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United States4053 Posts
My rank. Overall, I've been quite bullish on the newer teams joining the LCS and rather pessimistic about returning teams that struggled but didn't make significant improvements. Positions 6-8 are the ones I feel the least sure about.
1. C9
No changes to a consistently successful formula. This team may benefit the least from having coaching staff in the booths during Pick/Ban, though, since Lemon already more or less filled that role.
2. TL
TL with Piglet should be better than S4 Curse, which was a pretty good team. Quas, IWD, and Xpecial are all solid. I don't know if I believe Keane when he says that Fenix was a better choice than him for the Curse main squad (i.e. loyalty to CA is a likely factor in that statement), so I have him as a bit of a question mark.
3. Impulse
It's possible TiP is going to perform like a budget S4 SHRC, in that they just rely on sheer individual skill to overcome the team communication barriers. I've tried to account for that by placing them here. XWX should remain one of the most dominant midlaners in the NA scene. Rush IX was pretty hyped over in Korea; I don't know much about him, but his raw talent should help TiP achieve a decent rank.
4. Winterfox
They're going to struggle with Gleeb early on (he basically plays like an AI that's a lot better at not dying and a lot worse at skillshots), but the Helios-Pobelter-Altec core was already showing the fruits of its labor at the end of last season. This team is unique in NA in that it has 4 Korean-speaking members on the main squad (I think Pobelter speaks Korean? Correct me if I'm wrong), so they can hopefully bypass the language barrier very smoothly. Imagine is the only unknown quantity.
5. TSM
Santorin doesn't convince me; he doesn't seem like an obvious upgrade over Amazing, and Amazing was an enormous letdown most of the time. Bjergsen single-handedly carried TSM throughout the last split - either he pulled triple weight and the team won by being about average everywhere else (except jungle), or he didn't, and the team fell apart. I don't think he'll be able to repeat that feat in the face of the influx of talent this split.
6. Coast
The only obvious hole in this lineup is toplaner Cris. Impaler is every bit as strong as he was in EU. Sheep has always been an outstanding support that has for some reason been unable to find a job.
7. Dignitas
Dignitas' roster is comparable to their roster from last season, but that team ended up in shambles by the end of the summer. CoreJJ and Gamsu didn't impress at IEM at all, but they should improve at least slightly through the split.
8. Gravity
Assuming the CA squad stays together, they're a team that looked quite strong in promotions. They should be able to take some games off the top teams, but not be one themselves; their scrappiness reminds me of Complexity last season. I'm a little worried I'm underrating them.... it's just a hunch, I can't back it up too well, but I feel like they'll perform worse against LCS competition than fellow expansion team Coast.
9. CLG
I don't think CLG has fixed their problems. It's not a chemistry issue; I feel like CLG just plays too passively to take advantage of mistakes overall, punctuated once in a while with gigantic overextending aggressive plays. This might be pessimistic, but CLG has not rewarded optimism for some time now.
10. T8
I think T8 looked bad even in their promotions against Complexity, a team that eventually just disintegrated out of the league. Their most hyped player CaliTrlolz was a liability that whole series, and I expect them to struggle even against the bottom teams in the league.
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My quick rundown, with explanations of potentially controversial picks:
1. C9
2. TL
3. TSM
4. TiP: Tremendous solos that will be able to carry most games.
5. CLG
6. Winterfox: Not sold on Avalon or the fact that Pobelter can be the consistent carry he needs to be.
7. T8: Have always been a smart team with great teamfighting, not reliant on skilled laners to crush lane every game, which gives them an edge against less-coordinated bottom barrel teams.
8. Gravity: Overrated. Curse Academy was 2-7 VS T8 and 1-6 VS Coast across all challenger events, adding Hauntzer and Cop does not make them suddenly a top 5 LCS team like I've seen so many suggest.
9. Dig: Crumbz inconsistency and Kiwi will hurt this team, especially if Gamsu and Core play like they did at IEM.
10. Coast: One game away from almost not being an LCS team, players are decent but teamwork is awful.
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Whoever is putting us as fourth.. that's just cruel.
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Bearded Elder29905 Posts
On January 09 2015 15:03 EsanLOL wrote:
My quick rundown, with explanations of potentially controversial picks:
1. C9
2. TL
3. TSM
4. TiP: Tremendous solos that will be able to carry most games.
5. CLG
6. Winterfox: Not sold on Avalon or the fact that Pobelter can be the consistent carry he needs to be.
7. T8: Have always been a smart team with great teamfighting, not reliant on skilled laners to crush lane every game, which gives them an edge against less-coordinated bottom barrel teams.
8. Gravity: Overrated. Curse Academy was 2-7 VS T8 and 1-6 VS Coast across all challenger events, adding Hauntzer and Cop does not make them suddenly a top 5 LCS team like I've seen so many suggest.
