EPTworking now, so i'll have a lot less time than normal but i should be able to be consistent at least
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thrawn2112
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working now, so i'll have a lot less time than normal but i should be able to be consistent at least | ||
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/more ins | ||
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will be more ok once this thread is full of posts to read | ||
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been trying to remember the console command cheat codes to jedi outcast... you just reminded me that the no clip cheat = thereisnospoon off to play jedi outcast, bbl | ||
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On December 10 2012 09:37 Djodref wrote: @thrawn Did you seriously not read that millers are not self aware ? I dont see what the point of this question is, if I'm town then I obviously can't give a real answer. | ||
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On December 10 2012 09:56 Adam4167 wrote: Thrawn, I don't know you, can you link me some of your games as scum on here. uh go look at mario mafia, but that barely counts because I was only in for the first cycle | ||
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On December 10 2012 10:19 Adam4167 wrote: I think you better try to explain what you were hoping to accomplish here. I find this post sits in a stark contrast to your current play, and this is from one of your recent town games (ACME). What's the stark contrast? I don't see how these things are even related. Are you trying to suggest I'm scum? because you went about it pretty subtly. | ||
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On December 10 2012 10:28 Adam4167 wrote: Town you from ACME says that you disagree with the idea of millers claiming, and that you don't even know what your thought process would be for deciding if its real or not. Why are you trying to put everyone else in a similar position of confusion? If I wanted to call you scum, I would have. What I want to know is why you are doing what you are doing. That's not even the issue. How am I putting anyone in a compromising decision about whether or not to believe the claim when millers aren't even self aware? I don't understand what accusation you're trying to make, it makes no sense in the context of what the OP has to say about millers. | ||
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On December 10 2012 10:32 jaybrundage wrote: You tried to brush off bears vote. And then when the whole thread is asking you to explain you dont give an answer. Ok heres my thought of process. IF you dont wanna get lynched today your gonna have to try harder then that. If your a town player then your gonna have to put some effort in your defense because as it is I could totally see my self lynching you. I dont wanna start an early easy bandwagon. But your making a pretty good case for your self why your scum. you didn't read that post, did you? | ||
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On December 10 2012 11:55 wherebugsgo wrote: Lynch all liars. I'm tired of having to assume people are dumb and leaving them alive because of it. No more rewarding of stupidity. The reward is now a lynch. Thrawn is a confirmed liar. Time to lynch him. ##vote thrawn2112 Vote wbg for mayor, I will clean up the state of TL Mafia. All I'm reading from this is "I don't care about thrawn's alignment" If you were to assume I'm dumb, what assumption would you be making? If you are going to vote for me then you should at least say if you think I'm town or not. | ||
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On December 10 2012 12:16 wherebugsgo wrote:The point is that in a previous game, he claimed that millers claiming on d1 were hard to read. So, what to make of him claiming miller d1? He wants to be hard to read. are you actually saying that I, as scum, in a game where millers aren't aware, because of my past experience in dealing with miller claims, fakeclaimed in order to get people to be extra confused about my alignment? I don't like that you're policy voting, but whatever sometimes emotions get in the way of logic. However I just can't understand the reasoning you're using to call me scum. @marv nobody said anything about traps, my ego is not that over-inflated. and yes, this conversation is getting a little annoying | ||
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On December 10 2012 12:35 wherebugsgo wrote: no one knows your original intentions because you made a stupid play and then refused to explain it (I'm going to presume out of embarrassment, since anything else is just pathetic) Adam, thoughts on debears? for someone who thinks I'm scum, you sure have some pretty descriptive words about my town motivations | ||
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On December 10 2012 13:26 Clarity_nl wrote: Some questions for everyone to answer: - Why does Jay think Thrawn would be an easy bandwagon? - Why does Jay care if Thrawn is easy to lynch or not, if he truly believe he was scum? - Why does Jay flip-flop so hard from town/anti-town/scum in the course of a couple of hours, without thrawn saying anything that would change his perception? I'll answer them all for you, Jay is scum. ##Vote jaybrundage I don't read too much into people changing their minds a lot, but j's word choice does show scum mentality. Scum are the ones thinking in terms of "easy bandwagons" etc. | ||
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On December 10 2012 14:34 jaybrundage wrote: Lol is my reaction not what you expected  Wait a second, the reason i didn't vote is because i don't feel i have too. A vote doesn't mean anything till the end of the cycle. I have been going after thrawn and trying to get him to respond to me. And get some kind of explanation from him. However he has yet to respond to me. THRAWN STOP GAWD DAMN IGNORING ME. And yes i do care if the lynch seems to easy. Because then from my experience, its likely a bus or a townie were killing. I'll try to find the games if i can. Its been almost a year tho. And i already gave you a scum reasoning to do what he did. alright well I'm tired of the miller claim discussion so here's how it went down from my perspective. At first it was mainly a joke, but it was also intended to jump start discussion. + Show Spoiler + wow big surprise there right? | ||
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On December 11 2012 00:41 Munk-E wrote: Good morning and hello, everyone! I will be doing a more in depth reading of the thread, but for now, WBG, how on earth did you figure palmer was more likely to be scum than anyone? You said there were 5 people that hadn't participated yet, yet palmer, being one of them had a 2/3rds chance of being scum. Did you sleep through math class, or do you actually have some explaination to back that up? for a first post I don't like how 'irrelevant' this one is. people questioning each other about arbitrary percentages never results in anything useful. munk-e, please get to other stuff from the thread asap | ||
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On December 11 2012 09:36 debears wrote: If he is lying about the pm, and he is scum, then he has corrupt reads. But, based on the fact that he agrees with me, and I have a town mindset, then I see him more likely to be town than scum. I don't think he's lying about when he read the pm, considering he made an hour long video, I would trust his reads in the video in terms of being a townie mindset. Do you see what I'm getting at? No, this doesn't make sense. "I don't think he's lying about when he read the pm, considering he made an hour long video, I would trust his reads in the video in terms of being a townie mindset" First, Palmer didn't check his role pm. I'm already satisfied that he wasn't "acting" and I'm not even 20 minutes into the vid. So yes, his words in the video do come from a town perspective. HOWEVER, the video tells us absolutely nothing about palmer's alignment. In that video, palmer does not know his alignment. So how could anyone know palmer's alignment from the video? (at least until we get a lot of his post pm-checking opinions) Do you really not see that? | ||
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On December 11 2012 09:52 debears wrote: Do you not see that, if he doesn't know his alignment, then his ideas were from a townie mindset? Yes, that's what I said. His ideas in the video come from a townie mindset. But that doesn't count for anything because palmer didn't know his alignment. A palmer who made that video and is unaware that he's town is indistinguishable from a palmer who made the video and is unware that he's scum.. Making a read on palmer purely based on the video is a waste of time. | ||
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On December 11 2012 09:58 debears wrote: You and thrawn need to take a chillz pillz dude, debears: On December 11 2012 09:56 thrawn2112 wrote: Yes, that's what I said. His ideas in the video come from a townie mindset. But that doesn't count for anything because palmer didn't know his alignment. A palmer who made that video and is unaware that he's town is indistinguishable from a palmer who made the video and is unware that he's scum.. Making a read on palmer purely based on the video is a waste of time. | ||
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I had the same initial reaction to adam's post that debears did. Here is the line that I think is the start of the conflict: On December 10 2012 10:19 Adam4167 wrote: I find this post sits in a stark contrast to your current play, and this is from one of your recent town games (ACME). Yes, that line does imply that adam is having doubts about thrawn's alignment. And no, adam does not commit to a read on thrawn. There is no reason to compare thrawn's play this game with his play from a town game unless you are trying to show similarities/differences and therefore some sort of meta based read. However I'm fine with adam not voting for thrawn. I'm even fine with him not wanting to call him scum at that point. It happened at a very early point in the game... I don't expect anyone to be that sure of a read at that point. Do I think debears is scummy for that interaction? No, he's simply did what adam was doing, which was questioning people over weak shit that happened during the early game. Adam/debears "scumslip" I'm referring to this post. So what's going on is adam says he thinks debears is scum, and later says he thinks debears is misunderstanding posts. The logic is that if adam thinks debears is scum, he wouldn't think debears's problem would be that he's misunderstanding posts. Yet again I think debears is probably being overzealous because of two reasons... confidence and compartmentalization. If adam is town is he 100% sure about debears being scum? I'm assuming not, and when there is any doubt you always should compartmentalize your reads so that you don't make assumptions based off of unflipped players. (yes I know it's specific to the situation, but in general and especially on D1) On top of all of that, debears can be both scum and misunderstanding adam's posts. I see just about as many possibilities where it's a scumslip as where it isn't a scumslip, so I do not think it's a scumslip. On December 11 2012 10:44 Djodref wrote: @ Z-Boson First of all, you're wrong and you have failed to show what goal my actions would