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I just got in to work and won't be able to post much today (probably), given that I get off at the deadline.
On November 06 2012 00:46 Rad wrote:
@Obzy
What do you think of Clarity's defense?
Who else are you particularly suspicious of right now?
Honestly, I'm not sure, regarding Clar's defense.
On November 05 2012 21:01 Clarity_nl wrote:I asked marv about the flavor role PMs way before Cheese claimed. The reason I sounded so "condescending" (as you put it) is because I wanted him to shut up and explain why he claimed, and to try and stop others from claiming, but things went to shit fast. The reason I didn't say this earlier was because I had to check with marv if I was allowed to post this.
I think Clar probably isn't VT. When I saw Cheese's "Regular Fapper" comment, I asked our hosts if it was acceptable to post something like that. (Role PM) The response led me to not put any stock in the fact it was claimed; that is to say, I couldn't draw solid conclusions from it, so I didn't look at it again. When Cheese kept pointing at it, it started looking suspicious.
The only way Clar would ask Marv about the flavor role PMs before Cheese's claim is if he had multiple. Stopping others from claiming - well, everybody could've claimed. Every single person had the PM, apparently. If everyone claimed, we'd be back at square one with no additional information. I sympathize with his thoughts and agree with PMing the hosts and waiting for information, but I don't see why he would have asked Marv about anything before the role claim actually came into play. If he's blue, scum would have already picked up on this. If he's scum, then he's scum. I don't think it leads to him being VT, though.
I like his defense, but I don't think it matches up with the above statements, so I'm not convinced. If he doesn't die N1, it doesn't really mean anything, either. He could be blue and was protected, he could be blue and scum specifically didn't target him to try to get a vote on him, he could be scum and thusly survived.
Regarding other people - My scumteam before was Clar, Sylver, and CC as potential. CC obviously wasn't, that brings it to the first two. I still think that Rad and Alsn are town, da0ud seems more townish than not. [Ignoring myself of course :D], that leaves Djo and debears. Djo is going nuts on Clar, and honestly, it looks good to me. I've had a town read on debears all game, and that hasn't changed much. If Clarity (or Sylver), whoever is lynched, was not scum.. I guess my next thought would probably be deb just due to the number of people suspicious of him? I feel otherwise, but I could be wrong. I felt that CC was more scummy than not, and that was incorrect. So maybe I'm wrong about db town, too. I don't think so, though. I still want to vote for Clarity.
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So, I'd like to start with asking the following questions:
@da0ud, you had claimed that you considered Clarity to be your top lynch candidate before going to bed. Yet Clarity switching to Cheesecake over debears made you vote for debears? Why? If you believed Cheese to be innocent, why would you suddenly disregard the fact that your top scum read was trying to push Cheese's lynch?
I know that you also considered debears scummy, but what made you choose him? You were the one who was responsible for the debears counter-wagon, why did you pick debears and not Clarity?
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@ Obzy
The reason I asked marv before Cheese claiming was because I noticed what Cheese did. The OP Townie does not match with the PM townie. The PM townie flavor is in every PM. How do you conclude from this that I am blue or scum?
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@ Alsn and Rad
What do you think about a Clarity lynch tomorrow ?
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On November 06 2012 02:20 Djodref wrote:
@ Alsn and Rad
What do you think about a Clarity lynch tomorrow ? I'm not convinced either. Right now I'm trying to figure out what exactly I think about you.
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There is way too much stubbornness in this game, and I'm guilty of it too. Going to make dinner, be back in 30 minutes.
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On November 06 2012 02:13 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Obzy
The reason I asked marv before Cheese claiming was because I noticed what Cheese did. The OP Townie does not match with the PM townie. The PM townie flavor is in every PM. How do you conclude from this that I am blue or scum?
Because whether or not the text matches in the OP compared to the PM doesn't matter. I'm certain that every single person noticed this, but nobody else (has mentioned) PM'd Marv specifically asking if the VT flavor text meant VT. It seemed fairly self-explanatory.
And - I was under the impression that Cheese's claim was technically when he first put Regular Fapper at the end of his post; to him [as it turned out], that was a claim to all other VTs to take notice of that would not be recognized by blue or mafia. I don't agree that Cheese's actual claim was later- it was clear to him from the beginning.
