Hey Idra, I don't think your name is unfamiliar to anyone here on TL, but its been a little while since we've heard anything from you. Tell us a little about your experience in Heroes of the Storm, what teams you've played on, and in general what you've been up to since you left SC2.
After I quit SC2 entirely I started going to school, I played dota but purely for fun. I got into heroes the day it released thanks to a friend at Blizzard and have been playing it since, I wasn't sure how seriously I was going to take it at first. I figured I would at least make content or cast for it or something, but the game turned out to be way more fun and well designed than I expected. I also found a group of people who are really fun to play with, lzgamer is probably the only one who would be familiar to TL, so for the time being at least we're all practicing as seriously as we can and playing it as competitively as one can play a game that's in alpha.
That's really interesting, what are you in school for? And a little more on topic, what would you say it is that makes heroes fun to play and keeps you coming back?
Chem engineering at the moment, but I still have to do general classes so I'm not entirely sure where I'll end up. There are a lot of things that are appealing about the game, I honestly enjoyed farming in other mobas so I kind of miss the laning, but it makes up for it with very fast constant action. It's also more strategically diverse, I think, given how variable maps are and how many different objectives there are on each map. Every objective is likely to be a team fight so figuring out rotations and timings is a constant, important thing. The pace of the games is really, really nice too. My team all went and played league together during the recent downtime and games just feel so slow and lacking in action compared to heroes. It takes very specific maps, team compositions, and playstyles to have any kind of downtime in heroes.
This is completely true, heroes is very dynamic. Speaking of teams and dynamism, your team, Snowflake has had a couple of roster shuffles, you guys recently picked up Chillatech because you were looking for a strong vocal player who could serve as a shot caller, how has he been working out in this role so far?
It's been fantastic, we're still trying to figure out exactly where everyone falls in terms of communication, shotcalling and whatnot. Most of us come from an individual game background so that's been the hardest part for us. But chilla is very comfortable talking while he plays which is a huge help to the team, we had him and keylax swap roles and had practiced together for like 4 days and we took a series off of SMG, who had previously been unbeatable, so I think we're all going to do very well together once we get things ironed out.
Following that thought of you all originally being players from one vs one games, how has the transition been for you? Are there any lessons that have really stuck with you or that you think players transitioning from a similar background should keep in mind?
I played a good amount of both league and dota so even though I wasn't near competitive at either I don't really feel like I was coming at it from a pure RTS player perspective. I absolutely think communication is the biggest hurdle in the transition though, given that it just doesn't exist in solo games and, especially in a purely teamwork based game like heroes, it's absolutely paramount. I'm still not good at it so I'm not sure how much advice I can give, but just constantly relaying information and following decisions decisively are probably the two biggest points so far to me. As for the game itself, a lot of skills should transition, map awareness is still huge, judging fights is different but similar, control is simpler but more important. But lots of pure RTS players seem to be god awful at it, I'm honestly not sure where the disconnect is.
I found similar things when I started playing mobas, it turns out controlling just one hero isn't quite as easy as it seems. A little more on your team, Snowflake is considered one of the very top teams in the scene right now, what do you think are the main factors leading to your success?
There's a ton of factors that go into it, faye is probably the best player in the game mechanically, just in terms of hitting skillshots and whatnot. Lz and keylax are both very diverse players who have played a whole range of heroes competitively for us and let us experiment with our lineup and get everything perfect. Chilla has stepped in and performed great even from a shotcalling role with no competitive experience and little familiarity with the team. I play the ranged dps types so I just kind of stand there and shoot things, but everyone else is really good. Another big thing I think is the team atmosphere, we all get along really well and everyone takes losses well. A lot of the other teams will get super negative and bitch at one another if a game is going poorly. We take everything in stride, which has led to some insane comebacks, and even if we lose it makes it much easier for us to diagnose and learn from mistakes.
I wouldn't downplay your contributions, your positioning during ECS has been quite impressive to watch. Snowflake played Symbiote Gaming in the recently aired ECS finals, while your team lost the games felt pretty close. Going into them, did you guys have a particular draft or strategy prepared? Or were you especially concerned about Symbiote pulling out anything in particular?
That actually kinda sucked for us, we played the MVI winner finals vs them, the bo3 we won, immediately before that and we had a solid plan for how to deal with them that worked out well. They watched the replays and figured out what was going wrong and adapted better than us going into the ECS match. I think it was mostly on my drafting too, the easiest game we won vs them was when we just banned strong heroes and picked their comfort heroes for ourselves. Going into the later matches I got more conservative and just tried to pick generic strong heroes for us. All our players are really diverse in terms of hero selection and playstyles, didn't take advantage of that enough. But yeah generally speaking against symbiote you always have to watch out for bloodlusts and backdoors. Zagara and Rehgar are probably the two most important heroes for them. They also first picked Arthas+Tyrael for the first time there which caught us off guard and turned out to be very powerful.
Oh, wow, I didn't realize those series were played so close to each other, that gives a whole different perspective on how things turned out. In general how do you guys prepare for tournaments? How much time do you invest in practice would you say?
