posts with terrible english. why would you ignore a confirmed townie? very sketchy play imo The last time I remember someone saying that he was confirmed townie he was actually scum. the last time I had a grilled cheese sandwich for dinner I got laid by a hot Russian chick later that night Eden is town. Last time I played with Eden, he was mafia, and he wasn't joking around like this. He came down hard on people. I just checked this because I was interested, you're doing meta bad. Eden came out really quickly on someone in his towngame as well. - M&M Yeah, he went pretty HAM against me in his first newbie game. I had to n1 him. Bastard. Right. So in short sqrt is giving a townread based on false meta. This is bad. Don't think it makes sqrt mafia really, just that it's wrong. sqrt is irking me anyway. He's somewhere at the top of my to lynch list. But I gotta say, I agree with my town!buddy ExO...plammar looking shittier and shittier. sorry, i mean scummier and scummer ^_^ I don't understand why? This doesn't make any sense to me. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 01:42 GlowingBear wrote:
Or put the grapes on spoiler :p
Ok I think we have enough posts to make a case. When I get home, I'll reach my computer and do what I do best: filter diving. Then I'm going to bring cases. Expect a big post in around 4 hours since now.
Before I go, I must also say that focusing "townhunting" is worse than "scum hunting" in my opinion, because it gets easier to a scum to blend in your town circle and doesn't help to do a good lynch on day1, as you are going to choose who to lynch based on someone you just don't have a strong town read instead of lynching someone you have a strong scumread. Still no answer to my questions and some basic fluff that says nothing... Palmar is not mafia. (pg37) Robik's teammate explain this please: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 02:19 IAmRobik wrote:
My teammate is watching TI instead of playing the game. I try to push him to do more, but I don't think he can get over the hump of "fuck day 1" This is fucking stupid. Just plain out stupid. For the record i have posted nearly as much as ExO_ and i was genuinely unable to access internet for over two days... If you don't know what to do on D1 then the best thing is TO PLAY THE DAY 1 AND LEARN!!! + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 02:37 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
Okay, back, and I now that I think of it, rayn is suspicious. He sees something in my words that are flatly contradictory, calls me out on it, but doesn't push a lynch on me? That makes no sense. trololol srsly? pg41-50:+ Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 03:52 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 03:10 raynpelikoneet wrote:
marv i'll read Palmar when the game goes on and so will you.
If he is scum we lynch him, if he is not we'll figure it out. Right now his vote is on a good place. lol. I beg to differ D: On July 12 2014 03:55 IAmRobik wrote:
Why would Rayn say that vote is in a good place, if he himself was not voting for Team FakeClaim?
I really don't want to reevaluate Rayn. I feel like whenever I switch my read on Rayn, I end up reverted to the first read anyway which was the proper one to begin with. I actually thought Palmar was voting for Haru/GB. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 04:12 goodkarma wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 04:02 sqrtofneg1 wrote:On July 12 2014 03:57 goodkarma wrote:On July 12 2014 01:39 sqrtofneg1 wrote:On July 11 2014 21:13 sinani206 wrote:
hey palmar.
what do you think of robik. Why does sinani call out palmar in particular? Why hasn't he done anything yet? OK is better, but not by much. He also asks others of what they think of robik too. On July 11 2014 14:57 OnceKing wrote:
So based on what he's said thus far what think you of robik I'm not sure what to make of this team. I wouldn't mind lynching them.*insert grape picture here* Care to elaborate a bit on this? Asking questions and determining others' stances/reads is part of the game. And they have shared reads of their own. You say you wouldn't mind lynching them, yet you say you don't have much of a read on their alignment. I don't. But I wouldn't mind lynching them, because at that time, sinani had done practically nothing, and OK wasn't doing much either. Sinani's question struck me as strange. And I noticed that they both asked about robik. So it would have been a lurker lynch then? They've had reads and stuff at this point. Has your stance changed? And what does robik have to do with this? You assuming that they'd be scum railing against a townie robik? You haven't indicated you have any kind of townie read on robik. This is your last stance on him from your filter: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:16 sqrtofneg1 wrote:On July 12 2014 00:57 IAmRobik wrote:TOWNIEST POST IN THE MOTHA FUCKIN THREAD. THIS GUY IS SO FUCKING BRUTALLY TOWN. IF ANYONE VOTES TO LYNCH HIM, YOU WILL FACE MY WRATH On July 12 2014 00:54 ExO_ wrote:Some thoughts: Team D-I tend to have weird hours that I can be on, and I'm not just reading the TL forums 24/7, so while I can't always be as active as robik saying I'm not doing anything now isn't really giving me a fair shake in my opinion (@27ninjabunnies). Every game I've seen 27nb in she goes around being very caustic and arrogant towards some people, and very nice to others. It seems to be regardless of her alignment. I find it to be unhelpful, as she goes off on tangents with wild accusations filled with bullshit reasoning for scum reads. What this means in terms of the game is it's hard for me to read her as mafia or town. But I think she does more to cause problems in a town, than actually help with finding scum and uniting the town players. Poofter isn't saying much and is kinda letting her get out in front. I don't know how to interpret that, but in World Cup poofter stayed kinda quiet until it came time to push me in the wrong directions. Nearly worked too  . So a null read on the team but I generally think constantly creating a toxic atmosphere for the town is a bad thing even if they are town. Team WhineSlam is posting a fuck ton of 1 liners/pictures/general nonsense (hijole?) and sqrtofneg1 is saying nothing at all. In larger games I think mafia lurking works better than in a smaller game such as this, but it's almost nothing to read off of. Will have to wait to see what they vote day 1 and what happens night 1 to really know what to think of them. Team VendettaStradaI'm not sure if they're both posting from the same account, but it looks like it's all raynpelioneet. In my limited experience here I haven't seen him before, and though he hasn't posted a fuck ton of stuff, seems townish it to me. Looks like he's contributing. Team needs a lawyerI always kinda read HaruRH scummy, he has a little bit of omgus going on, but I miss read him in world cup so it gives me pause. So I look over at glowing bear, and he hasn't said a whole lot either. Just got caught up in the Kenpachi business. But doesn't really read town to me. I lean scum here, but I'm hesitant. Team Magic CarpetNot a lot of posts from straightform just asking questions "Robik why won't u post?, Why would exo/robik not posting Day 1 not be bad for town" etc... Palmar calls out team lawyer for not posting anything of value, but I see very little of value from him at all. After reading his filter i think Palmar is the most scummy looking person so far in the thread. *scum read* Team GoodCornBadCornCompletely afk. Like 1 combined other than their /in posts. like what....? Do they not know the game is happening? No reads yet for obvious reasons Team Crotch RocketNot a lot being said from good Karma. Eden is posting quite a bit, and seems okay. I don't think mafia are going to be quite as active as eden is being, but it could be good coaching happening. Town read for now though Team Fraud walRusSinani saying hardly anything, OnceKing's vote on our team I think is bad: it's based on robik not playing the game, when robik has been pretty active. Hasn't really expanded on any reads and got pretty caught up in ol' kenpachi but I don't get a scum vibe from him. Null read Team M squaredmderg hasn't said too much, but I've generally liked and agreed with what marv has to say. I think Town So that leaves me with Town M squared Vendetta Strata (aka how can I make a parody of that team name) Rocket Crotch Null D- Whine* Goodcornbadcorn* Fraud walRus Scum Lawyer Magic Carpet *Mostly afk Unfortunately, I think I shall cast some doubt on this post. Some of these town reads are kind of fishy. Ex:
Not a lot being said from good Karma. Eden is posting quite a bit, and seems okay. I don't think mafia are going to be quite as active as eden is being, but it could be good coaching happening. Town read for now though
Not my cup of tea. Or this one
I'm not sure if they're both posting from the same account, but it looks like it's all raynpelioneet. In my limited experience here I haven't seen him before, and though he hasn't posted a fuck ton of stuff, seems townish it to me. Looks like he's contributing.
