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On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
That would explain why you would want to have the gun in case the unruly high neighbors broke into your house while the police were en route (or in this case returning after having just left), but not why you would go outside to meet the people.
On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
That would explain why you would want to have the gun in case the unruly high neighbors broke into your house while the police were en route (or in this case returning after having just left), but not why you would go outside to meet the people.
True, calling the police in a bad situation when possible is never a bad idea.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
noooo nononono. I should have been more clear. I had not entered my house (apartment actually) by the time they approached me. And when a neighbor approaches you the first assumption isn't "im going to get attacked." Maybe he is concerned that it is my car? I don't know. But by the time I realized what was happening I was stuck. Obviously trying to pull out a cell phone to call police while they were 1 foot from me would not have ended well. Removing my jacket was a second-to-last resort.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
noooo nononono. I should have been more clear. I had not entered my house (apartment actually) by the time they approached me. And when a neighbor approaches you the first assumption isn't "im going to get attacked." Maybe he is concerned that it is my car? I don't know. But by the time I realized what was happening I was stuck. Obviously trying to pull out a cell phone to call police while they were 1 foot from me would not have ended well. Removing my jacket was a second-to-last resort.
Okay this makes much more sense then. I figured you probably just didn't describe the situation fully.
On February 02 2013 07:11 micronesia wrote: Okay this makes much more sense then. I figured you probably just didn't describe the situation fully.
It is completely understandable to assume that though. I will agree that some people will get "alpha" in that situation but that only causes problems and I really, really disagree with that approach. It makes innocent gun owners look bad by association.
On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
That would explain why you would want to have the gun in case the unruly high neighbors broke into your house while the police were en route (or in this case returning after having just left), but not why you would go outside to meet the people.
True, calling the police in a bad situation when possible is never a bad idea.
The problem with police is and will always be response time. If he was unarmed the high people might have harmed him.
Also I found this picture relating to this thread, with all the 2nd amendment arguments + Show Spoiler [Pictures] +
On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
That would explain why you would want to have the gun in case the unruly high neighbors broke into your house while the police were en route (or in this case returning after having just left), but not why you would go outside to meet the people.
True, calling the police in a bad situation when possible is never a bad idea.
The problem with police is and will always be response time. If he was unarmed the high people might have harmed him.
Also I found this picture relating to this thread, with all the 2nd amendment arguments + Show Spoiler [Pictures] +
[image blocked]
Related:
Police will come. But what will happen in the 20-30 minutes average response time? I don't know. What I do know is, a firearm can be your last line of defense until the police arrive.
Tell me - guys in this thread pushing firearm-free society.... in the video above, what are the girl's options while she waits for police?
On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
That would explain why you would want to have the gun in case the unruly high neighbors broke into your house while the police were en route (or in this case returning after having just left), but not why you would go outside to meet the people.
True, calling the police in a bad situation when possible is never a bad idea.
The problem with police is and will always be response time. If he was unarmed the high people might have harmed him.
Also I found this picture relating to this thread, with all the 2nd amendment arguments + Show Spoiler [Pictures] +
Police will come. But what will happen in the 20-30 minutes average response time? I don't know. What I do know is, a firearm can be your last line of defense until the police arrive.
Tell me - guys in this thread pushing firearm-free society.... in the video above, what are the girl's options while she waits for police?
Not much, considering most women don't have guns (~1/8). Source: http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp Don't look at me, I'm just a guy posting stats from an extremely pro-gun site.
On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
That would explain why you would want to have the gun in case the unruly high neighbors broke into your house while the police were en route (or in this case returning after having just left), but not why you would go outside to meet the people.
True, calling the police in a bad situation when possible is never a bad idea.
The problem with police is and will always be response time. If he was unarmed the high people might have harmed him.
Also I found this picture relating to this thread, with all the 2nd amendment arguments + Show Spoiler [Pictures] +
Police will come. But what will happen in the 20-30 minutes average response time? I don't know. What I do know is, a firearm can be your last line of defense until the police arrive.
Tell me - guys in this thread pushing firearm-free society.... in the video above, what are the girl's options while she waits for police?
Most gun control proponents aren't arguing for a zero-gun society, if thats what you mean. People can clutch their precious guns all they want. Making sure the wrong people aren't getting guns is where the problem is, and the country isn't capable of fixing it because of the gun lobby.
