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yeah I'm back but it's 2 am so I won't really read anything yet other than what's really obvious because I'm tired and will post tomorrow.
Why should I be scared? The assumption that mafia was looking d1 and therefore suicided GK is complete bullshit.
They suicided because they wanted to kill blues, not because they thought they could afford it. That's the worst reasoning ever. Even if they thought they could afford it they wouldn't just do it until they think it's worth it so what you've got is an action that made sense from a scumpoint of view no matter of "standing".
If they considered it a -EV move they wouldn't have done it no matter how good or bad in a spot they thought they are.
If they considered it a +EV move they would have done it no matter how good or bad in a spot they thought they are.
They apparently thought they're going to get a bunch of blues when bombing into BM24. Everything else would be playing against their wincon as they'd be giving away "charity" lol
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On September 09 2012 09:43 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 09:36 Toadesstern wrote:
yeah I'm back but it's 2 am so I won't really read anything yet other than what's really obvious because I'm tired and will post tomorrow.
Why should I be scared? The assumption that mafia was looking d1 and therefore suicided GK is complete bullshit.
They suicided because they wanted to kill blues, not because they thought they could afford it. That's the worst reasoning ever. Even if they thought they could afford it they wouldn't just do it until they think it's worth it so what you've got is an action that made sense from a scumpoint of view no matter of "standing".
If they considered it a -EV move they wouldn't have done it no matter how good or bad in a spot they thought they are.
If they considered it a +EV move they would have done it no matter how good or bad in a spot they thought they are.
They apparently thought they're going to get a bunch of blues when bombing into BM24. Everything else would be playing against their wincon as they'd be giving away "charity" lol Well, it was because they wanted to kill blues AND because they thought they could afford it. If they thought they couldn't afford it, they would probably suicide GK later in the game. It could also be that they felt forced to suicide him because he was posting ultra-scummy, and he would have been a nice delicious lynch choice for day 2. You should be scared just like you were scared in night 1, remember your-good-bye-they-are-going-to-kill-me post? Especially now, with two vets gone. What is a +-EV move?
There's no difference in when you use the suicide-bomber except for the fact that it is better the earlier you use it because with a lot of people alive it's more likely to kill multiple people.
The KP is stable, it's no difference whether they lose him n1 or n2 or n3 except for the fact that doing it later might actually risk not being able to use his ability because he might be lynched (although quite unlikely at that point of time).
There's not a single reason to use that role late except if you don't want to use it at all because you're going to lose that one guy no matter what.
The night has just started I'm not going to post something about my reads right now lol.
a +EV move is something from poker, something that gives you more advantages than drawbacks, while -EV is the opposite.
For example if you have to pay 1$ to role a dice (6 sides) and get 10$ if you role a 6 but don't get something when rolling 1 to 5 that's +EV because you'll end up making money by doing that. If you have to pay 1$ but only get 5$ it's -EV because you lose money.
Same thing goes for mafia. If they thought they could bomb away multiple people they thought it has more advantages than drawbacks. Like if they thought they'd kill BM24 + 2 blues in exchange for 1 mafia memeber that might be worth the trade no matter of position, or if they considered it likely to get BM24 + 3 blues, go figure.
If they think it's worth the trade they'll do it no matter what position they're in because it always improves you position, no matter if you've got 5$ in your pocket or 100$, doing the 1$ to win 10$ thing always makes sense.
If they think it's not worth the trade they wouldn't ever do it because no matter if you've got 5$ in your pocket or 100$, doing the 1$ to win 5$ will always but you at a worse position in the long run.
So what we get from that is that mafia thought bombing BM24 will kill a bunch of blues. Nothing else because if it's -EV they wouldn't have done it no matter what, if they thought it's +EV they would have done it no matter what.
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Anything from 1 to 3 watchers makes sense imo. It depends on the other roles to be balanced.
If we don't have a single tracker we could easily have 3 watchers.
If we have like two Trackers there might just be 1 or 2 watchers in this game.
If we've got a shitton of medics / jailers we're not going to have more than 1 watcher.
As noone has an idea about what roles there are in this game (total numbers) there's no way to figure out how likely there's just going to be 1 watcher or more than 1 watcher.
