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Active: 23028 users

First Impressions: Ragnaros

Forum Index > Heroes of the Storm
Post a Reply
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-12-22 16:18:36
December 22 2016 11:01 GMT
#1
Ragnaros

First Impressions


Analysis and Pro Opinions
by EsportsJohn


Ragnaros, an elemental as old as the world of Azeroth, has been called to many realms…but rarely one so suited to his destructive nature as the Nexus. As he strives to reduce this new land to ash, Ragnaros hews about with the fiery hammer Sulfuras and takes command of allied and destroyed forts, scourging all who approach him with falling rocks and waves of magma. Though his power is vast, those who summon the Firelord must be prepared to watch the world burn.


Table of Contents
  • Strengths and Weaknesses
  • Abilities
  • Breakdown
  • Talents
  • Professional Opinions



At BlizzCon, Blizzard revealed the next two heroes to enter the Nexus with a thrilling cinematic featuring an epic battle between Varian and Ragnaros. The Firelord was available for play at the venue, but it was over a month before he was actually released. Advertised as an assassin that could take over a fort and become a "raid boss", there was a lot of excitement for the upcoming hero.

Ragnaros lives up to the hype: he's big, does lots of fire things, and makes the game feel chaotic—but maybe a little too chaotic. Perhaps the most broken hero since Samuro, Ragnaros dominated matches during opening week, peaking at 70% on HotS Logs. He's since been nerfed a bit, but it still remains to be seen if Molten Core and Lava Wave are too impactful or potentially game-breaking. Let's take a closer look at this destructive Hero and his devastating abilities!



”By fire be purged!”






Strengths


  • Strong solo laner
  • Long range poke
  • Good waveclear
  • Dynamic zoning abilities




Weaknesses


  • Weak escape
  • No CC in his base kit
  • Vulnerable to CC chains






Abilities


Trait
  • Molten Core
    • Channel on an allied or destroyed Fort or Keep to replace it with Ragnaros's ultimate form, temporarily gaining new Abilities, having 4155.84 Health that burns away over 18.72 seconds. 120s cooldown.

      Ragnaros's returns to his normal form upon losing all Health in Molten Core.

Basic Abilities
  • Empower Sulfuras (Q)
    • Ragnaros's next Basic Attack is instant, dealing 219.44 Ability damage in an area, and heals for 20% of the damage dealt. Healing doubled versus Heroes. 6s cooldown

  • Living Meteor (W)
    • Summon a meteor at the target point that deals 74.88 damage, then rolls in the target direction dealing 299.52 damage per second for 1.75 seconds. 12s cooldown

  • Blast Wave (E)
    • Ignite Ragnaros or an ally, granting 25% Movement Speed for 1.50 seconds before exploding dealing 108.16 damage to nearby enemies. 10s cooldown.

Heroic Abilities
  • Sulfuras Smash (R)
    • Hurl Sulfuras at the target area, landing after 0.75 seconds, dealing 205.92 damage. Enemies in the center take 617.76 damage instead and are Stunned for 0.50 seconds. 60s cooldown.

  • Lava Wave (R)
    • Release a wave of lava from Ragnaros's Core that travels down the targeted lane, dealing 249.60 damage per second to non-Structure enemies in its path and instantly killing enemy Minions. Damage increased by 100% versus Heroes. 120s cooldown





Ragnaros' basic abilities are a nice mix of poke, sustain, and utility. For his Heroics, Ragnaros can utilize either global pressure with Lava Wave or build more for teamfights with Sulfuras Smash. The combination of these factors make him a beast at solo laning and useful in a variety of compositions. There are certain battlegrounds, like Braxis Holdout and Tomb of the Spider Queen, in which he is exceptionally strong, but he isn't necessarily bad on any in the rotation.

Even though he's classified a melee assassin, Ragnaros can put out a lot of long range poke damage with Living Meteor. Using some of the Meteor talents like Molten Power and Meteor Bomb, Ragnaros can maximize his poke and deal insane damage from afar while still retaining the ability to walk up and smash someone with Empower Sulfuras. The ability to fight from both a distance and in close quarters is one of the factors that makes Ragnaros one of the most well-rounded characters in the game.

