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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
I also never said they faked the logs entirely, I assume by the timestamps that they were actually using the mason QT but it is a possibility they are using the scum QT to discuss what to put in the mason QT in case they had to show logs. Much like my conspiracy theory-type posts from LX, I can perfectly understand if people think they're retarded, but I think it's at least worth consideration. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 05:05 DoYouHas wrote: @Vivax - You are ignoring the obvious explanation for the supposed slip you are trying to nail BH with. "Okay so the hosts are dragging their feet with setting up the Mason QT(So BH made one himself) so I'll drop some stuff in here(here being the QT BH just made) since I have to step out for a moment." It is far more probable than your theory that BH made a QT, the hosts were made aware of it, and they just stuck with that QT for the BH-GK masoning. The slip you found simply isn't. The thing is that's a POSSIBLE explanation, but it's not the one that BH has offered. The Mafia QT slip seems completely possible as well. I had similar thoughts as you, that there could be an explanation like the one you mentioned, but I wanted to wait to see what his actual explanation was first, instead of handing the excuse to him like you just now did. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On March 20 2013 05:06 zarepath wrote: I don't suspect him of fake-claiming, if that's what you mean, because I'm in a QT with him. He could be faking the color of his role, but that's not what I'm talking about. If we force everyone who blue-claims to state the name of their role, we can essentially shut down all fake roleclaims from scum because there will either be someone with the power they're claiming (a DT or medic or vet or what have you), or someone who has the name that they're claiming, but it goes to a different power. I think your speculation as to a power involving the names of roles is coming more from your distrust of me than it is from any logical perspective. No, I'm just curious to know what you think about BH since you're in a QT with him and I'm assuming there has been no activity as of yet. The problem with asking people to claim their roles is not all the roles will even be in existence if you read OP, and we have no idea as to the alignment of them. Yes it is a risky move for scum to claim the name of a role in case someone else has it, but chances are if it's a scum role name, no one else will have it and no one else would know. We all thought Nightmare was town, didn't we? | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
You have also sort of flip-flopped on whether you find BH scummy or null-scum or what have you, so I'm trying to divine a true alignment read from you on him. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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Vivax
22409 Posts
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 05:13 WaveofShadow wrote: EBWOP: we all thought Nightmare was scum at the start of the game. You have also sort of flip-flopped on whether you find BH scummy or null-scum or what have you, so I'm trying to divine a true alignment read from you on him. On BH, I don't know. There's a lot about his play that I don't like, but the content of the QTs (not the one I'm in now; he has a single post in it from when he made it where he wants to know my reads and if I'll help him lynch TPS) seems to show active sleuthing. I was hoping to get a firmer read on him through the QT today. I think that the non-contributors are more suspect at this point, and have voted for Wiggles accordingly, for his refusal to present and promote any reads at all. It's tempting to react to and analyze only the active players in the thread, but there's been a lot of disappearance. For example, at what point do we expect Mocsta and Ace to lay their full suspciions down? I thought Ace would be like a Marvellosity type where he lays out confident reads on everybody and breaks apart everyone's bad logic, but he's had zero thread presence since replacing in. Mocsta has just been annoying and then disappeared, although I think he is asleep in Australia or something. Comic's case against VE which is actually just a hardcore defense of BH is a little odd, and I wonder what you think about it. | ||
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glurio
Germany597 Posts
I'm also leaning scum on WoS. Many of his posts look like fabrication straight out of his crazy brain or contribute actually nothing. Day 1: WoS shares his reads on TPS/Vivax + Show Spoiler + On March 18 2013 04:16 WaveofShadow wrote: Also I believe I promised I'd give my thoughts on Vivax/TPS: Vivax's defense of me notwithstanding, I'm not so sure this was a slip. Meta reads are going to be something I will not be very good at until I play quite a few more games with all of you guys, so I can't look back at Yamato and try to find out if Vivax's claim is legitimate. I'm not sure why he would be so confident as to flat out call him Yamato in one sentence and the back off a little saying 'I think' in another, it's a very odd way of doing it rather than flat out asking 'Are you Yamato' or simply saying 'I think TPS is Yamato.' Either way the 'slip' itself seems null, as is Vivax's defense on me; his points ring true (and I'm happy people actually notice me for once) but obviously there are both scum and town motivations for doing what he did. As for TPS, I'm having a hard time because I actually enjoyed his setup speculation (even though I know that's something that is generally frowned upon) and his early pressure on Coag is something that I would have gotten behind if I weren't fucking terrified of having the wrath of every vet in existence on top of me for 'not knowing how Coag usually plays.' I said it in an earlier post, Coag doesn't look great to me, but I'll trust the townies who seem to know him. Now TPS's pressure in my eyes really depends on whether he is a smurf or not imo. If he is, I would think that he would know exactly how Coag usually plays and so this would seem like an agenda to me. If he's not, he is legitimately pressuring and pushing a read on a player who looked (at least up until he started posting more frequently and usefully) scummy. So null on TPS for now until the smurf idea is resolved. I CAN, however get behind a vote on DP. I support VE's case though I do not necessarily support his town circle; call that scummy if you wish but having never seen one in a game before I have no idea of their risks or benefits and it just seems manipulative to me. Vote: Darthpunk He doesn't wanna say anyone is scummy. It really looks like he is dodging doing a proper read. After that he just sheeps on DP. His second big post (the vote for GM) i already