EPT/G
[T] MTG Mini Mafia II - Page 50
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
(DontFear)ThePoster
Guernsey584 Posts
/G | ||
|
SuckMyTopdeck
Guernsey314 Posts
On February 01 2013 04:23 Clockwork Hydra wrote: No, it doesn't, because your fingerprints are all over the damn house. Now let me read Rock's filter. Nuh uh. My fingerprints are all over ONE house, and you don't know which house yet. But... the fingerprints I leave have always been in the first house, never the second, because I always plan the 2nd robbery perfectly! Yes! | ||
|
SuckMyTopdeck
Guernsey314 Posts
| ||
|
Clockwork Hydra
Uzbekistan442 Posts
On February 01 2013 03:10 RockHydra wrote: I have no mana with which to ninjutsu anything into play. Attacking with two 0/3 creatures for shits and giggles isn't my style unfortunately ~Hopeless Your earlier post: I disagree with the notion of everything that can attack should attack. However, I would only accept that if you were legitimately doing other things, instead of simply not attacking. The combat phase is like the voting structure, so if you either don't have creatures, or you have abilities that you want to use instead of attacking, I would like an explanation of what you intend to do and why. In addition, if you cannot contribute to the attacking phase itself, I'd like input on who you would like to have focused down, if anyone. You only accept people not attacking if they are legitimately doing other things. You are not. Why you contradict yourself? | ||
|
(DontFear)ThePoster
Guernsey584 Posts
And what about the 1st house? Answer me this marv, it's of utter importance /G | ||
|
SuckMyTopdeck
Guernsey314 Posts
On February 01 2013 04:30 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: What about the cat in the 2nd house? Do you give him milk and cookies and stroke his back so he doesn't alert the owners of the house you've been in it? And what about the 1st house? Answer me this marv, it's of utter importance /G Silly question, the 1st house doesn't have a cat. But yeah, I give the cat in the 2nd house milk and cookies. | ||
|
(DontFear)ThePoster
Guernsey584 Posts
 /G | ||
|
Stutters695
2610 Posts
On February 01 2013 03:59 RockHydra wrote: Hey all. I'm around again. I must say this is a pretty active group. I'm gonna be making a case on xfire now... although most things have kinda been said on that, but maybe I'll find something new. I'll get back with that in a sec. Then hopefully I also have time to read up on all the stuff going on with SuckMyTopdeck /zebezt So you disagree with Hopeless read that XF shouldn't be attacked I take it. Do you have any thoughts on anyone other than the person who is believed to be scum by most the thread? | ||
|
Clockwork Hydra
Uzbekistan442 Posts
Here are my earlier thoughts: nothing has changed. On January 31 2013 11:04 Clockwork Hydra wrote: I was writing a play-by-play case here on Suck but the crux of the question is this: Marv is pretty damned proud of his D1 status of never being suspected, and that is because he generally looks pretty damned townie on D1. Recent games: LVI, got elected and lynched scum on D1. PU, had some arguments, but was never in doubt. Took a back seat in most plays, because 3P wincon. Hero Mini, early support on bussing his scumbuddy D1. I don't think Marv has ever died on D1 and that is because Marv always puts in an effort on D1. This game, he clearly didn't (at least not at the start). The only other game I can find where Marv really didn't put in an effort on D1 is MTG Mini Mafia I. He was scum in that game. The play-by-play I was doing just showed the lack of effort he put in until about 2/3 through the day. Verdict: scum Then we get this: + Show Spoiler [Marv's defense] + On January 30 2013 22:12 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: Hi. I said I found Cross suspicious, and told you something I noted about it. I'm not gonna rehash what has already been said by multiple other posters. Although if it would make you happy I can have a go at rephrasing the same things again (hint: I won't do this). As far as I'm aware, I'm also one of the first (if not the first) to give the opinion of Stutters that his posts seemed interested and his empty promises mean nothing for alignment. Simply enough I was never going to post a lot this game. Last Magic game I did not a single thing, so this is me trying some  As for Aperture, I did the meme because I found what he did hilarious in its hypocrisy. I don't know how to judge it so much right now, and he'll have to be judged on his long-awaited scumhunting after the 'profiling' of the players that he's apparently carrying out. I don't really share my other half's suspicion of CH right now, although Acro is someone I'm generally extremely wary of being able to play a strong town game as mafia. I don't particularly like the condescending tone Acro has taken in several of his posts, but I don't think that has to be indicative of him being mafia. -marvelbabe This touched all the wrong keys. Marv is a good player, he knows when he has been contributing and when he hasn't. So why the hell bother making this