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In an interview with team yoe Flash Wolves analyst Fluidwind, he made some interesting comments regarding relative regional strength between LMS, LCS, LPL and LCK.
"We scrimmed versus TSM and thought we were really close -- but they're stronger than us in strategy. They use hard-engage comps like Sivir/Annie -- we usually play Janna or Morgana to secure our AD carry's damage and use long-range champions to defeat them in team fights, and aren't 100% confident with their team comp. Their team members have very good skill -- I think Bjergsen was the best mid laner of that tournament."
"We think [top LMS teams] are almost the same as LCS NA and EU's best teams -- not that easy to defeat them, but not easy to defeat us either. But I think LPL and Korea are still stronger. EDG is stronger than GE Tigers—we scrimmed with EDG and they're really hard to play against. The LCK teams aren't at the same level."
"I don't think we'd have a chance to win versus EDG in a Best of 5," admitted Steak, at least for now. He expects EDG to have a significant advantage come the Mid Season Invitational. But he's confident that the Wolves -- and everybody else -- will reach parity by October.
http://euw.lolesports.com/articles/rising-tides-yoe-flash-wolves-give-hope-taiwan
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I thought we already established that China top teams are better since they're the ones with all the good players now
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I think Korea is likely the more constistent region overall. In terms of skill I would put most teams in Korea over their counterparts in the standings in China. EDG though I feel is several cuts above the rest in China right now and very likely better than GE. This is obviously only speculation though as there's really no way to know with both teams having never played eachother. Even the regions as a whole have yet to play any matches against one another save a hanful of matches from IEM.
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Does this surprise anyone? EDG has been looking ridiculous this season.
BTW, Marin finally overtook Deft for the #1 spot on the Korean ladder. So Korea's got that going for them.
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I find that people can't seem to separate two things properly:
EDG vs GE.
and
Korea vs China.
EDG is a very good team, they are just as, if not more dominant in China than GE in Korea. Deft looks like the best AD in the world (again, deft the real king of spring), Pawn has ascended and is probably only behind Faker when it comes to the combination of champion pool+skill. I think clearlove is fine, bengi level or so, but no great team has a great jungler right now and Koro + Meiko do things properly to support the team.
This isn't Samsung White, or even Samsung Blue. Both those teams were better than EDG or GE, but that EDG is this good really means very little about the rest of the region (which also has a ton of teams).
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On April 03 2015 07:33 cLutZ wrote:
I find that people can't seem to separate two things properly:
EDG vs GE.
and
Korea vs China.
EDG is a very good team, they are just as, if not more dominant in China than GE in Korea. Deft looks like the best AD in the world (again, deft the real king of spring), Pawn has ascended and is probably only behind Faker when it comes to the combination of champion pool+skill. I think clearlove is fine, bengi level or so, but no great team has a great jungler right now and Koro + Meiko do things properly to support the team.
This isn't Samsung White, or even Samsung Blue. Both those teams were better than EDG or GE, but that EDG is this good really means very little about the rest of the region (which also has a ton of teams).
I have to disagree with you on Clearlove. I don't know if you've watched a lot of their games this split but this guy is the true carry of the team in my humble opinion. In terms of performance this split, he is on par with spirit/kakao and far exceeded dandy. Just look at his amazing Lee Sin play and consider that this was one of his worse champions last year.
He's by far the best Chinese jungler and probably a top 3 jungler in the world. He is much, much better than bengi.
I don't know if this team can ever match SSW in terms of strategy, but they are definitely on par with them on individual talents.
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I think Clearlove is good at taking advantage of his lanes giving him freedom (which is why I gave the Bengi example), but I guess the thing that may sway my opinions is that I only really watch matches between the top 5/6 teams in the LPL, or Starhorn right when Namei came back.
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On April 03 2015 08:25 chosenkerrigan wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2015 07:33 cLutZ wrote:
I find that people can't seem to separate two things properly:
EDG vs GE.
and
Korea vs China.
EDG is a very good team, they are just as, if not more dominant in China than GE in Korea. Deft looks like the best AD in the world (again, deft the real king of spring), Pawn has ascended and is probably only behind Faker when it comes to the combination of champion pool+skill. I think clearlove is fine, bengi level or so, but no great team has a great jungler right now and Koro + Meiko do things properly to support the team.
