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On October 21 2012 13:17 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 13:16 austinmcc wrote:On October 21 2012 13:14 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:11 DarthPunk wrote:On October 21 2012 13:09 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:01 iamperfection wrote:On October 21 2012 12:58 Hapahauli wrote:This drazak kid falls into the category of saying such dumb stuff that he must be town is what im thinking. I remember from liquid city and my newbie games that saying dumb stuff is not a scum tell and in fact it usally means the opposite. Also i cant imagine this game where there are 2 scum and the player list that we have that drazak would continue to say dumb stuff like he has so i would have to say town for him. Oh, and Idunno if I'd go THAT far. Mafia are capable of saying stupid things as well, though I do think he's town based on his interest levels. The question is whether he maintains his activity or not. i dont think so ive have seen this a lot espcially in my newbie games and it seems drazak is right out his newbies. The only person i remember saying dumb stuff on purpose was yourharry and he did that to match his meta. Nah mafia can say stupid stuff as well. Kush said silly things as town and scum. YourHarry in his most recent scum game also spouted off some stupid things, and not just to satisfy his meta. Saying stupid things is a null-tell alone. Howwweva, looking at Draz's defenses to his "stupid" statements seem pretty townie. He instantly and calmly responds to accusations against him. There's no hint of hesitancy or over-defensiveness at all. Bleh. If you are reading him as town we are on completely different pages. Which townie in their right mind would keep a vote on someone they think is not scum? There is not rationalising that action with a townie mindset. It's a similar read to my read on you really. Newer townies aren't "tainted" sometimes have very creative reasons for voting people. In this case, Drazak is saying he's keeping his vote on a null read to generate discussion - I don't agree completely with the rationale, but I don't find that mindset scummy. But it's good that you don't agree with me - it generates discussion and whatnot. I have more faith in Drazak's explanation than you do. Either way, I do want to hear more from him on the subject - can't hurt. hapa thinks non-new townies are "tainted." Not a townie mindset. Scum hapa! Damn you caught me! T_T
he claimed choo chooo all aboard
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Stuff me with your votes!
But in all seriousness, can't tell if austin's being sarcastic or not. There's a reason I use the word "tainted" in quotes. "Influenced" is probably a better term, but tainted sounds funnier =)
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austin never sarcastic. Non-town mindset. Then after my joke, you made a joke, and iamperfection made a joke.
DP didn't make a joke. Guilty conscience.
Hapa/DP scumteam.
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On October 21 2012 13:19 Hapahauli wrote:
Stuff me with your votes!
But in all seriousness, can't tell if austin's being sarcastic or not. There's a reason I use the word "tainted" in quotes. "Influenced" is probably a better term, but tainted sounds funnier =)
in non seriousness didnt you coach him so he would be in fact tainted by you.
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I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
On October 21 2012 09:45 drazak wrote:
So scum are wishywashy (if I unvoted you), but deciding to keep pressure on you is also scummy? You sir are trying to set a trap to catch a townie, not catch scum.
First, unvoting isn't being "wishy-washy", assuming you explain yourself. But hell, its not like you even unvoted, nor was DP calling you out FOR unvoting. He was calling you out for leaving your vote on someone who you ostensibly don't believe is scum. It's not a "trap", because he hasn't said anything about you unvoting being scummy to begin with. Voting for someone isn't inherently scummy, obviously, but leaving your vote on someone that you don't have a scum read on is certainly on the scummy side (although, I will admit, that I've seen townies do it too. That doesn't make the action itself less scummy, just that townies can, at times, play scummily).
Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now?
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On October 21 2012 13:20 iamperfection wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 13:19 Hapahauli wrote:
Stuff me with your votes!
But in all seriousness, can't tell if austin's being sarcastic or not. There's a reason I use the word "tainted" in quotes. "Influenced" is probably a better term, but tainted sounds funnier =) in non seriousness didnt you coach him so he would be in fact tainted by you.
