EPTTL Mafia LXII: TL Noir
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
30 too big anyway | ||
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yamato77
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On September 13 2013 02:41 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Ok you know what? This game gonna start sunday regardless of how many people are in it. If you have any objections speak now or forever hold your peace. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 15 2013 10:38 WaveofShadow wrote: WELL I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH THIS GAME STARTING NOW ANYMORE FUCK lolol That game, dude. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 17 2013 23:32 WaveofShadow wrote: /policy lynch half of town /in On September 17 2013 23:36 Clarity_nl wrote: True, but also has to do with everyone being fairly inexperienced in voice mafia. People are baffled by claims and stuff. Obviously voice mafia is shallow in comparison but that's because of the time put in but I think it has plenty of room to grow. Marv also happened upon some of the worst games that were played since we started all this. Doesn't get to see me win at LYLO all the time, hue | ||
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yamato77
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yamato77
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On September 18 2013 00:04 VayneAuthority wrote: can't tell yet if this game is going to be a nightmare to read or not. guess it depends on how busy everyone is Did you look at the player list? | ||
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yamato77
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Rayn will almost certainly be modkilled. | ||
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yamato77
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yamato77
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Something like that, yeah. | ||
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yamato77
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First and foremost, I will address the DP/Geript situation. Normally, I ignore these arguments becuase I find that telling the difference between mafia arguing and town arguing is quite difficult. However, this argument is still ongoing and has the potential to wreck D1, so I will put an end to it right here: @DP Geript as mafia would NOT be this ballsy at calling you mafia. The fact that he even went through the effort to make a case on you after he found your initial posts suspicious is proof enough that he isn't just making this up. Whether you agree with me or not, you should stop responding to him and look at the rest of the thread. I note a distinct lack of any other reads from you. You may be on tilt, but that is no reason to continue to argue incessantly with the person you think is mafia/thinks you are mafia. @Geript I understand that you thnik DP is mafia, however, you said it yourself that this would be a waste of effort because it is unlikely that you will get him lynched D1. This is true. Even if he is mafia (I am, as yet, unsure), you arguing with him is not going to advance your cause. If you are town, as I think you are, why don't you do the same thing I suggested to DP and look at the rest of the game? Right now, all you are doing is attracting votes on yourself. As for the other players in the game, I have a few problems with how some of your handled this situation: @Mocsta While you appear to be pushing a pro-town agenda (asking for reads/creating discussion), I note an undertone of aggressiveness and condescension that I associate with scum Mocsta. You have generally shat on whomever you were conversing with to the point that I feel your presence has actually been anti-town. As noted by others, your odd initial posting style and choice to call out a lurking Pandain is also giving legitimacy to my mafia read of you. @VisceraEyes I have conflicting opinions about you. On one hand, I don't generally like to see a VE that sheeps as hard as you have sheeped this game. As soon as the geript train got rolling, you jumped on it and tooted the horn. On the other hand, you seem emotionally involved in the game, which I take as a towntell. As of yet, I notice a void of other reads from you. You seemed to be looking at Mocsta, what do you think of my read of him? @WaveofShadow Your early contribution to this game was markedly pathetic. You complained about the amount of "shit flinging", but did absolutely nothing but add to the amount of shit in the thread. Your early conversation with DP was also completely pointless and lead nowhere. You still have yet to give out a legitimate read or even seriously weigh in on the geript/DP situation. At the moment, you are the best lynch candidate among the active players. If you're town, you would be far more useful at this stage of the game than you are now. ##Vote WaveofShadow Other notable posts: On September 21 2013 19:21 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Time to stop taking my crazy pills and join in the fun. I'm not familiar with Koshi's meta, I can't really say what the hell he's doing. Kush is making more sense than I remember him ever making, I'll keep an eye on that. Aaaaand that's all I got at this point. Out of the entire thread up to this point, I would expect more than this. This post, as an entrance, says nothing, and pushes no agenda. Mafia feel no impetus early on, and thus, do nothing. Sentinel is currently an excellent lynch candidate behind WoS. On September 22 2013 00:20 VayneAuthority wrote: not reading anything before this post, game starts now for me. I am an amnesiac and have lost the pages to the thread, my goal this game is to slowly find all the missing pages. ![[image loading]](http://cdn.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/alwaysunny-deecar.gif) Also suspicious, much for the same reason. I will be keeping an eye on him. I will be able to accurately read him based on how he chooses to re-enter the thread. That's the most important stuff that's happened in the thread at the moment. If anyone wants to bring anything else to my attention, feel free. | ||
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yamato77
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But I think he's a noob, and I'm terrible at reading noobs. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 02:44 marvellosity wrote: Funny, because this is the Wave post I jotted down as likelier to come from town. Seems a really weird angle to fake or take as mafia. Are you confused by the questions and their goal? Mafia are usually more straightforward. I'm not sure where it's coming from, but funky shit like this is somewhat more likely to come from town. I do disagree entirely with this idea. I read this as completely useless posting; Wave, as mafia, would very well feel compelled to post early, but doesn't know what to post, so he just starts some random useless conversation that has no bearing on who is mafia and who is not. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:09 yamato77 wrote: I do disagree entirely with this idea. I read this as completely useless posting; Wave, as mafia, could very well feel compelled to post early, but doesn't know what to post, so he just starts some random useless conversation that has no bearing on who is mafia and who is not. EBWOP | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:10 marvellosity wrote: Wave doesn't struggle to post. I reject that idea. There's little point in us arguing over the interpretation of that post though, because I'll go "it's A" and you'll go "it's B" ad infinitum. Okay, but overall, you cannot deny that he's basically done nothing and given zero reads when there's been plenty to making something of. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:10 marvellosity wrote: Wave doesn't struggle to post. I reject that idea. There's little point in us arguing over the interpretation of that post though, because I'll go "it's A" and you'll go "it's B" ad infinitum. And also, he did struggle to post early on as mafia in Les Mis, and IIRC, he caught some heat for it. It wasn't until later on that he really started posting well. But I digress, this argument will likely go nowhere. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:13 marvellosity wrote: Perhaps. The chances of me jumping on a player like Wave at this stage of Day 1 are approaching zero though, so whatevs ^^ So, what about anyone else I mentioned in my post? VE/Sentinel/Mocsta | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:14 geript wrote: Why does everyone forget that I was the first person to call out my wubbybumpkins. You could give an updated read on WoS, and perhaps reads on other players in the game. You know, like I asked you to do. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:17 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: @ Coagulation Why is pandain scummy to you? Just threw that out there and didnt back it up. Aside: yay me and marv share small scumread. Yamato seems town btw. I've also settled on thinking you are town. I also forgot Coag exists. He'd be my third lynch choice, for obvious reasons. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:18 marvellosity wrote: Mocsta you seem to have this meta-read on him that I actually wasn't aware of (condescension as mafia). Something I can be prone to do actually as you may know ;p The most interesting part about Mocsta for me is that he's posted a lot but I don't really think anything about it particularly positively or negatively. From his general posting outside of this game, his apparent lack of time to play forum mafia, I could see whatever tone you're picking up coming from that sort of general frustration, given how the game started perhaps? Or, he's being a dick because he gets off on being a dick when he's mafia. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzing This is actually how I read Mocsta now, btw. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:26 marvellosity wrote: Do you have any specific games that brought you to this meta conclusion, yam? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=395714&user=Mocsta¤tpage=3 Trolly RNG campaign, shits all over town, etc. Yeah. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:41 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm not particularly interested in lynching Mocsta today. While I disagree with some of his methodology, he's posting enough and in such a way that if he's scum he'll tell us about it. I could feasibly lynch LM from his filter but I'm gonna ng to read him in context when I get back to a computer. I'm precisely saying that his posting IS telling you that he's scum. | ||
