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On December 10 2013 07:16 Corazon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:13 Xatalos wrote:On December 10 2013 07:06 Corazon wrote:On December 10 2013 07:01 Xatalos wrote:On December 10 2013 06:53 Corazon wrote:
Lol can I go one game without being the first one voted.
Do you guys really think I'm more scummy at this point than Spag and Slam? I'm being open and honest with all of you. I'm not hiding anything. I've always tried to be genuine and not put up façades or wear masks. I'm telling you that I was going to be busy and I told you how I felt coming into this game. If you guys want to call me scum for that, go ahead. But just know that it is really silly to call me scum when Slam and Spag made one post and peaced out. Spag had to be coerced back into the thread and Slam still hasn't come back.
Plutarch wasn't trying to prod me for discussion; he was trying to twist my words and call me scum. Holyflare is just piggybacking off of everyone else's arguments to take town credit.
If you guys would look into the game, you would see that I am far from the scummiest player here. Also, it is good to know that you are all down for pressure voting so now I don't have to take your votes seriously until very close to the deadline. Sweet. Spagetticus and Alakaslam certainly didn't start in a townish way. But I have to ask which is worse: weak non-contribution (them) or passable non-contribution (you)? "passable non-contribution" doesn't exist. Your logic is flawed. My first post was contribution. You can call me out on it later if I contradict myself. You can't call Slam and Spag out on anything that they wrote in their first posts. Maybe the better choice of words would have been "a semi-contribution" - as in throwing a tiny contribution to the thread in hopes of people glancing over it and deeming it as a passable contribution. I think being the first real post with substance and allowing for discussion is a good contribution. If I wanted people to glance over it, I would not have been the first one to post it. I would wait until someone else was taking heat in order to make my entrance to the thread in such a way. Another point of bad logic.
I wouldn't call your first post as "real substance". Even "tiny contribution" is a favorable word for that post...
With that said, it's true that Mafia would probably prefer to wait a bit longer before making a post like that. You definitely brought attention on yourself with it (for good reason).
You've been playing entirely reactionary after that first "contribution", though. Do you have anything new to add so far?
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On December 10 2013 07:54 Alakaslam wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:51 Xatalos wrote:
Spaghetticus, I see you asking a lot of questions. Do you have opinions of your own so far? About me, Corazon, Alakaslam, for example? He is too busy chewin' ICE he is too dainty for fingernailz
The same question could be addressed to you, by the way...
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XATALOS
I TOO SUSPICIOUS THAT U IZ THANATOS
YOU SHALL BE UNDER THIS!
##Unvote
##Vote: Xatalos
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United Kingdom30775 Posts
On December 10 2013 07:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:36 LSB wrote:On December 10 2013 07:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:21 LSB wrote:On December 10 2013 07:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:17 LSB wrote:
I think we need to calm down. My "townie on townie day 1 shitstorm" sense is tingling.
That speaking, oddly enough it does encourage a Xatalos lynch Whom do you feel are townies from this and why? It hasn't really been one on one. It's been HF and Xatalos against Cora, and myself, Alakaslam and you against Xatalos. If you feel it's townie on townie, then you'd think Xatalos was town. So far I think I am townie, I haven't really thought past that. I just don't think this day 1 attitude is gonna be very productive. The whole entire Xatalos suspicion does require a meta read on Xatalos to see if he is brilliant enough to try for the plan on day 1, or does he just play like this. I just skimmed through the filter he linked and I don't think it looks like the start of this game at all. He's far more aggressive here. What were you trying to say exactly with your initial post if you didn't mean to give anyone a town read but yourself? I'm confused. I don't think a plan other than "starting shit" is required for scum. That's always a good thing. In my opinion natural scum play is to stay low, especially on day 1, the town tends to self destruct anyways day 1. This whole entire "starting shit" strat is actually pretty good, even though it is counterintuitive to the idea of trying to not draw attention. Thus I assumed this strat is not very obvious, especially since I personally never considered it. This is all pure speculation. Something more grounded is that Xatalos is definably acting very different from before, and in my eyes less of a townie I don't feel like Xatalos put himself in the spotlight as much as trying to put others in the spotlight. Corazon put himself in the spotlight without any scum gain. When you look at his post from a scum point of view, it doesn't make sense for them to make it. I can see a scum agenda behind Xatalos' posts. That said, I do like his view on my pressure on him in that it was nuanced rather than trying to score town points. The rest of the day should provide more information. Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:36 Holyflare wrote:Nobody going to discuss cora's mindset or are you going to dismiss it outright for xantos discussion some more? On December 10 2013 06:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Holy, I don't feel like his response is that different. I also don't think he'd put himself out there so much at the start of the game. No reason to draw attention to yourself like that as scum. Given you quoted me I take it you'd like a response from me? I don't find Corazon scummy at this point in time because he drew attention to himself without any scum benefit.
