Roulette Mini Mafia

On June 04 2013 09:00 prplhz wrote:
@VayneAuthority Why 31?

@Stutters695 I don't understand why you want to lynch s0lstice.

On June 04 2013 09:29 layabout wrote:

If you say that you arent going to post, pressuring you for a contribution serves no purpose for a townie

On June 04 2013 11:00 JarJarDrinks wrote:
sup y'all. I'll go ahead and agree w/ the claim all roles during the day plan.


@vayne - do u have any response to these?


Are you still planning on playing the same way you have in your previous games? Especially in regards to day 1?

On June 04 2013 13:00 mkfuba07 wrote:

What aspect of this game makes you feel like you'll naturally be playing way differently?

On June 04 2013 23:38 WaveofShadow wrote:
I may advocate a lurker lynch today. I am aware that people (ie Vivax) have stated their activity may be low but everybody can't be excused. I would not be surprised in the least if 1 or 2 scum are hiding thus far since there has been essentially no reason to post yet. Activity is shit so far and there is nothing useful to talk about yet; as far as I can tell people who have planted their votes have done so with mostly minimal reasoning and if the intent was to generate discussion, well it hasn't really.

Sorry to be a downer but I both love and hate D1 and this game has me leaning towards the hate side, strongly.

Sloosh, is your lurking indicative of you being scum, ie Carnival Cruise?

Rayn, where you at?

JJD having just played scum with me, if you had to evaluate my play thus far, what would you think?
Vayne you can answer as well.

On June 05 2013 01:51 Ace wrote:
Every claim is going to be taken at face value anyway so there won't be anything to base off reactions.

On June 05 2013 01:56 Ace wrote:
oh, well of course

I was thinking someone would be like "that claim is bullshit!" then we have to force people to read the OP. Again.

On June 05 2013 10:55 Stutters695 wrote:
Well I don't have the time to do detailed analysis of everyone I want to look into right now but let's bounce some suspects.

First for me is Fuba. Check out his long post his only suspect has been Vayne and with his answer he takes some time to defend himself and waffles on Vayne. Very noncommittal, doesn't really pressure and has been mia. I haven't played with Fuba in ages but I remember him being much more active. Do you think he's strapped for time and town or a scummer getting by due to the relative inactivity.

On June 05 2013 10:59 jaybrundage wrote:

Well how would you start day 1. I stuggle day one because there is no content to go off of. And the whole purpose is to create content.

On June 05 2013 15:27 Oatsmaster wrote:
WHY NOT FUCKING ACE GUYS.

SERIOUSLY.

On June 06 2013 02:45 layabout wrote:

How did he come to be a townread? Especially if he "doesn't really have a meta"

It better not be because of this:
+ Show Spoiler +

On June 06 2013 03:13 Vivax wrote:
Vayne, what makes you think the most active guy in the thread is scum and Rayn town after his last post.

Why do you think is fuba scum?

On June 06 2013 03:28 Vivax wrote:
If you're town the site you come from breeds really bad blood.

##Unvote
##Vote Rayn

Can you give me an opinion on Rayn's last post?

On June 06 2013 03:32 Vivax wrote:


I'd shoot you any day for the way you play. I shot you precisely cause you didn't contribute, except for flaming Prom.

On June 06 2013 03:34 Vivax wrote:


So did they call my case shit when I wanted to lynch him D1.
I don't recall you being one of the supporters.

On June 06 2013 03:35 WaveofShadow wrote:

Vayne I don't give a shit about D1 gutreads. There has been plenty of activity in the thread thus far, and unless the entire scumteam is lurking right now (possible, I know) then we should be able to find one WITH reasoning.

This isn't epicmafia; we actually put forth effort on D1.

On June 06 2013 03:39 WaveofShadow wrote:

Hey this sounds familiar. You use this reasoning yet this same thing happened to me in the same game where they killed Kita and scum were trying to do something with it because in Kita's like 2 posts he mentioned me.

Am I not allowed to use the same reasoning here to find a scumread? There were 4 people on that wagon trying to get me lynched and Rayn is one of them.

You get into these fights almost every game with people here; I just don't understand how they must play on epicmafia. Does everybody just post random bullshit and hope they find scum based on luck alone? Or sit back and hope other people do the analysis for you? Explain what it is you DO here, Vayne.