Molten Core and Lava Wave are game-changers. The way the abilities are designed makes him exceptional at pushing and defending forts and can even change the way objectives are played on some maps. For instance, Molten Core can delay close tributes on Cursed Hollow or Altars on Towers of Doom using the insane range on his second set of abilities. Lava Wave literally melts the Zerg rush on Braxis Holdout, making him a must-ban Hero on that map.

The one glaring weakness of Ragnaros is his lack of escape. Despite having great sustain with Empower Sulfuras and a small speed boost from Blast Wave, it can be difficult for Ragnaros to get out of a tough situation. Grabbing talents like Catching Fire and Resilient Flame can help boost his tankiness when he goes in too deep and hopefully him buy enough time to deal good return damage.




Talents



Ragnaros has one of the most adaptable talent trees in the game at the moment, but that might be largely due to his colossal damage numbers; when his numbers get nerfed a bit, we may see a bit more stability in talent choices. As with most assassins, his builds usually empower one ability and take defensive or utility talents where necessary.

Perhaps the most common build right now is the Living Meteor build, which does insane amounts of poke damage from a safe distance. Talenting into Shifting Meteor allows Ragnaros to keep the ball on someone for the maximum possible damage; it also makes it easier to consistently build stacks on Molten Power. Once he gets Meteor Bomb at level 16, he can wreck the back line and dish out some serious AoE damage.

If you're looking to play more of a melee style, you can go for a Q build. Sulfuras Hungers at level 1 is similar to Azmodan's Taste for Blood talent because it requires Ragnaros to last hit minions, and in turn, it greatly increases the damage of Empower Sulfuras. The quest doesn't take that long, but requires him to solo a bit so to gain maximum value out of his Qs without teammates accidentally clearing minion waves too quickly. Once you tack on Hand of Ragnaros and Giant Scorcher, Ragnaros does some insane burst damage with his Q on an absurdly low cooldown.

His level 20 Storm talents are all very good and situational. Heroic Difficulty makes it easier for Ragnaros to abuse his trait and push/defend far more often. When he's taking a lot of damage in teamfights, Submerge can help him survive for a bit longer and potentially dodge lethal damage. If he takes Lava Wave at 10, he can significantly increase its efficiency with Lava Surge; not only does it provide a second wave which can be staggered with the first, but it also lowers the cooldown by 10 seconds. More lava equals more winning.




Professional Opinions


On Kit, Design and Implementation:



Wings, Super Perfect Team (SPT)

The second ult Lava Wave deals so much damage that I feel it's getting nerfed pretty soon. As for the weaknesses, the model is huge so it's easy to get body blocked. And since he doesn't have any escapes, you need to be very careful with positioning. He's also weak against dive compositions for the same reason.


m, ZeroPanda

I think the hero is pretty interesting. His kit is enjoyable. Some of his talents can provide some self-sustain and damage mitigation. On the other hand, his mobility is mediocre. Sometimes an attempt to engage with Q might cost you your life before the ability even connects. As for his defensive utility, the value you can get from the trait as well as Lava Wave is tremendous.


Baphomet, Please Buff Arthas

I think the overall design is good. The kit is decent and the trait is very unique. Though categorized as a melee assassin, the hero is actually very good at poking. For now, I think a poking playstyle works well and can deal lots of damage. Some might feel the trait is a bit weak as you can’t move while it’s activated. However, when it comes to defending—say like enemies pushing with mercenaries or map objectives—the trait is extremely valuable. And it can also be used offensively. I think the trait is powerful enough to be considered a second ult and might open up a lot of potential strategies around the hero himself.


Sunshine, Coach

I think a great way to look at Ragnaros is to compare him to Thrall. He has self sustain in his Q, great poke potential in his W, and he can either speed himself or an ally with his E, which brings a lot of utility. Both of his ults are very good, and you probably just pick according to comp and map.

