EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XXII - Page 67
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25551 Posts
On August 10 2012 06:59 JingleHell wrote: Especially since I showed up and everyone was happy to see me after XXI. Where I played EXACTLY that way. When I did it here, it was scummy. And everything subsequent that I did was scummy. Including making cases against both of the remaining scum after Zork. That's seriously scummy behavior. As is breathing, using punctuation, speaking English, and tickling Elmo. I get that. I get that it was annoying. But resorting to insulting people can ONLY make your situation worse. | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
On August 10 2012 07:08 Blazinghand wrote: Yeah, from what I hear, if people are against you, verbally lambasting them and insulting them repeatedly is the easiest way to convince them to join your side. When I have a disagreement with my father, for example, I just start calling him a moron, and it solves the problem. To be fair, I tried reasoning with them first. But when I realized that they were going to interpret anything and everything I said as scummy, I gave up. I thought I did a fair job keeping my temper in check. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25551 Posts
On August 10 2012 07:10 JingleHell wrote: To be fair, I tried reasoning with them first. But when I realized that they were going to interpret anything and everything I said as scummy, I gave up. I thought I did a fair job keeping my temper in check. The part where you stopped trying to reason and started insulting is the part where you stopped seriously trying to win with all the resources at your disposal. | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
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Keirathi
United States4679 Posts
 My main motivation for writing that Will was because I knew Shady was going to be taking a lot of pressure if I died, and I *FULLY* expected to be shot night1 if Promethelax was scum.So my bias ended up working out in the end since I did give Shady a clear claim, but for the wrong reasons. @Golbat: Not really much to say here. I think you leaned a lot from this game that you can carry over into your subsequent games. Sorry we lynched you so early! @Mordanis: I still don't get the point of you pushing that I wasn't blue, although maybe that is the reason that the Medic and Scum both targetted me. Your post-day1 reads were solid overall though. It's too bad you couldn't overcome the suspicions on you from day1 and had to play with your back against the wall for the rest of the game. @Shady: Stepped up when it counted. It was interesting to see your progression in mentality from day2, up until the end. Blazing really did a good job of coaching you, and I'm glad you listened and took his advice to heart. Your play dramatically improved once you did. @Ange777: Good fucking game. There's really not much more to say. The crumbs were excellent, you made a clutch save, you caught the Zork slip, and were a big proponent in all 3 scum lynches. I feel sorry for any scum team that has to play against you if they let you live. @GoodKarma: I kind of tunneled you a bit because of your day 1 play, and I apologize. I just want to note that it IS possible to get solid reads on day 1. I think that was the big thing I took offense with. Solid play for the rest of the game, though. My only real suggestion would be to be more active. @Obvious.660: Not really a whole lot to comment here either. I thought you were scum early on. Being more active could have helped you feel more townie, but I understand you were going though RL things. @JingleHell: Meh. Good cases, bad execution. You played like you were a confirmed townie and that your cases should be 100% taken at face value and got angry when they were turned back towards you. I think everyone in the Obs QT thought you were scum at one point or another, so it wasn't just the people in the thread questioning your motives. @aRyuujin: I honestly liked the haikus at first, but eventually they started to obfuscate your thoughts because of the forced sentence structure. Your willingness to stop once I asked was a plus, though. You kind of came out of nowhere to push the DP case, which was good timing, but it definitely could have backfired on you just because you weren't more active for the rest of the game. @Promethelax: Sorry you couldn't be more active. Please FOR THE LOVE OF GOD quit saying town multiple times per post. Other than that, I think you played similarly enough to your scum meta to make you suspicious, but your cases were different enough (read: actually good, not pants-on-head retarded) that I was leaning town on you by the time of your lynch and I couldn't do anything to stop it @Zorkmid: Gotta be wiling to get bussed. DP said in Obs QT that your goal with the medic claim was to draw the real medic out: if you wanted to do that, you really needed to try harder. Your claim lacked enough evidence or passion for anyone to take it at face value, I think. @DarthPunk: Man you had me 100% fooled, at least until the Zork wagon got rolling. Literally my last words to Shady before I died were "Strong town read on Darth". Good job overall, just a series of unfortunate events led to your lynch and eventual loss. Good game, though. @alan133: People have said it already, but reading through the scum QT was enlightening. You really have a good mind for how to fluently manipulate the situation to your advantage. One or two small things happening another way and you would have easily carried this game to a scum win. Good job, and I sincerely hope that this isn't your last game. | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
