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Active: 865 users

Shadowing Players

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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GMarshal
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States21994 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-19 19:52:40
February 24 2013 00:28 GMT
#1
After the conclusion of Nomination Mafia, I thought it would be beneficial to make this thread. The point of this thread is to control and organize how shadowing works, so that games don't get overwhelmed with everyone shadowing and so that hosts and players are kept in the loop.

Shadowing - What is shadowing?
Shadowing is participating alongside one of the players of a game of Mafia. Think of it as sort of a reverse coaching. In traditional coaching, you as the player are asking for tips and advice from your coach in regards to your role and the game-state. In the case of shadowing, you are in direct contact with ONE player with the goal of getting insight into how that player perceives and plays their current game. The shadow never interacts directly with the game/thread or others involved with the game. It is a one-to-one relationship with a single player in a game.

Hosts reserve the right to deny allowing shadows in their games. Please respect the hosts' wishes.


Rules of Shadowing

Pre-game:
  • Shadowing must be cleared with the game host.
  • You may choose to request being a shadow with a player of your own choice.
  • You may not receive the Observer QT.
  • You may not receive or know the alignment of any other player in the game.
  • You may not disclose the interactions you have with your shadow to anyone outside of the host and the player you are shadowing until the game has ended.
  • Remember that the player you are shadowing is doing you a great service!

During the game:
  • Do not tell people who you are shadowing
  • At any point the player you are shadowing may have to prioritize rl or actually playing the game, at that point, you may be put on the back burner, be accommodating.
  • You may only communicate with the person you are shadowing with respect to the game
  • Its your job to keep in touch with your mentor. Use any resources you deem amicable. PM, private QT, Skype, etc.

Post-game:
  • Disclose your shadowing and share anything you feel is relevant.
  • Ideas for things to talk about include how your views of the game were different from the players'.
  • Share analysis / tips you have learned after the game has ended, so that others may also benefit.



Rules for the player being shadowed
  • Don't give the person you are shadowing any knowledge other than that of your alignment, and if you want role.
  • Don't talk about your shadow in the thread
  • Try to keep in touch with the shadow and keep them informed. Remember, you are essentially a mentor.
  • If anything looks odd or goes wrong, it is your job to get inform the host as fast as possible.



Each shadow team must be cleared by the host to be able to shadow in their game. This thread will keep a list of players who want to be shadowed, and people who want to shadow so we can get them in touch with each other and then in touch with the host. This can also serve as a sort of queue if the demand is high enough.

Mentors:
GMarshal
supersoft
GreYMisT
grush57
Promethelax
VisceraEyes
Blazinghand

Shadows:
slOosh
warbaby
Promethelax

Post here, or PM me to get on the list. With any luck this will raise the general level of play, and allow newer players a way to get a better insight into the game.

(credit for the revamped op goes to ObviousOne, who re-wrote it for me)
Moderator"life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery" The measure of a terrible day is when you go to bed thinking "man, I wish the zombie apocalypse would start already"
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain15330 Posts
February 24 2013 00:33 GMT
#2
What is the difference between shadowing and personal coaching?
GreYMisT
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States6015 Posts
February 24 2013 00:33 GMT
#3
Sounds like its the exact opposite.
"life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery" / Join TL Mafia! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
GMarshal
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States21994 Posts
February 24 2013 00:46 GMT
#4
On February 24 2013 09:33 Acrofales wrote:
What is the difference between shadowing and personal coaching?

When you get personal coaching, its a veteran advising an inexperienced player, when you shadow its a newer player watching a veteran player playing ,following their thought processes, and learning from that.
Moderator"life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery" The measure of a terrible day is when you go to bed thinking "man, I wish the zombie apocalypse would start already"
kitaman27 *
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States8604 Posts
February 24 2013 00:46 GMT
#5
Nice idea!
I'm better than dirt. Well, most kinds of dirt. I mean not that fancy store bought dirt. That stuffs loaded with nutrients. I... I can't compete with that stuff.
supersoft
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany3655 Posts
February 24 2013 01:16 GMT
#6
sounds pretty good... this is so much better than coaching. I am /in :-P
if someone wants to shadow me ^_^
Mr. Cheesecake
Profile Joined October 2012
United States3756 Posts
February 24 2013 01:27 GMT
#7
If someone shadows me, there will be 6 more weeks of winter.
But CC isn't protown as town. 100% real heuristic.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3289 Posts
February 24 2013 03:31 GMT
#8
I want to shadow if I count as newer player!
GreYMisT
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States6015 Posts
February 24 2013 03:34 GMT
#9
GM ill join in on this if thats alright.
"life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery" / Join TL Mafia! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
warbaby
Profile Joined May 2011
United States510 Posts
February 24 2013 03:35 GMT
#10
I'd like to sign up to shadow an experienced player, please. Sounds like a fun way to learn!
It puts the GG in the basket. It does this whenever it's told or else it gets the Mutalisks again.
grush57
Profile Joined March 2011
Korea (South)2577 Posts
February 24 2013 04:36 GMT
#11
shadow me up!
"Every thing is either simply awful or awfully simple." | "Weaklings can't pick... their way of death."
jaybrundage
Profile Joined December 2009
United States3394 Posts
February 24 2013 04:37 GMT
#12
I want to shadow my self.

