Looney Lynching Mini Mafia
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 03 2012 08:58 kitaman27 wrote: Since signups started such a long time ago, please /in if you are still interested in playing. Anyone is welcome to join, but preference will go towards anyone who has already signed up on the other site Player List 1) Mementoss 2) HiroPro 3) austinmcc 4) thrawn2112 5) sandroba 6) prplhz 7) OriginalName 8) da0ud 9) Djodref 10) Hopeless1der 11) kushm4sta 12) EchelonTee Replacement List 1) 2) 3) Filters for kita to edit into playerlist plox. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 10 2012 11:02 thrawn2112 wrote: policy lynch kush? I am unfamiliar with this policy. Please elaborate. On October 10 2012 11:04 prplhz wrote: so everybody has a role or is anybody vanilla? what if we want to lynch somebody and then he just stacks the other guy with 10 votes also, bedtime On October 10 2012 11:00 kitaman27 wrote: You may not vote on a match-up in which you are participating. Please feel free to pay more attention when reading. Thanks. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 10 2012 11:00 kitaman27 wrote: Please ensure you format your votes correctly as described in the voting thread. Voting Thread? How does Unvoting work with today's lynch mechanics? derp | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
Only the last of my posts in the voting thread is counted? If I were being stupid, I could post 20 times with different votes, but only the last one would count? Difficulty for the mods aside, if you say you're going to do something, then do it. Things to consider for this lynch mechanic: There will be two players that have 1 extra vote and two players that have 2 extra votes (assuming 1 vote per matchup). They will have greater power over who their next opponent will be due to the fact that they cannot vote on their own matchup. Its Day 1, Round 1 with very little to go off of. ##VOTES
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 11 2012 00:44 Djodref wrote: @hopeless would you mind explaining your gut feeling? Also I've just noticed that Kush ans ET have used the voting thread I'm mostly null on you both, but if a gun was to my head, I'd pick you. Both your filters are short, you had the post about how discussing vote systems could be scummy. In the same post, you also passively asked da0ud about his motivations with no reference to the fact that he's your opponent this round. It's not much, but that's why its a gut feeling on who between you two is scummier. Something I think that is going to be important this game is availability at deadline. If you all wouldn't mind, I'd like to know how your schedules work out. I am (in general) available around the current deadline of 19:00 MST (-07:00). Perhaps you've already thought of this, but can subsequent lynch mechanics be added to the Description post each day with any updated deadlines? | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 11 2012 11:02 HiroPro wrote: hey this thing where we vote in secret in the voting thread and don't say what we're doing in the main thread? that's not ok. It was deadline, its not like anyone could have done anything about it. The only thing I did there was let you push kush into Ro8. The rest of my votes were redundant and I'm interested to see how you pursue kush into the next round. pre-edit:=\ ON trying to deadline as well...interesting. Why the apparent scumread (and completely unnecessary vote) on djodref? | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 11 2012 11:18 HiroPro wrote: kush was already advancing even if you left your vote on prplhz - he was the higher seed. But in any case, I'm talking more about austin and thrawn. I didn't even realize until the last second from what thrawn said that he was putting another vote on prplhz. I feel the need to point out that prplhz would have gone through, not kush. Higher seed mechanic only applies to 0-0 ties. I feel like this is a legitimate misunderstanding, but its this kind of shit that leads to things like my snarky opening post this game. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
You panicked twice? dafuq...also completely unnecessary. Why were you willing to throw away votes like that? I'll ask again since no one responded last time: WILL YOU BE AVAILABLE AROUND THE DEADLINE (YES/NO)? PLEASE SELECT ONE RESPONSE. Hopeless1der: Yes | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 11 2012 12:22 kushm4sta wrote: maybe ...you're a cool guy On October 11 2012 12:48 da0ud wrote: Sorry I totally missed the deadline for first round of votes, I really wanted to but have been more busy that I thought. Hence this long post today. Is this going to change da0ud? Will you usually be here at the deadline or not? Going to bed now. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 11 2012 22:34 Djodref wrote: And one last thing before studying the MUs. @Hopeless Deadline is 11am for me and I have a meeting starting at 9am which should end my business trip. So I'm either going to be in meeting or on the way back to Seoul for the deadline. In the latter case, I should be able to check the thread with my phone. Now that I have answered your question, I would really like you to answer mine: Why are so concerned by people being around at deadline or not ? What are you trying to achieve exactly ? There is usually a panic towards the end of a day to consolidate votes and have crazy things happen during the final hours. With this lynch mechanic, there isn't enough time to properly consolidate and I think knowing who is willing and able to be active during the deadline is very beneficial to town. Case in point, go look at the way I voted and my concern makes much more sense. I asked for people's deadline schedules again because 7 out of 11 players (not counting myself) posted without acknowledging the question. There seems to be a severe lack of reading comprehension going on in this thread. da0ud is evidently foreign enough that he gets a pass. The rest of you bastards, not so much. What I'm trying to achieve is using my votes in the most efficient way possible to maximize town's advantage this cycle. This, of course, assumes I'm town. I'll explain my reasoning later if necessary. On October 11 2012 21:00 Mementoss wrote: Not all 3, but it is very possible for one of them to be scum, gaining 2 extra votes after the first round could prove to be a great advantage. Mementoss, I get that you're suspicious of people having all their votes, but can you look over how I (un)voted and tell me if you think I'm scummy because of it? OriginalName, you still havent addressed why you felt you needed two votes on djodref, ESPECIALLY when he was already leading his matchup. You were literally throwing away votes. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 12 2012 00:52 Djodref wrote: @Hopeless You are saying that crazy things happen during the few hours before the deadline yet you have removed your votes at the end of the round one. I find it paradoxal because, in my opinion, the way you can protect ourselves from crazy things to happen is too stick with our votes. Unvoting at last minute is giving more opportunity for MUs to be won be the dark horse. Last round, OriginalName could have reversed some MUs because you gave him room to do it. I can see town and mafia motivations for keeping 10 votes so I'll pass you that. I can see town and mafia motivations for knowing the schedule of the player so I'll pass you that. But I don't like the way you unvoted at all and I don't explain myself the aforementioned paradox. Could you please explain yourself? And last but not least, we don't have any trace of your voting intentions in the recap at the end of the round. It really looks like you don't want to play cards on the table. There is 100% trace of my "voting intentions" + Show Spoiler + THE FINAL VOTECOUNT: On October 11 2012 11:04 JingleHell wrote: Final Vote Count, Ro16 Thrawn2112 (Bye) HiroPro (Bye) sandroba (Bye) EchelonTee (Bye) KushM4sta (7) vs djodref (11) vs Hopeless1der (9) vs My vote that was unvoted: On October 11 2012 00:25 Hopeless1der wrote: OriginalName x1 prplhz x1 Djodref x1 THE BASIC ARITHMETIC THAT FOLLOWS (I.E. What the vote would have looked like if I had not unvoted): -> Changes marked in blue NOT Final Vote Count, Ro16 Thrawn2112 (Bye) HiroPro (Bye) sandroba (Bye) EchelonTee (Bye) djodref (11) vs Hopeless1der (9) vs Also, I feel that austin vs ON should have read 0-1 or 0-2, but that was Jingle's votecount. The results are still correct. tl;dr: I let kush into the next round specifically because I didn't vote. No other matchups were affected, and my intended targets all advanced. Because I think they're scummier than their opponents. On October 12 2012 02:44 kushm4sta wrote: I'm going to do the matchups 1 by 1 this time. Thrawn vs Hope I think everyone agrees on this one but I'm going to talk about it anyway From Hope's posts it's clear that he is not concerned with finding scum. What does he care about instead? -Will you be here for the deadline? -Don't waste your votes. Two topics, both of which I consider to be a total waste of time and a way to feign activity. Here's his latest comment: @hope Do you think it's scummy to "throw away votes"? What is scum's advantage to having less votes? Please share your scumreads if you have them. Throwing away votes would be like self-voting in a plurality lynch game to me. Its stupid and goes against your win condition. There was NO REASON WHATSOEVER for ON to attempt to vote the way he did. I was also here watching the game with my F5 button on repeat as his post occurred. This is just after the thought that Hiro was trying to manipulate me went through my head by leaving kush-prpl tied and saying "oh but I thought the higher seed...blah blah" (I've already said I think this was legit) On October 11 2012 11:00 JingleHell wrote: Voting is now CLOSED for the Ro16! Night post coming shortly. On October 11 2012 11:03 OriginalName wrote: Djodref x2 3 minutes of time had passed, or close enough to an amount of time that ON should have seen that voting was closed. His vote was both unnecessary (djodref was already winning) and excessive (why 2 votes?) for the purposes of showing his intent of lynching djrodef. Just throwing away votes is not inherently scummy it was the timing and implications behind that precise vote. A similar vote would have been Mementoss x2 when I already had 3 votes. What was the point? I think he's scummier than Hiro and he's my choice to vote this round, assuming my vote is in fact required to get him through. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 12 2012 02:44 kushm4sta wrote: From Hope's posts it's clear that he is not concerned with finding scum. What does he care about instead? -Will you be here for the deadline? -Don't waste your votes. Two topics, both of which I consider to be a total waste of time and a way to feign activity. Addressing more of this: IF you make any statement towards being inactive at the deadline (like mementoss has) then if you do anything around the deadline you're instantly suspicious. You will be scrutinized and the town will have a greater ability to control the lynch because everyone will know that certain votes are completely locked in place and are not subject to change. I'm getting some flak for my ##Unvote All, part of which is I gave no notice that I was doing anything. However, I had already posted that I was going to be available during the deadline, which no one cared about, and the end result is almost exactly the same. The exception is that you, kush, advanced as a result, BUT Hiro was under the impression that you would have gone through without my 'assistance'. My activity during the deadline had a significant impact, which I would rather people be aware of so that no one is blindsided. You say I'm feigning activity. My activity is poor, and as close to trivial as it gets, but my actions have clear motive in terms of how people have advanced each round. You claim I'm not scumhunting. No, not in the conventional sense, I'm not. There are now 4 players completely out of the running for todays' lynch, but for all I know, all the scum are in those players. I have no flips and very limited information. I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. On October 12 2012 03:45 Mementoss wrote: @Hopeless stop defending yourself and give us your two best scum reads or your view of the matchups and who you are thinking of voting I'd rather not give scumreads because of both the short length of the game so far and the lynch mechanics. I will go through the matchups and give my thoughts on those. Hiro vs ON is already done. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
My biggest reason for thinking ET could be scum is this post: On October 12 2012 02:23 EchelonTee wrote: You have got to be fricking kidding me. Look at my filter. Then yours. I am being low content???? Are you freaking serious? No seriously, coming from THE #1 lurker of Round 1? I don't even understand how you can possibly argue this. This is plain old terrible disruption. You could at least try to look townie. You have done literally nothing to try and help town, and are easily my top pick for champion. This isn't your first game by any respect, you have no newbie excuse. His dismissal of Original's accusations match his previously mentioned technique of being extremely critical of cases against him, but his arguments are bad and are the very definition of OMGUS. I think he is guilty of disappearing and moving towards lower content posts, and while I don't think that is enough to call him scum, it's something to consider for if we ever see ON's flip. djodref has spent a reasonable amount of time tunneling me in his last couple posts, and I know my alignment so this catches my attention. I want to see his response to my explanations but I don't think I'll get it before Ro8 deadline. In his 'predictions' post, I'm the only one that gets a clear stance. He's null on both Sandroba/Kush and says that ON is too scummy to be scum. He's got too much wiggle room in his stances and there's a lot of fluff in the entire post. He's still harping on Hiro for his early vote mechanics discussion. I'm more comfortable having him in the next round over ET. Between sandroba and kush, I'd prefer sandroba to advance. He makes no comment on the fact that thrawn thwarted his efforts to get da0ud advanced despite his "hunch" and has a generally low content filter compared to kush. I get a townier feel from kush reading through his filter. Busy at work for the next little while, I'll try to flesh out my vote on sandroba later. For now, I'm voting: OriginalName x1 djrodef x1 sandroba x1 | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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Hopeless1der
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Hopeless1der
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Hopeless1der
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Hopeless1der
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OriginalName x1 | ||
Hopeless1der
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On October 12 2012 10:56 Djodref wrote: Hello guys ! I finally got away from the meeting ^^ I just have caught up with the thread on my phone. First I would like to say that the predictions were a (failed) attempt to make my comments look like a starcraft MU preview. Thank you Kush for understanding me and believing in me Just a quick post about the people who are going to advance:
...ON is advancing, what does your last point have to do with that? You're up against ET. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
Who out of myself and OriginalName do you think is more likely to be scum and why? How do you plan on voting today? | ||
Hopeless1der
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Hopeless1der
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On October 12 2012 23:56 EchelonTee wrote: WTF, 1der ninja unvoted and we haven't been making a big hullabaloo about it? ??? Just woke up. I'm too scummy, so no one wants to touch me with a 10 foot pole. Going to explain why I'm voting sandroba shortly, then address djodref's case on me. I'll also start going through the rest of the playerbase and lay out my thoughts and suspicions more clearly (i.e. at all). Do you need me to re-visit my unvote explanation ET? | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 10 2012 21:07 sandroba wrote: I'm mad when I can't distiguish between someone being crazy or trying to make a fake contribution. You can vote for whoever you like as long as your explanation doesn't stink. And as long as the person can even get votes, which ET can't even get this round. Better luck reading the game and the thread next time. Make your votes and Explain your votes. Okay. On October 11 2012 10:36 sandroba wrote: Yo. I want da0ud to go to the next round. I have a hunch and those have been pretty good historically. Not only is that not an explanation, sandroba doesn't even comment on the fact that thrawn tried to start a pissing contest with him. He definitely had the time and opportunity to comment on why thrawn was yanking his chain but just glossed over the issue. On October 11 2012 20:49 sandroba wrote: Yes I'm was not explaining anything because nothing was solid yet. I rather let people talk then to post a ton. da0ud and thrawn are flooding the thread a lot, so I'm pretty pleased with how it turned out, even if he didn't make it through. That is because I would expect him to post way less had him gotten a pass as scum. Right now I'm pretty sure ON is scum. There was no reason to throw those 2 random votes and freak out a ton if you had not read the thread. Voting isn't even mandatory. The only explanation is someone informing him erroneously that he would be modkilled due to the cohost pointing out in the thread he had not voted and since on his mind he had to throw some votes somewhere he just used the opportunity to push some agenda that is yet to be seen by voting the most controversial match up. No reason for him to vote that match up at all if he was town and had no info, since he doesn't even know those players, and I would expect him to throw one vote on someone he knew if he didn't have any agenda. His afterthought is that da0ud ended up continuing to post, so he's probably townie...and he wasn't explaining because things weren't solid yet. Why is it that he is exempt from needing to explain anything he did? That so-called hunch should have been based on something, shouldnt it? On October 12 2012 05:17 sandroba wrote: That's pretty ridiculous comment prpl. And I known for my manners or my detailed explanation of my actions? No. Have there been any flips so far? No. Look at the cases people posted, which is the strongest? Definetely the case on ON. How can you ever say that I'm not trying to get scum lynched or that my play has been uninspired? You can't. This is currently the last post of his filter. It contains a large number of passive-aggressive questions that find flaw in items not discussed in prplhz's quote. Things like ON's case is the strongest (have you seen...me?) or the fact that there are no flips (Whether or not someone is flipped has no impact on you reading them as scum the way prplhz described). prpl is quoted as saying sandroba "can do magic" as town, but so far he has not seen that "magic". This type of response from sandroba reads as scummy to me because he's not answering for the things