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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
Hum.. wondering why the mafia killed Radfield's team, unless they did it because he was Radfield. Almost makes me think we don't have a medic because that's such an obvious person to protect =P. Going through his posts, let's see who he points fingers at / sides with: Radfield + Show Spoiler + --by post number-- 163: calls out 6-9 for 'laying low'. 314: Team 6 - Caller for being inactive, L for creating confusion. (Reads Team 2 as town) 392: Direct analysis of one of DCLXVI's posts, says it screams mafia. Link. Mostly calling them out for inactivity, but also for poor posting. 395: Analysis of Divinek, points out that Divinek has mostly been riding the opinions/words of others. noncommital, etc. 397: Analysis of DCLXVI, says the same things essentially, calls their playing style mafia-like. 398: Analysis of MooCow, same result. Calls to lynch them/calls for thoughts on Team 9. 426: calls for more looking at Team 9. 447: Analysis of bumatlarge, says he has a few decent posts, but otherwise spams a lot. Doesn't get a huge scum vibe from him however. 459: Points out L and Caller's inactivity again. 506: Okay with either lynches (Team 2, or Team 9). Says he reads red on Team 9, but is okay with letting them live for another day. 618: Says some of Ace's posts are scummy, ie. his push for Team 2. Also thinks that L is scummy however (near the top of his suspect list). Summary: Radfield points the finger almost exclusively at Teams 6 and 9... Before his death, he still though L was scummy. The question is, how much of this is Radfield reading poorly, and how of it is accurate? We at least know his thoughts are sincere and pro-town. So keep this in mind I guess. Random Thought: After looking through his posts again, I realize that Radfield (and probably Korynne although I haven't gone through her posts) were decent posts -> good hit for mafia. Add that to the 'entertainment value' for this game, and it makes it the perfect hit? | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
If I had wanted to downplay Radfield's read on Ace, I could've just as easily deleted that from my analysis. I kinda assume that people read my posts in full and therefore would be able to remember that fact. But if I call you scummy in one post and someone else scummy in five posts, which one should I focus on? | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 25 2010 13:52 bumatlarge wrote: I've got a strong feeling that either team 4 or L are mafia. It might not seem like team 4 has done much to warrant it, but I know first hand darth can act completely pro-town, especially in a game with no clues. I'm sure Ace has the ability to play right along side that style of play. Id think L only because hes been so negative in this thread and has acted generally underwhelmed by most everyone's play. But Im not too scared of the prospect of L being mafia. I'm afraid we will definitely lose if team 4 is mafia and not lynched today. I'm going to put my vote on them, as it seems alot of people are in agreement with this line of thought. I'm willing to put the vote on first, as I think this will be a decent time for newer townies to risk themselves against more experienced players. I was fairly cautious as a mafia, but now that we don't have much of an alternative, I'm willing to stay true to the amateur townie habits I've developed. It's a shame I haven't gotten to witness Darth as townie, so I could give him more leniency for his style, but this doesn't seem radically different from his previous game. Thanks for the compliment... But your logic doesn't really make sense. You think I'm pro-town, therefore I must be mafia. What would happen if I seemed like mafia to you? It's an impossible situation for me, which means there's a problem somewhere. Seriously, think about it. If I always seem pro-town, then it's not an aspect of my play you can call me scummy for. I don't think it's bad that the town thought I was pro-town last game, and I don't think it's bad if I come across as pro-town to you this game. That's supposed to say "OK, he's less of a suspect, who looks more suspicious?" If I actually have that good of a playing style (which I doubt), then you can't base my scumminess on that, because it's always the same - therefore, it doesn't indicate my role toward either alignment. And to lynch players because they are 'good' players and might be mafia is just silly, and encourages bad play. Furthermore, if you lynch all the good players, bad players will be left over, and the town will most likely lose because they are bad. If you're going to base this on our last game, I could say the same about you. Your posts seem pretty much the same to me, and I've commented on what I think about them. But I don't call you scummy because of your playing style and I don't consider your previous game style too much. When I call some of your posts scummy, it's because most of your posts aren't that great -> spam -> bad for the thread -> ~scummy. But you've had decent posts too, which is why I didn't push harder for your lynch