• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:26
CEST 20:26
KST 03:26
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru0BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview27Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL47Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, Zoun, Solar, Creator4
Community News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack0Weekly Cups (June 2-8): herO doubles down1[BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates9GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th13Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0
StarCraft 2
General
BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation StarCraft 1 & 2 Added to Xbox Game Pass
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) Bellum Gens Elite: Stara Zagora 2025 $3,500 WardiTV European League 2025 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance
Brood War
General
BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu BW General Discussion StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans?
Tourneys
[ASL19] Grand Finals NA Team League 6/8/2025 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 2
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread What do you want from future RTS games? Armies of Exigo - YesYes? Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
A Better Routine For Progame…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 40402 users

Golden Sun: The Broken Seal Mini Mafia - Page 12

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 10 11 12 13 14 16 Next All
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 13:56 GMT
#2915
Wait I thought the host confirmed that vl1 shot bulletproof cant be rbed
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 13:57 GMT
#2916
Oh nvm
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 14:12 GMT
#2920
Raynp a couple things:

Assuming that the "good" (I think experienced is a better word since good is game by game) are not on the same side is a very dangerous line to walk. It may be the case this game, but not every game.

also, assuming that the sk is one of the more experienced is 3p is wromg. Once you get into vet games the skill differencr isnt that great overall.
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 14:14 GMT
#2922
On September 18 2013 23:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
debears talk with me okay?
What do you think about the post i wrote about N1 reactions to BH's claim?
Ignore kush talking about you being SK, what do you make of the argument between me and him?


Kush has been shitting up the thread, especially since n2. Umasi and I have talked about it, hence umasi switching to kush

ill keep saying this: kush is very likely scum
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 14:19 GMT
#2926
On September 18 2013 23:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 18 2013 23:12 Papa_Smurf wrote:
Raynp a couple things:

Assuming that the "good" (I think experienced is a better word since good is game by game) are not on the same side is a very dangerous line to walk. It may be the case this game, but not every game.

also, assuming that the sk is one of the more experienced is 3p is wromg. Once you get into vet games the skill differencr isnt that great overall.

Yeah you are right. I was trying to put myself into scum shoes on D1. I would never ever let D1 end + N1 happen as it did.

Actually kush has some good points against Pandain & Grack. There are some seriously weird stuff they did on D1 end and on N1. I can even explain Grack's fakeclaim from mafia!pov but for this to hold water Vayne has to be scum.

How about Vayne/Grack for scum, Pandain as SK?


Funny thing is, if grack is scum, wouldnt kush be scum for bussing him?

I can see vayne as scum.

pandain as sk is possible, I would definitely label him as not scum
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 18:12 GMT
#3088
hmmm i just had a thought

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=19732241

Look at the timing on the vote. Grack was one the second person on the OP wagon, and WoS backed out 4 hours later. Grack led the wagon. why would he think the wagon is scum led if he was the first person (as town) to place his vote on OP?

I'm still on the fence with this one. But, as town, I would think that you would not find your own wagon "scum led" if you have any kind of confidence in your abilities.

I still would like to lynch kush the most. zealos is second right now. I'm warming up to a grack lynch though
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 18:13 GMT
#3089
actually screw it take kush out of my lynch candidates

zealos then grack
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 18:21 GMT
#3094
Btw we should not in any way vote Vayne today
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 18:49 GMT
#3097
##Vote Zealos

He is very likely serial killer. Will post reasoning later. Based on his d1 votes and timing of those votes. His voting makes no sense from town or scum perspective.

Join the love train

Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 19:17 GMT
#3101
On September 19 2013 04:03 Sn0_Man wrote:
Okay dibbers, Zealos is the SK (I'm not disagreeing or agreeing right now). Who is scum? We scratched kush off your list, leaving Grack. Theres at least one more no?