I'm not so sure he's town. But the post is definitely the best post so far. But some of these reads seem fabricated. + Show Spoiler + I like this post very much. Shows some actual reading & thinking and not just mindless shit like most of the last 10 pages were. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 06:10 Chairman Ray wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 05:50 Stratiform wrote:Well I have some stuff to say about the game at least. I feel like rayn is town, and I don't think haru is necessarily mafia. On July 11 2014 22:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
##vote: WeDemandALawyer I don't really think that in this situation voting without reasoning up front is reason to call someone scum. At this point in this game, I don't think mafia would sheep a vote without explanation, and then publicly declare it in the thread. I just don't see the logic from a mafia perspective. Haru is null because all he did was defend his teammate to the best of his ability, which you would want to do for either alignment. Also, although ExO has acted differently in other games, his massive post shows that he is putting a lot of effort into his reads. While I may not agree with all of them, I think it is a sign of town. Robik, while acting strange, isn't necessarily acting scummy. You dabbed through a few people's filters and posted the first thing that came to mind. ##vote: Team Magic Computer Haha this is exactly how i felt when i read the post above. Good CR good! Chairman Ray is town or he has learnt how to play as mafia. Most likely town. HI KOSHI!!!! NOW WE CAN BE WILL SMITH AND KOSHI AGAIN? Eden pushes sqrt. Good. Hoepfully he actually pushes it further later on. Slam not happy. Sad Slam is scum!Slam. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 07:33 Chairman Ray wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 06:36 Stratiform wrote:On July 12 2014 06:24 Chairman Ray wrote:On July 12 2014 06:14 Stratiform wrote:
Not really. I posted my thoughts, not the very first thing that came to mind.
And also, that's a great second post, CR. Do you have anything else to say about the game so far? Ok, so those are your thoughts on the game Firstly, you gave a townread on rayn for sheeping a vote without giving reasoning. Why didn't you give the same read to the other people that did the same thing, like OnceKing? Is OnceKing not worth pocketing? Your null read on Haru. You basically said Haru did X, which isn't alignment indicative. Why did you feel the need to post it? You townread ExO for making a long post. Pretty weak reason to townread someone, especially since you disagree with his post. And since you disagree with his post, why haven't you even posted why you disagree with it? Your last read says that Robik isn't necessarily scummy. Again, what's the point of this? I disagree particularly with ExO's read on my team. I included Robik to show that I think both members of their team are town. I don't see OnceKing voting for team WeDemandALawyer in the voting thread. In fact, I only see Palmar and Rayn, so I mentioned Rayn. I mentioned Haru because there was sort of a back and forth between rayn and haru. Tbh I initially put him in there because I townread him but then I realized I didn't really have enough info to confirm it. I understand that you disagree with ExO's case. Given that he made a scumread on you, you have to disagree with it. However you didn't interact at all with the reasons he scumread you. You just called him town for doing it. You also called his partner town, and didn't give any real reason. For lesser experienced players, when someone scumreads them, a town will usually omgus with "if he thinks I'm mafia, then he has to be mafia", while scum will usually pocket the person that scumread them. You produced the most clean-cut pocketing that I have ever seen. Your townread on rayn still doesn't sit right with me. I'll drop the reasoning that you didn't townread OnceKing for the same thing. However the reasoning you have for townreading rayn is the most detailed and specific case you have posted by far, and you did it to give a townread on someone who isn't even getting lynched. That's scummy.Your Haru thing doesn't strike much confidence either. If you had a townread on him before you had any evidence, that means you tried to read him under the mentality that he is town. That points directly to you being scum. You mentioned earlier that you have scumhunting tactics. So far it's managed to find a lot of town. Also with your re-entrance post here really sounding like you are paranoid about your own image. We should totes lynch Stratiform today. I'd also be up for lynching sqrt, that guy's totes scummy as well. Chairman Ray could you explain the bolded part and how is that scummy? + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 10:40 27ninjabunnies wrote:
Also, mafia team
Koshi/CR
Salm/Sqrt?
Maybe exchange them for Palmer/Strat I have no fucking idea what this post is about. Except that it's terrible. Eden cannot be mafia except with Haru/GB team. pg 51-60: On July 12 2014 14:29 GlowingBear wrote:Ok, I've read enough. I really can't read more right now, I tried to analyze every single page and it seems my head can't absorb that much information. I started to write a summary on what was going on but I've got no more energy to do. It's incomplete, but I will leave it here in case someone finds it useful: Half-ass summary: + Show Spoiler +
A) Game started with Eden claiming VT. Tehpoofter questioned it (indirectly btw). Got a wagon on him because of Kenpachi Rule policy. Bunnies and Eden started a discussion about the kenpachi rule and about Bunnies writing nonsense.
B) Robik posted about getting on the backseat while ExO would take the main point of his team. Got wagoned when Eden decided that this and Robik's vt claim was suspicious.
C) Rayn accused Eden's and tehpoofter's posts of being the worst of the thread. It can be viewed at page 22 as quoted by Ede. This is the game while on page 22.
D) marv/mderg starts posting at page 23 right after Exo express his will to hear about them.
E) Eden is questioned by marv and palmer for his vt claim. Eden insists in his vt claim. This is around page 24.
F) Palmar scumreads my posts because he thinks it was filled with fluff and unhelpful, then voted on me and Haru. Page 26.
G) Rayn decides to vote on me and Haru assuming that Haru was writing useless stuff when defending Palmar's push on me. 26-27
H) Robik posted and people got on him again, inquiring about his back seat attitude and his vt claim.
I) 32 - 36: sqrt starts giving reads on everybody, mostly null or town reads, except for Palmar because... he didn't confirm? o.O. People start to pressure him.
So, for what I read until now, I have three main targets I want to read more: ExO, Robik and Eden. I'll filter dive them tomorrow, as I didn't have energy enough even to read through 50 long pages. I have a stronger hunch on sqrt/alakaslam, as a lot of people were saying here. Why these guys? Because my way of scumhunting is going through passivity and too much friendly behavior. Going against people there were being quite and being friendly was my best bet on my first game and when I did that most of my readings got the right guys. I see this signals on sqrt's posts, mostly. Check out these quotes: sqrt's friendly quotes: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 00:52 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 11:47 GlowingBear wrote:/confirm Hello guys, it's my second game here. It seems that there is a ruckus going on already. Can someone explain me what Is the Kenpachi rule? Also, I'll be signing every post of mine with a bolded "-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear" so it gets easier to identify the team. -WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear First post that catches my eye. This team is leaning town. First team to get a signature. Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 00:55 sqrtofneg1 wrote:On July 11 2014 13:00 OnceKing wrote:
i also think we should evaluate each person individually independent of who their other half is.
This may come to prove important. Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:01 sqrtofneg1 wrote:On July 11 2014 19:33 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 19:30 mderg wrote:On July 11 2014 19:26 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 18:50 marvellosity wrote:
I think I'm going to ignore Eden, dunno if he posts like a stupid kid for a particular reason, but it makes him look like a stupid kid and it's annoying to read his posts with terrible english. why would you ignore a confirmed townie? very sketchy play imo The last time I remember someone saying that he was confirmed townie he was actually scum. the last time I had a grilled cheese sandwich for dinner I got laid by a hot Russian chick later that night Eden is town. Last time I played with Eden, he was mafia, and he wasn't joking around like this. He came down hard on people. Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:20 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Okay, rayn is first on my list. Town. Like I pointed out, this is an excellent post. On July 11 2014 22:51 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Also this is from my notes regarding my earlier post:
I felt like Eden is running out of arguments after the Kenpachi gambit. After the stuff he said does not sell to people he soft-calls out poofer for something really awful.
Also poofer's post was bad because this is not a normal hydra game and reading two people as one is a bad strategy, if someone is scummy they are likely to be scum. It does not matter how townie the other half looks.
Let's see if Palmar is paying attention to the game. He should most likely say these things in case he is town. Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:24 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Haru is definitely strange. He is not acting like in previous games. I don't like him. His partner, Glowingbear, however, I do like. This: On July 12 2014 00:19 GlowingBear wrote:On July 11 2014 21:28 Palmar wrote:Actually, I'm going to do this: ##Unvote
##Vote Team WeDemandALawyerThe reasons: 1. They both seemed excited to play pre-game, but haven't posted anything of value. 2. This post On July 11 2014 11:47 GlowingBear wrote:
/confirm
Hello guys, it's my second game here.
It seems that there is a ruckus going on already. Can someone explain me what Is the Kenpachi rule?
Also, I'll be signing every post of mine with a bolded "-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear" so it gets easier to identify the team.
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear Specifically the bolded sentence feels like massively useless fluff observation. 3. This post On July 11 2014 12:38 GlowingBear wrote:
Kenpachi rule doesn't sound as a winning plan to me. You may use it as a secondary argument but to get to the point you have a primary one there is so much game to be played. I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
Why do I think it's secondary: a scum can fake claim vt just so he can get townie to accuse him and get mislynched. More than that, a vt can simply try to pressure someone who claimed vt. Why not?
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and Glowingbear Talking about stuff that is really easy to talk about without giving any sort of an opinion on anyone in the game. I think it was sinani who pointed out that this post also came at a really awkward time, after people had mostly dropped the kenpachi thing. 3. This post On July 11 2014 19:59 HaruRH wrote:
/confirm
Robik is going to be afk? But exo is a d1 non-poster too...