he's done, he's saying that's the way it is and screw you guys for calling him scum over it. He promptly disappears. That response, combined with ET's "meta read" On October 12 2012 02:41 EchelonTee wrote: Sandroba vs. Kush I have a strong feeling that sandroba is town, which unfortunately is a feeling that is 75% meta and only 25% in thread. Sandroba is one of those super strong town players who is comparatively abysmal as a mafia player. When he's mafia, his lack of effort and interest becomes abundantly clear very quickly, sort of like Palmar but even moreso, IMO. Therefore, when he plays mafia I find that he runs active disruption to try and make as much chaos as possible until he inevitably gets shot/lynched. His posts have been been both interested in setup discussion (a common sandroba town tell) and reasonable tempered, compared to how belligerent he can be. I do not want sandroba killed today, but if his activity/interest/track record take a nose dive he should be murdered. Quote me on this if sandroba begins derping. Kush is a tough read for me and I'm pretty much null on him, but I don't want sandroba to advance. You wanted it quoted, so there it is ET. I think there's been plenty of time for sandroba to be useful, and he's been as bad, if not worse than me in terms of helping the town scumhunt. The only proper information/explanation he's provided is why he voted for ON (the strongest case in the game by his own admission) sandroba will get as many of my votes as it takes to move him forward on the chance that ON advances instead of me. If it looks like I''ll be moving forward, he'll get them all. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 13 2012 00:38 prplhz wrote: @Hopeless1der Why did you vote Djodref over EchelonTee? I'll do this before I address his case. Djodref was tunneling me at the time and no one else was committed to lighting a fire under me. My play has been admittedly lackluster, and yet everyone is content to just brush me off as scum with little to no discussion. Djodref sums things up nicely in his predictions post (Thrawn good, Hopeless bad), but note the bolded part regarding Hiro-vs-ON + Show Spoiler + On October 12 2012 00:38 Djodref wrote: Day 1 Round 2 Preview Hopeless/Thrawn It's kind of night and day. Thrawn is active in the thread, gives good contributions and points out what is weird in other players posts. So far I have a slight town read on him. I would expect very good reasons for anyone wanting him to advance. Hopeless on the opposite has almost contributed nothing. He also seems strangely obsessed with people being around at deadline or not. Which is even stranger when you consider that it seems ok for him to unvote everything without warning just before the deadline. I'll develop later on Hopeless, hopefully with some insight from his side, but I would go as far as saying that he is my top scumread at the moment. Prediction: Hopeless advances to the Ro4 3-0 HiroPro/OriginalName At first glance this MU looks easy but it could be more interesting that it looks like. Once thing I have learned in my previous game is that obvious scum players are usually town (Kush being an exception of this rule^^). We could all agree that ON looks bad, like very very bad. Casting last minute panic votes (on me on top of that) after zero posts and not even properly explaining his motives is scummy as hell. But thinking about it, I cannot imagine any mafia player being this obvious. So I want to give him a second chance for today and see if he can make it up before the deadline. HiroPro hasn't posting that much and I didn't like his post encouraging people to share their thoughts and plans about the lynch mechanics. Right now, I would vote him over ON but I don't want to spend more than 3 votes on this (I didn't keep my 10 votes like, let's say, Hopeless). Prediction: ON advaces against my will to the Round 4 5-3 Basically, I'm too scummy to be scum. And yeah, that's a stretch, but read my filter for the level of evasiveness and unproductive behavior. I actively avoided discussion and existed in my own little world of deadlines and schedules, all of which came up in djodref's case against me. I wanted djodref to advance because I felt I'd have a better chance at getting this case made against me and seeing if anyone bites onto it. So far, the responses have not been too supportive of his case, despite the fact that it makes sense, doesn't misrepresent me or what I did, and has clear and well thought out reasons for his vote against me. Djodref has been very consistent and open in his read of me AND of his stance of ON's lurking not being that scummy. For this, I now think he's town. I voted him to advance because I wanted to ensure I could the case on me made (knowing I looked scummy as shit) to see how his reads would or would not change. I feel that if I had advanced ET, he would not have been pressured into making the case. In addition, it demonstrates that djodref can and does provide his reads to the town and is an asset worth having around. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
Please don't kill me Mementoss Dropping sandroba x3 for now. I doubt it takes that many anyways. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 13 2012 02:33 thrawn2112 wrote: That's what I'm getting but I'm still trying to work through the logic of it...like I just don't see how it makes sense I know I'm town. Scum also knows I'm town. Despite the fact that I look like shit, the only player to properly address my play so far has been djodref. No one batted an eyelash when I advanced over mementoss or thrawn. There's been no redirection involving my matchups. I've been the clear forerunner the entire time, the easiest, biggest target there is, and NO ONE WANTS TO TAKE A SWING? I'll bet every town player in this game has been nursing suspicions on me since day 1. No one wants to be implicated in any connection to me. I needed the case on me to actually be built. My alignment is the only thing I know right now, its the only thing that I can manipulate to get information from other people. I felt that djodref was the strongest candidate to push for this case based on his existing assertions that I was scummy. Now that its out in the open, people need to take a stance on whether or not my actions appeared too planned, too scummy, too crafted to make sense from a scum perspective, and they absolutely could, but I'm saying that I did it on purpose and that I'm town. On October 13 2012 00:38 EchelonTee wrote: No. You unvoted to preserve votes, but the manner in which you did it is shady. If you don't enjoy policy lynches, you shouldn't pull stunts like that. I'll pull stunts like this if they work. Like you said, it was shady. Of course it was. That's been my whole point. On October 13 2012 02:31 EchelonTee wrote: The more I think about this the more it doesn't make sense. What would you have done if I had put a big fat case on you? I've had my eye on you for ages; maybe if you had advanced me instead I would've done that case. What that make me townie? What you yourself acknowledge is that you look scummy and that you have played bad; how the hell are we supposed to know if you're town? Usually I lynch scummy people because by definition of the adjective, they are most likely to be scum. I pretty much would have OMGUS'd you to see how angry you got and gauge your reaction afterwards. You've already chewed out Mementoss and OriginalName for casting 'aspersions' on you. Reading you as town would have depended on how hard you derailed the thread being angry with me, not just calling me scum. It is never just what you do, its how you do it. | ||
Hopeless1der
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On October 13 2012 03:17 thrawn2112 wrote: OK so you pushe ddjodref though to get a read on his alignment... by way of seeing if he were to make a case against you after he moved forwards. So that means at the time you voted djod you knew that you already looked scummy? Had you been playing intentionally scummy from the start as part of a gambit? I Ninja Unvoted + Show Spoiler + On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: Addressing more of this: IF you make any statement towards being inactive at the deadline (like mementoss has) then if you do anything around the deadline you're instantly suspicious. You will be scrutinized and the town will have a greater ability to control the lynch because everyone will know that certain votes are completely locked in place and are not subject to change. I'm getting some flak for my ##Unvote All, part of which is I gave no notice that I was doing anything. However, I had already posted that I was going to be available during the deadline, which no one cared about, and the end result is almost exactly the same. The exception is that you, kush, advanced as a result, BUT Hiro was under the impression that you would have gone through without my 'assistance'. My activity during the deadline had a significant impact, which I would rather people be aware of so that no one is blindsided. You say I'm feigning activity. My activity is poor, and as close to trivial as it gets, but my actions have clear motive in terms of how people have advanced each round. You claim I'm not scumhunting. No, not in the conventional sense, I'm not. There are now 4 players completely out of the running for todays' lynch, but for all I know, all the scum are in those players. I have no flips and very limited information. I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. I'd rather not give scumreads because of both the short length of the game so far and the lynch mechanics. I will go through the matchups and give my thoughts on those. Hiro vs ON is already done. Explicitly NOT giving a proper read on kush in the spoilered post above, despite causing him to advance in his bracket. I basically gave a summary of what happened with my votes without giving any solid input concerning my reads. I also posted this in the spoiler: On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. And my general insistence on deadlines and schedules earlier on in the game, instead of scumhunting or engaging in ANY productive discussion whatsoever. Working on my response to djodref's case. | ||