Usually watchers are quite rare but this game has no DTs at all, so Tracker + Watchers are the only information role and are going to be more frequently in this game than in usual games. Both Tracker and watcher are weaker than a true DT so it's quite likely that we've got more combined tracker+watcher than we would have had DTs if this was a DT set-up but again, the set-up has to make sense as a whole.
I don't know how Palmar usually balances his games vet-wise and if he does at all. I know Kita doesn't for example but I'd say the majority of hosts does it in SOME way, so yes I naturally like the "one of the vets got to be mafia" approach, which is the reason I mentioned foru.
If someone knows about Palmars hosting habbits and he really is someone who doesn't care about vet-balance (honestly from how he's posting I'd doubt he's balancing vet-wise, he likes games without vets) we might have to scratch that idea.
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I've got a little task for people, read this game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=330925
Also make sure to read the obs-QT and especially Syllos opinion on forumite (click me!)
I know I don't usually ask people to read older games because it's a pain in the ass but this one is important.
When you're done reading I want you to think about forumite. There's 4 major things that come to my mind when thinking about forumite:
- He is cautious when posting
- He is only posting when he has to
- He is isn't interested in what's going on or helping town at all
- He's doing apeshit right now
It's the very same thing we had in WoF. Town-Forumite is useful, good and will do STUFF.
Can you think of one important post forumite has done this game? Just one that instantly pops into your mind?
I can't without having his filter opened because there's really not much that sticks out. His most important post probably was this: + Show Spoiler [click me] +On September 09 2012 06:32 Forumite wrote:
Kreb (Miltonkram) (0)
Hapahauli
BroodKingEXE (16)
Hapahauli
slOosh
imallinson
Shady Sands
Hopeless1der
ShiaoPi
Rewok
DoYouHas
Maverick32x
grush57
Forumite
Gravan
Toadesstern
grush57
strongandbig
grush57
Toadesstern
Shady Sands
Z-BosoN
Kreb (Miltonkram)
DoYouHas (1)
Bill Murray
ShiaoPi (0)
Maverick32x
Maverick32x (0)
BroodKingEXE
Shady Sands (0)
grush57
grush57 (1)
DarthPunk
Toadesstern
Shady Sands
Z-BosoN (2)
grush57
austinmcc
BroodKingEXE
Not yet voted! (1)
Lvdr (mkfuba07) LOL
About his cautiousness:
I already quoted this but just as an example for this, you'll find multiple posts like the following in his filter:
On September 08 2012 10:18 Forumite wrote:
@Toades
After the D2-post you said you didn´t like the case on me provided by Hapless and Hapa, but you still thought I was probably scum. The only reason I remember was elimination, out of the people you stated are vets they are either dead or me, and those who died flipped town. Is that your case, "There should be scum among the vets, and now that some flipped town, the living ones are probably scum"? Because it´s a very convenient thing to say for scum, if people say there must be scum in a group, then scum kill half the group if it´s full of town, and leave it alone if there´s a scum in it so their buddy can hide better. I´m not saying that´s what happened, but it´s shaky to claim this early in a game that the last survivor of a group of must be scum event though the others flipped town.
Apart from that you said you thought I wasn´t as aggressive as usual. Partly that is because I don´t keep myself as updated as I usually do due to more stuff happening IRL than usual, but I also don´t want to make the mistake I did in DF-Mafia.
Anyway you need more reasons to you call me scum. What is it?
You'll find stuff like that all over his filter. He's always making sure to have a possible retreat when posting and not committing in the slightest.
He only really posts when he has to:
On September 07 2012 07:48 Forumite wrote:
=(
Toades, what do you want most, an answer to the case on me posted during the night, or my top scumreads. It´s late and I´m too tired to do both right now.
