WW had real kill pressure once every 3 minutes.

Also, no one bought wards early game.

Lee Sin used to be able to get first blood or deny a whole wave top against all top laners with just EQ. The Cripple slow was huge, red buff hurt a lot, and both top laners were always pushing to not get wrecked. Chances are top lane was like Nid (who didn't get cougar till 6 then), Cho, Malp, a fair bit of Panth, and Jax. Even Jax died cuz no one ever really saved jump.

Lots of top laners didn't even flash, because Lee would hold his Q, and they'd be slowed by like 80% with red + Cripple stack. There is probably VoD's somewhere of SmashGizmo raging about it. You could just Red > Gank ezpz.

You could likely just red gank right now actually, Riot eventually nerfed it so that junglers didn't hit 2 off one camp anymore. No one in soloqueue really wards at that timing, you'd be there like 1:50.

JazzVortical

Australia1825 Posts

May 08 2016 11:44 GMT

#263

What about those beta TF ganks?

Dandel Ion

Austria17960 Posts

May 08 2016 11:53 GMT

#264

On May 08 2016 20:44 JazzVortical wrote:
What about those beta TF ganks?

pshh overrated just flash the gold card while its still in flight

iCanada

Canada10660 Posts

May 08 2016 11:56 GMT

#265

TF players would have to level gate for that. Only nubs level E, cuz good players dont have to base.

Holy shit the nostalgia.

+ Show Spoiler +

The Madreds Bloodrazer rush by Phreak. 2 gud.

JimmiC

Canada22817 Posts

May 08 2016 13:31 GMT

#266

--- Nuked ---

iCanada

Canada10660 Posts

May 08 2016 15:05 GMT

#267

Yeah, I bet you could start snowballing real hard with em. Until people start warding at that time that is. Although, I guess if people are warding at that time, then they dont have a trinket ward for the standard timing.

That being said, I dont think they will be as free as LeeSin lvl 2 ganks top with old pre-pre-pre nerf Cripple and old red buff in Season 2.

Fildun

Netherlands4124 Posts

May 08 2016 15:16 GMT

#268

Well, in all seriousness, I don't really see how anybody could die to a level 2 gank at the moment, unless they misplay badly.
If you just blow a flash, it's still not worth considering how much it sets you back on your jungle path (and possible counterjungling from the enemy jungler).

Prog

United Kingdom1470 Posts

May 08 2016 15:19 GMT

#269

People die to lvl 2 cheese ganks in botlane all the time.

Fildun

Netherlands4124 Posts

May 08 2016 15:33 GMT

#270

But, how.
Unless both sides are already allining I don't really see how that happens.
And if your entire plan hinges on the enemy botlane committing to a fight I don't think it works all that often.

nafta

Bulgaria18893 Posts

May 08 2016 15:40 GMT

#271

On May 09 2016 00:33 Fildun wrote:
But, how.
Unless both sides are already allining I don't really see how that happens.
And if your entire plan hinges on the enemy botlane committing to a fight I don't think it works all that often.

Because it is soloq and nobody expects it.

kongoline

6318 Posts

May 08 2016 15:44 GMT

#272

didnt bjerg die to kikis lvl2 gank ? :D

iCanada

Canada10660 Posts

May 08 2016 15:56 GMT

#273

RNG.mlxg literally got first blood four times in group play at MSI using level 2 ganks. I think he was even Graves the one game. Granted, one time it was a flashless Huhi, but still. If pros fall for it, soloqueue players will too. The number of times I've thwarted a Shaco cheese invade to then have him just walk into lane level 2 and grab a kill is pretty absurd.

You give people too much credit Fildun. At the very least, I think your likely to get a summoner if you were to show up to lane as first wards die like 1:50.

Fildun

Netherlands4124 Posts

May 08 2016 17:36 GMT

#274

Well yes, obviously you get a summoner if you execute well, but usually you'll need some form of cc to make it work and since most cc is skillshot based you should be able to just flash and be fine versus 90% of level 2 ganks.

Amui

Canada10567 Posts

May 08 2016 18:11 GMT

#275

On May 09 2016 02:36 Fildun wrote:
Well yes, obviously you get a summoner if you execute well, but usually you'll need some form of cc to make it work and since most cc is skillshot based you should be able to just flash and be fine versus 90% of level 2 ganks.

Let's say enemy top laner is riven. You go top, your top baits a bit, and the enemy riven blows everything the instant they hit level 2. Boom free kill or flash. Especially with the current common tops, mao has 2 hard cc's at level 2, ekko has 1 + slows for days, and poppy can flash E and Q slow.

Nobody expects the level 2 gank in the current meta, and despite the fact that you get fucked if it doesn't work, it's still very, very strong.

Fildun

Netherlands4124 Posts

May 08 2016 18:26 GMT

#276

That's only the case when your toplaner plays someone with a bunch of cc at level 2 already, which is basically poppy and mao (dont consider ekko to have that much cc at level 2) and the enemy toplaner plays a pretty aggressive champion, which I don't see much of in soloq.
I think this falls within the 10% I previously mentioned and it's still not a guaranteed kill if he uses his flash well.

RagequitBM

Canada2270 Posts

May 08 2016 20:59 GMT

#277

I feed level 2 every game as ADC

I just push for 2 and all in with my supp, get ganked and feed a double. And then next game I do the exact same thing. I'm bad

kongoline

6318 Posts

May 08 2016 21:23 GMT

#278

lvl2 ganks are cheesy because if u fail u will be super behind and enemy jungler will take ur buff but saying it doesnt work is stupid, if anything lvl2 success rate is much higher than lvl3

cLutZ

United States19574 Posts

May 08 2016 21:56 GMT

#279

Honestly, lvl 2 ganks work even if they "fail". Half the time the exp loss means that guy will just feed a solokill. The trouble is the super failed ones where minions just clown you and your laners, and most junglers don't know the difference.

MuddyJam

535 Posts

May 08 2016 23:37 GMT

#280

On May 09 2016 06:56 cLutZ wrote:
Honestly, lvl 2 ganks work even if they "fail". Half the time the exp loss means that guy will just feed a solokill. The trouble is the super failed ones where minions just clown you and your laners, and most junglers don't know the difference.

if enemy jungle is worth anything you will lose your all the rest of your jungle putting you miles behind.
That guy HAS to stomp lane from that cheese which is alot of faith to have in random soloQ player