On February 02 2013 06:16 kmillz wrote: 278 people killed in the name of self defense by private citizens (2010) is actually a very good thing, and that a majority of the DGUs result in nobody dying at all?
The best thing a gun can do is prevent a crime simply by being there--no use, no threat of use, only by being there. I have a personal experience with this. And personal experiences are not very common if you try to keep out of harm's way (as I do).
I called the police to report vandalism to a nearby car (a couple drunks running by with a bat were striking it). I walked outside to explain to the police what I saw. My neighbor and his friend were high on... I have no clue, something hardcore, and once the police left they came out of the house and began threatening me thinking I called the police on THEM. They were very paranoid. Long story short, things were going downhill and I removed my jacket, which "unconcealed" my concealed firearm that I always carry. Keep in mind, I did nothing threatening, I didn't even make it a point to show them I was armed other than removing my jacket, I kept completely casual, and they quickly backed down, went back into their house and the situation returned to normal.
There's a prevented crime that involved no violence and no arrest which will never show up in any statistic or survey. How many more like this could there possibly be? It is completely inconceivable to even estimate.
Not to argue with any points you are making, but if high dudes are threatening you, instead of staying in your house and calling the police back, you step outside and remove your jacket? Sorry but that's a bit strange to me XD
How reliable are the police and how soon will they get there? When people ask me why I would carry a gun I jest that a cop is too heavy. I don't actually care to own a gun, I just support our right to have one in case of a situation that would escalate too quickly for the police to get there.
That would explain why you would want to have the gun in case the unruly high neighbors broke into your house while the police were en route (or in this case returning after having just left), but not why you would go outside to meet the people.
True, calling the police in a bad situation when possible is never a bad idea.
The problem with police is and will always be response time. If he was unarmed the high people might have harmed him.
Also I found this picture relating to this thread, with all the 2nd amendment arguments + Show Spoiler [Pictures] +
Police will come. But what will happen in the 20-30 minutes average response time? I don't know. What I do know is, a firearm can be your last line of defense until the police arrive.
Tell me - guys in this thread pushing firearm-free society.... in the video above, what are the girl's options while she waits for police?
Most gun control proponents aren't arguing for a zero-gun society, if thats what you mean. People can clutch their precious guns all they want. Making sure the wrong people aren't getting guns is where the problem is, and the country isn't capable of fixing it because of the gun lobby.
I have seen quite a few people in this thread specifically advocate for a removal of all guns from civilian society, save for law enforcement etc.. For all of the people who specifically believe that the person in that video, a typical american citizen, should not be allowed to own and possess that firearm the way she did, StarStrider wants to know what advice they have for someone in the same situation.
Those people who believe she should be allowed to own that pistol need not justify their stance for obvious reasons.
When I was 5 we had a break-in at my house. We lived near Houston in one of the suburbs, and it was a very scary situation from what I remember. One of the men was armed with a knife, the other with a crowbar and neither of them wore masks. I remember my dad pulling my sister and I and pushing us up the stairs trying to get us running. There were no gun shots, there were no injuries on either side. Once my dad got a hold of his pistol, the thieves ran. This is a personal account, and not everyone has these kinds of experiences. I've never forgotten what that moment was like though. There is really no time to call 9-1-1 in a situation like that. I will always be an advocate for firearm ownership with the right papers.
Won't be giving up mine, I don't particularly care what ya'll decide to do. It isn't like I am going to follow the gun control laws lol. Already quite stockpiled and nobody knows my little arsenal exists so I don't expect anyone to knock to take them any time soon.
"Should people be allowed to own guns?" - I really don't care, but I know mine aren't going anywhere. I can't really answer the question straight up because I selfishly consider myself different from everyone else. Even if I thought the average person should be disarmed, it wouldn't cause me to disarm myself.
On February 02 2013 13:03 `phobiA wrote: When I was 5 we had a break-in at my house. We lived near Houston in one of the suburbs, and it was a very scary situation from what I remember. One of the men was armed with a knife, the other with a crowbar and neither of them wore masks. I remember my dad pulling my sister and I and pushing us up the stairs trying to get us running. There were no gun shots, there were no injuries on either side. Once my dad got a hold of his pistol, the thieves ran. This is a personal account, and not everyone has these kinds of experiences. I've never forgotten what that moment was like though. There is really no time to call 9-1-1 in a situation like that. I will always be an advocate for firearm ownership with the right papers.