On September 07 2012 08:17 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 07:56 Toadesstern wrote:On September 07 2012 07:48 Forumite wrote:
=(
Toades, what do you want most, an answer to the case on me posted during the night, or my top scumreads. It´s late and I´m too tired to do both right now. I don't consider the case on you to be good and I don't agree with it. I want to lynch you because of method or elimination. So I'd rather see you talk about targets for today. I have two scumreads right now. I had Ottox down as scum, I was wrong but it shouldn´t affect the other reads. They are both based on the time around Matts claim. The first one is Maverick for his first post in the game, it was a reaction to Matts claim and the situation around it, and he was basically trying to divert attention to everyone else, without committing to anything. The second one is Hapa for his posts during the same time. The post below sums it up well. Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:32 Hapahauli wrote:On September 04 2012 09:26 Mattchew wrote:On September 04 2012 09:22 Hapahauli wrote:
Yeah I know what the role does, so what about it? I'll ask a question if I don't understand something. there is no information given to the role, it is a VT that (randomly) visits people. If a tracker or watcher see me on their check it could lead to a stupid mislynch Ah thanks for clearing it up. I'm just a bit wary of D1 claims in general after having seen SnB's "self-aware miller" claim in DeathNote Mini Mafia, justified or not. On September 04 2012 09:22 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 09:17 Mattchew wrote:On September 04 2012 09:16 Hapahauli wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. Hold up. Why would we want people with information roles to claim? ##vote hapahauli need an honest answer. What do you consider worse: a) People not thinking while posting / reading b) People defending other people 1 hour into the game when they have no reason to do such a thing and should be happy to see as much posts from the person in question defending himself rather than stopping the discussion defending him. Howabout c) People who pick fights with people who are trying to start conversation (slOosh) for the sake of picking fights? When I read this post at first, I see Hapa buddying up with Matt and throwing suspicion on those attacking him. It didn´t feel right, Matt claiming didn´t arouse any suspicion in him. He said hi to Matt and then chided those attacking him. That´s the ones that jumped out at me when reading the thread. Yes, I should reread all the spam from yesterday, I´ll see about that tomorrow. tl;dr: Hapahauli
Maverick32x
That's something we rarely see when looking through foru's filter: He's talking about his read after being pressured by me and giving some minor insight on what he thinks is happening. However, why is that only happening after I call him out as mafia? I tell people he's mafia, he instantly gets in the thread and posts something like that when all the time people weren't talking about him he did nothing like that. That my dear friends is scummy as shit
As mentioned I don't think he's interested in what's happening. I can't remember a significant post foru did because there was none. He isn't even trying to help. No "shut up guys, here's what's going on: XXXX, Therefore we lynch Y". No pushing his reads to make sure the best possible lynch ends up happening. He's just completly standing by, posting some minor things if he has to but nothing else.
Town-Foru would be interested in what's going on.
Town-Foru would be pushing his reads.
Town-Foru would be actively trying to help town and not just stand by.
It's just the same thing as WoF. He was mafia in that game and did apeshit. For some reason he never ended up being lynched although Sandroba and I called him mafia straight from d1 and sadly nothing happened.
Let me assure you, Foru would be doing SOMETHING to help if he was town. He isn't.
Forumite is mafia
Also vote me for mayor
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On September 10 2012 02:54 austinmcc wrote:
can you give a # for syllo's post on Forumite in obs?
#232 and #233
No when he is town he is actually useful
He's just not useful at all. He's doing apeshit this game sliding by, sometimes agreeing with people, sometimes voting but he isn't doing something himself. He's one of the top #3 vets this game had when we started (I'm not within the top #3!).
He should be out here trying to guide town, trying to stop people bullshit, trying to focus town to something he consideres to be a good lynch, he should be trying to take the lead, especially now that BC and Dr.H are dead, especially as I said I'm not going to have much time yesterday and two days ago and said that I'll be away, not making it in time for the deadline.
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On September 10 2012 03:04 austinmcc wrote:
EBWOP: Is there more than "when he is town he is actually useful"? Or is that what you're pointing to?
yeah there's more but I just realized that was mostly in irc 8(
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On September 10 2012 03:52 austinmcc wrote:Making notes but will put them in thread so you can see my thought process: Reading WoF scum QT : + Show Spoiler +Forumite not a scum leader, but seems to be thinking about whether his actions look town or scummy. Choosing targets to go after based on who his town self would go after. Some of not being the scum leader could be the fact that he's scum with Ace, who he and VE probably deferring to. Based off that, I don't expect to be able to look at who Forumite is pushing and say "scummy target," but perhaps the logic will be slightly different/lacking. Unsure whether to expect Forumite to be pushing scum's agenda or not. Reading WoF itself : + Show Spoiler +- Lots of questions. However, not in the scummy "I don't care about the answer, I'm asking to be active/look myself" way, but actually following up with the answers he gets, engaging in dialogue.
