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Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 19 2014 17:01 GMT
#511
I don't think scum ever shoots for wifom. It hasn't happened in my experience.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 19 2014 17:19 GMT
#514
On June 20 2014 02:05 slOosh wrote:
You know what I mean. Trying to extrapolate information about the night kill is not a particularly reasonable endeavour.

Current thoughts on VE?

I think it gives extra reason to check out karma's filter though. I skimmed through his filter and saw he was after BH (until he decided to give him a day) and VE.

Haven't read VE in depth. Saw the case on mderg but I skipped it for the time being as I haven't had much time so far. I'm not sure why his read on me developed the way it did. He seems to have gone from townreading me to (sort of?) scumreading me whereas you and Lazer have gone through he opposite evolution. He seems very detached. I'm hesitant to throw him under the train tracks too quickly though, he's been a frequent mislynch.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 19 2014 23:01 GMT
#556
VE/mderg case thing is giving me a headache. I don't think poor reasoning makes mderg mafia, though I like the point about how his read development doesn't make sense. However, this is compensated by the way how he replied to someone defending him. I like that he disagreed with someone that was defending him and see this as something mafia wouldn't do very quickly. That makes me pretty hesitant to vote for him right now. Also, can you explain how your read on me developed? I really don't understand how you townread me early, then switched it to a scumread when I feel like my later Day 1 was much more obvtown than early on.

BH/Koshi please do pro town stuff if you're town. That'd be nice.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 08:33 GMT
#569
BH, do you believe you're playing towards your win condition?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 09:01 GMT
#572
On June 20 2014 17:38 YouKnowZhou wrote:
So, Artanis[Xp], not only am I playing towards my wincon, I'm one of the few people who really does.

That's all I needed to know. You've spent the very little time you've had cracking jokes and making that post rather than trying to do anything useful.
##vote YouKnowZhou
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 09:05 GMT
#574
A) You've had very little time to spend on the thread, presumably since the end of Day 1 as you did post a decent bit before that.
B) You've spent it making promises or arguing about things that are not related to catching mafia or getting reads.
C) You claim to not be playing against your win condition.
B and C are contradictory if your alignment is in fact town.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 09:11 GMT
#576
Yeah, that counts under making promises.
I don't understand why you keep spending time replying to these posts if your time is limited. It's not helping me get a read on you, and I doubt it's helping you get a read on me. Get to your supposedly legendary case.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 09:52 GMT
#582
slOosh, you were scumbuddies with mderg in Detention. Do you feel he's playing similarly in this game?
BH, you were the host that game. What do you recall of his play and do you see similarities?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 09:56 GMT
#584
On June 20 2014 18:54 YouKnowZhou wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2014 18:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
slOosh, you were scumbuddies with mderg in Detention. Do you feel he's playing similarly in this game?
BH, you were the host that game. What do you recall of his play and do you see similarities?

What do you think of my case?

It's made me heavily doubt mderg's alignment, but it hasn't convinced me yet, ergo I'm looking for how he usually plays as scum/town for comparison.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 10:04 GMT
#587
There's one post from Detention that looks a little bit like the post he's made here, but it happened far later in the game and didn't include a vote at the end.
+ Show Spoiler +
On June 04 2014 22:18 mderg wrote:
I don´t think discussing the setup will really bring us further. It should be clear that blues should claim before lylo because that confirms them since scum can´t counterclaim.


I had fuba as town after day 2 but after that he kinda chose to disappear. This is strange, especially because he was against lynching sloosh. I think that you should put in more work than just voting on the main bandwagon after you vehemently opposed lynching scum.

I get a townie feeling from sqrt, I don´t really agree with everything he says but it definitely feels like he is trying to figure out the game. He´s active and questioning things, so i´d say he´s probably town.

I´m not really sure about Palmar, he´s been playing pretty lazy but not to an extreme. He´s definitely capable of doing that as town but it felt like he was not even trying to look beyond the MZ lynch which was odd.

HaruRH was quite active the last few days and seems to be trying to solve the game. His plan of lynching sloosh´s scumlist is based is strange, though. It has solid reasoning behind it but it hugely based on assumptions about sloosh´s intentions. Coincidentally I don´t think HaruRH was on that list. I´m still leaning town on him but this is definitely in the back of my mind.

Slam is a mystery to me. His posts make sense but I feel like he is not pushing his reads at all. He´s null for me.

Amiko is most likely town. I don´t see any way he can be scum.


Also I think the MZ lynch was very detrimental for us. There was a lack of good discussion and it´s difficult to get good reads based on that lynch.

Mderg played town in Cell Mini II, but I admit that I hosted pretty much the same way you did so I don't recall too much of how he played in detail either. Reading through the mafia qt of Detention though mderg seemed a lot more calculated in it than he's being this game. He discussed who to chase with his mafia buddies before going after them. He mentioned working on a post for 5 hours which suggests he cares a lot about how he appears, something he hasn't really done this game at all. If he did, that post would've never happened. I'm going through cell mini now to see if he made similarly poorly thought out posts there.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 10:17 GMT
#590
BH, I'm not a newbie player. I know that similarities does not necessarily mean the same alignment, but previous games can give you insights into their mind. Particularly a scum qt can be enlightening. It told me mderg is someone that thinks before he posts as scum, which is a point against him being scum this game.