post? It's a load of nothing in which he claims to have done more than he has, and in the next breath says he won't do much this game at all. It is NOT a post I would associate with Marv as either alignment, so we have to throw meta overboard (as with most of his play this game): in that case I see no town reason for making a post in which you claim to contribute, apologize for not contributing and fill it out with a bit of fluff. Verdict: scum Marv's redemption (a bit). The only post by Marv that makes me think he might be town is this response to me "catching him out": + Show Spoiler [Marv figuring things out] + On January 31 2013 05:21 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: It means you fail at analysis, and you overestimate yourself. As mafia, playing a card like MG played is obviously a pretty big deal, as it has large implications and certainly seems pro-town. There really would have to have been a specific conversation about it if they were mafia, I think. On the other hand, as town, MG would just be playing this card because it's good for town, and the need to plan it out is far less. To me it seems pretty obvious that a mafia Bin would have talked this over and made sure they were united far more than a town Bin. That is why I consider it somewhat of a town tell, not a null tell. This is somewhat analogous to how in normal games, mafia players usually post and stuff by themselves, but for big decisions like who they're looking to mislynch the next day or who they're going to NK, they're going to talk about it. Now this impressed me for two reasons: the first is that IF this was a scum play, it was fucking fast. The time difference between the posts is 5 minutes, which is a damn short time to come up with an elaborate story like this. The second is that it makes a coherent train of thought and it seems as if Marv thought of this first, then jumped to the conclusion he came to, and posted his conclusion. When I then asked him how he had missed something obvious, he posted the rest of his reasoning, which fills in the gaps. Verdict: town He then goes on to finding Nova scummy for almost exclusively bad reasons. SnB starts off terribly and spends almost all his time posting about magic-related stuff. I jumped to the conclusion fairly early that he is scum and I know SnB fairly well. He is not usually as useless as this. However, as scum he is prone to lurk and when posting, do nothing of value. Verdict: scum However, while I find his defense against attack terrible, I cannot argue that it is terrible at first sight only: At first I just raged, because Marv was making such a big deal about how they are hardly communicating at all and the lack of a QT. However, if they are scum, they don't need a QT, they have a scumQT. Whether Marv would be able to stop SnB from posting like a tard is a moot point: the new question is whether they would really not sync up their stories, if they actually WERE communicating? Verdict: town His other defense against MG's case is pathetically bad, though. It's so outrageously bad that I am not sure what to make of it, because the case had some good points and they are all dismissed with offhand remarks. The case against Nova is pathetic. As Dandel pointed out to me: it's as if Marv and SnB pre-picked Nova as a target and then started gathering "dirt" on him. They shrug off Nova's case as not indicative of alignment (it isn't), yet present one themselves which is even worse. + Show Spoiler [annotated "case"] + On January 31 2013 05:03 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: this is silly, someone else pointed it out before, but life gain is so weak in this format that i doubt scum would be worried, still that could be explained by him not knowing much about mtg, null leaning scum a little bit tell. Not indicative of alignment. You even say so yourself, yet throw in a "little bit of a scum tell" for absolutely no fucking reason at all. sucking up to gonzaw, who has a history of being partial towards people who suck up to him (see last mtg mafia), this is scummy. also misunderstanding the importance of card advantage but that's okay because not everyone has studied mtg theory, this is null. not wanting acro to get zombies is fine but not a towntell or a scumtell/ Not indicative of alignment. None of it. Buddying ALONE is not a scumtell. It could be a sincere opinion. what what "powering up town is bad because town can kill people more easily and they might be wrong" the solution to that is to not be wrong. it's okay to oppose powering up individual players if you think they might be scum or if you think they are likely to use that power impulsively to kill townies. it's not okay to oppose powering up town as a whole. what what Weren't you opposed to me getting zombies for the exact same fucking reason? The whole thing is not indicative of alignment in any case. nice jumping in to share widespread town sentiment without providing any reasoning. like, i dont see anywhere above here in your filter you saying that crossfire is scum or explaining this suspicion. Fluff = not indicative of