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Aquanim
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What is your opinion of this case from Mocsta? | ||
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I didn't notice that at least two of the quote which Onegu claims illustrate Mocsta's changing opinion... are in fact quotes of me. Obviously my opinion is different to Mocsta's... (This may have been brought up already.) The problem with Onegu's cases is that they're so bloated that it's impossible to reply to them and dissect them without making a horrendously large post that nobody's going to read. | ||
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Aquanim
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+ Show Spoiler + These are just a few of mocstas scum hunting, yes this is null null apparently. moving on. We also keep getting post like this all through the game, mocsta really like trying to make friends with thrawn According to Corazon thrawn was buddying mocsta. In my opinion they both know the other's town and they're working together. Not seeing this PoV of Onegu at all. I also want to point out this post and a few more that follow it or come right before this post, this is important because this is one of the main reasons why he was fine to policy lynch rayn. Even in this post we have a good town atmosphere but he takes a dig at me WTF. If the atmosphere is so go why does he need to take a dig at me it just doesn't make sense, Im not the type of person to take the bait but if I was he could then say he was ok to policy lynch me because I attacked him. this is pretty rambling, but I think the point is that mocsta took a dig at onegu. This is what mocsta does. Deal with it. That whole thing about "scum slips" and whatever Poorly chosen words at best. Not scum indicative. Here he says Cora's case on Sciberia was bad, but he is town for it. Later he will say the exact opposite for voting Cora. yeah Onegu quoted me here lol, this wasn't mocsta's opinion at all Votes Aqua for Thrawns reason. Sure he gave his own reasons on why Aqua is scum go read them I quoted them, tell me if you think they are legit reasons or not. I thought this was believable from Mocsta at the time, being on the receiving end of that vote. That "quote of the day" thing is the kind of thing town Mocsta votes over. A few posts later from where he calls cora town for his bad case now he cant see a pro town reason for it. Again a quote from me rather than Mocsta Soft defends Rean here. Mocsta raised a quite valid point about my approach to pressuring Rean, not "soft defending" him at all. Mocsta wasn't questioning my read, he was questioning whether I should have let it lie longer in order to gather more evidence. Likes a post from Jamp. So???!??!? Here he unvotes Aqua because he likes how he didnt push me. But somehow he ignores the possibility that we could be scum together. Why because he knows we arent. This unvote reason it terrible. Actually if you read Mocsta's post he DOESN'T like how I didn't push you. Are you even reading Mocsta's posts? But here is also where it gets interesting, He gives town reads for Rayn, Bereft, , Aqua, me, and cora. His scum reads are Sciberia, Rean, and Jamp. Before this he has had rean as a town read, Sciberia as null, and Jamp as he liked his posts. The only reason he gives for these read changes are mine and he doesnt see me doing what I did as scum. And Aqua who he had as scum for a long time and had just unvoted. His reason? Open and Transparent I don't see why mocsta should justify each and every one of his read shifts. Hell, changing his mind about me probably implicitly changed his mind about rean... Suffice it to say his reads made sense to me at the time so I'm not worried. Still no reasons still no reason to post reasons This is the only reason he gives for his scum reads and atually read it. It is mostly meta, and promoting a negative thread attitude, but read his filter he isnt doing that at all, and it is subjective if he is or isnt any way not a reason to call someone scum. I don't see how being "subjective" means Mocsta can't think Sciberbia's scum for that reason. I think Mocsta hadn't fully understood Sciberbia's posting (reflected in his revision to this read later once he had a better idea) but revising his reads does not make mocsta scum. A few posts later his reads change once again. so? reads change. Here is where mocsta says he is ok with a HF lynch, but he gives no reason for it. He then votes rayn because rayn Martyred. HF had done basically nothing, there were no possible reasons other than "no posts" which is obvious. Vote for Rayn was entirely understandable. Now jamp is scum with rayn. And his reason was jamp is holding on to the aqua thing when he let something go before. I have no idea how a few posts before jamp wasmt in your scum reads to scum partners with rayn because he follows up on Aquanim. The reasons mocsta gives for people being scum juat arent real reasons. this one was more "calling jampi out for a scummy attitude" rather than "calling jampi scum" if you understand how mocsta rolls Rayn drops his vote on jamp, mocsta who then has a scum read on jamp and who thinks is scumates with rayn, defends him calling his meta the same as his town meta for tunneling, which is what mocsta called him scum for doing on Aqua. Yes he says hes not 100% certain and it is ok to defend your scum read if you dont believe the reason they are being attacked by someone else, but mocsta called him scum because he was tunneled on Aqua. He gives meta reasons why he could be town for the same thing mocsta called him scum for. Entirely consistent with my own read on jampi at the time He shows his lynch list here again. Rean we have no idea what, HF for no idea why, and Rayn. And I dont understand why he asks cora the whole thing about staying by his scum read or lynching for info Pretty