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yamato77
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So you think DP is town, congratulations. Still not entirely thrilled with your game plan so far. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:47 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm saying I disagree. Why? | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:50 VisceraEyes wrote: The stuff about geript. Feels townie to me. Can you quote specific posts so I can see what you apparently see? | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:51 WaveofShadow wrote: What game plan? I don't have one. As town I hunt scum, and I make it easy for people to determine that I'm town. D1 is slow for me and always has been. I'll be able to get a read on a few players here and there but I very rarely have strong scumreads until a little later in the game unless it's something like Dandel. What more would you like from me specifically? Right now I could lynch LM based on Marv's point, or maybe justanothertownie. And don't even get me started on the lurker/no-post factor because that shit pisses me off every game regardless of my alignment. I have to stuff to say about that too but I don't want to derail if people don't want to hear it from me atm. What's your read on VisceraEyes? | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:52 WaveofShadow wrote: Yup. Geript is a ballsy player in general as town or scum but specifically attacking DP, who is a well-known strong town player and getting on his bad side is suicidal if Geript is scum and DP town. It would honestly make more sense if DP were scum and geript town, but I do not believe Geript actually has strong enough reasons to call DP scum fo realz, and I do not personally believe DP is scum atm. I agree with this, but he was talking about Mocsta's stuff about geript. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 03:52 VisceraEyes wrote: Although after reading he did go from taking a stance to saying firmly null. :/ convince me Yam. Mocsta jerry regardless of alignment. Why scum this game? In my experience, he's not necessarily this way when he's town. As I said, it's something I associate with scum Mocsta. | ||
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yamato77
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I am disappoint. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 09:31 ObviousOne wrote: Yamatbro, what you think about this justanothertownie fellow? Help me make things of consequence happen! He's probably town. | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 18:42 FirmTofu wrote: As much as I dislike DP's play this game, DP's response to me is making me warm up to him. It is reminiscent of classic town play. Townies know they are town. Therefore, when people call them scum, they instinctively believe the accuser is "bad" or scum. After all, they are town and they know that the accuser is wrong. This knowledge makes them act in anger and frustration when defending themselves. Classic thought process: "How could this asshole accuse me? I'm town! I've been playing super pro-town all game and this guy is saying I'm scum? He must be a terrible player or scum." While DP's anger toward me could be manufactured, it feels rather genuine. Scum DP is actually more likely to only argue the entire game than town DP is. Honestly, DP refusing to do anything OMGUS people the whole game is not a point in his favor, it is a point against. You should know better, because in Persona, he was actually somewhat useful despite there being arguments in the game. Unfortunately, if DP is mafia, you're probably just bad. This whole situation between you and DP is entirely too convoluted for two scum to have constructed. And yes, I am calling DP mafia, for the record. He can very well play this game properly and not like a butthurt noob. On September 22 2013 21:13 DarthPunk wrote: I do it as scum too. So no. not meta-able. Also I'm playing league. I will post when i feel like it. Pro-tip: Don't listen to a player's opinion of their own meta. Or take "I do this as scum/town, too!" as a valid excuse for legitimately scummy play. Wave has picked up on the same thing that I've picked up on, and it makes me feel very good about this read. I rescind my early scum read on Wave. On September 22 2013 20:45 raynpelikoneet wrote: FirmTofu why is your play completely different from Desert? As in, he's actually posting? This line of questioning goes nowhere, because in recent memory, FT has simply not posted and been lynched for it. As town. Questioning the difference is completely pointless. Something is off with Rayn this game. His questions are generally stupid, but he's a special kind of useless so far and it's begun to seriously bother me. RE: VisceraEyes Still pretty scummy and useless. Can be scummy and useless as town. Not necessarily a good lynch. His alignment will be clearer the longer the game goes on. RE: Mocsta Has toned down his play to some extent but his early game still bothers me. His outright refusal to respond to me is ridiculous and a pathetic excuse to not face your accuser. I think he doesn't want to argue with me because he knows I can catch him. If Mocsta was town, I would have expected a far more vehement response to my accusations than "blahblah I didn't even read Yamato's posts except for the part where he called me mafia. Totes not true." On September 22 2013 09:57 Chairman Ray wrote: Hey everyone, this is my first post here. Sorry I haven't been around since the start since I was pretty busy, but I'm definitely going to dedicate a few hours today and tomorrow doing my best to contribute. This is my third game of forum mafia. I have played real time mafia as well. Even though I'm a lot less experienced than most people here, I'll pull my weight just fine and I don't expect any newbie lenience. Last game I learned that it's quite difficult to get strong reads on people during the day. Most my reads at the start were quite off. A lot of town said scummy things, and a lot of scum were quite pro town. However during the final hour when thing started being messy, there were strong reads everywhere. So this game I will try to focus on making things very difficult for scum during the last hour. If a town ends up being lynched day 1, I want as much information to come out of it as possible. So feel free to ask me anything and I will try to be as transparent as possible. If I see something fishy, I will definitely try to flush you out as well. This dude is now the best lynch in the game, for quite obvious reasons. ##Vote: Chairman Ray | ||
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yamato77
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On September 22 2013 22:22 raynpelikoneet wrote: yamato there is a reason for my questions. You'll hear about the conclusions when i have answers. What do you think about Koshi? I have ignored Koshi's posts. Maybe he's scum? Dunno. Would expect him to be more active and spam y like the carefree townie he is, if he was indeed town. | ||
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On September 22 2013 22:28 raynpelikoneet wrote: Do you plan on reading marv this game and work from there (like you did in Desert with marv/Hapa)? Or have you done so already? Are you reading my posts? | ||
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yamato77
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On September 23 2013 01:25 raynpelikoneet wrote: He specifically said that's how he works in games. He finds out marv/(Hapa's) alignments and lynches them or works with them. He also gave me an impression he has tried to read marv's slignment, i don't see him doing so. That tactic works in Mini games. It does not work in large games. In large games, as town, I skim the thread, noting what I find suspicious, and then work with multiple scum reads. It is too hard to win a large game by getting townreads. In a Mini it is easy. But at least I understand that you seem to think this difference in my play is actually meaningful. Makes me feel better about your alignment. @VE On September 23 2013 02:45 VisceraEyes wrote: This is the thing I don't get about this post. He goes to some lengths to KINDA explain his reads on most everyone he mentions....except the person he's voting for. As if he doesn't want people to vote for the person he's voting for, rather one of the other people he called scum in this post (myself, DP for example). What's the town motivation for doing this and then disappearing? Why does he not care about getting his strongest read (in this case Chairman Ray apparently) lynched? Why not explain why he's voting for Chairman Ray rather than just say "Oh it should be obvious"? Yeah I'm voting Yamato. For the town. ##Vote: yamato77 I was feeling better about your alignment until this. Choosing to do nothing else but sheep thread sentiment onto my own wagon at a crucial time like this is actually fairly conclusive evidence that you are mafia. I see no indication before this that you actually thought I was scum, or thought anyone was scum, for that matter. The "reason" that you have voted for me is actually such a constructed piece of bullshit that I find it hilarious. You're not voting for any reason except for the fact that I voted for Chairman Ray when it should be apparent that I found the reasoning obvious? Laughably horrid. For the record, let me explain why Chairman Ray's post makes him 100% mafia. The one valuable thing I learned from Sicilian was that if there's one thing to be on the lookout for, it is terrible opening posts, especially late in the day. Now, all of you