9. Dig: Crumbz inconsistency and Kiwi will hurt this team, especially if Gamsu and Core play like they did at IEM.
10. Coast: One game away from almost not being an LCS team, players are decent but teamwork is awful.
I somehow agree with this prediction but I'd actually put T8 above Winterfox.
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On January 09 2015 14:32 JL13 wrote:
1 - C9: nothing new here
2 - TSM: nothing new here
3 - WFX: Would have been TL, but they are cursed
4 - TL: Cursed
5 - TiP: I don't see CLG progressing unless Xmithie and Zion go God mode
6 - CLG: Link's slump continues, xmithie doesn't realize potential, zion rots away on Maokai, double keeps on being double
7 - GRV: Almost beat CLG in promotion tourney, not sure if they can do it still.
8 - CST: not as bad as DIG
9 - DIG: not as bad as T8
10 - T8: is T8
Two things:
1. You're really, really underestimating DIG. What we saw at IEM is not going to be their actual skill level. Even Charlie (C9's Analyst) has claimed numerous times on Twitter that DIG is going to be the dark horse of Summer Split. Their new top laner, Gamsu, looks extremely solid.
2. What's your reasoning behind saying "Link's slump continues?" He had one, maybe two, poor games in IEM but otherwise destroyed Ryu. That one tournament is not a large enough sample size to claim his slump is continuing. Also, Xmithie and Zion don't need to go god-mode as long as Doublelift and Aphromoo return to the form they were in last split - they were the best duo lane by far for a good portion of the split.
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On January 09 2015 15:05 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Whoever is putting us as fourth.. that's just cruel.
I'm sorry! I swear I didn't put you guys there as some cruel joke! o.o
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after getting put into the dumpster by a guy named pepperoni I'm not sure why people think beating Ryu in lane is an indicator of skill any longer
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On January 09 2015 14:30 Slusher wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 14:17 SecretPancake wrote:On January 09 2015 13:48 Slusher wrote:
head
TL>C9>TSM>EG>CLG>TiP>T8>Dig>Coast I don't see how you could put TL ahead of C9. C9 has been a top team since summer of season 3. The other top teams have all had changes that could easily work against them. Santorin did not really prove himself at IEM San Jose, while FeniX is a really big unknown at the moment, especially swapping from the top lane down to mid. Piglet and xPecial in the bottom lane has the potential to be strong, but they will have to work past their language barrier. C9 has remained with the same roster that has been very dominant within NA and proved themselves again at IEM San Jose. Maybe if TL's gamble works out in their favour we'll see TL taking first, but definitely not in the spring split. my reasoning 1)To me Piglet/Xpecial duo is the strongest duo (including jungle/mid duos) in the league and that is enough to carry the majority of their games if Miso doesn't end up being horrible which I don't see happening. 2)With all of the teams being required to have full time coaches now I just don't think c9s strategy superiority will be able to maintain a wide enough gap to make up for being weak in mid.
I think you are overrating Piglet/Xpecial. We haven't seen them play at all yet and Xpecial has already stated some growing pains with the 2 of them. With the language barrier and them still getting used to eachother I would rate Sneaky/Lemon better than them and Rush Hour on par if not better.
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1- TL; I think C9 is going to drop because they refuse to make any roster changes, making their players too comfortable with their positions so they don't practice enough.
2- C9; Even with the above problems, I don't think any other team is good enough to take top 2 from them.
3- GRV- They have a great line up of veterans and new talent, and I think with full time dedication of a support staff
instead of second rate coaching while their coaches were more focused on the main team, they can go far.
4- CLG- I don't take their performance at IEM as a necessary downside to CLG, as they were without their jungler and they were playing against what I consider to be the 3rd place team in Europe. However, their refusal to remove liNk from the lineup will force Doublelift and Zionspartan to play the carry roles with liNk being inconsistent as usual. Double and Zion take it in stride though, and carry CLG to the 2nd best finish of their history in the LCS.
5- TSM- After their poor performance at IEM, with Turtle still showing inconsistency and Santorin not providing the playmaking potential they seem to need, TSM falls from glory and, for the first time ever, doesn't place top 2 in an LCS split.
6- TiP- I think WizFujiin has a lot to prove and I think he has the drive to do it. Also, Impact will be a great top laner in NALCS because of the lack of top lane talent, and XWX will play well mid as usual. The 2 wildcards are Adrian and Rush 9. Only time will tell how well they play.
7- WFX- This line up is way overhyped after their boot camp in Korea when the only player who showed something is Pobelter. Altec will be the only consistently good player on the team, with all the Koreans being underwhelming and Pobelter having good and bad games.
8- CST- Coast looked shaky in the expansion tournament, dropping against Curse Academy, now Gravity, and almost losing to Fusion, who looked to be having problems of their own. However, I think that their botlane and Impaler will have some standout performances and Coast will stay in the LCS for next split.
9- DIG- Dignitas looked shaky at best during IEM Cologne, dropping a game to Aces High E-sports club, a relatively new team from TURKEY, with almost no major tournament experience prior to this. This may be a disastrous split for the new Dignitas squad, with CoreJJ again being the best player on a bad team.
