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On May 25 2013 08:52 prplhz wrote:
i really liked scum single kp
a lot of games this size will be scum 2kp and then drop when scum gets lynched but that just makes for snowballing games, scum will be powerful for longer if town can't kill them and scum will get nerfed if town manages to kill them, and that's not too cool
funny enough almost all my games go to LYLO 
(Death Factory and World at War are clear exceptions)
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Also I don't even know the relative skill levels of all the people in the game. What you may think is someone making the Scum team unbalanced, I may just view as "oh ok, this is going to work". It's not like the Town didn't have players that would have helped or moments of brilliance. You chose to ignore it. The Promethelax lynch was a gift platter that you still can't seem to figure out. Go back and re-read what happened there.
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I thought you played fine. No clue why (or can't remember) Vivax shot you because I thought there were some easier shots to take. When he shows up ask him.
ETA: Also Oats had investigated you and found you innocent Night 0. Was weird that he didn't seem to be basing anything off your alignment.
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unrelated. how could you convince anyone that post is Scummy?
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Some people can be convincing with gut reads. Just spend some time thinking about what your gut is telling you and you'll find something.
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Just focus more and ask better questions. I'd say re-read Day 1 to see how OO almost got lynched, and the Promethelax lynch. Those were the 2 biggest turning points in the game imo.
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On May 25 2013 08:52 prplhz wrote:
i really liked scum single kp
a lot of games this size will be scum 2kp and then drop when scum gets lynched but that just makes for snowballing games, scum will be powerful for longer if town can't kill them and scum will get nerfed if town manages to kill them, and that's not too cool
I've been thinking about this for a while and I'm probably going to keep it that way. For one much easier to balance, especially with Night Starts. Two, the crippling factor of losing KP with a member. Having Scum KP set at 1 with the team somehow able to temporarily increase it may be a good solution. By going to great lengths to up it (Scum Absorber + Captain + Bulletproof/Medic) or luck ( Russian Vigilante) should make it better for the them overall.
Speaking of Russian Vigi I need to put that in to whatever game I come up with next .
Also since no one is going to trust a Captain for a while probably would need to include Absorbers with a Rolecop in the game.
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chaoser had an emergency so he couldn't continue.
BM told me he was out of time as well.
No clue what happened with sinani.
ETA: About LYLO. As Town - this is why you should seriously do work before getting to that point. You know the worst players will be alive so try and end the game before that. Shiro was useless so he was going to be lynched at some point anyway so your chances to win were small. Something I was going to put in my analysis, but the game ended before I got to, was VE actually had a chance to bus any of his teammates since he got "DT confirmed". Scum had too many options, and prp and snb lurked the last 2? days and still couldn't be lynched. Town's chances to win were very shaky with only 1 person trying to read the thread.
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Going after Prom isn't bad. The way you did it though was crazy
In retrospect the Town collectively, didn't put 2 and 2 together. However on a night where only Scum died after a Vigi flip an SK being in the game is possible.
You guys immediately post that it must be Prom. Two errors here:
1.) You guys never disprove how anyone else can't be the Serial Killer. In fact, none of you mention anyone else's name. This was the biggest problem with the posts.
2.) There is no real attempt at proving how Prom can be the SK, but not Mafia.
So if the Town is reading they should notice a concerted effort to get Prom lynched. When they finally believe he is the SK they should also realize who is likely Scum. At this point they didn't need to lynch him as they could kill any of you and go into next day at 4-3-1. Two of the Town's PR would have gotten weakened both factions severely and probably ended the game.
On May 26 2013 07:21 slOosh wrote:
I thought I was in danger given that I BH flipped, showing that I was pushing a town Hiro lynch over scum BH. Did I panic here? I knew when I pushed the Hiro lynch the reasoning was sound. Was I in a good position to defend any attacks against me?
I don't think you were in major danger of getting lynched because Town was busy arguing among themselves.Prom was an actual threat. Even assuming Prom would shoot you guys you had options. Bulletproof vest + finding a better way to lynch him.
