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On November 22 2013 12:48 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 12:41 Mocsta wrote:On November 22 2013 12:32 Holyflare wrote:
Onegu is someone who prides himself in reading rayn, he even started to call him town at his last post before he afk'd. If he knew rayn was displaying his towny attributes why did he not try and convince any of you that he wasn't scum? Well, his last post was at like 3am.. i dunno So.. am I still scum to you? From what I've read so far, I mean, you of all people have played with rayn and that vote just now was pure policy. You know I have also played with rayn a lot and so when I call him town based on what I've read you shouldn't throw it away and still lynch him. Yes he may have been obnoxious and shit flinging but that is because he was quite clearly annoyed at people. He was emotionally invested. It is hard to fake it the way he did and whether he was annoying or not a towny is a towny. You actively went against a win con because you did not want to play with him again. THAT is scummy. There was Aqua who blatantly disregarded anything rayn said at all. The crux of it comes down to this: He had reads on people that disagreed with thread sentiment. He thought he was correct in those reads and shit things up, so what part of that would have been scummy to you? He went balls to the wall defending someone other people think is scum. Do you think he'd associate that strongly with someone if he was scum? That is not how rayn plays at all.
WTF is this.
I asked if i am scum to you.
And you respond with:
This is something you did "that is scummy".
So i ask again.. am i scum to you?
Lastly, I never shied away from stating it was a policy lynch.
I find it funny how you come here and stand on your high horse. Why didnt you give your tells for a town rayn 2 hrs ago when it was actually relevant and useful?
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On November 22 2013 12:48 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 12:27 Aquanim wrote:On November 22 2013 12:20 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 22 2013 12:14 Aquanim wrote:On November 22 2013 12:10 cDgCorazon wrote:
Doesn't Onegu's vote look really scummy with Rayn's flip? I'm not sure why Onegu's vote looks scummier due to Rayn's flip. Unless you're saying he didn't want to take responsibility for the Rayn lynch... which would apply to you in spades too. Could you clarify? Onegu dropped a vote away from Rayn and then peaced out. What would scum do if they knew town Rayn was probably going to be lynched 12 hours in advance? They wouldn't all pack on the Rayn wagon. That would be too obvious for a scum team. Wouldn't it make sense for Onegu to put a vote on Moc in the middle of the Rayn tunnel to look like he was making an effort to scum-hunt and then be able to distance himself from a Rayn lynch? I was transparent with my stance on Rayn and my decision to no-lynch. Onegu was very shady about it and I think it's because he is hiding the fact that he is scum. That's a fair point. Do you think the same applies to jampidampi and Rean, who both left their votes on me without pushing my lynch at all seriously? Personally I doubt they're all scum but I think there's at least one and possibly two scum in {Jampidampi, Rean, Onegu}. And that's what should be the focal point of N1.
Interesting, ties in precisely with my post on reads from 1st half of day1.
Btw, i agere you were very transparent. I also think the action to no-lynch vs vote someone else was pretty townie.
Because in my mind it attempts to force a discussion on all remaining people vs just the new vote recipient.
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On November 22 2013 12:53 Holyflare wrote:
Why are you asking me if you are scum if quite clearly I gave your name in a list of people I want to lynch then??
Because I re-evaluate my reads after flips.
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On November 22 2013 12:52 Mocsta wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 12:48 Holyflare wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On November 22 2013 12:41 Mocsta wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 12:32 Holyflare wrote:
Onegu is someone who prides himself in reading rayn, he even started to call him town at his last post before he afk'd. If he knew rayn was displaying his towny attributes why did he not try and convince any of you that he wasn't scum? Well, his last post was at like 3am.. i dunno So.. am I still scum to you? From what I've read so far, I mean, you of all people have played with rayn and that vote just now was pure policy. You know I have also played with rayn a lot and so when I call him town based on what I've read you shouldn't throw it away and still lynch him. Yes he may have been obnoxious and shit flinging but that is because he was quite clearly annoyed at people. He was emotionally invested. It is hard to fake it the way he did and whether he was annoying or not a towny is a towny. You actively went against a win con because you did not want to play with him again. THAT is scummy. There was Aqua who blatantly disregarded anything rayn said at all. The crux of it comes down to this: He had reads on people that disagreed with thread sentiment. He thought he was correct in those reads and shit things up, so what part of that would have been scummy to you? He went balls to the wall defending someone other people think is scum. Do you think he'd associate that strongly with someone if he was scum? That is not how rayn plays at all. WTF is this. I asked if i am scum to you. And you respond with: This is something you did "that is scummy". So i ask again.. am i scum to you? Lastly, I never shied away from stating it was a policy lynch. I find it funny how you come here and stand on your high horse. Why didnt you give your tells for a town rayn 2 hrs ago when it was actually relevant and useful?