Oh man... another townie tainted by my ways TT
On October 21 2012 13:20 austinmcc wrote:
austin never sarcastic. Non-town mindset. Then after my joke, you made a joke, and iamperfection made a joke.
DP didn't make a joke. Guilty conscience.
Hapa/DP scumteam.
Damnit DP Y U NO JOKE?!?!
But back to "srs-land", if there's one person I'd have to call out as a top scumread at this point it would be vaderseven. His contributions are nonexistent so far.
His filter is comprised of a summary of his history, attacking DP's logic (but not saying anything significant about his alignment for it), and a promise to post more after work.
##Vote Vaderseven
(this is vote #3 correct?)
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
Vote Count!
vaderseven (3) - austinmcc, iamperfection, Hapahauli
DarthPunk (1) - Drazak
Drazak (1) - DarthPunk
Not Voting (4) - Keirathi, Marvellosity, vaderseven, Z-Boson
With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.
Day ends when a majority is reached.
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On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now?
Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this.
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On October 21 2012 13:31 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now? Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this.
There obviously is pressure on DP, he's been antsy about the vote ever since. He also thinks to think that it would fit scum motives to leave a vote on him? Haven't figured out how that works yet. You're all discussing things, and a lot of the discussion has its root cause in my vote on DP, so I'd say it's done a job well served.
##unvote DarthPunk
As far as what I said, it was brought up several times that being flip-floppy or wishy-washy is something that new scum does. We're all trying to establish town cred right now, that's all of our goals, if I was to do anything wishy-washy or flip-floppy, would I be helping myself (As town, or mafia)? I don't think I would be, but I did generate a fair amount of conversation.
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On October 21 2012 13:45 drazak wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 13:31 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now? Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this. There obviously is pressure on DP, he's been antsy about the vote ever since. He also thinks to think that it would fit scum motives to leave a vote on him? Haven't figured out how that works yet. You're all discussing things, and a lot of the discussion has its root cause in my vote on DP, so I'd say it's done a job well served. ##unvote DarthPunkAs far as what I said, it was brought up several times that being flip-floppy or wishy-washy is something that new scum does. We're all trying to establish town cred right now, that's all of our goals, if I was to do anything wishy-washy or flip-floppy, would I be helping myself (As town, or mafia)? I don't think I would be, but I did generate a fair amount of conversation.
Your vote wasn't pressuring me. It was pressuring you because it was stupid. Now you are unvoting me as soon as you are pressured. Again.
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On October 21 2012 13:45 drazak wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 13:31 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now? Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this. There obviously is pressure on DP, he's been antsy about the vote ever since. He also thinks to think that it would fit scum motives to leave a vote on him? Haven't figured out how that works yet. You're all discussing things, and a lot of the discussion has its root cause in my vote on DP, so I'd say it's done a job well served. ##unvote DarthPunkAs far as what I said, it was brought up several times that being flip-floppy or wishy-washy is something that new scum does. We're all trying to establish town cred right now, that's all of our goals, if I was to do anything wishy-washy or flip-floppy, would I be helping myself (As town, or mafia)? I don't think I would be, but I did generate a fair amount of conversation.
Who views scum hunting in the terms 'establishing town cred'?!?! Obviously that is your motive. But it isn't mine. I want to find scum, because I am town. You want to 'establish town cred' because you are scum.
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On October 21 2012 14:24 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 13:45 drazak wrote:On October 21 2012 13:31 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now? Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this. There obviously is pressure on DP, he's been antsy about the vote ever since. He also thinks to think that it would fit scum motives to leave a vote on him? Haven't figured out how that works yet. You're all discussing things, and a lot of the discussion has its root cause in my vote on DP, so I'd say it's done a job well served. ##unvote DarthPunkAs far as what I said, it was brought up several times that being flip-floppy or wishy-washy is something that new scum does. We're all trying to establish town cred right now, that's all of our goals, if I was to do anything wishy-washy or flip-floppy, would I be helping myself (As town, or mafia)? I don't think I would be, but I did generate a fair amount of conversation. Who views scum hunting in the terms 'establishing town cred'?!?! Obviously that is your motive. But it isn't mine. I want to find scum, because I am town. You want to 'establish town cred' because you are scum.
