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On January 14 2012 04:26 supersoft wrote:
hey, toadesstern, can you link me a game where you were town? I know your scummeta. It's talking a lot with no content. You do that right now.
here you go:
my first ever gamehttp://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=264798
my 2nd game
my third game was that 80 player game. I did the same to some degree but stopped posting after d2 or something like that because it was too much of a mess for me at that point in time
4th game was my first ever mafia (the one with annul)
5th game was resistance
this is the 6th game.
So nothing more I can provide
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On January 14 2012 04:31 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 04:26 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 04:15 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 14 2012 03:58 VisceraEyes wrote:
BC: Well, obviously you're no GF this game, because you claimed a confirmable role. Unless I'm mistaken, scum can't be mason AND GF, yes? DT checks will be accurate on you...so there's that. Confirming your alignment, in my opinion, should be paramount because I find it EXTREMELY likely that you would have elected to be mason on the scum team (for reasons that should be obvious to you and several others.)
What's your plan on confirming your role? Are you going to out who you've masoned with? Are you going to let them do it at their own pace?
I will out my first mason shortly, I want the debate to however move towards how to deal with masons as a whole. I say this because you know from experience with me just how subtle a touch can be needed to manipulate/confuse someone. A mafia mason will have the experience of a team in manipulation whereas a town member has their own ability to run with. On January 14 2012 04:01 Toadesstern wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On January 14 2012 03:32 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
The Day 1 Important Discussion Post #1
Read this post fully before posting. It is something that everyone must read, and that everyone must comment on
That is right friends, this post as I am writing it is near one of the most important posts of this game day. You are going to ask? Why BC? Simple. I am about to do something that will cause people to yell and scream at me. I am roleclaiming.
I am mason
Note what I have done?
[1]
I have now put myself from the statistical chance of flipping a town aligned role of 80%ish and lowered it to a solid 50%.
I am now either 50% red or 50% blue.[/1.]
I am doing this for a few reasons.
[2]
1) in this game there could exist masons on both sides of the equation. As such dealing with them early is key as they work behind the scenes of the game. [/2]
[3]
2) it is a confirmable role, stress this point, ROLE. I can confirm my role at the beginning of a day cycle as opposed to at the end of a day cycle [/3]
3) I am being transparent. By giving this information now, reading me becomes far easier. There will never be the "is he blue trying to breadcrumb etc..?"
[4]
4) goes along with 3, however it outs one of the masons now. It stops the discussion later of people discussing all the people who are masons and who is believable late game whereas we can cover at least one of them now [/4]
This also sets the town up in a very advantageous way. Why you ask?
I am elected and now town knowingly knows I am active in pms.
I am not elected and not auto lynched by mayor and same information is known.
[5]
It also forces the mafia to deal with me as they have no idea what I am doing in pm land. Do they try and kill who I am talking to? Do they use their own masons and attempt to find out what I have said, etc....[/5]
This I feel is the most advantageous day 1 use of my ability. I have already used my mason use for the day and will say who I used it on after this post in the nearish future. I am leaving who it is out as the purpose is to generate discussion on my claim, not on who I chose to mason to. As to detail of why I did this aside from the general points I made? Everyone will have an opinion on this claim. Some good, some bad. People will have to have an opinion on this subject however. EVERYONE will have an opinion. Do not just post "wtf bc you dumb fuck why would you do this". This is a debate about me specifically being a mason and if I should be elected, not elected and lynched, or not elected and left for the mafia to deal with me.
All vets, all new players, all semi experienced players will have an opinion and it is needed. Anyone who fails to properly contribute on this matter. I have thought this claim out and realize that generally claiming day 1 is bad, however I feel at least with this mechanic and how it could be abused it should be discussed (especially with a high profile player such as myself possessing it) now and not later.
On the most important note that this post will do however is generate serious discussion. How do you all wish to proceed with a mason claim? Specifically my mason claim?