and think you could easily be town. Anyway. Where do you get your "strong feeling" that either me/Ace or L is mafia? Show me proof. What doesn't match up? Just because I, or Ace, or L have the ability to appear pro-town while being mafia, does not make us mafia. "I'm afraid we will definitely lose if team 4 is mafia and not lynched today." People said that last game too about me being mafia mayor. Town still won. Granted we sorta gave up after the DT checks came in, but having a good player as mafia != autolose for town. Who's in agreement with your line of thought? Maybe L, because he and Ace are still catfighting + because he was vague about who had "terrible posts" in the last couple pages. Maybe Durak even though his point about me in that last post isn't really valid. Maybe Divinek? All he's done is cry about me voting for him to get his team posting more, which ended up happening, more because of Radfield though I guess. Your 'taking a risk' by voting for me isn't a risk at all either. Because you preface your vote with that paragraph, your voting first absolutely nothing about you, because it can be taken either way. "I'm willing to put the vote on first, as I think this will be a decent time for newer townies to risk themselves against more experienced players" This sentence is all fluff, for example. Also, if I'm mafia, why am I posting in a dead thread when I could just let it be? See you all in ~24 hours. I expect Ace to reinforce why your logic doesn't really hold if he needs to. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
L, are you really doing this? If you're town, you're wasting all of our time. First of all, Ace's argument is pretty solid compared to yours. Actually, after the first 2-3 (recent) posts from both of you, you guys just kinda started the name-calling kind of stuff. Didn't I say this earlier this game? You two are so... funny lol =p. Earlier I tried to call a truce between you two because I thought you were town. But now, considering how hard you're pushing to lynch us, and on what I see as mostly lies regarding Ace's play, I'm starting to think that you're mafia. Ace has been saying this all along, but I gave you the benefit of the doubt so to speak. Anyway, tapping out for the night. You'll see my thoughts in the vote thread. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 26 2010 16:08 Nikon wrote: Yeah, I only defend myself, because all you people do is harp on me - my sister's wedding is coming up this Sunday and things are getting quite hectic around here to be honest. It's interesting to note however, that Laxercannon still hasn't posted jack shit, yet me and Zyrre are getting all the flak for being inactive. In fact, the only thing that Laxercannon posted after his "going to take a shower - state an obivous fact" combo was a poorly constructed attack on myself in response to my post - this I find very scummy. Interesting post. 1. Cry about other people calling out his inactivity. 2. Give excuse for being inactive (as if that makes it better?) 3. Point the finger at someone else. 4. Cry more. 5. Continue pointing. 6. Top it off with "this I find very scummy". Nikon, you have a grand total of 12 posts, in ... 4.5 days (?) real time. That's what, 108 hours? Average 1 post every 10ish hours, which would be acceptable if they were huge posts but... they aren't. ^_^. Do you see why we're harping on you? Note: not defending LaXerCannon. He's also been worthless. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 07:11 Nikon wrote: I don't know, if Laxer bothered to provide a solid arguement, we might've had a point. So your point is? That LaXer doesn't have a point? And you think he accused you of being mafia? | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 08:49 DCLXVI wrote: I want to see L and ace argue for another day. I would love to see them both be mafia, but I doubt it. putting my vote on 7 for now for inactivity. Bad reason, but w/e. To generate some discussion, what do we think of this? | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 09:42 L wrote: If you interpret that in that way, then it isn't a grounds for killing someone. Even if you don't think the idea is 100% foolproof (and none are, in this format), that doesn't mean someone is scum for suggesting it unless there's a scum motive behind it. BM's post had nothing of that nature in it, which looks pretty obvious in hindsight. ? Are you... saying the same thing Zyrre is saying? You're right, if you interpret it that way, it's not grounds for killing someone. When was someone killed on the grounds that they were the third voter on the bandwagon? BM's the one who tried to use it as an extra reason for lynching Team 7 (I believe) rather than his own team. And Ace was saying that it's not grounds for killing someone, because the idea isn't in the magical number 3, it's in mafia feeling safe voting as the Xth slot. Day 1, for instance, we have a MASSIVE train on T7. T7 talks up just enough to get back under the radar and survives, mostly due to another push against T2. T9 was the secondary target, but they don't get nailed. Both T7 and T9 look terrible after the