serve if I was scum. I'm going to help you to read my posts because you obviously didn't understand where I was going during the early game. My problem with debears early vote was not that it was a vote following a LAL policy but rather the seriousness of this vote. I've assumed that it was a vote for sparking discussion because this was the early game and the atmosphere was quite carefree at this time. Nevertheless, thrawn calling out debears on his vote against him would have been a good starting point for a real discussion but debears chose to post a video instead of this. The problem was not the video itself, but more what he did not do instead. Anyway, this was an early FoS, and also an attempt for me to spark some discussion. And when debears implied that his vote was not serious (which I knew because he didn't use the voting thread to vote thrawn), I wondered why debears would throw early mindless votes like this, and I wanted him to explain this as well. All in all, I think that he didn't really care about what he was doing, and I don't read anything of it. I don't like how debears is focused on Adam so I didn't remove my Fos on him so far. Something that's been irritating me is the discussion about debear's vote for me. The actual vote itself and the manner in which he did it.... I'm leaning mostly null on but maybe just a little bit town. Djo... do you / did you realize that the matrix video was a direct representation about how debears felt about his vote? It was a joke video response to a question about a joke vote because of a joke claim. In fact, debears' reaction to thrawn's posts was what I was expecting from most people regardless of their alignment. You are questioning him for not engaging in the discussion, when it was (to me) obvious that he didn't find the discussion worth his time. I'm not seeing what's scummy about the first interactions between debears and thrawn. Palmer's video -his town group of debears/clarity/marv This might be what I agree with the most from the video, even down to the order of most town to most scum (clarity, debears, marv) Debears has been derping recently but not in a way that I think makes him scum. I've been getting a gut town read on marv because of how he jumped on me for being a jackass. I thought he was telling the truth about his opinion of my play. His overall involvement hasn't been quite up to my expectations but it's nothing extreme so I'm not worried about marv yet. On December 11 2012 11:30 debears wrote: I know marv. All in good fun :D When did you realize you were wrong? tldr -clarity/debears/marv are probably the people I'm least likely to lynch -the adam/debears conflict is interesting but I'm not convinced of either of debears' cases against adam and I don't want to lynch adam -+ Show Spoiler [p.s.] + palmer should make another video of him reading through posts for the first time because if he's scum it will be extremely obvious that he's faking it. in fact everyone in the game probably should. posting videos of yourself should probably be against the rules anyway but idc because I think everyone is too lazy to spend time watching/making hours and hours of content. I no longer want to lynch wbg. There's been more stuff to analyze since then and as the game has gone on I've been thinking that the chances of lynching scum outside of wbg are better than the chances that wbg is scum. Maybe I just really pissed him off or something and that's why he was voting so anti-town. this post has grown too large so I'll leave my lynch choices for the next one | ||
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On December 11 2012 11:11 marvellosity wrote: I like it. I have very little else to add other than I agree that it makes no sense that he was talking to you that way when you were his scumread. I'd understand it more if this was the start of the interactions, but it's been going on a while. Tunkeg has done jack shit to make me think he's town which I love to lynch for on Day 1, but Adam has betrayed a scum mentality right there. ##Unvote ##Vote: Adamsomenumbers I'm a little concerned about this... I'm nowhere near convinced about the case for adam and I'm surprised that marv is throwing away his tunkeg read to sheep debears' case. It seemed like marv was more convinced about tunkeg than he currently is about adam. Marv am I wrong about this? Does adam's 'scumslip' overrule what you had to say about tunkeg? | ||
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Djo: bleh I've probably waited too long to ask this, but I'd like you to go back to this post. When did you write it in relation to the post you made right before it? Was it one right after the other, did you make them simultaneously, did you write the 2nd one first but post the 1st one 1st, etc. please be as specific as possible | ||
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and atm i'd be opposed to an adam lynch if it was in opposition to say, a tunkeg lynch. i think a lot of the stuff about adam has been blown out of proportion | ||
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On December 11 2012 16:06 Tunkeg wrote: Lol WBG. In these games you are linking to, and others games like it, haven't you been the one complaining about me posting readposts like that? And also me posting "useless" questions? And now you say the same play you labeled as bad and useless actually was scumhunting? If you want me lynched for meta fine. But don't try to convince the thread you were a fan of my previos play. Is that "lol" as in "Lol are you scum?" or lol as in "lol wtf what are you saying?" "don't try to convince the thread" means that you are accusing him of doing bad sneaky things... what's your full read on wbg? | ||
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On December 11 2012 04:23 Tunkeg wrote: So I have skimmed through the thread. And these are my thoughts: Thrawn's "claim" is a joke claim. He did it in the very beginning, and quickly and without concern went back on it. I didn't like his response when called out on it. But when he in the end explained why he did as he did, it was an ok (no more, no less) explanation. I truly think people read to much into stuff like this, and overfocuses on it. I have many times made posts early that people have labeled stupid, with them voting for me and almost misslynching me (mainly because they didn't get my logic behind doing them, even after I explained it). I don't think the millar "claim" is anything worth spending much time analysing, but I would say that I find it more likely that a townie would do this. I like Clarity's post on jaybrundage. I think jaybrundage's posts are very non-commiting, and very fluffy. I have played games with jaybrundage before, and I may be wrong, but I think his style resembles what he did in Student, where he was scum. A very wishy-washy style, where he eventually did some major slips. I am also abit concerned about Djodref, I think he is posting alot, but his posts are very fluffy. I haven't played with him before, is this his style or? This is tunkeg's first post with content. There are a few things in it that remind me of my own scum mindset from mario. First, he says he skimmed through the thread. As town I would never skim through the thread before making my first real post with reads and stuff. The only time I have done that was as scum in mario. I made a similar opening post to the one T made. In that game a lot of the early game focus was on snb acting weird. I came in with a reasonable and well thought out post where I defended snb fairly hard but I didn't commit too hard on any of the specifics of the game's story. T has done the same thing... his opening paragraph from my perspective (knowing my alignment) looks to me like someone using their scum knowledge that thrawn is town in order to take what should appear to be a reasonable stance. He doesn't comment much on other stuff from the thread, except to agree with clarity concerning jay. The "I may be wrong" line is the obvious thing to point out here. Why even say it, blah blah etc. T mentions djo last and asks for meta information. I can understand asking people for general meta information about other players (btw I still have not received an answer to my question about grush's alleged intellect) but asking if djodref is usually fluffy? That is something that he can figure out without the help of people who have experience with djodref. | ||
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On December 11 2012 16:49 Tunkeg wrote: It is a: lol, don't come at me with this BS, which contradict what you have said about my play earlier. That is an interesting response. Emotionally it looks like you are upset with what wbg decided to attack you with and you feel like there is some sort of injustice going on. That's what scum would feel. Once again going back to my mario game, if someone accused me of being scum for a reason I knew was true I just felt kinda sad and demotivated. When they accused me of being scum for a reason I thought was BS I had a similar response to your "lol, dont come at me with that bs." When I'm town and I get accused of being scum for reasons I feel are dumb I'm usually immediately suspicious of my accuser. This reminds of the stuff from earlier with debears/adam but I think this example is more likely to have come from a scum mindset. | ||
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On December 11 2012 17:26 wherebugsgo wrote: also I love how Tunkeg treats me like town when he responds to me, as if he already knows my alignment. hehehehehehehehe that's what I was getting at here, it just took a lot more words. I think it's more likely to be a scumslip than what happened between adam and debears | ||
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On December 11 2012 17:26 Tunkeg wrote: If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck... You should probably vote then. It looks like you are trying to convince yourself I am scum. You are looking at what I am saying with the notion: "He is scum", and you make everything I say fit into that notion. Also, if you think this is me being upset, you might get surprised when I do  well i did vote, just not in this thread holy-deja vu batman I am getting the same feeling from this post as the one I got from T's most recent interactions with wbg. can you give your reads on me + wbg? | ||
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I was not trying to convince anyone that I was actually a miller... but people started making it into a much bigger issue than I had planned so I just went along with it for a bit to see what would happen. I have seen people posting in this thread who say i'm town but also appear confused as to what I was trying to do... (mostly nothing other than get the game going) I still dont think it was some awful, terrible play everyone is calling it but I'd rather take that up in the end game. I know this post isn't really related to the game but I'm getting a little annoyed seeing people talk about how I had a dumb townie plan when it wasn't really a 'plan' to begin with. | ||
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My other point is that I did not really have a goal when it started. The joke:plan ratio of what happened leaned way further towards joke than what it eventually turned into. All I feel comfortable admitting was dumb was my assumption that we all assume everyone else reads OPs. | ||