1) That's obviously bullshit. The chances to win lottery aren't 50% because you either win or you don't... but I see what you want to tell us 2) why? 3) no it's not. You're masoning someone. That someone is going to tell us if you masoned him. If you are a mafia you could tell us you masoned a mafiabuddy and of course your buddy will tell everyone you pm'ed him. 4) I don't realy care about what's going to happen with discussion later on if whatever might happen. I want to get a town mayor right now and for that reason I'd much rather see things tell give me something on your alignment than something that might or might not improve future-world 5) I'm pretty sure mafia will have to deal with you no matter what. That is if you're town. It's not like mafia is going not kill you because they think you might be a green instead of a blue and therefor you're no threat to them. Incorrect for you good sir. my role unlike anyone elses is confirmable. However my role is able to appear on both town and mafia sides thus rather than claiming "i am townie" and having the 80ish% chance of being one of the townie i am now firmly 50/50. My role is confirmable, my alignment isn't. You can clearly say "you were either 1 or the other before" however I have removed fake claiming almost entirely. Mafia do not benefit from me fake claiming this, nor do town. as for how I can confirm my role at the start? I mason at the beginning of a cycle not the end. As for saying its not confirmable? If i am a generic red and claim mason my mafia buddy says i masoned him. I die flip mafia goon he fucking dies. The only people who in their right mind would claim mason, are mason. As for also saying im not transparent? You know my role, I am even trying to discuss the role itself. If you do not care about the possible damages of a mafia mason late game and only care about the now then you are not playing in the best interests of this town. You must always look ahead. If there are roles that could potentially fuck town two days from now that wouldn't have if we talked about them today then we talk about it today. Period. as for mafia dealing with me? Say for arguments sake, there are 4 masons and 1 is red. I don't get elected and am not lynched by mayor. Mafia now has the option of killing me and thus reducing the number of people they can hide amongst and masons are confirmable. By claiming, town will always be analyzing me and determining if i am red or blue and choose to off me based on it. Mafia have the risk of killing me early and thus potentially outing one of their own early on or leaving me alone and hope the town ignores me. The longer I live the more benefit i am to the town and if i die by mafia shot I out one of their own slightly faster. Now. How do people wish to deal with masons as a whole? Do all discussions made get posted in thread? Do we opt to not talk to people who mason you, etc... This is an important matter, move just passed my personal claim and look at the role as a whole. Here is a link to a thread where masons were discussed before to get an idea why I think its important to discuss. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=278946the situation proposed there is obviously different from this game but the important none the less. The part about what I called 1) was what you said in your example: If there are 4 masons and only one is red the chances are not 50/50. If we don't have the exact same amount of blue roles it's not going to be 50/50. But that's just useless chat so I'll leave it with that because it's just not important at all imo. About your example what is going to happen if you're red and ask a buddy to help out. If this thing of yours works out and people believe you you won't be lynched. Neither will scum kill you because you are a mafia yourself in that scenario. Even if there's a rampaging vigi you're safe due to your bodyguards if you're elected. The guy you masoned probably is someone you think is town I guess? Why should he be lynched and same applies to mafia here: Mafia won't shoot that if you are mafia. About late game: I've never seen masions in action. I think they look neat but I can't judge how good they are. That's why I asked "why" because I did not think we have to talk about masons because I did not think they're that scary. That was more of an "explain pls". [...] If i am a red mason it means whoever claims i masoned will be town, period. I would never have to mason a scumbuddy as well, im already talking to them. Only a mason would make my claim. your ignore the case that im town. In whichcase if i am elected mafia now hates my guts, if i am not they still hate my guts as dealing with me is hard. You could frame me sure, but a dt checks, i die and they still are on a reduced list. Only my actions at this point will save me from dying or guarentee it. As for masons in action? Ask VE what I did in fw's game where everyone had 2 mason uses. I was mafia he was town, and in 1-2 conversations i had him create utter chaos in thread. We have had near no game where only a limited amount of players are masons. It will be a mechanic that can do more damage than any other role in this game.
First paragraph: I thought if you're a red mason you're not going to use your power d1 and just pretend you masoned someone while asking your bro to help out a little. Noone is going to see a flip if you both survive. And yes I agree you won't mason a red. It's either going to be noone and you're red or you're green and actually masoned someone.
2nd pararaph: No I'm not. I see that what you did might make sense as a townie as well. I just don't think it's bullshit as red either and I'm trying to point that out.
So what's your take about the masons? I actually like what sandroba suggested somehow. Haven't thought it through yet but I don't see drawbacks yet.
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On January 14 2012 04:48 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 04:45 Cyber_Cheese wrote:On January 14 2012 04:39 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 14 2012 04:36 Mattchew wrote:On January 14 2012 04:31 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
If i am a red mason it means whoever claims i masoned will be town, period. I would never have to mason a scumbuddy as well, im already talking to them.
