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On January 25 2013 02:43 radscorpion9 wrote:
The second part of his statement is basic logic. I don't think quoting him should really reveal anything new (except to some people who may be ignorant of this issue entirely). I do wonder how bad climate change will be though. It seems like lately the scientists are giving some pretty bad warnings, about how it will be worse than they thought in terms of the frequency and size of natural disasters. Maybe its a little callous...but I am kind of excited. I wonder what this new world will be like? I am imagining a future dystopia where we live underground, and poke outside once in a while to rummage through our wrecked cities for scrap. And I would be a sentry at one of the underground cities, occasionally taking out a bandit and picking through his weapons for something useful. It sounds so cool in my imagination, probably not so much in reality.
Too much video games man...
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I think most people got it wrong, we are not a plague that is pesting earth.
This planet and life on it will be there after we are gone, the forces of nature are much stronger than you think.
So yes, we produce too much crap like CO2, but that doesnt really bother the planet. The planet is fine with it, there have been periods of time where O2 was a toxic gas!
We should still care about what we do, but that is self preservation and not "saving the planet", since we actually cant live on a heated up planet with methane as a major part of the atmosphere. But other lifeforms would be rather happy about that.
Who knows, maybe nature just wanted some nice plastics and thats why we exist. And now we can go.
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United States5162 Posts
On January 25 2013 07:52 LaNague wrote:
Who knows, maybe nature just wanted some nice plastics and thats why we exist. And now we can go.
I like George Carlin, too 
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A plague on this planet? I'd say no.
A detriment to this planet? I'd say yes.
Do I think we should radically change our ways/kill ourselves because of it? No.
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On January 25 2013 06:20 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote:
Having spent the majority of my life learning about the dark side of the human mind and our activities on this earth (including such gems as how we think and thus how and why we suck at thinking, the way hate works and the dozens of ways in which we are fucking over ourselves and the world we live in), I tend to agree with his assessment.
We are a plague.
Unfortunately, I have found that happy people are unwilling to accept that fact. Even I in my happier moments have struggled against the cold logic that I used to form the belief that the human race is horrible. In the end, though, I could not counter my own logic with anything but naive denial.
I think you should look at the humankind as a whole not as a villain, but as a child. I mean look at them. Up until the age of 4 they don't even have a theory of mind, they care only about sweets, fun and games, they don't understand the consequences of their actions, they are often mean, angry and egoistic, they are absolutely useless and only require resources and attention for no apparent gain. But there is one big positive: they learn. The same applies to the humankind, we are terrible in the process, but we learn.
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Alex Jones may be right :D
But seriously, saying that a being that gets to fathom how the universe works or how it began is a plague ....... That's some reptilian bs yo =D
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Plagues are the most successful organisms we know of, so I view this statement as pointless masturbation of the ego. In reality if we had anything approaching the ruthlessness and innovation of most single called organisms coupled with our present intelligence we'd have conquered this solar system long ago.
Also, as I'm sure others have pointed out, the amount of available resources is constantly increasing thanks to technological development and application of labor. Not like the planet has x Amt of available resources and therefore theres nothing we can do about that but force Ethiopians to stop breeding.
I just hate threads where humans pointlessly (and with unwitting irony) denounce humanity, tends to bring out the most smug, superior, holier than thou among us.
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The solution imo is the dissolution of the current government system in the world and uniting together as one. No borders, no boundaries, just work together as a whole to find a solution to this.
But to be honest I think at some point the Earth will balance itself out but the human species as a whole won't be going out of the whole process without losing significant population, which is going to be a good thing for everyone. Less people is always good.
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Hmm let's see here... A man who has literally seen the whole world with his own two eyes, or a bunch of nerds who scream SOURCE!? PROOF!? whenever they come across unpalatable information. Yeah...
Humanity IS driving off a cliff, in more ways than this one. It's just a natural defense mechanism in most people to deny it.
Inequality, resource depletion, blind belief in our political/religious/financial institutions. These things will destroy us in the end unless people start to wake up from their slumberous apathy. I only hope we can do so in time.
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I actually agree. Then again, if you think about it, every single species is like a virus. Consume and reproduce, that's what we do, the problem is we, as an intelligent species, have managed to dodge many of the hurdles nature throws at us to keep population down. We're no longer cavemen, dying from disease, famine or drought. Sure, these problems can always hit a region or another, but we have doctors, agricultural progress, irrigation systems, technology, industry etc, to beat the odds. That means we are overpopulating the planet and beating nature's balancing gimmicks at every turn.
This 'nature finds a way to balance things out' does not mean it will be a way beneficial for us. We will reach a breaking point eventually, unless technology moves fast enough to grow food, energy and space for everyone. If our continued existence and overpopulation starts to affect the ecosystem to the point it starts to become hostile for us or unable to sustain us, then the planet gets what it needs and people start dying. What I wonder is, when that ball starts rolling, will we be able to stop it once our numbers have gone down enough or will it be too late?