On June 07 2013 08:08 WaveofShadow wrote:
None.

On June 07 2013 11:20 WaveofShadow wrote:

Because it's possible they're both town you derp.

On June 07 2013 11:23 Oatsmaster wrote:

So out of me and Ace, who do you wanna lynch?

On June 07 2013 13:25 Ace wrote:


I did address it. I said the next night a cop can just check me.

On June 07 2013 14:00 Ace wrote:
Well as I already stated even before the check I had a scumread on Oats. Just answering his statement that I didn't address the scum side of the argument. What's your take Vayne?

On June 08 2013 03:59 kitaman27 wrote:


If you feel that you are confirmed town, why were you running around like your head was cut off last night referencing non-existent vig shots?

On June 08 2013 04:05 WaveofShadow wrote:

What?
No.
GK at least put in the effort.

On June 08 2013 04:10 WaveofShadow wrote:

You're right, but I also said it pisses me off. YOU also said you wouldn't be playing the same way this game. Maybe you've reversed your meta now.


You are dead weight right now if you're town, and I don't tolerate dead weight in my town.

Again, for somebody so proud of his play on other sites I haven't seen much of that great play here. Who do you want to lynch and how do you plan to actively assist the town in getting your primary read lynched?

On June 08 2013 04:14 JarJarDrinks wrote:
????

On June 08 2013 04:16 WaveofShadow wrote:

I don't know what ATE is.
'Percentages and KP reduction' are not good enough when you have made no active contributions to the game this far. As I've said I may not be pushing you today but I certainly will not be dropping this entirely.

On June 08 2013 04:17 Oatsmaster wrote:

please do some work, Read both our filters, vote for the one you think is scum.
Thats the best way to get today correct irregardless of mine or Ace's alignment.
DO IT.

On June 08 2013 07:03 jaybrundage wrote:

If Ace is scum he can just back out with a Miller MAH BAD bullshit.

If anything if ace is as strong a mafia player as so many say he would just fakeclaim like he did on Oats. Then try to talk him self out the second lynch by saying Oats was miller.

On June 09 2013 12:09 WaveofShadow wrote:
That is NOT all.
I wrote down random notes to myself from the time I last left until now:
Scum are often around at the time of a lynch, see who posted. Whoever analyzed that in Les Mafia was right.

One scum not voting for Oats to spread out.
If we are to listen to Vayne (looks really opportunistic to me, first useful thing he's done all game? scummy.)
Then listen to Oats maybe, and check out fuba

Ace ABSOLUTELY MUST BE LYNCHED TOMORROW. There is no way around this. If they are both town then we just got fucked by RNG and there's nothing we can do.

Don't waste a check on him, he dies. Period. I don't want to ggive him the chance to worm his way out.
If this was a scum plan to get Oats killed then they have thought the next few days out and they have a pretty grand scheme going on so we're going to have to be on our toes.

I want Ace dead but it worries me that he put in so much effort as to go through the entire thread and respond to everybody even though Oats was esseentially already going down.
This was either done because he's town or to make sure no one switched votes later on, something which didn't seem very likely at all.

The shitty part is that again if it's RNG that fucks us then we're just fucked because we can't let Ace live after that.

In conclusion, burn Ace with cleansing fire and stay the fuck active or we lose.

On June 09 2013 12:14 WaveofShadow wrote:

I think with this very question you are already becoming more useful.
Why now?

On June 09 2013 12:16 WaveofShadow wrote:
Let's chat, you and I, since you seem to be around.
Firstly, you mention that there are 2 scum that bussed Rayn hard. Referring to Ace's separation of those who voted Rayn into the "had good reasons to vote" camp and the "inactivity lynch" camp, which camp are those scum more likely to fall?

Secondly, what are your thoughts on how we need to proceed on Day 3?

On June 10 2013 08:24 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:


That implicates moi does it not? He was pushing my lynch.

On June 10 2013 10:42 layabout wrote:
vayne, sent, kita scumteam maybe prplhz

On June 10 2013 10:53 layabout wrote:

don't call me dumb.

don't ask me to explain stuff Mr "he isn't the mafia power role i swear, reasons? shit! errr.... gutread "

On June 10 2013 11:52 WaveofShadow wrote:

I find that hosts rarely agree to artificially shorten the day; in this scenario I feel even more so that your request would be denied.