We have 4 hours of scheduled team practice that's intended to be scrims and serious games every weekday, and whoever has time tends to play additional less serious games to try out various heroes or whatever. Weekends we tend to play all day. It's really hard to practice specifically for matches right now, against a lot of the teams our specific preparation is more discussing drafts and playstyles. SMG is the only team that we really need to practice specifically for, and no other team compares to them either in terms of skill or style, so it's mostly just general practice and a lot of discussion and theorycrafting
That's a lot of time spent practicing. As you commented earlier, you tend to play ranged DPS heroes, would you say that's your favorite role to play or do you have another preference?
I've always preferred late game mage type heroes, AP carry equivalents from league, but there's not too many of them in the game yet. Tassadar kind of counts, and he's one of my better heroes. Falstad as well but I'm not as good on him for whatever reason. But I would be totally happy playing ranged dps, mages, or supports in this game. I'm terrible at tanky/bruiser/initiator types though. I find it very hard to judge the battles from their perspective.
Since you mentioned mage types, yesterday blizzard launched two new heroes, Azmodan and Anub'Arak, and Azmodan is all about hurling fireballs across the battlefield. If you've had time to look at them, do you have any opinion on how these new heroes fit in the game at higher levels?
The initial reaction from the community was that anub'arak was going to be super op, I think they're overrating/misplaying him quite a bit. He's way too squishy to be the divey stun machine everyone thinks he'll be. I think he'll still be strong though, just as more of a secondary tank who has to be pretty careful about when he hard engages. Azmodan I have not played yet, but he seems like he might be the strongest pusher in the game and Blizzard is really trying to encourage pushing type play. I think a well played Azmodan might be pretty strong, but he's an odd hero and I won't be sure until I play him a bit. I'm sad they stacked his q talents at level one though. I wanted to just farm it and sit in our base 1 shotting people.
A little more on recent changes, do you have any thoughts on the new patch that came out yesterday, and more specifically of the large changes to nova?
Regardless of how good nova is now the changes are fantastic, the biggest thing they need to improve about the game right now is the talent system. It gives them so much freedom with hero design since they don't have to mold everything around universal items, like other mobas, but currently a lot of the talents are placeholders. I'm sure it's just because the game is still in alpha, but it's still awesome to see them starting to implement more hero specific talents. For her specifically, she's still such a potential liability in competitive games, she's incredibly squishy and has no escape and if her burst doesn't kill someone she does essentially nothing for the next 10+ seconds. That being said her burst can be absolutely insane now, she's definitely much better, I'm just not sure if it's enough to justify picking her yet. For the patch in general, I dislike how much they seem to want to encourage pushing and split pushing, I think it's really boring and annoying. They're also doing it badly, with the way heroes works split pushers either need to have really powerful escape or a heroic that makes them relevant to team fights. Otherwise the pushing aspect of the hero just doesn't accomplish enough and is too easily punished while they force their team to 4v5. No hero specific changes stood out that much besides nova. I was hoping/expecting a nerf to backdooring that didn't come, so that kind of sucks.
Backdooring is one of the things that can get a little annoying. On a only slightly unrelated topic, maps! which do you think is the best for high level play? Do you have a particular map you just enjoy playing on?
I think curse, garden, and dragon knight are all good for competitive games. DK can be a little funny with everyone just constantly rotating between shrines waiting for an advantageous fight, but that kind of situation is still tense and there's strategy in timing out the rotations so you pick up two sets of giants, so it's fine. Blackheart is annoying in general. It discourages fighting a lot and is kind of snowbally. There's a lot of problems with the map and I'm honestly not entirely sure how to fix it. Mines is really weird, half the time the game is decided by a level 4 fight. The combination of securing the early golem + having a level lead along with it is a bit much. But having a map that forces and emphasizes team fighting that early is kind of cool in itself, now that we have custom games and can draft around it.
Custom games isn't the only change this patch brings, as of this week servers are region locked, which means EU players cannot play with NA players, do you think this is going to impact professional play at all? Are there any teams particularly affected by this?
We already couldn't play them, even without explicit region locking. The system just wouldn't queue NA teams vs EU teams. I think the top 3 or so EU teams might be able to compete with good NA teams, but it's really hard to judge just from watching vods. But honestly even if we could play one side would have latency and that always sucks. I think we just have to write off international play until legit lans start happening.
mYInsanity looks super good right now, so its a shame we won't get to see them compete against top teams. One thing people are going to start asking soon, if they aren't already is "how to go pro" at heroes, its a question that always pops up when a game like this gets popular, so do you have any advice for those people?
Find people to play with, probably via the reddit groups, I'm not sure how competitive they are but that would at least get you into the community. Playing with people on voice chat is absolutely necessary. Solo queue is cancer in every moba and, for now, it's even worse in heroes because most people are very new to the game and communication and cooperation so crucial. The community is small enough that it's still very open and accepting, everyone is looking to grow it. Just start playing with people and be cool and if you get good it won't be that hard to get attention. The ideal thing though would be to get another group of 4 people who are dedicated and practice and take the game seriously with them. Your team is absolutely everything right now.
That's solid advice. One last question, to sate my own personal curiosity, do you still follow SC2 at all? Any thoughts of maybe playing it for fun again?