WIFOM Otherwise, Do you think that all masons should claim like you have? Assuming atleast 1 mason would be mafia it could lead to a high percentage day 1 lynch how is that wifom? Why would I as red ever out myself and another mafia in the same day? Especially when if i had used my mason somewhere else i would be counterclaimed and die? It would mean i would have to hold onto my use and have a scumbuddy claim and thus waste my own power to corrupt a townie? It is pure logic, not wifom. As for masons claiming? Things like this are what my claim were supposed to generate. Forcing people to only post in the thread for instance is a huge deal as it removes a scum form of play, etc... The very fact you as a red shouldn't choose another red makes it wifom. You could do it in an attempt to give the other person cred in the event you flipped. How does me flipping red or blue give cred to whoever I picked? It gives you no information on them aside from the fact I mason'd them. I can talk to people, not confirm their alignment, or anything. If i say i masoned x and i die and flip, regardless of my alignment you gain no information on that player aside from I talked to them.
vs
On January 14 2012 04:21 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 04:17 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 14 2012 04:02 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 14 2012 03:57 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 14 2012 03:53 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 14 2012 03:49 Jayjay54 wrote:
I don't get it, BC. Why now?
From what I read here, you were on top of quite some voting lists, including mine? So why would you roleclaim when your campaign was good enough on its own.
Also, I'd like to line up with VE here. There's seriously nothing that says "I am town" here.
Or would you consider your claim a bad play if you were scum?
Therefore, I am glad that I didn't vote yet, because if I had, I had to unvote. Sceptical now. Being a mayor or sheriff whereas would rock does not outweigh what masons in generally can fuck up later in the game. I am one of whatever the end number is. If i don't get elected fine, however, is making everyone aware of at least one of the players who is capable of being active in pms a bad thing? As opposed to just saying "wow now your scummy" Discuss how we want to operate around masons, pros, cons, etc... Of all the roles in this setup, it is the only "confirmable role" but it is also insanely sinister as players can plant seeds of doubt, fish roles, etc... and that's kinda what you just did. you seeded doubt. why not win the campaign => roleclaim => comfirm. how would that in any why fuck up late game? the timing just seems off. Because i believe its important to get the discussion with as early as possible? Masons act the instant day 1 begins. Whereas all other roles act at night in the exception of a jack using their mason ability (i believe). This claim where "ill timed" only puts me at risk to a day 1 lynch to confirm my alignment. My role is confirmable. I can help assist the town via same actions I would do as a leader without the elected position, and with my claim mafia now has a hard time dealing with me. HOW as a group, do we want to deal with all masons as a whole? I say this as simply put. Not everyone is going to be a mason. Anyone could be mason'd. With a role that is potentially in the hands of both scum and town alike we need to discuss this now. Anyone who has seen me play before recognizes my stance on role does not = alignment, and with a powerful role like mason this shit has to be dealt with sooner rather than later. So you really think that having like 30 hours of discussion of how we should apply our masons do outweigh the pros of having a mason mayor? why is that? especially. when we not even know if you're a) a mason and b) town. Your role is not even confirmable at this point. Scum buddy " YAY he mason" Also, you say that with your claim it is hard for the mafia to deal with you. More than if you would've been mayor? How so? The discussion "HOW as a group do we want to deal with all masons as a whole" didn't really need a roleclaim. It would have started automatically. Hell, you could even haven given some ideas within your campaign. Sorry, I don't see any single reason why you would jeopardize your election with a roleclaim? Just to start a discussion how to deal with masons is really little - none benefit. On January 14 2012 04:02 EchelonTee wrote:
@jay, it was a posting mistake, that would be a pretty sorry way to try and get town credit. I have spreadsheets and stuff, which is where it came from. its not good practice imo to post tells without substantiation, thus I would've rather not posted that tidbit. And what's with the -mafia tag, is that just a dig at my post?
I don't like foolishness but that doesn't mean bm is bad. will return to this again later.
Current opinion on BC: wouldn't it have been better to get elected then mason one of your bodyguards? To get a tell on them? You already had a good shot at getting elected... I don't see as this scum though, more like a weird gambit.