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I don't like the jay lynch. It was ok earlier on but now it just looks like an obvious mislynch. somehow 3 people are voting for him? I dont understand those votes. I don't like adam as the lynch either. Here is the series of events I see.... He asks a question about my meta. Other people have brought up that this doesn't have to be bad but it's at least pointless as he can look at my meta himself. However I don't think that anyone has pointed out until now that his very next post was directly about my meta, and it specifically referenced a game that was not linked to by anyone in this thread. Regardless of his alignment he at least did the work so that point against him is invalid. Not only is it invalid but I'm actually getting a town read from it. Can scum do this? Sure, but my read from this specific situation is that town did it. Another point against him is his mindset when talking to debears... but tunkeg has done the same thing and it's more extreme of an example imo. Other than that, there is a weird tone to adam's posts that will make me not be surprised if he's red, but I don't expect that to be the case. I'm thinking about a tunkeg or maybe a lurker lynch. I don't like any of the other lynches too much. | ||
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On December 12 2012 02:17 Tunkeg wrote: Anyways, feel free to lynch me, at least then you know Palmar is pretty much confirmed town. This is probably of more value to the town than me sticking around. Remember to protect him from nighthits if you do this, and you will win this easypeasy. no it's not? wtf | ||
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writing some other stuff about bl | ||
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debears, why are you so irrational and emotional this game? | ||
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On December 12 2012 06:23 Vivax wrote: Either Bluelightz, Jay or Tunk. The initial case against Adam was pretty bad, but his latest activity isn't exactly townie, since he's not been doing anything useful nor defending himself much. He's the last option for me. to this: On December 12 2012 06:40 Vivax wrote: I like what grush had to say in this one. Inbefore OMG HE'S BANDWAGONING. ##Unvote ##Vote Adam when all what grush had to say about adam was this: On December 12 2012 06:25 grush57 wrote: I want to vote Adam because he is reminding me of his scum play. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler [this post] + On December 10 2012 12:45 Adam4167 wrote: He announced in thread to be voting for Thrawn, but the vote never made it into the voting thread, then he builds a case on me around not voting on someone that I had said I wasn't sure of the alignment of. Ill be watching him closely today. | ||
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On December 12 2012 08:30 marvellosity wrote: EBWOP: my views on Adam, that is. I disappeared before Tunkeg started posting again. any thoughts on the conversation between tunkeg and wbg? | ||
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On December 12 2012 08:33 marvellosity wrote: which part, where? if you're asking me a dumb question i'm gonna be pissed off. starts around here | ||
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On December 12 2012 08:40 Z-BosoN wrote: I won't be around for the deadline, gonna be pulling some massive weights, but I insist we go for tunkeg. I really don't like how little resistance there is to adam's lynch, look how easily it took off. Compare this to tunkeg, for example. Adam is a lurky player by nature, so that makes me even more not confident. + Show Spoiler + Also, there's no way I'm sheeping debears 2nd choice after tunkeg? I also think there's been more resistance to the adam lynch than you are suggesting. Maybe not direct opposition but opposition in the form of people pushing alternate lynches. What do you think of the other lynches? | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:05 Palmar wrote: That's the assumption. Also can we like get a vote or two extra on Adam just to prevent any last minute shenanigans? I'll do it at the last minute | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:07 Adam4167 wrote: Djodref Djodref's biggest scum tell from Mario Mafia was that he did absolutely no scum hunting and sat around setup speculating even at LYLO. He's pushed some cases this game, which I consider points in his favour, but he's also back flipped his read on me as soon as Palmar mentioned both of us in his video. He's spent a majority of day 1 defending himself from bad cases, and I think he's capable of being a good contributing townie, leaning town on Djodref. I disagree, go read looney lynching. mario was an abnormal situation | ||
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probably that you're dumb or something | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote: he's not pushing to keep himself alive at all honestly none of the lynch candidates are doing a great job of that.. | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:45 Munk-E wrote: Woah. Remember that we need 9 votes to lynch someone. With only a half hour left, it's probably too late to start a counter wagon. Even if jay seems more likely than adam, Adam is still worth your vote more. With 9 votes exactly on him, I'm worried that a last second band wagon gives any scum buddies he might have trying to bus him a legitimate reason to turn today into a no lynch. ##VOTE Adam4167 scummiest thing that's been said lately | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:49 debears wrote: He can prove he's vig dumbass I really don't see how... he can just be roleblocked | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:51 debears wrote: w/e i revoted adam w/e in regards to what? | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:54 marvellosity wrote: adam is scum but your whole argument is retarded no-one crumbs vigi, vigis fucking shoot people and say they did. then they get lynched for not having a crumb in their first game | ||
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On December 12 2012 09:58 marvellosity wrote: find me anyone who ever crumbed vigi in the whole world ever the only time i've crumbed vigi was when i wasn't actually the vig | ||
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On December 12 2012 10:47 Djodref wrote: I'm bad... but are you scum? so now it seems natural that among thrawn, boson, and djodref, each of them should be expecting to find at least 1 scum between the other two..... unless any of them think that all the scum were bussing adam, which thrawn doesn't | ||
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my dumb joke drew direct attention to the guy who flipped scum D1 and I feel smug about it and none of you can stop me from it. looking back now it's so obvious that he knew I was town but was really confused about what I was doing. people who didnt take my early stupidity too seriously get townie points from me | ||
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On December 12 2012 11:40 Djodref wrote: Z-Bo has spent the majority of his time tunneling me. I know I'm town so I would find it scummy if he keeps focusing only on me. I have no problem discussing with him to prove him that he is wrong though ^^ "I know I'm town so I would find it scummy" as in "if I was town I would find it scummy? | ||
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On December 12 2012 11:47 Djodref wrote: I would find it scummy if he keeps focusing only on me. Because I know I'm town. I don't think there is any ambiguity. Otherwise, L2 French Grammar "I would find it scummy" coming from a town player only makes sense when talking about a hypothetical scenario. But this isn't a hypothetical scenario. The only way it can be a hypothetical scenario is if you are hypothetically town, which of course means that you'd actually be scum. Telling me what actions boson needs to take in a hypothetical scenario in order for you to get a town read on him doesn't make any sense. | ||
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it's like the difference between the questions: because x, what are y? if x, what would be y? x = djodref is town and y = his reads | ||
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On December 12 2012 12:40 Djodref wrote: The hypothetical scenario is the scenario where Z-Bo is chasing only me for the next days. In this hypothetical scenario, I would need to revise my current town read on him. but see, why even divulge that information to the thread? "boson if you do x in the future I will change my read on you in this manner" | ||
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however it still doesn't make sense to give someone advice on how to manipulate their read on you | ||
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On December 12 2012 13:01 Hapahauli wrote: Regarding Djo I'm not sure if anyone's brought it up, but I watched Palmar's video and was really surprised he skipped over one of his posts in his analysis: The underlined bit is a very strange thing for a townie to say. Townies are a naturally suspicious folk, and a line of reasoning that assumes someone is not scum really goes against this mentality. Of course I'm not going to judge him on one post, but if there's anyone I could call a scum-read right now, it would be Djo. Did you read the context of the post? Wbg made a post defending jay then said he didn't find anyone else that scummy. Djo's response is a direct response to those sentiments. | ||
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On December 12 2012 13:22 Hapahauli wrote:This is my sanity break o.O | ||
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I'm also concerned about wbg, hapa, and maybe, maybe vivax, i'm the least sure about him. however other people seem to have enough interest in wbg to get that discussion going, and hapa is new so i'm going to focus on djo for the time being | ||
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On December 12 2012 14:39 Djodref wrote: EBWOP: I was serious regarding a grush lynch. This guy is just a liability. I actually have a read on him now, and it's town. What do you think about his actual filter, not his meta? I'm surprised that you would be talking about a grush policy lynch after a successful D1 lynch. A policy lynch is the last thing I have on my mind going into D2 after flipping a scum on D1. btw, I've concluded that grush is probably a smart troll. He's either smart for being right about adam or he's smart for doing the thing that makes me think he's town. | ||
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On December 12 2012 15:21 Djodref wrote: Regarding grush, I'm null on him because he doesn't explain his though process at all. And he is a liability, regardless of his alignment. If he's town he's not a liability based on what happened today. | ||
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On December 10 2012 09:53 Djodref wrote: Not true, if it was a probe post and you did it as town, then you can give a real answer like "I totally read that miller are not self-aware, but I wanted to use this fakeclaim as a probe to see how people would react to it" My problem is that I'm faced with the following choice right now