Hopeless1der
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On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. Is me pointing it out earlier that I know I was being useless. | ||
Hopeless1der
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On October 12 2012 18:06 Djodref wrote: As promised, I would like to present you my case against Hopeless. My main points against him are:
Lack of scumhunting + Show Spoiler + He admits it himself in this post in response to Kush On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: Addressing more of this: /snip You say I'm feigning activity. My activity is poor, and as close to trivial as it gets, but my actions have clear motive in terms of how people have advanced each round. You claim I'm not scumhunting. No, not in the conventional sense, I'm not. There are now 4 players completely out of the running for todays' lynch, but for all I know, all the scum are in those players. I have no flips and very limited information. I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. I'd rather not give scumreads because of both the short length of the game so far and the lynch mechanics. I will go through the matchups and give my thoughts on those. Hiro vs ON is already done. Please note also how he implies that we are going to mislynch (all the scum already out comment). This is not scummy but it is at least not good town mentality. On top of that he refuses to give his scumreads invoking bad excuses (what are the lynch mechanics doing here ?) and for this, I clearly don't see any town motivation. No one asked me to clarify what I meant by "conventional". My implication that we'd mislynch was to point out that there are potential scum that cannot be lynched this round and to try and find them would not be productive this cycle. As it turns out, many disagree and feel that I need to at least make my reads on players known. That way I can put up a nice, townie face so that THEY can read ME better. This has not been articulated well, but I get the point. Suspicious unvotes at deadline + Show Spoiler + I don't know if you have noticed it but his unannounced unvote at round 1 deadline had a influence on the kush/prplhz match-up. He let Kush advanced over Prplhz. Look at the way he presents it On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: /snip I'm getting some flak for my ##Unvote All, part of which is I gave no notice that I was doing anything. However, I had already posted that I was going to be available during the deadline, which no one cared about, and the end result is almost exactly the same. The exception is that you, kush, advanced as a result, BUT Hiro was under the impression that you would have gone through without my 'assistance'. My activity during the deadline had a significant impact, which I would rather people be aware of so that no one is blindsided. /snip I'm not accepting his excuse for this. Should I state that I'm going to be present for deadline tomorrow and happily reverse the result of a matchup ? Is this ok ? I don't like the way he presents it, stating that it almost exactly the same, when his actions led to an opposite results for one match-up. He has no choice but to admit it but the fact he has doing it passively (by unvoting) and shifting the focus on Hiro helped him to make Kush advance (or should I say eliminate prplhz from the competition?) quite unnoticed. First, Don't make connection theories until someone has flipped. If you wanted my read of Kush/prplhz, ask for it. Second, I read kush as scummier than prplhz in that instance, Hiro wanted him to advance but the Higher Seed rule was not going to apply. I also was reading Hiro as town at the time. At least, I didn't catch up at first. If you guys have all seen this then I'm sorry for bringing this up. What makes it even more suspicious is the global picture:
I would say that Hopeless doesn't really care about who is going to advance in this bracket. And the question I really would like him to answer is what he is planning to do with all the votes that he has carefully saved ? Of course I care, that's why I made Kush go through instead of prplhz. The rest of my reads went through. The fact that I used no votes to do it is weird, but not scummy. I very clearly understood and you could say abused the lynch mechanics, but my unvoting was extremely deliberate. At present, I hope not to advance to the next round because I don't think you're going to get votes and mine will be useless if I advance. I think you're town, so if I have to, they're all going onto sandroba. Contradicts himself + Show Spoiler + Firstly he did contradict himself while speaking about letting kush advance. I'm sorry but it not exactly the same when you reverse the issue of a matchup. And here is the second contradiction: I didn't understand why he was so obsessed with people present at deadline and I called him for it. Here is the post he gave me in response On October 11 2012 23:55 Hopeless1der wrote: There is usually a panic towards the end of a day to consolidate votes and have crazy things happen during the final hours. With this lynch mechanic, there isn't enough time to properly consolidate and I think knowing who is willing and able to be active during the deadline is very beneficial to town. Case in point, go look at the way I voted and my concern makes much more sense. I asked for people's deadline schedules again because 7 out of 11 players (not counting myself) posted without acknowledging the question. There seems to be a severe lack of reading comprehension going on in this thread. da0ud is evidently foreign enough that he gets a pass. The rest of you bastards, not so much. What I'm trying to achieve is using my votes in the most efficient way possible to maximize town's advantage this cycle. This, of course, assumes I'm town. I'll explain my reasoning later if necessary. Mementoss, I get that you're suspicious of people having all their votes, but can you look over how I (un)voted and tell me if you think I'm scummy because of it? OriginalName, you still havent addressed why you felt you needed two votes on djodref, ESPECIALLY when he was already leading his matchup. You were literally throwing away votes. What I understood from this answer is that knowing who is present at deadline prevents crazy things from happening. I think that the simplest way from preventing crazy thing to happen is to use your votes and sticking to them. Unvoting like you do results in more possibilities for outcome of MUs to change, something you want to prevent by asking everybody if they are going to be present at deadline or not. I think you want to give yourself some presence in the thread by asking everybody if they are here for deadline or not. In reality you just want to know if you can safely do you unvoting cuisine. I changed 1 matchup and left 2 unchanged. In doing so, I was able to preserve all of my votes. Because my strongest tool is my ability to vote, I reviewed the votecount at deadline and determined that 2 of my votes were not required to get the players that I wanted to advance. I agreed with Hiro's suspicions on kush and I needed to at least remove my vote from prplhz in order to advance kush. If I was going to be more explicit about it, I could have used a vote on kush, but that was not necessary due to the lynch mechanics. My droning on about the deadlines was me intentionally being unproductive. My "unvoting cuisine" occurred again at the end of round 2 when I reduced my votes so as to not waste them. This is not inherently scummy behavior in my opinion. With all this I'm pretty sure that Hopeless is [red]scum. I'm going to go full force in him this round against him because I really want him to get lynched today and I may not be able to use my votes on the next round. I'm also interested to see who is going to vote for his concurrent, the Great Lurker, I named OriginalName. Please be aware that I'm not forgiving ON in any way with this post. Right now, I really find Hopeless to be the scummiest among us. Prplhz is also looking scummy in my eyes. I'll develop on this later but I would like first to have some feedback on this case, especially from Hopeless. Hopeless x6 As I noted earlier, don't go looking at prplhz just because you think I've saved him, especially in the event that I don't flip today. Also, if you get the chance, I don't think you'll need to use all your votes. Just saying... | ||
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On October 13 2012 03:43 thrawn2112 wrote: You want us to lynch sandroba and you have somewhat of a town read on djo correct? And disregarding your situation what are your thoughts about lynching ON? Correct about wanting to lynch sandroba and a townread on djodref. I'm unsure about OriginalName. We're still technically on Day 1, and there is no explicit modkill rule plus you don't have to vote. I don't know what the deal is, he hasn't given us any input on why he's been so inactive aside from "my phone died". His excuses for his djodref x2 vote are extremely flimsy. He was around for a half hour after the lynch, and then returned almost halfway into Round 2 to say he panicked because of a "Y U No Post" PM from Kita. There had been multiple instances of people questioning his motives and he ignored all of it. His attempted last minute vote ended up counting towards the Day 2 votecount, which it seems that many were unaware of, myself included. If he doesn't return soon, or doesn't give us any indication that he gives a shit upon his return, I would heavily consider his lynch over sandroba's. For now, I'm operating under the assumption that he's got some serious IRL issues going on. | ||
