TL Mafia L

On January 06 2012 08:11 flamewheel wrote:
Okay editing OP. Currently thinking about 50 players, semi-closed setup (see my other games) with potentially more roles than normal. Sign up if you want to.

On January 06 2012 11:35 Jackal58 wrote:

He added us.
But thanks. That was a gracious action on your part. If I roll scum I'll kill you last.

On January 07 2012 12:08 Bill Murray wrote:
I vote for masons

On January 07 2012 19:13 flamewheel wrote:
Emperor flamewheel refuses to listen to the demands of the plebeians.

Masons are silly, and my semi-PM style takes way too much effort and isn't time-efficient.

On January 10 2012 09:39 Liquid`Sheth wrote:
Ok, so heres my take on this so far. I say we lynch the lurkers. Flamewheel is already lurking, and he hasn't chosen to take an action. I'm ok with lynching him to start the day. ##Vote:Flamewheel

On January 13 2012 17:57 GGQ wrote:


Hi, VE. Why are you trying to avoid responsibility for your day 1 lynch? Is it because you already know you won't be lynching scum?

On January 13 2012 17:15 sandroba wrote:
Also we need to consolidate our candidates. If everyone and their mother runs for election mafia can EASILY get whoever they want elected due to spreading of votes. So if you are running just because it's "standard" for you to run or you don't trust Y or Z please step down and take the time to analise the handful of candidates that actually have a shot and can make a difference.
Having the town's best interest in mind does not mean necessarily running yourself.

On January 13 2012 18:34 Palmar wrote:
I have no intentions of running for mayor or caring much about the mayor elections. I'm probably going to be voting VisceraEyes, depending on how dumb he will be through the day.

On January 14 2012 02:02 rgTheSchworz wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

You give no reason, cite a troll post, yet you are active.I have delved into town-Palmar and yes, town-Palmar usually runs for mayor or takes interest in mayoral elections.More than one-liner posts would be helpful.FoS Palmar.

D3, why lynch BM? He first got involved in elections by Foolishness and then posted to say why CC is hypocritical, which is semi-relevant.Maybe he is trying to defend bumat.

On the other hand sandro has been like,, I will be running for mayor''.
BUT

Blueclaim.
Rgtheschworz signing out

On January 14 2012 02:10 rgTheSchworz wrote:
If I was red, wouldn't I say that PRIVATELY?To then kill him at night?

Anyway, I was just fishing for info.

On January 14 2012 02:36 BloodyC0bbler wrote:


Eh? in smaller games with a core group of players where they are decent enough to dodge a solid read until d3 is why at least I typically am not active till then.

However. In larger games right from the getgo you have to be active. More new people, more people to hide in (as such people tend to slip up more as there is a level of security). As such by being active now and analyzing and calling people out you can snag them early or catch someone before they start getting coached by their team if red. This is something I like doing if at all possible.

I do appreciate your concern so I would levy you this question. Provided I do everything I said I will in my campaign post, as well as continue being active all through day 1 (as thats all we have to vote on) would you be willing to vote for me?

On January 14 2012 03:16 Palmar wrote:


No, your questions are dumb.

On January 13 2012 13:45 Cyber_Cheese wrote:
Something seems wrong...
I didn't autoscum :O

Speaking of auto-scum
##Vote MrWiggles

On January 14 2012 03:33 kitaman27 wrote:
VE, you mention that you're voting BM because he is scumhunting. Does this mean you agree with his case on cyber_cheese?

On January 14 2012 03:32 Palmar wrote:


See, dumb and bad.

On January 14 2012 05:31 kitaman27 wrote:




I disagree with a mass mason claim. A mason is a town favored role. Denying the mafia mason is not the priority. I'd be more than happy if a scum mason tried to contact me, considering they are now pressured into openly sharing their reads. People tend to have loose lips when regarding pms, but if you always consider their motives and agenda then there is no problem. With a mass claim, the scum team is free to pick off or roleblock blues. Suppose there are 4 mason claims and two get shot night one and flip town. Does that tell us anything about the remaining two masons? Not really.