So, I'll go with the first choice for the moment and ask you how you were expecting people to react to this fakeclaim. All in all, what was your motivation for this post ? I don't like this post. Djo says that he has two options.... 1) that thrawn used the fakeclaim as a probe to see how people reacted to it 2) thrawn is lying scum What I have issue with is he says he's going to go for the first option, but gives no reason for doing so. Then he asks thrawn why thrawn fakeclaimed. I don't see any purpose in djodref asking thrawn that question if djodref is assuming thrawn is town. He even gave thrawn the answer thrawn would need to assuage djo's doubts. He did the same type of thing with with boson later on in the thread. My point is that djo dances around the possibility thrawn is scum but assumes he's town and is strangely interested in why he "fakeclaimed." Adam did almost the exact same thing... he questioned thrawn about his motives (adam trying to appear useful) but wasn't interested in the "is thrawn town or scum" aspect of the issue. Djo then pressure voted thrawn even though he though thrawn was town... this looks like fake scumhunting. | ||
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hapa so much nicer than everyone else lol | ||
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On December 12 2012 17:38 Hapahauli wrote: So what exactly is wrong with my meta read? I skimmed some of your games, and came to a conclusion based on them. I'm really unsure what your "angle of attack" is here. It's that your opinion on tunkeg seems too well informed considering that you just replaced in | ||
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On December 12 2012 17:45 Hapahauli wrote: But thrawn and/or Tunkeg - some feedback on my read-dump would be appreciated. I pretty much agree exactly with your town list except for one or two others I might ass to it. I disagree with the scum read on bl. You say his play looks like a buss.. I think it looks like he was sheeping palmar. On December 11 2012 21:27 Bluelightz wrote: Palmar, when in the video did you comment on adam (the time pls). I only skimmed through it at school. He mentions palmer again when he votes. I also think the timing of his vote looks too early to be a buss. At the time he did it I was still pretty uncertain about who was actually going to be lynched and that's not a good time to buss if you don't need to. | ||
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On December 12 2012 17:51 Hapahauli wrote: Also he pretty clearly doesn't assume your town, since he pressure-votes you later down the line. No, he thought I was town the whole time. His first read on me was: "My first reaction to thrawn post was "yeah, obvious scum" then I thought that he might not have been serious at all. A one liner for a miller claim doesn't look real, regardless of his alignment. The way he answered "nvm, then" shows that he is carefree about it." The other issue is him asking why I did it and pressure voting me to find out. He later says the town motivation he thought I had was that that I was hoping to attract pressure from scum. This was based on a post I made from looney. So if he thinks I'm trying to attract scum attention, why would he vote pressure me so that I'll announce it to the thread? | ||
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On December 12 2012 17:52 Hapahauli wrote: Well sheeping Palmar is at the very least non-alignment indicative. Scum bl would be sheeping a vote for his scumbuddy? I missed the implication behind "at the very least non-alignment indicative." What is the other end of the spectrum? | ||
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On December 12 2012 18:18 wherebugsgo wrote: The fact that I ultimately chose not to vote him is actually not scummy, because trust me, I'm pretty fucking lazy as scum. I'm notoriously "hard to read" because my play doesn't boil down to "lazy as scum and active as town" unlike the vast majority of other players. so you are lazy as town or is one of those statements wrong? | ||
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On December 12 2012 21:34 Djodref wrote: [/list][*]If town, you would have better off stopping this ASAP imo, because people would have voted you for lying and being anti-town for not explaining yourself. Also, if you were baiting mafia, it was going to be far to obvious, so it didn't matter so much for you to "come clean". [*]If scum, it would have been better to force you into posting more shit So either alignment, it was dumb and not really worth talking about. It's either stupid because I'm mafia and it would attract too much attention or it's stupid because I'm town and the mafia will automatically be paranoid of stuff like that. So I don't see why you spent so much attention on it. You even said you were thinking about this quote from the looney game: On October 20 2012 09:13 thrawn2112 wrote: Cuz I'm not scum u silly. Don't worry I love being mislynched. It's the part of the game where in the past ive figured out who is scum. So if you thought that was the town motivation I don't see why you'd mention it to the thread | ||
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On December 13 2012 06:48 wherebugsgo wrote: He was fairly inactive and didn't say anything of substance. You're the polar opposite of that. That'd be hapa of either alignment | ||
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On December 13 2012 08:07 Palmar wrote: Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum.
Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. ok with everything so far except the bolded part. how did you reach this conslusion? On December 13 2012 08:07 Palmar wrote: Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. a bit hypocritical, don't you think? On December 13 2012 08:07 Palmar wrote: Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. Bugs is scum. I'd like to see bugs give an answer to this part. | ||
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On December 13 2012 10:37 Palmar wrote: Seeing as I was wrong on Bugs I might just let someone else take the reins for now. I'm gonna check out this bluelightz case. I recall writing something about him earlier, that he was getting away with something. I'm more interested in what you have to say about VE | ||
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On December 13 2012 10:49 Palmar wrote: It's worth noting that of the people that eventually did not join the Adam wagon, thrawn looks kinda towny and I'm not sure about Z-boson, however djodref looks bad. On December 12 2012 10:51 thrawn2112 wrote: so now it seems natural that among thrawn, boson, and djodref, each of them should be expecting to find at least 1 scum between the other two..... unless any of them think that all the scum were bussing adam, which thrawn doesn't | ||
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On December 13 2012 10:51 Hapahauli wrote: I have Z-Bo as leaning-scum through process of elimination atm. Djo... I still think his D1 lynch actions are townie. There was that series of "COUNTERWAGON GO" posts that seem suicidal from a scum perspective. One could certainly interpret it as him not giving a shit about who gets lynched other than adam, but I just can't connect a mentality of Djo knowing Adam was scum, knowing that Adam was the clear leader to get hanged, and then going off and pulling the stunts that he did. btw hapa, I just remembered was I was getting at when I brought up djo's hardcore bussing in looney. the point is that he's not afraid to make ballsy plays when people are ignoring him. you were saying something like djo's play looks ballsy to be scum, and that's how the looney game is relevant to this one | ||
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On December 13 2012 12:21 Z-BosoN wrote: Reading his filter, he seemed 100% confident that bugs was scum, asking to put vig shots on him, etc. Do you make this to be a scum excuse to not post any real content (which he hasn't done so far) or a town who really actually thinks bugs was scum? Idk, I don't expect smart town to try and direct night actions like that | ||
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On December 13 2012 14:00 jaybrundage wrote: If clarity didn't suck at scum hunting, maybe I wouldn't consider voting him. As it is, he tried to lynch me, and wasn't going for the adam lynch at all. He has yet to help us lynch a scum yet. If he succeeded at derailing the adam lynch to me we would have two dead townies How is that a town win condition oriented thinking process? Lynch the people who suck at scumhunting? | ||
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On December 13 2012 14:44 Djodref wrote: @ thrawn I have mentioned it to the thread because I thought that it was a pretty big towntell and that it would maybe have convinced other townies that you were more likely to be town than mafia pulling off a "big play". Also it was to show that I had definitively assessed my town read on you. I didn't care to out your plan because I thought that it was bad (too obvious) and that you wouldn't catch mafia players with it. Eh.... I feel okay about this response. Atm I'm wanting to believe it. CLarity shouldn't be lynched tomorrow... idk wtf people are thinking. Currently going through boson's stuff, sneak peak is I think he's scum | ||
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I'm surprised about how long people have kept talking about clarity being scum. I just don't see it. His reactions to certain things in the game have been the same as mine + Show Spoiler [example] + On December 13 2012 09:03 Clarity_nl wrote: Debears you are a logical mess and I hate that you were right about Adam. | ||
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I'm gonna do a re-read through of d1 then post thoughts on boson/djo/tunk unless I find something that convinces me not to. I don't have interest in any of the lynches outside of those people. | ||
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On December 14 2012 09:55 Djodref wrote: @ thrawn Like, not even BL ? This guy doesn't even have a scumread at the moment... idk I haven't done the meta research needed to figure out what to think of his lurking. but I still don't think he bussed adam. if i had to guess whats going on with him.... I think that for whatever reason he's not putting effort into the game and is just sheeping palmer | ||
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On December 14 2012 11:19 jaybrundage wrote: Annnnyway, Now that I expressed my random thoughts on Clarity and Palmar. Anyone still down for a Djodref lynch? ##Unvote ##Vote Djodref definitely but i'm undecided between him and boson | ||