When it goes into hollywood production they can call it "The mind of a madman"
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.
Promethelax
Profile Joined February 2012
Canada6808 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-24 11:07:59
February 24 2013 11:05 GMT
#13
I'd be happy shadowing or being shadowed. Depends on the level of the other player involved of course. This s a really excellent idea and has the potential to improve our play as a whole which I'm quite excited by.

If there are enough takers on both sides of this I think it could be valuable to host an all shadow game. I'd be interested in helping with such a game by playing, hosting or shadowing.
TL Mafia. Love it. Play it. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31 I find Kennigit really attractive. If anyone has a picture of him please feel free to PM it to me.
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom33843 Posts
February 24 2013 11:39 GMT
#14
Sure, I'm in.

slOosh, I'll PM you when I roll mafia...
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Dandel Ion
Profile Joined November 2010
Austria11072 Posts
February 24 2013 11:47 GMT
#15
I want to shadow Cheesecake.

We may end up randomly switching to "coaching" and/or cybersex though.
A backwards poet writes inverse.
VisceraEyes
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States20750 Posts
February 25 2013 18:02 GMT
#16
I'm /in.
if I had to describe his playstyle, it'd be a coked up rabbit with the attention of a goldfish injecting caffeine into himself directly through an IV drip. it's like a reel of random animated shorts where things just blow up randomly
VisceraEyes
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States20750 Posts
February 25 2013 22:49 GMT
#17
And for what it's worth, I feel like giving the shadow the names of teammates in the case of a scum shadow helps cut down the influence of having a shadow has on the player. I said this in Nomination, but no one responded. Is that not really a concern? Because that's something I thought of at the beginning of the game (see Obvious' post) and something slOosh picked up on immediately on hearing about it too.
if I had to describe his playstyle, it'd be a coked up rabbit with the attention of a goldfish injecting caffeine into himself directly through an IV drip. it's like a reel of random animated shorts where things just blow up randomly
ObviousOne
Profile Joined April 2012
United States3704 Posts
February 25 2013 23:04 GMT
#18
The heart of that conversation starts around here for those who are just tuning in:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17867161
Fear is the only darkness. ~Destiny Fan Club operator~
Promethelax
Profile Joined February 2012
Canada6808 Posts
February 25 2013 23:09 GMT
#19
On February 26 2013 07:49 VisceraEyes wrote:
And for what it's worth, I feel like giving the shadow the names of teammates in the case of a scum shadow helps cut down the influence of having a shadow has on the player. I said this in Nomination, but no one responded. Is that not really a concern? Because that's something I thought of at the beginning of the game (see Obvious' post) and something slOosh picked up on immediately on hearing about it too.


I think the problem with that is the shadowing player doesn't get to improve in any real way. Like scum is about acting and not being in the game he doesn't get to act. The idea, as far as I can tell, is to give the shadowing player a chance to work on analysis with a dedicated assistant. I think that falls apart if he has the whole scum team. I could be wrong though.

TL Mafia. Love it. Play it. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31 I find Kennigit really attractive. If anyone has a picture of him please feel free to PM it to me.
VisceraEyes
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States20750 Posts
February 25 2013 23:13 GMT
#20
Well when I shadowed Obvious I released the team incrementally so he had a chance to analyze too, but when an observational advantage would be most powerful (late-game) he had as much info as I did so his observations would mean less to me as a player because his viewpoint isn't objective anymore.
if I had to describe his playstyle, it'd be a coked up rabbit with the attention of a goldfish injecting caffeine into himself directly through an IV drip. it's like a reel of random animated shorts where things just blow up randomly
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