- Makes lynch preference on Zentor known, continutes referencing Zentor until deadZentor
- Engages other people's cases, but sticks with just Zentor as his case
- Likes to use his questions to mess with town heads. I see you made a case on x, why would x have done this? Sort of halfway pushing his own options, "I am forumite and I want you to think x did this because of ___" but not explicitly (See the VE/Marv stuff for some of this)
- Often times if directly asks about someone, he's either wishy-washy or gives a cursory read. When asked to contribute views on people he isn't aiming at, doesn't really do so. Pestering him about players he's unconcerned with in his own posts may be a good way to discern alignment.
- At least from WoF, scumForumite doesn't seem to build a massive case based on a filter. Only at the end, on Phagga (althought that was the final lynch, so there's more filter to use). Unsure on townForumite's way of building a case, but his Zentor case sort of just looked at 2/3 of what Zentor did and called it scummy, building and building.
Reading current game : + Show Spoiler +- Lots of questions.
- Questions feel...slightly different? Whereas in WoF I see a lot of picking at other people's cases, here he seems to be agreeing, or asking for more, or something slightly different than just "How do you explain this one bit of your case?"
- Engages Mav, his scumread, but feels different than engaging Zentor in WoF. Some of that could be that Zentor did some very scummy things like selfvote off the bat, but he's not grabbing onto everything Mav posts and twisting it to be scummy like he did with Zentor in WoF.
Agree that Forumite has not been involved. Gone most of BKE lynch, no comments on Grush apart from one "he's trolling with that awesome sesame street song and I want to lynch him" bit. No comment on Z-BosoN. However, at points he has commented on random extra stuff - last night's argument and saying he thought it was silly and everyone was town. Your cautiousness section is weaksauce. You posted a very mushy "Forumite is the vet I feel least confident" post/case-ish-thing, then noted that you disliked the cases others made on forumite, while still liking the forumite = scum conclusion. End result - I'm not entirely convinced. He doesn't look great. But while I think he's still doing a lot of questioning and not a lot of his own contribution at this point, the questions feel slightly different. I wish he'd give thoughts on other players, but scumForumite in WoF was picking apart a lot of cases that didn't focus his target. Forumite is not doing that here, he's on Maverick but doesn't really keep poking at other people to try and get them off their cases and onto Maverick. Right now I would not vote for him. However, I'll go read another game or two of his either before day or if I survive. I don't like drawing all my conclusions from (1) a game where he was scum and (2) a mini. Especially for those of us who haven't played with him much, of course he's going to look bad if we only read one scum game and see comments like "Forumite usually helpful" "Forumite usually pushing his reads." I'd like to confirm those thoughts with my own reads of other games.
dude, 3rd party Forumite gets shot n1 in his games because he's too helpful for town while trying to blend in.
Town forumite is helpful for town as well.
Only mafia forumite is doing apeshit.
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On September 10 2012 04:02 austinmcc wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2012 03:58 Toadesstern wrote:
dude, 3rd party Forumite gets shot n1 in his games because he's too helpful for town while trying to blend in.
Town forumite is helpful for town as well.
Only mafia forumite is doing apeshit. Third party forumite got shot for being too helpful in a game where I thought he was scum. That was the first case I made in that game before going nuts about your bandaid. I gave my thoughts on WoF Forumite and this game. Right now I wouldn't vote for Forumite. Reading past town games might change that.
You consider posts like:
On September 06 2012 08:26 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 06 2012 08:01 Maverick32x wrote:
Why am I being casually FoS'ed? I don't think I've ever seen a solid case against me, but I keep seeing people just drop my name into the list as an add-on without any reason?
I find THAT a bit suspicious. Weird, I see what you mean, and I agree. It´s a bad idea to tag you on as a regular suspect at the end of a scumlist. You deserve a top position for your first post on Matt before the Palmar confirmation. That´s a top-grade wishy-washy chainsaw-defence scum post. Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 13:17 Maverick32x wrote:
Hey guys- got a chance to catch up and I have a couple thoughts.
First- Not totally comfortable voting Mattchew at this point.. I understand the potential for lying about the role claim.. and I'm not a big fan of role claiming in general... HOWEVER- I'd like to reiterate BlackMamba's post that said something to the tune of "ITT- Townies arguing with Townies" because I find that people are so quick to blame each other for stupid stuff that we end up wasting the first couple days with literally zero reason for voting someone besides "They drew a picture"....