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Boson's D1 play can be described as two things... distanced from the game, and working towards scum objectives. His first post lightly hits on thrawn's "plan," and how he's suspicious of thrawn for not having scumreads. He says this even though thrawn has a vote for wbg. It's not too big of a crime to be inaccurate but it's his first statement of the thread and he's not even correct about what's going on. The next half of that post is criticisim's of bugs' 80% number. Arbitrary percentages attached to reads are some of the most useless things to argue over... it's hard for me to imagine a town player who looks at the "palmer is 80% scum" statement and thinks.. "that number isn't mathematically perfect. lets lynch this guy!" He also questions bugs for assuming that we have 4 scum.... this is another really pointless thing to have an issue with. It's not limited to 1 post, they have an extended conversation about it and boson eventually ends up dropping the issue. He doesn't continue on with his suspicion of thrawn either. Somewhere during all of this he drops some suspicion on vivax but nothing worth bringing up. He lightly jumps into the debears/adam debate but only to comment that debears is probably taking things out of proportion. After all of the above, we get this post: On December 11 2012 04:41 Z-BosoN wrote: I was trying to figure out where you were coming from with all of that, because I honestly can't follow that thought process. Anyways, I don't have any solid scum reads. As I've stated earlier, I find vivax a bit suspicious, but beyond that nothing really. What about you? So far... boson has done basically nothing. He's done as much nothing as the people who were lurking, because all of his "scumhunting" was him finding a problem with ridiculous things. He has stuff to say to people, and argues with them, but I don't get the feeling that he is suspicious of anything at all. On December 11 2012 04:50 Z-BosoN wrote: It's Z-Boson. It's funny you should mention Munk-E, because he has a town read on WBG, even though he disagrees with WBG's logic. Does anyone find this post right here: Any close to being normal? The above post is another example of boson having issues with dumb stuff. Boson criticizes Munk-E for having a town read on wbg, even though Munk-E disagrees with wbg's logic. I don't think that has anything to do with who is scum and who isn't. There's a part of the thread where suspicion of Adam starts rising beyond "maybe this guy is scum" to "maybe we should lynch this guy." Boson's interactions during this time tunneling djo while defending Adam from as far away as possible. Example: On December 11 2012 06:07 Z-BosoN wrote: Dude, wait to take the arrogant stance once you yourself have properly read what people have said. You said Adam implied thrawn was scum. Presumably when he said thrawn was "different" from his town meta. I said this isn't the case, because saying someone is playing different from their town meta doesn't necessarily mean they think they are scum. I used your meta as an example to this. Then you said he said thrawn wasn't scum. This is not true, he never said thrawn wasn't scum. Are you deliberately twisting words here? This isn't the first time boson has attacked debears for going after adam. He did it in the very beginning of the game too. He attacks debears in a way that makes debears look bad but he doesnt call debears scum or probe anything else about debears' play. Then there's a huge chunk of boson's filter where he tunnels djo, for pretty much the remainder of D1. He goes into extreme tunnel mode. That doesnt have to be bad in of itself but the way he came out of the tunnel was strange. Boson is questioning djo about an interaction between djo/thrawn, and when djo explains how boson is misunderstanding the issue, boson's next post is: On December 12 2012 01:43 Z-BosoN wrote: They are because they can't be legit in their scumhunting. This is fairly obvious. Hm, I didn't see you were answering thrawn. Well, I'm pummeling you for being inconsistent and not keeping your story straight. I view this as a small tell, which was augmented by the rest of your posting (not scumhunting). Until your case on Tunkeg you had zero scum hunting and some fluff, which is why I really thought you to be scum. I certainly see you as scum being capable of writing such a case, but I'll have to reassess and see what other people make of your posts and our exchange. You're not getting lynched today and we need to consolidate... so ##Unvote Boson doesn't have a real scumread for the whole game, and then drops his main scumread after it's shown that 1 very small part out of all his arguments is factually incorrect. I don't see this as the natural response of a suspicious townie, and is yet another time when boson is making incorrect accusations. He shows disinterest in the game and a lack of suspicion. Then comes the part of D1 where arguments about adam are heating up. Boson is asked for his opinion on adam because he hasn't given it voluntarily. Here's boson's summary of adam: On December 12 2012 02:09 Z-BosoN wrote: Well, like I said, debears seems to be doing some massive twisting of words to me. What I found suspicious on Adam's filter is this contradiction in his idea of a case -> vote relationship, which I'd like him to explain. He first criticizes debears for not voting him after making a case and votes him: This is funny to say the least, because later on, though, when he's made a case on vivax, here's his stance when questioned on why he wasn't voting vivax: I mean, it's ok that he makes a huge case and doesn't vote, but when debears did that it made him scum? Weird. Since we need to consolidate though, I am more confident in a Tunkeg lynch at the moment. His read feels so... unemotional and distanced. The whole post feels off. He gives an example of something scummy about adam... but it's not anything major and the line: "I mean, it's ok that he makes a huge case and doesn't vote, but when debears did that it made him scum? Weird." makes me think he's lying off his ass. Here's another instance of boson's reality being different than the thread's reality: On December 12 2012 08:40 Z-BosoN wrote: I won't be around for the deadline, gonna be pulling some massive weights, but I insist we go for tunkeg. I really don't like how little resistance there is to adam's lynch, look how easily it took off. Compare this to tunkeg, for example. Adam is a lurky player by nature, so that makes me even more not confident. + Show Spoiler + Also, there's no way I'm sheeping debears bleh.... I know he cites irl issues and those are supposed to give null reads but the fact remains that he wasn't around for the time that the lynch was decided... he disappears before the deadline and leaves another very soft defense of adam. A very, very soft defense. And he was completely incorrect... I felt tons of resistance to the Adam lynch. That statement about adam's lynch being too easy... I sorta wanted to lynch him for it right when I read it. tldr: -he's wrong a lot about what's happening in the thread -he soft defends adam and attacks debears for going after adam -tunnels on djo while there is tons of other stuff going on -generally more passive than what I remember of his town play -he's a lurker -one of the 3 who didn't vote for adam -he's not around for the lynch -is willing to argue about people over insignificant stuff and doesn't appear to actually be suspicious about any of it -etc there is more but for now I have to go watch the Hobbit | ||
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On December 14 2012 14:15 Djodref wrote: @ thrawn I like your case but I still feel better about a Tunkeg lynch because Z-Bo has at least shown some effort in scumhunting. Also I don't see it as necessarily scummy that he thought that debears was exaggerating. Do you think that Tunkeg and Z-Bo could be in a scumteam together ? How do you feel about a Tunkeg lynch ? I'm waiting for Z-Bo defense with great interest ! Why would I think boson and mr t are scum together? ... I don't see what that has to do with anything. CPUs you expand on ur boson read? | ||
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Lol I saw this too and I laughed | ||
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On December 14 2012 17:38 Vivax wrote: LOL I've been laughing for like 10 minutes irl after seein that, VE. I think jays reaction was quite telling, he's prolly in scumteam with Z-Boson and thought he witnessed a hardcore scumslip that would get him lynched. Overreacting, he instasheeped you. So, let's kill one of them, and if he's scum, let's kill the other one, aight? I'll look better into Z-Boson later before voting for him tho. I'll be back home at like 6 PM/18:00 CET, in about 9 h vivax, WTF? since when have you wanted to lynch boson? | ||
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"I'll look better into Z-Boson later before voting for him tho." - coming from a guy who hasn't been wanting to lynch boson till literally that very post so you're either scum or you're town who is randomly ditching your scumreads and planning on voting for a guy you haven't finished "looking into" yet... | ||
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example: On December 11 2012 04:17 Z-BosoN wrote: @debears I see you've got some Adam going on for ya. I think you are getting too riled up over expecting someone to go balls out on a day one suspicion. You, for example, are not nearly as spammy as your day one self. I don't think this aligns with your townie play, but I don't think it necessarily makes you scummy. I am curious to hear from adam his stance on thrawn, as he seemed to have dropped it.. note that the only thing this posts accomplishes is soft defending adam. he doesn't call adam townie or scummy, nor does he call debears townie or scummy Here's the most in depth thing boson had to say about adam: On December 12 2012 02:09 Z-BosoN wrote: Well, like I said, debears seems to be doing some massive twisting of words to me. What I found suspicious on Adam's filter is this contradiction in his idea of a case -> vote relationship, which I'd like him to explain. He first criticizes debears for not voting him after making a case and votes him: This is funny to say the least, because later on, though, when he's made a case on vivax, here's his stance when questioned on why he wasn't voting vivax: I mean, it's ok that he makes a huge case and doesn't vote, but when debears did that it made him scum? Weird. Since we need to consolidate though, I am more confident in a Tunkeg lynch at the moment. Imo this is one of boson's scummiest posts. He does bring up issues with adam's play but ends up dismissing it as "weird." That one word "weird" is what does it for me. and as an added bonus, boson does not appear in adam's final list of reads | ||
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On December 14 2012 21:53 Vivax wrote: Also, I skipped a lesson this afternoon if you wonder why I'm back already. i wasn't, but now i'm wondering why you're wondering if i'm wondering why you're back already | ||
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On December 14 2012 22:01 Vivax wrote: Anyway, I found that question I thought was scummy, but it was from debears lol. fos debears | ||
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On December 14 2012 22:05 marvellosity wrote: This Z-Bo wagon is pretty silly. He answered himself pretty satisfactorily, and it rises my opinion of Djodref a bit... although he may just be scum with prior knowledge of alignments. I made a pretty big meta case on Z-Bo in Mario Mafia about being passive and less involved than I remember him as town, and it was just completely wrong. sorry i do not comprehend what you're trying to say with this: "He answered himself pretty satisfactorily, and it rises my opinion of Djodref a bit... although he may just be scum with prior knowledge of alignments." | ||
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On December 14 2012 23:45 Bluelightz wrote: Addressing grush57 on his posts about me 1. "Bluelightz is scum because Vivax isn't." Is this a lie or is there some definitive proof? 2. Why is my play extremely bad/scummy? And I'm quite sure roles are RNG'ed... vote bl | ||