voting falls into place as multiple swings make them likely beneficiaries of mafia seeded argumentation and vote swings. If T7 and T9 were both town, the MOMENT night ended and radfield died, mafia members would have started their shit train up. 1 team would spark the move, the other could lay low and just take the heat off. Even if the aggressor team died for their move, they would have a non-suspicious backup in subsequent lynch or die days for town. Was it "MASSIVE"? Really? It had about 1/3 of the votes at its peak, but that was it. The ending trains (T2, T9) had almost the same amount, though not quote. And it wasn't really a lynch train as much as a "post or if you don't THEN we'll lynch you for being bad" train. As least that's how I saw it - YellowInk (?) led the train and was just pressuring them to post more, which they did. The T9 train was... well, some people weren't here for it, ie. Chez-who-could-have-saved-himself, which is why it didn't go through and T2 got lynched instead. Without pushes toward either of those teams, mafia wouldn't have needed to start anything up. After night ended, we didn't have that many posts. The first major thing that happened was bumatlarge pointing the finger at me/Ace and/or you, saying that he has a "strong feeling that either team 4 or L are mafia". Well, that's a good guess, considering he picked 2/7 teams and so has what, ~60% chance of being right on probability alone? (my probability is weak, I did 2/7 + 2/7 if you want to check). And the basis for that argument was that he knows I can play pro-town while being mafia. Then there was more about "1 of Team 4 or L HAS to be mafia" and then the next major thing was you and Ace arguing with each other. So on the one hand, you have a couple major arguments to cover the mafia's inactivity + distract the town, and on the other, you have the fact that Teams 9 hasn't been pressured at all today, and Team 7 was only pressured just recently, and not even that much because of the lack of activity. That didn't happen at all. Instead we had a huge push (read Page 32 and onwards) to create a binary between Ace and I. Even Darth tries to play it up. Generally speaking, the two easiest teams to get killed were ignored by mafia; Why? Well, it follows that one or the other are mafia. I still personally think Ace/Darth is the other mafia team, but I wouldn't be surprised if T7 or 9 was laying low and using the Ace/Me binary to get away with little posting. For the record, I didn't try to play it up? Well I wasn't here while it was happening, but I made like, 1-2 posts about it, said that if you're town, you're wasting all of our times, but otherwise, you're scummy for, well, wasting all of our time when most of the argument is two guys bickering because they don't like each other. From my perspective anyway. In terms of posting habits, Day 2 has produced only 6 pages of discussion. Day 1 produced almost 4 times that. Many people are VERY satisfied with the direction that town is going and many people don't feel the need to post. That is pretty telling in and of itself. To me, that says is that the mafia got rid of the two most active (well, spammy) teams, and the two mafia teams are still alive. I will agree with you though. Right now the mafia are happy that there's been very little posting today. I'm not sure whether it's Team 7 or Team 9 though, because on the one hand, you have that pointless argument between LaXer and Nikon last page (potentially a spam train), but on the other hand, you have the fact that Team 9 hasn't been pressured at all, hence the lack of a bigger spam train? | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 09:49 BrownBear wrote: Either he's like me, and is just amused by the arguing/flaming at this point, or he actually hasn't formed an opinion yet...? At this point in the game, saying something is a bad reason "but w/e" is absolutely inexcusable. Also, team 7 has been mildly active recently (even if it's only defending themselves), so he's not only inexcusably using shitty logic while acknowledging it's shitty, he's also completely and utterly wrong. This seems to me just like a trash post to justify a fairly random vote, and to mask the fact that he hasn't read the thread and probably isn't going to. You don't think of it as a throwaway, 'slick' kind of vote where a mafia tries to pass it off as nothing? You're right. It is a trash post. It is a trash reason at this point. There's no point to killing based on inactivity. MAYBE on day 1 in a larger setup, but definitely not on day 2. I thought it was pretty obvious that I found the post scummy based on the fact that I asked for discussion about it =p. It were implied, BB. On June 27 2010 09:57 YellowInk wrote: L, I agree with your general arguments here, but they also apply in reverse with you being the mafia and Ace/DTA being the town. Since I don't see either of you as having a stronger position as outlined in my earlier posting, I'm after the inactives that have a good chance of being mafia. I agree that the idea that the mafia are comfortable with where things stand is disconcerting, but I don't see any way to