may have the impression from him that he's a noon, but it honestly makes no difference. Anyone who struggles so mightily to post anything of value that late in the day when they enter the thread is almost certainly mafia. To be fair, you could also damn him for his recent sheep vote if LoneMeow just as that wagon was taking off. On September 23 2013 04:31 Chairman Ray wrote: Why would you say that voting Umasi is a terrible idea, yet vote him anyways? It seems to me like you are scum trying to get achieve a town mislynch D1, but unable to muster up any strong cases on anybody. So instead of posting a weak case against them and have everyone call you out on it, you beat us to the punch by telling us your case is poor to begin with. If you are really town, then a town who intentionally makes a bad vote is still hurting town. ##Vote: LoneMeow I guarantee that Chairman Ray is having a difficult time coming up with legitimately suspicious things to comment on, so his gameplan is to sheep the easiest lynch out there. At that time, LM fit the profile because votes were piling on him after he martyred. He is the most legitimately likely mafia candidate in the thread, and my vote will continue to stay on him. RE: The Rest of the Idiots Accusing Me Matthew voting for me I could see happening if he's town. Still a stupid vote, especially since it came after that abomination of a case VE used to justify his sheeping. But as town, I get the impression that he listens to others more than himself. DP I'm beginning to sway on. I'm not certain either way, and it's difficult to know when he's constantly defensive and proclaiming his accusers mafia. I should have known better than to voice my doubts about his alignment when his reaction is automatic. Still, he really has yet to come up with a scum read that wasn't "this guy accused me, he maf" Mocsta I'm pretty certain is mafia, but I hold small reservations that he could just be this horrid as town. He's not the best D1 lynch, Ray is. VE is a similar situation, for the record. As scum, they will continue to dig their own graves, so leaving them alive to get a better picture of them this game doesn't hurt anything. Sentinel, I don't really have much of a clue. I didn't like his entrance to the thread in the first place, and his timely sheeping of the wagon on me is quite disturbing. Could he be this bad as town? Possibly. If I had to guess, I'd say he's mafia, for the aforementioned reasons, but I don't feel good enough about it to lynch him. Now, I have some time today to spend posting in the thread. Between work and sleep, I have not yet been afforded this chance. So for a limited time, my thoughts are available. Mind you, I generally have ignored most of the rest of the thread outside of the people I have mentioned, so most of my reads on other players are "havent looked" or "probably town". | ||
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yamato77
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On September 23 2013 05:46 Mattchew wrote: Yamato i voted you to see how angry you would get... I dont sense the fury in that post I'm intentionally not tilting this game. It's easier to do in forum mafia than in Voice. If you OMGUS and yell at your accusers, you become DP. | ||
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On September 23 2013 05:50 raynpelikoneet wrote: yamato could you comment on Koshi. This is basically what he has done: 1) Called out Mocsta for bad reasons. 2) When Vayne made a non-alignment indicative post, retracted from the vote on Mocsta and voted for Vayne. 3) Retracted from Vayne because some people called his vote out. 4) Called some random people scum and voted for LoneMeow for martyring. 5) Reasoning for FT being scum is... no, actually there is no reasoning, Koshi just summed up what FT has done this game. TLDR; Bad, useless posts, fear of being called out for his ideas/intentions, summing up what someone said and calling them scumfor it without conclusions. And that's my case, Koshi is scum. Even if I read Koshi's filter and come to the same conclusion you have, he's still not a better lynch than Ray. | ||
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On September 23 2013 00:13 marvellosity wrote: Stop this Mocsta. This is shit. Stop it. This kind of posting is what I expect from scum Mocsta. As town, Mocsta has zero motivation to insult me and goad me into an argument as opposed to sincerely attempting to figure out my alignment. Scum Moc, however, loves to do just that. | ||
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On September 23 2013 06:35 Chairman Ray wrote: I need to ask you how you came to the conclusion that a terrible opening post makes someone 100% mafia. If the reason you believe I am mafia is that in a previous game, a mafia made a terrible opening post and you believe these two things have to be correlated, then I think you are wrong because you are basing your argument off a single sample, and you still haven't explained your logic on why terrible first posts must mean mafia. The last thing I want is for this game to end before you realize that anybody can make any sort of opening post, and you can't throw a 100% mafia read on them for it. I want to win this game right here, right now. In order to do that, I need everyone's trust, and that includes you. As for my vote on LM, I was not sheeping him. In my opening post, I explicitly said that I will not be sheeping as it is very unproductive, and I'm not going to discredit myself by doing what I said I wouldn't do. The reason I voted LM is that he showed a lot of vulnerability, and putting a lot of pressure on him can give us some good information. At the very least, I don't want him to vote Umasi or himself for stupid reasons. As of now, he still has his vote on himself. It is unclear exactly why, and I want to get to the bottom of it. I can assure you that I'm not going to be keeping this vote here for the rest of D1. My vote will be a lot more productive than that. I guess by saying this, it sort of relieves whatever pressure I had on LM, but right now I think getting you trust is a bit more important. Honestly, you're writing a lot of words, but almost none of those words have been "I think X is scum because Y". It's a simple formula, and town players generally follow it to some degree. But even in this post, you admit that your vote on LM is actually meaningless. That's why you're mafia. The opening post thing is a strong tell, and your follow-up is also sufficiently lackluster as to warrant serious suspicion. | ||
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On September 23 2013 06:40 ObviousOne wrote: I'm basically rallying for Sentinel btw. He played more effectively when he was in 4 games at a time during Smurf. Convince me on Sentinel, if you won't listen to me about Ray. | ||
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yamato77
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I'm here if there's anything you want to talk about. | ||
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On September 23 2013 06:44 Mattchew wrote: Yamato what do you think of stutters In games past I would simply townread him for how he's posted here, but apparently he finally rolled scum and could actually post, so there's no real good way to discern his alignment aside from extensively reading into his scum game and trying to pick up on specific tells that he wouldn't do as town (difficult to do, given his rather lynchbait town reputation). Basically, not a great lynch. His push on Kush is sad, though. | ||
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On September 23 2013 06:47 Chairman Ray wrote: Ok, I just looked in the voting thread, I saw that Koshi voted me. He didn't post it here, and he didn't post any reasoning or analysis on why I would be scum. If you have any reason to believe I am scum, then tell me why. At the very least post your vote here instead of hoping it gets unnoticed. Excuse me if I don't understand mafia as deeply as everyone else does, but isn't consolidating on a target the very least thing that town wants to do? If there is a leading number of votes on one person, that tells us almost nothing coming into day 2. For these two reasons, I think that koshi is definitely my biggest scumread right now. 1) He said he was sheeping me in voting you. 2) Consolidation forces scum to take hard-line stances on the wagons. Just as you don't necessarily want a pile of votes on one player (as you note here), you also don't want votes spread all across many players. | ||
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On September 23 2013 06:53 WaveofShadow wrote: Ohai. Trying to get back in here in terms of town sentiment since I haven't been able to post in a lot of hours, but I will be around until deadline. Just to start off a conversation, top two to lynch from you, and why? (short form, I am aware of your recent large posts) I have some stuff I want to ask you but I am attempting to not derail current topics because it seems people are not always interested in the things I want to talk about. Ray, for his bad opening post and generally poor attempts at subsequent scumhunting. Mocsta, for his bullshit attitude toward the game, flame-baiting, and general negative interaction with the thread, which I associate with scum Mocsta. | ||
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On September 23 2013 06:55 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Well there's yamato but that's out of the question for you, right? And then there's LoneMeow bandwagon, but I want to see LM defend himself/post reads before making judgment. If you seriously think I am mafia, you need to explain yourself better than you have so far. | ||
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yamato77