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On December 14 2012 23:45 Bluelightz wrote: Addressing grush57 on his posts about me 1. "Bluelightz is scum because Vivax isn't." Is this a lie or is there some definitive proof? 2. Why is my play extremely bad/scummy? And I'm quite sure roles are RNG'ed... the reason this post is extremely scummy is because who was dying to hear bl defend himself over a small point made by grush of all people.? imo out of all the things bl could have talked about at that point in time, especially considering how low content his filter is, this is one the the scummiest things to post about On December 14 2012 23:50 Bluelightz wrote: Your clearly informative accusation / suggestion of my lynch is informative and will be responded to soon.. + Show Spoiler + nope another empty threat | ||
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On December 15 2012 07:46 Palmar wrote: It's so nice seeing everyone holding hands to lynch tunkeg. probability of him flipping scum: relatively small. whatever, I still can't push the djodref thing tonight. i could lynch djo but i wanna talk about bl more first | ||
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On December 15 2012 09:09 Bluelightz wrote: Ah fuck this conversation. So, ##Vote Tunkeg. Tunk doesn't really need consolidation or any of that but I don't care. Can't give my own reasons on this one (complete sheep). we must lynch bl | ||
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no, don't think so. can you give a tldr version of why you think he's scum? hopefully including anything you thought of after the recent flip | ||
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"Did you seriously not read that millers are not self aware ?" What on earth is the possible town purpose behind this question? I didn't understand it at the time and I still don't. His next statemen about me (same post) was this: "My first reaction to thrawn post was "yeah, obvious scum" then I thought that he might not have been serious at all. A one liner for a miller claim doesn't look real, regardless of his alignment. The way he answered "nvm, then" shows that he is carefree about it." That looks like a town read... doesn't say town exactly but it directly goes back on the original premise that djo gave for me being scum. Lets look into all possible worlds where djo is town, thinks thrawn is town, and asks if thrawn read the op before making the claim: | ||
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"hmm.... thrawn claimed miller. is he town? did he not read the op? i'll ask him if he read the op." The first question can't accomplish anything, the second question is.... idk, I don't see the point. | ||
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I remember you listing something like 1 town who did some crazy thing 2 lying scum a scum who fail fakeclaims miller without having read the op doesn't explain it away by admitting they didn't read the op. so the question doesnt make sense | ||
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On December 16 2012 22:00 Vivax wrote: Thrawn who else are you suspicious of besides djo? boson bl and hapa not interested in a jay or vivax lynch, my feelings towards them are sorta similar to how I felt thinking about the tunkeg lynch | ||
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VE is.... hard to talk about. He, bl, and grush are the people we have the least information about. When I go through his filter I never find anything that convinces me he's scum. when he brought up the possibility of adam's vig claim hinting that clarity could be a scum vig I actually got a town read from it because I had the exact same thought when I was going back through adams' posts. I didn't mention it because thinking about things from town clarity's point of view made more sense, but VE got some town points from me for that. | ||
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Just from looking at munke's filter I'm surprised that hapa hasn't received that much attention. Everything munke said was scummy. Here's his first entrance into the thread: On December 11 2012 00:41 Munk-E wrote: Good morning and hello, everyone! I will be doing a more in depth reading of the thread, but for now, WBG, how on earth did you figure palmer was more likely to be scum than anyone? You said there were 5 people that hadn't participated yet, yet palmer, being one of them had a 2/3rds chance of being scum. Did you sleep through math class, or do you actually have some explaination to back that up? The tone of the post seems fake. At first he acts really friendly and talks about how he's going to do a more in depth reading of the thread... which is implying that he has at least read the thread. And he decides to attack wbg over the stupid wbg 80% remark? He even insults wbg ("did you sleep through math class") so he is pretty committed to this line of questioning. The 80% stuff is a scum topic and he's all the more scummier for it because it was the only thing he talked about. I point some of this out to him and then he posts: On December 11 2012 01:02 Munk-E wrote: I just find it strange how he went from maybe or maybe not policy voting you,(he didn't make it clear either way, which seems like a way to cover his ass in case he made a mistake) to very heavily and arbitrarily tunneling palmer, with no evidence when he had 5 people with the exact same case against them. It doesn't make any sense to me. I mean, he goes from out of nowhere accusing palmer saying he's 80% sure he's mafia, based on absolutely nothing, to when people ask him about it saying "woah, I didn't say i was certain he was scum" Then he lowers the percentage of palmer being scum, probably so if he flips town, he doesn't seem as guilty. It just seems weird to me. He talks about other stuff that makes wbg scummy... why didn't he mention this in his first post about wbg? And the new argument for the accusation he made about the 80% stuff was awful. After all of that his read onw wbg totaled up to "It just seems weird to me." Later on Munke posts: On December 11 2012 01:44 Munk-E wrote:as for WBG, the more i think about it, the more I think he's more likely to be town. If he was scum, this play would either be to bus palmer if he's scum, which would be stupid and unnecessary, or to try to start a bandwagon on him if he's town, which would most likely be futile. He could be trying to appear to be an aggressive scumhunter, attacking harmless enemies though, so he seems town, but then again, aggressive scumhunting seems town. I see his logic now, but it is flawed. I highly doubt that all the scum were lurkers. So now he goes back on his non committal wbg read using a wifom argument and now we're at 0 reads for wbg. He also throws in the completely irrelevant line about not all scum being lurkers.... how does this help us? Then there's his final post, his vote for adam: On December 12 2012 09:45 Munk-E wrote: Woah. Remember that we need 9 votes to lynch someone. With only a half hour left, it's probably too late to start a counter wagon. Even if jay seems more likely than adam, Adam is still worth your vote more. With 9 votes exactly on him, I'm worried that a last second band wagon gives any scum buddies he might have trying to bus him a legitimate reason to turn today into a no lynch. ##VOTE Adam4167 "Woah?" Lol. Is he sitting at his computer reeling in shock thinking about possible last minute scum shenanigans? He hasn't said anything at all about any other player than wbg but he says this important part: On December 12 2012 09:45 Munk-E wrote:With 9 votes exactly on him, I'm worried that a last second band wagon gives any scum buddies he might have trying to bus him a legitimate reason to turn today into a no lynch. ##VOTE Adam4167 I do not believe that a guy who's only contributions to the thread are making a half accusation against wbg which he later takes back and a comment about scum not being lurkers would be so sure and concerned about adam's lynch. He even talks about potential scumbuddies.... which reveals his underlying knowledge of adam's alignment. coming soon - part 2: hapa | ||
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On December 18 2012 08:08 Hapahauli wrote: Well it is rather risky given he's one counter-claim away from an insta-lynch. I wouldn't dismiss his claim as an outright lie until I see some more from him. scum already tried to claim vigi | ||
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djo just looks really townie lately... what he's done lately is what he would be doing if he's town | ||
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also i still want an answeer to my question about why you might want to lynch jay. are you accusing me of being scum right now by saying i'm too lazy? | ||
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On December 18 2012 08:42 Vivax wrote: You can still try WHAT? To convince 4 players who aren't reading your posts? yeah because some jackass is telling me to stfu | ||
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On December 18 2012 09:41 jaybrundage wrote: If you assume im town then it makes perfect sense. BUT YOU have to go with the premise that im town. Does anything im doing make sense form a scum perspective. ofcnot Now get of VE lynch thrawn i think your town but we need you to step up right now and get off of VE lynch o.0 | ||
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On December 18 2012 09:44 jaybrundage wrote: wtf guys why is no one moving we have like 14 mins left what do you think about a move to hapa? | ||
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Part 1 - Munk-e + Show Spoiler + On December 17 2012 17:07 thrawn2112 wrote: I agree with marv about hapa but I want to point out some things about munk-e Just from looking at munke's filter I'm surprised that hapa hasn't received that much attention. Everything munke said was scummy. Here's his first entrance into the thread: The tone of the post seems fake. At first he acts really friendly and talks about how he's going to do a more in depth reading of the thread... which is implying that he has at least read the thread. And he decides to attack wbg over the stupid wbg 80% remark? He even insults wbg ("did you sleep through math class") so he is pretty committed to this line of questioning. The 80% stuff is a scum topic and he's all the more scummier for it because it was the only thing he talked about. I point some of this out to him and then he posts: He talks about other stuff that makes wbg scummy... why didn't he mention this in his first post about wbg? And the new argument for the accusation he made about the 80% stuff was awful. After all of that his read onw wbg totaled up to "It just seems weird to me." Later on Munke posts: So now he goes back on his non committal wbg read using a wifom argument and now we're at 0 reads for wbg. He also throws in the completely irrelevant line about not all scum being lurkers.... how does this help us? Then there's his final post, his vote for adam: "Woah?" Lol. Is he sitting at his computer reeling in shock thinking about possible last minute scum shenanigans? He hasn't said anything at all about any other player than wbg but he says this important part: I do not believe that a guy who's only contributions to the thread are making a half accusation against wbg which he later takes back and a comment about scum not being lurkers would be so sure and concerned about adam's lynch. He even talks about potential scumbuddies.... which reveals his underlying knowledge of adam's alignment. coming soon - part 2: hapa Part 2 - Hapa's opening posts + Show Spoiler + I don't like hapa's first real entrance to the thread: On December 12 2012 13:01 Hapahauli wrote: Regarding Djo