Not at all, I watched a bit of the stupid stephano petraeus swarmhost game because twitter was blowing up about it and obviously I still have a lot of friends who are involved in the game so I hear bits and pieces, but I have no interest in it and definitely won't be playing it again.
That's totally fair, that's it for questions from us, we really appreciate you taking the time to do this interview. Do you have anything you'd like to add? Any shoutouts?
Follow me on twitter, twitter.com/idra. I'm streaming on MLG now, mlg.tv/idra, though I've barely been streaming lately. I'd like to promise I'll do more soon but I'm kind of busy at the moment. There isn't much for the team just yet but there will be an announcement for us soon that Starcraft fans ought to find very exciting.
Well, that's all folks, thank you so much for the interview. We'll all be looking forward to that announcement!
Ah, Idra, how I missed you. Still good to see him back and enjoying a game. He seems to enjoy team games a lot more when all the pressure isn't on him.
awww no idra return to sc2. thats unfortunate . but it is nice that he is still playing competetively in some way and he will definetly be my reason to watch HOTS tournaments.
That was a surprisingly pleasant read. He seems to really like HotS, never heard this much positivity from him in one go. Been playing a little bit myself, the game had far more depth to it than I expected.
i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
Would guess NDA and closed beta.
Also kinda good tactics of keeping it mostly under wraps until it's ready for release.
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
There are streams (like 20+ live right now), though 4 times more people watch Smite than Heroes...
There isn't much for the team just yet but there will be an announcement for us soon that Starcraft fans ought to find very exciting.
Teams being announced...............exciting for his team....SPONSORSHIP?!?!?! IdrA and LZGamer know EG...they are a good team...maybe new EG? ;o
Back to reality, thanks for the interview Marshall. Good old idra comments in there, seems he is having fun and the fact he doesn't mind losing or rages when loses seems good :D Will defiantly watch this stuff at Blizzcon for sure
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Can honestly say it is "hard" to find information on HOTS on TL...Marshall is the ONLY person/mod who does anything with HOTS, no one else. SC2 has like 10 writers and loads of people. Dota and Hearthstone have their own mini websites. HOTS is exactly the same hype level as CS:GO on TL right now which is one guy doing all the work...
Also if you see they are about to announce a team for BlizzCon so they will be throwing more around about it in the next few weeks.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Not much money in esports yet, gotta suck up to those publishers.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Heaven forbid they have good business relationship with a company that makes games they cover. So shocking that they might enjoy another Blizzard game.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Heaven forbid they have good business relationship with a company that makes games they cover. So shocking that they might enjoy another Blizzard game.
Just like game journalists having a good relationship ($$) with developers totally didn't cause a stir these past weeks.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
I wasn't talking about TL writers.
Well that's how this started. If you're talking about IdrA, he was never remotely shy about criticizing Starcraft 2, do you really think that now he feels like he needs to suck up to Blizzard? Give me a break
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
I wasn't talking about TL writers.
Lol, so you're saying IdrA of all people will shill a Blizzard game?
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
I wasn't talking about TL writers.
I am pretty sure Liquid Poker and the other sites do just fine without help from Blizzard. They did before. It might just be that folks on TL and maybe they will be throwing a team together.
Its not like they needed to get super cozy with Nintendo before they picked up a few smash players.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
I wasn't talking about TL writers.
Lol, so you're saying IdrA of all people will shill a Blizzard game?
That is literally the most comical part about it.
"Guys, we got all this money from Blizzard to hype this game. What do we do?"
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
I wasn't talking about TL writers.
Lol, so you're saying IdrA of all people will shill a Blizzard game?
Idra is the perfect player you want to interview if you want to hype a Blizzard game.
'Oh well if Idra likes it, we didn't listen to him the last 4 years he has been hating SC2 he must be right now'
I respect Idra as a community figure but hell, I still remember all the Jaedong and Flash videos lavishing praise all over WoL
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Wft, maybe they like the game? That would be the most logical reason.
People who's livelihood depends on being in Blizzards good books hype upcoming Blizzard games, so shocking.
Okay now I have to jump in. Livelihood?! TL writers aren't paid...We're just writing about a game we enjoy, and we put out the content because we think other people here will enjoy it too
I wasn't talking about TL writers.
Lol, so you're saying IdrA of all people will shill a Blizzard game?
Idra is the perfect player you want to interview if you want to hype a Blizzard game.
On October 10 2014 02:48 Plansix wrote: That is literally the most comical part about it.
"Guys, we got all this money from Blizzard to hype this game. What do we do?"
"Interview Idra!"
Blizzard doesn't need to pay anyone anything, just take away privileges. Actually Blizzard really doesn't need to do anything, sites will self-censor themselves because they think they won't get tickets to Blizzcon if even slight negativity is detected.
Whatever, just leave Liquiddota alone, LiquidMoba would kill my soul. On second thought, leave TL alone too, make LiquidHero or something if you have to.
On October 10 2014 02:48 Plansix wrote: That is literally the most comical part about it.
"Guys, we got all this money from Blizzard to hype this game. What do we do?"
"Interview Idra!"