This was a question to you Holyflare
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EBWOP
On November 22 2013 12:52 Mocsta wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On November 22 2013 12:48 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 12:41 Mocsta wrote:On November 22 2013 12:32 Holyflare wrote:
Onegu is someone who prides himself in reading rayn, he even started to call him town at his last post before he afk'd. If he knew rayn was displaying his towny attributes why did he not try and convince any of you that he wasn't scum? Well, his last post was at like 3am.. i dunno So.. am I still scum to you? From what I've read so far, I mean, you of all people have played with rayn and that vote just now was pure policy. You know I have also played with rayn a lot and so when I call him town based on what I've read you shouldn't throw it away and still lynch him. Yes he may have been obnoxious and shit flinging but that is because he was quite clearly annoyed at people. He was emotionally invested. It is hard to fake it the way he did and whether he was annoying or not a towny is a towny. You actively went against a win con because you did not want to play with him again. THAT is scummy. There was Aqua who blatantly disregarded anything rayn said at all. The crux of it comes down to this: He had reads on people that disagreed with thread sentiment. He thought he was correct in those reads and shit things up, so what part of that would have been scummy to you? He went balls to the wall defending someone other people think is scum. Do you think he'd associate that strongly with someone if he was scum? That is not how rayn plays at all. WTF is this. I asked if i am scum to you. And you respond with: This is something you did "that is scummy". So i ask again.. am i scum to you? Lastly, I never shied away from stating it was a policy lynch. I find it funny how you come here and stand on your high horse. Why didnt you give your tells for a town rayn 2 hrs ago when it was actually relevant and useful?
This was a question to you Holyflare
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On November 22 2013 13:00 Holyflare wrote:
Let me break this down for everyone else:
Onegu posts that rayn is town, onegu knows rayn's meta (thrawn and mocsta know this)
Mocsta sees onegu is afk, doesn't try and confirm rayn's meta to people, policy lynches him
Thrawn, calls rayn obviously towny, lynches him
Aqua, ignores everything rayn says, policy lynches him
1 of you is scum
Why only 1?
What does me seeing Onegu be AFK have to do with anything?
Break this down further.
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Btw,
I think Thrawn is town. I did very much 24hrs ago; and his compulsion to keep swapping votes is towny to me.
It could put him heavily under suspicion when rayn flipped town, and frankly, was unnecessary as scum play.
I thought Aqua was town from 24hrs ago as well. Holy states that aqua is ignoring everything, but that is not my opinion. If anything, Aqua can't stop bantering back with Rayn. Again, this is over done knowing it is a town flip. Aqua could have easily nested on his read - but he did not. I have a town lean on him, but wiill still be reading his cases carefully (and with Rayn gone I expect more output like cases from him)
Me: I was transparent about policy. You want to call that mafia, whatever. I knwo this game is 100% different to my recent scum game. Nothing more needs to be said + I dont knwo why you keep insinuating I am intimate with Rayns meta. I have expectations of his play, but I am not a connoiseur of him at all.
Onegu: Looks pretty bad I agree regardless of AFK.
Anyway mocsta is my biggest scumread now. Also Rayn is a terrible lynch today please change, ill try to be up for deadline but no promises. This in particular. Nothing to do with the AFK its got to do with how he went about the situation.
He gives rayn a town read, and forces town to consider Rayns thread opposition (me)
Compare this to Corazon who is trying to avoid continuing this ego battle - Onegu instead fans the flames.
Onegu *is* scum
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On November 22 2013 13:07 Holyflare wrote:
at least 1*
Onegu calls a person he can read well based off of meta town. You do not try and read into this any further or use it to stop a rayn lynch and then you just ask me why I didn't do the same thing? I clearly did not have as much time as you did to elaborate.
Another high-horse rider.
You were more than happy to chime in your tidbits.
Anyways, all you are doing is providing summaries of posts i can read.
You are not attributing scum motive to anything you are saying.
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HF
You actually dont sound like you believe what you are writing.