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I'm currently going through filters for proper scumreads. | ||
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I wanted to try to be scummy beforehand, so I was going to try to ninja vote, which I did, and be generally unhelpful to see who bites. I felt I was kind of screwed and needed someone to make a case on me, but no one needed to because my matchups were so one sided. I voted djodref mainly because I needed that case made, but also yes, to see his read/consistency. I'll try to be back within an hour @Kush: + Show Spoiler + On October 13 2012 03:28 Hopeless1der wrote: I Ninja Unvoted + Show Spoiler + On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: Addressing more of this: IF you make any statement towards being inactive at the deadline (like mementoss has) then if you do anything around the deadline you're instantly suspicious. You will be scrutinized and the town will have a greater ability to control the lynch because everyone will know that certain votes are completely locked in place and are not subject to change. I'm getting some flak for my ##Unvote All, part of which is I gave no notice that I was doing anything. However, I had already posted that I was going to be available during the deadline, which no one cared about, and the end result is almost exactly the same. The exception is that you, kush, advanced as a result, BUT Hiro was under the impression that you would have gone through without my 'assistance'. My activity during the deadline had a significant impact, which I would rather people be aware of so that no one is blindsided. You say I'm feigning activity. My activity is poor, and as close to trivial as it gets, but my actions have clear motive in terms of how people have advanced each round. You claim I'm not scumhunting. No, not in the conventional sense, I'm not. There are now 4 players completely out of the running for todays' lynch, but for all I know, all the scum are in those players. I have no flips and very limited information. I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. I'd rather not give scumreads because of both the short length of the game so far and the lynch mechanics. I will go through the matchups and give my thoughts on those. Hiro vs ON is already done. Explicitly NOT giving a proper read on kush in the spoilered post above, despite causing him to advance in his bracket. I basically gave a summary of what happened with my votes without giving any solid input concerning my reads. I also posted this in the spoiler: And my general insistence on deadlines and schedules earlier on in the game, instead of scumhunting or engaging in ANY productive discussion whatsoever. Working on my response to djodref's case. | ||
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That would perhaps have generated discussion, but in a much more chaotic manner than would be that useful. Kush, you trying to tell me you had a town read on me but since I made this shit up I'm now lying scum? | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:15 austinmcc wrote: If these were brackets today and you had to vote in them: (1) Who would you vote for in each matchup? (2) Why? (3) Would you use mass votes to ensure they pass on? Mementoss v. HiroPro Kush v. da0ud me v. prplhz I would probably neglect to vote on mmt vs Hiro, I'm reading null on them both. Since you say I have to vote, I guess MMT? I'd vote Kush over da0ud. Kush's filter is more spammy, I have a more clear town read on da0ud from his OP and reactions to people thinking he was being disruptive because of it. I would not mass vote as I'm currently reading kush as town as well. Kush's high activity makes me think it would be better for town if he were to advance because it would lead to better discussion. I would definitely vote prplhz over you. Going through your filter, I didn't really find anything that rubbed me the wrong way. Your posts are usually open. Only the last couple hours have you been reserved and I think you're saving some walls for us. I hope I'm right. Prplhz's recent activity has not been strong to me, and his lack of effort strikes me as scummy. He says he has specific reads on people but they aren't explained, or they're actually false (mistaking me and hiro). He also asks a lot of questions but I feel he's not very focused on them, just picking away for information without providing any himself. I would use a sizable number of votes if necessary. | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:39 thrawn2112 wrote: austin was there a point to that other than asking for reads? Perhaps we'll never know.... Anyways, my time filters has given me a scumish read of prplhz and a wtf read of ET. Prplhz for pretty much what I outlined for austin in my last post. On ET, he made his townread of sandroba clear, and now that sandroba isn't living up to expectations, he's not really doing anything about it. He also made a big stink about associative tells saying if sandroba flips scum he should be held accountable. That goes the other way too I think. He's been around, focused mainly on my bracket. I think its bad form that his filter directly implicates him but he hasn't had much presence on sandroba's bracket. I don't get why he's mostly ignoring it. | ||
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First off, I think ET is almost guaranteed town because of this: On October 12 2012 02:23 EchelonTee wrote: You have got to be fricking kidding me. Look at my filter. Then yours. I am being low content???? Are you freaking serious? No seriously, coming from THE #1 lurker of Round 1? I don't even understand how you can possibly argue this. This is plain old terrible disruption. You could at least try to look townie. You have done literally nothing to try and help town, and are easily my top pick for champion. This isn't your first game by any respect, you have no newbie excuse. This interaction does not feel like a bus at all to me. Given the knowledge that ON is scum, I'm town, and my townread on ET, I'm finding good reason to pursue a scum read on da0ud in this post below from ET: + Show Spoiler + On October 13 2012 00:12 EchelonTee wrote: 1.) I don't disagree with your logic, but an example like that shouldn't be a hard association. Remember those were early rounds; a scum putting votes on his buddies in those rounds allows him to distance himself from them (a good scum tactic) while not endangering them too much. 2.) I disagree; people can change their mind as the game develops, and Mementoss has been fairly open, and clearly posted why he changed his logic. 3.) I think the fact that Austin didn't vote in the 2nd round is a bit strange. Not a huge tell, but IMO townies should be involved in at least a few of the matchups per round, for the reason you stated. This post is pretty strange from you. You spent a fairly long post (listed above) detailing your opinions on 3 players, in an organized listed manner. But when it comes to 1der vs ON, a matchup that actually is in play right now, you are much more unclear and hesitant. 1. This point doesn't really hold; you say that a townie who is still in the running for a lynch would probably be more active, which is true. But a scum who is up for lynch would also probably be more active, compared to if he wasn't up for lynch. While I have my own reasons for being suspicious of ON, your logic here is a lot less laid out then your previous points. 2. It's not ok to put down an opinion, then say "well I'm not so sure because I'm a newbie". It seems like you're trying to shy away from responsibility for your actions. Especially because you are more assertive in other posts. If you could make a more definitive stance on 1der/ON, that would be nice. | ||
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So...we wait until Hiro comes in guns blazing? Austin, am I missing something or does the potato just...blow up and we have no control/knowledge of when? | ||
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On October 15 2012 08:57 EchelonTee wrote: That is a good idea though. Don't hide or you get lynched. 1. If you're town and you hide, then the scum will just give the bomb to a different townie then you, no benefit to hiding. 2. If you're scum and you hide, then we will lynch you in the future (if we can lol). The only problem I have with this is that the set up is closed. I doubt we know all the rules to this. I kind of want to hide for the hell of it, just to see what might happen. Or nominate players to hide if that works better. | ||
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On October 15 2012 22:36 EchelonTee wrote: @1der, any reason why you are refraining from doing anything today? What's your opinion of the potato shenanigans? The general consensus (which I agree with) is that one of da0ud or prplhz should be lynched. Personally, I think da0ud is more likely scum. The lynch mechanic itself has too much randomness to it for us to make a proper plan. At this point I have no intention of hiding. If I turn up with the potato, da0ud will be my first choice. Beyond that, I'd be looking for scummy things from other players. Things like MMT wanting us to ignore ON's flip to prove prplhz or da0ud being scum. They were both out in the first round. Other than the known information of scum flipping, it is extremely difficult to demonstrate scum motive for them when they are already safe from the lynch day1. The bulk of my read on da0ud revolves around his interaction with ON's situation. | ||