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Yea it was poor execution. Instead of you and snb coming out against Prom you could wait and see if the Town figures there must be an SK. Then you show up with oh look, Prom was accusing BH all day yesterday and go from there. Then like you said - oh look at these night kills too. Town and Scum would post analyzing the Night Kills anyway after 1 scum died so there is no suspicion there. Just throw in everyone who was trying to seriously get BH lynched. You could even stop right there and let the Town weed out the suspects for you - they may settle on Prom and walla! You've caused the SK to get lynched and the Town did the work for you Come back to claim credit for it after he flips for double lulz.
You could also paint a Scum case for Prom but that would be a bit more work with Prom going after BH. You'd really need to make a convincing bus case that the Town would believe. Not like that would be extremely hard, but you have to out argue Prom in that case. If I remember correctly most of the Scum team already had good thread presence at that point and Town were in-fighting. You could probably get a sizable voting block just convincing 2 or 3 of them and hoping apathy and deaf ears takes Prom down.
By the way this is all just theory. Even after the screw up your team did what it needed to come back from a bad position which is just as good. Probably even better.
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okok, so you have to lay down the premise of an SK first right, and establish that they are trying to balance numbers.
Right. So we work backwards and tell the town "look, BH died. The person failed to get him lynched yesterday so they shot him last night. They knew he was Scum. Pretty sure that guy is a Serial Killer"
Then you bring up BH's wagon. Let the chips fall. Also give Town lots of time to discuss things and see how close they are to lynching him. Then you add a bit more to it:
"SK was trying to balance numbers because he knows the Scum team was going to runaway with the victory. Look how hard Prom was pushing to get BH lynched."
Just mix it in like an add on to Town arguments. If they get sidetracked away from Prom you push it even harder to keep the focus on him. You appear like a Townie figuring this guy is 3rd party. Your only issue is what happens if a Townie shows up asking why lynch SK over Scum? They post an argument about a 4-3-1 scenario vs 5-4 scenario.
Then you just point out that no one has found any good Scum suspects. Of course they haven't, you've had them discussing Serial Killer possibilities for hours. They never had time
also this is kind of good: BH's wagon at the end of Day 2
Blazinghand[L-3]: HiroPro, Promethelax, VisceraEyes, HiroPro, grush, shirokami, kushm4sta, kushm4sta, Oatsmaster
You guys didn't know but the Cop is on this wagon so lynching him would have been lulz. But you've got an interesting argument to throw massive fire on Prom.
"Look at the votes on BlazingHand. Everyone except shirokami, Promethelax, and Oats switched off at one point. Oats was the last one on the wagon so if he knew BH was Scum he would have voted far earlier. Shiro's vote isn't even put on with any real explanation. (link the quote where he says "good night sweet prince"). This leaves Prome as the #1 suspect. He's the second guy on the wagon and never even changes his vote. He was 100% sure BH is Scum. He is most likely the SK"
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His BH push starts with this post. It actually isn't a really convincing push since he mostly complains that no one is doing much. Not really pandering for votes so you're right about that.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18630979
(before that he was pushing VE )
You could instead leave the part out about Prom pushing hard if you assume Townies will go back and read the interaction. Instead emphasize how he was so sure the guy was Scum he didn't even bother to change his vote. You could probably even use his lack of pushing against him - he didn't care all that much if BH didn't get lynched. Even if a townie did (HiroPro in this case) he was going to shoot him the upcoming night anyway. Prome's lack of pushing is actually an anti-town tell in this instance. A proTown player would be trying to get his scum read lynched if he is so sure. Prome was sure enough he didn't even move his vote because a Townie would die and he'd Night Kill BH. He is the Serial Killer.
Also, how does Prom being 100% sure BH is scum be indicative of him being SK? It makes him suspect, but if anything it would point him to be more likely scum than SK no?
2 paths and both are equally good for you:
1.) With BH dying and Prom on his wagon, Prom would have to be bussing. You could try and prove this and if you did that would be great. You could expose Prom for lack of pushing BH's wagon hard as he knew he wouldn't really die maybe? So it was a failed bus that happened to make Prom look good once BH got night killed.
2.) The first path is already discussed. Prom is SK because only 1 Scum died and he was pushing for BH's death. You just use the stuff already mentioned to get him killed.
Remember it isn't always about being right. You technically don't even care what is true and what isn't. You just want to prove a scenario exists where more likely than not Prom is an SK (or Mafia). Once you get enough of these little premises gathered up the Town is left to piece out what's a sound argument.
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EPT