That's really scary thankfully no one in your family was harmed.
I never understand people who expect you to call 911. There's a guy coming after me in my home let me go grab the phone which more than likely I would have to some how deke out this weapon wielding man and get past him to even get to the phone, then grab the phone and dial, tell the operator what is happening and THEN you can wait 15+ minutes for the cops to show up. I can't see any flaws in this... Especially if your walking to your car in the middle of the night after work or something when you can't lock yourself in a room. Some guy has a knife in your face and your gonna pull out your phone lol... see how that turns out.
People who don't think any civilian should have a firearm are hypocrites because they want someone to come save them who is armed. Seeing how fucking terribly some police act in the countless police brutality videos out there and how poorly trained lots of the force is I would rather just cut out the middle man...
The talk about banning assault weapons is so painful because people just wallow in ignorance. Why regulate the incredibly vague "assault weapon" when pistols are used wayyyyy more in actual crimes? Because people are stupid as fuck. Oh it looks scary so its only use must be used to murder puppies and babies while small hand guns are totally okay. As someone put it earlier .50 cal armour piercing baby seeking rifles. Let's talk about the real problems instead of pandering to ignorance and trying to score political points.
How do you define an "assault weapon"? It's like trying to define a sports car. Hypothetically, if we decided to ban sports car how would we do that. Would we ban based on engine size? the shape of the car? the 0-60 time? You can still kill yourself easily in my little v6 3.0 ranger if you drive like a fucktard as it is in a Lambo. Let's focus on training people to use firearms safely through licensing rather than just banning things randomly.
On February 02 2013 13:03 `phobiA wrote: When I was 5 we had a break-in at my house. We lived near Houston in one of the suburbs, and it was a very scary situation from what I remember. One of the men was armed with a knife, the other with a crowbar and neither of them wore masks. I remember my dad pulling my sister and I and pushing us up the stairs trying to get us running. There were no gun shots, there were no injuries on either side. Once my dad got a hold of his pistol, the thieves ran. This is a personal account, and not everyone has these kinds of experiences. I've never forgotten what that moment was like though. There is really no time to call 9-1-1 in a situation like that. I will always be an advocate for firearm ownership with the right papers.
That's really scary thankfully no one in your family was harmed.
I never understand people who expect you to call 911. There's a guy coming after me in my home let me go grab the phone which more than likely I would have to some how deke out this weapon wielding man and get past him to even get to the phone, then grab the phone and dial, tell the operator what is happening and THEN you can wait 15+ minutes for the cops to show up. I can't see any flaws in this... Especially if your walking to your car in the middle of the night after work or something when you can't lock yourself in a room. Some guy has a knife in your face and your gonna pull out your phone lol... see how that turns out.
People who don't think any civilian should have a firearm are hypocrites because they want someone to come save them who is armed. Seeing how fucking terribly some police act in the countless police brutality videos out there and how poorly trained lots of the force is I would rather just cut out the middle man...
The talk about banning assault weapons is so painful because people just wallow in ignorance. Why regulate the incredibly vague "assault weapon" when pistols are used wayyyyy more in actual crimes? Because people are stupid as fuck. Oh it looks scary so its only use must be used to murder puppies and babies while small hand guns are totally okay. As someone put it earlier .50 cal armour piercing baby seeking rifles. Let's talk about the real problems instead of pandering to ignorance and trying to score political points.
How do you define an "assault weapon"? It's like trying to define a sports car. Hypothetically, if we decided to ban sports car how would we do that. Would we ban based on engine size? the shape of the car? the 0-60 time? You can still kill yourself easily in my little v6 3.0 ranger if you drive like a fucktard as it is in a Lambo. Let's focus on training people to use firearms safely through licensing rather than just banning things randomly.
Then how do you explain countries in the rest of the world where people don't own guns? Do they have significantly lower crime rates or better police service? Not even trying to be an ass here just curious because it seems like the main argument is "I (or close friends and relatives) have experience of domestic robbery and would have ended much worse if not for said firearm." How is it then that the rest of the world doesn't get overrun by criminals if the police are so incompetent? Is it just an American thing? An anomaly?