But thanks anyways, there is nothing else worth discussing regarding that statement
Heres a new one:
On November 22 2013 09:59 Holyflare wrote:
failed f5, anyway I will not be lynching rayn today
You didnt have time to expound on this; yet you have a series of postings that avoid scum hunting that is relevant to the lynch - consistently responding to new posts within intervals of less than 5minutes.
So again, why did you not try to derail the lynch by expressing why Rayn was town akin to:
On November 22 2013 12:48 Holyflare wrote:
You know I have also played with rayn a lot and so when I call him town based on what I've read you shouldn't throw it away and still lynch him. Yes he may have been obnoxious and shit flinging but that is because he was quite clearly annoyed at people. He was emotionally invested. It is hard to fake it the way he did and whether he was annoying or not a towny is a towny.
The crux of it comes down to this: He had reads on people that disagreed with thread sentiment. He thought he was correct in those reads and shit things up, so what part of that would have been scummy to you? He went balls to the wall defending someone other people think is scum. Do you think he'd associate that strongly with someone if he was scum? That is not how rayn plays at all.
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Corazon, what do you think of what I wrote about Onegu, Aqua, Thrawn before?
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On November 22 2013 13:49 cDgCorazon wrote:
TBH Thrawn looks like your second head or something Moc. All I see from him are town reads on you and +1 on everything that you write. I wish he would branch out and do some of his own reads or else I would like to look at him some more.
Fair comment on being a "hydra"
ummm, Thrawn did that last cycle. It was the trigger for Rayns meltdown.
One of the key things he found was a read on LoneMeow/HolyFlare which ties in with how HolyFlare has come into this game.
On November 21 2013 18:26 thrawn2112 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On November 20 2013 21:41 LoneMeow wrote:
I could agree about cDgCorazon being scum. His filter has a ton of filler-like stuff, practically the only player he seems to have anything to talk about is sciberbia and even that is kind of non-commital, he's more or less hinting that sciberbia is scummy but never actually making it a real case. The part about town reads not being useful was just plain weird.
On the other hand, sciberbia's massive tunnel so early in the game is pretty weird and I really don't think they're both scum.
"I agree about Cor being scum" or even "I kinda agree" is how town people talk. "I could agree" is how scum people talk. "Could agree" as in "if I were actually able to have an opinion but I can't because I'm scum." When they phrase things like this you are hearing their inner monologue trying to figure out what their reads would be if they didn't already know alignments. LM is also scum for townreading Aqua at a time when the average townie should have been at least a little suspicious of Aqua. My only problem writing LM off as scum is that he's barely posted. JampiDampi isn't posting either and I don't like how he was so quick to agree that my Aqua case was good and then he immediately stopped looking for mafia. I remember a post about looking for replacements so if this is him then I don't know how important that last point I made is and this might apply to LM if he's the one who's dropping out. Hopefully this won't be a problem after D1. Picking one out of those two to be scum.. I'll go with LM. I just filtered scib real quick and he's ok. My gut says Bereft is town but at some point I'd like to do some 1v1 questioning. Onegu remains an enigma but my gut has more and more been leaning towards town. I was rereading rayn (sorry moc haven't finished up to the stuff you mentioned) and I came across this exchange On November 21 2013 02:21 Mocsta wrote:
Are Rean and Aquanim bussing? On November 21 2013 02:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:I don't know and i don't care. They both look individually bad to me. I'll reconsider when i see flips. I am not looking into connections now. Everyone has made good posts and those people have made bad posts in my opinion. I do not think Aquanim's reasons for voting for Rean are strong, i don't even know if he thinks he is scum as this is what he says: Show nested quote +For the same reason, I voted Rean above for the purposes of running a second wagon and introducing a choice. I'd cheerfully vote Corazon as well, his failure to actually vote for sciberbia despite his constant accusations is pretty damning. Shouldn't he be voting for Cora instead? A question like what mocsta asked is exactly the kind of unimportant and tiresome thing that town rayn both would strongly care about and also be able to provide several filter pages of spam talking about. Town rayn would never pass up the chance to indulge a question such as Mocsta asked. Town rayn cares deeply about every minute aspect of every angle of every possible theory and he can't stand not having an opinion about such things. I need to reread Corazon, I previously thought he was pretty townie but Mocsta seems to disagree. I am loathe to do it because I don't want to reread those opening cor/scib arguments again and I also think that town Corazon has a very scummy way of talking, arguing, and just the general way he organizes and presents his thought process. I will do this later.
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I do not disagree at all that Thrawn needs more presence.
I don't think he has been buddying me though - in the sense, if anything I buddied him.