make this vote go elsewhere with just over an hour left. I think DCLXVI's vote on Team 7 is trash, so if I were going to agree to any kind of train voting, it'd be on Team 9 for reasons similar to my alignment against Team 7. Consider this a call out - if you're here, post. Just spam "I'm here" if you've got nothing else pressing to say. Killing inactives ain't cool bro. Show me scumminess first. My current vote is half defensive, half L was scummy earlier. I'd almost rather kill Team 9 than Team 7. I'm not sure. What do you guys think? On June 27 2010 10:08 L wrote: I kinda relooked at the votes and it seems that T9 WAS trying to shitball T7 asap after the day started, which would make sense if T7 is town and T9 is mafia as per the above analysis. The only problem I have is that there was very, very little in the way of thread pushing, just very light taps. I am, however, very surprised at the overall level of activity that we're getting from everyone, not just T7. If I could, I'd prefer hitting T9 today because of how it fits into the above pattern, but frankly we don't have enough time to move the train and an attempt to move it would kill me, which means we'd be in Lylo tomorrow and that would be bad. Isn't that the whole idea behind being a mafia? Don't draw too much attention to yourself, light taps, etc.? I think we can move the train. Team 7 train is like 3 votes, dude. The question is if we want to or not. On June 27 2010 10:10 L wrote: Its probably not a trash or random vote. Its probably a way of taking an easier kill instead of drawing attention to mafia by pushing me and having me flip red. If T7 flips town, we're going to have a roller-coaster final 2 days. It's a trash vote. Meaning it's scummy =p. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 10:22 BrownBear wrote: Yass, agreed DTA :D I'm not sure it's scummy yet simply because it's way too obvious of a mistake for a mafia player to make... mostly be just holding DCLXVI to a higher standard of play than that. I wouldn't be that surprised if he were though. nah it's not. Were you there last game (XXVI)? lol. On June 27 2010 10:23 L wrote: I'm not saying being third is grounds for killing someone. I'm saying that suggesting a Jeep tell isn't grounds for being killed. Which is what happened. Because of your partner. Because he said this type of argumentation was obviously a huge scumtell. Clearly he was wrong. Was the largest train we've had this game, with 17 votes. At the time, the next strongest train was only 2/3rds as strong. That's a pretty large lead. Explain this. In depth. Specifically: Why do you know that mafia had to start something up? Who says T7-9 weren't also town? Couldn't they just have cruised to an easy town lynch either way? I think you just outted yourself hard, but we can deal with that tomorrow. Yes you did. You started throwing shit at me on your first post during day 2. Go read it. So you said either I'm town and wasting time because you're obviously 100% legit or I'm mafia and wasting our time because you don't like the way the argument is going? Do you not notice how devoid of content those statements are? uhh can't do quote by quote in the interest of time. I agree. A Jeep tell is not grounds for lynch, nor is suggesting a Jeep tell. Ace likes to exaggerate - there were a lot of other things that he saw in BM that were scummy (and I kind of agree but at the same time, I don't think Ace gave enough credit to BM's half-decent posts). I'm pretty sure he didn't push to lynch BM for that sole reason -_-. True, it was pretty big. I still see it as a pressure vote though. Explaining in depth: assuming either of 7/9 are mafia, if neither of them is in the spotlight anymore, why do they need to do anything besides watch? There was very little discussion going on, Team 1 (main advocate for Team 9) was dead, and YI (main advocate for Team 7 imo) had backed off for the time. Actually, everyone had backed off - there were several comments that "Team 7 stepped it up, etc. etc." So if they (mafia) aren't being pressured, they didn't need a new smokescreen to hide under. And ? I was arguing along YOUR lines. YOU'RE the one who was saying that mafia would've started 'a shit train'. And YOU'RE the one that said, "let's assume one of 7/9 is mafia (theoretical/hypothetical), etc. etc." My post for you here: On June 26 2010 14:53 DarthThienAn wrote: Got in late, and I've got to sleep like now. Early stuff tomorrow. From what I've seen... L, are you really doing this? If you're town, you're wasting all of our time. First of all, Ace's argument is pretty solid compared to yours. Actually, after the first 2-3 (recent) posts from both of you, you guys just kinda started the name-calling kind of stuff. Didn't I say this earlier this game? You two are so... funny lol =p. Earlier I tried to call a truce between you two because I thought you were town. But now, considering how hard you're pushing to lynch us, and on what I see as mostly lies regarding Ace's play, I'm starting to think that you're mafia. Ace has been saying this all along, but I gave you the benefit of the doubt so to speak. Anyway, tapping out for