EPTcase = idea
TL Mafia LX - Page 50
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
case = idea | ||
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Vivax
22168 Posts
There are people who didn't even post since the game started, the reason you're not calling them scum based on general contributions is cause you are biased towards only paying attention to the things in front of you. If you don't bother looking at every player's contribution, then don't bother saying I didn't contribute much, cause I did. Maybe start looking for scum at the playerlist and not just on the last page of the thread. I don't think you're scum, but you don't need to be to play anti-town. I suggest to look for scum among the less active players. Get them to post at least. I'd especially like JJ to give more than just a defence of Prom since he seems to have actually read the thread, thing we can't be sure of regarding hassy and jcarlson. | ||
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
I supported a prom lynch due to these posts: + Show Spoiler + On February 26 2013 10:04 Toadesstern wrote: are you mad that it didn't work or that you didn't get more credit for it? Because it sure sounds like that. We had some discussion about the rnd you suggested, we had some discussion about what I suggested. I most definitely wouldn't phrase it the way your are [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 10:25 Toadesstern wrote: [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 10:21 Promethelax wrote: [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 10:17 Toadesstern wrote: prom could you respond to what I (and VE in response) said over here: [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 10:06 VisceraEyes wrote: [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 10:04 Toadesstern wrote: [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 09:57 Promethelax wrote: Okay, so RNG didn't create the discussion I wanted. Screw you guys. [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 09:28 Wade Fell wrote: My new platform is killing Layabout Read his posts hes scum[/QUOTE] Explain. For the moment my top scum read is WoS, he responded to gerpit's candidacy all wrong, obviously assuming gerpit is town but statistically... [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 09:23 WaveofShadow wrote: [QUOTE]On February 26 2013 09:20 geript wrote: It looks to me that the best person for mayor is someone who is willing to: A. put in the time to read the thread B. both make and evaluate other's cases C. is unlikely to be an early target for NK In this regard I would nominate myself as I am more likely to devote more time to reading (both filters and filter in the context of the thread as a whole) than anyone else. Additionally, I am relatively unknown which removes untoward bias for or against me due to previous games as well as making me a more impartial arbiter as it regards established players. My lynch platform is: Scum read > hard/impossible to read > null read > town read ## vote geript[/QUOTE] Except for the fact that you were killed N1 last game for the above reasons, by someone who is very likely smurfing in this game.[/QUOTE] He focuses on the likelihood of a night kill on gerpit, he is too interested in night actions and not in the candidacy or the actual ideas which gerpit proposes. I'm not a fan of this post or WoS's mentality. Vote me, screw random lynch. I'll lynch WoS. [/QUOTE] are you mad that it didn't work or that you didn't get more credit for it? Because it sure sounds like that. We had some discussion about the rnd you suggested, we had some discussion about what I suggested. I most definitely wouldn't phrase it the way your are[/QUOTE] This is something I noticed too. It sparked discussion - I'm left wondering what kind of discussion he thought RNG was supposed to generate if it didn't generate the kind he wanted.[/QUOTE] because again, the way you phrased that sounds awfully odd and I'm thinking of multiple explanations. None of them includes something you with a townie-mindset.[/QUOTE] Because I wanted it to gain some real traction. I had an idea about actually getting close and withdrawing my nomination since if scum was up for lynch they'd be pushing me as mayor where if there was a townie up for lynch they'd be pushing against me. It's a plan that only works if I get support on it. That was the discussion I wanted to spark. [/QUOTE] The basic idea was that Prom had stood for mayor under the premise that he would rng the lynch but then he turned around and said he had just wanted to create discussion. This is scummy because he didn't make enough of effort to create or encourage this discussion as he would be expected to do as town. Upon rereading I am not sure that he didn't do enough to push discussion. He mentions rng in a few posts but nobody really treats it as a valid option or says why it's a good/bad idea. The discussion naturally moves on and he lets it. Aside from that he posting is fine. I suppose he calls hasssy scummy for vanishing but he at least makes the effort to find out why hassy had gone + Show Spoiler + btw it was 3am uk time so maybe that | ||
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Vivax
22168 Posts
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
So I admit to that. Thank god Marvellosity and Mattchew aren't in this game or I'd be trying to lynch Mattchew for what Marvel said and vice-versa. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