Blizzard doesn't need to pay anyone anything, just take away privileges. Actually Blizzard really doesn't need to do anything, sites will self-censor themselves because they think they won't get tickets to Blizzcon.
Whatever, just leave Liquiddota alone. On second thought, leave TL alone too, make LiquidHero or something if you have to.
They already have a LiquidHero.
Where'd you get that info that Blizzard gives TL free Blizzcon tickets?
On October 10 2014 02:48 Plansix wrote: That is literally the most comical part about it.
"Guys, we got all this money from Blizzard to hype this game. What do we do?"
"Interview Idra!"
Blizzard doesn't need to pay anyone anything, just take away privileges. Actually Blizzard really doesn't need to do anything, sites will self-censor themselves because they think they won't get tickets to Blizzcon.
Whatever, just leave Liquiddota alone. On second thought, leave TL alone too, make LiquidHero or something if you have to.
They already have a LiquidHero.
Where'd you get that info that Blizzard gives TL free Blizzcon tickets?
Oh, meant to type 'Blizzcon tickets or something', my bad. You get the point.
edit: can you link to liquidhero google just gives a sc2 player and a brewery?
The point is everyone is corrupt and bias and not one can just like a game and write about it. Same boring conspiracy theory non-sense we see on the internet all the time.
On October 10 2014 03:27 Plansix wrote: The point is everyone is corrupt and bias and not one can just like a game and write about it. Same boring conspiracy theory non-sense we see on the internet all the time.
Step1: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to key websites by offering them exclusive access, keys, whatever and 'help grow' ($$) this new game. Step2: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to popular xy blizzard game streamers, personalities, whatever and watch them fight over each others dead bodies to give legitimacy to xyz and become $$$ Step3: Get legitimacy and a pre-made community for a new IP in alpha stage without doing any work or heaven forbid, make a good game.
That was my point. Anyway, whatever, in a year or two watch 'hots pros' switch to a competitive dating sim by blizzard. Won't post anymore in this thread, TL can put whatever articles and can cover whatever games that they want. Just trying to voice the opinions of some members of the community, or at the least my opinion of Blizzard business practices in the last few years.
Blizzcon rosters have been finalized for most teams for awhile. LONG before this interview.
TL is doing coverage because they were obviously already interested in the game, and the Blizzcon spot might have just sped that up. There is also a group of dedicated staff and fans that want to see this happen (because of passion, not $) like Yorkie and Gmarshal.
And ANYONE suggesting IdrA will shill even for a Blizzcon spot automatically has their opinion invalidated, cause he bashed the shit out of SC2 even when he did want Blizzcon invites. He has never hyped a game falsely to gain things for himself. Even when he was a paid SC2 player he bashed the game almost daily.
IdrA actually is one of the most no-BS people in the scene hands down. TL obviously has an interest in this game and is making a team, so I would expect to see more Heroes coverage but I am confident Blizz isnt handing them $, instead handing them Blizzcon invite to speed up them entering Heroes. I also can say for sure doing interviews is not required as part of Blizzcon, for example I highly doubt any of the other 3 orgs that got slots will do the same.
TL is just awesome and has some cool dudes that care about the game in Yorkie and GMarshal that want to make good content is all.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Yes, Heroes of the Storm gets so much special treatment that our entire Heroes staff consists of like 3 people
On October 10 2014 06:05 teddyoojo wrote: so ur telling me theres actually a -competitive- scene for hots?
o dear
There is a competitive sense for rock, paper, scissors and Nintendo 64 WWF wrestling games. People a play Sailor Moon fighting game money matches at EVO.
On October 10 2014 03:27 Plansix wrote: The point is everyone is corrupt and bias and not one can just like a game and write about it. Same boring conspiracy theory non-sense we see on the internet all the time.
Step1: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to key websites by offering them exclusive access, keys, whatever and 'help grow' ($$) this new game. Step2: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to popular xy blizzard game streamers, personalities, whatever and watch them fight over each others dead bodies to give legitimacy to xyz and become $$$ Step3: Get legitimacy and a pre-made community for a new IP in alpha stage without doing any work or heaven forbid, make a good game.
That was my point. Anyway, whatever, in a year or two watch 'hots pros' switch to a competitive dating sim by blizzard. Won't post anymore in this thread, TL can put whatever articles and can cover whatever games that they want. Just trying to voice the opinions of some members of the community, or at the least my opinion of Blizzard business practices in the last few years.
Lol, what is this bullshit?
I don't know what's dumber, the fact that you think companies could actually bribe terrible games into popularity, or the fact that you think Blizzard needs to resort to fraudulent tactics to generate interest in their products.
There isn't much for the team just yet but there will be an announcement for us soon that Starcraft fans ought to find very exciting.
Teams being announced...............exciting for his team....SPONSORSHIP?!?!?! IdrA and LZGamer know EG...they are a good team...maybe new EG? ;o
Back to reality, thanks for the interview Marshall. Good old idra comments in there, seems he is having fun and the fact he doesn't mind losing or rages when loses seems good :D Will defiantly watch this stuff at Blizzcon for sure
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
Can honestly say it is "hard" to find information on HOTS on TL...Marshall is the ONLY person/mod who does anything with HOTS, no one else. SC2 has like 10 writers and loads of people. Dota and Hearthstone have their own mini websites. HOTS is exactly the same hype level as CS:GO on TL right now which is one guy doing all the work...