On January 14 2012 05:35 Cyber_Cheese wrote:

It's discussing the set-up, we don't really need that when we could be scum hunting.
There is enough information generated by elections already.

On January 14 2012 07:25 Kenpachi wrote:
id like a gist of what is going on right now

On January 14 2012 07:30 Liquid`Sheth wrote:


People are saying stuff. Its day1. There are lots of pages to read. Ignorance will not be treated well.

On January 14 2012 07:51 Foolishness wrote:

If anyone is voting for someone partly with the reason of "he's a good player" then they are doing the same thing. Don't know why you choose to call me out instead of any of the other lackluster votes. At least I have a plan and reasoning.

On January 14 2012 09:10 Jayjay54 wrote:


alright my vote is on sale. Do you still intend to lynch palmar?

how do you feel about the second mason claim?

On January 14 2012 09:48 Toadesstern wrote:


hey there. According to several people town performance has been pretty bad the last couple of games. What do you say about making a list of all the bad players we have and just do the opposit of what they want to do?
Either they're town and wrong or they're mafia and want to protect their buddies.

win-win situation!

On January 14 2012 10:58 Mattchew wrote:
So why would you not vote for me wbg? Wouldn't you rather have a confirmed townie in office than someone you would be taking a leap of faith on?

The 3 I listed are all acting scummy, not trollish or over the top scummy, just scummy. Palmar is trolling and over the top, he would be a great day2 lynch if these actions continue, but it is too up in the air right now as to whether or not he is trolling or scum. He could be one of our biggest strengths in the future, I'd rather kill someone else now.

On January 14 2012 11:46 wherebugsgo wrote:


shut up about being mayor and start doing something useful.

This is why I hate mayoral elections; they bring day 1 to shit by muddying everything up and allowing scum to just prance around happily doing whatever the hell they want.

Stop giving the mafia fields of flowers to frisk around in. Start scumhunting.

Give me your opinion on Palmar to begin with.

On January 14 2012 11:59 wherebugsgo wrote:


I was asleep 8 hours ago. I stayed up till like 5:30 lol. (8 hours ago was 11 am here)

also Palmar's day 1 meta as town is not be useless. It's establish himself as town. He's done nothing so far to do that. That's a common theme among his scum games; on day 1 he keeps posting one liners and not doing anything.

On January 14 2012 12:21 Nisani201 wrote:

This is all WIFOM.

On January 15 2012 03:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:


You as a former candidate go out of your way to encourage people to withdraw votes based on a lie. You can say you misread my post which potentially believable due to its length I find unlikely. If people were actively waiting for a piece of information then my large posts theoretically should be read carefully for said information. You are not like jay who has been on my nuts all game.

Had you chosen to encourage people to not vote for me as I claimed mason and had solid reasons behind it then I would see you as more townlike, as it would also be discrediting another player with the same claim. By opting to instead cherry pick one candidate over the other I see an inconsistancy. I say this as you made mention before in thread that you had reservations of electing me before as my alignment with my role was not provable (minus a lynching obviously), however this issue would be near identical to another mason and had you kept with that line of thinking as two masons were in the running I would have understood.

Singling me out however, via incorrect information, is why you are on my list.

On January 15 2012 03:44 BloodyC0bbler wrote:


Using the phrase "has been on my nuts all game" is more or less accurate. You are really the only person who has been against me for a decent period of time. You also have said your reasons why. Do i agree with them? No. I do understand them however. If you compare what you were doing to what VE did you would understand why he is on a radar now and you are currently not.

However, as for the upsides of my claim. Look at the specific post Incog (the hydra) quoted of mine from my town analysis thread that I believe i linked in a previous post. (if i didnt i can dig it up, its also somewhere on page 4-6 i believe of the mafia forum).

I stress that most people don't use pm's correctly. In a situation where only a few specific players have access to that domain, it gives the mafia an advantage. They will have 10 people able to work on manipulating a player. You can say "i am going to look for manipulation so it won't happen" but again. Ask what I did to VE. It was subtle and vile. All I did was plant an idea that I knew he would think on and run with, and he did it in a way I knew he would. Manipulation is not obvious and a good player will know exactly how to do it without being caught. Mafia will have 10 people making sure its done right. I know that I can freely romp in pm land, but no smart mafia is going to talk to me seriously if i mason them. Why? Because i could do to them what they would do to another player. As such I had to think. How likely is it that only top players got the mason role?