Who's actions were you attributing to me? I'd look but I'm lazy and watching a show right now. | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On February 27 2013 03:28 Vivax wrote: My case on JJ doesn't have a followup cause it isn't actually on JungleJorge, it was supposed to be on MachoMan, of which I found the response to my post to be quite townie. I put the wrong name in there (happens too often lately). There are people who didn't even post since the game started, the reason you're not calling them scum based on general contributions is cause you are biased towards only paying attention to the things in front of you. If you don't bother looking at every player's contribution, then don't bother saying I didn't contribute much, cause I did. Maybe start looking for scum at the playerlist and not just on the last page of the thread. I don't think you're scum, but you don't need to be to play anti-town. I suggest to look for scum among the less active players. Get them to post at least. I'd especially like JJ to give more than just a defence of Prom since he seems to have actually read the thread, thing we can't be sure of regarding hassy and jcarlson. jcarlsoniv is leaning scum for me but there's so little substance there that it's not worth pursuing right now. Lurkers will lurk, I've always felt they should be dealt with last. It's good that some people will pressure them to post, but I leave that up to others and I concern myself with analyzing and pressuring people who are posting. I have looked for scum in the playerlist. For your information I've read 11 filters and I'm working on my reads and cases in an office document, I'm not putting them out there until I'm ready to go in for the kill. I'll pressure, sure, but that's a more in the moment type of thing for me. Always has been. You can read through the playerlist, find a lot of inconclusive/town reads and that's fine. There is no reason to post them in the thread. The important part of your post was the accusation and pressure on machoman and it just kinda got lost in all the other information which was unimportant. Town does not need to know everything you are thinking at all times. So if you no longer think MM is scum, are you telling me you have absolutely no read at this point? How can you criticize me for not putting in effort to find scum when you have no read? | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On February 27 2013 03:31 VisceraEyes wrote: Generally people mix up my icon with like Bugs Kita MZ, so I get what your'e saying. Who's actions were you attributing to me? I'd look but I'm lazy and watching a show right now. A mix of macho man and probably everyone else talking about randombum. I think I'm naturally inclined to be really aggressive toward you so I apologize now for any future false accusations | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On February 27 2013 03:36 layabout wrote: I don't get why vivax made a big analysis post and then ended it with "i guess my analysis didn't really work". It served no purpose other than to demonstrate that he is putting in effort. If he had wanted to share his reads why not simply do so? Don't you see? all information is good information? I think layabout is a null read. There, I've done my part. Put in the work and contributed. I think we should all analyse the people who haven't posted in this game yet. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17883358 Regarding that post, most of it seems to be spot on from my perspective. You sort of belabor the shit out of the RNG points and spread them into other categories but think about how Zarepath acted D1 in the last newbie game he played with me (us? if you're mocsta) and you'll see that it's possible he was indeed going about trying to generate discussion. He might have even been successful if he was vigilant in driving the conversation or hinting as to the direction he wanted to go with it, but since none of that actually happened it's looking like a really bad point against him. As for considering WOS a candidate, after the smack talk prior to looking at his newbie game and evaluating WOS' re-entrance to the thread, I could see how his mindset (as either alignment) would allow him to 180. WHY he 180s is a question for him directly at that point in the conversation, though from my perspective I see an enthusiastic WOS looking to take some burden off the concerns of town at a point where we were only looking at ~2 real candidates. One thing to note about WOS re-entry is him mentioning Aquanim. What was his reason for that? | ||
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JungleJorge
Uganda104 Posts
On February 26 2013 22:00 Promethelax wrote: Hey all, catching a jetplane outta here in a few minutes but I'm here right now. I'm still uncomfortable with Wade though knowing it is bh makes him less likely to be scum in my eyes. His weird d1 behaviour is weird in a blazing way, which I usually find scummy. Things I still find scummy in him: his omgus attack already mentioned, attacking me for having a changed read after I reread the thread (I get that everyone wants to get on my wagon now, its the in thing to do but assuming you do lynch me when I flip look for shoddy reasoning like Wade's), his obsession with the vet/newbie dichotomy (he is focusing on it to the exclusion of actual scum hunting) Things I find townie: his confidence and casual tone ("for all you know I'm warbaby" and "so no real opinions then") conclusion: keep an eye on, not a good day one lynch JJ on the other hand is looking scummier (again this only works for me but once I flip go back and look at my reads k thx) I am under a lot of pressure now and most/all of the vets and smurfs (i.e. probable vets want to lynch me) and yet JJ comes in and says I am town for no reason. He has a reason. He just won't share it. It looks to me like a scummer trying to gain a little cred on a mislynch while also not actually derail the lynch. This is his whole interaction with me/comment on me before his sudden defense conclusion: probably scum, would lynch. I'm heading out of town and will have limited internet access. I will post when I can. Good luck town! Promethelax is likely scum. I made that post specifically to see how he would react (as you noticed I didn't provide any reasons). Mostly my concerns were that too many people were pushing for his lynch and there was no opposition to it. Also the main reasons for the