Don't try to convince me that you aren't scum, convince me(and everybody else) who is.
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@ Clarity
Could you at least tell me when you asked marv your question ?
I'm only asking for when right now ^^
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On November 06 2012 02:01 Clarity_nl wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2012 02:00 Djodref wrote:On November 06 2012 01:52 Clarity_nl wrote:No, I tried to stop him from saying that because if he did, as town, it would be moronic. And as you pointed out, I was starting to doubt my case on debears. Do you really not see a scum motive for Cheese pointing me out as "confirmed town" Again, you seem to think I had special information after marv posted that everyone knows VT flavor, but I didn't, you were just as informed as I was. We all voted for Cheese.Town Clarity has forgot Cheese for a while No, I was just kinda busy answering 1001 questions from you and debears. I was busy defending myself. @ ClarityAre you trying to deny your responsibility in the lynch ? Daoud did not vote for Cheese because he really believed that debears was scum... I have explained my reasons for lynching Cheese. I was being stupid but at least it makes some sense. I don't understand how you could not recognize that he was town and genuinely believing in the power of the VT flavor. How could you believe he was scum ? The only reason I see is that you were mafia and too happy to see a possibility to escape your lynch to think straight. I was already safe from lynching before I switched.
@ Clarity
Ok, that's cool, if you were safe when you switched, it's sure that your vote did not mean anything.
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On November 06 2012 02:32 Djodref wrote:
@ Clarity
Could you at least tell me when you asked marv your question ?
I'm only asking for when right now ^^
Date: 11/5/12 2:48
On November 06 2012 02:29 Obzy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2012 02:13 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Obzy
The reason I asked marv before Cheese claiming was because I noticed what Cheese did. The OP Townie does not match with the PM townie. The PM townie flavor is in every PM. How do you conclude from this that I am blue or scum? Because whether or not the text matches in the OP compared to the PM doesn't matter. I'm certain that every single person noticed this, but nobody else (has mentioned) PM'd Marv specifically asking if the VT flavor text meant VT. It seemed fairly self-explanatory. And - I was under the impression that Cheese's claim was technically when he first put Regular Fapper at the end of his post; to him [as it turned out], that was a claim to all other VTs to take notice of that would not be recognized by blue or mafia. I don't agree that Cheese's actual claim was later- it was clear to him from the beginning.
That's not what I asked. I asked if everyone was aware of the VT flavor.
If I'm VT -> I want to make sure if I should claim (when the time comes) Townie or Regular Fapper, and I wonder if scum/blue knows flavour.
If I'm Blue -> I want to know if scum knows VT flavor, and if VT knows the rest knows flavour.
If I'm Scum -> I want to know if blues know flavor, and if VT know the rest knows flavour.
On November 06 2012 02:29 Obzy wrote:
Don't try to convince me that you aren't scum, convince me(and everybody else) who is.
Easy for you to say, there are only so many hours in a day and I spent all of mine defending myself, and still am.
I was hoping today would be calmer because it's the nightcycle, but it seems people would rather push and push and push rather than collect their thoughts.
On November 06 2012 02:43 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2012 02:01 Clarity_nl wrote:On November 06 2012 02:00 Djodref wrote:On November 06 2012 01:52 Clarity_nl wrote:No, I tried to stop him from saying that because if he did, as town, it would be moronic. And as you pointed out, I was starting to doubt my case on debears. Do you really not see a scum motive for Cheese pointing me out as "confirmed town" Again, you seem to think I had special information after marv posted that everyone knows VT flavor, but I didn't, you were just as informed as I was. We all voted for Cheese.Town Clarity has forgot Cheese for a while No, I was just kinda busy answering 1001 questions from you and debears. I was busy defending myself. @ ClarityAre you trying to deny your responsibility in the lynch ? Daoud did not vote for Cheese because he really believed that debears was scum... I have explained my reasons for lynching Cheese. I was being stupid but at least it makes some sense. I don't understand how you could not recognize that he was town and genuinely believing in the power of the VT flavor. How could you believe he was scum ? The only reason I see is that you were mafia and too happy to see a possibility to escape your lynch to think straight. I was already safe from lynching before I switched. @ ClarityOk, that's cool, if you were safe when you switched, it's sure that your vote did not mean anything.