Kush is still scum. No wants wants to lynch him.

anyways grack would fit with him. Va possibly could. Sn0 could.
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 19:37 GMT
#3104
On September 19 2013 04:19 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2013 04:17 Papa_Smurf wrote:
On September 19 2013 04:03 Sn0_Man wrote:
Okay dibbers, Zealos is the SK (I'm not disagreeing or agreeing right now). Who is scum? We scratched kush off your list, leaving Grack. Theres at least one more no?


Kush is still scum. No wants wants to lynch him.

anyways grack would fit with him. Va possibly could. Sn0 could.

Why is Pandain town?


basically his play overall and how he relates to you. I only see him being scum if you are scum(or sk). I dont see either of those right now
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 20:02 GMT
#3106
On September 19 2013 04:56 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2013 04:37 Papa_Smurf wrote:
On September 19 2013 04:19 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On September 19 2013 04:17 Papa_Smurf wrote:
On September 19 2013 04:03 Sn0_Man wrote:
Okay dibbers, Zealos is the SK (I'm not disagreeing or agreeing right now). Who is scum? We scratched kush off your list, leaving Grack. Theres at least one more no?


Kush is still scum. No wants wants to lynch him.

anyways grack would fit with him. Va possibly could. Sn0 could.

Why is Pandain town?


basically his play overall and how he relates to you. I only see him being scum if you are scum(or sk). I dont see either of those right now

Uhh.. how does he exactly relate to me?
I can't understand a thing you say..


If you look at d1 with your interactions, you could see how you two interact with the thread that would make you both seem town. If you weren't town, the interaction (OP scummier than Pandain stuff) would mean you are both scum (or one scum one sk).

As I said, I think you are both town, so doesn't really matter
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 22:06 GMT
#3137
I'm around for an hour or so. Gotta type up my epic zealos is sk post
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 22:14 GMT
#3140
On September 19 2013 07:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2013 07:06 Papa_Smurf wrote:
I'm around for an hour or so. Gotta type up my epic zealos is sk post

I don't give a fuck about SK now. tbh if i want to lynch SK i want to lynch you over Zealos. You fit the profile far more than Zealos does.

Why can't people understand? If we lynch town we probably lose the game. Zealos is not sure to be SK. Why the fuck is everyone i think is anti-town hunting for SK and not scum? It must be because they are anti-town! <3


Hey, I already tried rallying a kush lynch for 3 days. No bites. Not much I can do with that
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 23:09 GMT
#3158
An Extensive Look into SK tells:
The Story of Zealos, The Lone Ranger

Debears, esquire

Alright, let me start by a basic rundown of standard SK traits (3p in general even).

1) Does not honestly care who gets lynched as long the lynch maintains a balance, and as long it is not the SK himself
2) Wants to maintain a balance of town and scum
3) Traditionally puts no weight into the d1 lynch (becuase the game is "even" at that point)
4) Wants to avoid putting himself out there as a mafia target, while keeping town off of him
5) Wants to target people different from the mafia's targets while keeping people who look scummier than him
6) Want to target people who are suspicious of him

Ok. Based off these rules, let's look at Zealos's play, specifically during d1.

1) Zealos's voting trends

A) The early/mid day 1
Zealos's voting and reasoning points specifically that he didn't care about any lynch.

First Vote - SNB

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 13 2013 21:55 Zealos wrote:
##Vote: strongandbig


On September 13 2013 22:11 ShiaoPi wrote:
Day 1 Votecount:

strongandbig(3): Koshi, Papa_Smurf, Koshi, raynpelikoneet, Zealos

VayneAuthority(0): Papa_Smurf

WaveofShadow(1): kushm4sta

Grackaroni(0): WaveofShadow

kushm4sta(3): Papa_Smurf, Pandain, Old Partner

Pandain(0): Grackaroni

Old Partner(1): raynpelikoneet Grackaroni

Koshi(0): blubbdavid

blubbdavid(3): VayneAuthority, Grackaroni, Sn0_man, Umasi

Currently, kushm4sta is set to be lynched (hit 3 first, after blubbdavid went down to 2 again, before coming back up)! Remember, voting is mandatory!
Not voting(2): strongandbig, Onegu


Next deadline:
Deadline date: Friday, Sep 13 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00)






What I would like to point out is, that, at this point, Zealos's vote wasn't damning on anyone. It was a vote that really didn't matter. Regardless of SNB having a third vote, he was still behind two others as the main lynch candidate (in terms of timing of the third vote).