Establishing yourself as town is at least as important as, if not more important than, good scum hunting.
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On October 21 2012 14:24 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 13:45 drazak wrote:On October 21 2012 13:31 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now? Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this. There obviously is pressure on DP, he's been antsy about the vote ever since. He also thinks to think that it would fit scum motives to leave a vote on him? Haven't figured out how that works yet. You're all discussing things, and a lot of the discussion has its root cause in my vote on DP, so I'd say it's done a job well served. ##unvote DarthPunkAs far as what I said, it was brought up several times that being flip-floppy or wishy-washy is something that new scum does. We're all trying to establish town cred right now, that's all of our goals, if I was to do anything wishy-washy or flip-floppy, would I be helping myself (As town, or mafia)? I don't think I would be, but I did generate a fair amount of conversation. Who views scum hunting in the terms 'establishing town cred'?!?! Obviously that is your motive. But it isn't mine. I want to find scum, because I am town. You want to 'establish town cred' because you are scum.
just because you said it like "who does XYZ"... http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=301748
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On October 21 2012 14:34 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 14:24 DarthPunk wrote:On October 21 2012 13:45 drazak wrote:On October 21 2012 13:31 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now? Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this. There obviously is pressure on DP, he's been antsy about the vote ever since. He also thinks to think that it would fit scum motives to leave a vote on him? Haven't figured out how that works yet. You're all discussing things, and a lot of the discussion has its root cause in my vote on DP, so I'd say it's done a job well served. ##unvote DarthPunkAs far as what I said, it was brought up several times that being flip-floppy or wishy-washy is something that new scum does. We're all trying to establish town cred right now, that's all of our goals, if I was to do anything wishy-washy or flip-floppy, would I be helping myself (As town, or mafia)? I don't think I would be, but I did generate a fair amount of conversation. Who views scum hunting in the terms 'establishing town cred'?!?! Obviously that is your motive. But it isn't mine. I want to find scum, because I am town. You want to 'establish town cred' because you are scum. Establishing yourself as town is at least as important as, if not more important than, good scum hunting.
Yeah but that isn't your MOTIVE. That is just something that comes along with being proactive and scum hunting, or rather is a consequence of good scum hunting and cases.
Do you honestly ever have a MOTIVE of being considered town as town? or do you not care because you are town and want to find scum.
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Draz who is scummiest and why?
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United Kingdom36161 Posts
Alright, I'm around and properly awake. Having a proper read.
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United Kingdom36161 Posts
So... I guess I might rehash a couple of things that have already kinda blown over, but as I've been afk I want to give my opinions anyways.
The DarthPunk role/alignment shizzle
At the moment leaning town on DP from the whole escapade. I won't bore you all with the details, but I noted down this post:
On October 20 2012 12:30 DarthPunk wrote:
Meh. It might dissuade him from fake claiming as scum later. Blues are going to claim if they need to regardless because it is the truth. Scum would find it much more uncomfortable to fake claim and lie about it when the lie is already in the thread and makes it a much less desirable proposition. It makes sense to me.
Obviously none of it matters now as I have had to go into length about it.
The bit I've bolded comes across as "wishful-thinking townie". Hapa also went into his continued earnest explanations. Good enough for me for now.
austin: In a totally disconcerting turn of events, I like austin this game so far. Cba to go in depth, but my notes read: agree on voting procedures. good point about DP's justificactions after the fact. agree with austin about who would say they're voting for someone not scummy. also decent vote on vader.
Which segues me ok on to Z-Bo's FOS/FOSV suggestion, which I'll touch on a tad - don't like it. Everyone should be accountable for their own votes, and mandating voting times/patterns removes this as something scum has to worry about. It's not been accepted anyway by the thread, so enough of that.
drazak: I'm mostly null so far, perhaps a touch town. With him in particular, I don't wanna pounce all over slips, because that seems too easy. I'm looking for sincerity and investment, which I *think* he's got atm, but want to see more.