Is it not also a scum mindset to heavily defend themselves when attacked, unnaturally so? Also while defending themselves to then deflect upon another person? Why are you only looking for the people that are "starting shit"? I only know a few scum that play that way. Have you any scum meta on Xatalos that suggests he plays like he is?
I don't like how you're so dismissive over cora without discussion when with Xantos you skim the filters to discuss him further.
On December 10 2013 06:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Holy, I don't feel like his response is that different. I also don't think he'd put himself out there so much at the start of the game. No reason to draw attention to yourself like that as scum.
On December 10 2013 07:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:21 LSB wrote:On December 10 2013 07:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:17 LSB wrote:
I think we need to calm down. My "townie on townie day 1 shitstorm" sense is tingling.
That speaking, oddly enough it does encourage a Xatalos lynch Whom do you feel are townies from this and why? It hasn't really been one on one. It's been HF and Xatalos against Cora, and myself, Alakaslam and you against Xatalos. If you feel it's townie on townie, then you'd think Xatalos was town. So far I think I am townie, I haven't really thought past that. I just don't think this day 1 attitude is gonna be very productive. The whole entire Xatalos suspicion does require a meta read on Xatalos to see if he is brilliant enough to try for the plan on day 1, or does he just play like this. I just skimmed through the filter he linked and I don't think it looks like the start of this game at all. He's far more aggressive here. What were you trying to say exactly with your initial post if you didn't mean to give anyone a town read but yourself? I'm confused. I don't think a plan other than "starting shit" is required for scum. That's always a good thing.
Look at the difference between these two points - on the one hand (cora) is dismissed by saying "I don't think scum plays that way" whereas the second (Xatalos) is "I have skimmed it briefly and think it's different because X,Y,Z. Question, question.
_____________________________
In regards to the point that you made about cora, I don't think he's "putting himself out there" like you suggest, he said that he couldn't dedicate some time towards the game but would still post actively and got picked up on it and was like OMGNUUWRONGRAWRRR!!!!!! and then didn't discuss why with people further or indicate that he had reads on other people because of what happened. He left the thread and then returned when people started mentioning Xatalos and piggybacked upon that with no new reasoning other than what people had said before. He mentions how people in the thread were piggybacking previously (me, etc.) and had qualms with them but then does the same thing here:
On December 10 2013 07:10 Corazon wrote:
I do feel like Slam was right as well. If Xatalos was using good logic and pushing me like a townie, I wouldn't have a problem with him. However, he is using faulty logic on purpose and trying to pass it off as correct when in fact his conclusions only come about because he needs to fake pressure on me.
This is contradictary with his previous approach of disliking people that piggybacking and is essentially +1ing another players points.
Take this in B2B for example, people had a bad read on him and he DISCUSSED why it was bad:
On November 21 2013 01:00 Corazon wrote:
When did I say that sciberia was bad town? Please find a post where I said he was bad town.
I didn't vote for sciberia because 0% of wagons in the first 2 hours of a game actually get to the deadline? None. What is the point of vote-jumping? It just allows people to skim my cases once they see the bold vote and only really look at it once it's my turn to be under the gun. Voting for people at this stage is pretty useless because it's not going to get a lynch going. I guarantee you that our reads and opinions are going to change before the deadline and it's useless to lock yourself in (or at least making a statement saying you are going to) 2 hours into a game.