Personally I can understand that if you are already living in a country with a rich history and culture of firearms, then it is impossible to take away. However, if anyone would argue that introducing guns to a practically gun free country (like China) is a good method for domestic defence, I would not agree.
I do not feel safe at all when I go to the US for travel. I keep thinking everyone has a piece on them and will shoot me and claim self defense for whatever vague reasons. It just seems rather backwards to have this "every man for himself" mentality.
On February 02 2013 13:03 `phobiA wrote: When I was 5 we had a break-in at my house. We lived near Houston in one of the suburbs, and it was a very scary situation from what I remember. One of the men was armed with a knife, the other with a crowbar and neither of them wore masks. I remember my dad pulling my sister and I and pushing us up the stairs trying to get us running. There were no gun shots, there were no injuries on either side. Once my dad got a hold of his pistol, the thieves ran. This is a personal account, and not everyone has these kinds of experiences. I've never forgotten what that moment was like though. There is really no time to call 9-1-1 in a situation like that. I will always be an advocate for firearm ownership with the right papers.
That's really scary thankfully no one in your family was harmed.
I never understand people who expect you to call 911. There's a guy coming after me in my home let me go grab the phone which more than likely I would have to some how deke out this weapon wielding man and get past him to even get to the phone, then grab the phone and dial, tell the operator what is happening and THEN you can wait 15+ minutes for the cops to show up. I can't see any flaws in this... Especially if your walking to your car in the middle of the night after work or something when you can't lock yourself in a room. Some guy has a knife in your face and your gonna pull out your phone lol... see how that turns out.
People who don't think any civilian should have a firearm are hypocrites because they want someone to come save them who is armed. Seeing how fucking terribly some police act in the countless police brutality videos out there and how poorly trained lots of the force is I would rather just cut out the middle man...
The talk about banning assault weapons is so painful because people just wallow in ignorance. Why regulate the incredibly vague "assault weapon" when pistols are used wayyyyy more in actual crimes? Because people are stupid as fuck. Oh it looks scary so its only use must be used to murder puppies and babies while small hand guns are totally okay. As someone put it earlier .50 cal armour piercing baby seeking rifles. Let's talk about the real problems instead of pandering to ignorance and trying to score political points.
How do you define an "assault weapon"? It's like trying to define a sports car. Hypothetically, if we decided to ban sports car how would we do that. Would we ban based on engine size? the shape of the car? the 0-60 time? You can still kill yourself easily in my little v6 3.0 ranger if you drive like a fucktard as it is in a Lambo. Let's focus on training people to use firearms safely through licensing rather than just banning things randomly.
Then how do you explain countries in the rest of the world where people don't own guns? Do they have significantly lower crime rates or better police service? Not even trying to be an ass here just curious because it seems like the main argument is "I (or close friends and relatives) have experience of domestic robbery and would have ended much worse if not for said firearm." How is it then that the rest of the world doesn't get overrun by criminals if the police are so incompetent? Is it just an American thing? An anomaly?
Personally I can understand that if you are already living in a country with a rich history and culture of firearms, then it is impossible to take away. However, if anyone would argue that introducing guns to a practically gun free country (like China) is a good method for domestic defence, I would not agree.
I do not feel safe at all when I go to the US for travel. I keep thinking everyone has a piece on them and will shoot me and claim self defense for whatever vague reasons. It just seems rather backwards to have this "every man for himself" mentality.
There is just higher crime rates but it isn't the guns causing it. It's the much weaker social support in the US compared to European countries. There isn't much in the way of support for people who are down on their luck like their is in the more left leaning countries in Europe. This means there is much more people who are likely to commit crime per capita because there is simply more desperate people. I mean even here in BC we have a massive homeless population living in Vancouver on the Downtown East Side where all of the people who got kicked out of mental institutions when they closed ended up with all the addicts.
