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On August 30 2013 23:34 debears wrote:
@Hapa
Can you remind me after lynch of something I need to talk to you about? A certain person is doing something off of his normal town game (at least I think he is). I don't think I would be able to get him lynched at this point.
If you're talking about me, it's been a while since I even played town, let alone played with you.
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##Vote: FirmTofu
Heads or Tails?
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On August 30 2013 23:53 debears wrote:Yamato. Take a look at the filters of Onegu, Syl, Hopeless, and Oats. Give me a quick gut read on which is scum. Then build a case on that person. Start playing My ranking 1) Syl 2) Hopeless 3) Onegu/Oats @Hapa and MarvI can't remember. Doesn't yamato usually check out of games once he is considered town (when he is town)?
Gut says Syl but it's like the weakest read ever.
Basically it makes no sense that he questioned my read of Marv at the start of the game on the basis of it being premature (everything is at that stage). It could be that he's actually putting in effort as mafia and is trying his best to be non-confrontational. Usually people like him who try to avoid arguments and the spotlight are good candidates for being mafia.
Onegu is like, second on the list. Hopeless third. Oats last because he's playing right now and not being completely retarded.
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Caught up. Totally fine with killing FT.
Hapa, sheep me.
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On August 31 2013 06:19 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 06:17 yamato77 wrote:
Caught up. Totally fine with killing FT.
Hapa, sheep me. Please give me more scum-reads than the practically non-posting lurker .
Not sold on the Oats thing.
As I said before, Syl is the next best lynch. That didn't change much with him voting Onegu.
I'd say Alakaspam and Onegu are tied for last. All the replacement has done is complain about how long the game is. If he can read Aperture, he can read this game and give reads. Otherwise he scum.
Onegu maybe scum, but he's kinda lynchbait.
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On August 31 2013 06:26 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2013 06:25 yamato77 wrote:On August 31 2013 06:19 Hapahauli wrote:On August 31 2013 06:17 yamato77 wrote:
Caught up. Totally fine with killing FT.
Hapa, sheep me. Please give me more scum-reads than the practically non-posting lurker . Not sold on the Oats thing. As I said before, Syl is the next best lynch. That didn't change much with him voting Onegu. I'd say Alakaspam and Onegu are tied for last. All the replacement has done is complain about how long the game is. If he can read Aperture, he can read this game and give reads. Otherwise he scum. Onegu maybe scum, but he's kinda lynchbait. REad Onegu's post on Syl. It's actually pretty good. Syl said earlier "lynching FT is fine by mine. I might vote for him". Then he bashes Onegu for voting FT. Total contradiction in a scum oriented fashion. Did syl suddenly forget he though FT was a good vote for lynch?
So we lynch silentman?
ok
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On August 31 2013 06:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
yamato and debears why are you refusing to look / comment on my posts on TK?
because your filter is like ten pages and I just wrote you off as tunneled town
TK is not scum, marv is not scum, stop it.
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On August 31 2013 06:40 yamato77 wrote:
##Vote Sylencia
ok
EBWOP
##Unvote
##Vote Sylencia
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##Unvote
##Vote Alakaslam
okay with this as well
dont lynch Oats
if rayn actually shoots marv, we lynch him tomorrow.
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I kinda want to kill Rayn for that stunt.
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Okay so I've finally actually read this thread.
On September 01 2013 06:53 marvellosity wrote:
Yeah, his filter there is 24 pages, and since they changed the filter shit I don't know how to display all pages at once. This is the comment I made in geript/mine QT though
marvellosity was signed in when posted
04-25-2013
12:12 PM ET (US)
"Clarity is always inactive, and him being fixated on Sharrant is not alignment indicative. His case is objectively something that scum like to do, but in the context of the game, I can see a town Clarity who had a late start feeling the need to get his thoughts about the game on the table, even if they weren't about the main lynch candidates. The fact that he basically has no other reads in the game is a point in his favor, but just like VE, we can afford to play a waiting game with him, seeing as we have unlimited time."
had a quick browse. found this funny.