It does mean something, but what it meant (in my eyes) was: "I'm having doubts about debears being scum, especially with the way he's reacting to all of this"
Cheese looked scummiest to me at that point, and YES, it made it so that I didn't get lynched. Surprise, a 100% wrong lynch looked worse to me than the person who looked scummiest to me. (See, I can do sarcasm as well)
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On November 06 2012 02:13 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Obzy
The reason I asked marv before Cheese claiming was because I noticed what Cheese did. The OP Townie does not match with the PM townie. The PM townie flavor is in every PM. How do you conclude from this that I am blue or scum?
@ Clarity
What did you notice ?
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That the VT flavor PM is different than the flavor in the OP, which is stock. So the PM said regular fapper, and the OP said Townie.
Cheese noticed this, that was his reasoning for claiming, because in his eyes only VT could recognize it.
Please read, I've said this earlier.
I'm also not a fan of how you claim to be leaving and then pop up again when it's convenient. This is the third time you've done this.
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ebwop: During all the chaos I even asked Cheese if he would've claimed had he known the flavor was known to all, and he said no.
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On November 06 2012 03:00 Clarity_nl wrote:
That's not what I asked. I asked if everyone was aware of the VT flavor.
If I'm VT -> I want to make sure if I should claim (when the time comes) Townie or Regular Fapper, and I wonder if scum/blue knows flavour.
If I'm Blue -> I want to know if scum knows VT flavor, and if VT knows the rest knows flavour.
If I'm Scum -> I want to know if blues know flavor, and if VT know the rest knows flavour.
Hmmm. To me, the idea that other roles knew VT flavor didn't remotely cross my mind until it became a central issue, so it made no sense that you would've asked Marv about it.
I'll think on it. Alsn and Rad feeling differently about you is making me worry lol.
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On November 06 2012 03:18 Obzy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2012 03:00 Clarity_nl wrote:
That's not what I asked. I asked if everyone was aware of the VT flavor.
If I'm VT -> I want to make sure if I should claim (when the time comes) Townie or Regular Fapper, and I wonder if scum/blue knows flavour.
If I'm Blue -> I want to know if scum knows VT flavor, and if VT knows the rest knows flavour.
If I'm Scum -> I want to know if blues know flavor, and if VT know the rest knows flavour. Hmmm. To me, the idea that other roles knew VT flavor didn't remotely cross my mind until it became a central issue, so it made no sense that you would've asked Marv about it. I'll think on it. Alsn and Rad feeling differently about you is making me worry lol.
Okay well, you implied you narrowed me down to blue or scum, so let me phrase it this way:
If I'm VT, and I notice the difference between PM and OP flavour, I would wonder if saying I'm a regular fapper would create chaos because the blue roles and scum have no idea what I'm talking about OR if I claim Townie, that people would say I'm lying because I would've known it was called regular fapper if I was actually VT..... I hope that makes sense.
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It does.
I have a problem with mafia, in that I'm bad at detecting liars lol. I like assuming that everybody is being honest and telling the truth, and in a proper game, that's not possible. Your responses to me are answering my questions, which just makes me wonder if I'm asking the right questions, or if you're innocent and it's just shining through or something lol. The way you reacted to Cheese's statement feels.. legitimate? Upon rereading.
What do you think of Sylver? If you're still around.
For that matter, what does everyone think of Sylver?
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I think his behaviour during the hour before Cheese lynch was really weird. He doesn't seem at all concerned about Cheese's claim, my reaction etc. While everyone is trying to figure it out wth Cheese's motivations are and what my response meant, he was saying "I now believe the scumteam is Debears/Clarity!" with little to no reasoning.
When it came to his opening post... all the "scumslips" that people pointed out were legitimate concerns. But then sylver posted a bit more, and a bit more, and I came to realize that if I wanted to, I could point out a scumslip in every single one of his posts.
The thing that's most concerning is his activity. Although his profile states today is his birthday, and it is the nightcycle, I guess I can excuse him for today. But during day 1 he came in way late and didn't offer much more than flailing of arms and pointing of fingers. Although everyone else is making more and more sense as time goes on, sylver is the biggest mystery.
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Okay since there hasn't been a post for an hour now I think it's time for me to go to bed. I urge the blue roles to do what they individually think is right. Do not let anyone tell you what to do, it makes you predictable.
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EPT