 @Marv: Hell yeah was I frustrated! >_< )I was really excited to roll my first blue roll  I thought about bread crumbing my role but decided to go for the nightsaves instead. I was kind of scared that they would be too obvious and be spotted by scum ^^ Are there any other good ways to bread crumb blue roles? After the day 1 lynch I actually only had one town read I was confident enough and that was Kei. Maybe it was good that the Vig was dead because previous to the day 1 flip I was afraid that I might save the wrong guys (who might even be targetted by the Vig). Night 2 I could not save Kei again so I went with my second best town read goodkarma. Night 3 Shady was already confirmed town. I was not that impressed by his play at that point as he was just often inactive and I felt that he didn't contribute that much. Considering the fact that scum might think that the medic will save Shady, I went for my next best town read Obvious. Night 4 I thought for sure that they are going to nightkill Shady or me. It would be suicidal to try to get to LYLO with both of us. So I saved Shady. I really wanted to get another night save but was always outwitted :D I think if it had not been for that "Zorktanic" we really would have had a hard time to win this game. In the beginning I also had a slight town read on DarthPunk but after all the discussion it got pretty obvious to me. I must say that I was really impressed by DarthPunk for trying to talk himself out of his lynch. He tried and tried and never gave up. One thing I'd like to ask the others: What did you think of Jingle's case against me? I felt like no one understood my frustration with a case that was basically pressuring me for answers that were all in my filter. Or was I just biased? Going to read the Scum QT now | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
10/10 play for you though. Really stunning. Edit: was just flicking through the ban thread. what's this nonsense talk of a warning/ban for Jingle? stop it whoever. | ||
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DarthPunk
Australia10857 Posts
Golbat: I think that your mislynch was purely down to your indecisiveness in regards to Mordanis. If you are goign to make a vote make sure that you are at least confident enough to not unvote as soon as someone questions you. Overall you seemed nice and I was sorry to see you go. Mordanis: <3 you were really useful to me this game as my go to scum read. Sorry for tunnelling you but there was always something I could spin. Your reads and thoughts in the qt were a huge improvement from what I saw in the game. Shady: Gah you were the second most frustrating person this game. Twice it came down to you to simply not switch your vote. With Zork and with me. but you made the right call every time. Well done. Ange777: You came out of nowhere to carry this game on your back! Easily the best player from zork onwards, but I really didn't view you as a threat before that. I think that the more sure you are in your reads the better you are at arguing them. I will be very wary of you as scum in the future. (maybe policy NK?) GoodKarma: You were frustrating for refusing to lynch Mordanis. And then the complete opposite when you were the only player to see my arguments my way. I wish you had been more vocal day 4 maybe then I could have got out of my lynch. Obvious.660: I would be really interested to hear what the reason was that you changed your mind on me. You had some correct reads early but your conclusions didn't really come out that way. If you thought alan and I were scum you should have pushed it with a good argument. JingleHell: Your attitude doesn't do you any favors. Although you knew what I was up to when I foolishly tried to defend you If I had just left you be, you would have earned us a mislynch with no effort on our part. You have good reads and ideas but the way you present them actually reduces their value. aRyuujin: Hey buddy . If it wasn't for ange777 I think I could have turned that lynch around onto you instead. Nevertheless It was great that you became active and I enjoyed arguing with you! Promethelax: You seem really nice and I look forward to rolling town with you in the Future! Sorry for mislynching you. You should read the scum QT where we plan it out, we are all super worried haha. We thought you were the doctor (which in our eyes was confirmed when you said there was a reason for buddying Keir) and we were all really nervous about actively trying to snipe you with a mislynch. I don't think there was enough to lynch you on and if town were playing that day as they played later it would have been different I think. Keirathi we thought you had a power role and so your NK was a snipe. I thought it was almost confirmed when you were saved. Because not only did I read you as a blue a Townie did. Turns out that was not the case. Early on you were well reasoned and slow to jump on bandwagons and thus were a dangerous player. Zorkmid: Zork, I think we collectively made bad decisions, It's not your fault we lost. Alan and I should have bussed you night 2 as soon as we saw that slip. Oh Well. I think alot of the miscommunication (not being in the QT that often) came from Malaysia (alan) and Australia (me) being such different Time zones from yours. alan: You are really good at this game. It's unfortunate you had such incompetent scum buddies and ange to deal with. You are really smart and were essentially my scum coach this game. GG <3 | ||
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Shady Sands
United States4021 Posts
