EPTBritish Empire Mini Mafia - Page 15
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jaybrundage
United States3921 Posts
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
On January 05 2013 15:00 DarthPunk wrote: Holy fuck. What do you not understand about this. I am town. I have no additional info. I have to figure shit out. The way I figure shit out is to have ideas and then alter these ideas with changing info or more thought applied to the problem. Whilst I was flaming with you I was thinking about Xatalos. Now the thing about Xatalos is that he is a pretty bad townie. He likes to sheep and he changes his mind. Changing your mind is a pretty bad thing to do as scum because people such as yourself for some reason view it as scummy, and as scum you don't need to change your mind. You can defend someone you know will flip town and be fully justified in doing that later when he flips. You can also tunnel people as long as they aren't your buddies, and even then you can do so. So changing his mind/sheeping was originally scummy but not with some further thought applied. His list post irks me as all lists post do in general HOWEVER re reading it actually contained decent content and seemed to fit someone trying to figure shit out. Not scummy. So. He is back to null after reevaluation and I need to figure some other shit out. Savvy? Savvy. You're town brah. ##Unvote DarthPunk | ||
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jaybrundage
United States3921 Posts
On January 05 2013 14:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Jesus Jay, he said "if he is town". Trying to get a cheat shot in much? EBWODP What's it to you? | ||
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Mr. Cheesecake
United States3756 Posts
On January 05 2013 15:03 jaybrundage wrote: Whats it to you? What's it to me? That's a scummy as shit move you pulled right thar sonny boy. | ||
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jaybrundage
United States3921 Posts
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
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Mr. Cheesecake
United States3756 Posts
On January 05 2013 15:10 jaybrundage wrote: You dont know DP alignment if your town. So I find it ironic that your thinking hes town. I made a comment on his post concerning his wishy washiness. So much wrong with this post. | ||
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jaybrundage
United States3921 Posts
On January 05 2013 15:10 Hapahauli wrote: No, DP is actually town. You may be convinced, I will hold my reservations | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
Firstly, me tunneling DP is somewhat ritualistic, because I find him super hard to read unless he gets under heavy pressure. So I just call him scum until I find reasons to believe he's town or scum. In this case, I think a lot of his recent posts show that he's pretty clearly town. For one, he refuses to get into a flame-war with me. This is very very clearly a town trait. I have no interest in repeating myself for you hapa. I will respond to others but I refuse to get into a flame war with you. My position can be found easily within my filter. Secondly, a couple of his other posts have shown exasperation and other traits I'd associate with a townie frustrated at pressure on him. This post in particular seemed really townie from an emotional perspective: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=391112¤tpage=14#278 As did his vote on Jay (which seemed sooooper townie) All and all, my tunnel served it's purpose. I'm convinced that DP is town. The method is crude, but IMO effective. Sorry DP <3 | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
After Hero Mini, my view on Jay is that he's lynch-bait, so I'm rather hesitant about lynching him. Right now, I'm unsure how likely his behavior is coming from a "town-Jay." His play on it's face is scummy, but I really need to hear more from him. @ Jay What do you make of my newly disclosed town-read on DP? Agree or disagree? Secondly, your quote accusing DP of assuming I was town was very clearly mis-interpreting his actions (in which he very clearly qualified as only IF I was town). It doesn't look very good. Explain yourself. | ||
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DarthPunk
Australia10848 Posts
I am not convinced hapa is town but I also don;t want to lynch the most active player. I am pretty furious with jay right now so my vote stays for now. I am going to read his last game and check his meta. anyone around to chat? | ||
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DarthPunk
Australia10848 Posts
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Xatalos
Finland9673 Posts
On January 05 2013 15:00 DarthPunk wrote: Holy fuck. What do you not understand about this. I am town. I have no additional info. I have to figure shit out. The way I figure shit out is to have ideas and then alter these ideas with changing info or more thought applied to the problem. Whilst I was flaming with you I was thinking about Xatalos. Now the thing about Xatalos is that he is a pretty bad townie. He likes to sheep and he changes his mind. Changing your mind is a pretty bad thing to do as scum because people such as yourself for some reason view it as scummy, and as scum you don't need to change your mind. You can defend someone you know will flip town and be fully justified in doing that later when he flips. You can also tunnel people as long as they aren't your buddies, and even then you can do so. So changing his mind/sheeping was originally scummy but not with some further thought applied. His list post irks me as all lists post do in general HOWEVER re reading it actually contained decent content and seemed to fit someone trying to figure shit out. Not scummy. So. He is back to null after reevaluation and I need to figure some other shit out. Savvy? Hmm.. Posts like this are the reason why I originally viewed DP as townish. From time to time there are scummy traits in his filter (angriness, contradictions...) but then again, there are many posts where he appears to genuinely try solving the game. For example this earlier post of his: On January 05 2013 06:16 DarthPunk wrote: I don;t like either of the 'cases' to be perfectly honest. Rise is completely null to me. And to be honest you are the one picking a fight with rise. There should be one read due to Rises' aggression and that is null. I thought that you were simply following up on him in order to push the town to be active. However you trying to