EPTI'd still like to hear the cases promised by RoL and Meapak before we opt to end things early. If you couldn't no-lynch, are you still thinking Meapak bum?
Responsibility Mafia! - Page 60
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
I'd still like to hear the cases promised by RoL and Meapak before we opt to end things early. If you couldn't no-lynch, are you still thinking Meapak bum? | ||
Ver
United States2186 Posts
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bumatlarge
United States4567 Posts
On January 04 2012 13:25 kitaman27 wrote: It wouldn't hurt. Maybe mafia has a limited number of shots on their roleblocker or something -_- I'd still like to hear the cases promised by RoL and Meapak before we opt to end things early. If you couldn't no-lynch, are you still thinking Meapak bum? By a hair, yes. But I'm feeling sway-able -_- | ||
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
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Meapak_Ziphh
United States6786 Posts
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Meapak_Ziphh
United States6786 Posts
 Kita...Also for those waiting for my RoL analysis, it's on hold until I figure out the hits in a way that's satisfactory to me. At the moment I haven't found a scenario where RoL is scum and the hits line up. If it's not RoL my next best bet would be Bum except that my town oracle (foolishness's filter) called him town :/ | ||
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Meapak_Ziphh
United States6786 Posts
So the final mafia is kita. Right off the bat he starts putting soft pressure on Sheth. Super easy target this is like Sheth’s second game, it’s not gonna be hard at all to get a ball rolling against him if you want to. He also brings really soft pressure against Foolishness, BC, and his favorite target of Sheth who he has mentioned three times out of seven posts. Here is the quote: On December 22 2011 00:24 kitaman27 wrote: Foolishness trolling -_- Apparently we're not allowed to touch him because he is too good? I haven't seen any attempt from him to establish himself as a pro-town player. Where is the effort? :/ I find it strange that BC comes in and tells Palmar to step up his game considering he only has one post, while complaining about him discussing neutral topics. He just finished spending three paragraphs describing why RNG is worse than analysis. Of course it is. I was worried Palmar not really pushing his influence on the lynch at first, but he seems to have picked things up. chaoser, would you mind explaining what you think GM is doing? And, GM what are you doing? Finally..... ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xTYrk.jpg) On the surface this is just calling for more activity, however the way it’s done is very fishy. Rather than actively call out these players, he vaguely mentions that they need to post more and does so in a manner that tries to take influence away from them. By this I mean he’s speaking in dismissive terms such as “Apparently we're not allowed to touch him because he is too good” (about foolishness) and “He just finished spending three paragraphs describing why RNG is worse than analysis. Of course it is.” (about BC). Here’s the thing about this post, a townie doesn’t need to subtly take shots, a townie just wants people to post. Also, this whole thing wouldn’t be as significant except that both BC and foolishness flipped town. In that light this looks a lot like a mafia attempt to discreetly discredit two very strong players. In his subsequent posts he continues to call out BC, and Foolishness and Sheth. This pattern continues for the rest of the day until we get to the lynch. At this point, Kita keeps his wording vague. Using phrases such as “I'm leaning scum on GM and uncertain/null on LSB” Kita keeps his reads very muddy and uncertain. If either GM or LSB are lynched and flip town then you certainly aren’t going to be able to associate it with him. This is important in two ways, one because mafia never want to be in the center of attention, and the other is to distance himself from WBG who is one of the pilots of the day one lynch. Kita first votes for GM saying “I know it may look like an OMGUS, but this really isn't the GM town play that I'm used to, so that is where my vote is going for the moment.” With this enourmous vote of confidence (sarcasm) kita finishes this post by once again asking people if they would like to lynch foolishness. With 20 minutes left in the day, kita completes his distancing of himself from a lynch that would have killed a townie either way and votes for foolishness. In his post lynch thoughts, kita comes up with this gem “Chezinu or Foolishness obviously wasn't going to get lynched” -_- dot dot dot, guess who had his vote on foolishness at the end of the day. He then bashes RoL for putting a placeholder vote on chez but if he’s angry about worthless votes then there’s someone a lot closer to home who needs some attention  Now we’re on to the next day, you’d