What was his reasoning and how did he push the SNB lynch?

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 13 2013 21:55 Zealos wrote:
I don't really know how I can prove that I'm town at this point.
I would argue that SnB looks Scummy, while I just look useless, so logic dictates that killing SnB is the best for today, then deciding on me tomorrow, after a bit more time has passed.


Zealos's main problem with SNB was his "misrepresentation" of Raynp's meta, which we later pointed out wasn't as big of a deal as Raynp thought.

Did Zealos provide new reasoning? No.

Did Zealos keep pushing immediately after? No.

Those two things show Zealos didn't actually care about gettin SNB lynched, because he would have done it when SNB was a main object of discussion in the thread.

After voting for SNB, Zealos later rescinds his scumread

On September 14 2013 06:23 Zealos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:19 Sn0_Man wrote:
On September 14 2013 06:14 Zealos wrote:
You just seem mad at him for making a case against you.

You have that backwards lol

Rayn got mad at SnB for calling him scum.

Rayns mad was making a decent case. SnB is complaining about nitpicking, which in itself is nickpicky.

I dunno, it's not a scumread, I just think SnB is half tunnelling Rayn for no good reason.


In this, notice Zealos never actually tried to figure out himself whether SNB was scum or town, he just nonchalantly removes his read.



B) The Transition

Next, Zealos transitions to a vote on Kush once the SNB wagon loses steam. Yet, despite unvoting SNB, he keeps pushing an SNB scumread (after, as pointed out above, that he said SNB wasn't a scumread).

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 14 2013 06:34 Zealos wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote: Kush


On September 14 2013 05:54 ShiaoPi wrote:
Day 1 Votecount:

strongandbig(1): Koshi, Papa_Smurf, Koshi, raynpelikoneet, Zealos, blubbdavid, raynpelikoneet

VayneAuthority(0): Papa_Smurf

WaveofShadow(0): kushm4sta

Grackaroni(0): WaveofShadow

kushm4sta(3): Papa_Smurf, Pandain, Old Partner, Papa_Smurf

Pandain(0): Grackaroni

Old Partner(6): raynpelikoneet Grackaroni, Oatsmaster, blubbdavid, Umasi, raynpelikoneet, WaveofShadow

Koshi(0): blubbdavid

blubbdavid(4): VayneAuthority, Grackaroni, Sn0_man, Umasi, Papa_Smurf, raynpelikoneet, kushm4sta, Koshi

Zealos(1): blubbdavid, strongandbig

raynpelikoneet(0): strongandbig

Currently Old Partner is set to be lynched! Remember, voting is mandatory!


Next deadline:
Deadline date: Friday, Sep 13 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00)




Notice, he bailed the SNB wagon shortly after Raynp and Koshi got off it. That tells me he was trying not to stick out, and instead blend in.

Meanwhile, look at Zealos's reasoning in thread

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 14 2013 06:34 Zealos wrote:
Pandain seems town, so I guess I trust you. Whatever :3
##Vote: Kush


Ok, use pandain as your reasoning for unvoting. Blending in.

On September 14 2013 06:42 Zealos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:40 strongandbig wrote:
Panda why do you say zealos is not going to happen. There are enough people active for a last minute vote switch to work. No one has said they're strongly against a zealos lunch. How about everyone who would be okay win zealos rather than old partner just switch now and can squelch back in ten minutes if it doesn't reach majority.