Posted from phone, will post more later. You posted TL links. How is this coming from a spreadsheet? Do you have links in your spreadsheet? The mafia tag was a dig, yes. Your thoughts on BM and BC are right, though how is my role not confirmable? Say im scum and a scumbuddy says "yes he mason'd me" if i die and flip non mason red, both of us die and two mafia die? How is that effective at all.
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On January 14 2012 05:32 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 05:12 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 14 2012 05:09 Cyber_Cheese wrote:
I vote we totally ignore this mason thing, and allow them to do what they will. Masons can help both sides, and can backfire for mafia. Additionally, the mafia masons have to worry about maintaining their townieness on two fronts. If the masons people use their intellect, we can make the mafia masons potentially backfire.
If their logs conflict at any point, we get a 1 for 1 trade. Mafia masons have the experience of an entire team to work manipulate someone. Townies only have themselves. The level of experience on one front is far more stacked then the other. By making people discuss what masons are allowed to do, or how they are allowed to act you instead cripple the mafia from the get go. [...] If we mass claim masons while making them useless, they essentially become VT's, so the mafia have higher chances of hitting other blues. Intense scrutiny is better all around. Play smart and masons are a very pro-town force. [...]
I don't think mafia will go by chance. Yeah we will end up "producing" some VTs but mafia is going to kill whoever they are going to kill for a reason.
Either they think they need to kill X fast or at least faster than Y or they don't think so. The rolke of Z is pretty much no matter of interest to mafia unless they think that Z might be a dangerous because of his role or his style.
I still agree with sandroba about the mass claim however. I don't really see a downside to that. It's not like mason is a role that's going to be useless after claimed. If they get shot that's kind of fine with me because mason information is pretty wifom until we see the mason flip himself or the targets of that mason (what bc said, if he deliveres us a couple of mafias he's pretty much confirmed town).
At the same time they're immune to roleblock as someone pointed out and they're not forcing immediate reaction by mafia like a dt or medic would.
Those two roles would easily die instantly or be roleblocked but I don't really see that happening with masons.
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I'm going with sheth here. It's nice that we got this discussion going and got some information we can work with but I'd like toget back to our mayor candidates.
I still have a bad feeling about bc and the only thing that's making me consider him is that wifom part because noone thinks a mafia would want to be in the spotlight that much. However according to what people are telling me about BC he's probably one of the few people who's capable of doing this without having a problem as mafia.
I know what sandroba thinks about the massclaim and that kind of helps me but I still want to know what he and other candidates are going to do with scum. What are your reads, who are you going to lynch and why?
I think we can and should wait with this masondiscussion until we got ourself a mayor
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On January 14 2012 06:53 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
Jayjay pardon if this sounds patronizing but (correct me if I'm wrong) you've never played in a PM game or seen how powerful they can be. For a decent townie, PMs are extremely useful. As I've already said, mafia PMs are less useful. Bc did just give an example but like I said in my previous post, it's a bad example and not representative of PMs on a whole.
My point is this. A player like bc can be deadly with PMs as town, as scum it's much harder to be effective in a normal game so the damage he can do is significantly less as scum.
what about the fact that we got pussy masons and no "real" masons?
I never played a pm game as well and when I was first told about masons I was not told about that restriction they got in our game. They're not allowed to pm the same guy multiple times.
Multiple times obviously referring to different cycles.
I don't know what that makes of our masons. The most scary part for mafia is a circle of confirmed townies. That's not possible with the kind of mason we got.
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On January 14 2012 06:59 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 06:53 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
Jayjay pardon if this sounds patronizing but (correct me if I'm wrong) you've never played in a PM game or seen how powerful they can be. For a decent townie, PMs are extremely useful. As I've already said, mafia PMs are less useful. Bc did just give an example but like I said in my previous post, it's a bad example and not representative of PMs on a whole.
My point is this. A player like bc can be deadly with PMs as town, as scum it's much harder to be effective in a normal game so the damage he can do is significantly less as scum. what about the fact that we got pussy masons and no "real" masons? I never played a pm game as well and when I was first told about masons I was not told about that restriction they got in our game. They're not allowed to pm the same guy multiple times. Multiple times obviously referring to different cycles. I don't know what that makes of our masons. The most scary part for mafia is a circle of confirmed townies. That's not possible with the kind of mason we got.
EBWOP: And thats the reason I did not think masons are that scary at all in our setup to begin with.