alignment. ditto the above, way to not actually say anything. "marvs typical posting style" lolwut, there's no way you havent seen at least a couple other games from him, hes ubiquitous. also there's literally no explanation of what nova finds scummy about marvs posts so far. and how the crap was my policy post cut and pasted? except that its the same policy i proposed last time i was town in an mtg game? Zzzzz, 2/3 of Marv's D1 was not following any meta and was just plain lurking. The only game anybody has ever played where Marv lurked, he was scum. Your policy post was just flat-out terrible. It was beside the point, hashed together and useless. Who cares whether it's cut-and-pasted. How is this indicative of alignment anyway? Nova says he'll post reasons from work. He then says work is utter chaos due to unforeseen shit. You then harrass him for reasons. Herpaderp. You could just have waited and if they weren't there tomorrow or so, then jump on it. lolk well this sucks we should wait a few days before we kill him. good thing we have to. also note that this is only an explanation for his recent absence not for his earlier terrible and scummy posting. So in short, the whole case is bogus. Now making a bad case is not necessarily a scumtell, but SnB was under quite a bit of pressure to get some scumhunting done and it looks like they picked their target based on a combination of easy shot on someone who hasn't really contributed much and a bit of OMGUS. They then gathered "evidence" to fit the case, rather than the other way round. Verdict: scum PS. I know I just did Nova's defense for him, but he has already responded and the case was terrible anyway. These are just my own findings from filter diving. Dandel is doing his own analysis (although we played some back and forth in skype). He didn't have time to finish, and can hopefully give you more tomorrow. For now, you have Acro's conclusions: is this a blatantly obvious scum? No. There's some stuff that doesn't scan with them being scum. But after reading the filter from back to front, front to back and inside out, I am still fairly confident that there is something seriously off with both Marv and SnB's play and the most obvious explanation is that they're scum, despite the town tells. /Acro | ||
|
Clockwork Hydra
Uzbekistan442 Posts
| ||
|
RockHydra
Pitcairn222 Posts
On February 01 2013 04:30 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Your earlier post: You only accept people not attacking if they are legitimately doing other things. You are not. Why you contradict yourself? That was in the context that attacking might actually have an impact. 0/3 creatures don't have an impact in my opinion. Me attacking is like laying an FoS, and then refusing to vote at the deadline. Are you trying to get me to leave myself open so you can throw all your zombies at me? Does no one else find Nova's case on Suck to be completely lacking on all fronts? He's had time and opportunity to come back and dissect maybe 1 more page of filter, but basically...hasn't. CH, you want me to send an empty thread at Nova to back up my statements? | ||
|
RockHydra
Pitcairn222 Posts
| ||
|
Clockwork Hydra
Uzbekistan442 Posts
I want to know how they are so incredibly schizophrenic, though. It's a great strategy as scum: Xfire is town! No! Xfire is scum! So what's your stance on Xfire? In fact, I am missing general scum reads, the whole filter is confusing in that sense. Lot of waffle, some town reads, but no pressure and no consolidated reads. If you had a 10/10 trample thingy, who would you attack? And why? Go. /Acro | ||
|
Stutters695
2610 Posts
On February 01 2013 03:05 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Stutters, imho, is one of the towniest players in the game. That is, imho a lot more valuable than SnB's half-arsed read of Nova based on almost exclusively bad tells. /Acro CH I'm a bit curious about this. In eight minutes I go from being used as an insult (I'm doing more than he is, which is bad) to you seeing me as one of the towniest players. Why such a sudden switch? | ||
|
Clockwork Hydra
Uzbekistan442 Posts
| ||
|
RockHydra
Pitcairn222 Posts
On February 01 2013 04:45 Clockwork Hydra wrote: K, Rock's filter is nice and short and full of fluff. Of the two, my earlier town read on H1 has gone to a slight scum read. However, my earlier null read on Zebezt is moving towards the town spectrum. I want to know how they are so incredibly schizophrenic, though. It's a great strategy as scum: Xfire is town! No! Xfire is scum! So what's your stance on Xfire? In fact, I am missing general scum reads, the whole filter is confusing in that sense. Lot of waffle, some town reads, but no pressure and no consolidated reads. If you had a 10/10 trample thingy, who would you attack? And why? Go. /Acro Nova for failing to substantiate why Suck is scum and the lack of follow up. | ||
|
Clockwork Hydra
Uzbekistan442 Posts