Unlikely as fw rng's roles. We are also a gimped mason as we lose contact with who we target after each cycle and can never use it on them again. This is inherently not helpful to town. Why? Because a townie benefits from bouncing ideas off one another in pms. However you need the time to build up a "trust" of sorts with the person to actually get a serious discussion on reads. People will naturally always suspect you at first when mason'd or at least they should. That is not alot of time to get by the distrust and have a discussion of who x and y think is scum. Then you have to go over all those pms and see if there is a hidden agenda there. PM's in the way we traditionally use them to "bounce ideas" or find scum are used over long periods of time with people mulling over information. As your ability to get reads is so short term they are unreliable and far more useful to manipulate or mislead which takes far less effort, and is doable in a much faster span of time.

As such I opted to want to discuss the role. However, I also knew that based on my decision to heavily push this point, I would be forced to claim my role as there would be no way I would be able to hide that fact for the game while pushing heavy on its discussion. Even if I could, it could lead masons to out and out claim and would look extremely bad if I didn't while essentially outing people in thread.

As such I did right from the get go.

On January 15 2012 05:31 risk.nuke wrote:
Nothing about this 'don't tell them what you will do', wifom shit matters. If CC is scum they will roleblock VE, if CC is town mafia will still rb VE.

On January 15 2012 06:11 Toadesstern wrote:


I've been thinking you're town all game long but since you fakeclaimed (it was a fake claim right?) I'm not sure anymore

On January 15 2012 06:18 Cyber_Cheese wrote:

The occams razor thing was to stop the WIFOM, not my personal stance.

When I said I wouldn't vote for BC now in that original post, well right then I wouldn't have, because he felt the need to claim his role. After thinking through the mason plans, I disagreed with it and was willing to lynch him. His continued belief after that his idea was good, and his other townie looking contributions outweighed the doubts I had about him.

On January 15 2012 06:20 Toadesstern wrote:


yeah but I don't blieve that claim at all. So I'm obviously asking myself why you claimed bullshit.
Furthermore I'm asking myself why you're starting to get chaos right now with another last second mayor candidate.

On January 15 2012 06:22 Cyber_Cheese wrote:

Jack has too many limitations to be the strongest blue role.


You aren't seriously demanding to be given more responsibility after trying to day 1 vig?
Use your veteran life and rely on heals.

On January 15 2012 06:23 L wrote:

I'll vote for you if you figure out a snazzy plan to confirm that you aren't bullshitting about your role.

On January 15 2012 06:26 risk.nuke wrote:

Well, You claim you're off and then come storming back trying to run for mayor. Earlier I was wondering at the time you claimed if you were going to try to use it to get elected, I even thought about promoting you myself but ended up thinking it would be to dangerous. I don't like it. No go Vicera.

On January 15 2012 06:31 Palmar wrote:


Business as usual.

On January 15 2012 06:45 Jayjay54 wrote:


What case? There's hardly any case. This is almost OMGUS. You were BFF and then he called you lynch candidate, all of a sudden you're like, DAYKILL. I didn't really get it.

Or did I miss something.

On January 15 2012 06:58 Jayjay54 wrote:


I did read your case, he makes minor contradictions, granted. But enough to justify a daykill? I hardly think so.

Also, I am like 95% sure that you wouldn't have made that case if he didn't call you lynch candidate. Which makes it an OMGUS. Sorry. But that is how I see it.

On January 15 2012 06:18 Cyber_Cheese wrote:

The occams razor thing was to stop the WIFOM, not my personal stance.

When I said I wouldn't vote for BC now in that original post, well right then I wouldn't have, because he felt the need to claim his role. After thinking through the mason plans, I disagreed with it and was willing to lynch him. His continued belief after that his idea was good, and his other townie looking contributions outweighed the doubts I had about him.