think we’d be ready to hear more about foolishness however Kita punts on this one, “Looking back at his [foolishness’s] past games on day one, they all seem pretty similar, with minimal posting and a bit of trolling regardless of alignment. I'm still learning scum on him based on his general attitude and would probably be willing to lynch him today, but I'm having trouble coming up with a strong case against him from the current set of posts. As for his case against bugs, I'm leaning town on bugs at the moment. “ This is just terrible. Not only do we have continued shots at foolishness’s credibility, we also have kita calling WBG likely town after the LSB debacle. It’s actually not so much the lynch itself that kita is defending WBG against, it’s foolishness’s accusations which have a history of being chillingly accurate. This is actually a pretty big deal right here. Foolishness was a huge threat to the scum team this game, he nailed half of it. Kita has spent the entire game trying to discredit him and here he is directly defending a confirmed scum, and not only that, a scum that foolishness named. The rest of that post is devoted to analyzing prplhz, of which he does a terrible job. One of his points is that prplhz called BC scum but didn’t back up his accusation. This is deliciously ironic. Not only did prplhz do an analysis on someone kita thought was scummy (something kita never did), he accuses prplhz of doing exactly what he did, which was call foolishness and BC scummy and then not vote for them (at least not until 20 minutes to then deadline when it didn’t matter anyway). I just have to quote this next post because of how hypocritical it is: On December 24 2011 23:36 kitaman27 wrote: What exactly has he done so far that "looks exactly like his town play"? Could you be more specific? As for BC, what makes him different than another lurker, say GGQ? So syllo (who is scum) shoots down his idea of lynching prplhz. He then suggests that he’d like to lynch a lurker and BC would be his number one choice. What does kita say? If you all guessed “he says yeah I’ve been calling BC scummy all game long let’s do it” you’re wrong. Instead he says “lol wut about GGQ.” -_-. Here’s what I think happened. Kita isn’t agreeing with syllo just to be on the safe side and it doesn’t appear that they are buddying. Kita read syllo’s post and decided to just deflect the topic about BC so he doesn’t get associated with syllo. This is the only explanation I can think of. A townie who hears someone agree with them generally goes “yeah me too, let’s look into it” a townie doesn’t know the alignment of who they’re talking to, all they know is that someone else thinks they’re right so why not explore this option. But Kita doesn’t do this. He instead casually distances himself with syllo by not fully engaging him. After this debacle kita makes two posts in a row where all he does is ask questions. Then he votes for BC for these reasons: On December 27 2011 13:55 kitaman27 wrote: You're always here for me bum. Really bad reasoning on the vig shot and no evidence that he cares about the town. ##Vote: BloodyC0bbler Let's see if anyone else is willing to hammer. Seriously? He just flat out says that BC made the vig shot. Nothing like “oh he’s lying about the vigi shot, he’s only mentioning it now because it seems like a safe claim.” No arguments like that. Instead he’s gonna lynch him because he made a bad vig shot. That’s just plain pants on head retarded if you’re town, kita admits in his post that BC made the shot sooooo doesn’t that make him a confirmed townie? No one cc’d him. It’s just poor reasoning. A better argument against BC would have been that he’s lying about the vigi shot because that would at least mean there’s a possibility of being BC being scum. However from a scum perspective this slip actually makes sense. Kita knows that BC made the shot and he can truthfully say that it was a stupid shot. He’s forgotten along the way however is that a) BC could be lying about the shot and b) if he’s not then the shot is confirmed. So as a tl;dr there are two problems with his reasoning. One is that he’s attacking BC from a non townie angle. The second is that if he does accept that BC is telling the truth (which according to his post he did) then he’s blatantly voting for someone who is confirmed (at least according to his logic). This next post is really important: On December 28 2011 14:03 kitaman27 wrote: Current Reads: Probable scum team: Foolishness- Not relevant in either the day one or day two lynch. Brings up a single case, but doesn't push it at all. BC- Bad reasoning for the vig shot. Nearly all of his discission has been based on his vig shot, rather than talking about who he suspects as scum. prplhz- See previous post. L- Seems to be discussing a lot of things that aren't very relevant distracting town. Hasn't given us any solid analysis. If not in the top four, the remaining are likely here (I know this is practically the rest of the