That leaves the two people I'm most interested in today, vader7 and Keirathi. Mebbe I'm about to look quite hypocritical citing activity and investment, but what can you do ^^
vaderseven - for lack of content, firstly. But more tellingly for the manner of his posts. He mixes in the cute little posts - "what do you want to know about mes" and the little fun facts about his rolling mafia. In between those posts, though, are sarcastic and patronising posts that are really easy for scum to make because it makes them look like they know what's going on without actually have to contribute anything.
Keirathi - In Keirathi there's a lack of investment, and also real overaggressiveness in defence where it's not really warranted. He's spending that time shouting at people rather than actually going after people himself.
On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:I don't really like Draz's explanation either. Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 09:45 drazak wrote:
So scum are wishywashy (if I unvoted you), but deciding to keep pressure on you is also scummy? You sir are trying to set a trap to catch a townie, not catch scum. First, unvoting isn't being "wishy-washy", assuming you explain yourself. But hell, its not like you even unvoted, nor was DP calling you out FOR unvoting. He was calling you out for leaving your vote on someone who you ostensibly don't believe is scum. It's not a "trap", because he hasn't said anything about you unvoting being scummy to begin with. Voting for someone isn't inherently scummy, obviously, but leaving your vote on someone that you don't have a scum read on is certainly on the scummy side (although, I will admit, that I've seen townies do it too. That doesn't make the action itself less scummy, just that townies can, at times, play scummily). Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now?
Is Kei pursuing draz here, or is he just lecturing him? It's like he's simply telling him what is and isn't scummy. And what?
On October 21 2012 14:34 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2012 14:24 DarthPunk wrote:On October 21 2012 13:45 drazak wrote:On October 21 2012 13:31 Hapahauli wrote:On October 21 2012 13:28 Keirathi wrote:
I don't really like Draz's explanation either.
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Second, putting pressure isn't scummy either. But, you're not actually putting pressure on him. You just parked a vote there and haven't done anything with it. THAT is scummy. What is the point of your vote right now? Ooooh I like that point. Interested to see what Draz has to say about this. There obviously is pressure on DP, he's been antsy about the vote ever since. He also thinks to think that it would fit scum motives to leave a vote on him? Haven't figured out how that works yet. You're all discussing things, and a lot of the discussion has its root cause in my vote on DP, so I'd say it's done a job well served. ##unvote DarthPunkAs far as what I said, it was brought up several times that being flip-floppy or wishy-washy is something that new scum does. We're all trying to establish town cred right now, that's all of our goals, if I was to do anything wishy-washy or flip-floppy, would I be helping myself (As town, or mafia)? I don't think I would be, but I did generate a fair amount of conversation. Who views scum hunting in the terms 'establishing town cred'?!?! Obviously that is your motive. But it isn't mine. I want to find scum, because I am town. You want to 'establish town cred' because you are scum. Establishing yourself as town is at least as important as, if not more important than, good scum hunting.
You establish your town by good scumhunting, normally. Something you're not doing right now. Normally I find you wishy-washy, but this game I'm finding you defensive and not-constructive. And actually my only hesitation in plopping my vote down right now is that in your scum game you seemed way townier than this.
So guys, Kei hasn't received any attention thus far, really. vader is a good candidate, but I want to know what people think about Kei in particular. Take a look at his filter and tell me why you are/aren't seeing what I'm seeing.
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Keir was conforming to his play this game in his last game as town in liquid city for what it is worth. Lack of scumhunting. Lecturing others. Overly agressive etc. etc.
If he didn't pick up his play later and actually contribute I would be more worried. But if I had to chose between lynching V7 and Keir it would be V7 in a heartbeat.
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Wow. I really suck at constructing sentences this late/ always. I hope you can understand WTF I am saying.
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For clarity.
Keirs play this game is similar to his early Liquid City play.
If his play doesn't improve as it did in that game I would take a closer look at him.
If I had to pick between a Keir Lynch and a V7 lynch I would lynch V7.
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EPT
