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On March 06 2012 17:24 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 16:57 Emperor_Earth wrote:Being fat is a choice except for the very rare exception where you are vegetated or something and not physically able to determine your diet. The equation has been the same for aeons and aeons:
if calorieInput > calorieOutput:
gainWeight(calorieInput - calorieOutput)
elif calorieInput < calorieOutput:
loseWeight(calorieOutput - calorieInput)
return
actually I'm pretty sure the new consensus is that it's not that simplistic.
If we have somebody whom eating next to nothing and exercising almost all day does not help loosing weight, I think humanity has finally found its first perpetum mobile!
edit: Anyways, I got nothing against people being overweight, in fact I myself am a bit. However I got something against people finding cheap excuses for what I think is just their lazyness and lack of willpower (and no, being overweight does not mean you are lazy and lack willpower, but finding cheap excuses is).
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On March 06 2012 17:39 VTPerfect wrote:
Pretty fail arguments from the pro exhibit side. Calorie input vs output is an extreme gross oversimplification of the biological processes that aren't even close to being fully understood. Doctors aren't going to say its your fault you got Arthritis, they aren't going to say its your fault you got a brain tumor and they aren't going to say its your fault you got Fat because there simply isn't enough evidence to conclusively say anything.
Really tired of posters using arguments like, "they are just lazy", "they need to eat less" "they need some tough love". Its pretty much the same flawed arguments about non-korean starcraft players (i find the term foreigner offensive). What exactly is your agenda anyways...
Except that you are 100% wrong. Barring some highly complicated health defect, it is biologically impossible to continue gaining fat when you consume low amounts of healthy, balanced foods and exercise daily.
It is true that you can't simply starve yourself to fitness. But if you get off your ass and actually use your body for what it was supposed to be used, you will not only lose excess fat but gain muscle and that is a medical and sports fact.
This is all a travesty backed by McDonalds and other food corporations. People need to stop finding retarded excuses why their life sucks, they need to stop being insulted by objective criticism, stop whining, sitting around, watching commercials, buying shit they don't need and just start living. I'd argue that "living" in its true sense absolutely involves daily exhaustion due to exercise or at least copious amounts of sex.
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On March 06 2012 17:36 beg wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 17:18 Gustis wrote:On March 06 2012 16:46 beg wrote:On March 06 2012 16:37 Gustis wrote:
"The National Association to Advance Fat Acceptance immediately condemned the exhibit..."
How's that even possible to have such an association? Could anyone elaborate why this is not retarded? as this thread shows, a majority of people seem to think it's ok to make fat people feel bad about themselves. someone even argued that fat people should be bullied until they start losing weight. lol. you really don't see how an association like that can make sense? With extremely miniscule examples of real illnesses(hormone deficiencies etc.), obesity equals eating more calories than using up. In your sense, how come we don't have The National Association to Advance Alcoholism Acceptance or The National Association to Advance Cigarette Smoking Acceptance? Because just like the chronic alcoholics and smokers, the obese people are choosing to live an unhealthy and socially/economically damaging lifestyle not only for themselves, but for other people. have you been an alcoholic, a smoker or obese? if not, you really dont know what you're talking about. none of these is a choice like "today i'm going for a walk".
Bullshit. I was obese but have since lost over 50 pounds last year, and I'm still working hard towards losing more. My dad was a chronic smoker who now quit because he found the motivation to do so. Sure it's fucking hard to give up smoking, eating or alcohol, but it's still a choice. You just have to work your ass off (no pun intended) to get where you want to go.
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so we are supposed to encourage people to be fat? especially kids? we shouldnt shame someone for being fat at the same time shouldnt give them the illusion that its a good thing. its unhealthy. When i have kids im not going to ignore their health in fear that they will feel bad about being fat. Sure acceptance is great but we should accept people that are different not accept EVERYTHING. what next? should we stop the antidrug campaigns because they make druggies feel bad? maybe we should stop condeming jerks because it makes them feel bad. We are raising a generation of spoiled brats because we forgot that we rebuke our youth for their own good. Genetics can play into people becoming alcoholics or drug addicts but it doesnt make it ok. Sure some people's genetics will make it easier for them to get fat and it sucks that they have to work harder to stay healthy but we all have our shortcomings. We just need to work harder to better ourselves instead of giving up.