I still think this guy is scum. He's flipping from person to person who he feels are easy targets.

If you're gonna write lots, at least try to look like you're being useful~


Shortly after, when his vote is off SNB, he still calls SNB scum. So, he doesn't want to poke his neck out and push his scumread. Definition of blending in and keeping off the radar.



C) The Events Leading up to Lynch ************Most important point

So, Zealos has been blending in the whole day up to this point. What does he do now? He pushes someone close to lynch that doesn't have votes. Also, he doesn't actually comment on any of the actual lynch candidates himself.

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 14 2013 06:38 ShiaoPi wrote:
Day 1 Votecount:

strongandbig(0): Koshi, Papa_Smurf, Koshi, raynpelikoneet, Zealos, blubbdavid, raynpelikoneet

VayneAuthority(0): Papa_Smurf

WaveofShadow(0): kushm4sta

Grackaroni(0): WaveofShadow

kushm4sta(4): Papa_Smurf, Pandain, Old Partner, Papa_Smurf, Zealos

Pandain(0): Grackaroni

Old Partner(6): raynpelikoneet Grackaroni, Oatsmaster, blubbdavid, Umasi, raynpelikoneet, WaveofShadow

Koshi(0): blubbdavid

blubbdavid(4): VayneAuthority, Grackaroni, Sn0_man, Umasi, Papa_Smurf, raynpelikoneet, kushm4sta, Koshi

Zealos(1): blubbdavid, strongandbig

raynpelikoneet(0): strongandbig

Currently Old Partner is set to be lynched! Remember, voting is mandatory!


Next deadline:
Deadline date: Friday, Sep 13 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00)



Look at the votecount. SNB has no votes. Zealos has a vote on Kush (who is also another lynch with no momentum). What is zealos saying in thread?

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 14 2013 06:56 Zealos wrote:
I like how Pandain is making points to try and make a lynch happen. Then you get SnB:
Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:00 strongandbig wrote:
Ryan what about lynching zealos instead of kush

Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:51 strongandbig wrote:
Look people in thread vote zealos. We can still make it happen

Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:53 strongandbig wrote:
Pandaind come on vote zealos. Kush isn't happening, people either have town reads on him or are on OP.

Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:53 strongandbig wrote:
Pandain if its between old partner and zealos why not vote zwalos



Post about SNB.

On September 14 2013 06:56 Zealos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:56 Zealos wrote:
I like how Pandain is making points to try and make a lynch happen. Then you get SnB:
On September 14 2013 06:00 strongandbig wrote:
Ryan what about lynching zealos instead of kush

On September 14 2013 06:51 strongandbig wrote:
Look people in thread vote zealos. We can still make it happen

On September 14 2013 06:53 strongandbig wrote:
Pandaind come on vote zealos. Kush isn't happening, people either have town reads on him or are on OP.

On September 14 2013 06:53 strongandbig wrote:
Pandain if its between old partner and zealos why not vote zwalos


+1
Show nested quote +
On September 14 2013 06:56 strongandbig wrote:
Blubb vote zealos! Lynch of justice



Another SNB comment.

On September 14 2013 06:57 Zealos wrote:
Anyway strong, if you think we shouldn't vote OP, why don't /you/ vote /kush/


Another soft push on a non main candidate.

On September 14 2013 06:59 Zealos wrote:
Not really time now, but look at my filter and see the amount of time as town I get mislynched after a massive wagon with me trying to tell people that I'm town.

I'm pretty sure most times I get lynched as mafia I go out in a blaze of fury.
See: My bus versus a teammate in some game a while ago.


So he comes back right before lynch, when there is a hard time of determining who is actually getting lynched with lack of votecounts (as shown by Pandain).



Ok. This is the main thing that makes me think he is SK.

When he didn't post in the thread at 15 minutes before lynch, he was comfortable. One vote on him. Not any serious talk.