On January 15 2012 07:02 Cyber_Cheese wrote:

If I were scum buddying up to you, why would I completely change my mind?


Your next move was staying out of the election. It was pathetic and scummy, so I decided you were a good lynch candidate.
I suppose I should dismiss the rest of your accusations...


WHAT? HOW DARE HE RECOGNISE THAT HE WASNT FIRST?
What sort of scum would be man enough to admit that an idea wasn't original if it was giving them town cred?

And OMG HE DIDNT CHANGE HIS VOTE STRAIGHT AWAY EVEN THOUGH HE HAD MANY HOURS LEFT IN THE DAY?!

Do you have any other OMGUS I should dismiss?

On January 15 2012 07:06 Cyber_Cheese wrote:

Protip: If you want to prove someones alignment, lynching someone else rarely if ever helps.

On January 15 2012 10:02 bumatlarge wrote:
How to distract Bum101: Post links to other games. Seriously spent 1/2 hour readinf BC's posts in PYP3. That was a fun game.

Glad L is around, I don't think it was too late for anyone to start running for mayor since the votes are fairly spread out. I honestly like where protactinum is coming from with his latest posts, and would like to see BC flip. He has gotten alot of votes from thin air :X, especially after Incog had already given his in depth analysis before most of the votes. Protact's surge of votes seems unsurprising, so I definetly want him in a mayoral position.

@Protact - What will you do if BC becomes sheriff and you become mayor? I'm assuming you'll lynch someone who voted for him, or ciryandor, your previous lynch? Who is macpo lol?

Also, lol at VE. I'm would vote for you bro, if you were close to the leader. I'm assuming you would lynch CC?

On January 15 2012 06:09 VisceraEyes wrote:
Okay, the answer: Vote VE for Mayor!

Wait did he just say.....

YES!

VE has retardedly outted himself as a Town Jack by trying to daykill C_C. What an idiot, right? But hear me out.

My case on CC is this: He's scummily inconsistent in his posting.

Like take this post for example. He states in no uncertain terms that A) he's not going to vote for BC and also B) Palmar must be scum based on Occam's Razor.

In this post he encourages me to stay in the mayoral race because he's voting for me.

Here, he goes a step further and changes his lynch choice to BC.

Wait a minute...he already said he agreed with the case on Palmar...Occam's Razor remember?

In this post, he tries to shirk responsibility for Macpo's stance on BC (Macpo very clearly cites CC for changing his view on BC) by claiming it was actually Hydractinum that his post was based on. As town, I'd be flattered if one of my posts changed someone's mind, I certainly wouldn't try to say it was SOMEONE ELSE who actually did the legwork...especially if I'm seeking election!

Okay, here's the post. In this post, he not only reverses his stance on BC, but he does so by saying "BC isn't as bad a candidate as everyone is making him out to be." Really? You've been one of his biggest detractors! Your campaign is based on LYNCHING BC! Interestingly, he also puts me on a lynch list....WHILE HIS VOTE FOR MAYOR IS STILL ON ME!!! This is so fucking damning guys.

Now his vote is on BC.

Now, I'm going to probably be roleblocked and killed tonight...we can avoid this by making me one of the elected officials.

If I'm elected mayor, I'll lynch the fuck out of C_C.

A Vote For VisceraEyes Is A Vote For Town Victory!!!!

On January 17 2012 10:28 wherebugsgo wrote:
oh also even if KP functioned that way, it wouldn't have worked, because 3 scum would have needed to be roleblocked for it to work.

So I think BM is full of shit and needs to die now.

##unvote Scamp

##vote Bill Murray

On January 17 2012 10:37 wherebugsgo wrote:


What is there to think?

Nothing Bill Murray has done has made sense. It's just brainless flailing around. In what universe does the sheriff jail someone to lower mafia KP? Particularly, in the universe we live in, it takes 3 dead scum for mafia KP to drop, which makes his claim of "I jailed Lanaia so mafia KP would drop" even more frightening.