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On March 06 2012 16:40 Defacer wrote:
Imagine this scenario:
You happen to have a genetically fat kid. It happens. Some kids are just naturally big (imagine InControl as an eight year old).
You and your kid go to Disney World with a bunch of friends and their families to Disney World. It's your kid's dream, and even though Disney World is as expensive as fuck you want to be an awesome parent and give him/her the best, care-free, guilt-free day of their life.
Then you run into this feel-bad attraction.
I know, I know -- it's important to educate kids (and parents) about good nutrition. But if you're a parent, or have worked in the family attraction industry, basically you know the reason why you go to Disney World is because it's a safe environment that will make your kid happy as hell.
I don't really care about political correctness, but there's a time and place for making people question their lifestyle.
TLDR; Let fat kids have their special day in magically happy-sappy make-believe land. They have the rest of the year to feel shitty about themselves.
This tbh.
100% agree.
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On March 06 2012 17:53 Mikau wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 17:36 beg wrote:On March 06 2012 17:18 Gustis wrote:On March 06 2012 16:46 beg wrote:On March 06 2012 16:37 Gustis wrote:
"The National Association to Advance Fat Acceptance immediately condemned the exhibit..."
How's that even possible to have such an association? Could anyone elaborate why this is not retarded? as this thread shows, a majority of people seem to think it's ok to make fat people feel bad about themselves. someone even argued that fat people should be bullied until they start losing weight. lol. you really don't see how an association like that can make sense? With extremely miniscule examples of real illnesses(hormone deficiencies etc.), obesity equals eating more calories than using up. In your sense, how come we don't have The National Association to Advance Alcoholism Acceptance or The National Association to Advance Cigarette Smoking Acceptance? Because just like the chronic alcoholics and smokers, the obese people are choosing to live an unhealthy and socially/economically damaging lifestyle not only for themselves, but for other people. have you been an alcoholic, a smoker or obese? if not, you really dont know what you're talking about. none of these is a choice like "today i'm going for a walk". Bullshit. I was obese but have since lost over 50 pounds last year, and I'm still working hard towards losing more. My dad was a chronic smoker who now quit because he found the motivation to do so. Sure it's fucking hard to give up smoking, eating or alcohol, but it's still a choice. You just have to work your ass off (no pun intended) to get where you want to go.
like you said... IT'S FUCKING HARD. and statistically almost no one can change these habbits.
"bullshit", i only asked whether you've been in such a situation yourself. ohhhh such a bullshit question. god you're full of shit. hope you gain all your weight again like i did <3
i'm out guys. arguing is so no fun at all :p
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On March 06 2012 17:53 Kickboxer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 17:39 VTPerfect wrote:
Pretty fail arguments from the pro exhibit side. Calorie input vs output is an extreme gross oversimplification of the biological processes that aren't even close to being fully understood. Doctors aren't going to say its your fault you got Arthritis, they aren't going to say its your fault you got a brain tumor and they aren't going to say its your fault you got Fat because there simply isn't enough evidence to conclusively say anything.
Really tired of posters using arguments like, "they are just lazy", "they need to eat less" "they need some tough love". Its pretty much the same flawed arguments about non-korean starcraft players (i find the term foreigner offensive). What exactly is your agenda anyways... Except that you are 100% wrong. Barring some highly complicated health defect, it is biologically impossible to continue gaining fat when you consume low amounts of healthy, balanced foods and exercise daily. It is true that you can't simply starve yourself to fitness. But if you get off your ass and actually use your body for what it was supposed to be used, you will not only lose excess fat but gain muscle and that is a medical and sports fact. This is all a travesty backed by McDonalds and other food corporations. People need to stop finding retarded excuses why their life sucks, they need to stop being insulted by objective criticism, stop whining, sitting around, watching commercials, buying shit they don't need and just start living. I'd argue that "living" in its true sense absolutely involves daily exhaustion due to exercise or at least copious amounts of sex.