Yes I have buddied you before correct. But I was supporting your scum reads, and using your arguments to push them.
I don't think Thrawn is doing that to me. I think it has been coincidence we were thiking the same things at the same time, and posting live -- its what lead to me thiking he was town + towards end of cycle we were starting to disagree on stuff.
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I'm feeling really good about Corazon.
I think a scum Corazon woudl love to poke fingers (a la HolyFlare).
So my reads
The Good: {Thrawn, JarJar, Aqua, Corazon, Bereft, *Sciberbia}
The Bad: {jampidampi}
&
The Ugly: {#Rean/HolyFlare/Onegu}
* Scibs is my weakest read in this group but I think his issue has been lack of time to deliver the content he wants to.
# Interesting tidbit: Rean came into the thread so say: don't use old meta -- maybe he thought i was trying to set a trap or something
INTERESTING BECAUSE
the last time someone said that to me was Onegu in Hogwarts. He said, dont use meta from my last game to defend me (he was scum)
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On November 22 2013 14:13 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 14:11 Mocsta wrote:
I do not disagree at all that Thrawn needs more presence.
I don't think he has been buddying me though - in the sense, if anything I buddied him.
Yes I have buddied you before correct. But I was supporting your scum reads, and using your arguments to push them.
I don't think Thrawn is doing that to me. I think it has been coincidence we were thiking the same things at the same time, and posting live -- its what lead to me thiking he was town + towards end of cycle we were starting to disagree on stuff.
(1) in 37 you were scum and I was town Moc (2) Also, why is your filter 11 pages? Don't you think that it is a bit ridiculous for 48 hours? (3) 11*20 is 220/48 is around 5. You have a post every 12 minutes. Tbh I think things would be better if you tried to tone it down.
(1) I know?? I was explaning the difference between buddying and having aligned thinking.
(2) Most of it I assume is trying to consolidate votes for a lynch. Yes, it took that much effort.
(3) Agreed; my reads are out there so if I'm NK'd I think those 3 (rean/HF/Onegu) are very good lynches to obtain a majority on.
/ciao
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I don't get this.
how am I not playing town that people like jarjar think I am a chance to flip scum?
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sihh
you huysbare playing like rayn.
looking too much into words spoken and go.... oohh scum slip scum slip.
thats stupid play.. townies say incorrect things all the time
need to start looking into motive. anyone reading the thread from page 27 onwards should have known with crystal clear clarity that rayn was the elephant in the room that needed too be discussed.
avoiding this discussion is scummy, especially because he is green in hindsight.
giving weak beans reasons that he istown, and presenting a counter and then disappearing is also weak beans. all that is doing is satisfying the checklist of what to do near a lynch.
conviction people.
I expect the night kill to be myself or thrawn, probably thrawn since some of you are starting to question me.
if I die, please read over my posts carefully. my confirmed flip DOES NOT make my reads right, but at least guarantees my intent is there.
people like onegu, holy, rwan are the best flips for day2.
I would go with holyflare personally as he has the best chance to convince you guys he is town but for all the wrong reasons,
cheers guys, I have enjoyed playing this game and don't regret lynching rayn. I feel it was a byproduct of having a majority lynch setup but we can save thiabdiscussion for post game.
if I'm alive, I will be out for maybe the first 24hrs. sorry, but real life is real life.
good lcuk
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Thrawn
Very quick. In phone thoughts with no reread
Jjd
Still town. I like the way he kept pushing Corazon about a point. He's always backing himself up with filter so good consistency.
I don't like that he assumed rayn could be right about Me.. but. Town can make those snap calls all the time. Plus jjd was suspicious of me at the start so I think there is progression to his comment.
Still town
Bereft
Yeah I'm a little concerned went into a big spiel to justify rayn lynch.
Um not sorry about it. I'm not really sure the town motive to give that spiel as bereft wasn't under pressure to justify actions.
I'm not sure if bereft is a townie that wanted to policy lynch rayn but doesn't want to admit. Or is scum hiding behind policy and again doesn't want to admit it.
Inoe that onegu presented the quote where bereft thinks onegu case wasn't on me but Cora.. I have to think about it.
Iverlall I would say that tell is null because that onegu case was so poorly formatted abd constructed it's message was never clear.
Will give bereft benefit of the doubt and say slight town lean. If anything is not worth considering when people like holy abd onegu are alive
Lastly I did not like how onegu addressed me over night. Seemed almost like a begging for forgiveness yonr.