Jay there is plenty to talk about just because we already have a lynch target for the day. For instance, I actually forgot to look into the post timings for yesterday's lynch into Oats which I said I was going to do, based on the fact that scum are more likely to be around at the time of lynch to be able to react to shenanigans/claims/what have you.
People who posted directly after the lynch (within 1 hour):
prplhz, mkfuba, Sentinel, kita, layabout, vayne.

Prplhz Sentinel and mkfuba posted directly within 15 min of the lynch, though prplhz was around a little bit before as well.
Of these I would like to direct attention to mkfuba.
His post directly previous to the flip:

Not the timestamp. This is a full day before the flip.
Now look at this.


5 MINUTES after the flip.

This does not seem entirely coincidental to me as scum are often extremely active directly around the time of a flip. It would be one thing if he had post on and off throughout the day as some of the others who posted directly after did but mkfuba contributed ABSOLUTELY NOTHING for an entire day and very little before that point; he is simply coasting on his 'confirmed town' status given to him by?

None other than Ace.

Kita I am aware there is a deal of merit considering he would have been the first to push Rayn somewhat on the first day and you gave him a recent townread yourself, but what do you think of this? A possible scenario I envision (and not entirely unlikely if Ace flips red) is that the decision to bus Rayn happened earlier on to give a lot of people towncred, especially considering Rayn may have informed his team that he would be inactive and therefore likely to die. This idea hinges a little more on the idea that Ace is scum however, since it would require massive lategame gambling and the sacrifice of scum's arguably strongest role. If Ace is scum this appears to be more likely since there must be serious planning going on for Ace to sacrifice himself alone.

In any case if the scenario I pointed out appears unlikely then by all means ignore it for now; I'd like to hear what people think of mkfuba atm.

On June 12 2013 03:37 kitaman27 wrote:


prpl claims roleblock on Vivax.
Vayne claims medic on Wave.

Are you saying that mafia shot into the player they were protecting or that they double stacked last night? How wouldn't Vivax be scum if you have a mafia read on Vayne?

On June 12 2013 03:47 Vivax wrote:


I have been roleblocked though.
I find it too hard to imagine that scum doublestacked JJD.

Kita mentioned that he would not have written a case against ace knowing he was going to fakeclaim cop cause he'd have sided with him.

Well he still did side with him after writing his case, so that argument doesn't even make sense, but now he looks like he was pressuring ace while lynching Oats.

On June 12 2013 07:59 jaybrundage wrote:

Ace could of claimed to protect Sent which has been noted. But he didnt do a good enough drawing attention away from him.

So then what is your scum reads given what you have said?

On June 12 2013 08:05 kitaman27 wrote:
I'm thinking its the other way around. He pulls that stunt BECAUSE his partners are in trouble.

On June 12 2013 08:11 kitaman27 wrote:


If the bad players are lynched, mafia kp immediately drops to one and the game is next to over. Cop claim earns him a lynch and an extra kp and perhaps we forget about the people who are suspicious on night one.

If he is in good standing and his scum buddies are in good standing, then why make a trade at all? Keep mislynching into victory.

On June 13 2013 10:36 Vivax wrote:


If you lynch prplhz and he flips scum you will know I'm town as well, except that you won't lose a townie to find that out.

On June 13 2013 10:36 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:


Explain this justification I have a hard time connecting the words in the first paragraph with the vote in the second.

On June 13 2013 10:46 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:


So you are admitting to the possibility that he's town and it would make a lot of other things make sense as a result?

Why can prplhz and stutters not be of different alignments?

Why is your post so scummy?

On June 15 2013 04:43 mkfuba07 wrote:

Sorry if I've forgotten or missed the reasoning, but why is sent obviously town?

On June 15 2013 05:48 mkfuba07 wrote:

A greencheck from vivax is enough for you to consider sentinel confirmed town?

On June 17 2013 08:15 kitaman27 wrote:


Last cycle you said your vote was on Vivax because it gave info about Sent. Now that sent has flipped, what is your case against Vivax?

On June 17 2013 08:27 kitaman27 wrote:


Thoughts on Vivax's scum buddy?