Suddenly, at 8 minutes he gets a second vote from Grack. Not a big deal, considering blubb had 4, kush had 4, and OP had 5.

Then, suddenly at 3 minutes before lynch, votes swap to Zealos. Zealos was posting in thread. What was his reaction?

In the quotes shown above, he kept weakly pushing 2 of the weaker lynch candidates. He didn't go crazy trying to save himself. He didn't vote for someone that would save himself.

Now think about this situation from the 3 perspectives

1) Town - Chances are you would be following the thread and trying to actually convince people to not vote you and jump on a wagon that would save you. You wouldn't care if that puts you in a spotlight, because you know you are town, and you don't know who else is.

2) Scum - Chances are you would be following thread while posting in the qt. Regardless, you and your team would want you to save yourself and your scumbuddy in OP, and you would know where you lie in votes. If you take a little fire from others, you play the town trying to save yourself as your only confirmed town read.

3) SK - After seeing 3 others with 3 or more votes than you, you would relax. You don't care who gets lynched of the three. You peace out and stop paying attention to the thread. Suddenly, when you come back a few minutes before lynch, you scramble to see where that puts you. With the confusion, you don't want to suddenly vote someone you think might be town, or else that puts you in the spotlight the next day with a last second voteswitch because you would have no backup and know you aren't being truthful. Also, you'd have to deal with pressure the rest of the game.

Zealos's unwillingness to push main candidates, or save himself from being lynched, make NO sense from a town or mafia perspective. It does make sense from a comfortable SK perspective.




2) His Reacion to BH's Survivor Claim before the WoS Flip

This point has already been brought up, but it is very good.

On September 14 2013 07:18 Zealos wrote:
I think OP/BH needs to die. Survivor = lynch
I doubt he even is Survivor. His attempt to argue his way out of it is crummy, at best. Get it?

##Predayvote:OP

vigipls


If you look at Zealos's posts around this time, all of them revolve around doubt of BH's claim before the WoS flip.

One 3p is pretty reasonable in any 12 or 15 player game. Yet, he is very doubtful of a surivovr claim very early on. Why is that?

1) Town - you don't see 3p claims as realistic in a 12 or 15 player setup.

2) Scum - you wonder if he actually is survivor, or some other 3p (sk), or maybe just a blue disguising himself (very unlikely).

3) SK - two 3p in a 15 player game are super unlikely. You think "this guy be scum doh" as a reaction and subconciously doubt the claim quite a bit immediately.

While scum do have a sensible reason of being suspicious of the claim, town don't, and the SK's reason for doubt is very strong. The SK is by far the most likely to doubt the claim (especially considering the d1 lynch was town, he would want scum lynched the next day).

3) Zealos's interesting choice of votes day 2

So, despite being super doubtful of BH's survivor claim in the night, when day comes, Zealos switches all his focus to SNB, his main accuser. Literally, SNB was on Zealos's dick the whole game, and Zealos kept wanting SNB lynched.

What does this show? Zealos is basing his priorities for lynch on his own problems. He already know OP was scum (or very likely scum). He didn't need OP killed right away. SNB, on the other hand, was a nuisance for him.

Here are some of Zealo's posts

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 16 2013 20:23 Zealos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 20:20 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On September 16 2013 20:18 Zealos wrote:
I've changed my mind again.
If we don't kill OP today, we will look back at the end of the game and be like "How did we let a potential SK or Squm survive when at best they are a survivor"

Stop talking about OP. Who do you think is scum and why?

From what I remember, SnB. He seems very keen to tunnel and not really contribute new ideas, rather hiding in old ones.
I'll have to give a lot more reasoning and get some other scumreads when I get home, but SnB just seems very off to me.


On September 17 2013 03:04 Zealos wrote:
##Vote: Old Partner
FYI


On September 17 2013 17:23 Zealos wrote:
Still not a fan of SnB. Even now all he's talking about is me.

