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This is the most competitive NA LCS split we've ever had and that's not an empty platitude. You could make an case for nearly any of the teams doing exceptionally well this year. Very tough to call.
I think it broadly comes down to how well you think the mixed language rosters will integrate. Particularly in cases like Dig where the Korean players were not bossing their scene at any point. It's fair to say it's likely going to work out in some cases, and fail spectacularly in others, with the factors contributing to success being impossible to predict without being close to the scene. That said:
1. C9. Impossible to bet against them. Solid worlds performance, very strong performance at IEM. Crucially they have always been one of the teams that has adapted best to changes in the game. Teams that make good objective decisions will be stronger than ever in season 5 and there's none better in NA than C9.
2. TL. Next three are really tough, but I put TL here because on paper, they have one of the strongest rosters in the League. I rate Piglet and Xpecial as 2 of the best players in their respective positions, with IWD and Quas not far behind. Fenix is a wild card, but he doesn't lose them games I like TL's chances. The curse will be broken.
3. CLG. Again, I rate their roster across the board. Rush hour was the premier botlane for the majority of Summer and Zion is far more flexible than people give him credit for. Link is Link. He'll be serviceable during the regular season and the question marks will hover over him when playoffs roll around. Xmithie has pedigree as one of the best low econ junglers of season 3, something CLG desperately needs. What I like about CLG this year is there's no fancy roll swaps or foreign players, just proven players who (with the possible exception of Link) have been among the best at their position in NA in the not too distant past.
4. TSM. TSM have problems, but it's hard to bet hard against them. I've seen nothing to suggest Santorin is an LCS level Jungler, but it's hard to think players like Bjergsen, Lustboy and Dyrus will drop too far from their previous levels.
5. Impulse. Honestly one of the hardest teams to evaluate. On one hand you have an elite Korean toplaner, and XWX who was second only to Bjergsen in terms of NA midlaners in Summer. On the other hand I've never heard of their Jungler and the best that can be said about Wizfujjiin is that he potentially might not be terrible. The dead center seems to be the right place for them.
6. Winterfox. Another one of the teams that could swing wildly. I'm a huge Altec fan, and Pobs is a strong player who grew more consistent as 2014 wore on. On the other hand I'm hugely skeptical about Avalon. Brotherly love has destroyed better teams than Winterfox (RIP Vulcun) and without any data about this guy it's easy to suspect nepotism.
7. Dignitas. Gamsu comes highly rated, but I still think it'll be a tough year for Dig. Kiwi/CoreJJ seems like a really shaky botlane, and I don't rate Shiphtur as someone to turn a losing team around.
8. Gravity. Difficult to rate them too highly in an extremely competitive split. I'd love to see honorary aussie Keane blow the competition away but I don't see it happening.
9. Coast. I've always liked Impaler and Sheep. Both have been quiet but effective performers. On the other hand I've never rated Jesiz or Mashme and they have one of the weakest players in the league in Cris.
10. T8. Snuck past Complexity (who in fairness had improved over the split) to get into LCS. Looked decent in patches but it's hard to see them getting past too many teams in a stacked league.
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1. C9
2. TSM
3. TL
4. Gravity
5. Winterfox
6. Impulse
7. CLG
8. Coast
9. Dig
10. T8
Anyone rating CLG in the top 5 is in a dream world. Link can't even be put in the same category as most of the mid laners in NA right now. Zion is only good if he's on a champ called Jax or Nasus. We haven't seen anything from Xmithie for a long time now, but he comes from a team that's not used to having a good work ethic. So he fits in at CLG. Rush hour is strong. But look at IEM, they looked so weak.
Dig is getting close to being relegated with Kiwi. Kiwi is a joke and it's mind boggling that he's still on a team. Having a support engage fights by having bad decision making and getting caught out is not a good strategy.
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1. C9
2. TL
3. TSM
4. WFX
5. Gravity
6. CLG
7. TiP
8. Dig
9. T8
10. Coast
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1: Cloud 9 - Still a strong team with excellent synergy and adaptation to emerging strategies.
2: Team Liquid - Excellent ending to last split and now improved bot lane.
3: Gravity - First bold choice, I think that their individual skill is nothing to sleep on and they've definitely got a decent handle on strategies. I believe they have a lot of potential to start mediocre and then improve throughout the rest of the split. I'd put them minimum of 6th, but I believe in the potential.
4: Counter Logic Gaming - Another team I think is being slept on, I think they have a real chance to improve on some old inconsistencies, especially in picks and bans. Safer mids are also making a comeback which take some pressure off Link's performance.