suspicion on him was some sudden change of mind or some controversial behavior, and those are normally townie traits. Now onto his reaction to my post: as town he would never come to the conclusion that I'm scum in that spot. What would be my interest as scum in defending a player everybody else thinks is scum? For town cred? As you can all tell that very often has the opposite effect and town cred is overrated anyway. People had not even mentioned my name prior to this so I had no reason to risk my neck over this. If you know you are townie your first reaction in this situation certainly is to think the people that are defending you are town! Now as scum what would you do? First you have inherent guilt, you think you look bad, so it's plausible that the claim that the guy defending you must have extra information should fly. Secondly you want to divert attention from your lynch, so it's a terrific opportunity to throw suspicion on someone that is on the other side of the issue. People that want to lynch prome certainly won't like the defense one bit, and are more easily willing to jump on the person defending it. As you can see Promethelax post makes very little sense if taken form a townie perspective, but makes a lot of sense given a scum mentality. I'll refrain from expanding my thoughts on macho man from now as to not derail this lynch. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
Soooooo....should we all hold hands and "ohhmmmmmmmmm" or something? How does he propose we do this thing? | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On February 26 2013 14:41 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Notice the connection between Prom's fixation on confirmed townies and the fact that mafia know for certain who the town are (assuming no third party shenanigans, theorizing about third party is really a waste of time until later when it matters for LYLO) btw This point actually really bolsters the feelings regarding Prom, I haven't checked if Prom responded to this but I know from the first read that he's AWOL right now... | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On February 27 2013 03:29 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Oh, bad memory. You're right, you weren't even involved. I wanted to get him out of the way as quickly as possible. So I admit to that. Thank god Marvellosity and Mattchew aren't in this game or I'd be trying to lynch Mattchew for what Marvel said and vice-versa. how do you know Matt isn't in the game? | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On February 27 2013 03:39 ObviousOne wrote: @Milk Suckler http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17883358 Regarding that post, most of it seems to be spot on from my perspective. You sort of belabor the shit out of the RNG points and spread them into other categories but think about how Zarepath acted D1 in the last newbie game he played with me (us? if you're mocsta) and you'll see that it's possible he was indeed going about trying to generate discussion. He might have even been successful if he was vigilant in driving the conversation or hinting as to the direction he wanted to go with it, but since none of that actually happened it's looking like a really bad point against him. As for considering WOS a candidate, after the smack talk prior to looking at his newbie game and evaluating WOS' re-entrance to the thread, I could see how his mindset (as either alignment) would allow him to 180. WHY he 180s is a question for him directly at that point in the conversation, though from my perspective I see an enthusiastic WOS looking to take some burden off the concerns of town at a point where we were only looking at ~2 real candidates. One thing to note about WOS re-entry is him mentioning Aquanim. What was his reason for that? Because Aquanim was the only one who actually acknowledged me; for the record I actually was feeling ignored but I had to go for a bit and wanted to see if anyone would react to me intentionally lurking. As for your talk of me 180ing...what? | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On February 27 2013 03:46 Toadesstern wrote: how do you know Matt isn't in the game? huh? im saying i get people confused with eachother in my head and make mistakes because of it. their names both start with Ms and I often think they are the same person when I start getting reckless | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On February 26 2013 15:08 MilkSuckler wrote: This vet circle jerking has to stop now Being a vet does not guarantee your logic is sound; or that your shit smells better than mine and others. Further it does not guarantee you are town. All members of this game have a responsibility to be transparent in play and present well-reasoned thoughts. Perhaps, players with lower experience would not make as capable a mayor as a vet; however: (1) This mayor role is nerfed without BG - so the outcome of vet/new is of less importance & (2) Less experience is not synonymous with being incapable of reasoned thought that is CORRECT. I don't have a problem with your prome case; I already commented on pretty much everything you wrote, a fair bit before you wrote it. But I guess it doesn't make sense, not coming from a confirmed vet. The quicker you get over your game of 'soggy biscuit'; the quicker we are going to get along. Nice blatant buddying here. Im guessing you buy ya kneepads on bulk discount... (Milk vs. Prom) Here my first reaction is screaming in my head "IT'S A BUS IT'S A BUS" but my first reactions are typically wrong. Why insult the majority of the game? Where's the town mindset in that? Why not just say it nicely such as if you more experienced players would be so kind as to note when the lesser-experienced players say something useful and expand upon it that would be much appreciated instead of going on about knee-pads? Just having a WTF moment reading this. | ||
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