Also if you see they are about to announce a team for BlizzCon so they will be throwing more around about it in the next few weeks.
After IdrA's comment, and TLPros tweet, I'm 100% sure Snowflake is being picked up by Liquid. Or I just fell into IdrA's ruse.
On October 10 2014 03:27 Plansix wrote: The point is everyone is corrupt and bias and not one can just like a game and write about it. Same boring conspiracy theory non-sense we see on the internet all the time.
Step1: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to key websites by offering them exclusive access, keys, whatever and 'help grow' ($$) this new game. Step2: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to popular xy blizzard game streamers, personalities, whatever and watch them fight over each others dead bodies to give legitimacy to xyz and become $$$ Step3: Get legitimacy and a pre-made community for a new IP in alpha stage without doing any work or heaven forbid, make a good game.
That was my point. Anyway, whatever, in a year or two watch 'hots pros' switch to a competitive dating sim by blizzard. Won't post anymore in this thread, TL can put whatever articles and can cover whatever games that they want. Just trying to voice the opinions of some members of the community, or at the least my opinion of Blizzard business practices in the last few years.
What is your problem?
It was rather obvious ever since the BW days that TL follows Blizzard games. I mean, it went BW>SC2>Poker>Dota>HS. Why do you need to go all Illuminati on the whole thing and figure Blizzard is pulling the strings to assert total "e-sport dominance" or something... That all sounds pretty ridiculous.
Of course, Blizzard chooses to give access to certain people if they believe it'll give them good advertising. What are they thinking, right? Those greedy bastards, trying to find potent advertising where they can.
Truth be told, I would much prefer to see a game being advertised through actual media covering and reviewing than just "Come play X, the next generation totally revolutionary game that will blow your mind!". This way, HotS is more likely to get proper feedback and have some shortcomings fixed, i.e. the talent system.
Anyway... The interview is cool. IdrA does seem more positive than usual. Could be his time away from SC2 has done him some good, but I happened to watch him play on stream, and he does seem just as he was. I expect him to encounter problems with the team aspect of the game, it's almost more challenging than the game itself to a character like him.
I also completely agree with what he says regarding talents. Ideally, they should give you a legitimate choice every time, but some of them are just so bland and useless. I really hope Blizzard steps it up in that regard.
Idra seems a bit more relaxed which is nice to see, I felt he was stuck in a rut in that SC2 was pretty damn good for him financially, but he really didn't have the love for the game that he did for Brood War.
TL is hardly whoring itself out for HoTS, there's a few threads here and there and that's about it, not sure what some of the weird tangents on this issue are about here.
On October 10 2014 06:05 teddyoojo wrote: so ur telling me theres actually a -competitive- scene for hots?
o dear
There is a competitive sense for rock, paper, scissors and Nintendo 64 WWF wrestling games. People a play Sailor Moon fighting game money matches at EVO.
This thread got super-bad super-fast. I read the interview and was more like "Purple background?" and then NukeD gotta be all like
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
As a middle child, I felt this way a lot when I was younger. I felt like the newest brother/sister got all the attention and it made me go into little-kid-rage. But look, eventually I got older and realized that new things naturally get more attention. Now, I think MOBAs are stupid, so I'm not even gonna go there, however, if MOBA is your cup of tea, or even if you have never tried one, I don't think trying out a new game is a bad idea. Hell, I tried out LoL and that's how I know it's not fun.
You're probably like "bUt NiNaZeRg, wHy tL gOtTa pUsH DiS gAmE oN uS sO HaRd?" and I would submit to you that Teamliquid is not pushing a product. The reason the interview is getting coverage is because it's fuckin' IdrA. If a new game comes out and big-name gamer plays it, of course people are going to want to do an interview. Unless they're a game-whore and just play everything.
On October 10 2014 04:07 Diamond wrote: And ANYONE suggesting IdrA will shill even for a Blizzcon spot automatically has their opinion invalidated, cause he bashed the shit out of SC2 even when he did want Blizzcon invites. He has never hyped a game falsely to gain things for himself. Even when he was a paid SC2 player he bashed the game almost daily.
You're probably right, but who the fuck knows. Yes, if someone says "IdrA did this so Blizz will give him da $$$" is talking with their foot in their mouth, because they're making an assertion with no proof and just blindly assuming there is some kind of behind-the-scenes Illuminati Garena Patriarchy Ancient Aliens conspiracy going on. But that's all you need to say! To declare the intentions of IdrA without actually being IdrA is almost as bad, because you don't know what IdrA is thinking. To say he never ever ever ever could hype a game for money based on past experience is wrong because you're assuming that a pattern will stay constant forever. For example, a kitten starts growing into a cat and if the cat just kept growing as a constant, it would eventually swell to fill the Solar System and the kitten would collapse into itself as a super-massive black hole and destroy the galaxy. So maybe IdrA is getting paid and maybe he's not. We don't know that. There's always that possibility, so I don't see why we'd be making an assumption like that one way or another.