10- T8- There's not a lot to go off of for this team, but based on their bot lanes performance at IEM and the fact that they barely edged out compLexity for this spot in LCS, I'm going to put them at right about the same skill level of that coL team. That is to say, worst team in LCS. However, they have the surprise factor going into this split and considering that each team only plays each other 2 times, they can pull out some great victories and maybe place higher.
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On January 09 2015 15:14 fanaticus wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 14:32 JL13 wrote:
1 - C9: nothing new here
2 - TSM: nothing new here
3 - WFX: Would have been TL, but they are cursed
4 - TL: Cursed
5 - TiP: I don't see CLG progressing unless Xmithie and Zion go God mode
6 - CLG: Link's slump continues, xmithie doesn't realize potential, zion rots away on Maokai, double keeps on being double
7 - GRV: Almost beat CLG in promotion tourney, not sure if they can do it still.
8 - CST: not as bad as DIG
9 - DIG: not as bad as T8
10 - T8: is T8 Two things: 1. You're really, really underestimating DIG. What we saw at IEM is not going to be their actual skill level. Even Charlie (C9's Analyst) has claimed numerous times on Twitter that DIG is going to be the dark horse of Summer Split. Their new top laner, Gamsu, looks extremely solid. 2. What's your reasoning behind saying "Link's slump continues?" He had one, maybe two, poor games in IEM but otherwise destroyed Ryu. That one tournament is not a large enough sample size to claim his slump is continuing. Also, Xmithie and Zion don't need to go god-mode as long as Doublelift and Aphromoo return to the form they were in last split - they were the best duo lane by far for a good portion of the split.
1. Kiwi-pie bot lane synergy is gone and I'm not sure if Core is as good/better than qtpie. Shiphtur has been playing too scared and needs to man up. Gamsu vs zion can be argued but this is a Dignitas team that got wrecked for the remainder of the summer split after a fast start and their offseason changes imo didn't help nor hurt. Meanwhile, I think CST and GRV have wayyy more upside than DIG.
2. Link's performance in the LCS has been average, slightly below average for a player of his caliber. So while his slump still puts him as a mid-tier player, he hasn't shown anything that says he'll surprise people this split (barring aphromoo's blog). Destroying Ryu is not the biggest task in the world ever since he tilted post-Faker. Doublelift-Aphro got CLG 6th place, which is where they will remain. They have disappointed me enough at this point.
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The TL hype in this thread is pretty absurd
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1. TL (heavily dependent on Fenix being better than Voyboy, if only by a bit)
2. C9 (Can easily be placed first, dependent on Fenix's performance).
3. TSM (What can I say? Regi knows how to keep a team performing.
4. CLG ( I wanna believe)
5. WFX
6-10 who cares?
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Baa?21248 Posts
People shouldn't underestimate how hard XWX can carry. Think TiP can be a major darkhorse, or at least a serious spoiler with some key upsets.
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1. C9
2. TL
3. WFX
4. TSM
5. TiP
6. CLG
7. Dig
8. Coast
9. Gravity
10. T8
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On January 09 2015 13:02 Banana Smoothie wrote:
1-C9
2-TL
3-WFX
4-TSM
5-Gravity
6-CLG
7-Coast
8-TiP
9-Dig
10-Team8
There's mine, what is yours?
I think this is the most reasonable top 4 prediction that can be made. At the moment, I do believe CLG can make it to the top half, but it's so hard to tell with all the changes, the undetermined strengths of the new teams, and the uncertainty that some teams recently displayed in IEM San Jose. TL for a single series seemed world class in playoffs this past Summer Split. I believe had they'd been on the other side of the bracket of Cloud 9, they would've been in the finals (avoiding the C9 losses). This new line-up looks incredible. Despite with my own disagreements with importing Korean talent, I think TL definitely made very good choices in what they did bring. This is the year Xpecial's repertoire pays off. Same goes for IWD.
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1. Team Liquid
2. Cloud 9
3. Team Solo Mid
4. Coast
5. Counter Logic Gaming
6. Team 8
7. Winterfox
8. Dignitas
9. Gravity
10. Team Impulse
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On January 09 2015 15:05 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Whoever is putting us as fourth.. that's just cruel.
Sorry Nazgul  I didn't even realize I did it. I believe though! I've finally got a League team to actually care about!
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On January 09 2015 16:05 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
People shouldn't underestimate how hard XWX can carry. Think TiP can be a major darkhorse, or at least a serious spoiler with some key upsets.
I think it's just a matter of being hard to gauge at this point. TiP might turn out very well within just the first few weeks. But two really strong teams in Gravity and Coast are weighing with already "positive looking" (take that with a grain of salt, if you dare at all). This is one of the most uncertain off-seasons NA has had, even compared to this past winter.
Just remember these predictions aren't worth a thing, but it does open a discussion about NA's individuals how viewers perceive them pre-play.
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EPT