Meh
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear
I like the summary of his opinion on the issue. "Meh". 1) Being excited =\= spamming. More than that, I wasn't posting anymore because I was sleeping. Different time zones hooray. I'm excited and I'm reading through everything but if you think not giving a opinion on someone is scummy, I'll say that giving free useless opinions on everyone is scummy. As I didn't know at the time what the Kenpachi rule was and as I said we needed more game to have a primary argument, I think it's pretty reasonable to just point out useless effort and wait to have more food to make a case, probably around midday. 2)Pointint out that I didn't know exactly what was happening because I didn't know the meaning of Kenpachi rule. How can I understand a fight if I can not understand the language? I think the team name bolding is very good so we can give a better analysis while diving through the topic. 3) See point 1. Also, I don't think it was unnecessary post as we were wasting breath on a useless subject by the moment, and I find scummy people who just spam things about useless objects, so town loses time and focus. It has already stopped, well, yes, but to the point you would say that I pratically necrobumped it? Check the post times or the distance between my post and the last "Kenpachi rule" post. It's less than a page. More: why would I bring the discussion back just to say "let's not discuss this"? If it was a misleading topic and I were scum, shouldn't I just keep the topic going on saying something like "oh we have to use this policy because of X"? Is a good post. Decent logic here. Overall, I'm on the fence with these guys.Haru, a question for you. On July 12 2014 00:34 HaruRH wrote:On July 12 2014 00:32 IAmRobik wrote:On July 12 2014 00:28 OnceKing wrote:On July 11 2014 14:31 OnceKing wrote:On July 11 2014 12:38 Stratiform wrote:On July 11 2014 12:28 27ninjabunnies wrote:
Stratiform, I've never seen you before or played with you before.
Do you play here on TL often?
How familiar are you with the game mafia?
What is your take on the game so far? I've never played on TL, only irl and some facebook based games. I'm familiar with how mafia works. As for the game so far, I don't really see any information to cast more than suspicion on anyone. Fun question What merits casting more than suspicion then And who is your suspicion cast upon So I go to sleep and I wake up and this question still isn't answered... Stratiform pls -- Robik can you tell me what bunnies/poof have done that's scummy other than "they disagree with each other"? Alternately can you explain why disagreeing with your teammate is alignment indicative? I don't know. The only thing that really bothers me strongly is that they have differing reads based off of my previous experience with playing as a hydra and the two heads expressing differing reads -- it also happened in my first game with rayn and mocsta expressing different reads. So both hydras that I've played with that were mafia had different reads. The one hydra that I played with that had the same reads (mattisfoolish) had the same reads. it also MINORLY bothers me that bunnies is trying to push scum on me because I'm town, so that's pushing an anti-town agenda I was waiting for you to say that robik Top town Why were you waiting for robik to say this? Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:27 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Tehpoofter hasn't done much. No read on him.Bunnies, however, has talked alot. A lot lot. Bunnies isn't as helpful as in other games, to the best of my memory. She's not questioning anything, not pushing people, I don't like it. But I don't think we should lynch them because you usually don't lynch the most outspoken player, even if they're not posting all that useful stuff. Bunnies, any particular reason for not scumhunting? Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:33 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Ray + tambo hasn't talked yet. No read. I've bolded most of his reads. He looks like he does not want to "get into the battlefield", mostly giving free townreads to people. What mostly bothers me: just one-liners. He made a push on Palmar, though: sqrt's vote on Palmar's: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 01:31 sqrtofneg1 wrote:I do not like palmar. (this seems to be a trend) He hasn't /confirmed yet. First post: Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 04:25 Palmar wrote:Hi I am Pálmar And then does nothing for a significant amount of time. Also this is not the palmar I saw when I played him. He was more analytical, more smart that game. This game, not so much. Stratiform, I don't have a clue. But this is my best read so far. They're mafia. ##Vote: Team Magic Computer Howerever, there is no strong argument to justify a lynch, as there is no strong argument to justify his townreads. If you check his filters, you will find tiny posts with little information and reasoning behind. It just looks like he is trying to look like he is contributing, but not contributing at all. But if he is scum, I'd better check Alakaslam also, because they are a team. If you filter dive him, you're going to find posts with no much useful information. Like this one: Hi Post from Alakaslam: + Show Spoiler +On July 11 2014 23:13 Alakaslam wrote:Well Hi So, although I'm not sure if alakaslam is not contributing more because he, at the time, didn't have enough food on anybody, and although he doesn't have an overly friendly behavior like sqrt, this lack of contribution fits sqrt's attitude until now. Slam gotta do better to change my vote. I absolutely hate this post and this should be killed with fire. Definition of over-explaining a read with no real basis. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 15:21 Eden1892 wrote:
ok friends here is a post count thus far, each number corresponds to the teams in the OP and the parentheses numbers are each poster
1: 31 posts (020/011)
2: 36 posts (025/011)
3: 99 posts (044/055)
4: 123 posts (031/092)
5: 64 posts (043/021)
6: 21 posts (009/012)
7: 80 posts (008/072)
8: 93 posts (077/016)
9: 89 posts (011/078)
10: 91 posts (076/015)
preliminary thoughts by team:
- slot 1 can stay, low posting but slenderman is doing work IMO, not killing this slot
- slot 2 is whatever i'll sort it out later but i would be ok killing it
- slot 3 is scum, we're killing today
- slot 4 is memorable as town + high-posting so we're not killing this slot
- slot 5 is oddly unmemorable for >60 posts, would be okay killing
- slot 6 TBD, low post count and not memorable but a lot of that is Koshi replacing in
- slot 7 is confirmed town, we're never killing this slot
- slot 8 is funny because robik said he wasn't gonna talk but then has a bunch of posts. also we're not killing this slot because it's memorable as town + high-posting
- slot 9 is confirmed town, we're never killing this slot
- slot 10 is unmemorable despite a lot of posting, would be okay killing this slot
tl;dr:
- slot 3 scum
- slots 1, 4, 7, 8, 9 are off the table
- slot 6 tbd
- slots 2, 6, 10 look good, probably in that order Well this post is absolutely.. ugh.. i don't even know what to say.. If you have time to make a post like this why don't you even put the playernames there. FYI people posting 5 times or 100 times in a certain amount of time does not make anyone town/mafia. Also how is Slenderman doing "good work" when you apparently don't even agree with his case OR my case (which is pretty much the same - just that Slendy dug deeper into it as i told him to in our QT before losing internet). What you are basically saying here is that "Haru/GB pair is really scummy but let's ignore the case and kill Slam/sqrt". That is not-townlike at all. + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 19:14 Eden1892 wrote:
Unflipped associations time!
If you're right about Shiny Ursaring being mafia, marv, then that explains why there's no counterwagon: the other mafia is busing.
Slamroot set itself up to be bused when it got caught -- notice how both members completely drop any effort to defend themselves from pressing questions as soon as they're brought up. If we're being honest, sqrt's post that I called him out on which started the avalanche of suspicion on their slot wasn't this damning or obvious. It snowballed because Slamroot didn't bother responding to any accusations whatsoever. I would acknowledge that giving up straight away is probably suboptimal play for the mafia because I don't think it would have been very difficult to defuse suspicions about them; however, even if suboptimal, it still conceivably advances scum wincon by allowing the partner to bus for credit. As town behavior OTOH it's not merely suboptimal, it's completely nonsensical. Giving up, spamming the thread and getting mislynched by a case that could reasonably be refuted is literally 100% negative utility for town.
So of course there isn't gonna be a counterwagon, and this shouldn't discourage anyone from voting for Slamroot today. There's not gonna be a counterwagon because Slamroot's partner is going to bus because the current situation is unsalvageable. What we want to look for is a slot that's acknowledging Slamroot's guilt and probably even voting for them, but whose reasoning isn't sound and whose primary claimed suspicions are elsewhere (and relatively unexplained).
