EPTTL Mafia LXI
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
I'll probably rejoin when it's about to start but I don't want to risk forgetting about this while it's waiting to fill up | ||
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Stutters695
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Some thoughts as to what I've seen so far but they're not really worth shit until I'm caught up since most of it was probably answered. | ||
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Stutters695
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I'm drawing up a more detailed post at the moment. | ||
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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On April 26 2013 07:36 VisceraEyes wrote: Stutters: Palmar's interaction with me. He clearly doesn't give a shit about the game, and he's hiding in his VE tunnel to excuse himself from doing anything productive. He's actively not giving a shit. I'm not paying much heed to it this game they but I've seen him play similarly before while town (prplhz in yanmm iirc, maybe in a big game too but can't remember). Others seeing him as wrong while he isn't really pushing because he expects people to sheep him doesn't necessarily mean he's scum. How he reacts after is much more telling imo. | ||
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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Of the people who seem lynchable today: VE: I really don't see how VE is doing anything lynchable that ShiaoPi isn't doing worse. I disagree with his reads, but I'm not seeing the "lazy" VE that Palmar is mentioning. At least not to the extent that he should be lynched over some of these other people. ShiaoPi: Pretty much the only thing I've said in my few posts. Easily my choice for a lynch currently. When I was catching up before joining I noticed similar things to VE and Vivax on that. He hammered a town player (would be understandable if he had expressed any interest before that) and has actively been avoiding major topics. Clarity-nl: TBH he doesn't seem as bad as others are making him sound but I need to go over his stuff in context of the thread. Again I see questionable stuff but nothing that comes close to what i see as shady about Shiao. | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On April 27 2013 04:02 WaveofShadow wrote: Uh, so stutters, I appreciate a ninjavote on my scumread as much as the next person, but for a guy who professes to find someone scummy for not interacting with their scumread, you're certainly looking mighty hypocritical right now. What's up, guy? Was typing out a response and I thought I made it pretty clear here + Show Spoiler + On April 26 2013 07:34 Stutters695 wrote: VE:I thought between the Vivax case and your points that the case on Shiao was pretty good. What specifically made you switch to Palmar over Shiao? I can understand why Palmar's posting is like he is, but Shiao has hammered oats when he hadn't interacted or even mentioned him all game with a very weak justification (Oats wasn't doing shit so why not hammer him for info [which he never brought up again]). I'm just not following what made you so sold on Palmar over him. | ||
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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ShiaoPi: You have yet to adress any points against you ever, much less give a reason a single reason why we should lynch a claimed cop over you (except that he's wrong). So I'll ask you: What made you drop your suspicion on Sharrant (note: not why you voted Oats, why you never pushed Sharrant in D2)? You say Gigyas should be lynched for being non-committal, no thread presence, and just going with the flow of the thread. That's awfully similar to your 3 reads throughout the game, none of which you have voted for. Any explanations or are you just going to say more obvious stuff like "Kill stutters" to try and deflect from yourself again? | ||
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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On April 30 2013 03:07 ShiaoPi wrote: LOL The points raised against me are mostly just inactivity and a fucking cop check which is just wrong. Besides hammering someone is kind of committal dont you think so? My read on sharrant changed as d1 progressed. Unfortunately I was unable to be active, so all you see is a seemingly total turnaround. Also I did adress points against me, so you are either dumb and unable of doing reading comprehension or just lying. Dunno why I answer to you anyway seeing that you are scum and should be dealt with fire. bed time now You hammered Oats when he was sitting at L-1 for fifteen minutes. Of fucking course he didn't have time to contribute more. I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt considering you hammered a townie WHO YOU NEVER HAD A SCUMREAD ON but if you're just going to dodge answering I'll await your flip. | ||
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Stutters695
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On April 30 2013 03:32 TheRavensName wrote: I called him giggleS recently, and I believe that post was in response to something I said. Correct, the post I called him giggles was a direct response to that post (plus its just fun to call people names). | ||