town but activity has been really awful) Liquid`Sheth syllo Mr.Wiggles GGQ RoL Chezinu Look at his scum team. He’s got his favorite targets of the entire game, but look who else made the list (drum roll fanfare) L! now other than a briefly directed question, Kita has never called out L at all. This is an extremely random scum suspect. What is the motivation for putting L here? I admit that I don’t know how kita thinks, but my bet would be that he felt like he should put one mafia on his list to make it more believable. It’s the same reason syllo made his secondary list. The thing is, none of the town know that L is mafia so putting him there really serves no purpose except it plays into the inherent guilt of scum. It doesn’t matter that we don’t know L is scum, kita knows and in a subconscious attempt to make his list more believable he’ll put in L. It also gives L (and to a lesser extent syllo) something to go back to and quote if Kita gets killed at some point. His next post is defending himself against Sheth. No offense to sheth but his analysis was pretty bad and kita has no trouble knocking it down. However at the very end he promises to write up something on L, how tantalizing… Next up is Kita’s current claim to town fame, his lynch on L. Here’s the thing, he’s not actually the first person to go after L on day 3. Bum is actually the first person to call out L with his very first post of the day. Kita isn’t even the second person to mention L as possible scum, prplhz, and RoL call L scum. Even Syllo beats around the bush saying that “In terms of balance L is probably scum but I don’t think we should kill him today” (paraphrase( and this is the main reason why I killed syllo for posterity sake)). The pressure on L doesn’t stop there, Bum continues to call him out going so far as to flat out say that L is scum. Keep in mind, this has all happened before kita does his analysis on L. Even Sheth manages to call L mafia and since Chez was absent, that’s every player in the game who is not L or Kita who has called L scum or at least hinted at it on day 3. Bum starts the voting on L, everyone in the game has called L scum at least once except for kita. If I’m in the scum QT, it’s pretty obvious from reading the thread that L is lost. It might be possible to force a mislynch but doing so would expose the entire scum team and even though it’s LYLO, there probably aren’t enough role blockers to prevent vigis from destroying you. Your best course of action at this time is to sacrifice L, and better yet, have one of your cleaner member become a key element. This is where Kita comes in. He’s the heroic second vote on L and with a flawless analysis to boot. But of course it’s flawless, L is scum and might have even helped Kita write it, and while Kita may be the second vote on L, he’s the last person to call him scum. Now look at L’s posting. Look who his scum team is. Bum, RoL, and Kita. L knows which way he’s going to flip, why not throw kita’s name in there to give him a little extra town cred as L makes his exit. The rest of the day is pretty boring. Everyone already thinks L is scum, it’s just a matter of people coming around and Syllo desperately trying to cover his ass. L makes a lot of noise and manages to call Kita scum a few more times. So what now? Kita and syllo are on their own. they’ve got a role block and a hit. Who do you hit? The person who is confirmed townie by shooting scum: prplhz. Who do you role block? The only person who’s called kita scum: Sheth. At this point kita and syllo are in good shape. Syllo has never been called out and tomorrow they can probably force a mislynch of Sheth without being obvious thus winning them the game. However I shoot syllo. Suddenly kita is in a jam. Why? Because at this point everyone knows that everyone is a vig. I’ve used my shot, RoL has used his shot, Bum, Sheth, and Kita haven’t used theirs. But as mafia, Kita can’t spare a shot to prove he’s a vig, not having a shot is a HUGE liability. But he got lucky that I shot syllo. It gives him a free out. And since mafia knows the blue role rules he knows he can safely say he lost his shot. Since everyone has claimed at this point except for me and sheth, kita has a wide variety of claims he can make because LSB and GM already proved that multiple of the same role can exist in the game. Kita doesn’t deviate from what I’m assuming the mafia’s plan was. Everyone is suspicious of Sheth so he gets that started. It makes a lot of sense. Sheth played poorly and at this point Kita just wants people dead. With new years and all, the rest of us don’t really complain, probably just hoping sheth is the last scum to avoid a situation like this one we’re in. The case is an easy one an everyone derps along (myself included :/). So Kita got the mislynch. But he can’t kill anyone at night. Regardless of who he kills, attention will come back to him. He could kill Bum, but Bum’s pegged Kita for a townie, same with RoL. If he kills me, when I flip town