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
This is a starcraft site, Hots is a blizzard game with a tournament at blizzcon o_O It seems pretty logical?
Was DotA two also getting 'special' treatment before it got its own subsection? Or Hearthstone? Duno, I don't play Hots at all but it makes sense to me that it's getting coverage.
its good to hear from IdrA again. And lol I've almost finished my first year of engineering and have to choose a specialisation soon. cool to see hes studying chemical engineering, its high on my list of specialization preference
from purely a game design perspective, hearing about hots developments is interesting. since dota is one of the best games in the world, its interesting to hear how its competitor intends to develop
On October 10 2014 16:09 ninazerg wrote: This thread got super-bad super-fast. I read the interview and was more like "Purple background?" and then NukeD gotta be all like
On October 10 2014 02:21 NukeD wrote: I gotta say, this sort of heavy advertising of HotS on TL makes me sick. Its obvious that this game gets special treatment whatever the reason is.
As a middle child, I felt this way a lot when I was younger. I felt like the newest brother/sister got all the attention and it made me go into little-kid-rage.
On October 10 2014 03:27 Plansix wrote: The point is everyone is corrupt and bias and not one can just like a game and write about it. Same boring conspiracy theory non-sense we see on the internet all the time.
Step1: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to key websites by offering them exclusive access, keys, whatever and 'help grow' ($$) this new game. Step2: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to popular xy blizzard game streamers, personalities, whatever and watch them fight over each others dead bodies to give legitimacy to xyz and become $$$ Step3: Get legitimacy and a pre-made community for a new IP in alpha stage without doing any work or heaven forbid, make a good game.
That was my point. Anyway, whatever, in a year or two watch 'hots pros' switch to a competitive dating sim by blizzard. Won't post anymore in this thread, TL can put whatever articles and can cover whatever games that they want. Just trying to voice the opinions of some members of the community, or at the least my opinion of Blizzard business practices in the last few years.
I don't know what's dumber, the fact that you think companies could actually bribe terrible games into popularity
On October 10 2014 16:09 ninazerg wrote: [...] For example, a kitten starts growing into a cat and if the cat just kept growing as a constant, it would eventually swell to fill the Solar System and the kitten would collapse into itself as a super-massive black hole and destroy the galaxy. [...]
Good stuff. I wouldn't mind being sucked into a super-massive pussy. Damn it at first I meant to say that I love cats, and then it turned into this...
On October 10 2014 16:09 ninazerg wrote: [...] For example, a kitten starts growing into a cat and if the cat just kept growing as a constant, it would eventually swell to fill the Solar System and the kitten would collapse into itself as a super-massive black hole and destroy the galaxy. [...]
Good stuff. I wouldn't mind being sucked into a super-massive pussy. Damn it at first I meant to say that I love cats, and then it turned into this...
So the end of the world will be triggered by a gigantic cat? That's adorable
Well obviously you all guys have a decent point with this being a site revolving around a Blizzard game, plus all the other points you made which makes no sense to repeat here, and generally I can relate to a lot of your points and agree.
However, I cant escape the immpresion that the attention this game is getting is forced if anything. It is so artificial and non organical even if I put your arguments in the equation.
On October 10 2014 23:19 NukeD wrote: Well obviously you all guys have a decent point with this being a site revolving around a Blizzard game, plus all the other points you made which makes no sense to repeat here, and generally I can relate to a lot of your points and agree.
However, I cant escape the immpresion that the attention this game is getting is forced if anything. It is so artificial and non organical even if I put your arguments in the equation.
I'm holding my judgement until later when the pro scene has run for a while. It should become apparent then if the scene is capable of growing organically, or if it's basically on Blizzard life support.
On October 10 2014 23:19 NukeD wrote: Well obviously you all guys have a decent point with this being a site revolving around a Blizzard game, plus all the other points you made which makes no sense to repeat here, and generally I can relate to a lot of your points and agree.
However, I cant escape the immpresion that the attention this game is getting is forced if anything. It is so artificial and non organical even if I put your arguments in the equation.
I'm holding my judgement until later when the pro scene has run for a while. It should become apparent then if the scene is capable of growing organically, or if it's basically on Blizzard life support.
We're currently putting together an intro piece about the pro scene that has been going for a bit without blizzard support. Hopefully that will give you guys a new perspective. Keep an eye out for it
On October 10 2014 03:42 Tenks wrote: Shit I wish I got in on some of this dirty, dirty Heroes money. I was first wave alpha access and all they've done is willingly take my money!
Lucky for you, I've never had any beta accesses, pretty sure my account is bugged.
On October 10 2014 23:19 NukeD wrote: Well obviously you all guys have a decent point with this being a site revolving around a Blizzard game, plus all the other points you made which makes no sense to repeat here, and generally I can relate to a lot of your points and agree.
However, I cant escape the immpresion that the attention this game is getting is forced if anything. It is so artificial and non organical even if I put your arguments in the equation.
Well, a lot of peoples lives are riding on this game. Build hype for this shitty game or get a real job? People will play anything these days as long as there is a shot at making money. Sc2 and dota too hard? Find something else.
