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2021 LoL Esports General Discussion - Page 3

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Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9289 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-05-30 22:20:14
May 30 2021 22:15 GMT
#41
I checked the LEC and LCS schedules in liquipedia and realized that players from the non-playoff teams got 3 months long vacation after the spring split. The rest, excluding the MSI teams, isn't that far behind them. This is silly. Even if Riot doesn't want to organize something for them, they could still allow a third party to do that, though I'm not sure if team owners in this franchised environment would be interested in participating.
You're now breathing manually
chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
May 31 2021 00:44 GMT
#42
How would that work though? MSI is a month long and there is no way Riot would or should let a third party compete with them for views.
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
May 31 2021 00:46 GMT
#43
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chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
May 31 2021 02:29 GMT
#44
Then when are players supposed to take breaks? Just have 3/4 of the year be professional play and 1/4 of the year be downtime?
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35172 Posts
May 31 2021 03:19 GMT
#45
The real problem is when a team has consistent success. Going from Spring, to MSI, to Summer, to at least quarters at Worlds means you only really get from elimination to the end of the offseason to decompress. Then, if you were on that team and are now looking for another team, then even that can get harshed.

The season can start later and the post Spring => Summer gap for non playoff teams is too long.
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
May 31 2021 17:00 GMT
#46
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chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
May 31 2021 18:07 GMT
#47
Even if they keep going playing solo Q isn't close to the same thing as scrimming and being competitive for a split. I think it was Perkz during the 2019 G2 Worlds run was talking about how by finals he didn't even feel like a person and he just wanted it to be over win or lose. They definitely do need breaks. Plus the breaks as they currently stand also serve as a chance for teams to retool failed experiments from Spring for a push to worlds, so they need the offseason as much as the players do.

I don't know what the answer is, and I think Riot has a lot more to fix before they tackle offseasons that are slightly too long
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
May 31 2021 18:43 GMT
#48
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chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-05-31 19:10:26
May 31 2021 19:07 GMT
#49
That goes back to the whole "why don't teams use their academy rosters in the regular season while the main team scrims in Korea" argument. There's literally 1 team in the entire league that could do that and have it not be embarrassing. So how would those same teams, TL/C9/TSM adequately give the rest to their players without harming their standings?

Now you could definitely argue that because of how utterly stupid NA's format is there's no reasonable way that those top three could fuck up their standings based on their spring splits, but that's a separate topic. Side note, holy shit I forgot Summer was TRIPLE round robin. Whos ready for the second coming of play in MSI group A.
Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9289 Posts
May 31 2021 19:12 GMT
#50
What's silly is the amount of downtime players from bottom teams get, both those who get eliminated early in the playoffs and who don't make it there at all. They spend like a third of the year with no opportunity to win anything or even gain exposure from playing in a serious event.
You're now breathing manually
chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-05-31 19:23:37
May 31 2021 19:21 GMT
#51
Again, how do you fix that? Do you run a reverse MSI where the regions worst teams compete? Do you do a tournament with qualifiers that you can only enter if you reached X place or worse in the regular split/play offs? When would that take place?

Said tournament would never ever be allowed to interfere with MSI so you either have to make it before or after. If you don't bar the good teams from playing their orgs WILL make them play in said tournament, so having a qualifier would still just result in the best teams in the region have yet another event to play in that they don't want to, ala Rift Rivals. If you do bar the top orgs from playing who's going to watch it? Would anyone really want to watch an international tournament where a group could be Brion/IMT/AXIS/KLG (random low placing teams from the same respective regions as group C MSI)? I mean maybe for kicks?
DarkCore
Profile Joined March 2011
Germany4194 Posts
May 31 2021 19:47 GMT
#52
On June 01 2021 04:12 Sent. wrote:
What's silly is the amount of downtime players from bottom teams get, both those who get eliminated early in the playoffs and who don't make it there at all. They spend like a third of the year with no opportunity to win anything or even gain exposure from playing in a serious event.


