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On January 08 2015 08:23 Ishentar wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2015 08:21 Makro wrote:
people should stop bothering the police operation and camera should back from at least 300meters, wtf is this ? they are next to them Yes, I agree the journalists should leave, they're doing nothing useful here except bothering the intervention, and even harm it by giving to terrorists important information.
I think it's good to film it, broadcasting it is another story.
So wait any confirmations one of the "suspects" was in class at the time?
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it's over, police is now here to let the RAID doing his job, finally
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On January 08 2015 08:25 Faefae wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2015 08:23 Boucot wrote:
So... basically... one of the suspects is not a suspect as he was at school today. So.... the ID card drop was a fake? Am i the only one that though it was a possibility? -_- wtf
No that wasn't the same guy. The card was owned by one of the older guys I think.
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On one hand I understand the worry of increasing anti-islam movement but on the other I can understand it's support. Look at England, and Germany where groups of Muslims have been caught ticketing and stopping pedestrians telling what they wear, and how talk, even who they are with is a sin and is "unislamic", then saying their beliefs should be respected and culture should be above the home countries laws etc. Meanwhile the ruling government allows this instances to keep happening.
That pisses me off and course should piss everyone else that observes this as well.
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On January 08 2015 08:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
On one hand I understand the worry of increasing anti-islam movement but on the other I can understand it's support. Look at England, and Germany where groups of Muslims have been caught ticketing and stopping pedestrians telling what they wear, and how talk, even who they are with is a sin and is "unislamic", then saying their beliefs should be respected and culture should be above the home countries laws etc. Meanwhile the ruling government allows this instances to keep happening.
That pisses me off and course should piss everyone else that observes this of as well.
Exactly. In East London Muslims tear bars' poster because alcohol is sinful.
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On January 08 2015 08:25 MrCon wrote:
Charlie Hebdo is invoking freedom of speech when they post muslim hate things, but when a very funny french comedian make jokes about jews and shoah they publish a big article to say this comedian is the devil incarnate and that freedom of speech should be limited.
This is very sad tho, but Charlie Hebdo became a right wing american paper in the last few years, a neocon newspaper disguised as satirical left wing newspaper....
Who are "they" in this scenario? In any case, "they" have every right to call him the devil incarnate and call for freedom of speech to be curtailed, just as we have every right to mock "them" for it. Whatever Charlie Hebdo may or may not have posted is irrelevant. This is an attack on a basic democratic principle, and the response has to take that into account. This is a no-compromise situation.
On one hand I understand the worry of increasing anti-islam movement but on the other I can understand it's support. Look at England, and Germany where groups of Muslims have been caught ticketing and stopping pedestrians telling what they wear, and how talk, even who they are with is a sin and is "unislamic", then saying their beliefs should be respected and culture should be above the home countries laws etc. Meanwhile the ruling government allows this instances to keep happening.
That pisses me off and course should piss everyone else that observes this of as well.
The biggest issue is that the whole debate is always swaddled in the odious reek of political correctness and general cowardice. We've lost the ability to call a spade a spade, to criticize a specific ideology which clearly and vehemently espouses doctrines which are utterly incompatible with basic democratic principles. Bizarre accusations of racism and xenophobia are the most common and simultaneously the most stupid respones whenever someone points out that this is a reccuring problem with one specific set of beliefs.
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On January 08 2015 08:25 MrCon wrote:
Charlie Hebdo is invoking freedom of speech when they post muslim hate things, but when a very funny french comedian make jokes about jews and shoah they publish a big article to say this comedian is the devil incarnate and that freedom of speech should be limited.
This is very sad tho, but Charlie Hebdo became a right wing american paper in the last few years, a neocon newspaper disguised as satirical left wing newspaper....
If you don't see why laughing at 6 million jews being massacred, inviting negationist Faurisson on stage and being best mate with a neo fascist like Soral is different of laughing at religions for what they are, I am terribly sorry for you.
Charlie was a libertarian left wing soixante huitard paper, certainly not neo con and never posted anything hateful about anyone. It mocked religions, all of them, and people committing violence ion their name.
You "very funny" humorist is an authentic racist, sentenced several time for incitation to religious hatred. Please don't insult the memory Cabu and Charb by comparing them to this asshole. Thanks.
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On January 08 2015 08:30 Squat wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2015 08:25 MrCon wrote:
Charlie Hebdo is invoking freedom of speech when they post muslim hate things, but when a very funny french comedian make jokes about jews and shoah they publish a big article to say this comedian is the devil incarnate and that freedom of speech should be limited.
This is very sad tho, but Charlie Hebdo became a right wing american paper in the last few years, a neocon newspaper disguised as satirical left wing newspaper....
Who are "they" in this scenario? In any case, "they" have every right to call him the devil incarnate and call for freedom of speech to be curtailed, just as we have every right to mock "them" for it. Whatever Charlie Hebdo may or may not have posted is irrelevant. This is an attack on a basic democratic principle, and the response has to take that into account. This is a no-compromise situation.
they = Charlie Hebdo
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Well the suspect is maybe an homonyme of the guy in highschool, for instance the same happened with Mohamed Merah when people said he was innocent... Mohamed Merah the innocent was actually an homonyme of the actual killer. Names are often shared by different people. The same happened in France with Paul Bismuth... etc;..
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On January 08 2015 08:30 Squat wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2015 08:25 MrCon wrote:
Charlie Hebdo is invoking freedom of speech when they post muslim hate things, but when a very funny french comedian make jokes about jews and shoah they publish a big article to say this comedian is the devil incarnate and that freedom of speech should be limited.
This is very sad tho, but Charlie Hebdo became a right wing american paper in the last few years, a neocon newspaper disguised as satirical left wing newspaper....