Every virus moves to another body to keep on consuming and reproducing, but we can't colonize planets or space and move people there just yet. That seems to me as the most humane solution. Sometimes I see this all as a race against nature. Will we beat it and survive, even if we end up living in tiny quarters, drinking our recycled urine, or will she finally get us?
Regarding winter, I can't comment. I'm in latin america, enjoying summer, which is awesome.
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scumbag humans, ruining the earth and shit.
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At 86, Sir David has no ulterior motives or hidden agenda behind this proclamation, and his body of work attests to this.
To become famous once again late in life. To give interviews, to be written about.
To get favorable coverage by a media very attuned to global warming and the energy crisis.
He has plenty of reasons to take up this position late in life, and may even have been propositioned by the population control extremists wanting more notoriety for their cause. The Economist already wrote about it. It wasn't too long ago that Japan's leaders met to address the crisis of an aging population as its replacement rate remains too low. Russia's worried too. Overpopulation ideologues forget how their advocacy can create the opposite problem.
The sheer amount of energy required to grow crops to feed the current growing population is cause for alarm if fossil fuels are legislated out of development or run out altogether. That problem I will agree with.
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United States42656 Posts
On January 25 2013 08:42 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +At 86, Sir David has no ulterior motives or hidden agenda behind this proclamation, and his body of work attests to this. To become famous once again late in life. To give interviews, to be written about. To get favorable coverage by a media very attuned to global warming and the energy crisis.
I don't think you understand who you're talking about. He is one of the most recognisable figures in Britain, if not the world. He is an iconic symbol. He will be written about for years after his death and he is still producing documentaries that are shown all over the world. I disagree with his point but Sir David does not need to pull any kind of stunt to get heard about or be remembered for his conservationism. He's pretty much the founder of modern popular conservationism and all the environmental awareness that goes with it.
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I agree. I think it's time to start terraforming Mars.
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This 'Sir David whatshisface' may be correct but I will tell you that only education can lead to success.
The solution to solving this "unsustainable growth" is to become smarter, which is what many of us are doing everyday. Humans are all about making things more and more efficient which means doing more shit by using less shit. Simple as that.
Pretty much Sir David just slapped us in the face saying that humans are dumb.
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Earth isn't sentient. We as humans have an evolutionary responsibility only to our own species. The extinction of other species should be weighed as events according to their value/detriment to us as a species not with some sentimental over-generalized self-condemning nonsense of an argument.
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this is straight up bullshit trying to justify whats going to come = population decrease it wont just be a "coincidence"
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On January 25 2013 08:47 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2013 08:42 Danglars wrote:At 86, Sir David has no ulterior motives or hidden agenda behind this proclamation, and his body of work attests to this. To become famous once again late in life. To give interviews, to be written about. To get favorable coverage by a media very attuned to global warming and the energy crisis. I don't think you understand who you're talking about. He is one of the most recognisable figures in Britain, if not the world. He is an iconic symbol. He will be written about for years after his death and he is still producing documentaries that are shown all over the world. I disagree with his point but Sir David does not need to pull any kind of stunt to get heard about or be remembered for his conservationism. He's pretty much the founder of modern popular conservationism and all the environmental awareness that goes with it.
So he took up a new cause related to what he already believes in. I'll agree that he may be very recognizable in Britain, and perhaps many parts of the world. I'll confess, this is my first hearing of his name and achievements.
He may actually be quite right. At 86, Sir David has no ulterior motives or hidden agenda behind this proclamation, and his body of work attests to this.
Did you read this and think the writer went a bit overboard? Of COURSE, this man is a saint and cannot be suspected of any other motives! The author laid it on a bit thick, as if this is the first guy supporting the over-population agenda and over-consumption ideology that is an honest man to boot. I take it that the first reason I listed is untrue, as he need no more fame or interviews. A naturalist is late in life persuaded that both population growth and consumption will lead to a litany of ill effects, not only that, but that "Humans are a plague on Earth" (Did he always have this spark for hyperbole?). Maybe he's the best thing to come to the cause he now champions. One honorable man has made a mistake in going so overboard for this issue. I'd have to know more about population control advocacy in Britain to fully know if he's further in the fold with popular causes for the naturalists. I came out reading that he has no ulterior motives or hidden agenda that this was the endorsement of the Pope and discovered writings from both Gandhi and Mother Theresa.
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If we destroy Earth, the only sad thing would be our own demise. Earth and the Universe for that matter are not very interesting when there's nobody to find it interesting. And a beautiful lively Earth is just as uninteresting as a post-apocalyptic one. A swirling mass of stupid which can't even question itself.
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EPT