drum up support for a bandwagon based of something that any player of your calibre should KNOW is a null tell is not 'potentially scummy' it IS scummy. and it has me worried. Since when do you call things 'potentially scummy' anyway??? sounds really fucking off to be honest. Yeah it was a WTF post from yamato initially. But his explanation, willingness to be open and transparent, and the fact that his original WTF post turned out to be an exercise in an open thought process give me a town read on yamato at this juncture. And once again I am wondering how the fuck a town hapa is not reaching the same conclusions as myself and is pushing the wagons of two people who are null at worst. These well thought-out and contentful posts about several players seem like something Mafia would have a hard time doing. Not impossible, of course, but they just fit town agenda a lot better. Combined with DP's relatively high activity and the speed at which the ghost bandwagon for him gained support, I don't really feel comfortable lynching him today. There's also the point that in my experience, a town vs town flamewar is the most obvious explanation for a fight between active players. With that said, there are some things in his filter that I don't like. DP, if you're there, I want your take on the following matters. On January 05 2013 07:04 DarthPunk wrote: What was on top of my agenda was figuring out hapa as you are the scariest player in this game, and if I could get a solid town read on you we could roll these scum. Unfortunately you went retard and or are scum so now I have to deal with a hapa tunnelling me based on All the while I am somehow illogical despite having really solid reasoning and you just ignoring that to serve your OMGUS agenda. Well, that is cool with me HAPA. I don't have to convince you you are scum. I just have to convince the town. And that should be straightforward after this little party we have been having together. I just can't wrap my head around this post. Here's what it basically says: 1) Hapa is the best player in this game 2) He's a retard and/or scum 3) He's definitely scum Where's the coherency and logic in all this? You called me out for switching my opinions in the time of 1-2 hours, but you're switching your opinions even inside the same post... It makes me think this could all be fake reasoning, only aimed at pushing an agenda, not finding the truth. And why is it so bad for Hapa to push weak cases? What it does is create discussion and draw opinions, likely even hints to several players' alignments, and simply there almost CAN'T be any strong cases this early. So it's infinitely better to push a weak case than merely talk policy or semantics. I have a hard time seeing why this makes Hapa scum exactly? - - - Alright. I don't have any strong scumreads at the moment, but... There are two players I'm considering for today. Mr. Cheesecake - Lots of one-liners that add nothing to the thread - So far his only suspect is me, based on my uncertainty about DP... and nothing else to add to the discussion? - A reasonable amount of posts, but basically nothing of value except the (weak) case on me - Generally being quite forgettable and blending in without drawing attention at all yamato77 - Voting for Mr. Cheesecake since... why? - Weird logic and reasoning... scrambling for something to back up his opinions? - Practically nothing useful in his (short) filter - Talking almost exclusively about meta/policy/semantics, nothing really meaningful related to this game | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
RiseAgain - Has been completely absent from the thread barring the opening hour of the game - Promised to return in 12-24 hours with some setup-speculation stuff and has not done so JayBrundage - He is lynch-bait, but his behavior alone has been the scummiest so far IMO. - Very little substantiative content in his filter. - He has his vote on Shaio right now, which is odd considering how much he's been pushing DP to get lynched. His "flow of suspicion" in this regard makes very little sense. I'll write more about this tonight when I have time. Yamato77 - Absurdly lurky and detached in comparison to his town games. - Hasn't done anything of consequence beyond a terrible vote on Mr.CC I would have ideally liked to have more narrow suspicions at this stage of the game, but it's simply impossible given the activity level. If you're town, your job right now is to generate content. If you see a player active at the same time as you are, have a conversation, probe that player, and ask him his opinions on things. The way things are going, this town is absolutely screwed if I get shot. | ||
yamato77
11589 Posts
Honestly my vote on CC was to get a better read on him. Up to that point I thought he was a bit scummy so I figured his reaction to me voting for him out of nowhere might reveal to me his alignment. It turns out it didn't, but some of the things he has said since then have swayed my opinion. I'm fairly confident in Hapa being town, so as far as active scum I don't think there are any. Jay is the only one I would question because his posts have a quality that makes them seem quiet, almost like his opinion isn't something to be valued. Is he scum trying to stay under the radar or just a weak townie? No I'm much more inclined to think a scum lies between Mr Zentor and Rise. Zentor hasn't contributed much besides a lot of setup talk and town reads. His filter is low content, low profile, very much like I think the scum are this game. Rise simply hasn't posted much since the beginning if the game and it is starting to make me question his motivations. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
Also, making a "pressure vote," and then subsequently doing nothing to pressure said player doesn't look very good. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On January 06 2013 00:10 Hapahauli wrote: Yamato, can you describe in detail the reasoning behind your 180 on Mr.CC? Also, making a "pressure vote," and then subsequently doing nothing to pressure said player doesn't look very good. His actions when you and DP were having it out were really towny. A scum could have been opportunistic or even just sat back and let it go on but he tried to get cooler heads to prevail and it worked. I haven't really had the time to follow up on anything yet this game. The vote wasn't a pressure vote, it was a play for a reaction, and I got one. | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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