On February 01 2013 04:46 Stutters695 wrote: CH I'm a bit curious about this. In eight minutes I go from being used as an insult (I'm doing more than he is, which is bad) to you seeing me as one of the towniest players. Why such a sudden switch? You're probably the newbiest newbie in the thread with a meta of lurking. Nobody expects you to do much. I was thus positively surprised by your contributions, this led me to do two things: 1. Taunt Marv and SnB who are two of the most veteran players in the thread, both with quite a track record, that they were being outplayed as a newbie. 2. When this was put to the question, state WHY they were being outplayed by a newbie. | ||
|
Clockwork Hydra
Uzbekistan442 Posts
and /Acro | ||
|
Stutters695
2610 Posts
| ||
|
RockHydra
Pitcairn222 Posts
here goes my case on Crossfire99 underlines in quotes are for emphasis by me. first post off the bat = On January 29 2013 13:55 Crossfire99 wrote: Hi guys. Just so you know I'm a magic noob. I was supposed to hydra with Risen, but he dropped out and took all the magic knowledge with him lol. I'll try to do my best, but I'll probably still be dumb, therefore, feel free to correct me when I make mistakes because I know I will. As for this whole Mind Glow issue. I only think a few mana total should be used on it because I don't think it is wise to discard so many cards because that's wasteful. I also don't think I would contribute mana to it because it seems like a big goal of using it is so Bin can get that Voyage card, which if I understand correctly won't help me at all. Risen seems to have had a fondness for non basic lands (all of my basic lands are already in play lol). Oh, also can anyone that played in the first MTG Mafia summarize any hugely important things from it? Basically, I'm trying to think what is better, everyone attacking 1 person or everyone slowly whittling down everyone else, so they'll be easier to kill later. Typing that out makes me think that attacking 1 person is best because it will be as close to a normal lynch as possible, but I'm not sure with all this magic stuff, so I'm asking. Making excuses for yourself is usually considered scummy, but this one isn't too bad in my book. The excuse is limited to mtg, and that seems a fair warning in this case. Saying discarding cards is wasteful is nonsense of course. We're not talking about the environment here. It might burn people through their decks faster, but that is a different thing. All in all, he is casting doubt on what is pretty good for town. Then about the lands.. only thinking about what is good for himself. Not what is good for town. Some will say "herpderp, but you cast 0/3 creatures that don't help anyone" that is completely different cause they will turn into awesome scumhunting ninjas! Also they did not prevent us from contributing to the Mind Glow. After this post he goes on to defend the rights of players to defend themselves. A big percentage of his posts are devoted to this and the ensuing confusion. Might be noobiness, but still looks a lil scummy. He then turns an accusing finger to CH. On January 30 2013 14:43 Crossfire99 wrote: Now onto some scum hunting. Let's take a look at Clockwork shall we. Look at the contradiction at how he responds to virtually the same question: + Show Spoiler + On January 30 2013 00:30 Clockwork Hydra wrote: -snipped- But the worst part is the last bit: 1. Can some over-eager townie please do all the hard work for me, by giving me a cliffnotes version of a long and complicated game? PS. All the time you spend summarizing that game for my lazy ass, you're not scumhunting, so doublescore one for me! 2. More MTG discussion, but this time with extra wishy wash! For the record: we focus down people. Why make it easier for the mafia creature to kill people? That is one of the mistakes made in the first game, which you would know if you had read it... like everybody has been telling you to. The entire post is completely useless. It contributes nothing, yet tries to sound as if he is actually contributing, with a "novel" point on the use of Minds Aglow and a pointless question about policy. If this post didn't put you on instant red alert, your scumdar needs fixing. On January 29 2013 08:59 Clockwork Hydra wrote: -snipped- Well, you mentioned quite a bit of it. They/you spent a LOT of time bickering about useless stuff (not just setup, but completely pointless stuff about setup) and town didn't play as a team (mainly due to everybody mistrusting each other for stupid shit). This game is fundamentally different from normal mafia games not just in that we kill with magic, but because we don't actually have a town-controlled KP. It is thus twice as important to be an active townie, because we are a town TEAM. We need to work together, because our strength is in numbers. This turn people may be able to play one creature, which is a bit of a wimp. But if next turn we can all attack one player with wimps, that will be a healthy chunk of damage. If everybody goes off attacking their own favourite target without reasoning it out properly (like happened in the first 3 turns or so of the previous game), then we have lots of players at 16 life and one dead townie due to mafia creature. That is pointless, and last game was in fact harmful, because the mafia creature could one-shot