That case was confirmation bias because you took 1-2 decent points about me (which alone are not enough to justify a vote or my lynching) and then supplemented them with saying "Corazon is doing stuff that he always does in every game, he has to be scum for it in this one".
He mentions WHY the case was bad etc etc, discusses it and outlines why he thinks it was bad croming from X player. Where is that here? It was a dissmissal of a case from me and a sheep onto townish consesus Xatalos.
__________________________________________
I don't like how these things are most definitely brushed off for simplicity that "I don't think scum do this" when there is a body of evidence that suggests a player does not play like this. Vote Cora for best lynch.
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Slam is actively obfuscating his intentions with spam. I don't like.
Corazon is a candidate for lynch day one, I'm waiting to see how he responds.
I am suspicious of you, but I think that is more a product of you being in the spotlight rather than any real problems I've got with you so far. I will continue to pay attention to your responses.
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COME XATA
U CHEWS THE ICE NAO
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On December 10 2013 08:04 Spaghetticus wrote:
Slam is actively obfuscating his intentions with spam. I don't like.
Corazon is a candidate for lynch day one, I'm waiting to see how he responds.
I am suspicious of you, but I think that is more a product of you being in the spotlight rather than any real problems I've got with you so far. I will continue to pay attention to your responses.
HAI
Do you like Ice?
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On December 10 2013 08:07 Spaghetticus wrote:
##vote:Alakaslam
Yes, yes you do
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On December 10 2013 08:01 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:36 LSB wrote:On December 10 2013 07:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:21 LSB wrote:On December 10 2013 07:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:17 LSB wrote:
I think we need to calm down. My "townie on townie day 1 shitstorm" sense is tingling.
That speaking, oddly enough it does encourage a Xatalos lynch Whom do you feel are townies from this and why? It hasn't really been one on one. It's been HF and Xatalos against Cora, and myself, Alakaslam and you against Xatalos. If you feel it's townie on townie, then you'd think Xatalos was town. So far I think I am townie, I haven't really thought past that. I just don't think this day 1 attitude is gonna be very productive. The whole entire Xatalos suspicion does require a meta read on Xatalos to see if he is brilliant enough to try for the plan on day 1, or does he just play like this. I just skimmed through the filter he linked and I don't think it looks like the start of this game at all. He's far more aggressive here. What were you trying to say exactly with your initial post if you didn't mean to give anyone a town read but yourself? I'm confused. I don't think a plan other than "starting shit" is required for scum. That's always a good thing. In my opinion natural scum play is to stay low, especially on day 1, the town tends to self destruct anyways day 1. This whole entire "starting shit" strat is actually pretty good, even though it is counterintuitive to the idea of trying to not draw attention. Thus I assumed this strat is not very obvious, especially since I personally never considered it. This is all pure speculation. Something more grounded is that Xatalos is definably acting very different from before, and in my eyes less of a townie I don't feel like Xatalos put himself in the spotlight as much as trying to put others in the spotlight. Corazon put himself in the spotlight without any scum gain. When you look at his post from a scum point of view, it doesn't make sense for them to make it. I can see a scum agenda behind Xatalos' posts. That said, I do like his view on my pressure on him in that it was nuanced rather than trying to score town points. The rest of the day should provide more information. On December 10 2013 07:36 Holyflare wrote:Nobody going to discuss cora's mindset or are you going to dismiss it outright for xantos discussion some more? On December 10 2013 06:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Holy, I don't feel like his response is that different. I also don't think he'd put himself out there so much at the start of the game. No reason to draw attention to yourself like that as scum. Given you quoted me I take it you'd like a response from me? I don't find Corazon scummy at this point in time because he drew attention to himself without any scum benefit. Is it not also a scum mindset to heavily defend themselves when attacked, unnaturally so? Also while defending themselves to then deflect upon another person? Why are you only looking for the people that are "starting shit"? I only know a few scum that play that way. Have you any scum meta on Xatalos that suggests he plays like he is? I don't like how you're so dismissive over cora without discussion when with Xantos you skim the filters to discuss him further. Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 06:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Holy, I don't feel like his response is that different. I also don't think he'd put himself out there so much at the start of the game. No reason to draw attention to yourself like that as scum. Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:21 LSB wrote:On December 10 2013 07:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On December 10 2013 07:17 LSB wrote:
I think we need to calm down. My "townie on townie day 1 shitstorm" sense is tingling.