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Yes, I think I can get him lynched. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:08 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: What I don't understand is how you easily rule out the possibility that Ray does truly have no idea what's going on, and the difficulty with coming up with arguments other than sheeping the easiest lynch is a symptom of that problem. Yes, it would be a scumread in a more experienced player, but looking at Ray's profile history he's come out of a newbie game recently. I don't get why you don't pursue your other reads more. I think if you read his posts, he has a clear understanding of what's happening in the game. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:09 WaveofShadow wrote: Oh, flerp. That makes a lot more sense. Yeah, you probably can get him lynched. I'm not sold on him being scum>bad town though. I'd probably lean towards him being bad town but I also have a bad track record of giving people the 'bad town' benefit of the doubt when they may not deserve it. I feel more strongly about Lonemeow being 'bad town' than Ray and Ray himself seems to be comfortable with his LM vote.... What I really want to talk about is DP v FT because I'm still pretty bothered by many of DP's reactions this game. I am aware you're currently still leaning town on him but I wonder if you know what a mafia DP is capable of? I have never played in a game where DP was mafia. Generally even bad town don't continually make posts that effectively say nothing. I'm not leaning town on DP. I'm firmly null on him. My official stance is "not going to pursue any further because accusing him doesn't help his alignment become much clearer." | ||
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yamato77
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What do you think of my updated reads? Please comment on them when you come across them. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:16 WaveofShadow wrote: At what point will his alignment become clearer? I'm not a fan of 'wait a few days and if they're still alive, lynch' because we're already going to have quite a few of those in this game. Have you played with a mafia DP before? I have, twice. In Personality 2, all he did was bitch about people pressuring him to contribute as a replacement and coast along until endgame. In Catch 22, he made shitty pushes (namely on me for accusing him) and continually claimed there was no way to catch him because he plays town and scum exactly the same. Sound similar? Hence my initial suspicion. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:17 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I just read his entire filter and he looks exactly like a guy who's playing his second (second? can't be more than fourth since he was previously in a newbie, someone confirm this) game. I don't see what would make him scummy. "I think he's noob/bad town" is a bad excuse for ignoring what is ultimately quite scummy play. Explain how his fluff posts and weak scumreads are more likely to come from noob town than noob scum. The latter is a real option, mind you, and the one that I tend to gravitate toward. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:25 Chairman Ray wrote: Since we still have a few hours left, I would like to discuss the reads you have one me right now so I don't get voted on impulse very last second. I don't buy your reasoning on why I should be the one lynched. I think that anyone can make any sort of opening post, whether they are scum or town. So what if there's one mafia in one of your previous games that made a terrible first post? In your history of mafia, has there never been a town that made a terrible first post? Also, what is your opinion on my reads so far? I appreciate that you commented on my LM read, and hopefully I managed to answer your question. I hope that maybe we could discuss things a bit more rather than you just shrugging off my reads as poor attempts of scumhunting. Right now I think there are far better people to lynch, like koshi. I just f5ed the thread, and he still hasn't made any mention on why he's voting me. I respect you for voting me, and following up with a lot of good analysis and valid questions, but all koshi did was vote me in the voting thread, and never even mentioned it here. What's that's supposed to accomplish? It doesn't put any more pressure on me, it doesn't give any information, or anything. He's probably hoping that it would go unnoticed. I'm starting to think that he's scum and he's joining the bandwagon on me. I explained that Koshi said he was sheeping me in voting you; this is not something that is extraordinary for town Koshi to do, in my opinion. If you think he's scum, what other reasoning would you put forward to justify this read, aside from that? Town make bad posts, yes, but scum make posts like yours. It's not a singular game of experience that I draw from, it is from vast experience in 20+ mafia games of my own in addition to the wonderful analysis Ver gave of my own opening post as scum in Sicilian that made me rethink how I view starting posts. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:27 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I don't think it's more likely to come from noob town, I'm saying he's neither town nor scum based on his current posting. You're not just gravitating towards the scum option, you're flat out blocking all other avenues by saying Ray's the most probable scum, and thus voting for him. I'm not blocking anything out. If I was blocking other stuff out, why would I ask your opinion on it? If you don't think he's town or scum either way, why is it so egregious that I actually have a read on him? Perhaps, in this case, I have drawn upon heuristics and knowledge that you have not, and thus, am capable of making a read that you are not. Does this make me mafia? No. I don't see why you think my read on Ray makes me scum. If that's the only justification you can put forward for voting me, you're in the same category as VE. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:34 marvellosity wrote: yamato, have you checked out Ray's only other game? Apologies if you've done so and I missed it No, but I see you think it's noteworthy. Which game is it? | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:35 marvellosity wrote: his filter http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=426146&user=Chairman Ray Not even a few posts in, I see him focusing on his scum reads and actually making sense. It's also notable that his posting looks less constructed in that game, even when he's talking about policy. It still has some degree of polish, but it's not to the same degree. Honestly, looking at that game and seeing him so easily talk about who he thinks is scum is only reinforcing my read. Maybe I'm biased by now, but it doesn't change my opinion much. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:47 Chairman Ray wrote: You have a lot of history with koshi, but this is my first time playing with him. With that being given, do you think my read on him was reasonable? Right now, I still believe koshi may be scum. I might be willing to accept that he just followed your vote in the first place, but he's active in this thread right now, I'm inviting him to give me some analysis on why he's voting me, and there still hasn't been anything yet. I still disagree with your analysis on my first post. You may have an extensive experience, but that doesn't mean you are correct. In this case, you definitely do have a misread on me, but I hope that we can resolve that now instead of post game. At the same time, I made a lot of rookie mistakes that caused you to have such a strong scumread on me. I would like to win this game so if there's any way that I could make myself easier to read for you and everyone else here, feel free to say it. If I could improve now, that may mean the difference between a win and a loss. Otherwise I'll probably be seeking your help postgame. Right now my radar is still on koshi despite you disagreeing with me. However if you are confident that he's town, then I could use some of your analysis as well on why he is, so I have a more educated vote. I still would like to hear from koshi on why he's voting me. This is a reasonable position, we may yet work from here. Koshi, do you have any other reason for voting Ray than because you think I am town? I am not infallible. | ||
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On September 23 2013 07:54 ObviousOne wrote: Talk to us about Mocsta. I've re-read through Sentinel three times and I'm seeing the bigger picture here, gonna unvote him. He's at least talking and while his vote towards Yamato is weak, his previous votes are all fine for what they are. I also buy his response regarding the vote thing. ##unvote: [UoN]Sentinel Read my posts about Mocsta. Do you agree or disagree with my evaluation of his play and its implications? | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:01 Koshi wrote: @yamato77: Well, his first post was a really easy way for scum to enter the thread. Say some stuff about himself mainly that his reads are bad and that you shouldn't pay too much attention to him. Ending with being open for questions if there are any. @rayn: WoS made a big ass post about secret taktics and it reminded me of his sekret tactics in Persona. @marv: I am here, reading everything. I don't know what to do. @JAT: Yes, I play different this time. I think it is because it is a big game now. I don't remember what I did right in Aperture that I am not doing now, probably activity. Read through his vote on LoneMeow and give me your honest interpretation. | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:08 ObviousOne wrote: Yeah let's do Mocsta. Why? The reasons you came up with are not lining up for me. | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:13 Mattchew wrote: Yam how early on did you think mocsta was scum? pretty early on, I think it was in my first post. | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:12 ObviousOne wrote: Because he's disruptive and a jerk and It will make me feel good. Can you expand this reasoning to include specific references? | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:27 WaveofShadow wrote: You know, for the record DP comes across to me as much more of an asshole this game than Mocsta. You've already established that you're not reading the game very closely, it's okay. | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:27 Koshi wrote: I actually have no problem with the reason why CR voted LM. But that last sentence is really strange. Remove that last sentence and I actually like it, but that last sentence is just strange. Don't know why that was added. So, outside of his first post, is there anything meaningful that would make you lean one way or the other about him? | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:29 geript wrote: Yes it is. Moc uses specific sets of heuristics as town and completely different sets of heuristics as scum always and forever. Moc is fine. Forgive me if I don't trust your opinion on this one. | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:29 Mocsta wrote: up to page 70. I like koshoi defence. sorry rayn my choice of lynch today is outy of yamato, lonemeow, or one of sentimental/umasi. will give more when I'm done reading spare me | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:31 Koshi wrote: Well he is attacking me for 2 reasons that you shut down immediately. He even brought it up again and you shot it down again. After that he is still on my ass. Dnu, what that is all about. Meh, he explained it well enough IMO. I'm having second thoughts about his lynch. | ||