commented on earlier in the game. I'd like to highlight another post: + Show Spoiler + On March 19 2013 03:34 WaveofShadow wrote: Haha wow I guess I really do have to be more careful what I post in these games...I make mistakes wayy too often that get seen as scummy. I guess it's good that people are pointing this shit out 'cause I didn't notice, and eventually I'll stop fucking myself over with these mistakes. I dunno, not much to say about that. I'll blame it on lack of sleep due to 3 month old baby. This post looks extremely scummy to me, makes too many mistakes so he can't be scum. Who would argue like that? It looks like he's just trying to say something to avoid suspicion. His general play is extremely blendy and following popular opinion, at one point when everyone suspected zare he also had his suspicion of him but as soon as zare went off of most peoples scum-radar, WoS also loses his scumread. He tries to find scummy things where he knows aren't any. Example + Show Spoiler + On March 20 2013 01:46 WaveofShadow wrote: Ok found it. It's the timestamps that bother me. Between BH and GK, (the ones Vivax suspects of being a scumteam-fabricated QT/logs) every single post has a fairly decent size berth in between; the smallest one being 3 minutes right at the end, the next smallest being 5 minutes (2-lines) and every one after that being 12 min or longer in between posts. This means that it's POSSIBLE that they were fabricating these posts in the scum QT in between. This isn't possible in the VE-BH logs, as there is evidence of free-flowing quick conversation taking place with multiple 2-minute spaces in between posts from both of them. Also of course the fact that they didn't even start contacting each other until much later in the day either means a) they were planning in the scum QT b) BH didn't send his mason request till late (can be a subset of (a), null) c) he's telling the truth and DrH didn't set up the QT until later. The post where Vivax outlines the slip makes option (c) seem VERY odd so the scummier options seem more likely here. Now this could all be Wave's Conspiracy Theories™ but I figure it's worth putting out there to see what people think. Especially later N1 and D2 his filter really looks like he just tries to look like he's contributing without really doing any useful scumhunting. I believe WoS is scum. ##Vote: WoS | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21171 Posts
But what are those objectives? Not hunting scum surely - he spent a little time talking about wanting to go after Peashooter and geript in the thread, but I've seen minimal evidence of this. Wade Fell is scum. Lynch him. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 05:14 Vivax wrote: If BH could just make a qt for himself why did he wait for the hosts to make another one? I don't know if this means much, but the creator for the QT I'm in now is DRHEL. For some reason I doubt that the host would allow someone to make their own QT. I've played more newbie games than not; is it ever a practice for the players to make their own QT in a normal game? | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21171 Posts
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
I'll look into cosmic's VE case again, but in the end I think it just makes me assume that one of either VE or BH has to be scum. The super hard defense of GK by BH makes me think if he's scum then likely GK is too btu I don't know how likely that is, despite my conspiracy theory and the QT 'scumslip.' Speaking of which I remember harboring concerns about VE's town circle earlier on D1, but now we're on D2 and we haven't heard anything. Was it a joke or what? | ||
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goodkarma
United States1067 Posts
In case you were wondering, yes. I tend to be a slower poster. Ask those who've played with me, look at my past games. I'm not going to have the same type of interactions with BH as Viscera because I'm not Viscera, and further I had a strong town read on BH. Do you grill a townread, or try to exchange thoughts? Anything else? Or can you now finally look at my case for lynching Mr. Wiggles? | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On March 20 2013 05:23 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm a Coward. I act as a Veteran as far as I can tell. This confused me a little VE. Do you not know what your role does? It seemed odd when you were claiming too: On March 19 2013 16:20 VisceraEyes wrote: I took a hit. I'm....not sure what that implies. I'm gonna sleep on it. I love you, town. And then right after you state it's because you're Vet. Explain? | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 05:24 WaveofShadow wrote: K glurio. GL buddy. I'll look into cosmic's VE case again, but in the end I think it just makes me assume that one of either VE or BH has to be scum. The super hard defense of GK by BH makes me think if he's scum then likely GK is too btu I don't know how likely that is, despite my conspiracy theory and the QT 'scumslip.' Speaking of which I remember harboring concerns about VE's town circle earlier on D1, but now we're on D2 and we haven't heard anything. Was it a joke or what? VE at one point said that the whole SAST thing was merely a tool and that he wasn't actually serious about it. I will have to go through his filter to find it but am about to leave work now. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21171 Posts
On March 18 2013 04:21 VisceraEyes wrote: For the record, my town circle idea was a conversation starter, and it worked wonders. I have no intention of attempting to hold people to voting with me or their peers in The Team, I simply wanted to gauge peoples reactions to it and see if it inspired people to start scumhunting. Some it did, others it didn't. But the fact is I think it has spawned useful discussion for everyone. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21171 Posts
On March 20 2013 05:26 WaveofShadow wrote: This confused me a little VE. Do you not know what your role does? It seemed odd when you were claiming too: And then right after you state it's because you're Vet. Explain? I just meant I'm not sure what to think about it. I definitely took a hit, and my role is a Veteran role...but I wasn't sure why scum would shoot me and still haven't decided what I think is most likely. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
Yeah VE I remember that post now, although i think I was confused at the time because of you mentioning 'The Team,' I'm not sure if it was an idea you still wanted to keep going rather than using ONLY as a conversation starter. Anyway, looking into the reads on Wiggle/VE now. | ||
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DoYouHas
United States1140 Posts
Vote: VisceraEyes A larger case will follow later tonight when I have more time. | ||
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