sure I understood why he wanted Rean at the time, HF for lurking, and Rayn for obvious reasons This is telling, he is ok to lynch bereft this cycle if what I say is true. But more importantly look what he says to thrawn when thrawn talks about looking to see if it is a town rayn. He isnt set if rayn is town or scum, just asking him questions while thinking about motive, but rayn still needs lynched, this just isnt something a townie says. This was something at least two townies said. Now before he even checks my facts, he gives big town points to bereft. So? If bereft did something townie is there a reason why Mocsta shouldn't observe that? I dont understand the point of this post, obviously refuseing to believe doesnt make it true, I was sleeping. Amd I really dont like people calling out other people who cant be here around deadline, it happens deal with it. irrelevant to mocsta's alignment. This is where he digs up the bereft things but conviently leaves out the post that links this all together. And now since I am misrepresenting bereft I am scum. I think you were entirely misrepresenting Bereft since I think Bereft's town and that Mocsta's position was at least understandable. I think some quotes are missing from the case here but whatever. Here is where he calls for policy, the same thing I pointed out with bereft, you are gunho on rayn is scum rayn is scum vote the scum, then all of a sudden you hide behind policy? Why do you feel you need to do this? The reason to say when rayn flips town, see im not sorry it was policy. No. Nonononono. He asked SCIBERBIA to policy lynch Rayn. Sciberbia didn't think rayn was scum, so if scib was to vote rayn it would HAVE to be for policy. Nothing wrong with this at all. The part he fails to mention is his reads on those players change, and he never explains those reads. Reads DO change, and he's not obliged to explain all of them all of the time whenever he says them. Again I have to ask what's your point? More town reads, but now I am scum, and I fanned the flames. Now I wasnt around so what flames did I fan? I dont understand this. He is making shit up for me to look bad that is what is going on. I don't know what mocsta was going on about here but sometimes he does run off on silly tangents as town. More read changes this time me and HF are scum. No reason on HF other than in a previous post I cant believe HF believes what he is writeing. And he compares something rean did in this game, to something I did in a different game to make rean look scummy. How can he believe what he is writeing? Still no reason needed on HF, and drawing analogies is perfectly fine. Look he calls out HF here for being like rayn and saying scumslip. Its stupid play. I direct you to the first post I put in my meat and potatoes part and open the spoiler and what do you see? Thats right mocsta saying cora and scib scumslipped. And rayn flipped town so calling out HF for this is so scummy, maybe he forgot he did it or thought people wouldnt see because hespoiled it, but I saw, I found it. this is just bullshit. 1) Mocsta forgot he did it before because it was UNIMPORTANT 2) rayn is hardly a model town player, playing like him is in fact stupid as town and desirable as scum 3) ..this is just ridiculous I'm out of words Oh yes this post, my favorite. JJD is still town. Bereft he doesnt know, but bereft did the same thing mocsta did the same thing with rany is scum, rayn is scum, its a policy lynch. And me ONEGU IS SCUM turned into onegu provided the missing piece on bereft but that is null because of formatting, into slight town read, with no explination at all... And then how in the hell did I ask him for forgivness? It hurts my head. Lynch mocsta please he is scum. Mocsta didn't give a town read on onegu in this post at all. Onegu again didn't understand Mocsta's post. (the grammar was a little frayed so a failure to understand is forgivable) Now he votes Jamp who was out of his scum team only a few posts ago, and his reasoning? There are scum in the actives but they can be figured out, and his tunnel on aqua, but when rayn voted him he provided meta defense this is town meta and that that wasnt enough to warrwnt a vote. jampidampi vote is fine, pressure Now he says he didnt think rayn was scum it was all policy, nope thats a lie called him scum all the way up then last few minutes said policy. doesn't actually contradict in any way the words mocsta used Please show me these reasons and the numerous times please can't be assed researching this Now I am full town yay!!! what's your point No more Jamp, no to take sciberia from his town pile into his vote. And check out these awesome reasons bad case (subjective) defended the guy who flipped town, and defending the person his scum read made a case on. Such scummy reasons not sure why Im not voteing for scib. again pressure, again fine Omg he goes from sciberia who was a town read as his vote, to JJD who was a town read and check out these reasons he delurked and thats it. Also now I went from town to he could vote me, and rean still not sure why he wants to vote rean since day 1... he's changing his mind in similar ways to what I was thinking day 2, not scummy Two posts later, HF is the best lych again what I was thinking Now he believes the doc claim.... AGAIN what I was thinking. exactly, in fact Makes a case on JJD and then this. suspicion of JJD was justified tl;dr Onegu has nothing on Mocsta and apparently didn't even read some of the posts he quoted. Extremely confirmation-biased. That being said I can see how Onegu might think some of this considering he wasn't in the thread at the time. It's much easier to read Mocsta when you're watching his play evolve with the thread, rather than looking at it afterwards. An observation of Mocsta's playstyle: Mocsta tends to post his knee-jerk reactions to the thread a lot. These are not necessarily consistent with his overall reads; but if he sees a scummy person post a towny post or a towny person post a scummy post Mocsta will typically call him out. Therefore, while when you look back at his filter it may appear somewhat contradictory, my feeling of what Mocsta's positions have actually been throughout this game (as opposed to trying to piece his positions together in retrospect) give me a town read on him. There Onegu, I read your case and I'm not impressed. (okay I see the mention of the quotes of me at the end, I remember seeing them mentioned at some point. Still... blleeeggg. Can you please work on consolidating your cases in the future) | ||