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On September 23 2013 08:34 Umasi wrote: A: when does day1 end and B: Can we get a vote count? At this point, I don't know why he'd be biased against me, I just kinda took his word for it, but marv bringing up the previous games makes me wonder, although I probably won't lynch him today. Why are people voting mocsta/want to lynch mocsta/think he is scummy/suspicious of him/whatever? I kinda think he's town. Can you confirm or deny that LM and yourself have a history? Read my posts about Mocsta, and/or justify your townread of him. | ||
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On September 23 2013 09:34 VisceraEyes wrote: Define "seems out of place" and I'll do just that. He means it sounds like bullshit. @Moc What do you make of Chairman's filter in his newbie game that is pretty "constructed"? | ||
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On September 23 2013 09:49 WaveofShadow wrote: Look at the people voting for Sentinel though....ugh I don't necessarily dislike any of them. | ||
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On September 23 2013 11:51 VisceraEyes wrote: Yeah not scum. Just real depressed.  Is that why you voted yourself? So depressed you decided to commit suicide in your mafia game? I can give you counseling, bro. | ||
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On September 23 2013 12:11 FirmTofu wrote: Can you please link me to the post where geript claims vig? Thanks. Can you just read the thread? | ||
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VE is a tertiary candidate, especially if he doesn't get his shit together. Martyring is not a town tell for VE, neither is sulking when called scum. When VE is caught (such as he was in endgame of Nomination), he sulks as scum and tries to play it off like he understands why people think he's scummy. It's a visage. | ||
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On September 23 2013 19:23 FirmTofu wrote: Finally got some decent reads. :D Firstly, I want to address the vigi situation. As a vigilante you want to shoot the people who are currently useless and are unlikely to become useful in the future. I'll go through a few people and address the value of shooting them. We have recent replacement inactives in Malongo, Deconduo, and Blazinghand. These guys deserve some time to catch up to the thread. Their deaths would not serve a higher purpose in the short-term. Then we have people like VayneAuthority, kush, and VE. These are people that are capable of strong town games, but are currently either just trolling or posting with a subdued interest. I would say that this group of people becomes more easy to read as the game progresses, hence they aren't the best vig shots. Tier 3 are people who are sitting in the semi-lurker category, but have some posts of substance. I would include Pandain, JAT, Mr.CC, Zaragon, Sentinel, Umasi, Stutters, and a few others I can't remember in this grouping. I believe that this group probably holds the majority of the scumteam. These are people that want to stay just above lurker territory so as to avoid suspicion. I think most of these guys would be good vig shots as long as some discretion is used. Finally you have the completely useless. These are people that aren't trying to get better and aren't going to play better when asked. They are either hardcore lurking or posting little to no substance. Examples include Risen, Coag, and Lonemeow. Anyone who is in this category is a decent shot from a vig perspective, but is less likely to be scum than the previous category I mentioned. Again, not done catching up, but wtf is this post We've been bitching at you to fucking read the thread for forever and this is what you come up with? uuuuuuuuuuugggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh | ||
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On September 23 2013 20:05 geript wrote: So you just chose to give me a townread after skipping most of my posts? Where's the sense in that? to be fair to the dude, I do this all the time. Even this game >_> | ||
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On September 23 2013 20:11 DarthPunk wrote: What is dull about it? I believe he is a Vig. I believe I am getting shot incredibly stupidly, I obviously can't do anything to get geript out of his moronic tunnel, So I need other people to do it for me. I am legitimately concerned about getting shot. And I don't know why you wouldn't be concerned about me getting shot. This is the kind of stupid bitchy shit that makes me think DP is mafia. idk, maybe I was right and he's just really butthurt | ||
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He seriously EXPECTS people to care about his imagined death at the hands of a wanton vigilante geript. rofl | ||
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On September 23 2013 20:23 DarthPunk wrote: I'm going to read marv's filter. If mocsta and rayn are around can you do the same? I feel that marv has been VERY apathetic this game and hasn't really played a townie game. I wouldn't want to lynch an asset like marv tomorrow. But on day three maybe. I think marv could be scum. wtf he's serious about this omg this is too funny | ||
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On September 23 2013 21:40 raynpelikoneet wrote: Is Sentinel supposed to be good? I don't remember playing with him unless it was the games i was scum and had no time to play. idk he's playing for the mafia team this game, though | ||
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DP almost HAS to be scum hamming it up. He could not be this butthurt as town, no way. | ||
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His read on Ray goes from this: On September 23 2013 07:17 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I just read his entire filter and he looks exactly like a guy who's playing his second (second? can't be more than fourth since he was previously in a newbie, someone confirm this) game. I don't see what would make him scummy. To this, 2 hours later: On September 23 2013 09:39 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: After reviewing Chairman's filter, I have to agree that something is up here. Maybe a little south of neutral in my eyes. Might it be a product of coaching in the newbie game and nothing in this one? To this, yet one more hour later: On September 23 2013 10:43 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I'm reading Ray's filter from newbie, he seems a lot more restricted here than there which is weird. Unless coaches were really on meth (holy shit I was coaching? nobody sent me any questions, I forgot all about it), I can't really say why he would regress in his ability to post substance. Better than yamato I guess. ##Vote: Chairman Ray With basically nothing in between except filler posts. Like I said, he is mafia. | ||
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On September 23 2013 21:49 DarthPunk wrote: God I am sick of yamato. He is constantly a dick to me over the course of several games and voice mafia. Seriously I am just about done playing at this point. You are being a dick to everyone you talk to in the game. Do not talk to me about my mannerisms. I tried being nice to you. | ||
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On September 23 2013 21:57 DarthPunk wrote: Yeah. I probably should. It's just a build up of yamato going at me every game of forum and voice mafia I have played in for like 6 months I did not call you mafia in Les Mis. You WERE mafia in Catch 22 I don't even remember other forum games I've played with you in that time frame. | ||
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If you have a problem with my play, don't bring it up in the middle of a game. | ||
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On September 23 2013 22:10 DarthPunk wrote: You did it at the start with perfection. then catch 22, then for a while at the start of Persona. And all the voice mafia games don't help. And then this retarded geript tunnel on top of everything else. I'm just not having fun anymore. I'll tone it down if I'm really bothering you, but on the face, it's difficult to believe that you're actually this upset about mafia. I didn't think it got to you. | ||
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On September 23 2013 22:30 geript wrote: I already did. It seemed really weird that Ray knew who the counter option was and changed my mind. Plus, I recognize that I'm biased against tofu. Why was Ray being aware of the game such a massive tell? IIRC you thought he was town. | ||
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are you serious | ||
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I called out people I think are mafia for their voting, and that's a contentless post that is somehow notable? ugh, if only I could rely on the fact that he was good, but he was the town janitor who used his ability N1 in Boardwalk, so... >_> | ||
