EPTUK Politics Mega-thread - Page 487
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Artisreal
Germany9235 Posts
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Zaros
United Kingdom3692 Posts
On March 13 2019 05:11 Artisreal wrote: Why did she win the confidence vote tho? Because the party as a whole wasn't ready and wanted to see what happened with her deal, if there could be another confidence vote now she would lose and she could still yet be forced out either by the cabinet (unlikely) or a house of commons confidence motion in which there would be a mad scramble to get a new leader in time to divert an election. | ||
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Artisreal
Germany9235 Posts
I don't see a deal emerging under their leadership at all. But to be honest I've yet to ask you, what advantages you think the new leadership would entail? It can't really be a deal, can it? | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15704 Posts
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Sent.
Poland9209 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21761 Posts
Then they will vote to ask for an extension (Thursday). And at some date the EU will hold that vote and it will fail (it needs to be unanimous from all 27 members) and then the EU tells the UK they are on their own and we're likely days away from a hard brexit (well, we are already days away...) Maybe at that time article 50 will be cancelled, maybe it won't but there has been no sign at all that Parliament is actually going to do anything useful, so I expect the next 2 days to be about shouting a lot but just kicking the can down the road for another day in the blind hope that tomorrow the world will miraculously be different, like a chronic procrastinator. | ||
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Longshank
1648 Posts
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KwarK
United States42906 Posts
On March 13 2019 05:34 Mohdoo wrote: It feels like you guys are basically going through a bunch of theater until the inevitable revoking of article 50. Do most of you expect brexit ends up cancelled? Postponed indefinitely so they can tell the Brexiteers that it’s postponed until the EU is ready to cave to their demands, but yes, your take is solid. It’s theatre. | ||
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Sermokala
United States13975 Posts
On March 13 2019 06:10 Longshank wrote: Can the votes in parliament only ever be Yay or Nay? What I'm wondering is if it would be possible(in theory) to hold a two-stage vote on the options remaining, like the French president election? That's the logical way for may to pass the grenade. It would be no deal May's deal revoke Brexit first round and a runoff of whatever is left. I don't think that's allowed in parliament though. And it would also be the end of May's career for stiffing the party like that. | ||
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Longshank
1648 Posts
On March 13 2019 12:01 Sermokala wrote: That's the logical way for may to pass the grenade. It would be no deal May's deal revoke Brexit first round and a runoff of whatever is left. I don't think that's allowed in parliament though. And it would also be the end of May's career for stiffing the party like that. Actually, there seem to be a mechanism to hold multi-option votes on motions. Not on legistation though so May wouldn't be legally bound by that vote, as I understand it. If the house agreed on such course of action, May would be equally screwed if she didn't honor it. | ||
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Slydie
1923 Posts
On March 13 2019 10:40 KwarK wrote: Postponed indefinitely so they can tell the Brexiteers that it’s postponed until the EU is ready to cave to their demands, but yes, your take is solid. It’s theatre. Does anyone really think the EU would cave? Why would they? They have good reasons to give the UK more time, but not forever. No-deal Berxit, Deal Brexit, Cancel Brexit, New Referendum. In the end, there are no more alternatives but none of them has a majority, right? I wish they could be forced to vote for one or the other rather than just vote no to everything... | ||
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m4ini
4215 Posts
On March 13 2019 17:18 Slydie wrote: Does anyone really think the EU would cave? Why would they? They have good reasons to give the UK more time, but not forever. No-deal Berxit, Deal Brexit, Cancel Brexit, New Referendum. In the end, there are no more alternatives but none of them has a majority, right? I wish they could be forced to vote for one or the other rather than just vote no to everything... Woosh. Straight over your head it seems. No, they don't have a reason to cave in. And they wouldn't cave in. Which turns "it's postponed until the EU caves in" into "it's postponed indefinitely" as Kwark even spelled out. It's a jab. edit: and how much it's reality is shown by what the house is voting on. Malthouse Plan B. They'll vote on something that assumes the position of the EU by default is "yeah sure you can do what you please and we accomodate" despite the EU already making clear that that's not the case. Here's what the EU said. Not through flowers, or implied - they very literally made clear that there's no transition without a deal. The Malthouse Plan B is this. It contains four measures that include the British government publishing its post-Brexit trade tariff schedules “immediately” and seeks an extension of Article 50 until 22nd May. The plan would also offer “mutual standstill agreements” with the European Union for a period until the end of 2021 at the latest with discussions on the future relationship and the UK contributing financially in the meantime. The EU already ruled that out. Weeks and months ago. This is literally asking for a transition period (it just calls it "a period with mutual standstill agreements"). This is not something that is the UK even able to decide, so it's a complete waste of time like literally fucking everything the UK has done in the last two years, with people like Zaros cheering for every borderline retarded move they make. "I'll leave, give me a deal" - here's the compromise, take it or leave it "Don't like the compromise" - okay, here's a slightly better version of the compromise, but this is the last option, no more "nah still don't like it, we now decide on something that isn't actually an option for no reason and then be fucking furious that the EU doesn't adhere to what we decided even though they made that position clear BEFORE we voted on it" But we got all time in the world, right? You got morons throwing around "yeah article 24 wto, such great, much trade wow", like Johnson and his parrots - conveniently forgetting that it's also not an option because it's not up to the UK to indeed decide that either. It's a decision made by both the UK and the EU, and has a very clear set of rules. That's not something the UK can "vote for", it's something that has to be negotiated. And call me pessimistic, after all the "negotiations" (pure demands)the UK had, i doubt there's much goodwill left in the EU. edit2: I mean.. Referring to the most controversial part of the amendment, paragraph 3, he acknowledges that Michel Barnier, the EU’s chief Brexit negotiator, has said this proposal (a transition without the UK having to agree to the backstop, basically) is unacceptable. But he says if the government just did everything Barnier said, it would never get anywhere. He urges MPs to back the amendment, saying it offers a way forward. "They don't bend over backwards like we're expecting them to, so lets vote on something that they ruled out already as a way forward". Right then. | ||
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Garrl
Scotland1974 Posts
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21761 Posts
308 out of 620 want a hard no deal Brexit. This is why shit will not get done. 308 people that want to see any deal fail but will complain loudly that May needs to go and get a better deal. | ||
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Zaros
United Kingdom3692 Posts
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Banaora
Germany234 Posts
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Zaros
United Kingdom3692 Posts
Bet some cabinet ministers will vote for it and claim it is a mistake and try to keep their jobs | ||
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Banaora
Germany234 Posts
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Zaros
United Kingdom3692 Posts
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