5: Winterfox - Altec and Pobelter having a good chance to carry combined with Helios' experience in the jungle sounds like a formula for success, but I'm worried about the bot lane synergy and the somewhat random top lane pick up doesn't inspire confidence.
6: Team Solo Mid - I admit bias against them but with a predicted general strategic improvement across the league I don't think they're gonna be keeping up. With jungle being a more important roll in the new season, especially strategically, the inexperience with Santorin the jungle and possible lack of synergy could be an easy weakness to exploit.
7: Team 8 - A decent amount of individual skill and some good carry potential. Might be a bit bold but I think there's a good chance that they'll avoid the relegation.
8: Team Coast - I want to see Impaler do well, and I definitely think he's a player who can carry from the jungle, but the rest of the team is just mediocre. I don't have much faith in the strength of their strategy.
9: Dignitas - Losing a lot of their carry potential, with Shiphtur's tilting habits I can't see them doing well if they don't start out well. The loss of synergy makes me lose faith in the team.
10: Team Impulse - I admit that this is bold and I'm probably sleeping on them, but having 1 player from their old lineup, possible communication problems, being hamstrung in their choice of talent because of the possible communication issues and only 2 real potential carries. I'm just not convinced.
EDIT: TSM moved down to 6th from 4th, considering the much higher objective focus of the new season TSM will have a lot to change if they want to remain successful. Also swapped Dignitas and Team Coast, similar reasons, but also a lack of faith in the imports made me reflect on their placement.
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1. C9
2. TL
3.-4. TSM , WFX
5.-6. TiP , CLG
7.DIG
8.-9.-10. GRV, T8, CST
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#1 C9 still number 1 in na. Hai was exposed a bit to his weak champ pool at worlds but I don't see many na mids giving him trouble besides Bergman.
#2 TSM- will probably live and die by turtles play vs the better teams but won't hVe problems regardless vs bottom 5.
#3 CLG -just a matter of keeping there shit together this year I think scarra will have a good influence on the team as a coach.
#4 TL -probably a little favoritism here but there roster has the potential to beat anyone in na but most likely will be a stronger summer spilt team.
#5 WFX should be ranked 4 but I'll take TL over godbelter just because.
#6 gravity- clearly a gap between top 5 and bot 5 but I think as a team they will be better then impulse.
#7 poor xwx
#8 dig only cuz team 8 and coast are not even lcs worthy go back to 8 teams plz
#9 don't know much about them but coast probably sucks worse
#10 coast- back to challenger it is
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On January 09 2015 13:51 Project Yasuo wrote:
Others have covered team analyses very well, so I'll just post how I think the first week is gonna turn out.
C9 2-0
TL 2-0
TSM 1-1
WFX 1-1
DIG 1-1
CLG 1-1
TiP 1-1
GRA 1-1
CST 0-2
T8 0-2
I like this, I don't believe CST will do that poorly IMO, but your outlook seems very reasonable as far as team experience and talent ways in. I really like this view.
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On January 09 2015 20:51 miGGi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 13:51 Project Yasuo wrote:
Others have covered team analyses very well, so I'll just post how I think the first week is gonna turn out.
C9 2-0
TL 2-0
TSM 1-1
WFX 1-1
DIG 1-1
CLG 1-1
TiP 1-1
GRA 1-1
CST 0-2
T8 0-2 I like this, I don't believe CST will do that poorly IMO, but your outlook seems very reasonable as far as team experience and talent ways in. I really like this view.
Yeah, but I'm not that sure about Cris and Mash so I rated them a bit lower to be safe.
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On January 09 2015 20:40 IamPryda wrote:
#8 dig only cuz team 8 and coast are not even lcs worthy go back to 8 teams plz
That's one hell of an outlook to take, especially since Gravity qualified through the expansion tournament and Team 8 were the ones who were already in the LCS.
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I actually don't believe all the teams with mixed nationalities besides TSM will be overly strong. The only reason people have high hopes is because they saw what Royal Club could achieve at worlds. But the reality is that other teams in China also did similar experiments and saw their results falter a lot (IG, WE), going from a top tier team behind OMG one split to very mediocre teams in LPL.
It takes a special type of synergy and very good players to make this work, otherwise it just doesn't work. CLG is a prime example of that. They brought Seraph in and man he looked mediocre as hell. So for teams like TL, WFX, DIG, TiP, that's going to be a challenge for them because they have to integrate people who speak little to no English onto their teams and play against other teams that are well established and can communicate freely.
Pinging and saying go is fine when your players are mad good like Royal's and they all play similar playstyles (Ping -> Engage -> No turning back). But when you import mediocre second tier Koreans, it's been shown in the past that it doesn't work most of the time.