His passive seems a little broken to be honest though. Love the concept, but it does so much. Prevents building damage, has massive range, very high damage output, slows, stuns, and just feels way to hard to play around. I feel like they left out a weakness to it, but that might just be me complaining about the OP hero being OP.


Youngbaek, Coach

His kit and especially the last hitting talent is a really interesting change for Heroes of the Storm. If we start seeing more talents like this, we'll see the meta and team compositions change based on talents like Sulfuras Hunters. It's similar to stacking Seasoned Marksman, but due to the last-hitting mechanic, it will be forced to play out differently.


sCsC, L5 (Ballistix)

All my teammates agree that Rag is plain OP. He isn't the best in standard teamfights, but his power near allied/enemy keeps is extremely imbalanced.


On Professional Play and Meta Changes:



Baphomet, Please Buff Arthas

Overall, the character is strong and well-rounded. It’s likely we’ll see the hero in competitive play.


Sunshine, Coach

Ragnaros has great solo lane potential, good self sustain, wave clear, and utility. I don't really know how Ragnaros couldn't find his way into the meta. I would be shocked if he wasn't picked, and he might even be ban material even with the nerfs.


Youngbaek, Coach

If he's strong enough, you'll see him in every region. I'm not talking about his current state, but after the nerf that should be coming from Blizzard's side. I can see his playstyle work great in Europe though; regions [like EU] that I consider a bit more careful and calculated will be able to execute the stacking game better than other more aggressive regions if that's the pro build.


On Map and Composition Viability:



Wings, Super Perfect Team (SPT)

The W ability provides decent poke and even burst damage in teamfights. His trait is extremely strong on maps like Battlefield of Eternity and Haunted Mines, as it can deal with map objectives really well. The trait is much less valuable on huge maps like Blackheart's Bay/Warhead Junction.


m, ZeroPanda

The second ult Lava Wave is very powerful on small maps or when teamfighting in lanes.


Baphomet, Please Buff Arthas

Maps like Infernal Shrines or Haunted Mines are where his trait shines, as it helps a lot in defending against enemies pushing with the map objectives.


Sunshine, Coach

Any map where the objective is forced to push down a certain lane will be a good map for Ragnaros, since it guarantees value from Lava Wave. I don't think he will really have a bad map, but Braxis Holdout and Tomb of the Spider Queen seem like maps that he would dominate.


Youngbaek, Coach

It honestly depends on what build the professionals decide on in the future. If he becomes a stacking hero, he should fit perfectly into the smaller maps like Dragon Shire and Tomb of the Spider Queen. But if it becomes another variation of the build, he should be good on larger maps as well. Maybe multiple builds will be viable, and you'll see him played on all maps.


Final Thoughts:



Wings, Super Perfect Team (SPT)

I think the hero is overpowered. His auto attack damage is quite high. At the moment, he can be one of the best solo laners in the game


Baphomet, Please Buff Arthas

The Ult Lava Wave is very strong when pushing, as it clears minion waves immediately and can force enemies to dodge it so they can’t defend their structures.


Sunshine, Coach

He's incredibly fun to play. Simple kit, but he has a lot of skill with how you play him. Knowing how to use your E will probably be what sets apart the good players from the bad.


Youngbaek, Coach

Expect a nerf coming to him. I think his overall kit is difficult to balance, and he'll likely be in a OP or undertuned stage forever.


sCsC, L5 (Ballistix)

We haven't scrimmed with him yet, so I'm not too sure about how team compositions will factor in. In Hero League, he's just a standard melee flex pick.





So what do you think about Ragnaros? Is Lava Wave OP? Let us know!

We would like to thank Wings, m, Baphomet, Sunshine, Youngbaek, and sCsC for taking the time to share their thoughts and insights on Ragnaros with us!

Huge thanks also to yaya, DogRay, and RallyJaffa for translations!