On June 17 2013 10:44 jaybrundage wrote:

Yea this wasn't the answer i was hoping from you. Yes you switched to the person i think it scum. But you didnt so with no content again. At least give some under lying reasons why he is scum. As kita said vote your biggest scum read. Sheeping isn't going to get us anywhere as we get closer and closer to lylo

On June 17 2013 14:28 jaybrundage wrote:


While yes scum can post long posts as well. I believe its a bit harder the them. Cause they arent actually scum hunting they are faking it. Thats why some peoples scum meta is simply to lurk cause its easier for them. And they dont have to actually produce content. I want your posting to prove that you are genuinely town.

If you dont know how to play a game of mafia and establish your townieness with your posting then go look at WoS. He produces content so it easy to see that hes most likely town. I don't think im asking you something extraordinarily difficult.

Also the fact that you have no prefrence between prplhz and Vivax kinda intrigues me. Why dont you care which one dies. You say that you believe Vivax's scum buddie to be stutters. But at the same time you change your vote for prplhz.

Time to start caring about the game ##Unvote ##VoteVayne

On June 17 2013 14:36 jaybrundage wrote:

I'm not trying to meta you. I don't usually use meta cause im lazy. I'm calling out your bad play for what it is scummy. Your posting no content and its scummy.

On June 17 2013 14:42 jaybrundage wrote:

No Im calling you scummy cause you dont post content and thats scummy. I dont know what meta your talking about. Meta implies looking at things outside of the game. Which i haven't done.

Also you conveniently forgot to answer these questions. These are other reasons i think you might be scum.

On June 18 2013 07:45 prplhz wrote:
doesn't matter, it's 15 mins until deadline. there's absolutely no chance of me not getting lynched.

anyway, i was town.

On June 18 2013 07:41 mkfuba07 wrote:
There are too many people left in this game for me... I can't get my mind straight. I've been reduced to little more than null on too many people after the sent mislynch. I'd been down to sent, vivax, prplhz, and a bit stutters, but was so sure of sent. Now it's like I'm just shooting blindly into a crowd. I don't feel like scum vivax would give a town read to sentinel when he was such an easy mislynch. I also feel like prplhz seems really sincere in his recent posting, but I'm often really swayed by these last minute appeals, so I usually keep myself from posting all that much.

I don't know... I feel like we're walking into another mislynch, but I don't know who we should lynch instead. I'd feel better with a Vayne lynch, probably, but that might just be because he's been bothering me all game. I've flip-flopped all over him, and can't come up with a town read unless I interpret his typical nonchalance as a town tell (which I have been until now). I don't like how much faith he seems to be willing to put into the night actions, when I personally feel like it's very difficult to trust anything about them. His willingness to lynch vivax just to get information from night actions, when night actions could have easily been manipulated by scum in some way, is something that I don't really expect from town. Then there's how positive he was of sent being town, when most people were either null/unsure. I really don't like any of it.

Is anyone else up for a vayne lynch? I doubt we have enough time/people to switch it, but this lynch feels wrong...

##Vote: VayneAuthority

On June 18 2013 07:58 mkfuba07 wrote:
What are you talking about? I don't see how those two situations are in any way similar or related. I didn't even say anything about you giving rayn a town read. Scum vivax, with the cop role, could have given a town read to anyone in the game. He instead gave it to the one person most likely to be mislynched (imo). That would have been a silly play for scum.

On June 18 2013 08:10 mkfuba07 wrote:

The difference is the ACTUAL ALIGNMENT OF THE FLIPPED TOWN READ/CHECK! And also the complete lack of any reasoning whatsoever on your part. Town vivax was cop, he checked his scumread, scumread comes back town, he says in the thread that he's town. There is reason for town vivax to believe it. Exactly as much reason as you would have had to believe the check if we lynched vivax and he flipped town, as a matter of fact. Scum vivax, on the other hand, was giving a town *check* on someone who is likely to be lynched. That *doesn't* make sense.

You gave a town *read* on someone for no reason whatsoever. That person ended up flipping and was revealed as the scum power role. You had no reason to give a town read on rayn as town (as shown by the fact that you didn't actually have a reason for your town read). As scum, however, the reason is obvious.