1) clarity is usually active
2) him being fixated on sharrant is alignment indicative
3) the context of the game makes the case scummier, not less
4) having no proper reads is not a point in his favour
so much fail in one paragraph
The main reason it reminded me specifically of the you/me post is that what i quoted there was part of a larger post with all kinds of fail which yamato somehow comes up with a couple of times per game as town, whereas he doesn't as mafia.
Anyways, i can't really disagree about how useful he's been, but do you really think he'd have gone balls out at BOTH of us like that?
1) Clarity had not been very active in any game I had played with him before LXI, such as Parallel where he replaced out. I had the impression that he was an inactive sort of player, for whatever reason.
2) They were both scum, and I later nailed the both of them. This was a post where I intentionally doubted all my own reads because I was being bad. This is also probably the second worst game I've ever played in.
3) You knew they were both mafia. You cannot objectively make these kinds of judgements.
4) It is a point in his favor for being mafia. I worded it poorly but you took this out of context. I made this post talking about who I wanted to lynch or something like that.
so stfu, I may make dumb posts occasionally but this was not one of them.
On September 01 2013 06:55 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 06:53 marvellosity wrote:
...
Anyways, i can't really disagree about how useful he's been, but do you really think he'd have gone balls out at BOTH of us like that? Maybe? I mean Yamato is fully capable of being useful as town, and if he's not next cycle, he should probably die.
It disturbs me that you're considering the idea that I'm worth lynching over some of the highly suspect players in this game. It also disturbs me that you didn't get shot at, apparently. I'm watching you, Hapa. Just because you tried to help me de-tunnel Marv doesn't mean I ignore your posts the rest of the game.
On September 01 2013 08:00 Hapahauli wrote:
Welll... sweet.
Also weird, IMO. Seems hesitant/unnatural. FOS Hapa
On September 01 2013 08:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:
That's not a vaild thought process, who would you shoot?
He would have shot me, Hapa, or debears if he were scum and we were all town. Probably not me, unless he's paranoid that I'm able to catch him (he wouldn't be).
Anyway, it DEFINITELY wouldn't be you.
On September 01 2013 08:26 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 08:25 raynpelikoneet wrote:
i am a vet. debears claim is shit. he is scum.
i was hit. I'm not following the logic here. Debears claimed roleblock and you claim veteran. OK. So... 1) You've claimed mason and vigi already. How can I trust your claim? 2) What does yoru claim have anything to do with debears being roleblocked?
The problem with Rayn here is that I think he'd do this as town, to be honest. He loves fakeclaiming as a powerplay to get what he wants. You are also correct in one of your posts where you say that it would be a stretch for scum Rayn to be this spastic. That said, I also believe debears. Not worth lynching into these claims TBH.
On September 01 2013 08:32 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 08:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
debears why do we have a vig? mafia have fixed 1 kp. I was shot. You claim to be shot. Would have to be a vig (or sk) And two veterans. Unlikely imo
This is also true. It's not entirely out of the question that there is a 3P with KP in this game, or perhaps a mafia vig. If you were town vig and shot one of Rayn or debears (lol, who am I kidding, you shot Rayn), you should claim.
On September 01 2013 09:03 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 09:00 sciberbia wrote:
shit sorry debears just did 3rd party speculation. I take it back.
I dunno I'm with hapa I think they are most likely both town. Not sure whether rayn is lying again or not to try to make a "big play" or something For as tough of a time I'm giving Ryan about the claim, it's probably legit (if Rayn is town). He hasn't been suspicious of debears at all this game, and all his other claims were levied around trying to manipulate the game around his individual reads. I do need to entertain the possibility of scum-Rayn tonight. And even though scum-Rayn can be somewhat spazztic, I don't know if he could fake these levels. Also, any town-vigi should claim. If not, we either have a mafia vigi or an SK on our hands. And if there's an SK, we can confirm it tomorrow night (if two people die) and thereby corroborate both of these claims.
SK could have the power to withhold his shot/it might overlap with scum. There's no 100% possibility to RULE OUT an SK, so we should always be weary. That said, it's also possible mafia have a 2-shot vig or something, so it's difficult to confirm one as well. Flips on anti-town parties are the only way to confirm their existence and the validity of the claims. But for now, it's not worth thinking about them anymore. We should continue on as if both are true.