Writer: EsportsJohn
Interviews: EsportsJohn
Graphics & Format: Shiroiusagi, EsportsJohn
Editor(s): EsportsJohn, PROlane
Art Credit: Blizzard


StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Thezzy
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands2117 Posts
December 22 2016 11:35 GMT
#2
Lava Wave is something that players just need to get used to.
I stood in it for the first few games along with most of my team and got melted.
But given that it now has a 120 second cooldown, it is announced globally and you can see it on the minimap, there is no real excuse for getting killed by it. I do wonder how murderous it is on Lost Caverns when you combine it with Thrall's Earthquake. Good luck getting out in time.

The main strength Lava Wave has in my opinion is due to two reasons:

- Using it on the lane with an objective that is pushing (Immortal, Punisher, Golem, Terror, DK) to ensure the enemy team is forced to disengage from said objective. Players that are too focused on the objective might get hit and get killed.

- Using it on the lane furthest from the enemy team that is pushing (preferably against Core with several catapults).
In a way this is similar to just spawning a Merc camp in that wave in the sense the enemy team is forced to deal with it or risk catapults chunking away at their core. Imagine you are on a 3 lane map fighting over bottom objective. Top lane is pushing enemy core with catapults but it is only two-thirds of the way there. One Lava Wave and that push will now go straight to the core. The enemy team has to choose between clearing the catapults or the objective. And Ragnaros can stay with his team in the bottom lane the entire time.

At the same time I think Sulfuron Smash is being overlooked a bit because of Lava Wave. The center area deals a stupid amount of damage and the cooldown is half that of Lava Wave. If you go Molten Core you can still use Sulfuron Smash but now from two screens away. You are defending a fort/keep and a low health hero is running to safety?
Go Molten Core and throw a Sulfuron Smash in his face. If you take Heroic Difficulty the ultimate alone hits for almost 2k damage.

His lack of escape is the primary problem. In one game on Haunted Mines the enemy team specifically choose to dive me in every engagement and I got blown up so fast with no escape. I like the E build a lot due to the extra wave clear, AoE slow and shield sustain but he is a bit like Thrall in that any CC murders him.

Anything with long range abilities also run circles around him. Playing against Jaina, Chromie or Li-Ming (even Lunara) is not fun as Ragnaros. All you can do is sit there and take the damage or run away. So he can't just dive in, he will need a buddy to ensure a target can't get away and that he isn't diving alone.
Playing Terran is like flying down a MULE drop in a marine suit, firing a Gauss Rifle
Markwerf
Profile Joined March 2010
Netherlands3728 Posts
December 22 2016 19:15 GMT
#3
Lava wave still a little bit too good I think.

It's no longer great on many maps but the few maps it shines on it's too good. Battlefield of eternity,infernal shrines but most of all braxis holdout and haunted mines. Lava wave molten core combo is too good on defense there, between those you can nullify the objective easily. Sure a decent team will avoid it but lava wave zones them out while the molten core prevents fort/keep damage and clears the objective easily. On offense it's even pretty good. Also yes it's easy to avoid but when you're pushing a keep the response time you have is a bit too little I think for what it does, with an earthquake, gust, VP, or just a big entangling growth it's a little too easy to secure it hits I think.

Stats on this subject however are hard to use. Lava wave is good on the maps where rag in general is good because of his trait, so the minimal win difference it has now could be attributed to the fact lave wave is picked more on maps where Rag is simply better. Ie lava wave isn't better than smash anymore, it's jsut a confounder for better maps. For example maps like sky temple or blackhearts bay are clear picks for sulfurus smash now, lava wave is unlikely to ever be useful in a teamfight there. His trait however is also quite useless on those maps except soaking some shots, fights rarely happen around forts/keeps on those maps.