On January 17 2012 11:42 Bill Murray wrote:
2 people who are masons are mafia together
the sandroba lynch gives us a lot of information

On January 17 2012 12:29 Bill Murray wrote:
I have 0 idea

On January 18 2012 04:45 Jackal58 wrote:

This is enough for me to hang your ass. You won't pass judgement but you'll help hang his ass. Scummy Visc. Very scummy.


If you don't like the Macpo lynch this guy is an excellent alternative.

On January 18 2012 05:35 wherebugsgo wrote:


The fact that you can confidently say I'm wrong too often when I've only been provably wrong once means you need to die today.

At most, you'd know that I've been wrong twice, (if you are town) which isn't
"too often" unless your standards for finding scum are unreasonably high, which I don't find likely, seeing as I don't believe you've ever even found scum as town before.

##unvote Protactinium
##vote Toadesstern

On January 18 2012 05:58 wherebugsgo wrote:
I was gonna point out the GGQ ninja, but got beaten to it by scum:



Have you even voted?

Do you even have a scumread?

Your filter is still full of the stuff I put in the toilet every morning at 8.

On January 19 2012 07:16 Jackal58 wrote:
Scum love to direct blues.

On January 19 2012 08:55 Toadesstern wrote:

yeah I already thought of that when CC was talking about chainsaw defence. talking about chainsaw defence is chainsaw defense itself :p

On January 19 2012 09:04 Jackal58 wrote:

For a moment after the flip I thought I was wrong about you.

On January 19 2012 10:01 Jackal58 wrote:

Go blow your scumshine up somebody elses skirt.

On January 19 2012 11:18 EchelonTee wrote:
? I thought Toad was one of your lynch candidates, but you support his views on Sandroba? You also said that GGQ was your other lynch candidate, but you don't like it because it's vet supported?

On January 19 2012 12:12 Jackal58 wrote:
Sorry guys. I think I've died night one 90% of the time over the past 6 months when I got town. So I played superderp. Somebody finally gave me a gun with bullets and I wasn't going to die before I could use it.
BC is scum. Lynch him.

On January 19 2012 12:43 Protactinium wrote:

If BM is mafia, anything is possible. We can't deduce anything unless we can trust the sheriff (because if he's red he will just lie about incarcerations).

On January 19 2012 12:45 blahz0r wrote:
I think I agree with Protactinium's list of lynching Bill Murray but not sure who I want to vote for 2nd lynch.

The following was posted before his Night 2 post...


Did BM do that? Does incarcerate only work on one hit? Need answers...

On January 19 2012 13:00 bumatlarge wrote:
I think BM has some explaining to do. Jackal, why did you shoot L if bill was supposed to jail him? I don't think that would refund your shot?

##Vote: bill murray

On January 19 2012 13:02 Scamp wrote:
Also for the record I highly doubt that Sheth used his vig shot because he said this earlier...

On January 19 2012 13:10 Scamp wrote:


You're welcome. Now stop playing like WBG and gain a little context for what you say.

The quote from Sheth was from day 1.


Reading over Kingjames filter has made me not want to vote for him.

On January 19 2012 13:40 Jackal58 wrote:

You can make the exact same case against the guy you're talking too.

On January 19 2012 15:23 bumatlarge wrote:
Meapak is clearly scum. His GGQ push is just one big crutch for him. Just read his last two posts.

##Vote meapak_ziphh

On January 20 2012 00:24 jaj22 wrote:
@Lanaia: You want Bill to blow up two of Foolishness/Protact/BC?

On January 20 2012 03:58 Toadesstern wrote:


That easy:
Whole town thinks I'm town? - Lynch me
Half of town thinks I'm mafia and the rest is not sure? - I'm town and a bunch of crazy people jumped out of nowhere, focusing on somethin I posted that made them think I meant something completly different and they stick with that.

Has been that way ALL THE TIME.

On January 20 2012 05:03 wherebugsgo wrote:
at this point it's pretty damning of kingjames to be so fervently pushing a random lynch we've never heard of.