If onegu really thought I was scum I would have expected more venom. Food for thought.
Gotta go. Sorry I couldn't be of more use
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On November 23 2013 10:54 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 10:38 sciberbia wrote:Have some questions for you Cora. 1) Can you explain what you were talking about in this post? How exactly did you think rayn was trying to gain town cred by going on a rampage and martyring himself? On November 22 2013 04:45 cDgCorazon wrote:
I really do not like Rayn martyring...tbh the concept of martyring has been beaten to death and I think he's just using it as a ploy to gain town cred.
2) If you think it would have been beneficial to scum to keep rayn alive yesterday EVEN given that he is town, why would you not vote for him yesterday? Surely if you think lynching town!rayn would be bad for scum, then it would be good for town? And if he flipped scum even better, right? I don't see how you reconcile voting for no lynch with claiming that it would have been better for scum to no-lynch yesterday. Ok, to be honest, the Rayn lynch was basically impossible for me to pick a side. On one hand, I really thought Rayn was town. On the other hand, Rayn's play was very anti-town. It is a very narrow playstyle that Rayn's townplay fits into. He can be town but not an asset to town at the same time. That is the reason I'm not attacking Mocsta after Rayn's flip. I think I'm being misrepresented (or perhaps I have misrepresented myself) to say that I was against the Rayn lynch. Rayn's really bad townplay, along with the fact that it was a majority lynch, gave me a choice of either lynching someone who I was very confident was town or having him shit up the thread. I think my thought process would make more sense if I went through it. At the beginning, when I made all of those "OMG this fight is stupid" posts, it was due to the fact that the thread had become a shitfest and Rayn/everyone else were simply shitting up the thread. I was truly exasperated and angry that the thread had gone out of control and we had gone from some very good discussion on Aqua/myself/Rean to Rayn and only Rayn. After I came back from school, I was still trying to make a decision whether to vote Rayn or not. When I made the post that you quoted, I think I was trying to justify a Rayn lynch to myself. I knew that it was a dumb lynch but I also knew that I could not do anything about it. Rayn had basically lost it and I did not know whether to give him a second chance or not. When I got back (about 45 minutes from the deadline), I said to myself "Fuck it, I'm not going to be dragged around and be forced to follow thread sentiment". So I voted for a no-lynch. I knew it was useless to try and suggest because Rayn was already bleeding badly and all of the sharks were floating around him. You guys were tunneled way too hard on Rayn and that was a mistake that I tried to correct earlier but gave up out of frustration. TL;DR: My town read on Rayn + The shitty town atmosphere Rayn was causing= scenario where no one wins and I'm forced to walk a very fine line to take a neutral stance on Rayn's lynch.
On a lunch break.
This is a really bad post.
Its very constructed and uses analogies. This is the first time Corazon breaks out a post with this type of construction and notably, he is answering a very important question from Sciberbia that - I think - produces an alignment indicative response.
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On November 23 2013 13:56 cDgCorazon wrote:
Also Mocsta, I'm tired of you picking on me. You've been waffling on your read about me. Either make the fucking case or hold your tongue.
I was posting stuff that stuck out as I was reading.
Using analogies isn't scummy.
Its when you dont use them and suddenly decide to.
im specifically referencing "sharks were circling rayn"
I dunno where my read on you sits; smoethings are good, somethings are bad. This probably means you are town, but im not confident. low priority to me regardless.
Unfortunately the correct play is to leave HolyFlare alone.
It is possible scum was RB or Delay KP.
If Delay KP, its self-confirming. --> ezpz lynch later
If RB, its odd play and the claim was made pre-lynch; suggesting its real. Absolutely dumb ass claim regardless.
##Vote: jampidampi
*Maybe there is scum in the actives, but they can be figured out.
Guys like this guy are too unknown. Early cycle is our best opportunity to put pressure.
I have had an issue with him ever since he had the mindset to declare Corazon could be emotionally tunneled and then proceeding to tunnel aquanim over semantics.
Because, I dont think he knows corazon that well, so the call emotional tunnel suggests he is highly analytical.
This doesnt sit well with the lack of analytics with aquanim.
I'm off again /ciao
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On November 23 2013 15:18 cDgCorazon wrote:
I think he should hang. He's scum man.
##Vote: Onegu
Please let the man build his case on me + bereft before trying to lay down pressure.
Im very curious to see the goods on Bereft.
Please join me with jampidampi.
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EPT