That being said- I'd like to draw a little bit of attention to the first voter for whom I feel like I can make an actual observation on- Toadesstern.
The reason I want to focus on that is just because of the speed at which he strikes out just makes me wonder why that's beneficial from a town perspective? And I'm just wondering if he just wanted to try to promote chaos right away?? Also- consistently attacking other posters seems to be a trend.... My reads: Maverick32x (Scum)Everyone else (Null) andOn September 07 2012 08:17 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 07:56 Toadesstern wrote:On September 07 2012 07:48 Forumite wrote:
=(
Toades, what do you want most, an answer to the case on me posted during the night, or my top scumreads. It´s late and I´m too tired to do both right now. I don't consider the case on you to be good and I don't agree with it. I want to lynch you because of method or elimination. So I'd rather see you talk about targets for today. I have two scumreads right now. I had Ottox down as scum, I was wrong but it shouldn´t affect the other reads. They are both based on the time around Matts claim. The first one is Maverick for his first post in the game, it was a reaction to Matts claim and the situation around it, and he was basically trying to divert attention to everyone else, without committing to anything. The second one is Hapa for his posts during the same time. The post below sums it up well. Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:32 Hapahauli wrote:On September 04 2012 09:26 Mattchew wrote:On September 04 2012 09:22 Hapahauli wrote:
Yeah I know what the role does, so what about it? I'll ask a question if I don't understand something. there is no information given to the role, it is a VT that (randomly) visits people. If a tracker or watcher see me on their check it could lead to a stupid mislynch Ah thanks for clearing it up. I'm just a bit wary of D1 claims in general after having seen SnB's "self-aware miller" claim in DeathNote Mini Mafia, justified or not. On September 04 2012 09:22 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 09:17 Mattchew wrote:On September 04 2012 09:16 Hapahauli wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. Hold up. Why would we want people with information roles to claim? ##vote hapahauli need an honest answer. What do you consider worse: a) People not thinking while posting / reading b) People defending other people 1 hour into the game when they have no reason to do such a thing and should be happy to see as much posts from the person in question defending himself rather than stopping the discussion defending him. Howabout c) People who pick fights with people who are trying to start conversation (slOosh) for the sake of picking fights? When I read this post at first, I see Hapa buddying up with Matt and throwing suspicion on those attacking him. It didn´t feel right, Matt claiming didn´t arouse any suspicion in him. He said hi to Matt and then chided those attacking him. That´s the ones that jumped out at me when reading the thread. Yes, I should reread all the spam from yesterday, I´ll see about that tomorrow. tl;dr: Hapahauli
Maverick32x
as not cursory?
That's pretty much the only thing he did this game.
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On September 10 2012 05:12 Z-BosoN wrote:
[...]
What's nagging at me, is that you completely shat on hopeless1's case, saying you didn't like cases against vet's in general. Also, in his case, there are some parts where he mentions some of the things you did on his case against forumite. If you were inclined to think that forumite is scum, why didn't you give emphasis to some of those parts?
[...]
I did not completly shat on hopeless1's case saying I didn't like cases against vet's in general.
I said I don't like it that much because it's far-fetched. What I meant with that is that I see some points on foru and I agree with them but I also got some things I completly disagree with in his case as I do not think everything he pointed out is a mafiatrait or scummy at all.
Also about the I don't like cases against vet's in general-phrase as at least 5 people have asked about that by now and it seems no matter how often you guys ask about there's always someone who's still misunderstanding what I said back than.
What I meant was I don't like the cases we've got on foru (or vets in general) so far, saying the cases on vets we've got are not good as they're far-fetched.
I never said or intended it to sound like I don't like cases against vets.
I think I should have made that misunderstanding clear by now but apparently people come back to that all the time and ask me about it...
About other Mafiareads:
Not much right now. We've already got 2 flipped mafias and there're not going to be 191518696 more mafias in this game.
I'm still standing by my point that either Grush or Shady has to be mafia. They're both giving me a hard time and everytime I want to get something going on Grush, Shady gets in the thread saying something that just screams "LYNCH ME" and vice verca.
So I'm kind of having a hard time on those two.
I'm still suspicious of S&B but I don't really want to go into details about him for a reason.