There is also a rampant drug problem in lot's of cities across the US with Meth being a huge issue. There are people who go out into state parks and grow marijuana and cook meth and they are armed to the teeth and campers and hikers die all the time when they stumble upon something they shouldn't have. People who are desperate for their fix are willing to go to horrifying lengths to get it. The drug trade leads to more gang crimes fighting over turf, getting even and more home invasions trying to steal drugs/money. These home invasions sometimes end up happening to innocent by standers, we had a string of missed invasions and an old couple got the shit beaten out of them by a bunch of thugs. I forget what the % is but most gun deaths come from illegal weapons by criminals in the US after suicides. Some areas in the US are just fucked because of the poor schooling, no father figures because they left the mother or in jail or dead, no employment opportunities funnelling them to the easy money in gangs and continuing the cycle for the next generation. I mean how can you succeed in an environment like that when every one around you is in a gang and that's the only way for you to make decent money.
I think there needs to be a background check/licensing before you can own a firearm but arbitrarily banning things that seem scary is not the way to lower gun deaths. It's just easier to point at a scary looking "assault weapon" and blame it for killing people rather than dealing with the indifference of society to those who are in need. It's not the responsible gun owners that you need to worry about. It's the mentally ill or desperate who harm others with their weapons other than in self defense.
On February 02 2013 13:03 `phobiA wrote: When I was 5 we had a break-in at my house. We lived near Houston in one of the suburbs, and it was a very scary situation from what I remember. One of the men was armed with a knife, the other with a crowbar and neither of them wore masks. I remember my dad pulling my sister and I and pushing us up the stairs trying to get us running. There were no gun shots, there were no injuries on either side. Once my dad got a hold of his pistol, the thieves ran. This is a personal account, and not everyone has these kinds of experiences. I've never forgotten what that moment was like though. There is really no time to call 9-1-1 in a situation like that. I will always be an advocate for firearm ownership with the right papers.
That's really scary thankfully no one in your family was harmed.
I never understand people who expect you to call 911. There's a guy coming after me in my home let me go grab the phone which more than likely I would have to some how deke out this weapon wielding man and get past him to even get to the phone, then grab the phone and dial, tell the operator what is happening and THEN you can wait 15+ minutes for the cops to show up. I can't see any flaws in this... Especially if your walking to your car in the middle of the night after work or something when you can't lock yourself in a room. Some guy has a knife in your face and your gonna pull out your phone lol... see how that turns out.
People who don't think any civilian should have a firearm are hypocrites because they want someone to come save them who is armed. Seeing how fucking terribly some police act in the countless police brutality videos out there and how poorly trained lots of the force is I would rather just cut out the middle man...
The talk about banning assault weapons is so painful because people just wallow in ignorance. Why regulate the incredibly vague "assault weapon" when pistols are used wayyyyy more in actual crimes? Because people are stupid as fuck. Oh it looks scary so its only use must be used to murder puppies and babies while small hand guns are totally okay. As someone put it earlier .50 cal armour piercing baby seeking rifles. Let's talk about the real problems instead of pandering to ignorance and trying to score political points.
How do you define an "assault weapon"? It's like trying to define a sports car. Hypothetically, if we decided to ban sports car how would we do that. Would we ban based on engine size? the shape of the car? the 0-60 time? You can still kill yourself easily in my little v6 3.0 ranger if you drive like a fucktard as it is in a Lambo. Let's focus on training people to use firearms safely through licensing rather than just banning things randomly.
Then how do you explain countries in the rest of the world where people don't own guns? Do they have significantly lower crime rates or better police service? Not even trying to be an ass here just curious because it seems like the main argument is "I (or close friends and relatives) have experience of domestic robbery and would have ended much worse if not for said firearm." How is it then that the rest of the world doesn't get overrun by criminals if the police are so incompetent? Is it just an American thing? An anomaly?
Personally I can understand that if you are already living in a country with a rich history and culture of firearms, then it is impossible to take away. However, if anyone would argue that introducing guns to a practically gun free country (like China) is a good method for domestic defence, I would not agree. I do not feel safe at all when I go to the US for travel. I keep thinking everyone has a piece on them and will shoot me and claim self defense for whatever vague reasons. It just seems rather backwards to have this "every man for himself" mentality.
If you had a gun, would you shoot some random person? No? Then why do you assume that other people would?