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On January 14 2012 07:22 Kenpachi wrote:
game started: a million pages.
hi guys im Kenpachi and im a townie 4 rela
funny. Scrolling my notes to see how got nothing in there and figured you (along with some other people) should start talking.
I haz superpowerz making you show up here telepathically?
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I know someone already pointed it out but I'm going to point it out again:
blahz0r do you mind joining the discussion? That's your filter: Klick me!
Not exactly looking good. Actually looking like a guy who is about to get modkilled but for some reason you already voted so you should know that the game has already started.
I know there's a couple of people who are lurking right now but you already voted so that's why I'm asking you and not everyone else.
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On January 14 2012 03:32 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 03:30 VisceraEyes wrote:On January 14 2012 03:16 Palmar wrote:On January 14 2012 03:05 VisceraEyes wrote:Palmar, would you kindly answer the questions I've asked you? Your life could very well be on the line sir.  No, your questions are dumb. All right - consider lynching Palmar as part of my platform. If you elect me to office, I promise to lynch scumPalmar as my first act. See, dumb and bad.
hey there. According to several people town performance has been pretty bad the last couple of games. What do you say about making a list of all the bad players we have and just do the opposit of what they want to do?
Either they're town and wrong or they're mafia and want to protect their buddies.
win-win situation!
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On January 14 2012 09:54 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 09:48 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 03:32 Palmar wrote:On January 14 2012 03:30 VisceraEyes wrote:On January 14 2012 03:16 Palmar wrote:On January 14 2012 03:05 VisceraEyes wrote:Palmar, would you kindly answer the questions I've asked you? Your life could very well be on the line sir. No, your questions are dumb. All right - consider lynching Palmar as part of my platform. If you elect me to office, I promise to lynch scumPalmar as my first act. See, dumb and bad. hey there. According to several people town performance has been pretty bad the last couple of games. What do you say about making a list of all the bad players we have and just do the opposit of what they want to do? Either they're town and wrong or they're mafia and want to protect their buddies. win-win situation! What does this quote even mean? Is this some sort of veiled attack on Palmar? What purpose does this post serve?
Well that quote kind f shows why I suggested that idea I just had.
Quoting something like
On January 14 2012 07:39 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 07:17 Mattchew wrote:On January 14 2012 07:14 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
This is an interesting conversation, you haven't convinced me but some good points have been brought up. What happens if a mason chooses not to claim when you all order them to? Do you lynch him the second he comes out on the policy of LaL? I just feel like this whole plan is very shortsighted.
And on that note I'd like to get back to the mayor/sheriff discussion. The last thing we want is to get completely sidetracked day 1. Bc's claim created good discussion and created a lot of material however we need to refocus and get done what needs to be done.
I still support BC to be my sheriff, however given that a lot of people are nervous of him because of his claim I'd like to remind people that Kita is my second choice. If you can't bring yourself to vote BC then vote kita. He's made some good points and he's probably best option behind bc.
I'd really like to hear from L right now. He's the only really good vet who hasn't checked in yet and I'd love to hear what he has to say about mayor. who is you? (curiosity not accusatory) Meapak is a baller. Doesn't mean he's town, but he's pretty good.
would be an odd start for my idea wouldn't it?
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as far as I understood him he already masoned someone.
Also if my theory is correct VE has to be a townie, because noone wants him to be mayor!
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nono it's better. There's plenty of people who don't have support. VE and BM are the only ones a lot of people think is a bad choice!
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On January 14 2012 10:30 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 10:28 Mr. Wiggles wrote:
Also, BC when are you claiming who you masoned with? I'd like confirmation about your role.
Right now, I'm leaning town on you. I've seen you manipulate townies before in PM as scum, and in light of that, your mason claim makes it seem like you're more likely to be town. I don't see a benefit for a scum BC to claim mason, when it puts a lot of pressure and suspicion on himself, when instead he can just win the election and use his secret mason role to manipulate townies. Instead, you're going to be forced to pretty much claim your target every day, and anyone you talk to is instantly going to be more on guard after all the discussion today. let's get this straight right now, so we don't have to deal with this later: BC's mason claim is NOT reflective of his alignment in any way, shape, or form. If he's scum, people saying "oh yeah his mason claim makes him more likely to be town" and then voting him are exactly what he wants! Good scum take calculated risks like this, and this very well could be a calculated move to get the mayoral position. Since the mason claim is not indicative of alignment, please do not suggest that it is, because such a suggestion is not even close to conclusive or useful.
yeah that's what i keep saying. Or at least I tried to. I see his claim as reasonable in some situations and it's it could be good for both, townie and mafia BC. I'm pretending that mason never happened at this point in time,
I'd also like to leave palmar for d2 to see what changes. It's not like he's going to run away and if he's still behaving like that, fine lynch if. For the time being we got some better candidates to look at imo.