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1) I probably have more content this game than anyone else 2) The posts he pointed out aren't even that bad he basically complained that I spammed a couple times, which is fucking stupid | ||
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On September 24 2013 08:01 VisceraEyes wrote: I get so fucking sick of hearing you say this. You say it every fucking game. No, you don't have more content than everyone else. I wouldn't go so far as to say you're even in the lower half of the game with regard to content, but there are PLENTY of people with more content in this thread than you. Get over yourself Yamato. Find one person who has posted more meaningful content than me this game I will tear you apart in this argument, VE | ||
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On September 24 2013 08:05 VisceraEyes wrote: No you won't because I'm not having it with you. Just stop acting like everything you do is some kind of super pro-town play and anyone who doesn't realize it is a fucking moron. That's all I ask. Okay, VE okay. | ||
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On September 24 2013 08:09 marvellosity wrote: He does have a point, yamato. I have been pro-town this game, perhaps more than any other game. I don't understand why me expecting people to notice this is so offensive. Then again, I don't care. | ||
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And for others, I'm too calm. Got it. | ||
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On September 24 2013 10:26 VisceraEyes wrote: All the troll really makes me lean town on VA. Wasn't he the guy who was all "TROLLS NEVER GET LYNCHED FFS I'M JUST GONNA TROLL MY LIFE AWAAAAAAAY" last time he was lynched as town? TBH, I wouldn't expect him to be so useless as town. Trolling is something he does as scum, like in Les Mis. He does something that annoys people that he thinks he can get away with. 100% of the time, btw. Firmly scum on VA, especially since he has yet to even try to play. | ||
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On September 24 2013 10:33 VisceraEyes wrote: Yeah......yeah. That makes sense kinda, but...I mean, didn't he at least APPEAR to try in Les Mis? I don't know and I could go look but I think you'll tell me the truth. Like...pretty ballsy to not only EXCLUSIVELY troll, but ALSO blatantly not do a thing to even APPEAR to help town as scum don't you think? Did you read his day 1? He said "I'm not going to do anything day 1 because we always lynch a townie" and then proceeded to do nothing. | ||
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On September 24 2013 10:37 Pandain wrote: This is where I'm coming from. Also scum Vayne in previous games tries to appear town. If he keeps doing it though and doesn't contribute I wouldn't mind lynching him day three, however. Not in my experience, at least not early. | ||
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On September 24 2013 10:40 Pandain wrote: When did he say that? To me it appears like he simply isn't giving a shit until later on. Day 1 in Les Mafia | ||
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delayed gratification mostly, I agree with Marv that knowing his alignment would help analyze the lynch. If he dies and flips scum, we have like 3 confirmed mafia. | ||
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On September 24 2013 10:44 WaveofShadow wrote: Uh...who would those be? I'm a little less towny on Geript lately (and I forget why) so maybe him? Also Ceph, I'm not the one you should be appealing to, since I don't have a gun. It seems you have convinced some others in the town so maybe you are safe tonight. Guess we'll see. If you are telling the truth, I look forward to seeing what you have to offer. Geript/Sent/VE VE maybe not confirmed, but meh. | ||
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On September 24 2013 10:47 VisceraEyes wrote: You'll take anything as confirmation that VE is scum. A fucking duck could waddle up to you and you'd be all "Welp, that means VE's confirmed scum." -.- I will neither confirm nor deny this statement. | ||
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We lynch Sentinel. | ||
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On September 25 2013 00:13 Mattchew wrote: So yamato is town, thats no fun Did I ruin your singular scum read by being so townie I got protected N1? Should tell you something about how you're playing this game. On September 25 2013 00:44 Mocsta wrote: @Rayn: Regarding - Mattchew OP links are NOT updated. Mattchew filter http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=423071&user=Mattchew Im just going to list things that stick out to me whether pro/con and then summarise + Show Spoiler +
Overall. I have a few problems with him (1) Tries to insinuate stutters is scum through others, but provides no insight of his own. In fact, he doesnt even probe stutters directly to ascertain his alignment. Exacerbated when he confirms he didnt have a scum read on yamato when voting him... but lists stutters on his scum team (His vote should have been on stutters !!) (2) When speaking about chariman_ray opener; the phrasing is really odd. Its almost as if he knows the guy is town.. i actually cant pinpoint my issue with it, its just really odd. (3) I have played voice mafia with this guy twice now. As town, matt is easily able to establish himself. He speaks freely and with confidence, is to the point, and doesn't listen to bullshit. I'm not getting an iota of that this game. I actually can't see how this guy can be town. His actions are very scummy/deceitful, and I can't picture the motive for a town to keep asking about stutters, without providing personal insight, or querying stutters directly. Im actually really happy with this guy to be voted. And willing to vote him above anyone else I discussed prior this cycle. ##Unvote ##Vote: Mattchew For the record, this case is very good and why I am reconsidering my townread of Matt. Him being exceptionally useless and not at all attempting to prove that he is town is not what I would expect from Matt, if he were town. Him having bad reads isn't necessarily a tell, because he accused me of being mafia in Voice once when I was literally the most active player in the game and drove discussion. Officially on the fence about Matt. If he were town, I wish he would do something useful. On September 25 2013 01:05 VisceraEyes wrote: Can I just say how annoyed I am that the "confirmed town", yamato and Coag, have had nothing to say today? SOOOOO salty. On September 25 2013 05:50 VisceraEyes wrote: The fact that there are only 3 kills weighs on my mind. The fact that I was suspicious of Coag, and that he's claimed one of the three kills last night. The fact that Yamato hasn't done shit since the day post except try and leverage his position. Yes, iamp, I do have reason not to believe him. Fucking ass. VE bitching about me not having played so far today is fucking ridiculous. Even more ridiculous is this sentiment that he doesn't want to confirm me as town. However, I don't know that scum VE would continually attempt to ruffle my feathers so much. He likes to placate townies more than butt heads with them. He accuses me like every game we're in together as town, so its whatever. On September 25 2013 05:58 deconduo wrote: Wait unless I'm missing something here, how is yamato confirmed? From what I understand, and coag hasn't been that forthcoming with information, coag claimed a vig shot on yamato, and yamato claimed he was protected. Why does that make yamato town? All it means is that coag is semi-confirmed, and a doc saved yamato. Why would a scum lie about being protected, it makes sense for yamato to claim the protection regardless of his alignment. Deconduo has also attempted his best this game to argue that I'm not town, which is amazing. He's done nothing else, notably. It's unfortunate that this is what is typical of his town play. Not a good lynch. As far as Sentinel goes, he's still the best lynch of all time. His explanation of why he voted for Ray is ass, and even if it wasn't ass, is so far removed from the actual action that it's meaningless. Suddenly he realized I was town because he thought Ray was scum and I couldn't be bussing? WTF FT's case on Umasi is not as impressive as people think. Umasi is on my "not looking at for a while" list that includes Pandain/Zaragon/JAT as people that aren't posting much but are probably town. FT's other reads this game have been unimpressive. However, I do like that he self-analysed his own meta. That's not something I would expect out of scum. Cephiro is someone I think could be mafia. Will look into shortly. | ||
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On September 25 2013 06:55 FirmTofu wrote: @Yamato So my case is not good because Umasi is on a semi-lurker list? Should you be looking into semi-lurkers more than others because mafia usually hide in that sort of posting level? You're telling me that most of scum are either active or hardcore lurking? Really? No, I'm saying that I've noted posts from those players that make me feel good that they are town. | ||
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On September 25 2013 06:56 raynpelikoneet wrote: Please do. yamato: That's not what Sentinel is saying. He said your case on CR and what marv said about him made him look into CR and after doing so he thought CR was the best lynch. Really? I'm pretty sure that's not what he said. | ||
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On September 25 2013 06:22 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Well the post that started all of it had yamato give several scumreads, then vote for Chairman Ray out of all of them. By this point I had an easier time believing Chairman was red rather than green. When I thought CR was townie, scum yamato could have easily isolated and lynched Chairman since he would prove to offer the least resistance. As scum-CR though, why would scum yamato insta-bus his teammate? He offered several good reads and picked one that didn't look too strong. He'd be a lot safer, at least initially, and have the extra man, if he pushed let's say DarthPunk after that big post. But he stayed on Chairman. So if Chairman is scum, like I convinced myself he was, yamato must have been town. Now I'm unsure if yamato was scum or simply misguided, so I'm looking to his more recent activity. Yeah, that's not what he said. | ||