Who are "they" in this scenario? In any case, "they" have every right to call him the devil incarnate and call for freedom of speech to be curtailed, just as we have every right to mock "them" for it. Whatever Charlie Hebdo may or may not have posted is irrelevant. This is an attack on a basic democratic principle, and the response has to take that into account. This is a no-compromise situation.
But anyway obviously that doesn't mean they deserved to be attacked, I just wanted to state how hypocritical their stance was (they aren't a satirical newspaper anymore, for some years already, well they are but with a very clear agenda)
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On January 08 2015 08:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
On one hand I understand the worry of increasing anti-islam movement but on the other I can understand it's support. Look at England, and Germany where groups of Muslims have been caught ticketing and stopping pedestrians telling what they wear, and how talk, even who they are with is a sin and is "unislamic", then saying their beliefs should be respected and culture should be above the home countries laws etc. Meanwhile the ruling government allows this instances to keep happening.
That pisses me off and course should piss everyone else that observes this as well.
this shit about the so called "sharia police" was blown out of proportions. it were just some idiots in a pedestrian area telling people that alcohol is bad and that they follow the rules of the islam. hardly something to get furious about, as its just as annoying as other religious groups running around and talking to you about god and the world, even tho you just want to walk through the city.
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On January 08 2015 08:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
On one hand I understand the worry of increasing anti-islam movement but on the other I can understand it's support. Look at England, and Germany where groups of Muslims have been caught ticketing and stopping pedestrians telling what they wear, and how talk, even who they are with is a sin and is "unislamic", then saying their beliefs should be respected and culture should be above the home countries laws etc. Meanwhile the ruling government allows this instances to keep happening.
That pisses me off and course should piss everyone else that observes this as well.
You can remove Germany from that. Thanks.
The "Sharia police" incident were a handful idiots, in one town, it was a planned provocation, the media jumped for it, because that is what the media does, and everyone felt like they now had to issue a very important speech about it. But absolutely nothing had happened, that really justified that medial overreaction.
But then again I was approached at least 3 times during the last year, how I could evade hell etc blabla by christian missionaries, that wanted to teach me the right way. Not once by muslims. Maybe we should throw out all christians!
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Seeing how the vast majority of French keep insisting on our mutual values in this thread, despite the events gives me hope. Thank you.
Also wtf, stop broadcasting this! Why don't you just phone the terrorists and tell them what's going on outside directly! Fucking idiots.
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from some people the true RAID operation is somewhere else and this one is a false flag to bait the media
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It's funny how for you guys nothing is a problem, everyone is super good and respectful, violence episodes are 'media baits' but bombing and attacks actually happen and then you go like 'how could this happen?'. Do you live in the world of magic unicorns?
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On January 08 2015 08:39 r00ty wrote:
Seeing how the vast majority of French keep insisting on our mutual values in this thread, despite the events gives me hope. Thank you.
Also wtf, stop broadcasting this! Why don't you just phone the terrorists and tell them what's going on outside directly! Fucking idiots.
Probably a fake intervention... Or french police is stupid? Hope & think it's the first!
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On January 08 2015 08:31 Biff The Understudy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2015 08:25 MrCon wrote:
Charlie Hebdo is invoking freedom of speech when they post muslim hate things, but when a very funny french comedian make jokes about jews and shoah they publish a big article to say this comedian is the devil incarnate and that freedom of speech should be limited.
This is very sad tho, but Charlie Hebdo became a right wing american paper in the last few years, a neocon newspaper disguised as satirical left wing newspaper....
If you don't see why laughing at 6 million jews being massacred, inviting negationist Faurisson on stage and being best mate with a neo fascist like Soral is different of laughing at religions for what they are, I am terribly sorry for you. Charlie was a libertarian left wing soixante huitard paper, certainly not neo con and never posted anything hateful about anyone. It mocked religions, all of them, and people committing violence ion their name. You "very funny" humorist is an authentic racist, sentenced several time for incitation to religious hatred. Please don't insult the memory Cabu and Charb by comparing them to this asshole. Thanks.
Well said man.
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On January 08 2015 08:35 MrCon wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2015 08:30 Squat wrote:On January 08 2015 08:25 MrCon wrote:
Charlie Hebdo is invoking freedom of speech when they post muslim hate things, but when a very funny french comedian make jokes about jews and shoah they publish a big article to say this comedian is the devil incarnate and that freedom of speech should be limited.
This is very sad tho, but Charlie Hebdo became a right wing american paper in the last few years, a neocon newspaper disguised as satirical left wing newspaper....
Who are "they" in this scenario? In any case, "they" have every right to call him the devil incarnate and call for freedom of speech to be curtailed, just as we have every right to mock "them" for it. Whatever Charlie Hebdo may or may not have posted is irrelevant. This is an attack on a basic democratic principle, and the response has to take that into account. This is a no-compromise situation. But anyway obviously that doesn't mean they deserved to be attacked, I just wanted to state how hypocritical their stance was (they aren't a satirical newspaper anymore, for some years already, well they are but with a very clear agenda)
Sure, they might be complete assholes, I don't know enough to make any statement in that regard. I just don't see it as very relevant. I would jump to the defence to WBC if someone tried to take away their right to free expression too.
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I think the question isn't about a citizenship here because it seems fair to be of a certain nationality if you are born in that country. The real problem is immigration isn't as successful as it should be or not the one outside Europe. In other words, integration should be greatly reconsidered in the next few years. Terror attacks have taken place in Australia, Canada, France, etc and it's often connected with islam. The world needs to either find a way to integrate muslims or never allow them in a country for a living. Racism? No. Just unbridgeable gap in culture.
User was warned for this post
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EPT