On October 10 2014 02:37 nigsky wrote: My issue with this game is the people behind it. I don't trust Kim or Browder to design and balance a high quality game.
You all know that If David Kim was in charge of Dota and not Icefrog the 6.82 rubberbanding would have been left unchanged until summer of 2015.
As if game designers have ANYTHING to do with TECHNICAL issues in a game
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
NDA No one is allowed to stream it unless Blizzard gives them the greenlight.
I think its because Blizzard wants a lot of the game still a mystery until they move into open beta. Usually open beta opens up stream opportunities.
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
NDA No one is allowed to stream it unless Blizzard gives them the greenlight.
I think its because Blizzard wants a lot of the game still a mystery until they move into open beta. Usually open beta opens up stream opportunities.
I don't think this is true, Sheth streams, ZP streams, a bunch of people stream.
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
NDA No one is allowed to stream it unless Blizzard gives them the greenlight.
I think its because Blizzard wants a lot of the game still a mystery until they move into open beta. Usually open beta opens up stream opportunities.
There are a lot of streams. Haven't you checked twitch before posting this ?
Most streams rarely get to the three digits, because well, there is almost no hype for this game, and it is only logical since most people can't try it out, so why would they switch their interest into a game on "alpha" phase when they already have their well stablished MOBAs of choice.
Later on, maybe more people will get interested, and i am sure all this stuff for Blizzcon is done to try to start hyping the game (and probably following it with invite waves afterwards). But to me it looked like Blizzard's decission to stay on low profile with this game for quite long time, to try to get the game right before going full advertisiment.
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
NDA No one is allowed to stream it unless Blizzard gives them the greenlight.
I think its because Blizzard wants a lot of the game still a mystery until they move into open beta. Usually open beta opens up stream opportunities.
I don't think this is true, Sheth streams, ZP streams, a bunch of people stream.
Really? lol I guess its because mobas aren't my thing, and I am not interested enough to find the streams.
But regardless, it seems Storm is going to be fun, so we shall see where it takes us.
About the discussion on TL nuthugging Blizzard, or paying for articles to hype the game, well I have no solid opinion and ninazerg said it best already.
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
NDA No one is allowed to stream it unless Blizzard gives them the greenlight.
I think its because Blizzard wants a lot of the game still a mystery until they move into open beta. Usually open beta opens up stream opportunities.
There are a lot of streams. Haven't you checked twitch before posting this ?
Most streams rarely get to the three digits, because well, there is almost no hype for this game, and it is only logical since most people can't try it out, so why would they switch their interest into a game on "alpha" phase when they already have their well stablished MOBAs of choice.
Later on, maybe more people will get interested, and i am sure all this stuff for Blizzcon is done to try to start hyping the game (and probably following it with invite waves afterwards). But to me it looked like Blizzard's decission to stay on low profile with this game for quite long time, to try to get the game right before going full advertisiment.
I go to twitch every day, but I hardly seek out any moba titles. I noticed Storm streamers a couple times, but I am not invested in those streamers.
On October 10 2014 03:27 Plansix wrote: The point is everyone is corrupt and bias and not one can just like a game and write about it. Same boring conspiracy theory non-sense we see on the internet all the time.
Step1: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to key websites by offering them exclusive access, keys, whatever and 'help grow' ($$) this new game. Step2: Dangle the 'you will become a big fish in a little pond ($$$)' carrot to popular xy blizzard game streamers, personalities, whatever and watch them fight over each others dead bodies to give legitimacy to xyz and become $$$ Step3: Get legitimacy and a pre-made community for a new IP in alpha stage without doing any work or heaven forbid, make a good game.
That was my point. Anyway, whatever, in a year or two watch 'hots pros' switch to a competitive dating sim by blizzard. Won't post anymore in this thread, TL can put whatever articles and can cover whatever games that they want. Just trying to voice the opinions of some members of the community, or at the least my opinion of Blizzard business practices in the last few years.
I don't know what's dumber, the fact that you think companies could actually bribe terrible games into popularity
Ever heard of World of Tanks?
Is that actually popular?
I got the impression that all that money they pumped into shilling and forced esport barely did anything.
Blizzard has an NDA ... but if that runs you don't even know the game exists. After that its all open. Idra has been streaming for a while and the viewer numbers were high, but then he went more into team mode and well streaming Heroes feels to me like sc2, you can't win anything if you show your strats on stream. And no one popular keeps streaming Heroes constantly like it was the case for Hearthstone. Its all about popular streamers if you want to be high up in twitch. Or you pay Twitch to be featured.
I really wonder how one can think that the hype for this game is artificial, I stumbled over some show matches done by Blizzard devs on accident. Apart from that its ESV TV and a few others that do things for Heroes. And I am glad they do, since its quiet hard to find stuff about heroes.
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
NDA No one is allowed to stream it unless Blizzard gives them the greenlight.
I think its because Blizzard wants a lot of the game still a mystery until they move into open beta. Usually open beta opens up stream opportunities.
There are a lot of streams. Haven't you checked twitch before posting this ?
Most streams rarely get to the three digits, because well, there is almost no hype for this game, and it is only logical since most people can't try it out, so why would they switch their interest into a game on "alpha" phase when they already have their well stablished MOBAs of choice.