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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On April 30 2013 03:54 ShiaoPi wrote: yeah you claim to have read my oh so small filter. just stop lying At no point in that post did you say what made you think that Sharrant was now not a suspect at all. You didn't provide new reads so it clearly wasn't that you just found a better candidate. And sitting at L-1 is significantly different than L-2 or higher. Oats might have still been lynched but had he sat at L-1 for a while I would expect much better content out of him than he was giving, given that he's town. I'm saying you hammered a townie "to know more" and never said anything about it after. | ||
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Stutters695
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On April 30 2013 04:44 Ace wrote: what? I've been around the entire game - where could I have slipped by? VE -> Palmar Palmar->CC CC->VE Town JK dont target any of them, let town docs take care of that. roleblocking any of them will screw us. let scum worry about who to rb. I tend to be not trusting of people pushing plans, especially when its like someone saying a wagon is bad without a way to verify. | ||
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Stutters695
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On April 30 2013 05:35 Ace wrote: Palmar has a guilty on you tho - thoughts? @stutters: what exactly are you referring to is being based on assumptions and should be done another way? I'm in my phone now so can't pull the exact quote but I remembered a detailed post about how people on the oats &ships wagons probably had a scum among them. Then your posts about cop claims and what they mean is all dependanrt on assumptions and thus could just be conjecture to appear active without giving out as much as you would with your earlier play which felt more solid to me. Since I'm a prime vig target and could easily die before or with Shiao i felt it worth bringing up because you're clearly able to pull off such a play. | ||
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Stutters695
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On April 30 2013 06:02 Ace wrote: you have to start with some assumptions and go back to read each cops' posts. I dont see what else you expect us to do to figure this out - just take every claim at face value? You are like 4 days late with the Oats wagon analysis. It's been done to death and generally accepted by now. When you get off your phone just point out where the assumptions dont hold up and if it hasn't already been addressed I'll be here to talk about it. Sorry I'm not making myself clear and I agree assumptions are necessary, but in addition to more question based analysis (and I do think your assumptions hold up as reasonable). It's more if Shiao flips red that kills a pretty major point of your contribution n2/d3 and it feels like your posting lacks the quality of your earlier posts in regards to discovering stuff in favor of theorizing which cop is lying instead of trying to determine which one/two are lying. This is probably just me being paranoid but it's something I've strongly considered when thinking what i I would do in scums shoes. | ||
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Stutters695
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Not saying it's likely but it does seem like a flaw we overlooked. | ||
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On May 01 2013 08:23 kushm4sta wrote: k i just updated my read on stutters to town read. i could not understand any of the posts in his filter but it looks like he is doing some townie conspiracy theory shit What? You can't understand my posts so I'm town? I mean my posting is identical to my other games where I'm busy but I don't understand how you come to a town read via conspiracy theories. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 02 2013 06:44 WaveofShadow wrote: Nothing about that REALLY makes him town but to pull that shit as scum and trying to do it in earnest doesn't make much sense either. I forget whose idea this was but I COULD see it being an attempt to protect BC if they were both scum considering no one would take his read seriously. Ugh the end of this game is gonna be tough. Eh, it just feels like Palmar has done this not giving a shit before but it always came back to him trying. Additionally if part of his reason for not giving a shit was to survive n1, why is it still happening? | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 02 2013 07:26 ObviousOne wrote: We are simply not lynching palmar today. Anyone who has seriously suggested that we do so needs to take a break, step back, think about why, and prove to me he's the best lynch today. Cop claim? Probably true Broken cop? Definitely Lazy? Tautology (see also n. Palmar) Wants to kill BC? Isolate his reasons outside of his check. I wanted to kill BC d1 too for being sort of a jerk. From what I remember, because it would be fun? It totally would. Today Palmar is my ally in lynching BC. I have demonstrated a scum mindset on BC's behalf that no one has proven to be demonstrably false. We are running out of objectively scummy shit to lynch for. I'm on my phone. Can you give me a brief summary of what you think BC has done to deserve the noose? I realize you've probably said it before but I can't filter dive right now. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 02 2013 10:14 TheRavensName wrote: If that was the case, he would have said so as his reasonings. he would say " I explained why, your going to hit town just accept it unless yo uget lucky Go listen to the podcast again.." He said for reasons not explained, if he had time to do a cop check first, that would be one thing. But I want to know what those unexplained reasons are, This was not a satisfactory answer. Seems to me from reading it that the "reasons best left unexplained" are that he wanted to appear on a bad lynch/completely off the mark to avoid getting shot. Would like to hear Ace's thoughts but this makes me feel less good about a Palmar lynch. Since I still can't filter dive, can you tell me what game cycle you were masoned to him on? | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On May 02 2013 11:55 TheRavensName wrote: Yea but, we were in th QT, not the thread there friend. Its not a good answer eiter way. If I was scum, I wouldn't care for his mtoivations on lynching oats, in fact if anything that phrasing was more likely to get him shot just for being like a ominious blue threat if it didn';t come out day 1, I would be happy he did, and if he was scum, he wouldn't want those shared bcause its essentually "i need mislynches to win." If were both town, which I waked into that QT thinking we were, he should have told me so I can understand, especially when he knows this is my first non newbie game. That's why I'm asking when he actually was masoned with you. I wasn't here d1 but I had some doubts about you when I was reading the thread waiting for the day to start so I could join. If his post was early into d2 (assuming it was)he might not have been 100% sure you're town. Claiming in mason chat isn't common knowledge afaik and I could see him not being trusting from what I've seen of Palmar. I don't think that alone is reason to lynch him. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 02 2013 12:38 GiygaS wrote: My computer just crushed destroying the little I had done on my post and my Frankenstein Essay. School takes priority, sorry guys, I'll try to make my post after I re-write my essay. First, I hope that your essay turns out ok. Seriously though, you go mia, come back to read the entire thread instead of commenting on anything relevant and go mia again. What reason is there to not lynch you? | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 02 2013 23:47 yamato77 wrote: If I'm right about Hopeless, I actually think Ace really is the other mafia. He seems pretty demotivated about this game now, isn't pushing anything strongly, and acquiesces to lynching Hopeless without any comment on my case, why he suddenly believes me, or how he's arrived at that conclusion. For someone who so vehemently called me mafia the whole game, he sure does feel fine with simply hopping along with the town sentiment I've created with the wagon on Hopeless. Bear in mind, he would do this regardless of Hopeless' alignment, because if Hopeless is mafia, he cannot risk sticking his neck out to save him when I have town sentiment on my side. He's obviously here, reading the thread, so that means he's not simply inactive. He's lurking, but not providing any input on why he feels Hopeless is a good lynch, and is obviously not invested enough in his read of Palmar to push it over my case on Hopeless. It's also a very real possibility he is SP. He wasn't rb'd n1 so it's either scum spent their joat(assuming they have one) vigi n2 or he poisoned. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 03 2013 00:29 Sharrant wrote: It would be very silly to lynch ace because he might be third party. If you think he's mafia push for his lynch. If you think he's third party and you're pushing for his lynch then stop. Read the op, think about it, read the op again, think about it in context of the game. Realize it's possible he's not third party and that he should be lynched after the last mafia dies and the game does not end, or if the jailer dies at some point. if someone can't point out why by the time I'm back from work, I'll explain.. It's pretty obvious why. Was just pointing out to yamato that I think it's considerably more likely he's 3p over scum. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 03 2013 00:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Stutters, thoughts on BC case go. Yamato: I think it's very likely that it was a 3rd party kill because I don't think Grush was a player that scum really feared. I'll type up a more detailed version soon but I'm not nearly as sold on it as I am on hopeless or even Palmar. I'm having doubts about Palmar but until he delivers on his promised big post I'd rather him over bc. | ||
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Stutters695
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@Artanis I'm going through his filter to check it out myself but obviously I've got some doubts. | ||
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Stutters695
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Self-aware Miller part: I wasn't around when this happened but reading it originally I agreed that Miller claiming is dumb. Not necessarily lynchable depending on circumstances but your entire paragraph falls flat because you can't discern when a scum does it and by not lynching them you've opened an avenue to get out of cop checks. His long post where he mentions Yamato and CC and the four posts after: Consolidating wasn't the right word there but you're taking it out of context. I interpreted that as Yamato wasn't trying to actively get him lynched despite being the only constant read. Not sure if that's true as I haven't re-read that section in context with Yamato's posts. I'll have to check that when I have more time, but right now that's more null than anything else (if he is misrepresenting Yamato it is much more concerning). The four posts after were within twenty minutes of the original post. If he had nothing else to add and VE was the only other poster the hell do you expect him to do other than comment about other issues in town? The further into the case the more I agree with it however those points concerned me. I would like to hear his reasoning for the remainder of it but just reading it before without his filter and having those doubts I wasn't convinced without reading his filter myself. Still would prefer Hopeless but with the Palmar BC interactions I'd like to wait for BC to actually respond and Palmar's promised post. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 03 2013 03:02 yamato77 wrote: Oh, and I'm certain that there is a town JK, and I'm fairly sure I know who he is. That's not a certainty that we have a jk. Scum already flipped their jk so if ace is SP he's going to lie, say he's rbed and bank on that until town flips a non-resistant jk while arguing that he's being blocked so it can't be him. He doesn't have another path to his win con that I can see. | ||
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Stutters695
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After Palmar claimed (paranoid cop), CC claimed (insane cop), and VE claimed (parity cop) with a claimed Miller, and mason. There have been 2rbs nightly (we just killed their jk) and the only night ace wasn't rb is the only night before a second unexplained NK, strongly implying ace as a SP, unless we flip the remaining scum and reveal a second scum vig in there. Not sure if you consider it likely/possible for 2 3p roles Truth be told i hadn't given that any thought. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 04 2013 00:51 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Then why did you feel the need to point out why you defended the second best plan? Also, I don't remember if I've ever played with you but I haven't exactly gotten strong town vibes from you. Because I've played before and know how this goes. If I say nothing someone accuses me of pushing a sub-optimal plan. If I point it out you accuse me of feeling guilty of defending a sub-optimal plan. However since my intentions are honest, by explaining my position and being transparent with my actions it should be obvious I'm town. Same way I play every game. | ||
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Stutters695
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I provide my thoughts fairly clearly, take a stance when appropriate and I'm not afraid to disagree or post something that will bring heat on me because I have nothing to hide (Plans regarding Ace, my concerns with the BC case). I wish I could have had the time to push Shaio instead of just bringing up more points against him (although I feel the points I brought up were lynchable on their own). If you aren't convinced I'll obviously try to fix that. For full disclosure my girlfriend is graduating tomorrow and her parents are coming to the apartment and then we're all going to dinner, followed by the graduation tomorrow at 9am so I'll only be able to check in occasionally from like 5est tonight until like 3-4est tomorrow (PM). So I'll be happy to answer any questions before then that will help. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 04 2013 01:42 WaveofShadow wrote: lol I asked Dandel about this when inquiring as to what the longest anyone has gone without rolling scum on TL and he mentioned you. Not including this game, how many games has it been? (Have you ever rolled 3rd party?) No 3p and off of memory (plus the database for the really old games) it's something like this: NMMXXIV NMMXXVI NMMXXVII NMMXXVIII Whose Line Mini Yet Another Normal Mini Personality 2 Themed Game Mafia MTG Mini II Mafia LIX I believe that puts me at 10. All VT unless they were themed. I'm so boring lol | ||
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Stutters695
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I was saying those 4 quotes were in a period of relative inactivity so there wasn't much for him to push in that period. His lack of actually saying it himself concerns me. Also this came to me when I was listing my games but iirc BC was scum in Whose Line and his play was similar. I can't verify until tomorrow but if someone wants to look into it that'd be great or I'll do it tomorrow. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 05 2013 04:23 Bill Murray wrote: bc wasnt even in that game stutters you doof Yeah they pointed it out minutes after I said that. That game was forever ago lol. Read it in context though. I defended part of the case against BC because I saw some bias. How is that distancing? | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 05 2013 12:13 TheRavensName wrote: How would his protection list prove anyone town? It was impossible for scum to die n1 (other than to a sk maybe, not sure how that would work) so it's very improbable that scum jailed their own. Thus whoever scum jailed of bc and palmar is probably town. And obviously the jk is town. | ||
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Stutters695
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On May 07 2013 03:58 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I brought this up earlier. Scum doesn't know Ace is 3rd party for sure though. It could be a veteran too. Also, there is someone that pushed Ace. Yamato kept bringing Ace to the table. I already talked about this scenario before though. Aren't night lives a once/game thing? I figured a veteran would have claimed days ago. | ||
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