Overall he seems in a decent spot now, perhaps a little too strong still but there are bigger issues to deal with now: rehgar's bloodlust, thrall's earthquake, dehaka's dark swarm build, and diablo still a bit.
MotherFox
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
United States1529 Posts
December 22 2016 19:16 GMT
#4
I am pretty sure I dislike lavawave purely because there is no skill in using it.
Don't Panic
Furinax
Profile Joined December 2015
Netherlands75 Posts
December 22 2016 21:08 GMT
#5
I think that he's still OP even after the nerfs. Don't really like that he counts abathur very hard so he will always stay OP for me
Beelzebub1
Profile Joined May 2015
1004 Posts
December 23 2016 00:20 GMT
#6
On December 23 2016 04:16 MotherFox wrote:
I am pretty sure I dislike lavawave purely because there is no skill in using it.


Uh this please, pretty ridiculous that there is ults that require tons of skill to use like Void Prison/Ring of Frost/Mosh that can totally fail if you aren't experienced but are game changers when used correctly and then Lava Wave is just like, a passive ult almost, press and forget.

"but that might be largely due to his colossal damage numbers"

This sums up whats wrong with Ragnaros, no reason he should be out damaging li mings and Gul dans (who himself might need a numbers adjustment he's pumping out some heavy heavy DPS lately)
FeyFey
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany10114 Posts
December 23 2016 02:17 GMT
#7
lava wave also requires no skill to avoid. There is almost no excuse to get hit by it. Only time it is excusable would be at the origin point, if someone rooted you there.
Any other position should be a report for feeding.

Or we consider that timing is a form of skill and then using and evading it correctly is not that easy anymore. Still only a fun ult, since most zoning ults aren't that super situational and more available at the same time lol.

But yah the usual assassin release. Seems like Ragnaros is more then fine, as everyone thinks he is strong .
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17921 Posts
December 23 2016 06:38 GMT
#8
This is a hero i've wanted to play
im not a fan of changing his usually smiling happy face to this... abomination though
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
JacobShock
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Denmark2485 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-12-23 17:32:42
December 23 2016 17:29 GMT
#9
is Lava Wave still a valid pick after the nerf? Also regarding that people say there is no skill to use it. Well thats kind of wrong, I have seen Lava Waves do jack shit. I like to do it in the most intense of team fights and try to distract as much possible and you'd be surprised how many people don't see and hear it coming. Other than that, it's not a skill shot no, but there are optimal times to use it, some people completely waste when it can be used to def against zerg waves and merc camps during objective.
"Right on" - Morrow
Valiver
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Caldeum1977 Posts
December 23 2016 17:32 GMT
#10
On December 24 2016 02:29 JacobShock wrote:
is Lava Wave still a valid pick after the nerf?

Yes
Writer
JacobShock
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Denmark2485 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-12-23 17:33:32
December 23 2016 17:32 GMT
#11
On December 24 2016 02:32 Valiver wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 24 2016 02:29 JacobShock wrote:
is Lava Wave still a valid pick after the nerf?

Yes

TY! Had a buddy of mine claim that it was useless now, haven't gotten to try it out myself.
"Right on" - Morrow
PROlane
Profile Joined December 2015
United States34 Posts
December 23 2016 20:35 GMT
#12
On December 24 2016 02:32 JacobShock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 24 2016 02:32 Valiver wrote:
On December 24 2016 02:29 JacobShock wrote:
is Lava Wave still a valid pick after the nerf?

Yes

TY! Had a buddy of mine claim that it was useless now, haven't gotten to try it out myself.


Lave Wave still does exactly what it is intended to do, but with a bit less killing power.
WriterEditor-in-Chief - LiquidHeroes
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
December 25 2016 06:51 GMT
#13
On December 22 2016 20:35 Thezzy wrote:
Lava Wave is something that players just need to get used to.
I stood in it for the first few games along with most of my team and got melted.
But given that it now has a 120 second cooldown, it is announced globally and you can see it on the minimap, there is no real excuse for getting killed by it. I do wonder how murderous it is on Lost Caverns when you combine it with Thrall's Earthquake. Good luck getting out in time.

The main strength Lava Wave has in my opinion is due to two reasons:

- Using it on the lane with an objective that is pushing (Immortal, Punisher, Golem, Terror, DK) to ensure the enemy team is forced to disengage from said objective. Players that are too focused on the objective might get hit and get killed.

