EPTbasically exactly what I said would happen when it was introduced.
[Patch 8.12] Shield Champ Nerfs General Discussion - Page 6
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
basically exactly what I said would happen when it was introduced. | ||
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Volband
Hungary6034 Posts
On June 16 2018 09:14 Fildun wrote: SC2 would've never popped off. My eyes hurt.... the most influential e-sport title was without a doubt Brood War, and here I am reading a 1v1 game would have never popped off. | ||
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Uldridge
Belgium5232 Posts
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Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
On June 21 2018 03:23 Uldridge wrote: What % of games are enjoyable for you guys? All of them. I love the current meta (or lack of). | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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St3MoR
Spain3256 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Fildun
Netherlands4124 Posts
On June 20 2018 18:18 Volband wrote: My eyes hurt.... the most influential e-sport title was without a doubt Brood War, and here I am reading a 1v1 game would have never popped off. Brood War also never popped off. We also weren't talking about esports. Both my brain and my eyes, in fact my entire body hurts after reading the sentence you've just written. | ||
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loSleb
Austria1389 Posts
O R T N I T E | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On June 20 2018 18:18 Volband wrote: My eyes hurt.... the most influential e-sport title was without a doubt Brood War, and here I am reading a 1v1 game would have never popped off. If you completely ignore the context around BW esports developing in the late 90s and early 2000s and the shift of gaming across the next decade then sure you could be outraged. Instead look at the environment SC2 was coming into. RTS genre was basically dead. The game managed to cause a semi-revival due to BW history and Blizzard name but that doesn't last very long. People quickly find out why the genre has faded from the greater gaming public again after nostalgia wears off. SC2 just could never actually make the impact BW did. It would either be too late or too early and thus compete with BW. I'm also not sure it's correct to say the most influential esport title is BW without a doubt. I could see arguments for other titles. It's no doubt influential but what exactly does "most" mean? How do you quantify that? | ||
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Uldridge
Belgium5232 Posts
Infrastructure, TV rights, commercials, all that stuff was shown to work in Korea, and was taking serious there. So why not transfer that to the West? That's why BW, which was taken under Korea's wing, is the most influential game. Though we should rather say that Korea is the most influential country when it comes to the Esports scene. I know that CS and Quake and other games had a pro scene (and let's not forget how dedicated and organized people can be to MMORPGs; WoW, Everquest, ...), but Korea was more mature than any other country (community?) and treated as a completely serious issue. It took a while before Western teams even took LoL serious (like coaches started being a thing in season 4?) | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8938 Posts
On June 21 2018 06:33 Fildun wrote: Brood War also never popped off. We also weren't talking about esports. Both my brain and my eyes, in fact my entire body hurts after reading the sentence you've just written. ? wat. the entire korean esports industry was founded by brood war. when a single game creates a multi million dollar industry thats actually recognised by the government, im not sure what more you want for a game to "pop off". volbands eyes hurting reading your nonsense is justified. also you do realise the very sites you are commenting on exist because of brood war | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On June 21 2018 06:55 Uldridge wrote: BW laid down the groundworks for modern esports. People looked at Korea to adopt their style of seriousness about games being played professionally. I mean, gaming houses weren't a thing before. Now they are. Coaching staff wasn't, now it is. Infrastructure, TV rights, commercials, all that stuff was shown to work in Korea, and was taking serious there. So why not transfer that to the West? That's why BW, which was taken under Korea's wing, is the most influential game. Though we should rather say that Korea is the most influential country when it comes to the Esports scene. I know that CS and Quake and other games had a pro scene (and let's not forget how dedicated and organized people can be to MMORPGs; WoW, Everquest, ...), but Korea was more mature than any other country (community?) and treated as a completely serious issue. It took a while before Western teams even took LoL serious (like coaches started being a thing in season 4?) See I find this all subjective and circumstantial without any real evidence to back it up. Take for instance the idea that the West looked at Korean BW and took their respective esports seriously. Brood War audience outside of Korea was rather small and niche, it wasn't particularly known or popular. You had events like Quakecon and CPL league forming in the mid to late 90s before Brood War even came out. It was clearly gaining traction in the West. I think if anything the biggest thing BW might have done for the West is help form the WCG which really got the movement off the ground around the world. After that there were repeated attempts to bring traditional TV and other aspects of sporting to esport in the West but it almost always failed horribly. It working in Korea with BW didn't actually translate to anything tangible in the West and actively harmed it. When CGS completely collapsed and teams were going under from the inflated salaries esports was in a very dark place. SC2 and Justin.tv were a huge revival phase, propelling it to where it is today. One could argue without BW there wouldn't have been a SC2 revival phase. It's tough to say. Was it just a perfect storm of timing? Anyway all I'm really trying to get at is that there are so many factors at work in the global scale that it's hard to really say "X is more influential than Y". They most likely all played some part to play in getting us to this point. I think we tend to overstate Koreans influence just due to being fans of Broodwar. | ||
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Uldridge
Belgium5232 Posts
Like I said, Korea didn't blow BW up internationally, but Korea, through the vessel of BW, helped shape the Esport scene today. The infrastructure and how things are handled probably are heavily borrowed from how Korea handled it all in the past. I'm not really saying BW was more influential, I'm saying Korea is the grandfather of Esports in its current form. | ||
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General_Winter
United States719 Posts
On June 21 2018 03:23 Uldridge wrote: What % of games are enjoyable for you guys? Most of them. Same as usual. I’m top / jungle so it doesn’t really effect me that much. Ganking bot lane can be a bit more chaotic than usual, but it’s fun. People in my games ban karrhus and Yi so I don’t run into weird funneling strays. Overall things are mostly the same. When I get top I am an island and complain about not getting any ganks. When I’m jungle I mute top and just camp bot lane. | ||
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Uldridge
Belgium5232 Posts
Ok maybe 5% is a bit of a stretch, but it's far below 50% for me, more around the 10-15% region and that's being generous. You guys are having fun it seems. But could the game be even more fun for you? Let's say matchmaking succeeds in giving you competitive games in about 99% of the time, would you enjoy it more than you do now or wouldn't it change that much? | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Uldridge
Belgium5232 Posts
I guess a snowball is what happens most of the time because of an early pre 20 minute play, but turn around still happen (people throw, teams get outscaled, someone does something insanely good, ...), but it still feels bad to just roll over at a certain point. The worst games are the one's where your team (and you by extension) literally rolls over because they're either too afraid to die (passive) or can't damage the enemy team. What is the point of no return in League? What gold lead is still surmountable? Is it within the 10% leading gold amount, or is it bigger? And how soon should that boundary between surmountable and insurmountable be met? I feel like 20 minute mark is a good benchmark for time because then you can forfeit with 4 instead of unanimously, but too often is there a broken morale or internal strife that makes getting to that 20th minute hell. So my question is this (next to a whole bunch of other questions): how many games are decided before that good (for me it's 20, for others it might be earlier or later, give me your opinions) timepoint where you feel like you've had a good, close game and even if you want to win (and are trying to), winning or losing doesn't really matter, but the experience does instead? | ||
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
If you can't find something to enjoy in a game even when it's not particularly close then this game isn't made for you. Whether it's trying to go for the most efficient finish or for the flashiest plays when you are far ahead, or carefully looking for opportunities to come back when behind, or just straight up memeing when you don't think you have much of a shot, if you don't find any of these things enjoyable, I'd probably recommend doing things other than videogames to be perfectly honest. | ||
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