So far Shiny Ursaring fits the bill there and I'd be happy to lynch them tomorrow, but I think there's just no way Slamroot is town. This post also makes no sense at all. + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 01:09 goodkarma wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2014 00:57 Alakaslam wrote:On July 13 2014 00:51 goodkarma wrote:On July 13 2014 00:28 Alakaslam wrote:
There is nothing to defend against you are all such sheep this game that I once again say all I have for you is pure acid
"Slam doesn't defend sqrt but his case wasn't even all that strong"
WHEN YOU YELLED LIKE WE WERE CONFIRMED SCUM! LOOK AT THE BULLSHIT LINKS THEY GAVE ME SUCH SHIT
NOW THEY ADMIT IT BECAUSE THEY ARE SCUM AND THEY ARE AFRAID I OUTED THEM
NOTICE ONLY TWO PEOPLE ARE PUSHING ME SO HARD AND THE REST ARE LOKE "meh well he didn't defend (lol!) and poly morphed into wormwood so I guess he is scum"
AS UNPLEASANT AS IT IS
READ MY FILTER There's almost nothing in your filter but complaining and image spam. You may have mentioned you didn't like Eden/OnceKing/maybe ninja, but there's been no followup. You bring it up and go into full spam/martyr mode. The way you've behaved, I'll see you lynched. Not just you, but your partner have been super-scummy all game. If you somehow actually are town, follow up on reads/make meaningful case points. The clock's a-tickin'. You suck. You actually suck. Or you are lying and didn't read, deserve to lose/scum And that's literally been the only argument I've seen for your scumsuspects. OMGUS. But let's for a moment assume that you're a townie. You act like scum. And your partner acts like scum. Why is it so hard for you to believe that while you continue to act like scum, there could be townies pushing your wagon? Until you present some kind of case or meaningful argument there's really nothing more to be said. You should be lynched. If you really are town that's martyred yourself you should be banned for playing against your wincon. Show nested quote +On July 13 2014 00:58 Alakaslam wrote:On July 13 2014 00:53 Koshi wrote:
When is the lynch? It's long right? Idgaf you are all so blind and tunneled it is poimtless and has been once my actual content was ignored I'm more than happy to see this "actual content" btw. I have yet to see it myself after going through your filter a few times over. Perhaps summarize/repost? There is one thing that bothers me alot in this post. Can anyone tell me what it is? Show nested quote +On July 13 2014 01:12 Koshi wrote:On July 13 2014 00:58 Alakaslam wrote:On July 13 2014 00:53 Koshi wrote:
When is the lynch? It's long right? Idgaf you are all so blind and tunneled it is poimtless and has been once my actual content was ignored If you are referring to the case you made about Eden talking about a Scum QT I am not impressed. Give me your read on OnceKing. I for one did not remember a single post of him and it seems like he has 5 pages of filter. You might got something there. Talk to me. bad Koshi bad. If you gonna play like this i will murder you. + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 01:16 Koshi wrote:
Meh, OnceKing his filter is pretty ok after reread. thank you. + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 01:21 Koshi wrote:
I feel like Alakaslam is lacking smart content. He is capable to say a lot of good stuff between the randomness. However, this game he is really angry for getting lynched while there is almost no good content.
That's why I am ok with his lynch over HaruRH/GlowingBear.
But I don't want to make marv and rayn mad. So what's it gonna be Koshi? dun dun...... + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 02:35 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
Glowingbear's team town.
M&M town.
Robik/exo scum.
The other scum is probably either palmar's team or eden's team. I thought you thought i was scum? + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 02:49 sinani206 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2014 02:41 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
I shall not.
You shall lynch me either way.
You who have ears, let him hear.
Let my reads be known to those who choose to listen. how to play town: convince other towns that your scum are scum how to play scum: say things like this And you are definitely the most useless guy in this game. Unfortunately i don't know what does that make you. pg 61-70:ninjabunnies might be mafia. Onceking is the towniest town that has towned this town. Never lynching that pair. GlowingBear basically reposts what he said before.... Nothing new, no more elaboration (it was not the point that marv didn't understand his posts, the point was - if you read marv's post - that THERE WAS NOTHING CONCRETE IN THE READS!!!) They were based on stuff that makes noone mafia, at least that's how GlowingBear presents his arguments. Why isn't Robik more emo? Strong opinions and yell everyone to lynch the people he wants to regardless of if people even understand his reads or not = town!Robik (and no i don't mean the dumb shit he sometimes does). In general this is weird. Robik could you elaborate on this? + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 05:53 IAmRobik wrote:
Cause Haru is wise beyond words.
I'm voting you because:
1) you're trying to push scum on me incorrectly
2) banks isn't doing dick this game, and that's his scum meta
The reason to not vote you is that the point on Koshi/CR is kinda interesting and is what I was thinking...especially the koshi entrance. I thought that the CR one wasn't so bad, but it wasn't great either. He was really try-hard mafia in Order, but he was lackluster mafia in the small BH game. I'm gonna revisit that game and see how he entered/played I don't like (1). I like (2). Robert you bneed to get out of this crap you are pulling all the time. Yes, you do it as mafia aswell. Noone is scum if they think you are scum because townies can also think you are scum even when you are town. The truth is, you haven't said much this game. Not much content and not much town!Robik "spam" (i can't find a better word for it but at least you know what i mean). I can't see why i should think you are town, can you tell me why? + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 05:59 Tehpoofter wrote:
Robik you're typically not terrible bunnies told me about how slam/sqrt basically both conceded so hard not to vote them.(Even though everything I've heard about slam is that he loves playing scum and I find it hard to imagine him just straight up conceding a game as scum I haven't read in the thread where he did yet.) I'm more curious what you think about the Palmar/Marv/Rayn folks in the game (really excited rayn is back tbh) I read the part where you basically auto confirmed rayn off one post. Still like that read? The interactions that were had between like pages 24-29 (this is the way back machine as I read slow) between Marv/Palmar especially were weird. I feel like one if not both is mafia. I need to read the rest of the thread obviously but I'm curious about your reads on them. (If you've already given them just link the posts for faster viewing if you would be so kind)
Not reading the thread. WHY WOULD YOU EVEN SAY SOMETHING LIKE THIS???? + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 06:49 Eden1892 wrote:
ok with slenderman's superb vote switch the count is 5-2-1-1-1
the 2 wagon is fucking obvtown bunnies crew and has one person on it who's said he expects to end on the lead wagon so it's not even a counterwagon
great job team, if you're not on the slamroot wagon please explain why not Eden explain this post please. I can't understand what you are saying here. I do not like bunnies soft-defending Slam-sqrt like she does. She doesn't present an alternative, she doesn't say why anyone ELSE is more likely to be mafia. She just defends them for no reason... Explain why Slam as mafia would just not give up? + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2014 07:21 OnceKing wrote:
I have no clue where sinani or goodkarma are but it doesn't concern me since they're both town Elaborate on this OnceKing please. sinani is useless as fuck and GK looks... maybe okay.
EOD1:Okay so ~90% of the posts are fluff. Onceking is town. CR is town too. Eden looks fine after all i guess.. meh.. Ok & Eden were the two people who actually tried to do something on D1 (for reals). I'll probably check some older games from them (or most likely Eden, just because he had some shaky posts) just to see if they can play as scum aswell. I cheated and went on reading the N1 end because i got a strange feeling about Palmar as he hates fluff and all he posted was @EOD was fluff. You are all fuckers for not reading Slendy's posts, and i hate you all (not to say i would have disagreed with the lynch - as sqrt was scummy as fuck) just because Haru/GB pair is mafia and should be killed with fire. Bunnies doesn't look too dandy, she has a lot of posts that... really do not say anything at all. If Koshi does not start playing soon he is mafia. poofer has literally said nothing, so has sinani. I'll go onto N1 after sauna. [/spoiler]
[/spoiler]
TL;DR:
Palmmar not scum
Robik is stupid
CR is town/learnt to play mafia
Eden not scum (unless we are scum)
... ...
SUDDENLY
Okay so ~90% of the posts are fluff.
Onceking is town. CR is town too. Eden looks fine after all i guess.. meh.. Ok & Eden were the two people who actually tried to do something on D1 (for reals). I'll probably check some older games from them (or most likely Eden, just because he had some shaky posts) just to see if they can play as scum aswell.
I cheated and went on reading the N1 end because i got a strange feeling about Palmar as he hates fluff and all he posted was @EOD was fluff. You are all fuckers for not reading Slendy's posts, and i hate you all (not to say i would have disagreed with the lynch - as sqrt was scummy as fuck) just because Haru/GB pair is mafia and should be killed with fire.
Bunnies doesn't look too dandy, she has a lot of posts that... really do not say anything at all. If Koshi does not start playing soon he is mafia. poofer has literally said nothing, so has sinani.
I'll go onto N1 after sauna.
THIS IS THE ONLY QUOTE OUT OF THE WHOLE FKING 'READ' SHIT HE DID THAT MENTIONED WE WERE SCUMMY. LITERALLY. AND HE IS CALLING US TOP SCUM NOW.
Haru The Judge's Final Rating:
rubbish read with 0% credibility, meant to look like he was reading the thread.
|
Case #2:
+ Show Spoiler +On July 14 2014 18:45 Koshi wrote:This was made on page 35: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:42 GlowingBear wrote:
Or put the grapes on spoiler :p
Ok I think we have enough posts to make a case. When I get home, I'll reach my computer and do what I do best: filter diving. Then I'm going to bring cases. Expect a big post in around 4 hours since now.