As for the shots, it's obvious that debears was shot + roleblocked by scum. This is a common mafia tactic when bluesniping. But if someone picked up on his crumb, why would they shoot into a veteran, and if they did, why wouldn't they double-stack him and kill him off if they did have multiple KP?
It is likely, then, that debears was shot under the normal decision making process of NK choices. This begs the question, why were the 2 higher-priority NK targets (Marv/Hapa) shot at? Mafia might have had a blue read on Debears somehow, but missed the crumb. It is also possible that Hapa is mafia and intentionally chose not to shoot Marv because of Marv's emotionally tilted play this game, and as to not lead to too many questions of why he is alive and Marv dead later on.
Rayn seems unlikely to have been shot at by mafia. Rayn as town is a top-tier thread destroyer. He is also a liability to town with his propensity to make powerplays and generally ignore the advice of more objective players. If he is telling the truth and was shot, to me it implies a third party player who found him a threat to their survival. This heavily implicates TK, in my opinion, as no one else received even a fraction of Rayn's attention as he did.
As for my reads in this game:
Town: Marv, Rayn, Debears
Leaning town: Sylencia, sciberbia
Null: Onegu, Sn0, Slam
Probable anti-town: Oats, TK
I'll substantiate my reads on the null/anti-town players in short order.
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On September 01 2013 22:57 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Why is there no Hapa in your reads yamato?
Also one thing that especially bothers me is why would debears be shot over Hapa/marv in case even one of them is town? Him being shot AND roleblocked by mafia makes sense how? Who would doc debears over marv/Hapa on N1?
##Unvote:
Like, i think there is a possibility of 2 vets in the game. But what does this mean?
I'm not going to talk about Hapa until I know his alignment.
I talked about why debears would be shot over hapa/marv, I also talked about why he was shot + roleblocked. Please read my entire post.
It's also possible that mafia thought Hapa/marv were too dangerous to shoot into (as in they are likely to be protected), but that doesn't really explain the roleblock unless they had no idea how else to use it.
2 vets probably means quite a bit of anti-town KP. Obviously.
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On September 01 2013 23:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I understand the roleblock, i understand the shot. I don't understand them together, because mafia would need to think:
1) Do not shoot into marv - Hapa because they are likely protected
2) debears is blue, let's shoot him
3) but hey, let's also roleblock him in case he survives (which makes no sense because of 1 - as vet cannot be rb'd, and would mafia seriously assume 2 medics?)
It just makes no sense to me.
Like I said, mafia commonly do this when bluesniping (or even shooting at all, really). He could be vig or whatever, it's better to be safe than sorry when dealing with roles.
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Hapa, do you have anything to say about my post besides to question my weak town read of Syl?
This goes for anyone, btw.
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On September 02 2013 09:54 Hapahauli wrote:
Yamato, why are you being so useless this game? Is this a work-related thing? Because I've never seen a town-game from you where you've had such abysmal thread-presence.
I really haven't played town in a while, and certainly not with this group of players who I mostly find difficult to read.
Generally, it's easy enough for me to get some townreads and go from there, but I have too many question marks and not enough time to really pin them all down.
@scib I will give those reads, probably in the morning. I am unfortunately out of time right now.
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On September 02 2013 17:35 sciberbia wrote:@alakaslam Yamato looks like scum to me because - he's hardly ever in the thread and has a much lower thread-presence than he normally does as town
- he doesn't do a lot of scumhunting or give out a lot of reads
- he is wishy/washy on many of the reads that he does give out
- he called hapa & marv scum but then backed off for no good reason
- he doesn't look very interested in helping town find good lynches
- he admits to being useless but still acts disturbed that hapa thinks he's scum
But I'd be more interested in hearing your thoughts on other people than further thoughts on yamato. I'd love it if you could find someone you think is scummy. Thanks for the follow-up explanation by the way. That was more helpful.
1) I'm limited in my time, period. My scum games look inactive because I care about teh game even less than I do now. That said, I have A LOT of time today to do some real scumhunting, now that I'm off work.