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On October 16 2012 11:02 Djodref wrote: I would like to add that we also let Hopeless do nothing on day2. He has been on holidays since he exposed us his brilliant plan. @Hopeless I gave you a second chance because your defense of my case made sense but I would have expected you to be less lurky and really investing yourself in this game after the brilliant plan. You doing almost nothing expect saying that prplhz and daoud were scum since then. I would appreciate you to shape up or I would have the regret to have to cote you again in the near future. @Hiro Why were you holding onto the bomb at the beginning on day2 ? And why were you active in the thread only at that time ? I want you to post MORE. I'll work on it. I had a rare busy day at work that had me away from my computer all day. Nevertheless, I don't think there is much I could have done today...the lynch mechanic wasn't really used much and people insisted on holding onto the damned potato. I won't sit idle tomorrow, if I'm still alive. On October 16 2012 11:07 thrawn2112 wrote: i'm re reading the thread and i'm suspicious of hopeless because i am seeing some weirdness in the way he talks about ON and ends up voting for sand. i'll expand on that later Yeah I just read my own filter...I look like shit. Again. This time unintentional. Do what you have to do, I'm going down swinging if you come away with a strong scum read on me. I maintain that I wanted sandroba over ON. OriginalName was strictly a policy lynch. sandroba wasn't living up to people's expectations and there was a general idea that he should have been doing more and his inactivity was resemblant of his scum meta. My reasoning was set from the time I made this post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=16533220 If I'd even bothered to return to the thread, swapping votes onto ON would have looked scummy anyways. Again, I look like shit because of all my deadline shenanigans in previous rounds. I wasn't here at that time. + Show Spoiler + I picked a bad time to get drunk. For tomorrow, I would still like to lynch da0ud. He was a stronger scumread for me than prplhz was (and still is my strongest read), but I wasn't against either of them dying. I would have hoped prplhz would have been willing to toss it back and forth given that he was town, but here we are. | ||
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Night ends after 24 hours from Night Post? | ||
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On October 17 2012 10:52 austinmcc wrote: One reason I'm thinking power roles of some sort exist: night actionS. When I have received all night actionS night actionS. If they're ALL submitted early. We have not seen rb claims. We have not seen medic protects. However, we've only seen 1 KP per night, and the N1 posts make pretty clear that there were multiple actions to be received. Moreover, Sandroba made it to R4 in D1. That means he didn't look uber-town. Yet scum chose to kill him. Why? He's been known to be a dangerous scumhunter. If scum killing him was the only action, I would expect it to happen EARLY. He was killed because they were afraid to let him live, and killing him early in the night would be better than giving him time to get some night thoughts out. So the fact that night didn't end almost immediately means that scum killing sandroba was probably not the only action that needed to come in. Alternatively, Kita/Jingle were just super busy, but I agree, I believe there is at least 1 power role. I'm not going to try to game the setup any more than that though. On October 17 2012 08:37 kushm4sta wrote: Not proud of my d2 lol. But you have to see it from my perspective. I just wanted those bitches lynched any way possible. Rest assured, I'm more likely to get lynched ahead of you at this point. I had the same idea you did and did even less about it. Current reads: 1-da0ud 2-austinmcc 3-djodref 4-Mementoss 5-HiroPro 6-kushm4sta 7-thrawn2112 8-Hopeless1der Of note: I really think da0ud (#1) is scum. I think austin (#2) is scum because I think da0ud is scum and austin would then be actively using his towncred to save da0ud. djodref's defense of da0ud is piss-poor in my opinion, and his case on me is wrong. I don't know about Hiro, but I read Hiro as town. Based on this, djodref follows at #3. Beyond that I am unsure of 4,5,6, pretty confident thrawn is town and I know my own alignment. Come at me bros. Preparing an actual case on da0ud, now that the lynch can be properly (read: predictably) directed instead of the randomness we had yesterday. P.S. Mementoss gets angry when I defend myself. I will refrain from doing so until late in the cycle (~5 hours to deadline) unless explicitly told otherwise (for example, because people really need my response to make their read on me). At this point, my efforts are probably better spent finding scum instead of defending my farce of a game. | ||
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On October 13 2012 11:03 da0ud wrote: I wanted ON over Hopeless because of ON inactivity and actually ON has posted a lot of good things and but effort in his defense. There is more content to be expected from him to help us get a better read on him in the future. I do want Sand > Djo which is the case right now. From what i said earlier I dont think either that Djo and Hopeless can both be mafia, hence at least we are saving one valuable town with constructive agrumentation. -> da0ud wanted ON. Me and Djodref can't both be scum. Cool. FIVE MINUTES LATER (Austin's "defense" started here) On October 13 2012 11:08 da0ud wrote: Wahouuu I didn't see the 6 votes on Hopeless from kush and at the last second you actually vote on ON. Only looked at the update. Happy with how it went then ! EchelonTee votebombs at the last possible minute. So far so good, he's maintained his stance that he wanted ON and is happy I didn't get advanced. On October 13 2012 11:10 da0ud wrote: What if he has a town read on Hope, then his last second vote makes perfect sense Defending ET...buddying townie? (WIFOM) Is this him being sad/upset? He's panicing now that things went awry. END AUSTIN'S DEFENSE On October 13 2012 11:14 da0ud wrote: I have this feeling as well. I will need to be sure though. With 9 votes, I should be able to make a difference. Wait...+ Show Spoiler + Sandroba #1 to die. And I'm super duper town? Yeah right...(I am town...just not at the level he's blindly agreeing) On October 13 2012 11:18 da0ud wrote: I see as well that Sand voted 7 times against ON to make him move on, when himself was already doomed over Djo. Hence ON and Sand cannot both be scums. It is actually a good result to have Sand vs Hopeless ON and Sandroba cannot both be scum. Based on what he's said so far, I'm 99% town and sand is 99% scum. (or is my reading comprehension failing me?) On October 13 2012 11:21 da0ud wrote: ON moves on then not then again. Now I am pretty sure at least one town is in the finals. Let's hope there are not two of them and we find the scummy one Somehow that 99% sandroba scum read is no longer valid because...I disappeared? We KNOW sandroba flipped town and OriginalName flipped scum. Does this not strike you as a strange change of heart based on the past series of quotes? This entire series of quotes occured over less than a half hour. Moral of the story? Austin's defense of da0ud can suck it. Kill me first if you need to, I'll gladly trade 1-1. | ||
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He is A) Agreeing to lynch sandroba B) Agreeing I'm 99% town C) Both. In any of these cases, his later reactions are extremely suspicious once it becomes clear that ON advances. | ||
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I missed an option... D) He agrees that he's scum. For the sake of completion. | ||
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On October 13 2012 11:14 da0ud wrote: I have this feeling as well. I will need to be sure though. With 9 votes, I should be able to make a difference. When the votes were finalized and it changed to ON vs sandroba: On October 13 2012 11:21 da0ud wrote: ON moves on then not then again. Now I am pretty sure at least one town is in the finals. Let's hope there are not two of them and we find the scummy one You were no longer so certain. I don't get how you could have such a drastic change in scumreads as town or lose your conviction to kill sandroba just because his opponent changed. I really could have just posted these two quotes as my counter to austin's defense of you. | ||
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On October 17 2012 13:50 Djodref wrote: @Hopeless Why is daoud at the top of your list ? If you have time, I would like to have your comments about my post : why we shouldn't daoud. I'm going to bed now so I'll get on this tomorrow. There are a number of things that turned up from re-reading ET's filter, and just general disagreements I have with your defense of da0ud (that could go either way, but I'm reading it as scummy instead of townie). | ||