I was also gonna say that I am fairly sure that Umasi is town. Then I saw his cases on me and he's either well meaning but a little off the mark, of looking for a totally irrelevant lynch to avoid one of his mafia teammates dying. I haven't decided yet.



Talk about SNB>Vote OP> Continue talking about SNB.

4) Zealos's reactions after the nk on SNB and going into day 3

On September 18 2013 18:04 Zealos wrote:
Hmm.
First thoughts on the night kill on SnB seems that it makes it too easy to try to get me lynched. Prove he's a townie, then I look bad for pushing him as Scum...


What does this quote reveal? Zealos is thinking of his defense before any accuses him. He has a guilty conscience, and he points out how other people would accuse him for scum. Also, his reasoning would be bad if he was town for thinking people would think he's scum.

Seriously, look at the thread from the daypost all the way to this quote (quote is around page 145). No one actually says "oh zealos scum since SNB was killed".

It's incredibly odd that Zealos would bring up such a thing that demonstrates a guilty conscience as town or scum. It would make sense as a SK though.

Finally, what have Zealos's posts and involvement been looking like when he is suddenly the main lynch candidate?

On September 19 2013 03:05 Zealos wrote:
I'm gonna assume the mason claim is legit for now.
Based on the QT, Pan looks pretty town too.
This leaves:

kushm4sta
VayneAuthority
Oatsmaster
raynpelikoneet
Grackaroni
Papa_Smurf
Sn0_Man

I don't think kush is scum. He has been actively hunting all game, including calling me reasonably town. I know myself that I am town, so he hasn't tried to push a mislynch on me.

Leaving:

VayneAuthority
Oatsmaster
raynpelikoneet
Grackaroni
Papa_Smurf
Sn0_Man

I'm not so much of a fan of rayn anymore. On page 23 for example he goes from voting for me in one post, to calling me town in the next. Hmm. He throws accusations everywhere.
Will post more after eating.


Wow. Zealos post with more than four lines of his own wording.

No definite reads. Just a "look at these guys" post. He's attempting to deflect attention from himself.

Summary

If you read closely at this case, and at zealos's votes and posting in thread, you can see he does not have a real mafia agenda because he straight up hasn't been involved. However, he has kept up with the thread. Yet, he doesn't post actual reads. His only posting was on "SNB so scum" all day1 and day 2.

Also, SNB was killed night 2, and it wasn't by scum (or at least very very very unlikely). The only way the nk wasn't zealos was if someone else, if zealos wasn't sk, was trying to set him up.

If that is the case, these things pop in my head.

1) A SK wants to keep people scummier than him around. Why would a SK try to frame Zealos, who has been a discussion of lynch since day 1? The only way for a SK to win is to outlive everyone. A SK has a hard time doing that if all the very townie looking people are still around.
2) A SK wants to keep people who are suspicious of him off himself. Why wouldn't the SK try for someone who actually was onto him to some degree (not that a large majority of SNB's posting was directed at a Zealos scumread).

After looking at this case. I would say zealos is 90% likely to flip SK. 8% to flip town. and 2% to flip scum

Zealos is SK
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 23:13 GMT
#3159
Btw just to let people know.

The reason why Umasi and I and Pandain are voting with each other is from the mason talks. Umasi and I both think Pandain is town based on mason chats and overall play.

Umasi and I have talked it over a few times, and we feel zealos is the best lynch. We both think (or at least thought) that kush is scum and was the best lynch earlier. With lack of support, we decided to move towards zealos, since he is most likely SK. Considering that Pandain agrees, we are very strongly on the zealos lynch.

We do admit there is some stuff going on with Grack, but not enough to overrule a zealos lynch
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 23:16 GMT
#3160
On September 19 2013 07:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
These people, Pandain, Grackaroni and debears. They are not trying to find mafia. They are trying to find the SK. They are fucking making cases why someone is SK!