I think it evens out, they can still scrim and have more time to figure out why their roster performed poorly. It's a good time for intensive coaching because they don't have to prepare for an opponent every week.

I do wish there were more minor tournaments though. Something like a Europa League for mid tier teams. But it would probably be abysmal quality, LPL and LCK are stacked, but LEC and LCS fall off hard outside of the top teams, I expect the same for minor regions.
Fixed a bug where LeBlanc could lose
Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9289 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-05-31 19:55:35
May 31 2021 19:55 GMT
#53
On June 01 2021 04:21 chipmonklord17 wrote:
Again, how do you fix that? Do you run a reverse MSI where the regions worst teams compete? Do you do a tournament with qualifiers that you can only enter if you reached X place or worse in the regular split/play offs? When would that take place?

Said tournament would never ever be allowed to interfere with MSI so you either have to make it before or after. If you don't bar the good teams from playing their orgs WILL make them play in said tournament, so having a qualifier would still just result in the best teams in the region have yet another event to play in that they don't want to, ala Rift Rivals. If you do bar the top orgs from playing who's going to watch it? Would anyone really want to watch an international tournament where a group could be Brion/IMT/AXIS/KLG (random low placing teams from the same respective regions as group C MSI)? I mean maybe for kicks?


There's no need to intefere with MSI or to organize an interregional event. You could take bottom tier LEC teams and top national teams and have them play in something like EU masters, with games being scheduled on Thursdays or right before MSI games. There's also enough time to hold a shorter tournament after MSI. Yeah, the viewership would be much lower than usual, but it's still better than nothing. Make it a normal event with a standard structure instead of weird stuff like Rift Rivals or super weird stuff like All-stars.

If EU masters is a sanctity they don't want to tinker with, they could try to organize something with bottom tier LEC teams and top Turkish/CIS teams. NA could do the same with Brazilian and Latin American teams.
You're now breathing manually
chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-05-31 20:17:27
May 31 2021 20:14 GMT
#54
If it isn't an international event do you think that it would degrade the meaning of playoffs in the region if those who make playoffs have a chance at qualifying for MSI, but those that don't are still qualified for this other tournament? Like why not just make regular season a seeding system for a tournament with all 10 teams in it for play offs at that point?

I can't stress enough that I agree with you that the current format gives potentially too much time off for bad teams and definitely too little time off for good teams, but I don't know what can be done about it in reality juggling the need to not interfere with MSI, while giving teams enough time to make roster moves and get into the swing of things for summer while making it so the solution isn't "well what if everyone has too little time off"
Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9289 Posts
May 31 2021 21:59 GMT
#55
I think it would be fine. There would be no doubt that this other tournament is for teams who aren't good enough to compete with the best. Winning such tournament should be about as impressive as placing top 5-6 in LCS/LEC playoffs.

Team owners probably wouldn't agree to participate in such system though. Imagine getting demolished by an amateur team and having to come up with an explanation why they shouldn't replace you in the main league.
You're now breathing manually
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
June 01 2021 02:12 GMT
#56
--- Nuked ---
Uldridge
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Belgium5090 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-06-01 12:59:50
June 01 2021 12:57 GMT
#57
Not playing in the LCS or a tournament isn't time off, JimmiC
There's still scrims, meetings, soloQ grinding, fundamentals that need to be brushed up and more cerebral things like understanding the meta. Their careers are playing the game at the highest level, playing the game outside of the scope of a tournament is therefore not necessarily time off.
Taxes are for Terrans
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
June 01 2021 18:01 GMT
#58
--- Nuked ---
chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
June 01 2021 22:47 GMT
#59
Again I think that's also ignoring that fact that players are being traded/joining other teams and negotiating etc. Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge huge proponent for every region having a Kespa/Demacia Cup event after worlds and before the next spring split where the tier 1 teams and tier 2 teams play in a tournament together. But I definitely agree that not all time spent not on stage isn't time off.
chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
June 07 2021 12:28 GMT
#60
Scout is now an LPL resident, so expect EDG to import a top or a jungle player in the offseason
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