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On October 17 2012 21:43 Djodref wrote: Well, I have the same problem, but I'm feeling really excited right now. There is some good discussion going on ^^ @Hopeless Please look at my second defense of Daoud, and tell me if you still want to lynch him after this. I didn't appreciate the fact that you have said that my first defense of him was piss-poor. But I'm realizing right now that I might have been totally stupid while tunneling you. Please step up and you're going to drop quickly from the top of my list. Of course I still want to lynch him. Your defense of him only worked because you assumed I'm scum and I'm still actively pushing his lynch. If/When I flip town, a lynch on da0ud becomes more desirable, but as you've said, you have been tunneling me and I may not be able to change your mind this time. Going back to your first defense, you attempt to completely throw out any association with ON because ON was a lurker. However, ON still came in and placed votes and said some stuff. In addition, we KNOW OriginalName flipped scum. I went through da0ud's filter right around the time that ON got pushed ahead of me by ET. He couldn't keep his story straight even though he was damn near certain of a couple things involving: - Hopeless vs djodref - ON vs sandroba I just can't follow his logic (page 2 of his filter) and I think it's because he's scum and he was just saying things to make it look like he cared about the lynch. Also, how does this happen: On October 16 2012 16:50 da0ud wrote: Currently my scum to town scale goes as below : 1) Mementoss 2) Hopeless 3) ET 4) Austin 5) Kush 6) Hiro 7) Djo 8) Thrawn On October 17 2012 13:19 da0ud wrote: I am not the best at this game yet I admit it. I am not the best psychologist. I have not read (yet) the threads to learn how to play better. One thing I am sure of : I am good at maths and finding patterns. This game is intense and trust me being asleep when the heart of the action takes place is not easy. I wake up every morning with 10 pages to read. Would be easier for me to improve faster if I was in your timezone. @ Kush : I will look into why I do put Thrawn on top of my town list. On October 17 2012 15:49 da0ud wrote: Update : 1) Thrawn 2) Hopeless 3) Mementoss 4) Austin 5) Hiro 6) Djo 7) Kush 8) Da0ud Thrawn literally went from top town read to top scum read, and Thrawn's already commented on this revelation. I can't sit here and watch this go unpunished. + Show Spoiler + Side Note...his first town/scum rank "ladder" was made before we even knew the lynch mechanic. Are the hosts stealing ideas from the thread or did da0ud have access to the lynch info somehow? This is too coincidental for my liking. | ||
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Hopeless vs Sandroba (He felt sandroba was scum) but when it was ON vs sandroba he was no longer sure of anything. His change in tone and conviction is drastic and is not adequately justified. I see massive scum motivation in trying to avoid taking a definitive stance in order to gauge the town atmosphere and attempt to push for sandroba's mislynch. | ||
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2-austinmcc 3-djodref 4-HiroPro 5-kushm4sta 6-thrawn2112 7-Mementoss 8-Hopeless1der Obviously I'm biased due to his case, but MMT has been berating us constantly for not actively pushing scumreads and I kept seeing him saying things that weren't true Day1 regarding voting on your own matchups. I sincerely doubt that a scumteam would allow him to continue to misunderstand the lynch mechanics like that, or that he'd be so careless if he were scum. Be back later, need to go do work for a change. | ||
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On October 18 2012 00:08 thrawn2112 wrote: What are you referring to with hopeless vs sandroba I don't recall that being a matchup It almost was one before ET's votebomb went through. Kita had to re-read his own rules to make sure. | ||
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On October 17 2012 16:01 thrawn2112 wrote: 1 da0ud 2 austin 3 hiro 4 hopeless1der 5 mementoss 6 Djodref 7 kushm4sta 8 thrawn2112 He said thread(s) [plural] for a reason. | ||
Hopeless1der
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On October 17 2012 06:24 HiroPro wrote: I wanted to be more in control/leading. Hasn't really worked out partly cause I haven't had time, partly cause I'm not sure exactly how to go about it. Hiro you really need to get your ass in here or explain your absences better. Your filter is currently smaller than mine is, and it doesn't give me the fuzzies all over.. What happened to the deadline post? | ||
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On October 18 2012 05:50 austinmcc wrote: Currently at 1. Mementoss 2-7. Dudes 8. Me Thinking over mementoss's recent posts. Will reread games where I've accused him as town, as well as his scum games. If nobody is really screaming scum, then it feels likely likely that either Djoref or kush is scum for the R3 votes on hopeless1der vs. ON. Again though, mementoss fits the bill there because he says he would drop votes except the matchup's already going the way he wants it to. Not scummy on da0ud today. But he needs to keep contributing. Either there will be helpful stuff there OR he'll slip up. HiroPro replacing out leaves me with him feeling townie early on, and I'm interested in seeing what a fresh pair of eyes does with the thread. Still believe we have night actors. No way are kita/jingle being super sneaky in constantly saying "actionS" and "all actions" if nobody is taking night actions. Stay hidden. da0ud did the same thing mmt did with the R3 votes, and the way he did it seemed far more scummy to me. For the record I haven't given your most recent case on MMT a proper read and probably wont until I get home from work...so not until 4-6ish hours from now. | ||
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Ultimately, I'm currently more town on MMT but unwilling to support a lynch on austin today. I read da0ud as scummy and I also don't think he's a prime candidate for any upcoming NK's, whereas Austin, MMT, VE are all significantly more likely to get taken out by scum (assuming they aren't scum themselves, duh). Lynching da0ud is a better longterm plan for town imo as it cleans out sandroba/ET's read on him and I think it will narrow our reads a lot more than say lynching MMT or Austin. Yes, its scummy to do things for information alone, but then again, why was ON lynched instead of sandroba? People (not me) felt they would be able to tell sandroba from sandroba. Can anyone in this game say the same of da0ud? I'm revising my votes so that MMT and Austin get my 6/7 spots. I don't want either lynched today because MMT has started to put down some serious effort into the thread (scum motivated or not) and Austin, while tunneling, is still known to post walls of text from time to time. There is also the fact that VE has just replaced in and has yet to properly sit down and take a good look at this game I think. 1-da0ud 2-djodref 3-kushm4sta 4-VisceraEyes 5-Thrawn2112 6-Mementoss 7-Austinmcc 8-Hopeless1der djodref is up there because in isolation, he's a scummier looking player, but I feel I'm really forcing any connections I make between him and other players. Since I want to hold off on MMT/Austin, after da0ud I'm ranking in the order of who I would care least if they were to go missing. I don't think kush or VE are going to be anywhere close to getting lynched, and I may need to move djodref around to have a better shot at da0ud. Really tired, so I'll lay out the short version of why I want da0ud before I go to sleep:
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On October 18 2012 23:37 da0ud wrote: I don't understand why people believed I could be scum because I did this scale ranking before we ended up having it for real in D3, but it was pure coincidence. It was just making sense for me to rank people versus the others. I have been reading more than talking, and not putting someone at the top of my scale for telling me i am dumb, bad and scum (sorry Thrawn in particular) - or you would all have been number one, Djo number 7, me number 8. After all, I still want to put Mementoss on the top of my scale, for his changes of mind, votes, as I stated in D2. I want to push Austin number two currently because he is the one that has the most chances of being lynched instead of me, and I know I should not be killed. Not too sure who will be 3 and 4 between Hopeless, Hiro/VE. Hiro/VE has not been too very active, I could not find a lot of scumhunting, but has been decently consistent. so I will put Hopeless over Hiro. Kush and Thrawn will occupy the ranks 6 and 5. They do bring a lot to the discussion and are the ones that make me feel the most how useless I can be sometimes. Scum people would not do that, it would not be beneficial because me behaving badly does create interference which is good for the scum team. Djo ranked 7, he has made good cases, and did help the town to start changing their mind about me. 1) Mementoss 2) Ausin 3) Hopeless 4) Hiro 5) Thrawn 6) Kush 7) Djo 8) Da0ud I guess I'm up there by elimination, but you don't seem to really have much of a read on me da0ud. Also, your reasons for having Austin that high, while understandable, are not helpful. Do you think he is town or scum? I don't care how likely he is to get lynched, I care what you think about his alignment. This post just makes me want to lynch you even more. | ||
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On October 19 2012 00:01 Djodref wrote: I'm going to bed, I'll be here for the deadline. I'm quite sure that ON has been bussed. Please have a look at Hiro's filter and imagine him with the intent of bussing ON. You guys are putting too much importance on the matchup Hopeless/ON. It could have just been a town/town fight for all we know. You mean scum/scum? | ||