I'm not sure if anyone's brought it up, but I watched Palmar's video and was really surprised he skipped over one of his posts in his analysis: The underlined bit is a very strange thing for a townie to say. Townies are a naturally suspicious folk, and a line of reasoning that assumes someone is not scum really goes against this mentality. Of course I'm not going to judge him on one post, but if there's anyone I could call a scum-read right now, it would be Djo. I didn't have a problem with djo's line "If I take your word for jay and assume that you are not scum yourself." Djo was involved with a discussion with wbg and wbg was probing djo for alternate scumreads. I don't expect hapa to miss something like this which he later claimed here: On December 12 2012 13:09 Hapahauli wrote: Ah see this is why I should catch up before I pull the trigger. Hapa ended the first post about djo with "Of course I'm not going to judge him on one post, but if there's anyone I could call a scum-read right now, it would be Djo." That's an incredibly weak read to make and hapa didn't even go so far as examining the context of djo's post. I don't think a town hapa who had watched palmar's video would enter the thread like this. There's also an interesting exchange between hapa/boson starting with a z-boson post where hapa seems to be able to give a response to boson's case too quickly... this is what scum do because they immediately enter the thread with an agenda. In my experience town replacements are uneasy committing to any reads because they aren't familiar with the thread and haven't been in the game long enough to get a feel for all the players. Scum are often the opposite because they already know alignments. A little bit later tunkeg calls hapa out for the same kind of thing here. Part 3 - Hapa's scumhunting + Show Spoiler + Hapa doesn't make cases this game. I tried to look through his filter and tried to find cases and this might be the closest thing I could find to a normal aggressive hapa case but it's not really even close to a case. When town hapa makes cases he goes in depth on his reads and explicity says what he thinks and he has clearly aggressive objective. That's not at all how he's played this game. He is writing it off as him not putting as much into this game as he normally would but this hapa still is too passive to be town hapa regardless of if his activity explanations are legitimate. Day 3 VE's lynch + Show Spoiler + Day 3 starts with Hapa voting for VE. He does this despite not really pushing for a ve lynch or talking about him beforehand. Marv calls him out for it and hapa says "no I do have legitimate reasons to vote for ve" and links to this post: On December 15 2012 10:18 Hapahauli wrote: Not time to vote Palmar. I'll have to look between jay, VE, BL, and Z-Bo for the next scummer. I was planning to post question VE about one of his posts if Tunkeg flipped red. That sadly didn't happen, but the post seems relevant regardless: The bolded is a pretty strong statement. I'm not sure if it's just poor wording or not, but he seems to be putting some heavy suspicion on Tunkeg, then dancing around the issue in favor of Z-Bo. I can't find much other than that post that would make me think hapa would have been considering a VE lynch. And the content of the post itself is not much of commitment to a read on VE. The next section of hapa's filter for D3 is almost completely composed of hapa defending himself. There was a lot of momentum for a djo or ve lynch and this would not have been a good use of a town hapa's time, especially when his vote and stance on VE was pretty weak to begin with. Then Ve's claim comes out and here is hapa's reaction to it: On December 18 2012 07:38 Hapahauli wrote: interesting. I'll have to think about whether it's true or not. If no one counterclaims, I could get behind a Jay lynch. His tunnel on Djo felt really forced all through today. For myself, VE's claim is what made me ok with settling for VE lynch instead of a hapa lynch. Boson said ve was "lying through his teeth." He goes back and forth on what to do but pretty quickly decides not to trust the claim. I said VE's claim looked too easy to pull off. Vivax didn't believe the claim. Djo didn't believe the claim because ve hadn't committed to defending djo because of the green check. But hapa seems the least suspicious about the claim out of everyone. He said it looks too risky for a fake claim.... but scum have already tried to claim vigi this game! It didn;t look risky at all... there is no way to confirm it if we don't already have a cop (which wasn't likely due to the number of blues already) to counterclaim. At this point hapa is suggesting we lynch Jay. On December 18 2012 08:43 Hapahauli wrote: I want to lynch jay because his tunnel on Djo felt really forced. He's also afk for critical moments of the game (such as now) and he hasn't given me any reasons to think he's town. That's only if VE steps up though. But then comes this post: On December 18 2012 09:38 Hapahauli wrote: I can't figure out a player that I'd feel comfortable switching onto. Jay's reactions so far don't seem scummy. He's setting himself up to draw alot of attention to himself regardless of how VE flips. Even Z-Bo seems alright. ...and who else? Bluelightz? Seems like a coin-flip. I disagreed then and now, Jay's actions did seem scummy at the time regardless of how I felt about VE's chances of being scum. I think this is the consensus of other people as well. But somehow hapa has the exact opposite reaction that everyone else had and no longer is down for lynching Jay... then he suggests we lynch Z-bo or bluelightz instead of either VE OR JAY... both people that hapa has weakly claimed to want to lynch in various parts of D3. | ||
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1. hapa 2. jay 3 grush 3 bl 3 boson 4 djo 5 marv | ||
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yes, I have done extensive smiley analysis of this game and the results were slightly concerning yet inconclusive | ||
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On December 18 2012 22:29 marvellosity wrote: what would you have expected from a town hapa instead of what you showed, thrawny? someone who would read the context of djo's post before declaring djo his top scumread | ||
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On December 18 2012 23:04 marvellosity wrote: You and Vivax are both doing this, stop it. The reasons should be obvious. I can't do anything about being alive, and this just hurts more than it helps. If you really have to then lynch me at LYLO, but I don't think it will come to that. uh, is that your actual advice? | ||
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On December 15 2012 10:18 Hapahauli wrote: Not time to vote Palmar. I'll have to look between jay, VE, BL, and Z-Bo for the next scummer. I was planning to post question VE about one of his posts if Tunkeg flipped red. That sadly didn't happen, but the post seems relevant regardless: The bolded is a pretty strong statement. I'm not sure if it's just poor wording or not, but he seems to be putting some heavy suspicion on Tunkeg, then dancing around the issue in favor of Z-Bo. On December 16 2012 10:09 Hapahauli wrote: Way to fight the good fight guys ##Vote VisceraEyes On December 18 2012 07:38 Hapahauli wrote: interesting. I'll have to think about whether it's true or not. If no one counterclaims, I could get behind a Jay lynch. His tunnel on Djo felt really forced all through today. On December 18 2012 08:43 Hapahauli wrote: I want to lynch jay because his tunnel on Djo felt really forced. He's also afk for critical moments of the game (such as now) and he hasn't given me any reasons to think he's town. That's only if VE steps up though. On December 18 2012 09:38 Hapahauli wrote: I can't figure out a player that I'd feel comfortable switching onto. Jay's reactions so far don't seem scummy. He's setting himself up to draw alot of attention to himself regardless of how VE flips. Even Z-Bo seems alright. ...and who else? Bluelightz? Seems like a coin-flip. two times hapa has the opposite reaction of the thread (not doubting ve's claim and thinking jay looked townie at the end of d3) He started the day wanting to vote for ve. jay was also a possible candidate. ve claims, nobody believes him except hapa and hapa wants to lynch jay. then jay comes into the thread acting crazy and hapa no longer wants to lynch jay and settles on a "coinflip" between bluelightz and boson | ||
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who do you think is scum? write stuff about that instead | ||
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i was dead posting as scum? wat? | ||
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On December 19 2012 10:52 Hapahauli wrote: Also as a last bit, I would never miss an NK as scum. So what's more likely: a) Jay/BL lurker scumteam b) I thought it would be a great idea to mindfuck/wifom-bomb you all | ||
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On December 19 2012 15:01 jaybrundage wrote: Im curious. What are you going to do when i flip town. when are you going to start putting effort into the game so that we won't be completely fucked over if this hypothetical scenario happens? | ||
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On December 19 2012 15:10 jaybrundage wrote: How about we not lynch me. Are there any other good candidates. if you are town you should have your own ideas about this | ||
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certain things djo said about ve and they way djo posted lately makes me think there's no way he's scum. i cant really remember disagreeing with marv about anything in a long time. I had doubts about bl still but they were assuaged by what he's posted recently. grush is still somewhat of a question mark but tbh he's actually been pushing town objectives with almost all of his posts. i've had a town read on vivax for a long time but i don;t really spend too much time reading his posts. hapa's spent most of his time defending himself and i dont like his accusation of bl. when he starts talking about his actual reads and stuff his posts get way shorter. i'm interpreting what jay is doing right now as trolling. there is a good amount of associative evidence between the two. + Show Spoiler [associative case] + hapa starts off the day considering both jay and ve for the lynch. he backs down at the claim then no longer wants to lynch jay. jay seemed willing to stop the ve lynch at all costs with the execption of voting for hapa. I pressed both of them on this during the lynch and if you want me to go through and make a formal post about it with quotes and everything I will. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + | ||
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do you realize you are getting lynched? you should be trying harder your current push against boson is pretty weak | ||