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On January 14 2012 10:38 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 10:35 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 10:30 wherebugsgo wrote:On January 14 2012 10:28 Mr. Wiggles wrote:
Also, BC when are you claiming who you masoned with? I'd like confirmation about your role.
Right now, I'm leaning town on you. I've seen you manipulate townies before in PM as scum, and in light of that, your mason claim makes it seem like you're more likely to be town. I don't see a benefit for a scum BC to claim mason, when it puts a lot of pressure and suspicion on himself, when instead he can just win the election and use his secret mason role to manipulate townies. Instead, you're going to be forced to pretty much claim your target every day, and anyone you talk to is instantly going to be more on guard after all the discussion today. let's get this straight right now, so we don't have to deal with this later: BC's mason claim is NOT reflective of his alignment in any way, shape, or form. If he's scum, people saying "oh yeah his mason claim makes him more likely to be town" and then voting him are exactly what he wants! Good scum take calculated risks like this, and this very well could be a calculated move to get the mayoral position. Since the mason claim is not indicative of alignment, please do not suggest that it is, because such a suggestion is not even close to conclusive or useful. yeah that's what i keep saying. Or at least I tried to. I see his claim as reasonable in some situations and it's it could be good for both, townie and mafia BC. I'm pretending that mason never happened at this point in time, I'd also like to leave palmar for d2 to see what changes. It's not like he's going to run away and if he's still behaving like that, fine lynch if. For the time being we got some better candidates to look at imo. no, screw leaving people till day 2. If he's useless now he'll be useless day 2. Kill him. I couldn't care less about veterans and usefulness later on or all of that bs. If you're a vet and I think you're scum day 1 I want you to die day 1. Palmar fits this perfectly. Just look at his filter if you don't believe me; he's had a full day (and by EU time it was an actual day, I've only had about 6 hours worth if you compare) and all of his posts have been one liner marginal content bull. He also refuses to respond to any sort of pressure and has been completely incapable of any sort of scumhunting. He's scum. Just kill him.
I know I looked into his filter and I already said bc that palmar just looks over the top useless. I don't know if this is some weird trick of his (calling it now: BC masoned palmar and they're both tricking us!) or if he's just useless because he's mafia.
What he said is way too scummy to actually happen d1 for palmar if he's playing serious. So imo this is wifom about wether he pretends to be useless therefor making us think way too much to actually be mafia or if he pretends to be useless for whatever trick he is trying on us this time.
Alll I'm saying is we've got a decent chance figureing him out d2 and I'm not completly sure we going to hit a red when lynching palmar. If he continues to troll him insta lynch him d2 and go for someone else d1.
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On January 14 2012 10:45 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 10:38 wherebugsgo wrote:On January 14 2012 10:35 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 10:30 wherebugsgo wrote:On January 14 2012 10:28 Mr. Wiggles wrote:
Also, BC when are you claiming who you masoned with? I'd like confirmation about your role.