This isn't Samsung White, or even Samsung Blue. Both those teams were better than EDG or GE, but that EDG is this good really means very little about the rest of the region (which also has a ton of teams). I have to disagree with you on Clearlove. I don't know if you've watched a lot of their games this split but this guy is the true carry of the team in my humble opinion. In terms of performance this split, he is on par with spirit/kakao and far exceeded dandy. Just look at his amazing Lee Sin play and consider that this was one of his worse champions last year. He's by far the best Chinese jungler and probably a top 3 jungler in the world. He is much, much better than bengi. I don't know if this team can ever match SSW in terms of strategy, but they are definitely on par with them on individual talents.
Eh, I'd say clearlove is top 4, but he has the most to work with out of the 4. Kakao can only gank 2 lanes, Dandy can hardly gank any, and Spirit is a miracle worker in all honesty. Clearlove's team works incredibly well together and he has great synergy with his support and Pawn. Their skirmishing skills in 2v2s and 3v3s is really fucking good. I'd honestly put Spirit at #1 right now and the other 3 as 2-4 in whatever order. We'll see how good he is on tank champions this next patch. His nunu was pretty good, but I think he relied on lee sin a bit too much for his best performances.
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No way Flash Wolves will reach parity by October.
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On April 03 2015 11:19 FeltFace wrote:
No way Flash Wolves will reach parity by October.
Parity with the LPL? Probably not.
Parity with the rest of the world? I think they proved that at IEM (1-0 vs c9, 1-1 vs sk, 1-2 vs tsm).
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If you think Clearlove is Benji level, you don't watch LPL. There are games where Clearlove basically needs to carry 4v6 in the game because Pawn is trolling his ass off. Spirit has played mid-late games rather lackluster. He just stands out because he powered up to god level during IEM, and even then had some strange team fight engages. If you watched him post 15 minutes in any of WE's games, the team fighting just isn't. I jumped on the Spirit hype train during IEM but domestically now, WE hasn't changed all that much tbh. The game is still determined by whether or not their mid/bot can snowball because Spirit has the best first 15 minutes of the game atm. I know this is an unpopular view given how prominent Spirit does stand out on his team but I actually put Kakao/Clearlove > Dandy/Spirit atm. Dandy is just hard as hell to rank simply because his team looks so awkward. I literally can't tell what VG's style even is.
Then again, I can be eating my shoe in seven hours when Spirit and CL faces off  .
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LPL still plays on the patch where the first 15 minutes is the most important for junglers though...
Whats a good Clearlove game where Pawn was getting dumpstered but he carried?
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On April 03 2015 12:28 cLutZ wrote:
LPL still plays on the patch where the first 15 minutes is the most important for junglers though...
Whats a good Clearlove game where Pawn was getting dumpstered but he carried?
The last three games Clearlove have had Lee Sin . They're fairly recent and I forget against who except one game was against SHRC.
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The troll game with Katarina? The super-deft juggermaw game? (Pawn did well in both those lanes...) Or are you talking about something from Demacia cup (which I havent seen).
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On April 03 2015 12:25 KissBlade wrote:If you think Clearlove is Benji level, you don't watch LPL. There are games where Clearlove basically needs to carry 4v6 in the game because Pawn is trolling his ass off. Spirit has played mid-late games rather lackluster. He just stands out because he powered up to god level during IEM, and even then had some strange team fight engages. If you watched him post 15 minutes in any of WE's games, the team fighting just isn't. I jumped on the Spirit hype train during IEM but domestically now, WE hasn't changed all that much tbh. The game is still determined by whether or not their mid/bot can snowball because Spirit has the best first 15 minutes of the game atm. I know this is an unpopular view given how prominent Spirit does stand out on his team but I actually put Kakao/Clearlove > Dandy/Spirit atm. Dandy is just hard as hell to rank simply because his team looks so awkward. I literally can't tell what VG's style even is. Then again, I can be eating my shoe in seven hours when Spirit and CL faces off .
A lot of that has to do with how his team follows up... He was on the most godlike teamfighting team in league history and now he's on WE. WE without spirit is an LSPL team. Xiye literally feeds solo kills when Spirit isn't watching over him like a hawk.
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MMM those clearlove games with U. As expected.
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On April 04 2015 14:24 cLutZ wrote:
MMM those clearlove games with U. As expected.
The problem was Deft with Kalista...
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I thought the Sejuani game was bad...
But they were probably both troll games considering they let WE pick Ahri and Leblanc.
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Deft has not played a single kalista game this season and he is not very impressive on that champ.
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EPT