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Baa?21248 Posts
I'm not onboard with the WFX hype at all, since I think Pobelter and Altec are still in the #potential category without convincing results yet, combined with importing less-than-proven Koreans, introducing possible communication issues.
I'm surprised by how many people are ranking WFX in the top half of the standings.
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On January 10 2015 00:25 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
I'm not onboard with the WFX hype at all, since I think Pobelter and Altec are still in the #potential category without convincing results yet, combined with importing less-than-proven Koreans, introducing possible communication issues.
I'm surprised by how many people are ranking WFX in the top half of the standings.
Its pretty much based on pobelter getting multiple high challenger accounts and altec overcoming his nerve issues in regular season.Honestly that is very meaningless but seems to be enough for a lot of people.
Also this might be one of the closer splits in skill but not that high in skill overall.Every team but c9 either has a big random factor that could make or break them or is simply a team that isn't gonna be top tier.
Also funnily enough I feel like this is a good opportunity for clg to sneak in top 3 without doing much.
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Baa?21248 Posts
On January 10 2015 00:32 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2015 00:25 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
I'm not onboard with the WFX hype at all, since I think Pobelter and Altec are still in the #potential category without convincing results yet, combined with importing less-than-proven Koreans, introducing possible communication issues.
I'm surprised by how many people are ranking WFX in the top half of the standings. Its pretty much based on pobelter getting multiple high challenger accounts and altec overcoming his nerve issues in regular season.Honestly that is very meaningless but seems to be enough for a lot of people. Also this might be one of the closer splits in skill but not that high in skill overall.Every team but c9 either has a big factor that could make or break them or is simply a team that isn't gonna be top tier. Also funnily enough I feel like this is a good opportunity for clg to sneak in top 3 without doing much.
This could become the split when Hai and LemonNation's propensity to randomly feed finally catches up to them!
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On January 10 2015 00:34 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2015 00:32 nafta wrote:On January 10 2015 00:25 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
I'm not onboard with the WFX hype at all, since I think Pobelter and Altec are still in the #potential category without convincing results yet, combined with importing less-than-proven Koreans, introducing possible communication issues.
I'm surprised by how many people are ranking WFX in the top half of the standings. Its pretty much based on pobelter getting multiple high challenger accounts and altec overcoming his nerve issues in regular season.Honestly that is very meaningless but seems to be enough for a lot of people. Also this might be one of the closer splits in skill but not that high in skill overall.Every team but c9 either has a big factor that could make or break them or is simply a team that isn't gonna be top tier. Also funnily enough I feel like this is a good opportunity for clg to sneak in top 3 without doing much. This could become the split when Hai and LemonNation's propensity to randomly feed finally catches up to them!
Yea all those teams who don't even speak the same language will certainly capitalize correctly on those mistakes with vision control and team coordination  .
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The land of freedom23126 Posts
C9
TSM
TL
Winterfox
CLG
Gravity
TIP
Dignitas
T8
Coast
I wanted to throw TIP into last category, but i love Impact so okay, i just hope that CLG and Winterfox make playoffs, nothing more.
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1. C9
2. TL
3. TSM
4. CLG
5. Gravity
6. Dig
7. Winterfox
8. Impact
9. Coast
10. Team 8
Although with exception of C9, TL has the strongest roster on paper.
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#1 - Team Liquid
#2 - Cloud 9
#3 - Team SoloMid
#4 - Winterfox
#5 - Counter Logic Gaming
#6 - Team Impulse
#7 - Team Dignitas
#8 - Gravity
#9 - Team Coast
#10 - Team 8
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On January 10 2015 00:25 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
I'm not onboard with the WFX hype at all, since I think Pobelter and Altec are still in the #potential category without convincing results yet, combined with importing less-than-proven Koreans, introducing possible communication issues.
I'm surprised by how many people are ranking WFX in the top half of the standings.
Everyone on the team but Altec speaks Korean. Altec also had a really amazing summer split. Now they also got rid of Innox, easily the worst player on their team. While I'll also agree that picking up unproven Koreans isn't a good choice. But who do we rate above them? CLG? Not after IEM, CLG is playing like it's solo q. Dig? Definitely not after IEM. Impulse? They'll have significant communication problems and their ADC is Wizfujin.
It's less the fact Winterfox is being hyped as it it is Winterfox is a known quantity and looks superior to the competition.
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1. C9
2. TSM
3. TL
4. Winterfox
5. Gravity
6. Impulse
7. CLG
8. Coast
9. Dig
10. T8
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EPT