Right now, I'm leaning town on you. I've seen you manipulate townies before in PM as scum, and in light of that, your mason claim makes it seem like you're more likely to be town. I don't see a benefit for a scum BC to claim mason, when it puts a lot of pressure and suspicion on himself, when instead he can just win the election and use his secret mason role to manipulate townies. Instead, you're going to be forced to pretty much claim your target every day, and anyone you talk to is instantly going to be more on guard after all the discussion today. let's get this straight right now, so we don't have to deal with this later: BC's mason claim is NOT reflective of his alignment in any way, shape, or form. If he's scum, people saying "oh yeah his mason claim makes him more likely to be town" and then voting him are exactly what he wants! Good scum take calculated risks like this, and this very well could be a calculated move to get the mayoral position. Since the mason claim is not indicative of alignment, please do not suggest that it is, because such a suggestion is not even close to conclusive or useful. yeah that's what i keep saying. Or at least I tried to. I see his claim as reasonable in some situations and it's it could be good for both, townie and mafia BC. I'm pretending that mason never happened at this point in time, I'd also like to leave palmar for d2 to see what changes. It's not like he's going to run away and if he's still behaving like that, fine lynch if. For the time being we got some better candidates to look at imo. no, screw leaving people till day 2. If he's useless now he'll be useless day 2. Kill him. I couldn't care less about veterans and usefulness later on or all of that bs. If you're a vet and I think you're scum day 1 I want you to die day 1. Palmar fits this perfectly. Just look at his filter if you don't believe me; he's had a full day (and by EU time it was an actual day, I've only had about 6 hours worth if you compare) and all of his posts have been one liner marginal content bull. He also refuses to respond to any sort of pressure and has been completely incapable of any sort of scumhunting. He's scum. Just kill him. I know I looked into his filter and I already told bc that palmar just looks over the top useless. I don't know if this is some weird trick of his (calling it now: BC masoned palmar and they're both tricking us!) or if he's just useless because he's mafia. What he said is way too scummy to actually happen d1 for palmar if he's playing serious. So imo this is wifom about wether he pretends to be useless therefor making us think he's way to much looking scum to actually be mafia or if he pretends to be useless for whatever trick he is trying on us this time. All I'm saying is we've got a decent chance figureing him out d2 and I'm not completly sure we're going to hit a red when lynching palmar. If he continues to troll him insta lynch him d2 and go for someone else d1.
EBWOP: it's getting late and I don't proofread. Business as usual. Made it a little more understandable within my quote
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On January 14 2012 10:47 wherebugsgo wrote:
no, he's literally this bad as mafia. If he's this useless, he's auto scum.
If he's town he'll actually put in effort. This is not WIFOM because if he were town he would not want to confuse us. He would be clear about establishing himself as a townie and the "WIFOM" you speak of wouldn't exist.
Honestly there is no WIFOM, the only possibility for Palmar at this point is scum.
Since you keep saying let's keep him till day 2, I assume you have a better candidate for us to lynch? Why don't you give us that candidate? If not, then let's lynch Palmar, not? Why wait a day and waste a lynch that will potentially hit a townie instead of just killing the almost certain scum in Palmar?
he threatened to dayvig a dayvig last time he rolled town. He even said that he tried to chill a game and tried to troll town until everyone was telling him to stop shooting townies (telepathically thanks to V7's help).
Other alternatives? Sure what about those guys:
11. EchelonTee
20. Ciryandor
30. blahz0r
45. Macpo
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nooo, I was considering voting for you, sandroba or wbg at this point in time and you had the lead 
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On January 14 2012 11:20 VisceraEyes wrote:
No Toad, vote for me! Your vote would be absolutely cherished....like a daisy growing in Antarctica or some shit.
I was tricking you!
You even called it and did not realize what I was doing when you said:
On January 14 2012 09:54 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 09:48 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 03:32 Palmar wrote:On January 14 2012 03:30 VisceraEyes wrote:On January 14 2012 03:16 Palmar wrote:On January 14 2012 03:05 VisceraEyes wrote:Palmar, would you kindly answer the questions I've asked you? Your life could very well be on the line sir. No, your questions are dumb. All right - consider lynching Palmar as part of my platform. If you elect me to office, I promise to lynch scumPalmar as my first act. See, dumb and bad. hey there. According to several people town performance has been pretty bad the last couple of games. What do you say about making a list of all the bad players we have and just do the opposit of what they want to do? Either they're town and wrong or they're mafia and want to protect their buddies. win-win situation! What does this quote even mean? Is this some sort of veiled attack on Palmar? What purpose does this post serve?
I am a mastermind for that was the best veiled attack on Palmar mankind has ever seen. Surly there was noone realizing my true idea behind all this and yet I have to tell you, that I was not serious when suggesting to simply do the opposit of what all the bad players are suggesting
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On January 14 2012 11:51 wherebugsgo wrote:
I'm willing to vote bum for the fact that I like him right now. I think he's
Bum are you willing to lynch Palmar?
I'd be willing to lynch BC too if I continue feeling the way I'm feeling about him. But we'll see. Need more time on that, since BC is much harder to read than Palmar. Palmar's just like lolscum
woke up and I'm at this post.
Yeah I liked bum a lot too but I don't really like the people he likes
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EPT