people will suddenly take a much harder look at his vigi claim. At this point, his safest bet is actually to role block bum and then take the risk of facing three players at MYLO rather than two at LYLO. ##Vote Kitaman27 | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On January 04 2012 13:06 bumatlarge wrote: Oh meapak, that's heart warming. Shame I'm the only one with a shot left, and mafia has a roleblocker. KITAMAN, YOU SHALL BE PURGED. NO MERE ROLEBLOCK CAN STOP MY WRATH. And guys, no lynch right? I mean, this might just a test in order to see if scum can increase his chances, but it might be that he cannot kill anyone? Then we get two lynches? I mean it's really stretching, but there is no reason not to wait. Ver is a cruel dude sometimes, but he isn't bill murray (Cue 2nd no-lynch gives mafia 2 KP). We still have a lot of cycles to go through. Meh, maybe to give scum time to figure out what he isn't doing  Can we opt to end the day early? I want to point out just how convenient this is. You are the only one with a shot left, which means you are going to keep getting "RBed" even if we no lynch today. So we can never disprove your claim. | ||
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
After reading your analysis Meapak, I really feel as if you had come to a conclusion before making the post. Here is my response: On January 04 2012 17:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Right off the bat he starts putting soft pressure on Sheth. Super easy target this is like Sheth’s second game, it’s not gonna be hard at all to get a ball rolling against him if you want to. That is how I start 75% of my games. I pick the newest player in the thread, vote for him, and pressure him into slipping up. I was hosting election mafia at the same time that Sheth was playing and he was actively posting in that game. In addition, he was streaming, but repeatedly mentioning that he was too sick to post. Did you take the time to read through Sheth's posts at the time I was bringing him up? This was not scum motivated. On January 04 2012 17:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: In his subsequent posts he continues to call out BC, and Foolishness and Sheth. This pattern continues for the rest of the day until we get to the lynch. At this point, Kita keeps his wording vague. Using phrases such as “I'm leaning scum on GM and uncertain/null on LSB” Kita keeps his reads very muddy and uncertain. If either GM or LSB are lynched and flip town then you certainly aren’t going to be able to associate it with him. This is important in two ways, one because mafia never want to be in the center of attention, and the other is to distance himself from WBG who is one of the pilots of the day one lynch. Kita first votes for GM saying “I know it may look like an OMGUS, but this really isn't the GM town play that I'm used to, so that is where my vote is going for the moment.” With this enourmous vote of confidence (sarcasm) kita finishes this post by once again asking people if they would like to lynch foolishness. With 20 minutes left in the day, kita completes his distancing of himself from a lynch that would have killed a townie either way and votes for foolishness. In his post lynch thoughts, kita comes up with this gem “Chezinu or Foolishness obviously wasn't going to get lynched” -_- dot dot dot, guess who had his vote on foolishness at the end of the day. He then bashes RoL for putting a placeholder vote on chez but if he’s angry about worthless votes then there’s someone a lot closer to home who needs some attention Umm...Meapak? Have you read through day one? The reason the vote was switched to Foolishness was because LSB and GM had just counter-claimed each other has vig late into the night. I explained what I thought would be the best vig plan and moved my vote off the blue claim. I wasn't distancing myself, it was a blue claim. There is a big difference between the placeholder votes and what I did. My vote was moved 20 minutes before the lynch after I felt a no-lynch was the best option. It's not like I expected him to get a majority on him with so little time left. RoL never even commented on the LSB/GM situation, which was why I brought it up. On January 04 2012 17:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Now we’re on to the next day, you’d think we’d be ready to hear more about foolishness however Kita punts on this one, “Looking back at his [foolishness’s] past games on day one, they all seem pretty similar, with minimal posting and a bit of trolling regardless of alignment. I'm still learning scum on him based on his general attitude and would probably be willing to lynch him today, but I'm having trouble coming up with a strong case against him from the current set of posts. As for his case against bugs, I'm leaning town on bugs at the moment. “ This is just terrible. Not only do we have continued shots at foolishness’s credibility, we also have kita calling WBG likely town after the LSB