Granted, this is exactly what he did in XLVIII, just always pushing random people who never had a chance of being lynched. Knowing this, though, it becomes hard to determine whether he is actually scum or just playing like he normally does

At this point I don't care because I don't think kingjames is the best kill for today. I'd much rather we kill BM and Toad.

On January 20 2012 06:23 p4NDemik wrote:
VE you baffle me. You totally agree with the biggest push I have made in the game up until this point, put in your vote to that effect, but you continue to swing wildly back and forth and put your vote back onto me. You acknowledge that I have a solid case, but just because kingjames keeps pushing me you keep forgetting that and voting for me. The most telling thing I have done all game is this lynch against supersoft and bill murray, I've drawn a line in the sand and you've said you agreed with that. This fact should carry more weight than me making some mistakes earlier in the game.

On January 20 2012 07:02 bumatlarge wrote:


Wut? I don't shy away from the spotlight -_-! I wasn't able to post as much as I would like, but I keep up with the thread and stay active. There is little doubt in my mind that bill and meapak are scum.



I'm happy to have struck a chord. GGQ is more or less irrelevant compared to you. I would make an effort to assess GGQ if you flipped town. As I seriously doubt that, I don't think GGQ would be a great bus at this point, so I would go with town if you are scum. GGQ is still in a bad position if you flip before him, so I would argue against his lynch.

If my posts really look like I'm not putting effort into them, I'll try harder to better them. meapak's post does nothing but make me more suspicious though, so as far as I'm concerned at the moment, he's the best lynch.

On January 20 2012 10:30 Jackal58 wrote:

Chill man. I'm just observing now. For what its worth I see about 20 people as scummy right now.

On January 20 2012 10:48 Bill Murray wrote:
I've got to vote kingjames, even if I have a townslip from him;
I KNOW I'm a mad hatter, he could be a townie
sandroba needs rope really badly
My one bomb is on Protactinium, so when I'm lynched, I guess he's coming with me
My Night 1 was jailing Lanaia, and then I was going to fake that I "derped" on the next 2 nights
Why else would I jailkeep N1? It was a bad idea in retrospect, but I thought I would either die N1 if BC was mafia, or I would have until BrownBear and Kitaman were alive.

Cwave masoned me yesterday
Jitsu masoned me yesterday
one of BC or OpZ are probably mafia
GG guys I'm dead in an hour if you all don't unvote and there goes the sheriff

On January 20 2012 11:22 BrownBear wrote:


Wait what. This is nonsensical and silly.

Why on earth do you have a bomb on Protact if you're MH? I thought you had a town read on him, or was I just imagining that?

On January 21 2012 08:02 Bill Murray wrote:


WBG I am leaning town on. However, when I caught up on the thread, I saw something around him I didn't like. When he was
talking to supersoft, revolving around the GGQ/L shit, I feel like 2 of them are probably mafia. It was a fishy situation.

BC has been the most contributing person in the thread so far, and I don't want to lose that, if he's town. If Protactinium would have bussed Ciryandor d1, would we be where we're at?



Why would I claim hatter when I didn't have 2 bombs out? You can say "oh, you already did that", but when I'm a serious mislynch, I have to claim my role. There is no way I would have claimed my role to those masons. The only reason I claimed the BGs was in case me/BC both died, or just me? I'm not really sure how it would work - because mafia substituted them

I assumed I had to choose. I had a red or blue read on Lanaia, hence why she was a scum read d1 and isn't now.


No, only in my head, but I can rectify that


Go ahead. You're wrong, though. Either BC or Protactinium is mafia, 100%, book it, one is fooling the other.
Incognito is better at blending in than BC. Incognito is Protactinium, by the way. If you've noticed, reading my filter, I have grilled BC a few times. I didn't really get much out of it, but his actions up until now have seemed sooo protown. He has made huge walls, and has been a very good mayor. I want him to be town. I hope I'm not just being naive.

I also hope I'm not being naive in that you guys aren't going to lynch me after I put forth all the effort reading 40 pages of text walls last night, but if you do, I guess I should improve my town game. It wouldn't be the first game I've been mislynched as town on Teamliquid.

Speaking of that, a little WIFOM for you - I am always lynched as town, and not ever as mafia