That is how the two are different.

On June 18 2013 08:15 WaveofShadow wrote:

How was he trying to change his lynch exactly by 'buddying' you?
I remember you bringing that up earlier and thought to myself that it was strange that you'd think of ti that way.
You, my friend, have warranted a re-read.

In fact I think I want to start actually putting some effort in now since my lategame play is notoriously bad.
Kita, thoughts on the mislynch please?

On June 18 2013 08:16 mkfuba07 wrote:

ROFL

Please please please please PLEASE try to get me mislynched.

Oh, and it's very townie of you to say that you're going to keep trying to get vivax lynched, then pointing out two more scumreads who are supposedly working together. Do you not see the error here?

On June 18 2013 08:27 mkfuba07 wrote:
Oh dear, not being noted by vayne. How will I ever live with myself?!

You're wanting to lynch vivax. That's one. Then you're saying that both me and jay are setting you up for a "mislynch". That's three. Either you don't actually believe vivax is scum, or you don't believe that "setting you up for a mislynch" is actually scummy. You can't have both.

On June 18 2013 08:27 WaveofShadow wrote:

I think scum do what they wanna do when they're on the chopping block.
You should know this.

On June 18 2013 08:37 WaveofShadow wrote:

Or, ya know, scum WIFOM and shit, and it means nothing and you constantly look into it for what reason?
A scum Rayn would try to garner trust from a vet, huh? I think in every game I've ever played every time I've ever made obvious attempts to 'buddy' people (as town, mind you) I get called out for it. Vivax I believe one of those times was you.

If anything I think buddying up to a vet as scum is a horrible idea because it is likely to make said vet take a long hard look at you. (PS I don't have much regard for the vet/newbie split anymore for the record, I need to stop using the terms.)

On June 18 2013 08:58 WaveofShadow wrote:
Vayne I apologize for saying this in advance because I don't put much faith in it as a heuristic, but you're certainly pulling one of those 'the lady doth protest too much' deals on me here. I'm pretty sure I made it clear that I don't know what I'm going to find when I dive you, and I'm not doing so just because I think you'll turn up scummy. In fact if you're ever looked into any of my filter-diving analysis, much of it pulling up points that can be thought of from either alignment and turning to the thread for assistance.

This is a stupid question, but why are you so concerned?

On June 18 2013 09:22 WaveofShadow wrote:

Yes but there's a difference in how we play when we're about to get mislynched. (Which, as you've said, does not happen in the end.)
Your play is very self-centered and you're always out for survival, even when it's not arguably necessary (see your cop claim in I Swear). When I was about to get mislynched as GravityMan I didn't spout defense after defense, because you can still win a game even after being mislynched if you provide something that helps the town kill scum after you're gone. Your primary concern should be to lynch scum, not your own survival. End of story. I am aware that is not indicative of you being scum or town because that's just the way you play, but it's part of the reason why people haven't found you particularly useful in many of the games we have played together.

Eventually I imagine if you keep up your behaviour the way it has been you'd be the type of person to get policy lynched as people will realize it's not worth keeping you alive until later on. (Although a counterpoint to this is kushmasta's baffling lategame survival rate despite his play every game.)

On June 18 2013 09:39 WaveofShadow wrote:




I believe I've asked you this before, Vayne in other games. What do you plan on doing to help town win this game besides defending yourself? Why should you not be considered a policy lynch in future games?

On June 18 2013 09:59 WaveofShadow wrote:

Of course it pertains to this game. You blame other people for your own scumhunting shortcomings ingame; you did so in I Swear. You shouldn't be giving a shit about what other people think of you; hell you've even said you don't give a shit what other people think about you but your play always ALWAYS belies that you actually do care. If you truly didn't care you'd let people say what they want and you'd go out and prove yourself through your actions. Which you never do, hence having to resort to things like shitty cop claims.

This discussion is helping me a great deal with my meta analysis btw, so thanks.

On June 18 2013 10:14 WaveofShadow wrote:

Even JJD was confused. It's not apparent at all.


Like....wtf IS this.
I truly don't understand how your mind works, Vayne.
I've been trying to read Les Mafia from the town perspective and, like I've stated before, you try harder and look townier in that game than any other game you've played in thus far.
Why on god's green earth would you think a Rayn red flip where he names you town makes you confirmed town?