Before I go, I must also say that focusing "townhunting" is worse than "scum hunting" in my opinion, because it gets easier to a scum to blend in your town circle and doesn't help to do a good lynch on day1, as you are going to choose who to lynch based on someone you just don't have a strong town read instead of lynching someone you have a strong scumread. This was made on page 45: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 07:41 GlowingBear wrote:
OMG just got back home and BOOM 45 pages to read.
Gonna take a shower, skim through the pages, filter dive my strongest scum read and give a case. Then, if I get enough energy, I'll filter dive other people's scum reads to give my opinion.
God, it will take a while.
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear GlowingBear has shown activeness through pages 1 to 45. These 2 quotes come from the bottom of his first first page of filter. How can you be active in the first 35 pages of the game, say you will make cases when you return in 4 hours, and then when you return you are totally lost because there are 10 more pages to read? What is the difference between 35 pages or 45 pages? To me this looks like a scum showing activity in the early game but not thinking about the game. Then after being pressured to give reads (also by his own teammate HaruRh: "GlowingBears reads are amazing, just wait on them") he says he will do it in 4 hours, but when trying to come up with reads failing horribly. This feeling is only strenghtened by the actual read post: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 14:29 GlowingBear wrote:Ok, I've read enough. I really can't read more right now, I tried to analyze every single page and it seems my head can't absorb that much information. I started to write a summary on what was going on but I've got no more energy to do. It's incomplete, but I will leave it here in case someone finds it useful: Half-ass summary: + Show Spoiler +
A) Game started with Eden claiming VT. Tehpoofter questioned it (indirectly btw). Got a wagon on him because of Kenpachi Rule policy. Bunnies and Eden started a discussion about the kenpachi rule and about Bunnies writing nonsense.
B) Robik posted about getting on the backseat while ExO would take the main point of his team. Got wagoned when Eden decided that this and Robik's vt claim was suspicious.
C) Rayn accused Eden's and tehpoofter's posts of being the worst of the thread. It can be viewed at page 22 as quoted by Ede. This is the game while on page 22.
D) marv/mderg starts posting at page 23 right after Exo express his will to hear about them.
E) Eden is questioned by marv and palmer for his vt claim. Eden insists in his vt claim. This is around page 24.
F) Palmar scumreads my posts because he thinks it was filled with fluff and unhelpful, then voted on me and Haru. Page 26.
G) Rayn decides to vote on me and Haru assuming that Haru was writing useless stuff when defending Palmar's push on me. 26-27
H) Robik posted and people got on him again, inquiring about his back seat attitude and his vt claim.
I) 32 - 36: sqrt starts giving reads on everybody, mostly null or town reads, except for Palmar because... he didn't confirm? o.O. People start to pressure him.
So, for what I read until now, I have three main targets I want to read more: ExO, Robik and Eden. I'll filter dive them tomorrow, as I didn't have energy enough even to read through 50 long pages. I have a stronger hunch on sqrt/alakaslam, as a lot of people were saying here. Why these guys? Because my way of scumhunting is going through passivity and too much friendly behavior. Going against people there were being quite and being friendly was my best bet on my first game and when I did that most of my readings got the right guys. I see this signals on sqrt's posts, mostly. Check out these quotes: sqrt's friendly quotes: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 00:52 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 11:47 GlowingBear wrote:
/confirm
Hello guys, it's my second game here.
It seems that there is a ruckus going on already. Can someone explain me what Is the Kenpachi rule?
Also, I'll be signing every post of mine with a bolded "-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear" so it gets easier to identify the team.
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear First post that catches my eye. This team is leaning town. First team to get a signature. On July 12 2014 00:55 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 13:00 OnceKing wrote:
i also think we should evaluate each person individually independent of who their other half is.
This may come to prove important. On July 12 2014 01:01 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 19:33 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 19:30 mderg wrote:On July 11 2014 19:26 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 18:50 marvellosity wrote:
I think I'm going to ignore Eden, dunno if he posts like a stupid kid for a particular reason, but it makes him look like a stupid kid and it's annoying to read his posts with terrible english. why would you ignore a confirmed townie? very sketchy play imo The last time I remember someone saying that he was confirmed townie he was actually scum. the last time I had a grilled cheese sandwich for dinner I got laid by a hot Russian chick later that night Eden is town. Last time I played with Eden, he was mafia, and he wasn't joking around like this. He came down hard on people. On July 12 2014 01:20 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Okay, rayn is first on my list. Town. Like I pointed out, this is an excellent post. Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 22:51 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Also this is from my notes regarding my earlier post:
I felt like Eden is running out of arguments after the Kenpachi gambit. After the stuff he said does not sell to people he soft-calls out poofer for something really awful.
Also poofer's post was bad because this is not a normal hydra game and reading two people as one is a bad strategy, if someone is scummy they are likely to be scum. It does not matter how townie the other half looks.
Let's see if Palmar is paying attention to the game. He should most likely say these things in case he is town. On July 12 2014 01:24 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Haru is definitely strange. He is not acting like in previous games. I don't like him. His partner, Glowingbear, however, I do like. This: Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 00:19 GlowingBear wrote:On July 11 2014 21:28 Palmar wrote:Actually, I'm going to do this: ##Unvote
##Vote Team WeDemandALawyerThe reasons: 1. They both seemed excited to play pre-game, but haven't posted anything of value. 2. This post On July 11 2014 11:47 GlowingBear wrote:
/confirm
Hello guys, it's my second game here.
It seems that there is a ruckus going on already. Can someone explain me what Is the Kenpachi rule?
Also, I'll be signing every post of mine with a bolded "-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear" so it gets easier to identify the team.
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear Specifically the bolded sentence feels like massively useless fluff observation. 3. This post On July 11 2014 12:38 GlowingBear wrote:
Kenpachi rule doesn't sound as a winning plan to me. You may use it as a secondary argument but to get to the point you have a primary one there is so much game to be played. I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
Why do I think it's secondary: a scum can fake claim vt just so he can get townie to accuse him and get mislynched. More than that, a vt can simply try to pressure someone who claimed vt. Why not?
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and Glowingbear Talking about stuff that is really easy to talk about without giving any sort of an opinion on anyone in the game. I think it was sinani who pointed out that this post also came at a really awkward time, after people had mostly dropped the kenpachi thing. 3. This post On July 11 2014 19:59 HaruRH wrote:
/confirm
Robik is going to be afk? But exo is a d1 non-poster too...
Meh
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and GlowingBear
I like the summary of his opinion on the issue. "Meh". 1) Being excited =\= spamming. More than that, I wasn't posting anymore because I was sleeping. Different time zones hooray. I'm excited and I'm reading through everything but if you think not giving a opinion on someone is scummy, I'll say that giving free useless opinions on everyone is scummy. As I didn't know at the time what the Kenpachi rule was and as I said we needed more game to have a primary argument, I think it's pretty reasonable to just point out useless effort and wait to have more food to make a case, probably around midday. 2)Pointint out that I didn't know exactly what was happening because I didn't know the meaning of Kenpachi rule. How can I understand a fight if I can not understand the language? I think the team name bolding is very good so we can give a better analysis while diving through the topic. 3) See point 1. Also, I don't think it was unnecessary post as we were wasting breath on a useless subject by the moment, and I find scummy people who just spam things about useless objects, so town loses time and focus. It has already stopped, well, yes, but to the point you would say that I pratically necrobumped it? Check the post times or the distance between my post and the last "Kenpachi rule" post. It's less than a page. More: why would I bring the discussion back just to say "let's not discuss this"? If it was a misleading topic and I were scum, shouldn't I just keep the topic going on saying something like "oh we have to use this policy because of X"? Is a good post. Decent logic here. Overall, I'm on the fence with these guys.Haru, a question for you. Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 00:34 HaruRH wrote:On July 12 2014 00:32 IAmRobik wrote:On July 12 2014 00:28 OnceKing wrote:On July 11 2014 14:31 OnceKing wrote:On July 11 2014 12:38 Stratiform wrote:On July 11 2014 12:28 27ninjabunnies wrote:
Stratiform, I've never seen you before or played with you before.
Do you play here on TL often?
How familiar are you with the game mafia?