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Who to lynch tomorrow? My preference is Chezinu or Onegu. I'm pretty sure both of them are in the scumteam along with one of Holyflare/Alakaslam. The case on Jampidampi by Mocsta and the "scumslip" picked up by Thrawn is probably as close to a read on Chezinu as we're going to get, especially if Thrawn dies (since I'm pretty sure none of the rest of us have much prior experience with Chez). May as well flip that coin sooner rather than later. As for Onegu, this last tossup with Corazon has finally broken my credulity in just how few damns Onegu gives about this game. I honestly don't think there's any way he can have thought those two posts by Corazon were at the 2-hour mark if he's seriously analysing this game. His cases on Bereft and Mocsta could easily have been written by scum just pulling out post after post after post from their filters and saying the first damning-sounding thing which comes to mind. And while I was fooled by Onegu's indignation yesterday, I've been fooled by Onegu playing dumb before (see Newbie 43). I don't intend to let it happen again. You can lynch Onegu first to satisfy Corazon, if you like. As for Holyflare: - I have never seen him angry as town, but that's the vibe I'm getting here - I have never seen him this disinterested as town. Read page 4 of his filter, compare it to any town game he's played in the past, and tell me that this is a town Holyflare who is genuinely interested in pushing a lynch - He could claim to save somebody who aren't the two who scum kills. In that case, use your judgement. - Sure he hasn't played like this as scum before, but there's no reason to change his town meta into this and plenty of reason to change his scum meta (replaced into a scum team with lurkers, just plain doesn't want to even try to contribute) A quick aside re. Holyflare + Show Spoiler + If there's a save tonight obviously don't lynch Holy tomorrow, but still keep him on your radar. His play so far this game has been COMPLETELY unlike his town play, and maybe this is the scum team trying to protect Holy. It would explain their motive for having him claim in the first place. It does give us another mislynch so I think it would be poor play, but my opinion is hardly going to stop them... maybe, MAYBE he'll get off his ass and contribute now that the weekend's over. But I think he's just scum. (Having difficulty reconciling that with the doctor claim, but... frankly that doctor claim was a f***ing awful idea whatever his alignment, so I guess it being risky as scum isn't scum-indiciative.) Alakaslam I still gotta think about. If I die you're probably better off considering what he posts tomorrow rather than whatever thoughts I have now anyway. In the light of this claim I have no idea who scum will shoot. If they shoot me, good luck - you're gonna need it. (tl;dr I agree with sciberbia and mocsta, {Holyflare // Rean, Chezinu (jampi), Onegu}) Last-minute additions: Corazon's cop claim... gah. I don't see the point if he's scum. But damn it why did you claim so long before deadline? If the scum have a framer we could be led entirely up the garden path. I hope he's planning to check someone who isn't Onegu and was just claiming that to lead scum astray. I'd far prefer to see a check on Chezinu or even Holyflare than Onegu. Given how hard Corazon bashed on Holy for his claim I have hopes that Corazon has plans he hasn't revealed yet. | ||
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stop talking shit | ||
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Then again, looking at the trend in his profile if he survives N2 he's probably scum  | ||
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On December 03 2013 12:20 cDgCorazon wrote: This is still a point and this needs to be brought up again. This town sheeped way too much and didn't even listen to a good argument. No one read this case until I asked them too. No one tried to poke holes in it. They all just nodded and said we could lynch Onegu until thrawn said "JJD is scum lynch him" and everyone bows down to him and says "OMG THRAWN U R THE GREATEST MAFIA PLAYER EVAR OFC WE WILL LYNCH JJD" ...Corazon, what you've said might be true of the other players in this thread, I don't know what they did. I can only speak for myself. I read your Onegu case. I went and read Onegu's posts for myself. I went and read JarJar's posts for myself. Then I decided that JJD was the lynch more likely to flip scum. As it turns out, neither of them would have done so. I appreciate the effort you put into your case on Onegu, but putting effort in doesn't automatically make you right. Nor does it mean everyone should automatically sheep whoever puts the most effort into their cases (if that was the case, we'd have sheeped Onegu's cases. Can't say I agreed with them either, but there was an assload of effort involved there.) To play this game you have to understand that other people do not think the same way as you and may disagree with you, even if they do not choose to or are unable to post exactly why they disagree with you. EDIT: To be clear, I didn't sheep Thrawn - I made my own judgement. Just as I made my own judgement about your case. | ||
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