Your play in general is a clear indication for you being town this game (and it certainly should have been clear in I Swear but then you do things like YOLOshoot a town Oats) but I worry because I know you've become aware of your meta on this site. It's stuff like this that is going to force you to become a policy lynch in games that people (or at least I) play with you.

Still reading.

On June 18 2013 10:23 WaveofShadow wrote:
That's not true, you gave plenty of reads and analysis in Les Mafia when you were scum. So I certainly know that kind if thing IS possible from you, but for some reason you're more content to sit back and do nothing as town and let your team lose. You're right I was just as responsible for the town loss in I Swear as you were.

Anyway,

Can you explain how the game is solved now if Vivax flips town?
There's a bunch of other questions I have for you in my past few posts, of course it's up to you as to whether or not you want to answer them.

On June 18 2013 10:32 WaveofShadow wrote:

Sorry I kinda loled.
Anyway,

Can you explain this in more detail? I don't really follow.

On June 19 2013 03:34 kitaman27 wrote:


Ruh roh. Whenever people start posting that at night, I find myself dead a few hours later.

On June 19 2013 03:45 Vivax wrote:


Sup bro.

Tell me why I would not simply stay silent when people scream for a Sentinel lynch.
It's simply not true when you say I had no other choice.

Sit back, watch Sentinel getting lynched.
Instead, I'd try to stop his lynch when the other option at the start of the day was lynching me?

Vein pls

On June 20 2013 03:13 mkfuba07 wrote:

If vivax flips town, who do you think is scum?

On June 20 2013 03:44 Stutters695 wrote:
Vayne are you here?

On June 20 2013 03:57 jaybrundage wrote:
Looking over him the big points i dont like. Is his self proclaimed confirmed town just from rayn calling him a town read.
Here he defends it saying that Rayn calling him town when Vayne doesnt have any influence on the thread day 1 that it doesnt make sense for scum to buddy with town like that. And he some how takes this instance to call him self confirmed town.

Again talking about Rayn calling him town. Its all WIFOM and he keeps coming back to it cause its his only argument that he has for him being town.




His not caring who died voting prplhz even tho he doesnt have a scum read on him. Says he doesnt have a case on Vivax just wants him to die. He just wants someone to die besides him and his scum buddie. He makes it obvious he doesn't care who he lynches. I made one comment to him about why he doesnt have a case. And he just changed his vote. No conviction about his read.




##Vote Vayne
Plz vayne convince me other wise.

On June 20 2013 04:15 kitaman27 wrote:
Vayne could you point me to what makes jay scum outside his suspicions of you? Right now it looks like an omgus.

On June 20 2013 04:45 mkfuba07 wrote:

The difficulty for me when it came to that question was that the only people I considered "confirmed town" were myself, kita, and to some extent WoS (though I certainly had a constant nagging feeling that he might have played us somehow). So if he was asking me if scum might have been playing us like this, the only implication in my mind is myself (not scum, but that's what scum would say XD) or kita, who would have had to withhold KP on the offchance that the doctor would protect him, in an effort to confirm himself town. Neither of these are correct.

My problem is, given the night actions as they are, if we lynch vivax and he's town, then that means that vayne and stutters are most likely scum. That's at odds with my belief that scum didn't withhold kp at night. So the options are vivax is scum, there was a lie/godfather somewhere in you/layabout, or scum withheld kp N2 to make vayne look like confirmed town without then using that held kp to burn the vet role (or possibly some combination of the last two).

Oh wow, just realized that if scum used the kp to burn the vet, then anyone who later used it would be implicated as scum (if it became known that they used a KP in this way), and if they didn't use it then they would reveal that Ace shot himself to burn the kp. That would ultimately make it a worthless action, right?

Given this, I'd much rather lynch vayne than vivax. His major contributions this game have been confusing logic, misrepresentations of things others have said, and pushing for a Vivax lynch which would supposedly confirm him town if vivax flips town, when I see a town vivax as doing almost the exact opposite. I also just went back to check, and the night after the sentinel lynch, after I kept questioning vayne about him calling sentinel "obviously town" (questions that he decided to stop answering), was the night I got shot. The major thing holding back my voting for him was the belief that vivax was town, and scum wouldn't just not use one of their KP, but this absolutely makes sense to me now.