Golbat: Sorry. We messed up on you, but you made yourself a really easy target, too. A valuable lesson. Mordanis: Was fun playing with you. Sorry about pushing for the lynch, but eventually figured out that you weren't scum because no one was really coordinating with your points. Darthpunk: Sorry that I'm frustrating lol =). The Zork lynch boiled down the fact that Ange's arguments made sense, while yours and Alan's didn't. Your lynch boiled down to a rather big mistake from you in defending Jingle (and not bussing him.) In all honesty, I'm not that great of a player, I just got lucky with scumslips. Ange777: Wow. You are awesome. If I ever go to Germany I am definitely treating you to a nice dinner or something because play this good deserves a reward. GoodKarma, Obvious, aRyuujin: You, Obvious, and aRyuujin I don't have as strong an impression of, but I enjoyed playing with all three of you. You guys worked hard. Let's do this again sometime. As for aRyuujin specifically, I think you laid out a great defense of why you weren't scum even though you were on the Mordanis train. Definitely a post that I'll bookmark for my future play. JingleHell: Sorry this game wasn't as enjoyable for you as it was for the rest of us. Your play was honestly frustrating to interpret, since the more angry you became, the more convinced I was that you were putting on an act to cover up any potential scumslips. This probably put us into a negative cycle, which I'll be sure to avoid in the future. A valuable lesson all around. Promethelax: Honestly, Keir scared the shit out of me in the Mason thread, which is why I tunneled you so hard on D2. I was actually leaning Zork/Obvious (hindsight is 20/20, I know) but Keir's warnings + your whole "trusted townie" circle just put our scum-meters into red alert. Sorry. Zorkmid: Zork, no offense, but you were probably the weak link in the scum chain (just as I was the weak link in the town chain). I look forward to watching us improve together. alan: You're really good at this, I can tell. The existence of a medic kind of made things wierd regarding analyzing you, because your play fit the blue role perfectly. In retrospect, the fact that scum hadn't sniped you yet should have set off alarm bells in my head. Good play nonetheless. Keirathi: Buddy! Thanks so much for putting up with me. I'm sorry to make you do that. You are 10x a better player at this game, and you gave me tons of tips early on in the game. Blazinghand: Thanks so much. You are the best coach ever, and had it not been for your coaching, I don't think I could have contributed to town in much of a meaningful way. Keep it up. You've inspired me to keep learning this game, and I have no doubts you will inspire others to do the same! | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Also, the scariest part of the entire game was Shady's statement that if GK flipped scum, Ange or anyone else could also be scum. Ignoring the fact that I don't think it would make sense in any situation, it was saying there were still multiple scum left in the game. I'm was afraid the entire game would enravel... | ||
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Shady Sands
United States4021 Posts
On August 10 2012 13:02 Mordanis wrote: I still think the biggest scum-slip of the entire game was the way that Alan got pissed off at Zork for scum-slipping. I would have pushed that a lot harder... Also, the scariest part of the entire game was Shady's statement that if GK flipped scum, Ange or anyone else could also be scum. Ignoring the fact that I don't think it would make sense in any situation, it was saying there were still multiple scum left in the game. I'm was afraid the entire game would enravel... Hah, I mean that if we thought GK was scum, the same logic would also make Ange or anyone else scum too. Sorry, bad wording on my part | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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DarthPunk
Australia10857 Posts
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
If you guys are talking about the above post by Alan (re: pissed off at Zorkmid's scumslip), I think it was a pretty big scumslip. This is what convinced me Alan was mafia in the obs QT. Look at the context: first he attacks Ange's case on Zorkmid... then he calls out Zorkmid for scummy play? There is literally no townie motivation behind this. | ||
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Golbat
United States499 Posts
I did learn a lot about how to play, and I'll try to bring those lessons into futures games that I play. <3 u guise | ||
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goodkarma
United States1067 Posts
. This was a very fun game. I can only hope that NMM XXIII is just as epic .A quick couple questions: Where can these qts be found? I can't seem to find the mafia qt... And can we now see the other qts too (such as the obs qt), now that the game is finished? Also: @aRyuujin: I was not trying to "pick on" you. I was looking for more activity from you, which you didn't really deliver until your (well-made) Darthpunk case. But I was also looking for inconsistencies in play, so when you did what I encouraged you to do, and started actively posting, you also looked suspicious. I admit I put you in a bit of an impossible situation. Hopefully you can understand I was just trying to go with my reads and won't take it personally. | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=353315¤tpage=65#1295 | ||
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Mr. Wiggles
Canada5894 Posts
On August 10 2012 07:04 Hopeless1der wrote: Under no circumstances can tickling Elmo be WIFOM'd into scum behavior. Elmo is red. If you tickle him, his redness rubs off on you. Now you are also red. Red is the colour of mafia. If you are the colour of mafia, you are mafia. Therefore, if you tickle Elmo, you are mafia. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://2media.nowpublic.net/images//24/cb/24cb2c6e4dbe01438707ffc459add689.jpg) | ||
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