What is your take on the game so far? I've never played on TL, only irl and some facebook based games. I'm familiar with how mafia works. As for the game so far, I don't really see any information to cast more than suspicion on anyone. Fun question What merits casting more than suspicion then And who is your suspicion cast upon So I go to sleep and I wake up and this question still isn't answered... Stratiform pls -- Robik can you tell me what bunnies/poof have done that's scummy other than "they disagree with each other"? Alternately can you explain why disagreeing with your teammate is alignment indicative? I don't know. The only thing that really bothers me strongly is that they have differing reads based off of my previous experience with playing as a hydra and the two heads expressing differing reads -- it also happened in my first game with rayn and mocsta expressing different reads. So both hydras that I've played with that were mafia had different reads. The one hydra that I played with that had the same reads (mattisfoolish) had the same reads. it also MINORLY bothers me that bunnies is trying to push scum on me because I'm town, so that's pushing an anti-town agenda I was waiting for you to say that robik Top town Why were you waiting for robik to say this? On July 12 2014 01:27 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Tehpoofter hasn't done much. No read on him.Bunnies, however, has talked alot. A lot lot. Bunnies isn't as helpful as in other games, to the best of my memory. She's not questioning anything, not pushing people, I don't like it. But I don't think we should lynch them because you usually don't lynch the most outspoken player, even if they're not posting all that useful stuff. Bunnies, any particular reason for not scumhunting? On July 12 2014 01:33 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Ray + tambo hasn't talked yet. No read. I've bolded most of his reads. He looks like he does not want to "get into the battlefield", mostly giving free townreads to people. What mostly bothers me: just one-liners. He made a push on Palmar, though: sqrt's vote on Palmar's: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 01:31 sqrtofneg1 wrote:I do not like palmar. (this seems to be a trend) He hasn't /confirmed yet. First post: And then does nothing for a significant amount of time. Also this is not the palmar I saw when I played him. He was more analytical, more smart that game. This game, not so much. Stratiform, I don't have a clue. But this is my best read so far. They're mafia. ##Vote: Team Magic Computer Howerever, there is no strong argument to justify a lynch, as there is no strong argument to justify his townreads. If you check his filters, you will find tiny posts with little information and reasoning behind. It just looks like he is trying to look like he is contributing, but not contributing at all. But if he is scum, I'd better check Alakaslam also, because they are a team. If you filter dive him, you're going to find posts with no much useful information. Like this one: Hi Post from Alakaslam: + Show Spoiler +On July 11 2014 23:13 Alakaslam wrote:Well Hi So, although I'm not sure if alakaslam is not contributing more because he, at the time, didn't have enough food on anybody, and although he doesn't have an overly friendly behavior like sqrt, this lack of contribution fits sqrt's attitude until now. Slam gotta do better to change my vote. So this read post is 13 hours later then when he promised he was going to provide reads. But Glowingbear doesn't get further then the page he was on when he promised these reads. These reads all date back to page 35. Now if we look at the actual content in this post there is only something on sqrt, and it has nothing to do with scumhunting. It's just sqrt is being friendly and on the sidelines. Which is exactly how Glowingbear is playing tbh, this is the first post that contains any form of reads and we are 50 pages far. There is nothing on Alakaslam. From reading the Alakaslam filter GlowingBear quoted a post about Alakaslam saying "Hi". That's it. I don't even know what to say about that except that it isn't a townie looking to figure out Alakaslam his alignment. HaruRh makes it look like GlowingBear was pretty good in previous games at scumhunting, I haven't checked this but if GlowingBear did find scum. He probable didn't do it by analysing "Hi" posts. So in this post he against promises reads for 3 other people. I am seeing a pattern here. GlowingBear keep getting behind on the thread and then by catching up he doesn't have to play in the moment. He just gives himself time to make outdated posts. In theory this is already 100% scummy, but forgivable if the reads would help the game forward. Or in the very least attempt to do so: Show nested quote +On July 13 2014 05:29 GlowingBear wrote:-> About my suspicions on ExO: As I said before, my preferred method of chasing scum is looking after passivity/overly friendly behavior, although not the only one (this is the last time I'm saying this, you all know it by now). So, what raised suspicions on ExO was this particular post: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 00:54 ExO_ wrote:Some thoughts: Team D-I tend to have weird hours that I can be on, and I'm not just reading the TL forums 24/7, so while I can't always be as active as robik saying I'm not doing anything now isn't really giving me a fair shake in my opinion (@27ninjabunnies). Every game I've seen 27nb in she goes around being very caustic and arrogant towards some people, and very nice to others. It seems to be regardless of her alignment. I find it to be unhelpful, as she goes off on tangents with wild accusations filled with bullshit reasoning for scum reads. What this means in terms of the game is it's hard for me to read her as mafia or town. But I think she does more to cause problems in a town, than actually help with finding scum and uniting the town players. Poofter isn't saying much and is kinda letting her get out in front. I don't know how to interpret that, but in World Cup poofter stayed kinda quiet until it came time to push me in the wrong directions. Nearly worked too . So a null read on the team but I generally think constantly creating a toxic atmosphere for the town is a bad thing even if they are town. Team WhineSlam is posting a fuck ton of 1 liners/pictures/general nonsense (hijole?) and sqrtofneg1 is saying nothing at all. In larger games I think mafia lurking works better than in a smaller game such as this, but it's almost nothing to read off of. Will have to wait to see what they vote day 1 and what happens night 1 to really know what to think of them. Team VendettaStradaI'm not sure if they're both posting from the same account, but it looks like it's all raynpelioneet. In my limited experience here I haven't seen him before, and though he hasn't posted a fuck ton of stuff, seems townish it to me. Looks like he's contributing. Team needs a lawyerI always kinda read HaruRH scummy, he has a little bit of omgus going on, but I miss read him in world cup so it gives me pause. So I look over at glowing bear, and he hasn't said a whole lot either. Just got caught up in the Kenpachi business. But doesn't really read town to me. I lean scum here, but I'm hesitant. Team Magic CarpetNot a lot of posts from straightform just asking questions "Robik why won't u post?, Why would exo/robik not posting Day 1 not be bad for town" etc... Palmar calls out team lawyer for not posting anything of value, but I see very little of value from him at all. After reading his filter i think Palmar is the most scummy looking person so far in the thread. *scum read* Team GoodCornBadCornCompletely afk. Like 1 combined other than their /in posts. like what....? Do they not know the game is happening? No reads yet for obvious reasons Team Crotch RocketNot a lot being said from good Karma. Eden is posting quite a bit, and seems okay. I don't think mafia are going to be quite as active as eden is being, but it could be good coaching happening. Town read for now though Team Fraud walRusSinani saying hardly anything, OnceKing's vote on our team I think is bad: it's based on robik not playing the game, when robik has been pretty active. Hasn't really expanded on any reads and got pretty caught up in ol' kenpachi but I don't get a scum vibe from him. Null read Team M squaredmderg hasn't said too much, but I've generally liked and agreed with what marv has to say. I think Town So that leaves me with Town M squared Vendetta Strata (aka how can I make a parody of that team name) Rocket Crotch Null D- Whine* Goodcornbadcorn* Fraud walRus Scum Lawyer Magic Carpet *Mostly afk So, basically, a huge post with tons of null reads and three town reads. This is, to me, being over friendly. Moreover, if you check his scum guesses, he thinks me and haru might be scums because we are not posting things with value. However, he is hesitating on us. Then, he thinks Palmar is scum for saying that we are scum for not posting anything of value. So, he is attacking Palmar for using the same logic as him. So, not a good post. This is what made him feel suspicious for me. ********* --> About my suspicions on Robik Alright, I felt Robik was suspicious because he said he wasn't going to post and then started to spam things, or that is what I felt. Something like these posts: + Show Spoiler +On July 11 2014 12:29 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 12:22 OnceKing wrote:On July 11 2014 12:07 OnceKing wrote:
so do you have an actual reason for not playing the game robik i must have missed it read the thread. not gonna answer this again cause i'm a lil whiney bitch On July 11 2014 12:21 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 12:13 27ninjabunnies wrote:
Rob if you were mafia, what kind of post would you have made? Didn't think about that and didn't have to worry about it because when I opened my role pm I found out that I was town. On July 11 2014 16:32 IAmRobik wrote:
Cause I am god-tier at reading Rayn. And on that note I'm going to bed On July 11 2014 23:51 IAmRobik wrote:
Man, if I was town jr and marv was my town sr, I would be so content right now. I literally would have 0 posts in the thread On July 11 2014 23:55 IAmRobik wrote:
I mean, my comment had nothing to do with the game or my reads. It was a random thought that came to my head. On July 12 2014 03:45 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 03:41 OnceKing wrote:
it was a hearthstone discussion
and no
but i dont think i joked around that much in my newbie as town either sooooooooooooo poor meta reads ftw? just looked into the first game. I was in it. I was town. You were medic. You didn't save me n1. Policy lynch: ##vote: oncekingworstmedicnaeuoceana http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/postmessage.php?quote=611&topic_id=461355On July 12 2014 01:40 IAmRobik wrote:Man this post is so fucking scummy, but this guy is town. Don't lynch him! Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 01:38 ExO_ wrote:On July 12 2014 01:34 mderg wrote:On July 12 2014 01:27 IAmRobik wrote:On July 12 2014 01:24 mderg wrote:
Can we lynch Robik for being a liar? Where did I lie? right at the start when you promised to barely post this game. (I don´t really want to lynch you for that, I´m just salty because of world cup mafia) Listen here I tried to save you in world cup remember! I was wrong on just about everything else, but I did try to save you with good logic! On July 12 2014 00:57 IAmRobik wrote:TOWNIEST POST IN THE MOTHA FUCKIN THREAD. THIS GUY IS SO FUCKING BRUTALLY TOWN. IF ANYONE VOTES TO LYNCH HIM, YOU WILL FACE MY WRATH Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 00:54 ExO_ wrote:Some thoughts: Team D-I tend to have weird hours that I can be on, and I'm not just reading the TL forums 24/7, so while I can't always be as active as robik saying I'm not doing anything now isn't really giving me a fair shake in my opinion (@27ninjabunnies). Every game I've seen 27nb in she goes around being very caustic and arrogant towards some people, and very nice to others. It seems to be regardless of her alignment. I find it to be unhelpful, as she goes off on tangents with wild accusations filled with bullshit reasoning for scum reads. What this means in terms of the game is it's hard for me to read her as mafia or town. But I think she does more to cause problems in a town, than actually help with finding scum and uniting the town players. Poofter isn't saying much and is kinda letting her get out in front. I don't know how to interpret that, but in World Cup poofter stayed kinda quiet until it came time to push me in the wrong directions. Nearly worked too . So a null read on the team but I generally think constantly creating a toxic atmosphere for the town is a bad thing even if they are town. Team WhineSlam is posting a fuck ton of 1 liners/pictures/general nonsense (hijole?) and sqrtofneg1 is saying nothing at all. In larger games I think mafia lurking works better than in a smaller game such as this, but it's almost nothing to read off of. Will have to wait to see what they vote day 1 and what happens night 1 to really know what to think of them. Team VendettaStradaI'm not sure if they're both posting from the same account, but it looks like it's all raynpelioneet. In my limited experience here I haven't seen him before, and though he hasn't posted a fuck ton of stuff, seems townish it to me. Looks like he's contributing. Team needs a lawyerI always kinda read HaruRH scummy, he has a little bit of omgus going on, but I miss read him in world cup so it gives me pause. So I look over at glowing bear, and he hasn't said a whole lot either. Just got caught up in the Kenpachi business. But doesn't really read town to me. I lean scum here, but I'm hesitant. Team Magic CarpetNot a lot of posts from straightform just asking questions "Robik why won't u post?, Why would exo/robik not posting Day 1 not be bad for town" etc... Palmar calls out team lawyer for not posting anything of value, but I see very little of value from him at all. After reading his filter i think Palmar is the most scummy looking person so far in the thread. *scum read* Team GoodCornBadCornCompletely afk. Like 1 combined other than their /in posts. like what....? Do they not know the game is happening? No reads yet for obvious reasons Team Crotch RocketNot a lot being said from good Karma. Eden is posting quite a bit, and seems okay. I don't think mafia are going to be quite as active as eden is being, but it could be good coaching happening. Town read for now though Team Fraud walRusSinani saying hardly anything, OnceKing's vote on our team I think is bad: it's based on robik not playing the game, when robik has been pretty active. Hasn't really expanded on any reads and got pretty caught up in ol' kenpachi but I don't get a scum vibe from him. Null read Team M squaredmderg hasn't said too much, but I've generally liked and agreed with what marv has to say. I think Town So that leaves me with Town M squared Vendetta Strata (aka how can I make a parody of that team name) Rocket Crotch Null D- Whine* Goodcornbadcorn* Fraud walRus Scum Lawyer Magic Carpet *Mostly afk These are quotes with Robik's sarcasm (which is really funny imo). But the thing is, looking out of context, it just seems that he wants to spam the thread. While re-reading his filters and trying to put those quotes on context, it looked like he was actually answering people. But... I don't know. Poor answers tbh. He insists to let ExO post more too much, also. And... why quoting his partner just to say "look ppl, this guy is town!". I just think that his spamming is not good, it looks suspicious to me because it just makes the thread difficult to read. Finally, I haven't seem a hard push coming from that team. That's what raised suspicions on him. But people who played with Robik before can say better if I'm being too hard on his playfulness. ********** --> About my suspicions on Eden Same as Robik. Funny but unhelpful in some posts: + Show Spoiler +On July 11 2014 11:35 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 11:34 IAmRobik wrote:On July 11 2014 11:32 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 11:30 IAmRobik wrote:
We are town. I will barely be posting for the rest of the game as we have absolutely nothing to hide and thus I will allow ExO to give his reads as they will be 100% genuine and not convoluted because he is town and everything that he posts will 100% be his honest opinion. I was thinking on the ride home how I would word this post if we got VT and it sounded way better and less convoluted, but it is what it is.
ExO, the floor is yours! confirmed power role i will sheep you to victory robik lead me Gets on Banks case for PR hunting...goes on to PR hunt LAWLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL i'm allowed to do that because i'm confirmed town On July 11 2014 11:58 Eden1892 wrote:
is D short for Dumb Shit That Doesn't Matter
because Team TheD isn't talking about anything else right now On July 11 2014 12:02 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 12:01 27ninjabunnies wrote:On July 11 2014 11:58 Eden1892 wrote:
is D short for Dumb Shit That Doesn't Matter
because Team TheD isn't talking about anything else right now No, I want to move passed this. I think it is dumb and stupid. Whether it's kenpachi rule, or whatever the hell made up rule you came up with. ![[image loading]](http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51dp0Ng1guL._SY300_.jpg) On July 11 2014 12:02 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 12:01 IAmRobik wrote:
OK and Eden have to stop harping on this "whatever" rule bullshit. It's really not progressing the thread anywhere and it's annoying to read over and over again go back to not posting On July 11 2014 12:04 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 12:03 27ninjabunnies wrote:On July 11 2014 12:02 Eden1892 wrote:On July 11 2014 12:01 27ninjabunnies wrote:On July 11 2014 11:58 Eden1892 wrote:
is D short for Dumb Shit That Doesn't Matter
because Team TheD isn't talking about anything else right now No, I want to move passed this. I think it is dumb and stupid. Whether it's kenpachi rule, or whatever the hell made up rule you came up with. That's some good seasoning. We use it in the South on just about everything. it is, i use it all the time very high salt content though, much like your post On July 11 2014 12:43 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 12:38 GlowingBear wrote:
Kenpachi rule doesn't sound as a winning plan to me. You may use it as a secondary argument but to get to the point you have a primary one there is so much game to be played. I think that if we keep discussing this topic it will just a waste of breath.
Why do I think it's secondary: a scum can fake claim vt just so he can get townie to accuse him and get mislynched. More than that, a vt can simply try to pressure someone who claimed vt. Why not?
-WeDemandALawyer: Haru and Glowingbear Show nested quote +On July 11 2014 12:41 27ninjabunnies wrote:
I like this post. Townie points.
Btw: How happy are you with your team name this game?
Do you need to call a lawyer?
The"Double"D wow ok count 'em up there's #2 we goin to da top town ![[image loading]](http://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/assets/4636903/cockypop2.gif) On July 11 2014 14:07 Eden1892 wrote:
Boy it sure is boring being a Louisiana VOLTRON Mason with bunnies and OnceKing... On July 12 2014 06:57 Eden1892 wrote:![[image loading]](http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140108021302/villains/images/2/27/Beetlejuice.jpg) Ok, I'll stop here because I've made my point. But that's not the only suspicious part. I find weird his strong push on poof based on a policy, while I think poof was being sarcastic regarding Eden's claim. But even if he thought poof was scum, I think he should reason it better. His explanation was late: + Show Spoiler +On July 11 2014 11:56 Eden1892 wrote:
y'all are dumb as hell smh
no one is using the Kenpachi Rule
this is actually the Ihcapnek Rule, where someone is scum because they believe a VT claim too quickly, not because they cast doubt on the VT claim
this is much better than the Kenpachi Rule and you should all follow the Ihcapnek Rule and vote TheD Ok, so, if he thinks this policy is good, he should push hard on it, no? He didn't: + Show Spoiler + On July 11 2014 14:59 Eden1892 wrote:
Sweet.
I didn't actually "get the feeling" blahblah at all, actually I was starting to back off my scumread of slot TheD and bunnies' recent posts have solidified that move.