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I think I've seen Shady twice in newbie games and the general idea about his town meta seems to be something along the lines of
"not posting at all, lurking not contributing" so I wouldn't say his play is off meta-based at all.
Yeah it's hearsay because I haven't played with him myself but that's not a reason to lynch him. If it is you would have to say BM is mafia as well while we both seem to agree that BM looks somewhat townish.
Shady looks bad because of posts that just scream "LYNCH ME" like those:
On September 09 2012 01:36 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 01:35 Toadesstern wrote:On September 09 2012 01:32 DarthPunk wrote:On September 09 2012 01:27 Toadesstern wrote:On September 09 2012 01:21 DarthPunk wrote:On September 09 2012 01:15 Toadesstern wrote:
I'm thinking about this claim and I've got to say I don't like lynching BKE right now although I said otherwise an hour ago before thinking this trough.
It just really doesn't make sense right now. The only thing I dislike about BKE's claim is that he claims BM24 was suicide bombed and not BC because I consider BC more likely to be the target, but BM24 being the target isn't out of the ordinary that much.
On top of that with Palmars statement it really could be he's telling the truth and if something like:
Suicide vs BM24
1KP vs BC
1KP vs other vet (myself, maybe Foru or whoever else) or someone being really active (not going to call names here for obvious reasons) who got protected isn't that unlikely at all.
The thing about late switches is they almost always turn out bad because they're not thought through and mafia has an easy time to manipulate. I'm pretty sure that either Shady or Grush is mafia right now and I could see both flipping red (though not both), so we could go for either of those two but as mentioned, those things really go wrong all the time... It Is also bad to potentially mislynch a watcher. I would rather mislynch a VT then a Watcher. If that is the worst consequence from mafia manipulation. So be it. Of course it's bad to lynch a watcher but we can't consider that a reason to not lynch him and have to take both lynching a VT and a Watcher as equally bad. If we don't we're giving mafia the easiest time ever to just get in here "LOL I'm a mad hatter" and everyone insta unvotes because of something that can't be proven at all. That being said I still dislike the BKE lynch right now and would prefere a grush lynch. Hmm I hadn't thought of that. In my last game The scummiest player claimed vig after a vig shot. He was so scummy no one believed him and he was lynched, In the obs QT Marv said that lynching blue claims was something newbies loved to do. I understand your point about all scum making easy claims. But this wagon smells. Grush smells. I skimmed through the thread and alarm bells started blaring in my head. well yeah I agree. I really don't like the situation we're in right now. Lynching BKE sounds really stupid right now and I don't like Grush's attitude at all. I'm going to vote for Grush. I've still got about an hour left before I have to go so let's see what we can do and whether or not it's possible. ##vote Grush Alright, let's get this wagon going. ##Vote Grush
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As mentioned, I got a slight townread on BM and he hasn't started blackmailing town yet. Both tells me that I want him alive :p
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Just a random mention: I get what you're talking about when mentioning what I said about BC and myself and yeah that could be a set-up, didn't think of it that way 
But the other thing you quoted, me telling people to shoot Ottox no matter wether or not you think he'll be taken care of is something I posted 10 seconds prior to the deadline, for a reason. The moment people read that the deadline was already over and I could not have possibly influenced someone. It was just a "if he survives this night you have to lynch him".
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Why are we missing 2 mafia KP Z-Boson? I only remember one:
Ottox got (probably) shot by a townvig
BM24 got (probably) bombed by the suicidebomber
BC got single-stacked by GK according to BKE
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This game is bullshit. How do you go from **vote foru to
On September 10 2012 08:51 Bill Murray wrote:
Forumite's appeal to me to unvote him (though implied) shall be heard at this time.
I will be honoring my word as a man, and voting Shady Sands.
Z-BosoN is town, as is Toad, and possibly Forumite.
This I have decreed.
I have decreed that I will hence forth be known as Toad, the Confused because this is giving me headaches.
Why can't vigs just claim 5secs prior to deadline (that is if what Grush posted is truely the case) like they are supposed to do... Would make things way easier to figure out, especially in a game without notifications.
See you tomorrow... need to reread A LOT
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On September 10 2012 07:58 Forumite wrote:
I get the feeling that scum decided on those nightkills very close to the deadline, since Hapa and austinmcc dropped suspicions on BM, Toades and me right before dying.