The fact that vayne's been trying to make it seem like I've been setting up a mislynch on him for the last few days was just irritating and overly defensive when I thought he was town. But it's clear now that he was accusing me of that just so he could do the very same thing now. He preempts every possible action that could have been taken against him, because he knows that eventually they'll be coming. He consistently considers more members of a scumteam than are even possible, and now appears to be appealing to the towniness in his definite scumread (stutters) to declare vivax and jay as another definite team. Appealing to the *towniness* of *scum*. Doesn't make sense.

Oh, and why did Ace sacrifice himself like this when it made no sense to do so? So it would look absolutely insane to consider that they would give up such a strong scum player for one extra KP, and then just not use it.

##Vote: VayneAuthority

On June 20 2013 05:09 mkfuba07 wrote:

No, vivax flipping green means many things. It means he wasn't scum. It means his cop check is as trusted as can be with a roaming miller/godfather about. It means jay is likely town, and in turn layabout is likely town. It means that the only two scum left at that point are you and stutters. And this is nearly impossible if we assume (like I had been) that scum didn't hold their KP.

You're appealing to the simple when it doesn't make sense to be doing so. The simple explanation is next to impossible. You also completely ignored the substance of the case and are focusing entirely on the setup-based possibility of you being scum while ignoring the scummy things that I claim you have done. Then you resort to ad hominem attacks.

On June 20 2013 05:14 kitaman27 wrote:
##Vote Vayne (Just because I feel left out on the insults. Will probably be changing)

I still feel that too many people have town reads on Vivax without explanations. Can anyone point it out to me?

On June 20 2013 05:16 jaybrundage wrote:

I have trouble reading Vivax. I had a town read on him day 1 for defending me and helping make sure i wasn't the day 1 mislynch. But as his activity wavered i began to doubt my early read on him and that he could be scum. However there was people I was alot more sure were scum. Sent and then prplhz. It just seems hard to pin anything scummy on him.

He has been having a fairly straight forward game with lower activity then I like. The biggest thing that i think can implicate him is that he was roleblocked when there was no shot. But the same thing happened to Sent and Sent turned out to not be scum.
Ill go over Vivax again. But it just seems like most of the case against him. Is based on blue's and KP instead of actually content in his filter.

Also the fact that WoS mentioned scum messing with blue roles or faking using them. Made me really suspicious about people that were "confirmed town" via blue roles. With all the no shots going on. Isn't it likely that scum just held a shot off one day or decided to use a blue role to get town cred for the late game. The scum have done a solid job so far blending in. I wouldnt put it past this scum team to lost KP to gain towncred late game. Thats why I think Vayne is a more likely candidate as well.

On June 20 2013 08:56 mkfuba07 wrote:
Updated and compiled N2 scum theory v.2.0.0.1:

Night two, scum get doc and veteran (possibly cop, who knows). They do not have roleblocker (prplhz). They have two people double stack JDD, and in this way guarantee that exactly one person dies that night regardless of who is roleblocked. This sets up a situation where there's exactly one kp missing, and by lynching vivax vayne becomes confirmed town.

So... lynch Vayne.

On June 20 2013 09:11 Stutters695 wrote:
Or justify your vote by anything other than night action speculation

On June 21 2013 06:06 Vivax wrote:
Vayne, didn't you say that you think jay is scum?

On June 21 2013 07:32 Vivax wrote:


That's precisely the reason for why I'm growing doubts about my jay + vayne scum theory.
He's currently skipping on the chance to switch to my lynch along with thread sentiment.

Vayne, if you put your money where your mouth is we can switch to jay.
Fuba, would you be in for that?

On June 21 2013 08:12 jaybrundage wrote:

Why do you think stutters is town. Ill have to go over him. But not even placing a vote just seems off to me. And Vivax could of been fingering him for as a lynch candidate to WIFOM it later

On June 21 2013 08:47 kitaman27 wrote:
A no kill would be fantastic! We could just no lynch and get two cop checks rather than one, while continuing to roleblock the same player. If kills never go through, we cop check every player a couple times and the game is solved.

I think ensuring the roleblocker and cop do not overlap should be a priority.