Later on, maybe more people will get interested, and i am sure all this stuff for Blizzcon is done to try to start hyping the game (and probably following it with invite waves afterwards). But to me it looked like Blizzard's decission to stay on low profile with this game for quite long time, to try to get the game right before going full advertisiment.
I go to twitch every day, but I hardly seek out any moba titles. I noticed Storm streamers a couple times, but I am not invested in those streamers.
Yeah Idra is the most recognizable name as far as heroes streamers are concerned, but he streams on mlg.tv so you won't see him
On October 11 2014 05:13 FeyFey wrote: Blizzard has an NDA ... but if that runs you don't even know the game exists. After that its all open. Idra has been streaming for a while and the viewer numbers were high, but then he went more into team mode and well streaming Heroes feels to me like sc2, you can't win anything if you show your strats on stream. And no one popular keeps streaming Heroes constantly like it was the case for Hearthstone. Its all about popular streamers if you want to be high up in twitch. Or you pay Twitch to be featured.
I really wonder how one can think that the hype for this game is artificial, I stumbled over some show matches done by Blizzard devs on accident. Apart from that its ESV TV and a few others that do things for Heroes. And I am glad they do, since its quiet hard to find stuff about heroes.
Wait, that featured section on the homepage is paid? I thought that was done random and freely done.
On October 10 2014 01:51 xeliana wrote: i find it curious that i never see any kind of streams of heroes on twitch. is the community still so small, that no one cares or does no one bother to stream the game at all?
NDA No one is allowed to stream it unless Blizzard gives them the greenlight.
I think its because Blizzard wants a lot of the game still a mystery until they move into open beta. Usually open beta opens up stream opportunities.
There are a lot of streams. Haven't you checked twitch before posting this ?
Most streams rarely get to the three digits, because well, there is almost no hype for this game, and it is only logical since most people can't try it out, so why would they switch their interest into a game on "alpha" phase when they already have their well stablished MOBAs of choice.
Later on, maybe more people will get interested, and i am sure all this stuff for Blizzcon is done to try to start hyping the game (and probably following it with invite waves afterwards). But to me it looked like Blizzard's decission to stay on low profile with this game for quite long time, to try to get the game right before going full advertisiment.
I go to twitch every day, but I hardly seek out any moba titles. I noticed Storm streamers a couple times, but I am not invested in those streamers.
Yeah Idra is the most recognizable name as far as heroes streamers are concerned, but he streams on mlg.tv so you won't see him
Ahhh I didn't know that. mlg.tv must be giving a better cpm for advertising. I heard twitch is horrible, but I could be wrong. Besides twitch forces nda on all streamers, so they can't explicitly state the revenue through advertising. I think Destiny alluded that twitch ad revenue is not that great, and that's why he switched to own3d.tv.
Wow nice purple background... *then read the comments* --->good mood ruined Not really hyping HotS right now, but definitely going to give it a try when Chinese server launched (which is hopefully very soon...)
On October 10 2014 23:19 NukeD wrote: Well obviously you all guys have a decent point with this being a site revolving around a Blizzard game, plus all the other points you made which makes no sense to repeat here, and generally I can relate to a lot of your points and agree.
However, I cant escape the immpresion that the attention this game is getting is forced if anything. It is so artificial and non organical even if I put your arguments in the equation.
Why would you think that? How can you even measure whether the "general hype" of a community is organic or not?
And how do you figure that this is being forced down our throats? You think blizzard has tl in its pocket or something? This is a gaming website where we post about games.
On October 10 2014 06:49 KillerSOS wrote: Too bad it's still closed though... would love to take a look at it.
this. Would've given HoTS a try had it been open or something otherwise sounds like fun but who knows. Thanks for the interview and ya, Idra feels really relaxed based on that lol
Heroes fun game I actually enjoy playing it, I dont enjoy dota 2 and never tried league.
As for idra guy is a joke right now he is king of the scrubs and casuals, he will love it till money comes in and so do decent players, then he starts getting stomped by Chinese and Korean players, then it will be game is designed badly it's in balanced game, these people don't play the game the right way cry cry cry into retirement.
On October 28 2014 15:41 thunder54 wrote: Heroes fun game I actually enjoy playing it, I dont enjoy dota 2 and never tried league.
As for idra guy is a joke right now he is king of the scrubs and casuals, he will love it till money comes in and so do decent players, then he starts getting stomped by Chinese and Korean players, then it will be game is designed badly it's in balanced game, these people don't play the game the right way cry cry cry into retirement.
Calling someone a joke because he retired is pretty weak. Look you can dislike IdrA all you want but you can't deny his success in SC2 and BW. For a foreigner the stuff he did is pretty huge.
As for Heroes in general, I think it's way too early to say anything. I for one think IdrA could do really well since the mechanical skillcap is obviously lower and IdrA always had the tactical part going for him.
Guy's earned the right to be the biggest casual of all time given how long he stuck it out in the Kespa system in BW lol, he seems to be relaxed and enjoys Heroes, which I don't think you could say about him and SC2, especially the latter period of his career.