They are not questioning anyone, they are not making cases against scum. They are making cases against SK!Zealos. If Zealos flips town there is no fucking way town is going to win this game!


just saying. this is fucked up.


You should understand at this point Raynp. Here are the scenarios

1) Zealos flips town. The Sk would be looking to kill a mafia tonight. Zealos is eliminated from the pool of mafia players, making it easier for the sk to hit mafia
2) Zealos flips SK. We slow the game down by lowering the kp. There are only two scum left and there are bound to be associations around.
3) Zealos is scum. There are still 2 kp, but we have a better idea of who is the final scum. The SK will be a slight problem, but with only 1 mafia it makes it much easier for us
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 23:18 GMT
#3161
On September 19 2013 07:17 raynpelikoneet wrote:
debears i am going to tell you now something. IF you somehow manage to lynch Zealos and he flips town you'll get 100% lynched the next day.


Then get on the zealos lynch. You can lynch me tomorrow if I'm wrong
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 23:27 GMT
#3170
On September 19 2013 08:26 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2013 08:18 Papa_Smurf wrote:
On September 19 2013 07:17 raynpelikoneet wrote:
debears i am going to tell you now something. IF you somehow manage to lynch Zealos and he flips town you'll get 100% lynched the next day.


Then get on the zealos lynch. You can lynch me tomorrow if I'm wrong

I am going to look at this more closely tomorrow. I am fucking tired.
At first glance you have some good points and some points that are not so good.


Ignore the "bad" parts and jump for joy at the good ones
Papa_Smurf
Profile Joined September 2013
336 Posts
September 18 2013 23:29 GMT
#3174
On September 19 2013 08:27 kushm4sta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2013 08:13 Papa_Smurf wrote:
Btw just to let people know.

The reason why Umasi and I and Pandain are voting with each other is from the mason talks. Umasi and I both think Pandain is town based on mason chats and overall play.


Why would you need to give an excuse for all being on the same wagon as town??
This is REALLY scummy.


SCUMSLIP. HE'S BEEN CALLING PANDAIN SCUM

YET JUST GENERALIZED PANDAIN AS TOWN WHEN TALKING ABOUT MY READS, WHICH AGREE WITH PANDAINS

DINGDINGDINGDING
Prev 1 10 11 12 13 14 16 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 34m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 734
BRAT_OK 99
UpATreeSC 59
MindelVK 50
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 5918
Sea 3346
Mini 703
EffOrt 475
Stork 284
ggaemo 275
Nal_rA 219
Dewaltoss 170
Aegong 39
sSak 24
[ Show more ]
Sacsri 22
Backho 15
yabsab 13
Shine 12
Counter-Strike
fl0m6156
olofmeister3124
rGuardiaN69
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu272
Khaldor176
Other Games
tarik_tv33932
gofns11580
FrodaN886
Beastyqt708
XaKoH 214
shahzam143
Mew2King84
TKL 74
QueenE55
Trikslyr52
ZombieGrub31
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream1404
Other Games
BasetradeTV63
StarCraft 2
angryscii 39
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 22 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta16
• Reevou 3
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 41
• Michael_bg 9
• ZZZeroYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• FirePhoenix0
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21372
League of Legends
• Nemesis5261
• Jankos1800
• TFBlade1103
Other Games
• imaqtpie846
• Shiphtur299
• WagamamaTV112
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Monday
5h 34m
GSL Code S
15h 4m
Rogue vs GuMiho
Maru vs Solar
Online Event
1d 5h
Replay Cast
1d 7h
GSL Code S
1d 15h
herO vs Zoun
Classic vs Bunny
The PondCast
1d 15h
Replay Cast
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
OSC
2 days
Korean StarCraft League
3 days
[ Show More ]
SOOP
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
Cheesadelphia
3 days
CSO Cup
3 days
GSL Code S
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Cure vs Percival
ByuN vs Spirit
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
2025 GSL S2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.