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I want to lead a lynch for a day. | ||
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On September 25 2013 07:11 marvellosity wrote: There's lots of things I want to do before I arrive at a lynch in principle, no, I'm not, he doesn't really have any redeeming features. one thing is that it would seem kinda odd for him to question your confirmed-townness if he's mafia, because he would know he hit you and he would know that you were saved therefore. He would have had to fake that. That's not particularly hard to do when Risen, VE, and Deconduo have all chimed in about their doubts | ||
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On September 25 2013 07:25 marvellosity wrote: Perhaps not, do you remember where Sentinel came in in regards to these guys? I know it's not much but it's the kinda thing that gives me pause with stuff. Not really. I know Risen was first. | ||
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On September 25 2013 12:26 Pandain wrote: Maybe we can get it going. Going to read him again, a lot of his D2 posts made me think he's town. Since you'll respond to this anyway, I assume you also put forth an argument that I can read? If so, link? I've been explaining my reads the whole game. | ||
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On September 25 2013 12:34 Mocsta wrote: Sorry yam. If mattchew flips scum. I think the next guy to flip should be Geript. His dwlurk yesterday was such an odd timing...and..reading his filter now I really fucked up early game to ve... He was right about Geript using ve to find Dp scummy. Geript posted his points after the comment, not before as I had said Highest % to flip for the win right? I'm not convinced Matt will flip scum, bro. | ||
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On September 25 2013 12:44 Mocsta wrote: That's ok. I know are waiting till deeper in the cycle to confirm how he will react.. if he does. So. Is sentinel really your highest % to flip? Obviously. This is also fueled by teh fact that I don't trust you 100%. TBH, I'm just like Marv in that you and Rayn are question marks. | ||
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Dude is town. | ||
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On September 25 2013 15:36 geript wrote: Ok so here's where my mind's at. The night kills were super odd in many ways. I'm assuming that the NKs were Yam/BH/Wos; we could make an interesting argument that BH/VA/WoS were the shots and that Coag is actually scum, but I see very little reason to do so there. Yam/BH/WoS isn't awful I guess. but with both VE and Marv in a game I'd fully expect if both of them were town that both of them would be targeted as it's unlikely that both would be medic'd. In the very least I'd expect a doublestack on one of them and then a freebie shot at BH. Here's the problem that I'm seeing: town got into a shitty place on D1 which is amazing for scum (yes part of that is my fault) and the best priority for scum in this type of situation is to do their best to keep it that way. So the highest priority for scum is not to remove blues but rather to remove people who can bring the thread on track. WoS is ignored half the time despite being a decent player. Yam can bring a thread on track but just as often derail a thread into "No You're scum" posting. Vayne (if he was a scum shot) is intentionally worthless until endgame. Rather my priority as scum would be to remove active quality players of which the available shots would be: VE, Marv, DP (prior to rage quit), Mocsta, Rayn and a few others. So what's the point in shooting WoS or Yam/Vayne over any of those five. I'm honestly not seeing it. There's a shit ton of scum (6); there's an amazing KP rate (1/2 round up), town seems to be mostly inactive. Where's any sort of benefit of not trying to remove the "get on track" type people to keep the thread in a clusterfucked situation? I've only seen odd kills like this in two drastically different situations: mostly inactive scum where NKs going through is far more important than anything else and mostly active experienced scum where they need a bit of time to hide before it becomes obvious. I'm not sure that Mattchew is right about Marv, but I really think that we should be taking hard looks at Marv/VE/etc. again because I'd bet that a number of the "pro scummers" are scum. This is wrong and dumb. VE wasn't a good shot because he did nothing until today. Marv has been passed over for NK many times. I've been shot before him in Les Mafia. WoS was clearly town, and BH was a replacement with the possibility of being good for town (maybe). Saying VE/Marv are worth looking into because they are alive is stupid. | ||
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I'm glad that Marv and I are on the same page about Ceph/Matt. I feel good about today's lynch. | ||
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I want you to explain why Sentinel wasn't on your list last night and yet is now "confirmed mafia". I must have missed that transition. | ||
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On September 25 2013 21:47 marvellosity wrote: yamato, on post volume alone I'm slightly concerned about lynching Sentinel. Do you seriously buy his explanations for why he decided to vote Ray? It just smells like BS to me. | ||
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he means that if left to your own devices, you will show your alignment | ||
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On September 26 2013 06:16 raynpelikoneet wrote: Why is it so that in the first 40 hours of the day we have a reasonable converation about many people. In the last 8 hours every fucking lurker chimes in and the thread explodes and suddenly there are like 1829 lynch candidates. Because big games are a clusterfuck. I'm voting Cephiro, BTW. Out of all the lurky fucks who are useless, I think he's the one who could be much more useful if he was actually town. | ||
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On September 26 2013 06:17 VisceraEyes wrote: I don't hate Ceph for scum - I don't like him for lynch today though. :/ Do something productive | ||
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On September 26 2013 06:19 VisceraEyes wrote: ##Unvote ##Vote Cephiro ? .....? | ||
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Would implies knowing, I speak in hypothetical because that's literally the only way to play a game with limited information. | ||
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On September 26 2013 06:20 VisceraEyes wrote: You said do something productive - to your eyes would that be considered productive? Not if you don't want to lynch him. I meant you should probably make a decent post on someone you actually want to lynch. | ||
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On September 26 2013 06:23 Koshi wrote: would implies you know his meta. could implies you go for a crapshoot. Why would you go for a crapshoot? You have no place to attempt to lecture me on my scumreads. You have 1, and even if he is mafia, I would bet that you are, too. Rayn loves elaborate busses. | ||
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We are still lynching Cephiro. Any last minute shenanigans should be aimed at players like Sentinel, if we're going to #yolo Moc stop being dumb | ||
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On September 26 2013 10:01 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Mocsta is not being dumb. I like his approach to that, actually. I don't, I want two wagons. More split is more stupid. | ||
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He would be the only person worth switching to. | ||
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You're going to give me your read of VE, and I'm going to decide whether you're worth saving or not. | ||
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On September 26 2013 10:04 Mocsta wrote: From what? You have given no signs of interest in him, and now giving a read. GTFO I generally focus on people that I actually think are mafia. Me not mentioning him precisely means that I am not at all inclined to think that he's mafia. you stfu | ||
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On September 26 2013 10:05 VisceraEyes wrote: Of the Chairman Ray voters I prefer geript. Everyone else I've got a pretty solid townread on....Sentinel being the least townie townread. I could do this also he's been spectacularly useless | ||
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fucking idiots | ||
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On September 26 2013 11:15 Mocsta wrote: Sigh.. I'm sorry you're fucking mafia | ||
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On September 26 2013 11:15 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: I'm done. you're just as liable for this stupidity we should have lynched ceph | ||
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I don't know that acronym. | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:18 VisceraEyes wrote: The thing I keep coming back to without trying is the fact that so many people wanted FT dead at the end of the day D1, yet when I was trying to get people to vote him D2 no one was interested. I don't know what it means, but it just seems to me like it should have been easier early on given that he was town. :/ FT died? | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:29 VisceraEyes wrote: ? I know, but my point is that he wasn't a lynch candidate really early in the day when I was voting for him. Like, immediately you were calling for a Sent lynch in direct opposition. I'm just trying to understand how he got lynched in spite of it being so hard to get a wagon rolling on him early in the day. I thought LM died. | ||