2) lolol whatever. I, as town, don't necessarily always throw reads out into the blue either. But I do have them, and for the most part, you know my read on every player in the game, just not particularly why I read them that way.
3) Means absolutely nothing. I'm wishy-washy about Hapa/Marv/Oats because I've read them wrong so many times in the past. The rest of you are just fucking mind boggling.
4) I backed off Marv because he was acting the way he used to when I accused him. Very good reason. I haven't actually backed all the way off Hapa, in fact, I'm actually going to do extensive reading of old games between the two of us.
5) "Finding good lynches" doesn't mean anything. I find mafia. FT was a perfectly good lynch for D1 because there was so much uncertainty regarding so many players that time was needed to let the thread develop. Basically everything was 50/50.
6) I am being useful. I will be exponentially more useful soon. It is not illogical to find Hapa's weaksauce push of me suspicious because it is suspicious. It's like he's afraid to actually call me mafia and push for my lynch. Harkens back to Duel Mini where he was mafia and pussy footed around the issue the whole game. Going to compare the two and see if memory serves.
So, after I get back from the store and read Hapa's filter in Duel (plus maybe RTP for a vice-versa comparison), I will let you all know what I think. But Hapa calling me mafia since last night and then defaulting to lynching Slam is fucking SUSPICIOUS.
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On September 02 2013 23:44 marvellosity wrote:Bleh, I was going to talk about Hapa and yamato, but it seems a little pointless. I just want to ask yamato Show nested quote +On September 02 2013 21:16 yamato77 wrote:
6) I am being useful. I will be exponentially more useful soon. It is not illogical to find Hapa's weaksauce push of me suspicious because it is suspicious. It's like he's afraid to actually call me mafia and push for my lynch. Harkens back to Duel Mini where he was mafia and pussy footed around the issue the whole game. Going to compare the two and see if memory serves.
So, after I get back from the store and read Hapa's filter in Duel (plus maybe RTP for a vice-versa comparison), I will let you all know what I think. But Hapa calling me mafia since last night and then defaulting to lynching Slam is fucking SUSPICIOUS. If he's mafia, why make a 'weaksauce' push on you? What exactly is he gaining? I don't understand the motivation. Relating to the last bold bit, presumably if you know you're townie you know your alignment, so him wanting to lynch someone not-you is surely better than wanting to lynch you?
Hapa, if scum, would not want confrontation with me. HE KNOWS I CAN CATCH HIM.
But he does have to have reads, so he makes up the idea that I'm possible scum because I'm "useless" or whatever.
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BTW, writing up my thoughts on how he compares with his play in Duel as we speak.
Needless to say, my towntell on him for trying to break us up was... faulty.
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On September 02 2013 23:48 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2013 23:46 yamato77 wrote:On September 02 2013 23:44 marvellosity wrote:Bleh, I was going to talk about Hapa and yamato, but it seems a little pointless. I just want to ask yamato On September 02 2013 21:16 yamato77 wrote:
6) I am being useful. I will be exponentially more useful soon. It is not illogical to find Hapa's weaksauce push of me suspicious because it is suspicious. It's like he's afraid to actually call me mafia and push for my lynch. Harkens back to Duel Mini where he was mafia and pussy footed around the issue the whole game. Going to compare the two and see if memory serves.
So, after I get back from the store and read Hapa's filter in Duel (plus maybe RTP for a vice-versa comparison), I will let you all know what I think. But Hapa calling me mafia since last night and then defaulting to lynching Slam is fucking SUSPICIOUS. If he's mafia, why make a 'weaksauce' push on you? What exactly is he gaining? I don't understand the motivation. Relating to the last bold bit, presumably if you know you're townie you know your alignment, so him wanting to lynch someone not-you is surely better than wanting to lynch you? Hapa, if scum, would not want confrontation with me. HE KNOWS I CAN CATCH HIM. But he does have to have reads, so he makes up the idea that I'm possible scum because I'm "useless" or whatever. I don't get it though, he doesn't need to have *that* read on you.
Maybe he thinks he can get away with just calling me mafia?
Why he has the read isn't the point really, it's how he's handling it.
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EPT