the night. You'll see my thoughts in the vote thread. My opinion was requested (by jspz), so I gave it. I said, "If you're town, you're wasting all of our time." Which you were. The only possible instance of me "throwing shit at you" is "But now, considering how hard you're pushing to lynch us, and on what I see as mostly lies regarding Ace's play, I'm starting to think that you're mafia. Ace has been saying this all along, but I gave you the benefit of the doubt so to speak." From my perspective, Ace's play hasn't been that scummy. Obviously I'm biased but your arguments weren't that convincing -> why are you making a mess out of nothing -> nudge toward scumminess. I haven't said ANYTHING about it since. I haven't pushed to get you lynched (except for my vote), I haven't called this this and that of yours "OH HE'S DEFINITELY SCUM". If you consider those two sentences as "throwing shit at you" then you need to redefine what you consider "throwing shit at you". "So you said either I'm town and wasting time because you're obviously 100% legit or I'm mafia and wasting our time because you don't like the way the argument is going? Do you not notice how devoid of content those statements are?" This is from my perspective. I didn't like where the argument was going, because it was you and Ace arguing about what a Jeep tell was, and not even arguing about how it relates to this game. If you're going to call my posts devoid of content, look at your argument with Ace and tell me that's not devoid of (game-related) content. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 10:28 BrownBear wrote: And where the FUCK is everyone. Inactivity could kill this game. Every reply to L takes a minimum of 10 minutes. No joke :p. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 10:31 DCLXVI wrote: wow I didn't realize throwing my vote on an inactive team to make sure I wouldn't get modkilled would look so scummy. I suppose I should have said that, but you guys seem to love last minute bandwagoning T9... On June 27 2010 10:41 DCLXVI wrote: So I have to love how Darth innocuously drops the "what do you think of this" and then waits to see everyone's opinion before siding with the majority. Has team 7 even voted yet? are they going to get modkilled and we lose if we mislynch?(and they are not mafia) My post was stupid because I didn't clarify and was in a rush, but now I have to vote for 6 or 7 to stay alive. I suppose it is partly my fault for the hasty post, but you guys do overreact quite a bit. Hey look at my last, 4-5 posts, they're all longer than anything you've ever posted I'm pretty sure. Read the original post. The scumminess of the post was implied by my bringing it up in the first place. Nikon's voted. stormtemplar has been missing for days. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 10:51 YellowInk wrote: I note that at the ten minute mark neither DTA nor L have gone to voting on team 9. I'll just watch for these two and if they go to 9, I'm there as well. That's voting power 11 which should have it locked down unless we have mass mafia lurking. But that will give us huge amounts of information as well. On June 27 2010 10:50 DarthThienAn wrote: ##unvote ##Team 9 o.o | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 10:50 L wrote: The problem is that you can't just magically traipse in and say "assuming either of them are mafia they had to do nothing". If either team is mafia, there's quite a bit of importance regarding when it happens. You essentially replied under the guise that mafia had to do something, which they wouldn't unless one of the two pushed teams was mafia. Assuming that 7/9 aren't both mafia, it means that mafia's actions weren't even triggered by pushing 7/9, it was triggered by pushing one or the other of 7/9. Prior to that point, a mafia team would have been doing their best to discredit other posters, which is pretty much what Ace's been doing the entire game, hence why I'm pretty sure that your team is the aggressive mafia in a 4/7 or 4/9 team. I could be wrong, but that's how I see it atm. Sadly it seems impossible for you to get killed today so we'll have to settle for the second best option. I think I misread your previous comment. I thought it was under the assumption that either one of 7/9 was mafia that the mafia would start pointing fingers, etc. I didn't realize you meant a train to get THEM lynched. So dismiss most of what I said earlier if it doesn't make sense. >_> | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On June 27 2010 10:55 YellowInk wrote: DTA just shifted to team 9. If he shifts back to kill L, we'll hang him for it tomorrow (were L to flip town), obviously, since he used that to get my and L's vote to shift off of team 7. I see no reason for DTA to be insincere in this, it's lose lose for him. I'm doing it for the lols. I'm going to switch back right now  | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
Hey L, sign up for my game, it'll be funny. | ||
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
http://excoboard.com/somethingveryverysecret gg all ^^ | ||
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