I'm not up for a mderg lynch at this point in time. I am up for a Koshi lynch though.
##Unvote
##Vote Koshi
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 15:41 GMT
#600
Koshi, you hate playing scum whereas you like playing town. You're not playing right now, therefore I'm quite happy to vote you.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 16:09 GMT
#606
On June 21 2014 00:48 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2014 00:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Koshi, you hate playing scum whereas you like playing town. You're not playing right now, therefore I'm quite happy to vote you.

I am playing right now. But instead of engaging me you are pushing me away. Why? What do you want from me? Everything I have to say is in the thread already. What is missing?

No, you're not doing anything. You're parroting BH then peacing out without asking any questions or having any followups on your questions at the end of D1. I'm not going to do your work for you. That wouldn't help me to get a read on you.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 16:47 GMT
#610
VE, you feel like BH's case is scum on scum or how do you see it?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 20:20 GMT
#625
On June 21 2014 05:10 slOosh wrote:
Artanis, why don't you want to vote YKZ?

I thought his case was pretty decent.

I feel like my reads are utter shit this game though, so just gonna go and sheep you.
##Unvote
##Vote YouKnowZhou
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 21:46 GMT
#648
[insert whine about Release wall of text here]
Chez, YKZ has 5 votes since the last vote count, VE and mderg both have 2, Koshi has 1. Snickers and myself switched.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 21:54 GMT
#652
Looking at the first post Release quoted of Snickers, it reminds me of mderg's post but it looks worse to me. Mderg's post mentioned all relevant posts whereas Snickers goes off giving null reads on people who hardly posted so far. What's also interesting is how Snickers changed his read on you after momentum swung in favour of that read, with VE and goodkarma chiming in, which is mighty coincidental. It's unfortunate that he's a smurf/new player so I can't check meta
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 22:00 GMT
#656
On June 21 2014 06:58 YouKnowZhou wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2014 06:54 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Looking at the first post Release quoted of Snickers, it reminds me of mderg's post but it looks worse to me. Mderg's post mentioned all relevant posts whereas Snickers goes off giving null reads on people who hardly posted so far. What's also interesting is how Snickers changed his read on you after momentum swung in favour of that read, with VE and goodkarma chiming in, which is mighty coincidental. It's unfortunate that he's a smurf/new player so I can't check meta


As I mentioned, I do want to lynch Snickers. I like the Release case but I doubt there's any real way to make Snickers happen over me today. I'd prefer mderg; I think he's more likely to flip town; but the inconsistencies that Release has pointed out make Snickers a more acceptable lynch today. Artanis, would you lynch Snickers today?

I probably would.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 22:10 GMT
#659
On June 21 2014 07:04 YouKnowZhou wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2014 07:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:58 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:54 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Looking at the first post Release quoted of Snickers, it reminds me of mderg's post but it looks worse to me. Mderg's post mentioned all relevant posts whereas Snickers goes off giving null reads on people who hardly posted so far. What's also interesting is how Snickers changed his read on you after momentum swung in favour of that read, with VE and goodkarma chiming in, which is mighty coincidental. It's unfortunate that he's a smurf/new player so I can't check meta


As I mentioned, I do want to lynch Snickers. I like the Release case but I doubt there's any real way to make Snickers happen over me today. I'd prefer mderg; I think he's more likely to flip town; but the inconsistencies that Release has pointed out make Snickers a more acceptable lynch today. Artanis, would you lynch Snickers today?

I probably would.


Even with the two of us together, it's just 2 votes on Snicks, which isn't any better than the 2 votes on mderg, whom I would rather lynch. Release isn't voting Snicks, so I'd rather keep my vote on mderg. If it turns out lynching Snicks becomes a real possibilty (ie Release votes him etc) then I'm on board, but until then I think mderg is a better choice. I'll see if I can find stuff in mderg's later filter that might be more convincing.

Aside from the fact that it seems mderg wouldn't make this mistake as scum since he was more careful in the previous game, do you have any other hesitations about him being scum? Or is the case itself just not convincing enough, hesitations nonwithstanding?

There's been a lot of things that made me think of mderg as town. The way he had the same idea about 27nb's reasons for reading me as town, the meta, the way he commented on all relevant things when he entered the thread and got straight to the point all felt townie to me. From the two games I read of him, I felt he played worse when he was town than when he was scum. I don't feel the current cases are convincing of him being scum, but rather of him playing poorly, which I would sooner attribute to him being town. The carefulness factors into that.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12973 Posts
June 20 2014 22:15 GMT
#661
I'm still on the market for lynching Koshi. A triple lynch today would be nice honestly.
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