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To Jay: (a lot of these are "hypothetical" so just go with it. just try to answer as naturally as you can.) 1. if you were a random person in the obs thread watching this game and you think jay is scum, who do you think is the other scum? 2. who else do you think is mafia besides boson and why? 3. why did you vote for boson after saying "Just to be clear i think it would b a mistake to lynch anyone but (djo)" 4. which 2 people would you be most surprised about if they flipped scum? 5. at this point in the game, who are you the most paranoid/scared about being scum? 6. if you are town thinking you are going to be mislynched, why are you being so passive? 7. if boson is scum like you say, what advice do you think ve gave him before ve got lynched? 8. if you are town.... pretend you are scum. pick any other player you wish to be your scum partner. what is your strategy to win the game? 9. if you're town, pretend you are scum. what happened to the mafia kp last night? if you are scum, are there any reasons why you would withhold kp? 10. what are your thoughts about this survey? | ||
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thrawn2112
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imo the night kill stuff is still.... not really worth thinking about yet. your post doesn't include the possibility that mafia just withheld kp intentionally because they'll just get 2 kp next time. | ||
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thrawn2112
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for example, they could just withhold kp last night, knowing jay will get lynched but hoping to wifom the thread into a mislynch later on... as I suspect you are doing. | ||
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thrawn2112
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earlier you made a commitment to thinking bl is scum, but it seemed like more of a process of elimination based read rather than you having real reasons for why you think he's scum. so i've been anxiously awaiting for you to come in with a case on bl... and now your case against him is based on wifom about your scum play and night kill theory. | ||
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
On December 20 2012 18:30 Hapahauli wrote: Honestly, it's somewhat insulting that you think I'm capable of doing something that stupid. meh, if you're scum it's honestly not that stupid considering it'd be your only real option at this point given how everyone thinks you're scum. do you see? this is why I don't like the topic. i dont think anything can be gained by us arguing about what you would do if you're scum i'll post some stuff about bl but I need to read through his filter and the voting thread again so it may take some time | ||
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thrawn2112
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On December 20 2012 18:23 Hapahauli wrote: I realize you have respect for my scumplay, but show me one of my games where I attempt something even resembling a WIFOM play. Hell there's no incentive for a WIFOM play. If I was scum, it would be 10000000x more beneficial to shoot marv, or even you, rather than risk all this shit. On December 20 2012 18:30 Hapahauli wrote: Honestly, it's somewhat insulting that you think I'm capable of doing something that stupid. hmm? | ||
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thrawn2112
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i'm probably done for tonight as well, i'll talk about bl when i wake up. | ||
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munk-e pretty much only talked about wbg and his 80% thing, then he dropped wbg as a scumread. so he goes from 0 scumreads to this: On December 12 2012 09:45 Munk-E wrote: Woah. Remember that we need 9 votes to lynch someone. With only a half hour left, it's probably too late to start a counter wagon. Even if jay seems more likely than adam, Adam is still worth your vote more. With 9 votes exactly on him, I'm worried that a last second band wagon gives any scum buddies he might have trying to bus him a legitimate reason to turn today into a no lynch. ##VOTE Adam4167 | ||
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However if by a miracle jay isn't scum, and if hapa isn't scum he's gonna be one of the first people I look at. I do not think grush/marv/djo are scum. I read bl's filter a few hours ago and it does look pretty bad.... but mostly only in the amount of content. I was initially having a little trouble exactly understanding his posts but I've gone back and read carefully and I think I see a town thought process. Those two are who I'm most considering as the second scum if it isn't hapa. I still think hapa matched the profile of a scum replacement rather than a town replacement. My recent conversation with him was interesting and I'm less sure of him being scum but more paranoid about it as I was before. The fact that that specific topic (wifom about night kills and what scum hapa would do) was coming from hapa himself is too obviously self serving to ignore. That also seems to be part of his defense, that he wouldn't try to wifom a defense for himself. Based on my all my town coaching from him I would not expect him to make that defense as either alignment. My overall feeling during that conversation was that he was using wifom maliciously. | ||
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thrawn2112
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honestly i haven't read his filter in awhile, i decided awhile ago that he was town and that i don't like interacting with him | ||
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On December 21 2012 01:17 marvellosity wrote: I was hoping for a slightly fuller answer ^^ that should have been an edwop to my post about munke's vote | ||
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On December 21 2012 20:49 Vivax wrote: Ok it's simple: If marv survives this night, we lynch him. If scum stacks another shot, we lynch him too. If he dies, we lynch Hapa. In any case, we should take a super close look at Z-Boson. Gonna deliver during the da..night. .................... Do you realize why this kind of post, at this specific time, is bad and only helps mafia? | ||
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.................... | ||
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On December 22 2012 03:37 Vivax wrote: I'm still not sure about marv, but lately BL's behavior has been striking me as scummier. I'm glad I took the time to look at his filter since I actually bought he could be town since his VE vote. Hapa has done a lot of shit, but there is someone out there who appears to be way more scummy in retrospect: Djo. I can't explain else why he was so supportive of a jay lynch when he's been doing the same stuff in front of Palmar. That puts the puzzle together, scum will probably shoot me and thrawn or Z-Boson, so you know what to do the next day. I'm gonna post the definitive proof later. What do you mean about "djo doing the same stuff in front of palmar?" | ||
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On December 12 2012 10:51 thrawn2112 wrote: but are you scum? so now it seems natural that among thrawn, boson, and djodref, each of them should be expecting to find at least 1 scum between the other two..... unless any of them think that all the scum were bussing adam, which thrawn doesn't the only way that one of djo/boson/thrawn isn't scum is if all the mafia bussed adam | ||
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just lol | ||
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LAST WILL AND TESTAMENT OF: thrawn2112 I, thrawn2112, do hereby declare that this is my last will and testament and that I hereby revoke, cancel and annul all wills and codicils previously made by me either jointly or severally. I declare that I am of legal age to make this will and of sound mind and that this last will and testament expresses my wishes without undue influence or duress. If I am gone on the morrow, as I think is not an unreasonable proposition, I do wish that you not despair, rather, you should take heart knowing that this journey is nearly complete for better or worse, and that things are not as bleak as they might appear. If however, your hearts are filled with doubt then I humbly suggest a no lynch, because by my count you are likely to be at 4-2 tomorrow and your odds may infact be improved by delaying such a decision until you deem your reads more accurate. That being said, I have the upmost faith in your ability to lynch scum tomorrow. I shall outline what I believe to be your best course of action. Hapa..... I still think he's scum, unless marv is scum. If marv is scum then hapa's chances of being scum are significantly decreased. Hapa, if you're town can you try real hard next lynch? Djodref is probably town. His reaction to VE's fakeclaimed investigation check seems too naturally paranoid too have been fabricated by scum. I have a town read on marv due to how often I've agreed with him, but if he is still alive you must consider lynching him. If marv is town, why would scum leave him alive? It may be argued that he would be kept in the game for wifom purposes, but if I were in the scum's position I would be much more afraid of an alive marv whom people slightly suspect than a dead marv who is no longer a potential mislynch. Grush is probably town. Hapa linked this post, which upon reading I can only come to the conclusion that grush is town. His meta allows for him to troll as either alignment, yet his town trolling is actually not as "trollish" as it seems. A scum grush, being aware of his meta, uses his meta in order to troll in a way that hurts town. Nothing grush has posted has had a negative impact on town's play this game. The only cause for concern is his post count but that is a staple of his play regardless of his alignment. Vivax is actually my strongest town read at this point even though I often vehemently disagree with his posts.Be wary of his advice, but do not lynch him. Z-Boson is town. I really thought I could catch a scum between him/djo but after looking through VE's filter I don't think boson is scum. He also doesn't look like considering how quickly VE joined my boson lynch. Bluelightz is probably scum. I don't feel like he's even been playing the game. He came into the thread with a large post about people that I know are all town (myself jay and wbg) but once people put pressure on him he all but disappeared. Signed on this 21st day of December 2012, at this location (teamliquid) in the presence of any of you who happen to be town. SIGNED: _________thrawn2112___________ + Show Spoiler [tldr] + If marv is still alive, lynch him. If he dies, lynch hapa, then probably bl. Or you might want to lynch bl first in either case. grush/vivax are strongest town reads. If whatever player you lynch flips scum and the game continues, reevaluate all reads as to not repeat another Jay lynch. I think the scumteam is either marv/bluelightz or hapa/bluelightz. I'm most sure of hapa, then blue, then marv. However if marv is alive, marv moves up in that list. Godspeed. then i missed the deadline and failed to post it.... not like my reads were that great but it was still pretty depressing | ||
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thrawn2112
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someone trade me, scum qt for obst | ||
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On December 25 2012 04:07 Djodref wrote: Yeah, I know, It was too convenient. But I was really torn. Did you see Munk-E filter ? Also it would have been the perfect way to frame marv, not to kill him. This claim wasn't making so much sense, but I've been fooled once again ^^ my thoughts on this were.. as scum, what would you be more worried about? an alive marv at lylo who people are worried about because he's at lylo, or a dead marv at lylo who you can't frame for a mislynch? | ||
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