We're not lynching bunnies today
##UNVOTE Team TheD
##VOTE Team FakeClaim
Why? Robik is on Team FakeClaim, and Robik claimed town. Therefore he is fake claiming and therefore he is scum. Checkmate Then, suddenly, Robik is town: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 06:38 Eden1892 wrote:
ok i'm on page 40
everybody shut the fuck up about robik he's town this is a waste
bunnies is not toxic to the thread, her questions might not always be going places and her spat with robik or whoever tf back in the 30s was silly but it doesn't matter because she is also town
we're lynching sqrt today, god bless america
someone read the post i highlighted in response to exo's reads and tell me how it isn't scum-motivated His scumreads flips too quickly, look what followed up: + Show Spoiler +On July 12 2014 14:34 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2014 14:17 TheSlenderMan wrote:
But that doesn't mean the rest of the topics of discussion should die trufax, ignoring Slamroot for now right now I would only be okay with killing the following teams (listed in order in 2nd post of thread): - WeDemandALawyer - Magic Computer - GoodCopBadCop - M&M of those I like Magic Computer, GoodCopBadCop and M&M the most for potential next-lynches I'm not trying to ignore your case on WeDemandALawyer, promise, it's just weird to me that none of those slots have done anything I really remember/consider important On July 12 2014 15:21 Eden1892 wrote:
ok friends here is a post count thus far, each number corresponds to the teams in the OP and the parentheses numbers are each poster
1: 31 posts (020/011)
2: 36 posts (025/011)
3: 99 posts (044/055)
4: 123 posts (031/092)
5: 64 posts (043/021)
6: 21 posts (009/012)
7: 80 posts (008/072)
8: 93 posts (077/016)
9: 89 posts (011/078)
10: 91 posts (076/015)
preliminary thoughts by team:
- slot 1 can stay, low posting but slenderman is doing work IMO, not killing this slot
- slot 2 is whatever i'll sort it out later but i would be ok killing it
- slot 3 is scum, we're killing today
- slot 4 is memorable as town + high-posting so we're not killing this slot
- slot 5 is oddly unmemorable for >60 posts, would be okay killing
- slot 6 TBD, low post count and not memorable but a lot of that is Koshi replacing in
- slot 7 is confirmed town, we're never killing this slot
- slot 8 is funny because robik said he wasn't gonna talk but then has a bunch of posts. also we're not killing this slot because it's memorable as town + high-posting
- slot 9 is confirmed town, we're never killing this slot
- slot 10 is unmemorable despite a lot of posting, would be okay killing this slot
tl;dr:
- slot 3 scum
- slots 1, 4, 7, 8, 9 are off the table
- slot 6 tbd
- slots 2, 6, 10 look good, probably in that order That concludes what I found suspicious on Robik, ExO and Eden. I would like to see marv's opinion on this post. Waiting for it. This again is so many hours later and I already commented on this post to show goodwill to GlowingBear. But in the end this post just isn't what it should be. There is nothing here that pushes the game forward, that only a townie would think off or what a scum wouldn't say. Show nested quote +On July 13 2014 15:04 GlowingBear wrote:3am here but I'm not feeling sleepy. Someone to talk please? marv, please, bring your thoughts on my main posts Show nested quote +On July 14 2014 02:30 GlowingBear wrote:On July 13 2014 20:24 marvellosity wrote:On July 13 2014 15:04 GlowingBear wrote:3am here but I'm not feeling sleepy. Someone to talk please? marv, please, bring your thoughts on my main posts honestly I can't really be bothered, because it's boring. I think anything you wrote could have been written by mafia, but Haru being weird on several occasions has made me leery of lynching you. Take it or leave it my friend ^^ "Glowingbear threw random names" *a huge post justifying my suspicions* "Lol tl;dr too boring to read." Gg. At least koshi had the decency to reply to my post Koshi, about Robik, I said that his posts, at least out of context, sounded like he was simply throwing random jokes and that when looking inside a context I wasn't sure if they were some random jokes or had some kind of meaning, but I still thought they were simple spam. When I say spam I am referring to a lot of posts with little information. I think that they make the thread bigger and useless. I think this is harmful to town. That is why I like to skim through the thread and post big posts, because it makes easier to people analyse what I say. I'm still improving on the formatting so I makes easier. I'm doing my best to be clear to town, clear to any analyses, but still there are people saying that I look scummy for that. I can't really understand why. Then in the following many muchos hours. GlowingBear keeps referring back to his post about ExO, Robik and Eden. Why? Is it because he still thinks these 2 teams are the scumteams? I dare you. Who are the scummers in GlowingBear his mind right now? Tell me? You can't. Now I also skimmed HaruRh his posts and I don't see much scumhunting there as well. Pretty sure he calls Robik town, I don't know about Eden. cba to look atm. I already know enough. ##vote: WeDemandALawyer
Look at this:
Now I also skimmed HaruRh his posts and I don't see much scumhunting there as well. Pretty sure he calls Robik town, I don't know about Eden. cba to look atm. I already know enough.
So basically, Koshi's 'scumread' is ONLY based on glowingbear. Which were mostly outdated and rubbish. Like this:
GlowingBear has shown activeness through pages 1 to 45. These 2 quotes come from the bottom of his first first page of filter. How can you be active in the first 35 pages of the game, say you will make cases when you return in 4 hours, and then when you return you are totally lost because there are 10 more pages to read? What is the difference between 35 pages or 45 pages?
To me this looks like a scum showing activity in the early game but not thinking about the game. Then after being pressured to give reads (also by his own teammate HaruRh: "GlowingBears reads are amazing, just wait on them") he says he will do it in 4 hours, but when trying to come up with reads failing horribly.
This read is bad because it is saying 'yea glowingbear is active, but doesn't seem to be active, so is scum' <-?????
So this read post is 13 hours later then when he promised he was going to provide reads. But Glowingbear doesn't get further then the page he was on when he promised these reads. These reads all date back to page 35. Now if we look at the actual content in this post there is only something on sqrt, and it has nothing to do with scumhunting. It's just sqrt is being friendly and on the sidelines. Which is exactly how Glowingbear is playing tbh, this is the first post that contains any form of reads and we are 50 pages far.
There is nothing on Alakaslam. From reading the Alakaslam filter GlowingBear quoted a post about Alakaslam saying "Hi". That's it. I don't even know what to say about that except that it isn't a townie looking to figure out Alakaslam his alignment. HaruRh makes it look like GlowingBear was pretty good in previous games at scumhunting, I haven't checked this but if GlowingBear did find scum. He probable didn't do it by analysing "Hi" posts.
So in this post he against promises reads for 3 other people. I am seeing a pattern here. GlowingBear keep getting behind on the thread and then by catching up he doesn't have to play in the moment. He just gives himself time to make outdated posts. In theory this is already 100% scummy, but forgivable if the reads would help the game forward. Or in the very least attempt to do so:
NOTHING TO DO WITH SCUMHUNTING
NOTHING TO DO
NOTHING
So, although I'm not sure if alakaslam is not contributing more because he, at the time, didn't have enough food on anybody, and although he doesn't have an overly friendly behavior like sqrt, this lack of contribution fits sqrt's attitude until now.
Slam gotta do better to change my vote.
NOT-
Then in the following many muchos hours. GlowingBear keeps referring back to his post about ExO, Robik and Eden. Why? Is it because he still thinks these 2 teams are the scumteams? I dare you. Who are the scummers in GlowingBear his mind right now? Tell me? You can't.
So when someone is attacking you, you ignore them? #koshiTownMeta?
Haru The Judge's final Rating:
Mostly incorrect information, read is only based on one player. Nope. Still bad.
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someone cliffnotes the above two posts because im not reading them
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i had to hit page down 7 times from the start of them to my post which is about 4 more times than my attention span is willing to allow
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On July 15 2014 12:49 Eden1892 wrote:
someone cliffnotes the above two posts because im not reading them
Just read my red tl;dr notes
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so are rayn and/or koshi scum
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Haru -
about rayn: how did you get that tl;dr... ya the palmar town thing i get (not that THAT helps, we already know that)
but where did you get this from:
Robik is stupid
CR is town/learnt to play mafia
Eden not scum (unless we are scum)
actually good catch though that rayn said nothing about you guys in that whole post then suddenly called you guys mafia. however slendy had been talking about you guys for quite a while.
about koshi: disagree wholly
at that point i honestly could not have told you who i thought glowingbear believed to be mafia.
and just because it's on one head of the hydra doesn't make it invalid.
speaking of wihch i need to unvote them...
##unvote
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On July 15 2014 06:48 OnceKing wrote:
Bunnies when you get back explain why you are tinfoiling on Eden and me please
On July 15 2014 09:07 OnceKing wrote:
gb did you ever explain why rayn's posting is confirming your suspicions of slender? they actually make me feel better about him
human beings in a mob man...
these two questions need answering
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.banfiwines.com/wp-content/uploa...on-670x390.jpg)