So just because someone's fat their life sucks? Why's that? Is it because they really are unhealthy, or is it because everyone THINKS they're unhealthy?
And as I posted earlier, what about me? I eat plenty of bullshit grease, sit at my computer all day. I'm sure most of these posters do as well. How are we different from those who are fat?
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On March 06 2012 16:25 lisward wrote:
Often a times these fat advocates go about using 'be happy with your own body' as an excuse to not improve yourself. Sure maybe genetically speaking you're more inclined to gain weight easily, but don't use that as an excuse for leading an unhealthy lifestyle.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
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On March 06 2012 18:03 Son of Gnome wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 16:25 lisward wrote:
Often a times these fat advocates go about using 'be happy with your own body' as an excuse to not improve yourself. Sure maybe genetically speaking you're more inclined to gain weight easily, but don't use that as an excuse for leading an unhealthy lifestyle. Couldn't have said it better myself.
So you're promoting anorexia?
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On March 06 2012 16:57 Emperor_Earth wrote:Being fat is a choice except for the very rare exception where you are vegetated or something and not physically able to determine your diet. The equation has been the same for aeons and aeons:
if calorieInput > calorieOutput:
gainWeight(calorieInput - calorieOutput)
elif calorieInput < calorieOutput:
loseWeight(calorieOutput - calorieInput)
return
Shh, you'll give away men's magazines secrets.
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On March 06 2012 18:04 Oiseaux wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 18:03 Son of Gnome wrote:On March 06 2012 16:25 lisward wrote:
Often a times these fat advocates go about using 'be happy with your own body' as an excuse to not improve yourself. Sure maybe genetically speaking you're more inclined to gain weight easily, but don't use that as an excuse for leading an unhealthy lifestyle. Couldn't have said it better myself. So you're promoting anorexia?
Omg, I hate it when people do this in an argument. :p
When did he ever say anything about anorexia?
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On March 06 2012 17:24 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 16:57 Emperor_Earth wrote:Being fat is a choice except for the very rare exception where you are vegetated or something and not physically able to determine your diet. The equation has been the same for aeons and aeons:
if calorieInput > calorieOutput:
gainWeight(calorieInput - calorieOutput)
elif calorieInput < calorieOutput:
loseWeight(calorieOutput - calorieInput)
return
actually I'm pretty sure the new consensus is that it's not that simplistic.
Make a statement with no explanation or backing... while denying a basic mathematical equation.
Math doesn't lie. Statistics can be misused but the math does not lie.
If you eat more than your body needs you gain weight. If you eat less than it needs you lose weight. It is that simple. All the excuses in the world don't change that. If you are controlling what you eat then you have a choice to put in only what you need.
I have two fat sisters, I am not fat. I have heard all the excuses. They eat more than they need and until they want to change they will stay fat. Anyone who tries to say it is more complex is just trying to justify why they eat more than they need. I am personally sick of the excuses.
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On March 06 2012 17:24 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 16:57 Emperor_Earth wrote:Being fat is a choice except for the very rare exception where you are vegetated or something and not physically able to determine your diet. The equation has been the same for aeons and aeons:
if calorieInput > calorieOutput:
gainWeight(calorieInput - calorieOutput)
elif calorieInput < calorieOutput:
loseWeight(calorieOutput - calorieInput)
return
actually I'm pretty sure the new consensus is that it's not that simplistic.
It really is...Find your BMR, eat 500-1000 cals less than that, figure out macronutrient ratio, and you're good to go.
And lift heavy.
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Well there are pretty huge differences in people's metabolisms. I have a skinny little Chinese Canadian friend who always orders two full meals when we go out to eat. doesn't exercise and managed to eat four quarter pounders in one sitting. If I ate like that I'd put on a huge amount of weight.
But yeah, the vast majority of people who are obese/overweight are eating too much junk. Nobody seems to have any problem giving smokers a hard time so I'm not sure why fat people shouldn't also be given some tough love. The most laughable thing to me was when the US government decided to classify pizza as a vegetable.