About Toades case on me, I´ve been busy and haven´t been putting much effort into the game. Yes, I´m more cautious than my usual meta, which unfortunately puts me closer to how I behaved in Wheel of Fortune Mafia, my scumteam kept a low profile while town lynched eachother, this tactic worked well in that game. There´s not much more to say except that I have some serious rereading to do.
Are you claiming blue or are you claiming third party here?
Might as well get over it if you post like that 8(
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On September 10 2012 10:11 Z-BosoN wrote:
Because he would have killed austin N1!!!!!
Confirmed blue role >>>>> vet townie
Why should he?
In PTP3 Matt was not just a 2-shot vig but a confirmed INFINITE-vig and everyone knew it. Mafia let him alive because he was wrong with what he said and Matt ended up killing a shitton of townies not targeting a single mafia for the whole game. The only mafia he killed was when someone used "confusion" against him which redirected his vig-shot to someone random and the hosts /rnd-25 hit a mafia n1.
There's no reason to kill a townvig from a mafia PoV, especially if he's wrong with what he's saying/thinking, that is if he was wrong.
That's an incredible easy judgement to do.
Also as someone said otherwise: there's no reason to not claim vig prior to deadline if you are one.
If you hit mafia you are instantly confirmed town and that's more helpful than a 2nd hit that may or may not hit another mafia.
If you hit town mafia will leave you alive, won't RB you and will just play the wifom "why is he still alive" game while you keep on shooting townies.
The fact that Austin did not claim is quite troublesome to be honest... I checked his filter and I wasn't able to find a breadcrumb for n2 either, so no idea if he shot while that information could possible give us an almost confirmed mafia right now....
Haven't checked for his n1 posts yet but I'll do that later and if I or someone else can find something there we're probably best to assume that he did not shoot n2.
If nothing is to be found it's just a null.
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yay you're awake at 7am as well? \o/
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On September 11 2012 00:23 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2012 21:58 Forumite wrote:
I haven´t read the last few pages.
What I get from rereading the Matt situation is that Z-boson looks very bad. He was avoiding talking about Matt except to softdefend and provides distraction cases until several people had all voted Matt. He then says he´s voting Matt but doesn´t while, providing a very wishy-washy reason for the vote.
##Vote: Z-boson This shows that Forumite doesn't care about the game. This is his very first mention of Z-boson, he is picking a target that is easy to hop onto, the reasons for scuminness could have been cited D2 but never were and he was not present for any of the discussion concerning him D2. Furthermore, he has not even drawn anything from the discussion as the only behavior he mentions is from D1. Couple this with several more instances of him not reading and general apathy to the game, appearing only when people start suspecting him. ##Vote: Forumite
but than again he is right that Z-Boson looks bad.
Why can't I be the Joker in a game like this
Just shoot em all.
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Let's be honest here:
I think if we lynch into one of either Forumite, S&B, BM or Z-Boson we're going to hit "not-townie" all the way.
That's the reason I didn't want to talk about S&B because I suspected him to be an Assassin (you're welcome \o/ ).
If BM is Mafia Foru's got to be an Assassin (again, you're welcome \o/ ) and isn't actually mafia himself.
Foru basicly claimed he's playing cautious on purpose so that fits the Assassin as well.
Z-Boson and BM have some weird connection this day.
I really don't like how Boson gets in here telling people BM is confirmed because of the blue thing, on top of that he instantly finds another breadcrumb BM apparently did and the knowledge BM had about austin is supposed to make him somehow town when there's no way mafia would have shot a vig n1, even if they knew about one.
So if you take them all apart I'd be all up for lynching Forumite today.
If we're considering them as a whole I'd rather lynch Z-Boson.
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Mmmh going to vote Forumite. He's the least likely to flip town out of the 4 people I mentioned.
The drawback is that he could really flip Assassin... while someone like Z-Boson is either going to flip mafia or town and it's more likely to be a mafia flip. But unlike Forumite he has a somewhat realistic offchance to somehow flip town.
On top of that the big issues I've got with Z-Boson and BM are all because of what happened today with that blue BM apparently figured out and I think I'm seeing connections there.
I like lynching into people when I see connections but pretty much every other vet tells me not to do it because it could be anything I'm seeing.
That being said the case on Forumite is the strongest on itself if we ignore the "what if X is mafia" arguments.
##Vote: Forumite
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EPT