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On September 26 2013 11:14 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Night 2 The town again rampaged through the streets. More citizens were dead and the survivors were ready for blood. As night fell the search became more heated. The streets were cloaked in darkness and the gathering lynch mob lit torches and lanterns to light their way through the parts of town where the streetlights had sputtered out. They came upon the house of Lone Meow. The same scene that had occurred previously last night repeated itself in the street. Lone Meow the doctor has been lynched It is now night 2! Please send all night actions to me AND solstice Yeah, it was. VE is now confirmed mafia. | ||
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Lololololol. | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:36 VisceraEyes wrote: OH WAIT! I MEAN YES!!! I LEGITIMATELY AM TRYING TO INFUSE CONFUSION INTO THE THREAD BY FORGETTING WHO WE LYNCHED! CLEARLY I HAVE SOME SORT OF SINISTER ULTERIOR MOTIVATION FOR SAYING SOMETHING! This is oddly like scum VE to react this way. | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:38 VisceraEyes wrote: So kill me yamato I'm so beyond caring if this is the attitude I'm going to get for trying to cobble together some sort of meaning from the last few phases. Excuse the fuck out of me. Immediate martyring. I mean, it worked for DP, right? | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:39 VisceraEyes wrote: Everyone listen to Yamato. He knows everything, and has clearly caught me red-handed. You've been on my shitlist the whole game, to be fair. | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:43 VisceraEyes wrote: KILL ALL THE TOWNIES!!! KILL THEM ALL! BURN THEIR FLESH!! Moc is not town. | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:49 Mattchew wrote: Yam you my homey but your moc scumread i disagree with Seriously? Do you REALLY think Mic would fakeclaim doc as town to get some random lurker lynched? Fuck him if he did. Cannot let stupid shit like that go unlynched. | ||
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On September 27 2013 05:52 Mattchew wrote: Stupid =\= alignment and his push on me was extremely towny... Hes making cases and believes in his reads No it wasn't. He fucking dropped the case even thought he still "thought you were scum" because Marv and I came to the correct conclusion and pushed other lynches. He doesn't believe in his reads any more than it takes to lynch some townie. | ||
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Don't be fooled just because he posts a lot. | ||
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On September 27 2013 06:07 marvellosity wrote: only if we're right on Ceph. When are you around today? i have bed in ~4 hours and i'll vaguely be around up till that time if you wanna shoot the shit also fingers crossed we have a 2nd doctor I have more time to sit down at an actual computer soon. Right now I'm on my tablet. We can shoot the shit until then. | ||
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On September 27 2013 06:11 Stutters695 wrote: Ceph is a better shot than Moc. Moc is only a concern if Ceph is red, and although Moc absolutely should be policy lynched for that shit, that's not how we win if we kill him before ceph. If they are both mafia, it doesn't matter which one we kill first. | ||
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On September 27 2013 06:12 marvellosity wrote: don't answer that yamato. talk to me about iamp. you know his meta almost as well as i do. The fact that he isn't beaming green out of every orifice is disturbing. He also had notably terrible arguments IIRC. I'd have to reread his posts, but on the face, he could definitely be mafia. | ||
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On September 27 2013 06:14 Stutters695 wrote: And if Ceph happens to be town, Moc is probably just being his terrible self where he gets crazy ideas. No. | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:15 Pandain wrote: Someone please explain to me why Mocsta's other play besides roleclaim is scum? I got a town impression tbh. RTFT | ||
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On September 26 2013 09:00 iamperfection wrote: Well unfortunately we don't have that many people here it seems. which leaves not that much room for shenanigans so it looks like it will cephiro or lone are the only realistic choices. and i could do either or I don't exactly like that he basically takes no stance on the lynch at any point. I feel like iamp, even if he thought this, would push one over the other. | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:19 Pandain wrote: Uh if this is your argument its too situational. Disagree he doesn't believe reads as he's been pushing them and consistant. I'm actually going to say Mocsta shouldn't be vig'd at all. I think he's town. I'll explain later. You also had Marv and I that both said that you shouldn't take what you just said as a town heuristic. And this "I'll explain later" shit ends. If you think he's town, we have this discussion now. | ||
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It tells me nothing about your alignment, or iamp. | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:22 VisceraEyes wrote: It makes me lean townier on iamp. I feel like scum would have, in general, been afraid to comment on something so definitively when dude was about to flip. Like, not impossible, just unlikely to me. what if scum really just wanted to lynch the doctor? | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:25 VisceraEyes wrote: I just don't think there was time for scum to come to a consensus about something like that, or take action to do anything about it. Why not just either let him hang himself (he really didn't mention you Yam at all D1 before protecting you) or shoot him at night? I was a consensus townread for most of the thread. Does he have to mention me for it to be believable? No. Without Mocsta's counterclaim (that makes him mafia), there's no reason to disbelieve him. Scum would HAVE to push the counter-logic sentiment in order to secure a lynch. I highly disagree that this one action is at all townie-leaning. He takes zero risk by disbelieving the claim, and gains an excuse to vote for the doctor. This, combined with the fact that the rest of his filter reads noncommittal and altogether useless makes me think iamp is mafia. It also is kinda funny that his action fits in with Mocsta's in that the scum team went all-in on lynching the doc. VE, if you're actually town, you need to realize that you may be the best townie alive tomorrow, and you will be responsible for making sure a scum gets lynched. If you don't side with mine or Marv's reads, who are you going to push tomorrow? I want definitive answers. | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:33 VisceraEyes wrote: I think this makes JAT town maybe. :/ The inception-post also makes me feel better about Ceph being mafia. | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:34 Pandain wrote: 19 pages of filter before day two. Super active all time. Proactively pushing players. A lot of his pushes seem smart and have good logic. He isn't being dumb or bullshitting(pre bullshit). Like before this I could not put him even near my scum list. He has said plenty of things that are flat-out bullshit, especially D2. Marv and I both pointed them out. Activity is not an alignment tell with Moc, as has been said many times. Neither is pushing lynches. Remember, HE LIKES BEING MAFIA. | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:39 iamperfection wrote: What are you talking about your last post was like 2 hours before the lynch why did you only take a stance on the lynch when LM claimed doctor? | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:41 iamperfection wrote: because i was debating on who to kill and this is what happened in front of me. I looked at his filter and thought he was full of shit why did you not believe him before the counterclaim? there's seriously no good reason to lynch the claim without one | ||
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On September 27 2013 07:46 iamperfection wrote: i never believed him. He came in 10 mins before the lynch to claim dr. When you open his filter there is no mention of yamato. That looks like a fake claim to me just in hope to get a counter claim. So you wrong i had reasons Him not mentioning me does not mean he didn't have a townread of me. Nor is the timing of a claim scummy. Marv claimed cop 30 mins before lynch once, and he was town. I don't believe you, iamp. | ||
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On September 27 2013 10:49 Mocsta wrote: Like. U really need to review how u pressure and scum hunt. How am I even meant to respond to this? It's just slander yam. I am far from playing a perfect game, but at least I express clearly what my issues with play is. The same can not be said for u. Not once throughout the whole game have u actually explained why I'm scum. Other than he enjoys playing scum... And so what? I don't need a lecture from you on how to play. | ||
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i am disappoint. | ||
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On October 06 2013 03:17 marvellosity wrote: As an aside, I enjoyed playing with Umasi, jat, Zaragon - 3 newer players. I hope they stick around and play more. All 3 were easy town reads and tried to help in the game. Agreed. | ||
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On October 06 2013 14:25 gonzaw wrote: If nobody gives a shit, then how are you going to make sure a game like this doesn't happen again? People will now go "meh" and join the next game and do the exact same thing. The very least we could get an analysis post from MZ or someone so....you know...people can learn from their mistakes and shit I could critique every townie's play in the game, but I trust that the most egregious offenses committed have already been realized. If someone wants my opinion of their play, I will be happy to share it. | ||
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