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On October 19 2012 00:32 thrawn2112 wrote: I don't know if there's any merit in the sandroba nk speculation with regards to people who are aware of his ability being likely scum... his veteran status was something that was brought up over and over again during D1 so everyone in the gamewould be aware of it. Yeah it was a big point in why people wanted to lynch ON over him in the first place. But now it WIFOM's his da0ud hunch a bit. On October 19 2012 00:21 Djodref wrote: Ok, it's just that I'm tired of explaining myself over and over again for these votes. I'm sorry, I really don't want to get mislynched for them. So let me ask all of you what do you think about my explanations for these votes ? I personally don't have an issue with the way you voted. I handpicked you to advance for the explicit purpose of having you attack me so I could get a better read on you. I thought you were town then, but I don't like the way you keep pushing Hiro/VE and I don't agree with your defense of da0ud. IF da0ud flips scum, you and austin are my next highest reads due to your defending him. | ||
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On October 19 2012 05:07 kushm4sta wrote: Time to go on the lynch Austin campaign trail @hopeless1der Where is your townread of austin coming from? I see your biggest scumreads are djodref and daoud. From this it seems that you are very harsh on newbies, even though you have done some newb scummy things yourself. I implore you, reconsider what you think is scumminess might just and probably is newbness. Can you see a newb acting how daoud is acting? I can. Djodref: look how easily he posts, not his big cases, but the little ones in between. He has no fear of slipping up, no fear of sharing what's on his mind. I never said I had a town read on austin, he's just low in my list because I'd rather lynch into da0ud first and didn't want austin picking up stray votes along the way. MMT and austin were at each other's throats for a while, VE sees scummy scum scum from austin, but again, I'm not comfortable with my read of him. I'd rather wait another day and give VE some time to hopefully hammer some sense into the thread after that D2 debacle. I have a scum read on da0ud and a scummy read on djodref. After Austin's case on you, I have lots more connection theories to pursue, and now that he semi-claimed, I have even more reason to want to keep him alive. I expect him to deadline his claim post in the event he gets NK'd tonight, unless this lynch turns silly. For today, I think that if you are scum, one of da0ud and djodref is also scum. In fact, I'm moving you to #2 and djodref down to #3. 1-da0ud 2-kushm4sta 3-djodref 4-VisceraEyes 5-thrawn2112 6-mementoss 7-austinmcc 8-hopeless1der | ||
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On October 18 2012 04:32 kitaman27 wrote: Day Three Votecount 28 da0ud 28 austin 25 hiro 16 kushm4sta 14 hopeless1der 14 Djodref 10 mementoss 9 thrawn2112 In the event of a tie that cannot be broken by the first player to reach critical mass, we will remove the most recent vote and re-tally, until a winner has been decided. Unofficial Votecount 46 austinmcc 38 djodref 38 kushm4sta 34 da0ud 34 visceraeyes 33 thrawn2112 31 hopeless1der 31 mementoss I did not work out the tiebreakers since austin was leading | ||
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On October 19 2012 07:14 kitaman27 wrote: Day Three Update 41 daoud 40 austin 40 kush 38 djodref 38 VE 34 thrawn 29 mementoss 28 hope I went through this twice, but it probably wouldn't hurt to have someone double check to verify the vote count. 45 minutes remain Austin alone: MMT 5 VE 8 djo 7 da0ud 7 austin 1 thrawn 8 hopeless 2 kush 8 Total: 46 What's going on kita... | ||
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Unofficial Votecount 46 Austinmcc 39 Kushm4sta 38 djodref 36 VisceraEyes 33 thrawn2112 32 Hopeless1der | ||
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On October 19 2012 07:43 Hopeless1der wrote: k well...my updated Unofficial Votecount 46 Austinmcc 39 Kushm4sta 38 djodref 36 VisceraEyes 33 thrawn2112 32 Hopeless1der ...How did 'enter' do that while I was mid post... Unofficial Votecount 46 Austinmcc 39 Kushm4sta 38 djodref 36 VisceraEyes 33 thrawn2112 32 Hopeless1der 32 Mementoss 29 da0ud | ||
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On October 19 2012 07:58 kushm4sta wrote: Either austin or me and you would rather lynch me...? yessir. | ||
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On October 19 2012 07:52 kitaman27 wrote: Day Three Update 45 austin 41 djodref 40 kushm4sta 36 hiro 33 hopeless1der 33 thrawn 32 mementoss 28 da0ud | ||
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I went looking and can't seem to figure out what has you so convinced. Hopefully your death post fixes that. @djodref I think a lot of your case on Hiro can be swept under a rug of "inactive, got replaced" which leaves me Null on a lot of things like his reluctance to give reads or his willingness to discuss lynch mechanics. It is suspicious, but not enough for me to chase his lynch. I would have gotten upset as well if I was VE because you're ignoring the fact that Hiro isn't in this game anymore, VE is. As for da0ud, I'm not as eager to lynch him now that we're at MYLO. I can see the newbie side of things, but I really dislike that train of thought because you can't hold him accountable for anything he does. If I see scummy things, I'll push him for it. I'm damn near certain that one of kush/thrawn is scum, so we'll see where this nk takes us and I'll go from there. | ||
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On October 20 2012 02:53 kushm4sta wrote: Why is either thrawn or me scum lol...I was wrong about ve targetting the noobs because 1der you are the biggest fucking noob in this game. All day you have had no arguments, just talking about how you want me dead. You are wrong you are bad and this is the last time I will talk to you directly. Pretending to be scum to catch scum...what a joke. @mmt thrawn has been my biggest scumread yeah I would lynch him. I'm not as sure as I used to be about it though. Austin pushed you towards the end of the day. I believed him when he claimed blue and pursued his read on you. He flipped blue. I was right you were wrong. This alone does not make you scum, but telling me I'm terrible because I agreed with a confirmed blue is unacceptable. You have not flipped. This angry act is bullshit. I'm coming for you in about 5 hours. | ||
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On October 20 2012 02:59 Hopeless1der wrote: this is the last time I will talk to you directly. trololol | ||
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On October 20 2012 08:25 thrawn2112 wrote: If ve is scum then fu mods This | ||
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On October 20 2012 08:21 thrawn2112 wrote: Well.... Don't see any way I'm not getting lynched. Town is gonna be silly and follow the last will of the person who scum decided to kill..... think about it. If I'm scum then why would I night kill someone whose last will included a huuuuge case against me? Use your noggins. Uhh...perhaps because MMT would have tunneled you with all his might and NOW you get to WIFOM his case. | ||
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On October 20 2012 08:49 Djodref wrote: A blue role ? Protecting VE What about a mafia role ? If we have no claim we have to assume mafia imo. We don't even know if its a role at all, I'm just spitballing | ||
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I don't think D3 really went that bad, but given that there is no chance for a no lynch, I agree that we should try to make a plan for today. However, I think using the friend votes will be useful. They're public and should be manipulable, it's only the foe votes that are hidden. As a default I'd say to protect yourself with your friend vote. Since I think everyone agrees that I'm town, I'm willing to defend whichever of kush/thrawn I don't use my foe-vote on to try and keep scum from pushing the other case as a mislynch. I realize that if I have the wrong read this is a potentially terrible idea if only one of them is scum and I choose wrong. My current "friend" vote choices are between myself and djodref. Can't vote for VE Still kind of want to have da0ud killed, but I think we're better off going through austin's and mmt's case to see who we want to lynch out of thrawn/kush. I also want to see what VE has to say about his pardon, but I doubt it really has a big effect, if any, on who we choose to lynch today. | ||
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On October 20 2012 03:11 kushm4sta wrote: make up and.kiss? Friend: Hopeless1der | ||
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On October 22 2012 00:54 kushm4sta wrote: Explain the last part of this post please. I don't understand what you are saying is wrong with my theory. He's saying pardoner scum should have pardoned his teammate instead of a townie. To your earlier question, if thrawn flips scum I'm probably going after da0ud. | ||
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assuming 4v2, the pardon turns it into 3v2 or 4v1 depending on if a town or a scum gets pardoned. 40% vs 20% "chance" to lynch mafia if we were to randomly lynch. | ||
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On October 22 2012 01:28 thrawn2112 wrote: are there any magic words I can say that will make people not vote for me? tell me what they are and I will happily oblige unfortunately no. | ||
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Foe: Thrawn2112 but I think it was pretty obvious. I think djo is town, VE is off the table and da0ud is "too noobie" to lynch today, so its between you and kush. I'm sheeping MMT over Austin. Oh noes. | ||
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"Oui oui" | ||
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gg djodref. Screw you Hiro for having to get replaced! | ||
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