- Using it on the lane furthest from the enemy team that is pushing (preferably against Core with several catapults).
In a way this is similar to just spawning a Merc camp in that wave in the sense the enemy team is forced to deal with it or risk catapults chunking away at their core. Imagine you are on a 3 lane map fighting over bottom objective. Top lane is pushing enemy core with catapults but it is only two-thirds of the way there. One Lava Wave and that push will now go straight to the core. The enemy team has to choose between clearing the catapults or the objective. And Ragnaros can stay with his team in the bottom lane the entire time.

At the same time I think Sulfuron Smash is being overlooked a bit because of Lava Wave. The center area deals a stupid amount of damage and the cooldown is half that of Lava Wave. If you go Molten Core you can still use Sulfuron Smash but now from two screens away. You are defending a fort/keep and a low health hero is running to safety?
Go Molten Core and throw a Sulfuron Smash in his face. If you take Heroic Difficulty the ultimate alone hits for almost 2k damage.

His lack of escape is the primary problem. In one game on Haunted Mines the enemy team specifically choose to dive me in every engagement and I got blown up so fast with no escape. I like the E build a lot due to the extra wave clear, AoE slow and shield sustain but he is a bit like Thrall in that any CC murders him.

Anything with long range abilities also run circles around him. Playing against Jaina, Chromie or Li-Ming (even Lunara) is not fun as Ragnaros. All you can do is sit there and take the damage or run away. So he can't just dive in, he will need a buddy to ensure a target can't get away and that he isn't diving alone.


I have problems with Lava Wave because it just completely stops pushes dead. Combined with Molten Core, it makes it feel nearly impossible to ever siege structures against a Ragnaros. To be fair, the counterplay to that is just winning at objectives, but certain maps like Braxis Holdout and Tomb of the Spider Queen objectives are in lane so you get relatively little value out of the objectives. I agree that Sulfuras Smash has been overlooked, though. The damage on that thing is absolutely broken ridiculous, but the utility + damage on Lava Wave has been largely overshadowing it.

The only other problem I have with him is that he's lulzy ridiculously good in lane. I would like to see some nerfs to his splash damage on Q.

On December 23 2016 04:15 Markwerf wrote:
Lava wave still a little bit too good I think.

It's no longer great on many maps but the few maps it shines on it's too good. Battlefield of eternity,infernal shrines but most of all braxis holdout and haunted mines. Lava wave molten core combo is too good on defense there, between those you can nullify the objective easily. Sure a decent team will avoid it but lava wave zones them out while the molten core prevents fort/keep damage and clears the objective easily. On offense it's even pretty good. Also yes it's easy to avoid but when you're pushing a keep the response time you have is a bit too little I think for what it does, with an earthquake, gust, VP, or just a big entangling growth it's a little too easy to secure it hits I think.

Stats on this subject however are hard to use. Lava wave is good on the maps where rag in general is good because of his trait, so the minimal win difference it has now could be attributed to the fact lave wave is picked more on maps where Rag is simply better. Ie lava wave isn't better than smash anymore, it's jsut a confounder for better maps. For example maps like sky temple or blackhearts bay are clear picks for sulfurus smash now, lava wave is unlikely to ever be useful in a teamfight there. His trait however is also quite useless on those maps except soaking some shots, fights rarely happen around forts/keeps on those maps.

Overall he seems in a decent spot now, perhaps a little too strong still but there are bigger issues to deal with now: rehgar's bloodlust, thrall's earthquake, dehaka's dark swarm build, and diablo still a bit.


Omg, another amazing moment where I actually agree with Markwerf. Gotta take in these moments; they're rare :p.

Pretty much agree with everything here. Lava Wave still too strong because it negates several map objectives and creates way too much pushing power. But yeah, I'd also like to see similar skill-less abilities like BL or EQ get addressed as well. Diablo is in a great spot, but he definitely needs a few damage nerfs.

StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
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