On February 02 2013 13:03 `phobiA wrote: When I was 5 we had a break-in at my house. We lived near Houston in one of the suburbs, and it was a very scary situation from what I remember. One of the men was armed with a knife, the other with a crowbar and neither of them wore masks. I remember my dad pulling my sister and I and pushing us up the stairs trying to get us running. There were no gun shots, there were no injuries on either side. Once my dad got a hold of his pistol, the thieves ran. This is a personal account, and not everyone has these kinds of experiences. I've never forgotten what that moment was like though. There is really no time to call 9-1-1 in a situation like that. I will always be an advocate for firearm ownership with the right papers.
That's really scary thankfully no one in your family was harmed.
I never understand people who expect you to call 911. There's a guy coming after me in my home let me go grab the phone which more than likely I would have to some how deke out this weapon wielding man and get past him to even get to the phone, then grab the phone and dial, tell the operator what is happening and THEN you can wait 15+ minutes for the cops to show up. I can't see any flaws in this... Especially if your walking to your car in the middle of the night after work or something when you can't lock yourself in a room. Some guy has a knife in your face and your gonna pull out your phone lol... see how that turns out.
People who don't think any civilian should have a firearm are hypocrites because they want someone to come save them who is armed. Seeing how fucking terribly some police act in the countless police brutality videos out there and how poorly trained lots of the force is I would rather just cut out the middle man...
The talk about banning assault weapons is so painful because people just wallow in ignorance. Why regulate the incredibly vague "assault weapon" when pistols are used wayyyyy more in actual crimes? Because people are stupid as fuck. Oh it looks scary so its only use must be used to murder puppies and babies while small hand guns are totally okay. As someone put it earlier .50 cal armour piercing baby seeking rifles. Let's talk about the real problems instead of pandering to ignorance and trying to score political points.
How do you define an "assault weapon"? It's like trying to define a sports car. Hypothetically, if we decided to ban sports car how would we do that. Would we ban based on engine size? the shape of the car? the 0-60 time? You can still kill yourself easily in my little v6 3.0 ranger if you drive like a fucktard as it is in a Lambo. Let's focus on training people to use firearms safely through licensing rather than just banning things randomly.
Then how do you explain countries in the rest of the world where people don't own guns? Do they have significantly lower crime rates or better police service? Not even trying to be an ass here just curious because it seems like the main argument is "I (or close friends and relatives) have experience of domestic robbery and would have ended much worse if not for said firearm." How is it then that the rest of the world doesn't get overrun by criminals if the police are so incompetent? Is it just an American thing? An anomaly?
Personally I can understand that if you are already living in a country with a rich history and culture of firearms, then it is impossible to take away. However, if anyone would argue that introducing guns to a practically gun free country (like China) is a good method for domestic defence, I would not agree.
I do not feel safe at all when I go to the US for travel. I keep thinking everyone has a piece on them and will shoot me and claim self defense for whatever vague reasons. It just seems rather backwards to have this "every man for himself" mentality.
How do you explain why some countries with strict gun control have low crime rates? The same way you explain why some countries with little gun control have low crime rates. You seem to be claiming that America is the only country where crime is rampant, which is kind of strange. I don't know of anyone who is arguing that we should introduce guns into a near gun-free society, we are addressing the issue of gun control where there are hundreds of millions of firearms in circulation.
Why would you be afraid of being randomly shot in the US when you are more likely to be hit by a car?
On February 02 2013 13:26 Romantic wrote: Won't be giving up mine, I don't particularly care what ya'll decide to do. It isn't like I am going to follow the gun control laws lol. Already quite stockpiled and nobody knows my little arsenal exists so I don't expect anyone to knock to take them any time soon.
"Should people be allowed to own guns?" - I really don't care, but I know mine aren't going anywhere. I can't really answer the question straight up because I selfishly consider myself different from everyone else. Even if I thought the average person should be disarmed, it wouldn't cause me to disarm myself.
You guys are all missing the point. Nobody cares about your anecdotal stories of chasing off bad guys because you had a gun and were able to save yourself. The people asking for more gun control don't have a problem with your guns. The point is, how are we going to make the laws better and stronger so that the wrong people don't get guns? People who shouldn't be able to get guns were able to in the case of sandy hook or VT - so how can we strengthen the laws so that those kind of people with psychological problems cannot get guns? You have to acknowledge there is something wrong with the ways guns are regulated when people are dying in situations when they never should have.
EPT
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