That speaking, oddly enough it does encourage a Xatalos lynch Whom do you feel are townies from this and why? It hasn't really been one on one. It's been HF and Xatalos against Cora, and myself, Alakaslam and you against Xatalos. If you feel it's townie on townie, then you'd think Xatalos was town. So far I think I am townie, I haven't really thought past that. I just don't think this day 1 attitude is gonna be very productive. The whole entire Xatalos suspicion does require a meta read on Xatalos to see if he is brilliant enough to try for the plan on day 1, or does he just play like this. I just skimmed through the filter he linked and I don't think it looks like the start of this game at all. He's far more aggressive here. What were you trying to say exactly with your initial post if you didn't mean to give anyone a town read but yourself? I'm confused. I don't think a plan other than "starting shit" is required for scum. That's always a good thing. Look at the difference between these two points - on the one hand (cora) is dismissed by saying "I don't think scum plays that way" whereas the second (Xatalos) is "I have skimmed it briefly and think it's different because X,Y,Z. Question, question. _____________________________ In regards to the point that you made about cora, I don't think he's "putting himself out there" like you suggest, he said that he couldn't dedicate some time towards the game but would still post actively and got picked up on it and was like OMGNUUWRONGRAWRRR!!!!!! and then didn't discuss why with people further or indicate that he had reads on other people because of what happened. He left the thread and then returned when people started mentioning Xatalos and piggybacked upon that with no new reasoning other than what people had said before. He mentions how people in the thread were piggybacking previously (me, etc.) and had qualms with them but then does the same thing here: Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:10 Corazon wrote:
I do feel like Slam was right as well. If Xatalos was using good logic and pushing me like a townie, I wouldn't have a problem with him. However, he is using faulty logic on purpose and trying to pass it off as correct when in fact his conclusions only come about because he needs to fake pressure on me. This is contradictary with his previous approach of disliking people that piggybacking and is essentially +1ing another players points. Take this in B2B for example, people had a bad read on him and he DISCUSSED why it was bad: Show nested quote +On November 21 2013 01:00 Corazon wrote:
When did I say that sciberia was bad town? Please find a post where I said he was bad town.
I didn't vote for sciberia because 0% of wagons in the first 2 hours of a game actually get to the deadline? None. What is the point of vote-jumping? It just allows people to skim my cases once they see the bold vote and only really look at it once it's my turn to be under the gun. Voting for people at this stage is pretty useless because it's not going to get a lynch going. I guarantee you that our reads and opinions are going to change before the deadline and it's useless to lock yourself in (or at least making a statement saying you are going to) 2 hours into a game.
That case was confirmation bias because you took 1-2 decent points about me (which alone are not enough to justify a vote or my lynching) and then supplemented them with saying "Corazon is doing stuff that he always does in every game, he has to be scum for it in this one". He mentions WHY the case was bad etc etc, discusses it and outlines why he thinks it was bad croming from X player. Where is that here? It was a dissmissal of a case from me and a sheep onto townish consesus Xatalos. __________________________________________ I don't like how these things are most definitely brushed off for simplicity that "I don't think scum do this" when there is a body of evidence that suggests a player does not play like this. Vote Cora for best lynch.
These are definitely some good points. It's surely premature to declare Corazon as today's lynch, but it would be a good pick in the current situation.
I dislike Artanis's dismissal of Corazon's play as well, but I doubt Artanis and Corazon would be scum together. It would seem risky to make a connection like that. That's WIFOM, though.
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Flares are warm, and are useful in times of trouble
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On December 10 2013 08:04 Spaghetticus wrote:
Slam is actively obfuscating his intentions with spam. I don't like.
Corazon is a candidate for lynch day one, I'm waiting to see how he responds.