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On March 06 2012 18:07 DwmC_Foefen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 18:04 Oiseaux wrote:On March 06 2012 18:03 Son of Gnome wrote:On March 06 2012 16:25 lisward wrote:
Often a times these fat advocates go about using 'be happy with your own body' as an excuse to not improve yourself. Sure maybe genetically speaking you're more inclined to gain weight easily, but don't use that as an excuse for leading an unhealthy lifestyle. Couldn't have said it better myself. So you're promoting anorexia? Omg, I hate it when people do this in an argument. :p
If you hate it, then you probably like to strangle kittens.
On subject, the parents of the rare kids who are fat because of an illness or genetics should just not bring their children to that particular attraction ? There are plenty of activities to do in Disney Land.
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On March 06 2012 18:04 Oiseaux wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 18:03 Son of Gnome wrote:On March 06 2012 16:25 lisward wrote:
Often a times these fat advocates go about using 'be happy with your own body' as an excuse to not improve yourself. Sure maybe genetically speaking you're more inclined to gain weight easily, but don't use that as an excuse for leading an unhealthy lifestyle. Couldn't have said it better myself. So you're promoting anorexia?
I advocate literacy, and you sir are a shining example of why we need to focus on reading skills in this day and age. Improving yourself, and leading a healthy lifestyle are exactly the opposite of anorexia. Please don't post such trash anymore, low quality posts really arent appreciated
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I had a really well articulated post, but I deleted it realizing that it was at its core, a very hateful rant about fat wastes of space.
I'm avoiding the rest of the thread, but thanks for the OP.
Gonna go box a heavy bag. ugh.
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On March 06 2012 17:39 VTPerfect wrote:
Pretty fail arguments from the pro exhibit side. Calorie input vs output is an extreme gross oversimplification of the biological processes that aren't even close to being fully understood. Doctors aren't going to say its your fault you got Arthritis, they aren't going to say its your fault you got a brain tumor and they aren't going to say its your fault you got Fat because there simply isn't enough evidence to conclusively say anything.
Really tired of posters using arguments like, "they are just lazy", "they need to eat less" "they need some tough love". Its pretty much the same flawed arguments about non-korean starcraft players (i find the term foreigner offensive). What exactly is your agenda anyways...
Having looked into the matter myself some time ago i can say that a vast majority of fat people have noone to blame but themselves.Yes people are born with different bodies, some have very high metabolism and some people just seem to put on weight faster than others but i'd estimate from what i know that anywhere between 90 and 99% of fat people could have avoided it and looked just like the rest of us by making the right decisions regarding their food and their exercise.
What is really tiring is people looking for any defense they can for their dumb lifestyle, science report found that some people burn food faster than others? Every fat person jumps on it and claim to have a shitty body that isn't doing it's job, no, that aint true, you're just eating wrong and not moving around enough.
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People who bring metabolism into the discussion are silly. Its not about comparing yourself to anyone else. Your PERSONAL intake should be equal to or less than your PERSONAL requirement to maintain or lose weight.
Its not a case of that guy ate 50 hamburgers and looks good, so I should be able to as well. How stupid can you be.
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On March 06 2012 18:07 DwmC_Foefen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2012 18:04 Oiseaux wrote:On March 06 2012 18:03 Son of Gnome wrote:On March 06 2012 16:25 lisward wrote:
Often a times these fat advocates go about using 'be happy with your own body' as an excuse to not improve yourself. Sure maybe genetically speaking you're more inclined to gain weight easily, but don't use that as an excuse for leading an unhealthy lifestyle. Couldn't have said it better myself. So you're promoting anorexia? Omg, I hate it when people do this in an argument. :p When did he ever say anything about anorexia?
Granted I'll agree it's a low blow, but I honestly don't feel bad about it since he didn't say other than "I agree."
I'm just amazed at how all these posters think they can assume the lifestyle choices of fat people based solely on the fact their fat. Simply assuming they all eat McDonald's for breakfast, lunch, and dinner and that they never exert any form of physical labor. It's fucking disgusting, pathetic, and stereotypical.
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EPT