people sooner than should have been possible (although mafia derped too when they missed an attack). Yes, they're more elaborate forms of our own policies, with some stuff we forgot about. /Acro Also, look at this post where they advise caution when powering up a single person + Show Spoiler + On January 29 2013 09:07 Clockwork Hydra wrote: rhetorical questions, already? huh. As for your points, they're fairly straightforward. The thing about #4 (also kinda applies to #5): Sure it's a townies job to establish his townieness - but if everybody did that properly, we wouldn't need any policies in the first place, now. I shall be reluctant to participate in plans when they result in a favorable position of somebody whose alignment I have no clue about. And I advise everybody to use the same caution in regards to this. On the other hand, I won't have any problems cooperating with people whose townieness I am sure of. (or at least if acro is, that's fine too) ~dandel On January 29 2013 11:00 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Okay so here's the thing: We are running Zombie Infestation. (this badboy right here:+ Show Spoiler + For that reason, we would have prefered Minds aglow next turn (and given all 3 mana, too!), but it seems like like it would be more beneficial to town in general this turn, than delaying until next turn  So if it's going to be today, we would REALLY like to cast zombie infestation this turn (instead of contributing mana). And of course still ask everyone else to use as much mana as humanly possible! Not just the lurkers/scum! Everyone! Think of it as a group project! I promise we're not crazy (or scum) ~dandel (with acro's consent) Lastly, I already showed before how their attack on me was bad and all of this definitely has me thinking Clockwork is the first scum. His first point is basically that he feels unfairly treated because CH bashed him for asking about the previous game, while answering somebody elses question about it. Ok.. it was a little unfair. But in no way proof that he is scum. His second point is that CH says he is "reluctant to participate in plans when they result in a favorable position of somebody whose alignment I have no clue about" but then is liking the mind glow a lot while it helps him most of all. This is of course in no way contradicting as CH explained later on. He knows his own alignment after all. A lot of time passes and no posts appear, people point fingers... Then just before the deadline 2 creatures are cast. Was he just lurking this whole time? He claims to be busy, is anyone too busy to even drop a quick line? To say when they will be back? Then we get this: On January 31 2013 08:19 Crossfire99 wrote: Seriously, you want me to use mana for Join Forces, when I think Clockwork is the most scummy as of right now. Oh hey what's this post by you to suck: This makes no sense seriously. I'm just...lask;dfjkl;sdjlakj.f...aaaaaarrrrrrgggggggggggggg...why are you attacking me for playing according to my reads...ajdsfljdfiopjdoajfp On January 31 2013 08:25 Crossfire99 wrote: I have a freaking life and it is pretty busy right now. I played at night when the started 2 days when i had time. I played at night last night when i had time. Now i am playing just when i got home. I really really really really really lrajljafl;dsfjal; klaldsfj want to attack you right now just cause of the crap you just said, but I know that is just me not thinking clearly because of what you said, so I'm not going to decide rihgt now. ughguigho CROSSFIRE SMASH!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The underlined lines to me, seem like TRYING to sound angry. Is he the only person on the internet that does not know how to swear? I skimmed through some of his previous games. Nowhere does he ever type like this. In fact I notice most of the time he is getting along very well with everyone and laughing a lot. Not quite like this game. Suspicious After this he apologizes for being angry: On January 31 2013 08:39 Crossfire99 wrote: Your right Gonzaw. Sorry, for getting so angry. There's a lot of crap going on irl causing me to be stressed and i'm getting way too pissed off at people saying where's crossfire. crossfire isn't here. crossfire needs to post more becaues I know i am literally using every free moment to play this game. I hope we can have a clean start from here and i will try not to let me emotions get the best of me. Feel free to call me out again if I get too angry again. I don't want to play like that. This is nice n fuzzy n all, but actually looks weird to me. Who moodswings like that? is he having PMS? This is the kind of apologetic that seems scummy to me. After this people attack him for casting a creature that has an anti-town ability. While this is not completely fair, since he hasn't used the ability, he could have not cast the creature and instead have contributed to an extra card for everyone. After all of this though, zero contribution to scumhunting except a TERRIBLE case aimed at CH. All of this combined makes Crossfire by far the scummiest player at the moment. /zebezt | ||
| ||