debacle. It’s actually not so much the lynch itself that kita is defending WBG against, it’s foolishness’s accusations which have a history of being chillingly accurate. This is actually a pretty big deal right here. Foolishness was a huge threat to the scum team this game, he nailed half of it. Kita has spent the entire game trying to discredit him and here he is directly defending a confirmed scum, and not only that, a scum that foolishness named. Yep, I was wrong about Foolishness/bugs, but that doesn't make me scum. Every player that is alive was wrong on day one and day two. At least I started generating results on day three/night three. On December 24 2011 23:36 kitaman27 wrote: What exactly has he done so far that "looks exactly like his town play"? Could you be more specific? As for BC, what makes him different than another lurker, say GGQ? On January 04 2012 17:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: So syllo (who is scum) shoots down his idea of lynching prplhz. He then suggests that he’d like to lynch a lurker and BC would be his number one choice. What does kita say? If you all guessed “he says yeah I’ve been calling BC scummy all game long let’s do it” you’re wrong. Instead he says “lol wut about GGQ.” -_-. Here’s what I think happened. Kita isn’t agreeing with syllo just to be on the safe side and it doesn’t appear that they are buddying. Kita read syllo’s post and decided to just deflect the topic about BC so he doesn’t get associated with syllo. This is the only explanation I can think of. A townie who hears someone agree with them generally goes “yeah me too, let’s look into it” a townie doesn’t know the alignment of who they’re talking to, all they know is that someone else thinks they’re right so why not explore this option. But Kita doesn’t do this. He instead casually distances himself with syllo by not fully engaging him. You're looking at this completely the wrong way. Syllo at this point has been extremely conservative in giving us any of his reads. He mentions his number one read is BC and I'm pushing him to provide support or a case. How am I distancing myself when I vote for BC hours later? On January 04 2012 17:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Seriously? He just flat out says that BC made the vig shot. Nothing like “oh he’s lying about the vigi shot, he’s only mentioning it now because it seems like a safe claim.” No arguments like that. Instead he’s gonna lynch him because he made a bad vig shot. That’s just plain pants on head retarded if you’re town, kita admits in his post that BC made the shot sooooo doesn’t that make him a confirmed townie? No one cc’d him. It’s just poor reasoning. A better argument against BC would have been that he’s lying about the vigi shot because that would at least mean there’s a possibility of being BC being scum. However from a scum perspective this slip actually makes sense. Kita knows that BC made the shot and he can truthfully say that it was a stupid shot. He’s forgotten along the way however is that a) BC could be lying about the shot and b) if he’s not then the shot is confirmed. So as a tl;dr there are two problems with his reasoning. One is that he’s attacking BC from a non townie angle. The second is that if he does accept that BC is telling the truth (which according to his post he did) then he’s blatantly voting for someone who is confirmed (at least according to his logic). This doesn't make sense. I'm scum because I have knowledge that BC shot GM? BC claimed shooting GM and there was no counter-claim. Nobody was disagreeing with this fact. Who else would have shot him? It was a bad shot because GM had blue claimed suicide vig and BC's reasoning for shooting him was that he would be continuously roleblocked. Why would BC be "confirmed"? There was no evidence at day two that all vig's are town, nor is there now. Earlier you mention how I'm trying to dodge the LSB mislynch, yet here I'm the 9th vote on the BC mislynch, requiring only one more hammer vote. On January 04 2012 17:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Look at his scum team. He’s got his favorite targets of the entire game, but look who else made the list (drum roll fanfare) L! now other than a briefly directed question, Kita has never called out L at all. This is an extremely random scum suspect. What is the motivation for putting L here? I admit that I don’t know how kita thinks, but my bet would be that he felt like he should put one mafia on his list to make it more believable. It’s the same reason syllo made his secondary list. The thing is, none of the town know that L is mafia so putting him there really serves no purpose except it plays into the inherent guilt of scum. It doesn’t matter that we don’t know L is scum, kita knows and in a subconscious attempt to make his list more believable he’ll put in L. It also gives L (and to a lesser extent syllo) something to go back to and quote if Kita gets killed at some point. At this point RoL had already