I am suspicious of you, but I think that is more a product of you being in the spotlight rather than any real problems I've got with you so far. I will continue to pay attention to your responses.
Hmm, okay. When you say you don't "like", do you mean as in scummy or annoying?
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I dislike Artanis's dismissal of Corazon's play as well, but I doubt Artanis and Corazon would be scum together. It would seem risky to make a connection like that. That's WIFOM, though.
Please stick to sequential reasoning. Once we've caught one we can start talking about who is and isn't connected to who. #freetips
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On December 10 2013 08:12 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 08:04 Spaghetticus wrote:
Slam is actively obfuscating his intentions with spam. I don't like.
Corazon is a candidate for lynch day one, I'm waiting to see how he responds.
I am suspicious of you, but I think that is more a product of you being in the spotlight rather than any real problems I've got with you so far. I will continue to pay attention to your responses. Hmm, okay. When you say you don't "like", do you mean as in scummy or annoying?
Dunno, Thanatos.
What do you think?
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On December 10 2013 08:15 Alakaslam wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 08:12 Xatalos wrote:On December 10 2013 08:04 Spaghetticus wrote:
Slam is actively obfuscating his intentions with spam. I don't like.
Corazon is a candidate for lynch day one, I'm waiting to see how he responds.
I am suspicious of you, but I think that is more a product of you being in the spotlight rather than any real problems I've got with you so far. I will continue to pay attention to your responses. Hmm, okay. When you say you don't "like", do you mean as in scummy or annoying? Dunno, Thanatos. What do you think?
Judging by his vote, probably scummy. But it could be just an empty vote, I guess.
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On December 10 2013 08:12 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 08:04 Spaghetticus wrote:
Slam is actively obfuscating his intentions with spam. I don't like.
Corazon is a candidate for lynch day one, I'm waiting to see how he responds.
I am suspicious of you, but I think that is more a product of you being in the spotlight rather than any real problems I've got with you so far. I will continue to pay attention to your responses. Hmm, okay. When you say you don't "like", do you mean as in scummy or annoying?
Both.
It's pissing me right off.
He's microing his meta rather than attempting to even look town.
I don't think it's really worth discussing but...
- I don't like it.
- It's not helping town
- It's cheap
- It's essentially 'active' lurking
- it clogs up the thread
- I want him to stop
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Yes I am moody, and no I have not had much sleep.
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On December 10 2013 08:16 Spaghetticus wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 08:12 Xatalos wrote:On December 10 2013 08:04 Spaghetticus wrote:
Slam is actively obfuscating his intentions with spam. I don't like.
Corazon is a candidate for lynch day one, I'm waiting to see how he responds.
I am suspicious of you, but I think that is more a product of you being in the spotlight rather than any real problems I've got with you so far. I will continue to pay attention to your responses. Hmm, okay. When you say you don't "like", do you mean as in scummy or annoying? Both. It's pissing me right off. He's microing his meta rather than attempting to even look town. I don't think it's really worth discussing but... - I don't like it. - It's not helping town - It's cheap - It's essentially 'active' lurking - it clogs up the thread - I want him to stop
-You fear the heat of the south
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On December 10 2013 07:20 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2013 07:18 Alakaslam wrote:On December 10 2013 07:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:On December 10 2013 06:44 purpletrator wrote:On December 10 2013 06:43 LSB wrote:
##Vote: purpletrator
Scum are mafia pretending to be someone else.
Smurfs are players pretending to be someone else.
Smurfs = Mafia.
Flawless mafia. Lynch all Smurfs You could at least start in alphabetical order. What if I reveal my identity? Would you change your vote to a different smurf? Worst post in thread. ##Vote: purpletrator Kusplain? Hello sir, I promise not to get mad at you this game If purpletrator can reasonably explain what he is going to achieve with that post i'm going to unvote. Now i gotta sleep! cya tomorrow. Please don't be useless Alakaslam ok?
By the way... rayn, what are you doing? I thought you were going to be one of the most contributive players here. I hope it'll get better from here... Otherwise you're probably scum.
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EPT