claimed his vig shot on BC. In addition, it is extremely likely that scum shot Foolishness for his bugs analysis. So here I am, posting my scum list with two players there are about to flip town 5 minutes later. That makes me look great. As for you mentioning that I've never called out L, that is untrue. Looking through the thread, I'm probably the player that has brought up the most things prior to day three. I called him out for his metric "trap", which didn't trap anyone. I mentioned that he was arguing about nonsense with his day 1 scum lynch %. I mentioned that he was bringing up jackal's reads, but not his own. I argued with him regarding his insistence that GM was lying about his roleblock. You're punishing me for including scum on the list and punishing me for not including scum on the list :/ On January 04 2012 17:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Next up is Kita’s current claim to town fame, his lynch on L. Here’s the thing, he’s not actually the first person to go after L on day 3. Bum is actually the first person to call out L with his very first post of the day. Kita isn’t even the second person to mention L as possible scum, prplhz, and RoL call L scum. Even Syllo beats around the bush saying that “In terms of balance L is probably scum but I don’t think we should kill him today” (paraphrase( and this is the main reason why I killed syllo for posterity sake)). The pressure on L doesn’t stop there, Bum continues to call him out going so far as to flat out say that L is scum. Keep in mind, this has all happened before kita does his analysis on L. Even Sheth manages to call L mafia and since Chez was absent, that’s every player in the game who is not L or Kita who has called L scum or at least hinted at it on day 3. Bum starts the voting on L, everyone in the game has called L scum at least once except for kita. How am I the last person to call him scum, if I just posted him in my scumlist before the day three flip? I commit myself to L as my lynch target when there are two town votes on RoL. I was the only person to write up an actual case against L. It's LYLO. Scum only need a single incorrect vote and they already have two. How in the world does it benefit me to move 2 town votes off RoL and onto L, when the game could be over otherwise? Scum would know there are tons of vig's still alive to worry about, so they might not even get an opportunity for another lylo. syllo came off looking awful from the lynch as one of the last people to vote and provides no reasoning for his vote. If this was a planned bus, wouldn't he try to gain some town cred as well, instead of looking like a defeated scum? I was not bussing L. The last four paragraphs seem to be a summary of what you think happened, so I'm not sure there is anything I can say about that. Looks like a no-lynch is going to be our best option today. | ||
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
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bumatlarge
United States4567 Posts
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
I'll write one of your awful stories for you bum: You suck. The end. BM BM BM. RAGE. CAPS CAPS CAPS. No GG. | ||
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
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Ver
United States2186 Posts
Night something No lynch. Day ends blah blah. Send your actions. Can we speed up cycles plz. | ||
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chaoser
United States5541 Posts
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
To that end, sorry about my inactivity, I thought I would be able to play at my internship yesterday but I was busy, then I went straight to GF's and I just got home -_-; | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On January 05 2012 14:01 Ver wrote: Night something No lynch. Day ends blah blah. Send your actions. Can we speed up cycles plz. Let me help you out. Day ? No one died! BumAtLarge was roleblocked. | ||
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Meapak_Ziphh
United States6786 Posts
I've been reading the thread again and I'm feeling very confident that kita is scum at this point. | ||
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
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bumatlarge
United States4567 Posts
On January 06 2012 02:48 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I obviously knew that kita was going to disagree with my analysis of him, but I'd like to hear what Bum and RoL think. Bum do you still think I'm most likely to be scum? If so, what problems do you have with me that you don't have with kita. Same with RoL, what is wrong with my kita analysis that makes bum a better lynch? I've been reading the thread again and I'm feeling very confident that kita is scum at this point. No, you are not my top candidate for scum, and if RoL would just set off my role condition I would feel a lot better about him. | ||
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